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View Full Version : NFBT : The Marijuana Thread - Your Opinions


BIG_DADDY
04-10-2001, 10:22 AM
Considering that this is a pretty conservative BB I thought I would post this thread to prove a point. The point would be that I feel even the most conservatives want to end this war on drugs, especially locking people up for possession of an herb. There were 1.4 million people arrested in this country on marijuana related charges in 1998 & 99. There have already been 8 states who have approved the prescription of medical marijuana with over 20 states enacting some kind of marijuana legislation. All of this and the all out assault on this devils herb continues. The US Supreme Court recently heard the case for medical marijuana and seemed to be attacking the legislation instead of trying to objectively review the facts. I'll bet my right arm that they will continue this all out assault when they announce their verdict. Personally I think possession on less than a pound should be decriminalized. I also feel that the Supreme Court should quit telling my doctor what he can and cannot prescribe. I feel that it is all about the money. If the drug companies were the ones making money the legislation would be passed tomorrow. As long as the rich are being handled the legislation will follow. It's not what the voters (the people) want, or vote for, as the government and Supreme Court continue to do whatever they want to. Your opinions?
<IMG SRC="http://www.marijuana.org/GraphixFolder/graphix3/leaf_ani.gif";

Phobia
04-10-2001, 10:26 AM
I don't care about MJ one way or the other. I can take it or leave it. The problem is that many people can't control it and the government feels a need to legislate it. I know the same argument can be made for alcohol. Legalize it as a trial and study the results. What can it hurt? The people that currently use will still use and those opposed will stay away.

Is this what you were expecting from someone as far left as I?

BIG_DADDY
04-10-2001, 10:32 AM
Phobia,

Most that do not use, do not care until they realize that it costs tax payers over 30k a year to house an inmate. 1.4 million arrests in 98 & 99. I know you don't care how much you have to pay in taxes, right?

Phobia
04-10-2001, 10:36 AM
To be fair, I'd guess a very small percentage of those arrests actually spent any time in the pokey. Additionally, those that are in prison for dealing MJ probably also don't limit themselves to MJ. Another educated guess.

I'd consider myself a user - just haven't used in several years. I'm one of those guys that doesn't enjoy it enough to go find it for himself but if you break it out and offer, I won't turn you down.

Mark M
04-10-2001, 10:36 AM
I think my thoughts on this have been pretty well known ...

Legalize it. I've done just about everything and pot is the least dangerous of anything. Plus, it does have medicinal uses.

Control is why the gov't won't legalize it ... they would have none. It can grow just about anywhere and, once legal, there would be no way to stop where it came from. This isn't a bad thing, IMO, but something the gov't doesn't want.

Sorry so short ... must post quickly due to prying eyes.

MM
~~Wondering when 4:20 will get here ...

alanm
04-10-2001, 10:37 AM
We've had this discussion before. I vote now as I voted then. Legalize it as Bob Marley said.

alanm
04-10-2001, 10:39 AM
10 days Mark. 10 days!!

seclark
04-10-2001, 10:40 AM
legalize it...that way maybe i could turn my brother in law into the police next time he pinches a "handfull" out of my stash!
sec

redhed
04-10-2001, 11:00 AM
alanm: Wasn't that Peter Tosh?

"Legalize it...Don't criticize it. Legalize it (yeah, yeah)... and I'll advertise it." - P.T.

redhed has no opinion on this subject.

Logical
04-10-2001, 11:21 AM
Legalize it and tax the heck out of it. $5 a pack of 20 with $4 being tax.

ExtremeChief
04-10-2001, 11:24 AM
IMHO I don't think it will ever be legalized. John Q. Public can grow enough in his house to last forever, so how would the federal govt. receive taxes from it?? If there is no great benefit to the govt., why would they do it???


As far as myself, I don't see how it's any worse than alcohol, so it just as well be legal.

doooobieee, dooobie, doooo....

Iowanian
04-10-2001, 11:26 AM
But I really could care less if others do...my stance has softened considerably....I rememeber beating the hell out of a kid from another town who pulled out a doobie at a party.

It might be nice to raise a crop that paid a little something too....corn has been $2/bushel since WWII, and costs have increased exponentially...

I draw a deep line in the sand at MJ though...won't budge on other stuff.

~Iowanian won't be smoking all the profits.

keg in kc
04-10-2001, 02:30 PM
I think it will be legalized. I remember reading something not to long ago about the DEA (I think, though maybe it was FDA) considering taking it off their list of "really bad stuff". I'm not a user, although I have tried it a time or two and don't have any particular problem with it.

However, I tend to agree with BDs take on it. The biggest obstacle to its legalization is pharmaceutical companies.

It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out over the next 20 years or so.

As for the so-called "drug war" I've always considered that a farce and an insult to any intelligent Americans. There's more than enough evidence, at least IMHO, that the guys in D.C. have been playing both sides against the middle on that one all along...

ct
04-10-2001, 03:39 PM
My opinion? I'm in favor!! Much like KPhobia, I just don't use anymore.

Clint in Wichita
04-10-2001, 06:09 PM
Tobacco can be grown at home, yet companies like Phillip Morris rake in billions.

I'd bet they've already got a plan in place for converting a large portion of their sales to MJ.

Anyone who's ever REALLY overdone it w/ alcohol knows firsthand that it's worse for you than MJ.

ExtremeChief
04-10-2001, 09:06 PM
Maybe I'm wrong (it wouldn't be the first time) but I don't think it is as easy to grow tobacco at home as it is marijuana. If it was, with cigs at $3+ a pack, a lot more people would be doing just that.

How many more people would smoke the wacky if it were legal??? I might be tempted to smoke more often if it were.

law abiding (as far as the law knows)...

47mack
04-16-2001, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by Mark M


Legalize it. I've done just about everything and pot is the least dangerous of anything. Plus, it does have medicinal uses.



Using the medicinal value as a red herring to legalize it for personal use is a crock. I highly doubt that our government will legalize it as a whole because it is proven to be a good medicine (if that is ever proven). Last I heard, it was at the Supreme Court for the medicinal use, not personal use.

I used to be very against the legalization, but know I have no strong stance either way. I have seen the bad things that MJ can do to someone, but I have also seen the bad things that alcohol can do.

Clint
To say that "someone who over uses alcohol will agree that MJ isn't as bad for you" is a weak argument. Over using MJ, alcohol, and/or tobacco will have pretty much the same effect. It is just a matter of which one you are abusing.

Clint in Wichita
04-16-2001, 02:45 PM
There is no way you can experience excessive levels of both alcohol and tobacco & walk away with the feeling that they're "about the same".

47mack
04-16-2001, 02:56 PM
Clint
My point is that all three will end you up in the same place...dead (if you over-use it). If I had to choose, I would go down with my bottle of Jim Beam!

BIG_DADDY
04-16-2001, 03:15 PM
47,

All three will not have you running your car into innocent people or beating your wife either. In my opinion it is ridiculous to be charging people with crimes for mere possession. The biggest crime though is having a government and supreme court ignore the people and do whatever they want. The government has definitely gotten WAY TOO BIG, POWERFUL, and COSTLY.

kcfanintitanhell
04-16-2001, 06:01 PM
I think the greatest obstacle in legalizing MJ isn't the pharmeceutical industry: it's the oil industry (of course they may be one and the same). Any step, however tiny, toward legalization means that this country is one step closer to the legal producing and cultivation of hemp, which is really scary if you're a Big Oil Company. Big Oil has been one of the driving forces behind keeping MJ illegal for the past 60 years (remember the Reefer Madness infomercials?) Oil companies 60 years ago recognized the huge trouble they'd be in if hemp was converted into a cheap, clean-burning fuel-thusly, they have done everything they could to
make sure any form of MJ stayed illegal.
And although the MJ plant and the hemp plant are from the same family, the hemp plant contains very little THC, the active ingredient that makes a person high. (I'm not the only one from the upper Midwest that tried smoking ditchweed and got little more than a sore throat and headache, am I?)
The bottom line is that if 6% of this country's farmland was converted to growing this noxious weed, we'd never have to drill another oil well again, anywhere, ever.

KCWolfman
04-16-2001, 08:46 PM
Big Daddy - Not to get into the whole debate... but I have one point.

The government tells your doctor what to prescribe on a daily basis, it is called the FDA.

While I am for limiting government in most phases, the FDA has helped more than it has hindered over the last several decades.

Thalidomide is a perfect example. It was a drug widely prescribed in Europe for morning sickness. The FDA did not approve it. After several years a link was made between the drug and malformed appendages on fetuses. Look at your hands and feet and be glad for an FDA.

As far as marijuana as a medicinal property, there is no basis in fact that it does better than many other drugs in limiting pain or slowing down the processes of glaucoma. That is merely someone looking for an excuse to be high - at least be honest.

kcfanintitanhell
04-16-2001, 10:15 PM
Sorry, but the REAL debate over the legality of marijauna has never been about the medical benefits or the mind-altering abilities of THC: sure, there have been claims about how MJ has been known to lessen the severity of side effects of chemotherapy,but it is not a proven elixir, and also it has been used successfully in the treatment of glaucoma, but not to the extent that it's a recommended treatment.
The REAL issue over marijuana is not about any of these things-I haven't smoked pot in years-but I know that the legalization of growing hemp/marijuana would help countless farmers put their business back on a paying basis, much to the chagrin of the major Oil companies.
Now I'll step back off my podium. Sorry, this stuff pisses me off so much I had to vent.

47mack
04-17-2001, 06:49 AM
Originally posted by BIG_DADDY
47,

All three will not have you running your car into innocent people or beating your wife either.

So, you are saying that only alcohol effects your driving abilities? I don't agree with that. However, I do agree with your thoughts on the government.

Gaz
04-17-2001, 09:09 AM
Legalize it.

And legalize all other drugs as well. It is not a proper function of government to regulate what consenting adults do to themselves or one another.

If someone gets high and drives a car, drop the hammer on him. If he snorts cocaine at home until his sinuses rot out, I do not care.

xoxo~
Gaz
Up on that ol’ Libertarian soapbox again.

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 09:29 AM
47,

I would hardly call driving under the influence of MJ and Alcohol the same. Similar MAYBE but not the same.

Wolfman,

My fiance lost her mom 3 years ago to cancer. The only thing that helped her hold down food was MJ. As far as the other benefits, why should anyone have to spend a bunch of money to support our pharmaceutical companies when they just grow an herb in the back yard. Herbs do have health benefits and IMHO MJ is not the exception. Even if it was I still think it should be legalized. I am tierd of seeing people locked up for somthing so ridiculous.
I am sure the government has done good things(FDA) and for every good thing they have done I am sure they have done plenty of bad things in the interest of promoting a particular pharmaceutical companies best interest and not the peoples.

kcfanintitanhell,

Where did you find out that "Refer Madness" was produced by the oil companies? I thought Hearst had something to do with that.

Mark M
04-17-2001, 10:50 AM
47--
As much as I'd love for it to be legal for any use, I'd be happy to see it legalized for for medical use first so people can see that it's not this devil weed people always make it out to be. The reason that there are no firm studies on it's medicinal use is two fold:
1. The gov't makes it almost impossible to get permission to carry out the tests.
2. The pharmaceutical companies would rather spend their time coming up with drugs that will net them the most profit.

The fact that it's classified as a schedule 1 narcotic is the most ridiculous thing the government has ever done. And the fact that we, as taxpayers, have spent billions trying to stop it (to no avail) is just plain sad. Maybe someday those in power will see the light ...

MM
~~He'll advertise it.

Dartgod
04-17-2001, 11:02 AM
I say legalize it. I can't smoke anymore because of my job, but it's no big deal.

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 11:07 AM
MM,

I couldn't agree more.

47mack
04-17-2001, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by BIG_DADDY
47,

I would hardly call driving under the influence of MJ and Alcohol the same. Similar MAYBE but not the same.



Similar or the same, what difference does it make? Either way it is endangering the innocent people on the roads.

I am not saying it shouldn't be legal, I am merely offering a different point of view. All to often I run across an MJ smoker that says...."legalize it, it is a good medicine and a great alternative crop." What the hell does that have to do with them wanting it for personal use? NOTHING.

As for there not being enough research done on the medicinal use, that isn't true either. There is plenty of on-going research being done, there just hasn't been enough proof that medicinal MJ is any better than already available medicine.

TeenagerFromMars
04-17-2001, 11:53 AM
I've said it before, but I think it bears repeating:

The only objection I might have to legalizing it is if there is a possibility that the Chiefs might get Vanover and Morris back (eeeeeeek!).

Schedule 1 narcotic my a$$!

Lightning Rod
04-17-2001, 12:18 PM
The only reason it is illegal is the because we have decided it is bad for people. We as a society have determined that we should make people do what is good for them whether they like it or not. Is lighting anything on fire and sucking the smoke into your body a good idea? I don’t think so. The same exact thought process could be used for Alcohol, Cigarettes, or Bratwurst, you name it. I do not get high, I did when I was younger and now I choose not to. Most things in moderation are essentially harmless most things in excess are not. Hell if you drink enough water you can damage yourself buy flushing out all the vitamins and minerals in your body. In short what consenting adults do in their own home is none of my business. If you want to prostitute yourself, smoke crack, or hit your self in the crotch with a hammer I really do see it as the governments or my business. It will affect whether I choose to associate with you but that is an entirely different matter.

Rod
Sounding more Libertarian every day

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by 47mack

As for there not being enough research done on the medicinal use, that isn't true either. There is plenty of on-going research being done, there just hasn't been enough proof that medicinal MJ is any better than already available medicine.

Like I said before. Why should everyone have to pay through the nose for their medicine when they can just grow a plant? I have personally seen the benefits of MJ in conjunction with chemotherapy. All this being said, even if it didn't have a medical use I think it should still be decriminalized. Give me one good reason why we should keep these ridiculous laws on the books? I know you are just presenting another point of view but if it WAS in your hands what would you do? BTW thanx for the help.

alanm
04-17-2001, 12:42 PM
RCGChief, Hit yourself in the crotch with a hammer?? Although in the privacy of your home I guess it's ok. :D

47mack
04-17-2001, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by BIG_DADDY


BTW thanx for the help.

I must not of helped, I see no picture!

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 12:55 PM
47mack,

That's weird because I am.

shakesthecat
04-17-2001, 12:59 PM
alanm,
Don't be so old fashioned. I know if I saw a couple guys out on the street corner flattening their nards with a hammer, I'm pretty sure I'd have to watch. ;)

As for MJ. It's SO easy to get now, why mess with a good thing.

47mack
04-17-2001, 01:16 PM
DADDY

Now I do. My fault. Must be all that weed I am smoking!!!!! HA HA

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 01:34 PM
47,

LOL. Still didn't answer that question though. If it was up to you what would you do?

47mack
04-17-2001, 01:48 PM
I honestly don't know. I could live with a society that allows the use of MJ, but I just can't see legalizing all drugs, like Gaz says. Many of my friends were avid MJ smokers in college, so I have experienced a lot of things. I don't agree that it is a victimless crime, and I don't believe that it doesn't have similar effects that alcohol has.

But, that is the point....alcohol IS legal! Why? That is a question that no one will ever be able to answer.

Like I said before, I used to be very against the legalization/decriminalization. Hell, I even wrote my college thesis on why it SHOULDN'T be. But, know I am open to both sides. Either way, no one will be happy.

Pitt Gorilla
04-17-2001, 02:03 PM
Mind altering drugs (legal)- Caffine, alcohol, nicotine
carcinogenic drugs (legal)- alcohol, nicotine

The only reason that I can find for these being legal and MJ not legal is tradition. Alcohol and cigarette industries represent traditional, high-revenue, fortune five hundred companies that employ hundreds of thousands of people in the US alone. From the tobacco, barley, and hops farmers to the CEO big-whigs, America has its roots tangled in these drugs. Is it a double standard? Clearly. Does that seem to matter? No, not really.

Lightning Rod
04-17-2001, 02:21 PM
OK the hammer to the crotch was maybe a little too far out in left field but the point is valid. I think the freedom of choice we are “supposed” to have, is what is truly important. I can separate my intellectual and moral beliefs from what I believe should be law. Where other people are not unwillingly damaged (see victim) by an activity I don’t see where laws need be involved.

BIG_DADDY
04-17-2001, 02:33 PM
A lot of people do things that are not necessarily good for them and I guess I just don't understand protecting people from themselves. When are we going to ban fat people from eating too much or at least make them exercise as an example. This country is supposed to be about freedom and smaller government. Does anybody remember the Boston Tea Party? To quote one of our greatest presidents:

" Prohibition....... goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation and makes crimes out of things that are not crimes. A prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded."

---- Abraham Lincoln