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View Full Version : Crummy,Robinson as DC !


ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:35 PM
Can you believe this!

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:37 PM
WTF hiring is this????

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:38 PM
Daggummit...now we are UCLA EAST! This is horrible!

morphius
01-15-2001, 12:39 PM
Greg Robinson hired as DC for the Chiefs.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/latest/mainnews.asp?storyID=2055&cat=1&showLatest=yes

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:40 PM
A-ha!

Now I know why.

Looking at his resume. Guess where Greg Robinson was from 1982-1989?

UCLA

Maybe John Wooden isn't too far off in the distance...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:41 PM
Well, Donnie will be happy.

Larry Atkins might be franchised as a result...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:41 PM
Larry Parker is as good as gone. No one from USC is going to stick around now...

morphius
01-15-2001, 12:42 PM
Well, at least he knows how to beat the Raiders, and may help us out against the Donx as well.

Morphius
Trying to see some upside in this.

Cannibal
01-15-2001, 12:42 PM
I don't particularly like this hiring either.

I don't care what the stats are, Denver's D has been soft for the last 3 or 4 years.

I think I would have went with a young up and coming defensive position coach. Like maybe the LB's coach of the Ravens.

However, this could help us retain our dominance over Denver.

Hopefully, this guy can provide additional insight into the inner workings of the Donkey's.

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:43 PM
Maybe CP thinks Robinson can carry over the plans to beat the Raiders twice in a year!

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:46 PM
Un-freakin-believable!

Tobin or Rhodes would be far better choices than Robinson. I can't believe Tobin didn't get this job, considering he goes back many years with Vermeil.

Any Broncos fan worth his salt knows as far as importance towards winning their Super Bowls, Robinson's Defense was nowhere near a major reason for winning it all.

The Bronocs had a superb offense, which masked a defense that had to gamble frequently to mask their deficiencies.

Now, you'll see Gunther land in Denver in what amounts to a trade of coaches; a trade which is not favorable to the Chiefs at all...

morphius
01-15-2001, 12:47 PM
Roy - Maybe he is also bringing over the vasoline/cooking spray jersey trick.

Morphius
Getting less happy.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:48 PM
The only thing I'll give Robinson credit for is he knew when to bring the blitz.

More than any other team, the Broncos would blitz the Chiefs the past several years on 3rd and long and force many punts.

Then again, anyone with half a brain could realize that...

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:51 PM
CP is bringing in coaches with UCLA ties and personal ties. This is his last chance.....I'm not happy at all with the Robinson pic. There was better choice's to choose from!

I was look'n forward to Tobin installing an attacking defense again!

Cannibal
01-15-2001, 12:51 PM
The Chiefs have beaten the crap out of the Donkey's D for the last four games in a row. Even in some of the losses they had before that the Chiefs put up huge points on the Donks, only to have Elway bring them back.

That is not a good sign.

Because the Chiefs offense sucks.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:51 PM
Morphius:

Let's just hope he'll leave his techniques to stop the run behind in Denver.

I can still see Dillon running into open daylight, along with Richardson...

He should have been fired after the Dillon game!

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:52 PM
Hey, is it too late to bring back Kurt? ;^)

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:54 PM
I hope we draft some stud DL ,DB,LB's cause people will kill us with the run.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:54 PM
Boy, I tell you...

If this announcement was to be made before packed house at Arrowhead, it would receive one heck of a BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!

I wasn't sure whether to laugh or to cry when I first read this...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 12:58 PM
OK, so let's get this straight, for all of you who are scoring this.

We have a Broncos reject as our D Coordinator.

We have a Raiders reject as our ST Coordinator.

Oh, goodie! I can hardly wait to see who is going to be our O Coordinator.

Why, lookie here. Norv Turner was just named O Coordinator for the Chargers. Hmmm... Maybe the guy he replaced is coming to KC to replace raye. After all, he does qualify as an AFC West reject.

God, I hope Vermeil knows what he's doing....

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 12:59 PM
I don't like this addition to our D!:mad: We better sign every daggumm running back available so they don't run against us!:rolleyes:

Just when we thought that things were looking up for us......we get :spank:

Cannibal
01-15-2001, 01:03 PM
Hey dudes,

Don't worry, you'll get your typical "Rufus Dawes" spin on this soon. They'll make you "feel better" about it.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:05 PM
Cannibal: (re Rufus Dawes)

Can I have sulfuric acid poured over my head instead?

What a friggin' outrage this move is!!

ChiTown
01-15-2001, 01:07 PM
Sorry, but this is un-f**king-believable!!!!!

Greg Robinson is tossed out of Bronco Territory and lands in KC. Enough with the AFC WEST rejects on Defense (Shaw, Robinson). Ray Rhodes was, by far, the best candidate for this job followed closely by Tobin.

I'm not liking this total Rams/UCLA coaching love fest thats going on at 1 Arrowhead Drive. The only guy I wanted from those connections was Saunders and we haven't closed that deal yet.

Carl/Dick - Get a freakin grip on what your doing and open up another book besides the UCLA Alumni Directory.

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:07 PM
AJ

Agree this does have AFC West all over it.Somehow think'n that CP thinks he can winn all the AFC west games to the playoffs? Who do we get from Seattle ? SD ? or UCLA ?

Cannibal
01-15-2001, 01:08 PM
Sure...

http://www.geocities.com/cannibal1970/acidmeltposticon.gif

ChiefsFanatic
01-15-2001, 01:09 PM
He was probably cheaper than Tobin. Carl has to make up some of that bonus money somewhere.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:11 PM
Cannibal:

LOL!!!

Hope there's a few more drops left there for good ol' Rufus...

NaptownChief
01-15-2001, 01:13 PM
If he is not good enough to hold a job with the Donks then why is he good enough for us? You guys still glad we threw away our 2nd and 3rd rounder now?

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:14 PM
Glad we don't play the Bengals next year! :D

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:16 PM
No, I can't possibly think this was a dollars and cents move. The coaching staff was nickeled and dimed before, and we all saw what nickels and dimes gets us nowadays.

Rather, this is something bigger than $$$. There is a UCLA fetish running around Arrowhead these days.

Now, I think we should set a pool for when Aikman will become a Chief?

I would have chosen March 17, but green isn't a color for UCLA.

Phobia
01-15-2001, 01:16 PM
Cannibal:I think I would have went with a young up and coming defensive position coach. Like maybe the LB's coach of the Ravens.

You mean Jack Del Rio? Are you really think USC alum would join this UCLA squad even though he spent 2 years with the Chiefs? Plus, I'm not sure Del Rio is ready for the D-Co job - he's only been coaching 4 years. I dunno though, the Ravens are pretty good. I wonder if Del Rio gets the D-Co job when Lewis moves on?

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 01:16 PM
Yeah, the only good thing I've got to say about him is he knows how to use the linebackers.

I don't like this hire...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:19 PM
I sincerely hope Jack Del Rio never comes back to KC in any capacity.

I still remember him attacking the great Otis Taylor during the 1987 strike.

Del Rio was striking at the time and Taylor was working for the Chiefs and Del Rio initiates a scuffle with him???

To hell with Del Rio...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:22 PM
ROY C:

LOL!

True on both your observations on both the AFC West/UCLA connections and Bengals remark...

ChiTown
01-15-2001, 01:23 PM
Are there any comments from Vermeil about this hire??? I'm guessing it's too soon.

At any rate, how the hell is DV going to spin this move into a positive for the Chiefs?? I have not been this pissed in a long time (since the hiring of Gun 2 years ago, in fact). What a blown opportunity. My day is shot with this news.

ChiTown
~wondering when DV is going to change the team Uni's to ***** blue and gold

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:27 PM
You just know JJ Stokes will be brought in to replace Kevin Lockett, once he leaves via free agency...

Cannibal
01-15-2001, 01:30 PM
Kphobia,

I bet he either becomes the D coordinator with Baltimore, or he'll join Marvin Lewis wherever he ends up.

MrBlond
01-15-2001, 01:36 PM
Gunther was a failed DC from a AFC west rival when KC hired him. He turned out to be a very good DC. Robinsons defenses were good enough to win 2 Superbowls. I say lets see what he can do before we start saying this was a bad hire. Vermeil, Saunders, Robinson, and Ganz beats the hell out of Gun, Raye, Kurt, and Stock.

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:36 PM
What a way to demorlize me after watch'n the Raiders get manhandled! Greg Robinson and UCLA bandits!

Now that we have all this SB exp.in coaches,and the knowledge of the AFC WEST...do you think we will sweep the Division. Probally be more bicker'n about what plan to use!:argue:

ChiTown
01-15-2001, 01:37 PM
Somewhere in Cyberspace, BroncoFan is out there laughing his a$$ off hysterically. Does anyone remember JQ's immortal words of (paraphrased)"you will be very sorry with Shaw as your Dbacks coach with the softest coverage around"

I'm just wondering what the comments will be from our Bronco friends.

ChiTown
~Wondering if Tommy Maddox is planning to buy a house in the KC area.

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:39 PM
The Chargers offensive coordinator in 2000 was none other than Geep Chryst (who?). He is being mentioned to be the new Cardinals OC, but just wait a cotton-picking minute here. If he's from UCLA, you'll see him here

I'd rather have Jeep Cherokee making plays than Geep Chryst...

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:39 PM
Mr Blond......
Thanks...you are right,just put me in my place! Thanks,it is better than the 3 stooges!


I hate to be humbled! :o

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:41 PM
Roy:

Make no mistake about this one. This move to choose Robinson over Tobin/Rhodes was a hard kick straight to the family jewels...

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:46 PM
Mr Blond:

Though you are right that anything beats the Stooges, Robinson's D were at best, above average. But never to be confused with great.

I'd rather think Elway, Davis, and a kick-*** OL which gave Elway and Davis time to use their talents were the principal reasons why the Broncos won those trophies.

Tobin has been more suucessful a coach than Robinson. Robinson's had better teams, but Tobin is better.

Rhodes also had a kick-*** offense to work with in SF in 1994 when they won it all, but you know something? His defense in 1994 was better than either of the Broncos defenses in 1997 or 1998.

God, I hate this move!!!

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 01:48 PM
http://www.denverbroncos.com/lockerroom/coaches_bios/robinson_greg.php3

Denver's take on Robinson before he got fired...

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:48 PM
AJ

I was look'n forward to Tobin...now I have to wait and see how the D will be layered around his game plans!

Where is Gunther going to?

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:51 PM
Roy:

He has already been in Denver to interview for Robinson's job.

Also might be brought aboard the Jets ship, now that Bradway is there.

I'd bet on him going to Denver.

Is it just me or does the AFC West personnel moves have an incest feel to it?

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 01:58 PM
Chi Town:

Cool flashback with Maddox? You do know Bono was from UCLA as well, and I don't remember hearing he retired :O

Vermeil actually is quoted about the Robinson hiring on kcchiefs.com

http://www.kcchiefs.com/latest/mainnews.asp?storyID=2055&cat=1&showLatest=yes

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 01:58 PM
AJ

I knew he was in Denver,just check'n if anyone has heard anything on him yet.

Yes this AFC West carousel is nothing more than try'n to get an edge on the division !

[Edited by ROYC75 on 01-15-2001 at 02:05 PM]

AJKCFAN
01-15-2001, 02:03 PM
Is it just me or does Greg Robinson look like Lt. Harris from "Police Academy" fame?

Mile High Mania
01-15-2001, 02:06 PM
I think this was a quality hiring by Vermeil. Honestly, he's a good guy and Denver had good success with him. I wish him luck, in all but 2 games while he is in KC each year.

Plus, this means Rhodes could still be a Bronco soon!

G_Man
01-15-2001, 02:32 PM
I hope you're being honest, MHM. I don't like this hiring, but I'll give him a chance. Hopefully the problems in Denver stemmed more from personnel. :^)

Mile High Mania
01-15-2001, 02:35 PM
I think Denver has some solid defensive players, but the secondary sorta sucked quite a few times in 2000. I think he'll be fine in KC... and that's not smack.

milkman
01-15-2001, 02:37 PM
jl,
I, like you, was never happy that we gave up those draft picks to get Vermeil, although the possibility of some players that were out the door, returning because of him, made it easier to stomach.
This hire, and the Ganz Jr. hire make me even less happy about those picks, and the Vermeil hire, which even if we had retained those picks, I would have been less than pleased about.

NaptownChief
01-15-2001, 02:43 PM
Milk,

The most optimistic I can be on this whole mess is to give it a wait and see attitude...We should definitely be more competitive this year with the ousting of the Stooges but I think the decision making over all has been average at best.

Taco John
01-15-2001, 03:06 PM
LOL! This is too good...

I think that I've captured the feeling of the majority of Broncos Fans everywhere on my website...

http://www.orangemane.com

ck_IN
01-15-2001, 03:08 PM
Just some foor for thought gang, before you all storm Arrowhead with torches and pitchforks.

<i>The performance of Robinson's defense throughout the 1998 playoffs was paramount to Denver's quest for a second straight title. The Broncos allowed opponents just 53 rushing yards per game in the postseason, and forced an unbelievable 13 turnovers in just three games, giving Denver a +12 turnover ratio. Add that to an impressive +10 ratio for the regular season, and Denver boasted a +22 ratio for all of 1998. In each of the Broncos' first two postseason games, the defense allowed a franchise-low 14 rushing yards, and in the entire postseason allowed just 25 points and two touchdowns.

The Broncos ranked third in the NFL in rushing defense in '98, allowing just 80.4 yards per game, the lowest in franchise history. The top two full-season rushing defense figures in franchise history have come during Robinson's tenure (1st-1998, 2nd-1996). Over the final 11 games of the season (including postseason), Denver allowed just 56.6 rushing yards per game, and for the season, allowed just two individuals to rush for more than 100 yards. Additionally, the Broncos allowed fewer than 20 points in 11 of their 19 regular or postseason games in 1998.

The Broncos' defense was equally impressive in 1997, when Denver won its first World Championship. Robinson crafted a brilliant game plan in Super Bowl XXXII to control the
explosive Green Bay offense, resulting in a 31-24 win. Robinson's defensive unit rose to the occasion when most challenged, limiting the Packers to an 0-of-7 showing on
third-down attempts in the second half, and 0-of-1 on fourth down. Out of six occasions during the entire playoffs in which opponents began a drive in Denver territory, just two netted points, and both were field goals. During the regular season, opponents were shut out once and held to three points on three other occasions. </i>

Someone with more ambition than I can cross check this with NFL.com, but I'll trust the accuracy.

HC_Chief
01-15-2001, 03:15 PM
Well, our arguments against Robinson's so-called 'great SB Ds' apply now; just as they applied then: When your offense posts 20+ point leads in the 1st quarter, your opponent abandons the running-game in favor of a 'catch-up' approach (i.e., pass-happy philosophy). When an O posts big early leads, and forces their opponent to pass, a D is afforded the luxury of 'pinning their ears back' on every down.

In other words, those SB Donkey Ds were successful, in most part, due to an outstanding O.

[Edited by HC_Chief on 01-15-2001 at 04:30 PM]

ROYC75
01-15-2001, 03:28 PM
We have good talent here on Defense,I will take a point to set back,wait to see approach on this.I will admit that this is not who I would have liked to of seen,but I'm not the coach.

He is now part of the family and I just hop'n I don't have to vote him off the island! :D

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 03:37 PM
50 sacks in 1999

The Broncos allowed opponents just 53 rushing yards per game in the 1998 postseason, and forced an unbelievable 13 turnovers in just three games, giving Denver a +12 turnover ratio.

The Broncos ranked third in the NFL in rushing defense in '98, allowing just 80.4 yards per game, the lowest in franchise history.

The top two full-season rushing defense figures in franchise history have come during Robinson's tenure (1st-1998, 2nd-1996). Over the final 11 games of the season (including postseason), Denver allowed just 56.6 rushing yards per game, and for the season, allowed just two individuals to rush for more than 100 yards. Additionally, the Broncos allowed fewer than 20 points in 11 of their 19 regular or postseason games in 1998.

Robinson's defensive unit rose to the occasion when most challenged in Super Bowl XXXII, limiting the Packers to an 0-of-7 showing on third-down attempts in the second half, and 0-of-1 on fourth down.

Under Robinson's direction, 10 Pro Bowl selections have been bestowed upon Broncos defensive players in the past five years.

In his first two years as defensive coordinator, Robinson guided an improvement in overall league rank from 28th the year prior to his arrival ('94) to fourth in '96, and has kept his unit among the league's best in the three years since.

During his last four years with New York, Robinson's defense forced 151 turnovers, most in the AFC and second most in the NFL during that span (Philadelphia was first with 155).

There is a perception that his defenses are soft, and maybe they were, but sacks and turnovers are what he does bring to the table, along with knowledge of how to use the linebackers effectively in the blitz, something I've wanted to see for a long time since that disaster with DT and the Falcon. Donnie Edwards and Mike Maslowski need to be used properly.

We'll see...

MrBlond
01-15-2001, 03:45 PM
HC-Chief,

Don't we now have an outstanding offense? An aggressive OC armed with Grbac, Alexander, Gonzo, Morris, TRich and a 1st round HB would make Robinson a much better DC.

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 04:00 PM
``I think man-to-man is critical in this league,'' Robinson said. ``I like bump-and-run coverage. It depends on your personnel. But if you're in man-to-man coverage, you put yourself in position to be aggressive.''

Sounds better than Kurt "I wanna play 17 yards off the reciever" Schottenheimer.

"This is not an apprentice program," Vermeil said today. "You're brought in, you put programs together and you're not given a lot of time to get it done anymore. You used to take a job and think you have five years to rebuild it. Well, you don't. We're not in a rebuilding program. Maybe, a little rejuvenation, a little tweaking."

We'll see...

HC_Chief
01-15-2001, 04:29 PM
MrBlond - absolutely! BUT, the operative phrase is <i>TRich and a <b>1st round HB</b></i>! :)

Another option (one I am not big on): TRich @ HB and draft a FB.

In either scenario, we <i>must</i> scrap the RBbC sh*t!

BTW - a few of the Donkey faithful are starting to worry a bit about Robinson defecting to the <font color=red>RED</font> & <font color=gold>GOLD</font>. They admit that 'fresh blood' was needed in Denver - but credit Robinson with much of their b-t-b SB success; and they aren't particularly pleased he came to their arch-rival! Interesting stuff! Of course, many of them are LTAO....

<a href="http://www.denverpost.com/voice/voice.htm">DPO Forum</a>

[Edited by HC_Chief on 01-15-2001 at 04:58 PM]

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 04:55 PM
HC,
Like Vermiel said, he believes in putting the ball in the hands of the gifted players who can make plays and letting them go.

I took that to mean we won't be seeing too many screens and handoffs to Donnell Bennett anymore...

Taco John
01-15-2001, 07:11 PM
Hey HC...

Wha are you talking about? Everyone I know is dancing a jig over this news! I couldn't be more happy. Geez, I wonder if Shanahan will be able to figure out Robinson's schemes? LOL! This is GREAT news for us...

So I'm wondering, who at the DPO is worried? I didn't see anyone...

Frazod
01-15-2001, 07:27 PM
This sucks... I don't want anyone or anything tainted with the scum of Denver even remotely associated with our team. Ex-Broncos should be staked throught the heart, NOT HIRED BY THE CHIEFS! :mad: And when did we become division garbage dump for washed up coaches? NOT happy..... :mad:

This f#cker better perform.... :mad:

nmt1
01-15-2001, 08:03 PM
We're screwed. This is the ONE guy they shouldn't have hired. The freakin' Bungles put up almost 300 rushing yards on the Broncos this year. Man, we are screwed.

soliday
01-15-2001, 08:10 PM
Corey Dillon set the rookie one-game rushing record a few years ago against a pretty good Tennessee defense that two years later went to the Super Bowl. Anybody who bases any football opinion on one game is being foolish.

Soliday

nmt1
01-15-2001, 08:12 PM
We beat the Broncos twice this year. Enough said.

nmt1
01-15-2001, 08:15 PM
In fact, we haven't lost to the Broncos in quite a while. What does that tell you about their defense?

Red and Gold Mania
01-15-2001, 08:20 PM
Friggin' Kitna had 250 yards against them. :mad:

Red and Gold Mania
01-15-2001, 08:23 PM
Ryan Leaf 321 yards! Enough said about Denver's D!

soliday
01-15-2001, 08:24 PM
Guys,
Until this past August I lived in Denver for 6 years, including the Broncos Super Bowl years. I got to watch the Broncos all too closely, and it is true that the Broncos offense was superior to their defense--not many defenses would overshadow the Broncos offense of the Shanahan era. I too looked upon the defense as the Broncos Achilles' Heel, but I can also tell you the Broncos defense was characterized by an extreme aggressiveness, a wide and varied package of blitzes, man-to-man coverage mixed with occassional zone schemes which many QBs found very confusing, and I constantly belittled the defensive talent, because there wasn't much of it in my opinion---no Reggie White, no Derrick Thomas, no Deion Sanders, no Ray Lewis.

I think that Robinson performed his duties very well, given what he had to work with. He was shown the door because the players didn't perform, and started shutting Robinson out. It happens to all coaches, I think.

As for Rhodes, he took over a playoff-caliber team and drove it into the ground. He's overrated in my opinion.

Soliday

DaWolf
01-15-2001, 08:29 PM
I think Robinson got fired in part so Shanahan could hire his good friend Rhodes, or even now Cunningham if that doesn't work, as defensive coordinator. The sacrificial lamb, so to speak...

soliday
01-15-2001, 08:34 PM
It was actually the Broncos offense that failed them this year when it counted, scoring nothing against the Chiefs defense and 3 on the Ravens.

People, put aside the failures of the past. It's a new era. None of it is going to have any impact on the next 3 or 4 years, except in the minds of fans who mistakenly think it does, and in the words of Raiders and Broncos and Rams fans who want to make you think it does so they can get under your skin.

Soliday

Mile High Mania
01-16-2001, 07:36 AM
Wow... you guys are making me feel better about this move with each post! Robinson is a good guy, just wait and see what he can do with KC's talent. You never know. Shanahan was cast out of Oakland, but he's turned out pretty well.

As for Denver, check this out...http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/brnx0116.htm

Rhodes is what this team needs. Along with some upgraded talent in the secondary, two more OLinemen, a third WR and a better backup QB. That's the list, I've checked it twice and now it's time to take back the division and put our rivals butts on ice!

GO BRONCOS!

ROYC75
01-16-2001, 08:31 AM
After all that has been said,writtened,and talked about...I will take a wait and see approach to this guy!

Gaz
01-16-2001, 11:37 AM
The one thing I always admired about the Denver Defense [and heaven knows there was precious little to admire] was their willingness to fearlessly blitz, blitz and blitz some more. After the Spineless Jellyfish Stooge and his stinking soft zone, I am ready for a DC with the stones to take chances.

Was Robinson responsible for the recently-unimpressive nature of the Denver D, or was it the stunning lack of talent in the secondary?

I was ready for Tobin as DC, but as long as the new DC is aggressive and attacks the Enemy [particularly the pencil-neck], then I will be happy. For now, I am in "wait and see" mode with Robinson.

xoxo~
gaz
still afterglowing over the Stooges removal.

DaWolf
01-16-2001, 12:26 PM
Here is something to consider. A lot of people as I recall said they would have liked for Emmitt Thomas as DC over the last few years. I consider him a good DC. But he didn'thave the horses in Minnesota to get a real good defense together.

I think the important thing is here that if Robinson has a sound scheme, is going to be aggressive yet makes sure the foundation of it all is to stop the run, and is not going to play 7 yards off the line of scrimmage, he has a chance to succeed, assuming we are able to keep Hasty and add another corner who can be physical, if Bartee can't get it done...

Cannibal
01-16-2001, 12:37 PM
Denver's D's have been "unimpressive" for a few years now.

Shannahan's offenses have protected his D's for quite a while now.

Hell, 3 years ago, we threw for 400 yards and put up 30+ points on them in Denver. And the QB that supposedly can't throw the ball down the field was the one throwing the football. The only reason they won is because Elway had another one his classic comebacks.

When the Chiefs totally mediocre offenses can move the ball on those D's you know you have a problem.

When a team was able to stop the Denver offense, their D ALMOST ALWAYS folded.

58Forever
01-16-2001, 12:56 PM
Who knows?...a new team...a new start...new players...maybe he can recreate the good Denver Ds of the past few years...he must have done something right, they won two SBs...besides...if he fixes our D for just long enough for us to go to the dance...then I'll be happy, they can fire him then...I'm still very optimistic about this team next year...maybe not the coaching staff we expected but anything is better then what we had....

DaWolf
01-16-2001, 12:57 PM
So should Ray Rhodes when he came out of SF have been considered a bad coordinator because he worked with a great offense and in a weak division where he was always up by 20 at halftime? I remember some people having great individual efforts against his defenses too. But they got the job done when it counted, the playoffs.

We may have had big days against them. Some teams have another team's number. Denver certainly didn't have as many problems against Oakland for example like we have...

Cannibal
01-16-2001, 01:09 PM
Rhodes probably is overrated.


For the last four or five years it has been pretty much a given that if you stop the Denver offense, their D would fold. They've ALWAYS given up a boat load of points. The only reason they put up good numbers against the run is because they always had a lead to play with.

I think this hiring is indicative of what we've been getting in KC for along time now... mediocrity.

At BEST you can say that Robinson's D's were mediocre, but the last couple of years, they've been downright awful.

DaWolf
01-16-2001, 01:23 PM
I dunno Cannibal. He put together a pretty good gameplan to slow down Favre and that offense in the Super Bowl. People kept saying their run defense was overrated and they could be run on, but yet in the postseason against the best teams they were even better, in fact shutting us down in our own house, holding our backs to 52 yards rushing, and that was the year we were near or at the top of the league in rushing. Their D went from 28 the year before he arrived to 15 to 4 in two years when he took over.

As DC of the Jets they tied us for takeaways and ranked 6th in points allowed. he had a pretty good record as DL coach in NY too. And I don't remember their high powered
offenses.

Besides, the point in the NFL is to build a lead and not give it up. If Dick Vermiel, as he says, believes the most important stat is margin of victory, he plans on putting points on the board and not sitting on it and playing conservative defense (see the Oakland/KC game in Arrowhead).

We can always pick apart a guy for having his bad games, but he has had his good games too. The same can be said for any DC...

Cannibal
01-16-2001, 01:28 PM
The Packers put 24 up on the Donkeys in the Superbowl.

If it had not been for fat *** Gilbert Brown and some other sorry Green Bay defenders, the Pack would have won.

I will give him his props for holding the Chiefs to 10 points in the playoffs though. That was an outstanding defensive effort.

But Pittsburgh [of all teams] put up almost 30 on him in the next game.


Everyone has their moments, but in Denver the D was usually below average.

Mile High Mania
01-16-2001, 01:40 PM
Cannibal, I agree... Denver's defense has always been "better than average" over the last few years. The defense would get a lot of sacks and rack up the takeaways, but there was always a tendency to give up the big play.

The offense was always able to save their butts! Denver's offense can still be explosive, but if the defense had been top 10 in all categories this year... they could have defeated KC once, along with Cincy and the Pats. Again, the players are the key, but someone has to be responsible for those players starting.

Red and Gold Mania
01-16-2001, 05:00 PM
H***, when Ryan Leaf and the Chargers put 311 yards passing against them that speaks volumes to me.

I hate these castoff hirings.

Gansz - special teams - reject from Oak.
Guinta - dbs - reject from STL.
Robinson - Denver's reject.

:mad: