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View Full Version : the people have spoken, NAACP not happy!


Archie F. Swin
04-18-2001, 10:25 PM
JACKSON, Miss. The NAACP raised the threat of an economic boycott Wednesday to drag Mississippi "kicking and screaming into the 21st century" after voters overwhelmingly decided to keep their 107-year-old state flag with the Confederate emblem.


C.R. Pants take: I'm the kind of person that thinks the more issues/regulations that are given the blessing of the voter, the better. This flag issue was handled admirably by The State of Mississippi and the citizen's voices have been heard. Voters elected to keep the flag that bears a likeness to the "stars and bars", so be it. Those who oppose must understand that democracy was given a fair shake here, and their opinion is not the popular one. Believe me, I know what its like to have a minoirty view. I feel the NAACP is an institution that has strong convictions about the peoples voices being heard. Well, The people have spoken . . . and if you(NAACP) are not content with the issue being settled in that fashion, tough titty.

morphius
04-18-2001, 10:51 PM
I think it is sad that people feel the urge to hide history, and then can't even go with the vote when the people who this is supposed to offend voted not to get rid of the flag.

47mack
04-19-2001, 05:19 AM
I think people need to take a stand against the NAACP. Oragnizations like that are what keep America divided. Maybe people should boycott them...withhold some donations. I don't think they would enjoy that.

Morph
I couldn't of said it better myself. History is what made who we are. Why try to hide it?

old_geezer
04-19-2001, 06:04 AM
Liberals are for democracy only when the vote goes their way. If the vote goes against them then it's something to the effect of "we must do what's right no matter what the majority want." For some reason they don't believe conservatives have that same choice.

OK, I'm done venting - everyone (conservative or liberal) have a great day. :)

KCWolfman
04-19-2001, 06:55 AM
Fact - Robert E. Lee did not own slaves. He believed that the idea would die morally with a few decades. Yet he fought for his banner which represented a way of life, not slavery.

Fact - The Confederate flag does not represent slavery.

Fact - More heinous acts have been committed under the Stars and Bars than under the Confederate Flag, yet no votes are made to remove it.

Fact - You (meaning the NAACP) have no right to legislate the State of Mississippi from another state..... shutup!

Archie F. Swin
04-19-2001, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by old_geezer
"we must do what's right no matter what the majority want."



OG,

Do you really think that this is strictly a Liberal view? Sounds like a non-conformist view to me. This sound like something that may have been said by many American individualists.


Originally posted by KCWolfman
The Confederate flag does not represent slavery


Wolf,

The way I look at it is the Confederate flag represents a group of Americans that fought for certain rights. One of them being the right to own slaves.

KCWolfman
04-19-2001, 07:26 AM
CRP - The Stars and Bars represent a country that intentionally infected indians with smallpox, separated blacks from the rest of the nation, and Oh Yes, Slavery. Have you started a petition to remove it from our Congressional Halls?

Archie F. Swin
04-19-2001, 07:43 AM
Please forgive my ignorance, I'm not sure which flag you speak of when you say "stars & bars"

Once you clear things up, I can answer your question

NaptownChief
04-19-2001, 08:07 AM
We could live in a perfect world and Kwasie Mfume would still be screaming and hollering. Cause the day he and the NAACP stop creating fear and rage amongst people is the day that they stop pouring donations into his pockets....And you can rest assured that ole Kwasie has no desire to obtain a real job anytime soon....

What the world needs, especially the black community, is more role models like Mfume running around trying to win the breeders cup by creating illegitimate children all over the country...Sheeese....

morphius
04-19-2001, 08:28 AM
CRP - Stars and Bars = Stars and Stripes.

Yes it stood for a way of life, one in which the state had the rights to pick its laws and not be dictated to by a national gov't. Sure slavery was a large part of it, but from the beginning of the union there were many states that believed in states rights.

As a side note, it is my feeling that as technologies appeared slavery would have no longer been cost effect and too slow of a way to do things, and would have gone on the wayside all on its own. Of course we still have Africans selling Africans into slavery, but I know that is another story.

KCWolfman
04-19-2001, 09:25 AM
Thanks Morph.

How is the family?

Dammit we are down 2-2 with the Kings now. It doesn't look like we will get revenge for last year.

CRP - ALL flags of all nations have committed and supported various atrocities. To single out one is just crazy

Archie F. Swin
04-19-2001, 09:53 AM
i've always associated the moniker "stars & bars" to the flags of the Confederacy. That's how I referenced it in the original thread. I've never called the current US flag the stars and bars . . . sorry for the confusion.


I dont care to stray from the topic. What I'm talking about is the black man's attempt to rid state flags of Confederate symbolism. I feel this particular attempt is a little overwrought. I'm not here to debate what evil things flags stand for.

Logical
04-19-2001, 10:33 AM
CRP,

Are you supporting the position that despite the majority of the popular vote in Mississippi changing the flag must still be pursued?

If the answer is yes, then how do you feel about your fellow liberals argument last fall that Gore should have been President just because the popular vote totals went his way, despite the fact the system is not set up to elect the winner of the popular vote. Also did you agree because that did not work out for Gore that the Constitutionally mandated Electoral College should be abandoned to make the popular vote the final decision?

If the answer to the last two questions were you did support the popular vote being the final arbiter is it not inconsistent to now say that despite the majorities position in Mississippi the changing of the flag should still be pursued?

Looking for consistency of Logic

morphius
04-19-2001, 11:12 AM
Logical - I think it can be said that the electoral college his how the Presidential Race is won, since it is the only thing that people in multiple states get to vote in, everything else is done by popular vote.

So it is not inconsistent to have a state vote on a state issue decide that issue.

morphius
04-19-2001, 11:22 AM
kcwolfman - They are doing okay, the wife is getting around much better.

I can't believe they choked a 3-0 lead last night and then lost in overtime, not to say that I didn't celebrate it, but still couldn't believe it after the first two games.

Of course the Av's swept :)

Archie F. Swin
04-19-2001, 11:26 AM
Logical,

I do not feel that the flag issue should be pursued further. I tried to make it clear in my original thread that the people of Mississippi have spoken . . . case closed.

But, I must admit, after reading your question I looked at my thread and edited it to make my view a little more clear.It wasn't as direct as I had intended

old_geezer
04-19-2001, 12:41 PM
CRP

You are correct that both liberals and conservatives are guilty of trying to force their beliefs on others. The topic just caught me at a bad time (still waking up) and I over-reacted.

As I said at the end of my first reply - Everyone (liberals and conservatives) have a good day. What really interests me are the Chiefs. :)

Archie F. Swin
04-19-2001, 01:23 PM
OG,

The fact that you were compelled to respond is all I ask. I dont post threads just to watch them quickly sink to the bottom of the topic menu. Your contribution kept the thread alive . . . thanx for your time.

Raiderhader
04-19-2001, 05:39 PM
Whoa! I and CRP agree on a political issue!? The end of the world must be comin', and I'm standing in the middle of the road.:) I agree completely with you CRP. The people spoke, many of which were black (go figure), and the NAALCP can complain about it all they want, but it is already a settled matter.

JohninGpt
04-19-2001, 06:18 PM
The flag known as the "Stars and Bars" is actually the second Confederate National Flag, consisting of three horizontal "bars", red white and red, with a blue field containing a circle of stars, it is not being disputed at the moment.

I have been stationed in Gulfport, Ms for the better part of the last 12 years, I am actually an Okie, so I don't vote in Mississippi. From what I have seen there are three camps in this argument: those who want to keep the current flag, those who want the new flag, and those who would be receptive to a new flag but voted against this one because it has no meaning or significance to the people of Mississippi. Really, have you seen this thing, it looks like a red, white and blue table cloth with a pizza in the corner.

My personal opinion, as somewhat a student of history, is that the past should never be hidden or covered up. I do not agree that this state should hide it's past because someone finds it offensive.

John
- 952 miles from Arrowhead

Logical
04-19-2001, 07:06 PM
CRP,

Glad to hear it, thought it was strange as you have been a pretty consistent person, even if I rarely agree with you in most things political :D

Frazod
04-19-2001, 07:27 PM
Random thoughts on this issue:

1. To hell with the NAACP. I'm sick of these muckraking scumbags trying to tell the rest of us how to think, live and act in general. NAACP, I believe, stands for the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People. How are they advancing any people by attacking the rag flying over the Mississippi state house? It seems like they would be better served by putting the resources they're wasting on this crap into actually advancing some of their own impoverished people. Of course, that doesn't make headlines.

2. Unlike most of you, I've had the distinct displeasure of actually spending time in Mississippi - I attended a school there when I first joined the Navy. It is a backward, impoverished, sweltering hell hole, overgrown with Spanish moss and crawling with bugs the size of small dogs. If they flew a Confederate flag, a dead possum or a used rubber over the state house (assuming they actually even have one), I can't imagine why the hell anyone outside of Mississippi would care.

3. Slavery existed under the Confederate flag for 4 years. It existed under the American flag for 85 years.

4. I'm pretty sure no flag ever owned a slave.

5. Perhaps someone should form the NAANRWP - the National Association for the Advancement of Non-Wealthy White People. Seems like there's an organization somewhere looking out for everyone but us. Perhaps I'd join that.

JohninGpt
04-19-2001, 08:35 PM
"Unlike most of you, I've had the distinct displeasure of actually spending time in Mississippi - I attended a school there when I first joined the Navy. It is a backward, impoverished, sweltering hell hole, overgrown with Spanish moss and crawling with bugs the size of small dogs."

Frazod,
I'm guessing that you went to "A" school in Meridian, in which case your description is right on the mark. The Coast, however, has changed a lot in the last few years. The Casinos brought a lot of modernization and a very eclectic population. The genepool gets porportionally shallower with the distance you travel north of I-10.
As far as the Gulfport/Biloxi area goes, I kinda like it here.

John

Raiderhader
04-19-2001, 08:42 PM
I used to go down to Gulf Port quite a bit. I have family down there and we would often times take trips down there in the summer. In fact, my aunt is a big wig at Marine Life, so we always get free passes when we go down there. I have to agree with John that it has changed quite a bit since the casinos moved in. The town does look nicer (although the beach is still one of the ugliest I have seen. But hey, it's still a beach). I can't speak for the rest of the state because all the time I spent up north (Jackson) was when I was real little visiting my grand parents. They eventually moved down to Gulfport so most of what I remember is down there.

Frazod
04-20-2001, 05:45 PM
John, you're absolutely correct - I went to A School in Meridian during the Summer of '84. The area was awful - never seen poverty like that before or since, and I currently live in Chicago. One of my friends bought a $500 Al Bundy-special-Dodge Dart, and we drove around the countryside ocassionally - we saw homes made of crates and assorted garbage (you could see light shining through holes in the walls). It was medieval.

I never really went anywhere else in Mississippi, and it certainly isn't fair to judge the entire state on one area (I was obviously being a bit flip). Hope I didn't offend you.

JohninGpt
04-20-2001, 05:50 PM
Frazod,
No offense here, I'm an Okie who grew up just outside of Tulsa, I just live here. Not to bad a place to live though. This time next year I'l be living in LaMaddalena, Italy. That will be really cool.

John