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DomerNKC
12-27-2006, 08:23 PM
I was just checkin out the stats from this year and our first rounder. I know that we were looking at Manny Lawson. Some say we took the second best DE remaining by chosing Hali. Tamba has better numbers than Lawson and Mario Williams.
Williams--35 Tackles--12 Assists--4.5 Sacks--0 Interception
Lawson--42 Tackles--10 Assists--3.0 Sacks--1 Interception
Hali --40 Tackles--16 Assists--6.5 Sacks--1 Interception

Bob Dole
12-27-2006, 08:24 PM
All of our players suck worse than anyone on any other roster.

Try to keep up.

doomy3
12-27-2006, 08:26 PM
How many forced fumbles and fumble recoveries? Seems like he is a turnover machine.

88TG88
12-27-2006, 08:27 PM
hes good but he could be better with DT help

Pitt Gorilla
12-27-2006, 08:29 PM
Stats and gameplay mean nothing; it's all about the 40 times.

doomy3
12-27-2006, 08:30 PM
BTW, as much crap as Carl takes about the draft, he has drafted some good players in the last few years. Hali, Johnson, Johnson, Allen off the top of my head. Looks like Pollard and Page were steals as well.

I know he missed on Sims and Siavii, but there were a lot of franchises that would've taken Sims where we took him.

Iowanian
12-27-2006, 08:30 PM
I like Hali...he's had a pretty damn good season for a rook.

Its also worth mentioning that Hali had better numbers than the Almighty Dwight Freeney.

It should also be said that he has less sacks than some 5th rounders like dummerville, and that shoplifted DE from Chicago, Anderson.

I'd like to see what kind of numbers Allen and Hali would put up with some DT pressure in the middle.

doomy3
12-27-2006, 08:31 PM
hes good but he could be better with DT help


Really? Didn't realize that. Maybe we should find some DTs. I think that has been mentioned on here a couple times before.

doomy3
12-27-2006, 08:34 PM
kcchiefs.com says that Tamba has SIX forced fumbles and one recovery. Tamba is a turnover machine!

doomy3
12-27-2006, 08:36 PM
kcchiefs.com says that Tamba has SIX forced fumbles and one recovery. Tamba is a turnover machine!


And Jared Allen leads the NFL with 6 recoveries!

crazycoffey
12-27-2006, 08:39 PM
I like Hali...he's had a pretty damn good season for a rook.

Its also worth mentioning that Hali had better numbers than the Almighty Dwight Freeney.

It should also be said that he has less sacks than some 5th rounders like dummerville, and that shoplifted DE from Chicago, Anderson.

I'd like to see what kind of numbers Allen and Hali would put up with some DT pressure in the middle.


yeah, DUH!!!

Priest4Prez
12-27-2006, 08:45 PM
Folks, what DTs are going to be available in the draft?

unothadeal
12-27-2006, 08:46 PM
The stats on kcchiefs.com say Tamba has 7 sacks and 6 FF.

BTW, Hey all

88TG88
12-27-2006, 08:46 PM
The stats on kcchiefs.com say Tamba has 7 sacks and 6 FF.

BTW, Hey all
what up

Tribal Warfare
12-27-2006, 08:52 PM
Folks, what DTs are going to be available in the draft?

Alan Branch, Amobi Okoye, Quinn Pitcock, Frank Okam

Iowanian
12-27-2006, 08:54 PM
yeah, DUH!!!

I know one of these warpaintards didn't just "duh" me....

scott free
12-27-2006, 08:56 PM
I like Hali...he's had a pretty damn good season for a rook.

Its also worth mentioning that Hali had better numbers than the Almighty Dwight Freeney.

It should also be said that he has less sacks than some 5th rounders like dummerville, and that shoplifted DE from Chicago, Anderson.

I'd like to see what kind of numbers Allen and Hali would put up with some DT pressure in the middle.

The best part is that he's only a rook, theres a ton of upside left. His command of the game & NFL life in general will be so much better his 2nd year, he will fill out in the weight room as well.

The doubters about him & Jared will eat Raiduhs when everything's in place. Jared has yet to reach his peak IMO as well.

***Pacino voice*** These guys are juzz gettin' STAHDED, HOO-HA!!!

Bob Dole
12-27-2006, 08:56 PM
Folks, what DTs are going to be available in the draft?

Kansas City should never, ever, EVER again draft a DT.

Ever.

Chief Roundup
12-27-2006, 09:00 PM
Kansas City should never, ever, EVER again draft a DT.

Ever.
I would agree but after the way Hali has turned out I would give Herm a shot at drafting a DT.

the Talking Can
12-27-2006, 09:01 PM
I know one of these warpaintards didn't just "duh" me....

ROFL

Iowanian
12-27-2006, 09:03 PM
wuddup can

Did you see phildo drive up to the front door and open his minivan hatch, unload the icy hot stuntaz and leave?

Pitt Gorilla
12-27-2006, 09:05 PM
Gotta give it up for the Stuntaz reference. Mad props.

Florida_Bronco
12-27-2006, 09:05 PM
It should also be said that he has less sacks than some 5th rounders like dummerville, and that shoplifted DE from Chicago, Anderson.

I'd like to see what kind of numbers Allen and Hali would put up with some DT pressure in the middle.

I'd like to see Dumervil get to play next to a serious DT, I bet that would elevate his game quite a bit.

bringbackmarty
12-27-2006, 09:05 PM
Stats and gameplay mean nothing; it's all about the 40 times.
exactly, ive never believed in the games, it's all about the combine.

the Talking Can
12-27-2006, 09:05 PM
wuddup can

Did you see phildo drive up to the front door and open his minivan hatch, unload the icy hot stuntaz and leave?


lol...Birdman6969 and the whole crew...it's like Phil gave this board herpes...

scott free
12-27-2006, 09:06 PM
Gotta give it up for the Stuntaz reference. Mad props.

EXACTLY what i was thinking right before seeing your post... ROFL

Iowanian
12-27-2006, 09:09 PM
Ya'll bitches better chill. We rollin in heyah now. This board Stuntaville now.

http://img19.exs.cx/img19/954/Hug.jpg


*disclosure that I busted out the Stuntaz in phildos documentary last week.

PastorMikH
12-27-2006, 09:10 PM
I could have sworn the other night that on one of the sacks resulting in a fumble was credited by the radio crew as by Hali however, ESPN and NFL.com don't show him credit for a sack.

Did I mis-hear? Did the announcers make the srong call?

Did anyone else hear of Hali getting a sack against Oakland?

Iowanian
12-27-2006, 09:10 PM
We told you a long time ago the brownCow experiment was stupid.

That said, dummerville was a good value for the rat.

I'd like to see Dumervil get to play next to a serious DT, I bet that would elevate his game quite a bit.

bringbackmarty
12-27-2006, 09:11 PM
i am beginning to think allen and hali should play on both sides of the ball.

Allen takes over for tg @ te when we trade him for pix.

Favorite pass route\after the catch move: the mlb circle rush with club to the head after the catch.

hali fills the fb slot. favored blocking technique, the swim block\eyegouge move.

Hoover
12-27-2006, 09:34 PM
While I agree that we need to find some help at DT, I don't know if we should use another one of our top picks in the draft for one.

2001 - Eric Downing 3rd Round (Our top pick that year)
2001 - Terd Sands 7th Round
2002 - Sims 1st round 6th overall
2002 - Eddie Freeman 2nd Round
2003 - Montique Sharpe 7th Round
2004- Junior Siavii 2nd Round (Our top pick that year)

We used five of our 29 draft picks on DT's from 2001 to 2004. If you really want to know why the Chiefs suck on D and are an old team its because we focused on one position for too long at the top of the draft.

I'm not saying we shouldn't draft one, but I'd try to find some bulk on the FA market, and go a different direction in Rounds 1 and 2 in the draft, and see what we can find in round 3-7.

TinyEvel
12-27-2006, 10:01 PM
And Jared Allen leads the NFL with 6 recoveries!

And who's second place with 5 recoveries?

DAVID CARR!


ROFL

Alphaman
12-27-2006, 10:41 PM
While I agree that we need to find some help at DT, I don't know if we should use another one of our top picks in the draft for one.

2001 - Eric Downing 3rd Round (Our top pick that year)
2001 - Terd Sands 7th Round
2002 - Sims 1st round 6th overall
2002 - Eddie Freeman 2nd Round
2003 - Montique Sharpe 7th Round
2004- Junior Siavii 2nd Round (Our top pick that year)

We used five of our 29 draft picks on DT's from 2001 to 2004. If you really want to know why the Chiefs suck on D and are an old team its because we focused on one position for too long at the top of the draft.

I'm not saying we shouldn't draft one, but I'd try to find some bulk on the FA market, and go a different direction in Rounds 1 and 2 in the draft, and see what we can find in round 3-7.

Our biggest gaff was taking Sims over John Henderson. Ironically, it might be smart to bring Sands back this offseason.

RedThat
12-28-2006, 12:41 AM
You know what?

What can I say? stuff happens!

I know the Chiefs haven't been the greatest at drafting DT's. But that shouldn't negate them from drafting one? When it's clear they most definately need one.

I remember for years we used to be terrible at drafting RB's. Remember those days when we drafted Greg Hill? Rashan Sheehee? Mike Cloud? Donnell Bennett?

But we didn't stop? And we got Larry Johnson. Just using this as an example of how sometimes the right players can come.

*I would still draft a DT no question about it. And if you have to sign one through FA like a good veteran that can provide some leadership on the defensive line, you do it. Thats probably the best way to help solidify that position.

I would still keep Edwards and Reed. I think those guys can provide some good depth.

Florida_Bronco
12-28-2006, 03:22 AM
We told you a long time ago the brownCow experiment was stupid.

That said, dummerville was a good value for the rat.

We got them dirt cheap, and Ekuban has been playing really well for us.

boogblaster
12-28-2006, 06:26 AM
I still think Hali was the best rook DE this year....

stevieray
12-28-2006, 06:31 AM
And he missed games. He'll be a force next year.

Chiefnj
12-28-2006, 07:05 AM
I still think Hali was the best rook DE this year....

Anderson of the Bears.

InChiefsHell
12-28-2006, 07:17 AM
Hali turned out to be an excellent pick and has had a great Rookie season. He's got tons of upside. The big test however is can he keep it up, or will he be another Hicks? Time will tell...

Saulbadguy
12-28-2006, 07:19 AM
Interceptions are a garbage state for DEs. Just sayin.

Bob Dole
12-28-2006, 07:27 AM
Hali turned out to be an excellent pick and has had a great Rookie season. He's got tons of upside. The big test however is can he keep it up, or will he be another Hicks? Time will tell...

There is only ONE Eric Hicks.

InChiefsHell
12-28-2006, 07:32 AM
There is only ONE Eric Hicks.

We can all hope and pray...

InChiefsHell
12-28-2006, 07:32 AM
Interceptions are a garbage state for DEs. Just sayin.

How come...and what state is that? :p

ct
12-28-2006, 08:16 AM
Interceptions are a garbage stat for DEs. Just sayin.

I would tend to agree, in general. But that's not a golden rule. Jason Taylor made 2 incredible plays this year, recognizing the play, and grabbing INTs when the QB tried to lob it over his head. He returned both for TDs. These were 2 truly amazing plays, and definitely NOT flukes.

Priest4Prez
12-28-2006, 08:43 AM
Yeah, but who did we pass on to get Hali? The best DE in the entire draft: Mathias Kiwanuka. He his having a moster year, but his stats are lower because of injuries. If we needed a DE, that was it.

Rain Man
12-28-2006, 08:53 AM
Yeah, but who did we pass on to get Hali? The best DE in the entire draft: Mathias Kiwanuka. He his having a moster year, but his stats are lower because of injuries. If we needed a DE, that was it.

I think Blair Thomas would have outproduced Barry Sanders except for injuries, too.

morphius
12-28-2006, 09:14 AM
I think Blair Thomas would have outproduced Barry Sanders except for injuries, too.
Percy Snow was great when he wasn't injured...

(or something stupid like that, or that one WR first rounder that couldn't stay healthy, or Michael Bennett now)

What we don't need is another oft injured player.

Thig Lyfe
12-28-2006, 10:09 AM
And who's second place with 5 recoveries?

DAVID CARR!


ROFL

Can he play DT?

Ari Chi3fs
12-28-2006, 10:22 AM
yeah, DUH!!!

Wow, your sig is really annoying.

Plus, its HOOOOOME of the Chiefs. Not Land. Dumbass n00b.

Mr. Laz
12-28-2006, 11:13 AM
difficult to judge ......


1. comparison of how many total defensive plays


2. surrounding talent

htismaqe
12-28-2006, 11:49 AM
Not difficult to judge at all. There isn't a player on our defense that is better and changing a game by forcing a turnover.

htismaqe
12-28-2006, 11:51 AM
Yeah, but who did we pass on to get Hali? The best DE in the entire draft: Mathias Kiwanuka. He his having a moster year, but his stats are lower because of injuries. If we needed a DE, that was it.

Best DE in the draft?

ROFL

Mr. Laz
12-28-2006, 12:18 PM
Not difficult to judge at all. There isn't a player on our defense that is better and changing a game by forcing a turnover.
so because Hali is the best player on our team(IYO) that means he's automatically better than Manny Lawson??



(assuming you're reponding to me that is ... if not, ignore and carry on)

Mecca
12-28-2006, 12:57 PM
Yea Hali's been solid this year but......he was also considered more NFL ready and more of a polished product than these other guys. It'll take 3-4 years to know if he's really better than these guys.

Rausch
12-28-2006, 01:11 PM
He still seems to have trouble fighting off the bigget T's (not uncommon) but he's more of a playmaker than I thought he'd be.

He's forced his share of fumbles and he's thinking turnover when he hits the QB. I like his play. If we can get some help at DT he and Allen will have huge sack totals next year...

beer bacon
12-28-2006, 03:41 PM
NFL.com fixed their stats. They took away that sack from Mitchell and gave it to Hali. 56 tackles, 7 sacks, and five FF with one game to go is pretty damn good.

htismaqe
12-28-2006, 03:43 PM
so because Hali is the best player on our team(IYO) that means he's automatically better than Manny Lawson??



(assuming you're reponding to me that is ... if not, ignore and carry on)

Yes, I was responding to you.

I evidently worded it wrongly.

So far he's had the most impact in that bunch AND he's the best on our team (at forcing turnovers).

InChiefsHell
12-28-2006, 04:12 PM
NFL.com fixed their stats. They took away that sack from Mitchell and gave it to Hali. 56 tackles, 7 sacks, and five FF with one game to go is pretty damn good.
Don't forget the meaningless INT... :p

crazycoffey
12-28-2006, 04:16 PM
Wow, your sig is really annoying.

Plus, its HOOOOOME of the Chiefs. Not Land. Dumbass n00b.

sorry I will change it promptly, it's been so long since I've heard that sweet song sang properly.

what else would you like me to change with my signature, don't like Monty Python?

crazycoffey
12-28-2006, 04:25 PM
Wow, your sig is really annoying.

Plus, its HOOOOOME of the Chiefs. Not Land. Dumbass n00b.


by the way, get your wife/girlfriend/sister a boob job BEFORE you put her pic on your signature.

dumbass your self

Rain Man
12-28-2006, 04:26 PM
NFL.com fixed their stats. They took away that sack from Mitchell and gave it to Hali. 56 tackles, 7 sacks, and five FF with one game to go is pretty damn good.

Heck, yeah.

Hali is probably the most productive rookie we've had in...my lifetime? Dear god, have we ever had a productive rookie?

crazycoffey
12-28-2006, 04:29 PM
Heck, yeah.

Hali is probably the most productive rookie we've had in...my lifetime? Dear god, have we ever had a productive rookie?


yikes, but this year we had a couple positives with rookies

do we yell at CP or Herm for that?

cdcox
12-28-2006, 04:38 PM
Joe Delaney had a pretty good rookie year (made the probowl):

1981 kan | 15 | 234 1121 4.8 3 | 22 246 11.2 0

Derrick Thomas was a probowler his rookie season.

Dale Carter had 7 interceptions his rookie year.

Will Shields started 15 games his rookie season.

Mike Livingston had a productive rookie season, even though he was a terrible, terrible QB.

That's a few.

ChiefsCountry
12-28-2006, 04:42 PM
Victor Riley, Sylvester Morris had good rookie seasons.

crazycoffey
12-28-2006, 04:43 PM
Victor Riley, Sylvester Morris had good rookie seasons.


GOOD POINT!!!! :hmmm:

BigRock
12-28-2006, 04:46 PM
Jared Allen had 9 sacks his rookie year and he didn't even start until, I think, the second half of the season. He was one of the only bright spots on the whole team that year.

Rain Man
12-28-2006, 04:46 PM
Whew. It's nice to know that we've had five to eight productive rookies over the past 35 years.

the Talking Can
12-28-2006, 04:50 PM
Yea Hali's been solid this year but......he was also considered more NFL ready and more of a polished product than these other guys. It'll take 3-4 years to know if he's really better than these guys.

sounds like an entry in the lexicon....

Any Chief's rookie = he's been solid this year BUT [insert vague counter-position established by reference to one draft report out of 3,000,000 draft reports...probably the one written by Voyager]


Hali has been a great success as a rookie and relative to his draft position, no qualifiers necessary.

the Talking Can
12-28-2006, 04:51 PM
by the way, get your wife/girlfriend/sister a boob job BEFORE you put her pic on your signature.

dumbass your self

this is what Phil left for?

crazycoffey
12-28-2006, 04:57 PM
this is what Phil left for?


you lost me

I knew I should have taken that right turn at albuquerque

Halfcan
12-28-2006, 10:00 PM
Heck, yeah.

Hali is probably the most productive rookie we've had in...my lifetime? Dear god, have we ever had a productive rookie?

DT had 20 sacks does that count?

Rausch
12-28-2006, 10:03 PM
DT had 20 sacks does that count?

No.

That falls under the "Marty got lucky" excuse.

Titus has all this $#it on file somewhere...

RedThat
12-28-2006, 10:57 PM
Hali has been ok. Inconsistent at times, but pretty solid.

He needs to work more against the bigger tackles. He struggles when the big guys get their hands on him.

I like the kids motor. Overall, he had a pretty solid season for a rookie. I hope he can improve.

But no question, he needs help in the middle.

tk13
12-28-2006, 11:03 PM
I still don't understand how Hali got the label as "more NFL ready" and "less ceiling". While a lot of these guys were playing football all their lives, Hali was living in freaking Liberia. You would think he'd have a lot more room to learn and grow because of that. But what do I know.

Hoover
12-28-2006, 11:08 PM
Hali sucks cause he wasn't on CNNSI's top ten rookie thingy...

the Talking Can
12-29-2006, 05:33 AM
I still don't understand how Hali got the label as "more NFL ready" and "less ceiling". While a lot of these guys were playing football all their lives, Hali was living in freaking Liberia. You would think he'd have a lot more room to learn and grow because of that. But what do I know.

Liberia's youth football league is legendary.

Redcoats58
12-29-2006, 06:32 AM
sounds like an entry in the lexicon....

Any Chief's rookie = he's been solid this year BUT [insert vague counter-position established by reference to one draft report out of 3,000,000 draft reports...probably the one written by Voyager]


Hali has been a great success as a rookie and relative to his draft position, no qualifiers necessary.
Lol! Nice, I almost forgot about Voyager's incessant mock drafts year in and year out.

scott free
12-29-2006, 06:51 AM
I still don't understand how Hali got the label as "more NFL ready" and "less ceiling". While a lot of these guys were playing football all their lives, Hali was living in freaking Liberia. You would think he'd have a lot more room to learn and grow because of that. But what do I know.

Yep, sometimes i really wonder what scouts are looking at/thinking. Every year at draft time i'll buy 2 or 3 draft guides & the player break-downs are wildly contradictory 75% of the time.

One take on a LT for instance will say "Doesnt shuffle & slide well, doesnt have good knee bend & lets guys get into his body too often & leans into blocks too often".

The next one says "Gets good bend at the knees, slides fluidly in pass pro. Uses hands to keep guys off him well, maintains good balance & rarely leans into blocks".

Sometimes the scouts sound like total morons. Herm & Co. got this one right.

InChiefsHell
12-29-2006, 07:41 AM
I remember that DJ was supposed to be bad at taking on blockers and Tamba was too small and not fast enough. Can't believe we've had 2 first round picks in a row that have been pretty solid. It's like listening to the weather, most of the time they don't know what the hell they are talking about.

morphius
12-29-2006, 07:49 AM
I remember that DJ was supposed to be bad at taking on blockers and Tamba was too small and not fast enough. Can't believe we've had 2 first round picks in a row that have been pretty solid. It's like listening to the weather, most of the time they don't know what the hell they are talking about.
Yeah, there was a lot of that about DJ because he went around the blocks. I guess he was supposed to act like an OL and just stand there and block back. I have to admit I giggle every time I watch him just go around the blocker to make a play.

Priest4Prez
12-29-2006, 08:35 AM
do you know what makes me laugh? It is watching Jared Allen being held every single play and he still applies pressure to the QB. Maybe the refs should be watching the holds a little more, like in the Raiders game. See what I mean and watch the game on NFL replay or you TIVO/DVR

Chiefnj
12-29-2006, 09:04 AM
DJ and Hali are two examples of why you should read scouting reports right now and after the final bowl game. They are based on what happened on the field.

After January, is when the rumors start flying - DJ doesn't take on blocks. Then if you have a bad combine workout things get exagerated. Hali runs a 4.6 and is now slow and doesn't come off the line quickly - all BS.

penchief
12-29-2006, 10:29 AM
Not only is Hali good in pursuit and a good tackler but he hits like a ton of bricks. He hits with compacted force and it jars the ball carrier. I agree that some help in the middle would open up his game big time.

Woodrow Call
12-29-2006, 10:32 AM
Not only is Hali good in pursuit and a good tackler but he hits like a ton of bricks.

That is what has surprised me the most. Hali is all over the field.

Rain Man
12-29-2006, 10:41 AM
Not only is Hali good in pursuit and a good tackler but he hits like a ton of bricks. He hits with compacted force and it jars the ball carrier. I agree that some help in the middle would open up his game big time.

As badly as we need help at OT and WR, I must admit that getting a strong DT to go with Allen and Hali could have a big payoff.

I'm always intrigued with the benefits of having one really strong unit on a team. Opponents can avoid one shutdown cornerback, but they can't avoid two of them. They can double team one good pass rusher, but they can't double-team three of them. Our own offensive line the past few years is another example. When your entire line can pull, pass-block, and run-block straight ahead, the opponents can't game-plan to exploit anything.

RINGLEADER
12-29-2006, 12:00 PM
How bout that Mario Williams?

htismaqe
12-29-2006, 12:58 PM
DJ and Hali are two examples of why you should read scouting reports right now and after the final bowl game. They are based on what happened on the field.

After January, is when the rumors start flying - DJ doesn't take on blocks. Then if you have a bad combine workout things get exagerated. Hali runs a 4.6 and is now slow and doesn't come off the line quickly - all BS.

It pains me to say it, but the PERFECT example is Marcus McNeil. He got owned at the Senior Bowl last year and fell all the way to SD in the 2nd. And they have they're LT for the next 10 years now...

Priest4Prez
12-29-2006, 03:41 PM
How bout that Mario Williams?

Why would we want Mario?

Spicy McHaggis
12-29-2006, 05:37 PM
I'd like to see Dumervil get to play next to a serious DT, I bet that would elevate his game quite a bit.

I was not happy to see him go to Denver, especially on the 2nd day. Once again production is severely undervalued in face of underwhelming physical characteristics.