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View Full Version : GREEN DEAL SHOULD GET DONE FOR A FOURTH-ROUNDER


LTforMVP
04-27-2007, 03:27 PM
POSTED 4:24 p.m. EDT, April 27, 2007

GREEN DEAL SHOULD GET DONE FOR A FOURTH-ROUNDER

We just heard John Clayton of ESPN report on the air that the Chiefs have dropped their demand for a first-day pick from the Fins for quarterback Trent Green.

This means that the Chiefs, who don't have a fourth-round pick, would take a fourth-round pick to get the deal done.

And we think that's a fair price.

The debate has been that the Chiefs think the Fins should give up something equivalent to what Green, who would likely be their starting quarterback, is worth to them. The Fins think that the Chiefs should take something equivalent to what Green, who will otherwise be cut, is worth to them.

Last year, the Titans and Ravens were in the same position with quarterback Steve McNair. They settled on a fourth-round pick.

It's a no-brainer to us -- the same deal should be done here.

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

Bill Lundberg
04-27-2007, 03:31 PM
STOP SCREAMING AT ME

OnTheWarpath58
04-27-2007, 03:32 PM
Great. If it actually happens.

A R4 pick is almost the same value as a swap in the 3rd.

Take it, Carl.

Sure-Oz
04-27-2007, 03:34 PM
If a 4th is offered it will get done

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 03:34 PM
PLEASE BE TRUE

that would be great news....make it happen Carl

Codered
04-27-2007, 03:34 PM
PFT is reporting it? Sorry I won't believe it until Warpaint does.

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 03:35 PM
a high 4th...sweet

do it..DO IT

el borracho
04-27-2007, 03:35 PM
Do the Dolphins have a 4th round pick? I thought I had read that they did not. If they do I would be happy with the trade.

Count Alex's Wins
04-27-2007, 03:36 PM
Do the Dolphins have a 4th round pick? I thought I had read that they did not. If they do I would be happy with the trade.

They don't have a 5th.

Coogs
04-27-2007, 03:37 PM
Do the Dolphins have a 4th round pick? I thought I had read that they did not. If they do I would be happy with the trade.

I just went over to Great Blue North. That site says the Dolphins have a 4th. Pick #108. They don't have a 5th rounder.

OnTheWarpath58
04-27-2007, 03:39 PM
Actually, the R4 pick is worth a little more than a swap of 3rd's. I was wrong.

Our picks would be at:

23, 54, 82, 108, 148, 160, 196 and 231.

Tribal Warfare
04-27-2007, 03:40 PM
Bwwaahhaaa

:fire: Good! Good ! :fire:

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 03:40 PM
Miami has the 9th pick in the 4th round...this is a good deal...

Smed1065
04-27-2007, 03:42 PM
Sold!

Chiefnj
04-27-2007, 03:42 PM
Carl's eyes got watery and he blinked.

eazyb81
04-27-2007, 03:42 PM
A 4th has been the fair deal the entire time - it's amazing how long it takes to get a deal done around draft time.

Chiefnj
04-27-2007, 03:43 PM
A 4th has been the fair deal the entire time - it's amazing how long it takes to get a deal done around draft time.

I don't think it will happen until it is time for the Dolphins to make the pick in the 4th. Teams will regroup after day 1 and reevaluate everything. They will want to make sure there isn't a player that made it past day 1 that they really want.

SLAG
04-27-2007, 03:44 PM
I want a 4th and a 6th and a 2008 conditional.. and a Hot Dog...

DTLB58
04-27-2007, 03:47 PM
I want a 4th and a 6th and a 2008 conditional.. and a Hot Dog...

ROFL

Whose the Hot Dog for? You? Carl? Or how about one free weenie for the whole stadium at the home opener? :)

Fish
04-27-2007, 04:07 PM
The Fins think that the Chiefs should take something equivalent to what Green, who will otherwise be cut, is worth to them.

Rumor thrown around so much it's treated as fact....

el borracho
04-27-2007, 04:12 PM
Rumor thrown around so much it's treated as fact....
Oh, man, I wasted about 2 hours on here a few nights back trying to convince someone that Green's release was not a given. Even links to articles with quotes by Peterson and Edwards were not enough. It's like a bullet-proof rumor.

Count Alex's Wins
04-27-2007, 04:13 PM
Some Dolphins fans think Miami has ALL the leverage...

Sure-Oz
04-27-2007, 04:15 PM
Some Dolphins fans think Miami has ALL the leverage...
Miami needs Green way more than we do, that is for sure...

siberian khatru
04-27-2007, 04:19 PM
I said from the beginning that I'd take a 5th for him ... and since the Fins didn't have a 5th, I'd take their 4th. :D

If this is true, I'd be very satisfied.

beer bacon
04-27-2007, 04:21 PM
A 4th has been the fair deal the entire time - it's amazing how long it takes to get a deal done around draft time.

The deal was never going to get done until after the Raiders picked in the 1st.

Chiefnj
04-27-2007, 04:22 PM
The deal was never going to get done until after the Raiders picked in the 1st.

Why?

Rooster
04-27-2007, 04:24 PM
Rumor thrown around so much it's treated as fact....

LOL.. I know what you mean. If you hear someones opinion enough times over and over you start to think it's true.

A fourth would be alright. Get it done and throw in Sims for free. What the hell. :)

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 04:24 PM
Why?

because John Clayton is freakishly ugly

el borracho
04-27-2007, 04:25 PM
Why?
If I were Miami I would wait until after my first round selection before consumating any deal with the Chiefs. If I got Quinn at #9, I wouldn't bother trading for Green. If I didn't get Quinn, I would be more motivated to make the trade.

carlos3652
04-27-2007, 04:25 PM
Because if the raiders picked someone other than QB, Miami might have had a chance at either Quinn or Russell, which means they wouldnt aquire Green...

Frankie
04-27-2007, 04:41 PM
I've always predicted 4th. But now I kinda want a little more. Especially if there is any substance to Oakland having signed Quinn rumor. If Quinn is taken Miami should be a motivated buyer. Come on Carl, hold out for a 3rd. Or at least a 4th and a 6th.

Sure-Oz
04-27-2007, 04:44 PM
I've always predicted 4th. But now I kinda want a little more. Especially if there is any substance to Oakland having signed Quinn rumor. If Quinn is taken Miami should be a motivated buyer. Come on Carl, hold out for a 3rd. Or at least a 4th and a 6th.
Their 4th is like a late 3rd...id be happy.

penchief
04-27-2007, 05:25 PM
If I were Miami I would wait until after my first round selection before consumating any deal with the Chiefs. If I got Quinn at #9, I wouldn't bother trading for Green. If I didn't get Quinn, I would be more motivated to make the trade.

Quinn is going to be a better quarterback with Green there. He's not going to learn that system overnight. He's going to get to watch the best at running it for at least a year. Green would be a huge asset to Quinn's development. I think the dolphins really want Green. I've said for a while that a fourth this year and a conditional sixth to fourth pick in 08 is fair.

Mr. Laz
04-27-2007, 05:38 PM
i do really think Green is worth a day 1 pick ....... at least a pick that could be a 1st day pick depending on Greens playing time.

i wouldn't be pissed about a 4th .... not happy either, but not pissed.

BigRock
04-27-2007, 05:39 PM
Erroneous Nick is apparently claiming that the Fins have offered KC a 4th and Carl's still holding out for a 3rd or a 4th and more picks.

cmh6476
04-27-2007, 05:39 PM
maybe we can sucker em in to throwing in an incentive based pick next year :shrug:

Count Alex's Wins
04-27-2007, 05:40 PM
Erroneous Nick is apparently claiming that the Fins have offered KC a 4th and Carl's still holding out for a 3rd.

Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.

Mr. Laz
04-27-2007, 05:42 PM
maybe we can sucker em in to throwing in an incentive based pick next year :shrug:
i'm still holding out hope for that


like we got screwed with welborn


a 4th rounder this year ... next year a 7th, that can become another 4th next year or something if Green starts 75% of their games.

Brock
04-27-2007, 05:43 PM
Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.

It isn't premium information when it's made up bullshit.

Count Alex's Wins
04-27-2007, 05:46 PM
It isn't premium information when it's made up bullshit.

Why don't you ask the mods how they feel about it...

Brock
04-27-2007, 05:46 PM
Why don't you ask the mods how they feel about it...

Because I don't care?

Mecca
04-27-2007, 05:49 PM
Nick will come over and yell at us........I'm sure everyone is scared.

stlchiefs
04-27-2007, 05:56 PM
Nick will come over and yell at us........I'm sure everyone is scared.

Maybe he'll pay for all the free advertising/spamming that he gets over here from GoChiefs

Mecca
04-27-2007, 05:57 PM
Maybe he will pay Phil the money he owes him......

BigRock
04-27-2007, 05:59 PM
Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.
I didn't know it was premium. My most sincere apologies.

WAIT. I only said he was "apparently" saying it, I didn't say for sure he was. You confirmed it was true. I think that makes you just as guilty. Perhaps moreso.

tmax63
04-27-2007, 06:02 PM
excellent trap there BR

Logical
04-27-2007, 06:02 PM
I have to say I would be ecstatic if we got a 4th for Green, that is way above what his value should be for this draft. Go Carl.

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 06:21 PM
Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.

so is spam, but that doesn't stop you

alanm
04-27-2007, 06:26 PM
Maybe he will pay Phil the money he owes him......
ROFL :LOL: ROFL

Count Alex's Wins
04-27-2007, 06:27 PM
so is spam, but that doesn't stop you

Link me to some of said spam.

Bill Lundberg
04-27-2007, 06:48 PM
Link me to some of said spam.

http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3929966&postcount=11

Mile High Mania
04-27-2007, 06:51 PM
Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.

If it's 'premium' ... why post it here? Nobody buying it there?

|Zach|
04-27-2007, 06:52 PM
http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3929966&postcount=11
So in your opinion we shouldn't people able to speak of other Chiefs boards? Wah?

How is that post spam?

Mr. Laz
04-27-2007, 06:52 PM
Link me to some of said spam.
every time you post a partial story with a link or a contest with a link for another football website that you are affiliated with it's spam.


we don't need any searching or links to know how much that has happened.

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 06:53 PM
Link me to some of said spam.

you offering me a free premium membership?

|Zach|
04-27-2007, 06:54 PM
every time you post a partial story with a link or a contest with a link for another football website that you are affiliated with it's spam.


we don't need any searching or links to know how much that has happened.
He has been asked to do that no longer...I am sure it will stop.

I don't think it will stop people from whining or people calling football info spam but it is what it is.

Bill Lundberg
04-27-2007, 06:55 PM
So in your opinion we shouldn't people able to speak of other Chiefs boards? Wah?

How is that post spam?

You should people able to do what ever you want.

milkman
04-27-2007, 07:15 PM
Miami needs Green way more than we do, that is for sure...

No they don't, really.

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 07:18 PM
No they don't, really.

we don't need Green at all, how could they need him less than that?

milkman
04-27-2007, 07:31 PM
we don't need Green at all, how could they need him less than that?

Neither team is going to win a SB, or compete for one even, with Green.

Neither team needs him.

He's a luxury for Miami that will ensure that they will achieve the same level of mediocrity over the next couple of years as the Chiefs.

With him they are mediocre, drafting anywhere from low mid, to high mid first round, much like the Chiefs.

Without him, they draft top 10 most likely.

If I were Dolphin fan, I'd rather draft higher and build.

If I'm the organization, I can't really see any benefit that makes Green a real need.

the Talking Can
04-27-2007, 07:37 PM
Neither team is going to win a SB, or compete for one even, with Green.

Neither team needs him.

He's a luxury for Miami that will ensure that they will achieve the same level of mediocrity over the next couple of years as the Chiefs.

With him they are mediocre, drafting anywhere from low mid, to high mid first round, much like the Chiefs.

Without him, they draft top 10 most likely.

If I were Dolphin fan, I'd rather draft higher and build.

If I'm the organization, I can't really see any benefit that makes Green a real need.

but they've already negotiated a contract...they want him, and they want him to be their starter...they wouldn't have done this if they didn't feel they needed him....

milkman
04-27-2007, 07:44 PM
but they've already negotiated a contract...they want him, and they want him to be their starter...they wouldn't have done this if they didn't feel they needed him....

They feel they need him to help implement their offense, and to ensure they aren't stuck with Cleo Lemon starting.

I'm just stating my opinion that I think it's a mistake to trade for Green.

In the long term, they'd be better served just letting Lemon start, and taking just a little longer to get the offense worked out.

Giving the Chiefs a draft pick is wasting resources.

chagrin
04-27-2007, 08:19 PM
Actually, the R4 pick is worth a little more than a swap of 3rd's. I was wrong.

Our picks would be at:

23, 54, 82, 108, 148, 160, 196 and 231.

If these numbers are correct, this will be a solid draft for us, as long as fuggin Carl doesn't go drafting 2 TE's and another safety

el borracho
04-27-2007, 08:28 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau

ChiefaRoo
04-27-2007, 08:31 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau

Fooking dismal

el borracho
04-27-2007, 08:34 PM
Ooops- hit "reply" a little early.

To finish that thought, out of eight 4th round picks in the last 7 years we have gotten one above average player and seven nobodies. 4th round picks are a gamble; Trent Green is more of a sure thing and easily surpasses the production of any of those picks besides Allen. Heck, Green for 2-3 years might be worth all of those (excluding Allen) picks put together.

el borracho
04-27-2007, 08:36 PM
I guess there is the risk that Green's brain is mashed like a potato which is why Miami should probably offer us a conditional pick.

Messier
04-27-2007, 08:41 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau
Too bad we're not a good drafting team like the Colts. Here's their 4th rounders:

2005-Dylan Gandy, Matt Gioirdano
2004-Kendyll Pope
2003-Steve Sciullo
2002-David Thorton
2001-Ryan Diem
2000-Josh Williams

milkman
04-27-2007, 08:41 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau

I think for the Dolphins situation, he's not worth a 4th round pick.

greg63
04-27-2007, 08:45 PM
I think a fourth rounder is about the best we can hope for at this point.

el borracho
04-27-2007, 08:46 PM
Ah, you think they have no chance at winning big so they shouldn't even try for mediocrity? That they should just outright suck and hope that they are better in a few years?

KcMizzou
04-27-2007, 08:51 PM
Ah, you think they have no chance at winning big so they shouldn't even try for mediocrity? That they should just outright suck and hope that they are better in a few years?That seems to be the general idea lately. If you're not thought of as one of the top 5 teams in the NFL, just pack it in and play to lose.

milkman
04-27-2007, 08:51 PM
Ah, you think they have no chance at winning big so they shouldn't even try for mediocrity? That they should just outright suck and hope that they are better in a few years?

Exactly.

They should be doing exactly what the Chiefs should be doing (and apparently are attempting).

Build through the draft and try to field a SB contender in a couple of years.

KcMizzou
04-27-2007, 08:52 PM
I think a fourth rounder is about the best we can hope for at this point.I'd be fine with a 4th... not great but it beats the crap out of a 6th. If Trent were 28 it'd be a hell of a different story, but he's not.

blueballs
04-27-2007, 08:54 PM
I hope the trade goes through before
they find out NewChief lives on Trent's
property in Ark and has cat fights for $$

Frankie
04-27-2007, 08:56 PM
I think the dolphins really want Green. I've said for a while that a fourth this year and a conditional sixth to fourth pick in 08 is fair.
Cam Cameron was Green's HC in college, I think.

KcMizzou
04-27-2007, 08:57 PM
Exactly.

They should be doing exactly what the Chiefs should be doing (and apparently are attempting).

Build through the draft and try to field a SB contender in a couple of years.I'm not against that manner of thinking... in fact, I'm pretty excited that the Chiefs seem to be taking that approach. (I'd never have believed it could happen with Carl near the end of his reign.)

Not everyone can do that though... the Chiefs have a solid rabid fan base that (I believe) is ready for this. I think KC can handle a couple rough seasons and keep the stadium full with the promise of a brighter future. I'm not so sure Miami's ready for that.

Groves
04-27-2007, 08:58 PM
Posting premium information is generally frowned upon here.

I think you got that wrong. It's frowned upon THERE at WPI.

I believe even a straw poll would inform you that it's not exactly frowned upon here, as you put it. Not by much of us, anyway.

Messier
04-27-2007, 09:00 PM
They seem like they won't budge from the 6th round pick offer. This probably won't get resolved until tomorrow night.

milkman
04-27-2007, 09:01 PM
That seems to be the general idea lately. If you're not thought of as one of the top 5 teams in the NFL, just pack it in and play to lose.

No.
That's not it at all.

But why give up draft picks for Green.

If he were a FA, then yeah, sign him.

But use those picks to build with for the future.

Trent Green is not the future.

I'd be hoarding picks like GoChiefs and Star Wars figurines.

milkman
04-27-2007, 09:04 PM
I'm not against that manner of thinking... in fact, I'm pretty excited that the Chiefs seem to be taking that approach. (I'd never have believed it could happen with Carl near the end of his reign.)

Not everyone can do that though... the Chiefs have a solid rabid fan base that (I believe) is ready for this. I think KC can handle a couple rough seasons and keep the stadium full with the promise of a brighter future. I'm not so sure Miami's ready for that.

With revenue sharing in the NFL, a couple of down seasons aren't that difficult to work through.

In a couple of years, with good drafting, the fans will be back.

Frankie
04-27-2007, 09:06 PM
He's a luxury for Miami that will ensure that they will achieve the same level of mediocrity over the next couple of years as the Chiefs.
If they get Green he can be a great tool for developing either Quinn or whoever QB they might draft in the 2nd.

Mecca
04-27-2007, 09:08 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau

That list wouldn't look as bad if they had taken Brandon Lloyd like I was practically begging for in 03 but no......Brett Williams.

milkman
04-27-2007, 09:13 PM
If they get Green he can be a great tool for developing either Quinn or whoever QB they might draft in the 2nd.

That's what you have QB coaches for.

chop
04-27-2007, 09:16 PM
That list wouldn't look as bad if they had taken Brandon Lloyd like I was practically begging for in 03 but no......Brett Williams.

Yeah, Brandon Lloyd has been really lighting up the NFL. If Lloyd had been drafted by the Chiefs, everyone here would be calling for his head by now. The guy does have potential but you all know what potential does for you if not utilized....nothing.

Mecca
04-27-2007, 09:16 PM
Atleast he's still in the league, that's more than Brett Williams can say.

chop
04-27-2007, 09:18 PM
Milkman, You really don't think a starting QB is worth a 4th, even if that QB only plays 2-3 years?

For perspective, here are the Chiefs 4th rounders, of late:
2006- none
2005- Craphonso Thorpe
2004- a) Samie Parker, b) Jared Allen
2003- Brett Williams
2002- Omar Easy
2001- a) Monty Beisel, b) George Lane
2000- Frank Moreau

Seeing Moreau on this list reminds me of the days when the Chiefs couldn't find a good rb. It wasn't that long ago.

KcMizzou
04-27-2007, 09:20 PM
Seeing Moreau on this list reminds me of the days when the Chiefs couldn't find a good rb. It wasn't that long ago.No shit. How easily we forget.

chop
04-27-2007, 09:21 PM
Atleast he's still in the league, that's more than Brett Williams can say.

I was a fan of Lloyd going into last years fantasy drafts. I quickly soured on him. He had so much hype going into last year and he didn't come close to all of those projections.

chop
04-27-2007, 09:25 PM
No shit. How easily we forget.

I cringe when I hear someone say that rb's are a dime a dozen because I remember very well how long the Chiefs were without a premier runner in his prime.

Mecca
04-27-2007, 09:26 PM
I was a fan of Lloyd going into last years fantasy drafts. I quickly soured on him. He had so much hype going into last year and he didn't come close to all of those projections.

Well the Redskins tend to do that to people....

chiefsfan1963
04-27-2007, 09:30 PM
hello did anybody think that KC would get any better than a 4th rounder for Green? Jesus H Christ!!!!!!!!!!!!

sign LJ and get 2 extra picks. One for Dante and one for Green. That is not a bad day's work if we can get this done.

This is truely a rebuilding year this season. No prime time for us this year. I'm glad I have DTV.

We'll have 7 picks next year possibly more and perhaps a Top 10 position in the draft. Not bad. Then one more year of Herm and CP and then we throw the BUMS out and start our New Chapter FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

blueballs
04-27-2007, 09:33 PM
Dick Vermeil wears depends
he doesn't mess his pants
his chawed ass needs the padding

Skip Towne
04-27-2007, 09:33 PM
I don't think you have to hit rock bottom while rebuilding. Marty never does.

Direckshun
04-27-2007, 10:49 PM
How much you want to bet the Chiefs and the Dolphins never do business again ever.

keg in kc
04-27-2007, 10:59 PM
Isn't posting BS from PFT a bannable offense?

El Jefe
04-27-2007, 11:02 PM
Is the deal done yet? I been at work all day and I just got on, gotta catch up.

keg in kc
04-27-2007, 11:04 PM
Is the deal done yet? I been at work all day and I just got on, gotta catch up.Hey, me too. Working until 11 on a Friday is great ain't it.

'course, it's my own fault.

Phobia
04-27-2007, 11:07 PM
Cam Cameron was Green's HC in college, I think.
You're way off. Green was gone 5 year before Cameron took the HC job at Indiana.