PDA

View Full Version : Giuliani: Dems want nanny government


recxjake
07-30-2007, 06:21 PM
1

Hydrae
07-30-2007, 07:43 PM
Key to his plan is a $15,000 tax deduction for families to buy private health insurance, instead of getting insurance through employers. Any leftover funds could be rolled over year-to-year for medical expenses, under Giuliani's plan.

I don't know about most of you around here but I don't have 15K to put up to get a deduction for. I am coming to believe these guys in Washington have no idea what it is to be poor or even lower middle class. If they think I can put 15K into health care in a year they are nuts. It doesn't matter what that number is if I can't make the investment to get a deduction out of it.

Taco John
07-30-2007, 09:02 PM
Key to his plan is a $15,000 tax deduction for families to buy private health insurance, instead of getting insurance through employers.



So why wouldn't I want to get my healthcare insurance paid for as a benefit from my employer?

Pitt Gorilla
07-30-2007, 09:23 PM
I had totally forgotten that it was primarily the Dems that brought about the Patriot Act, No Child Left Untested, Department of Homeland Security, challenges to decriminalization of pot, etc.

noa
07-30-2007, 10:06 PM
Last week, Giuliani called the Democrats the "party of losers"

Nice

BucEyedPea
07-31-2007, 08:48 AM
I don't mind Rudy's health insurance proposals. However, it won't prevent the trend of prices upward if he's an open borders type and he is. This means more illegals getting free healthcare which will increase demand. This means higher prices followed by higher premiums. And it just keeps going and going and going.

BucEyedPea
07-31-2007, 09:04 AM
I don't believe him on that.
He's too connected to the corp interests that want open borders.
I also don't like his National ID idea either.

BucEyedPea
07-31-2007, 09:18 AM
Not a national ID for you and me.... for illegals
I'd rather not go this route, because these things expand later.
Ron Paul worked very hard with a few others to defeat a national ID after 9/11.

If they don't get one, they are out
If they commit a crime, they are out
If they are going to be in the US we are going to know where they are and what they are doing
Sounds good on the campaign trail and on paper. But a corp may just hire 'em anyway and not ask or tell. They can still drain our healthcare services because they can't be turned away from emergency rooms.

I prefer Paul's approach. Cut off the benefits and welfare.

First and foremost, he wants to secure the border with all means possible.
I don't believe ANY of the top tier candidates including Rudolph on this.
They are supported by Pac money and special interests which are corporate interests mainly.

When you travel to England, the first thing you show them is your passport.... they know who is in their country.... we should be able to do the same.
That's fine if one comes in legally....but not illegally.
Besides don't they still show passports on entrance to this country?

Ron Paul has the best policies for handling illegal immigration. And it has to go hand in had with defeating the open borders free trade issues. If not then it's just a scam and political posturing. IMO he is the only sincere candidate on this issue.

Cave Johnson
07-31-2007, 09:25 AM
He compared private health plans to plasma TVs, saying the plans would come down in cost as demand grows.

That's the only statement I need to know Rudy is a mouth-breathing jacka$$.

BucEyedPea
07-31-2007, 09:29 AM
If you secure the border, then everyone comes in legally
True. Like I said, I don't believe him. He's too connected to corp money.

Regarding health insurance:
Demand increases prices. Illegals drive up healthcare costs as it's more demand when it's free. Technology does come down in price over time but there's also the phenomena of that not being perceived as a necessity.
Don't know about services...especially with more doctors wanting out of the system.

Taco John
08-01-2007, 02:37 PM
Does it bother you that nobody except for you on this forum is really energized about Giuliani. It's like there's no demand to really consume Giuliani information.

Cochise
08-01-2007, 02:44 PM
Big government types want to create dependent classes of people who need the government to provide everything for them? Who knew?

Ultra Peanut
08-01-2007, 02:44 PM
It's like Stevie Wonder mocking someone's eyesight.

Adept Havelock
08-01-2007, 02:49 PM
Does it bother you that nobody except for you on this forum is really energized about Giuliani. It's like there's no demand to really consume Giuliani information.

LA LA LA LA I can't hear you LA LA LA LA

:)

Cochise
08-01-2007, 03:00 PM
Really, if we wanted to read that copy and paste crap, I could go to his website.

Mr. Laz
08-01-2007, 05:46 PM
and the GOP has a "Go F@#* yourself" government.

your point?

noa
08-01-2007, 08:09 PM
On this forum... doesn't bother me at all.

New polls out in Iowa, NH and S. Carolina.... Rudy leading in all three states.

New Nationwide poll... Rudy up 13%

Rudy Giuliani will get the Republican nomination.

ps.... ClevelandBronco likes him a lot too.

Rudy is leading in Iowa in one poll and losing in the rest.

recxjake
08-01-2007, 08:13 PM
Rudy is leading in Iowa in one poll and losing in the rest.

leading in the most current.

Logical
08-01-2007, 10:13 PM
Originally Posted by recxjake

Key to his plan is a $15,000 tax deduction for families to buy private health insurance, instead of getting insurance through employers. ROFLROFLROFL

So for those making under $30,000 there is no benefit at all.

You have to make $120,000 before the tax deduction will equal what health insurance is paid by my employer.

You are nucking futz and so is Rudy.

ChiefaRoo
08-01-2007, 10:30 PM
So why wouldn't I want to get my healthcare insurance paid for as a benefit from my employer?

I'll tell you why. First they will raise taxes across the board. Do you know who pays the most taxes? The middle class does. These are couples that both work with or without kids that make a combined gross of $75k or so a year. They'll take more of your tax money and then put you into Universal Healthcare. Competition will drop because the Govt. will limit the amount of patients that can be seen by a certain doctor in the plan. In the end you'll get a nice governmental beauracracy like FEMA, TSA, IRS telling you where to go and stand in line. When it begins to tank and quality goes down and costs go up they'll want to tax the people again. The only thing Univeral Healthcare guarantees you is the right to see a doctor it doesn't guarantee you the operation you may need, a doctor who is well qualified or a drugs that are cutting edge. No, it just means you go for free.

It's a giant power grab where the pols want the majority of the voting base to be beholden to them. It would give them power over you and me. I for one don't want the govt. telling me which doctor to go see or how many times I can go see him. Fook them, they can't even pave the roads half the time.

Attached is a speech from 1961 that Ronald Reagan made about Universal Healthcare. The only thing that has changed is the name of the politicians pushing for the power grab. Listen to it and learn from it. This is how self reliant Americans think and it's how we all should think.

http://www.dirtyworldnews.com/files/ronald-reagan-socialized-medicine.mp3

ChiefaRoo
08-01-2007, 10:36 PM
So why wouldn't I want to get my healthcare insurance paid for as a benefit from my employer?

All good companies provide private healthcare plans. It's part of what makes a good employee want to work for the company.

ClevelandBronco
08-01-2007, 11:22 PM
On this forum... doesn't bother me at all.

New polls out in Iowa, NH and S. Carolina.... Rudy leading in all three states.

New Nationwide poll... Rudy up 13%

Rudy Giuliani will get the Republican nomination.

ps.... ClevelandBronco likes him a lot too.

Keep it coming, man. I appreciate the info. It helps me when I'm talking Rudy up among my fellow right wing religious nut jobs.

I had a great discussion last night with the staunchest Catholic I know. He, for one, is ready to take Rudy at his word with regard to appointing strict constructionists to the bench and letting the individual states sort out the issues (read: abortion) that should be up to them anyway.

Bob Dole
08-01-2007, 11:55 PM
"Dems want nanny government."

Duh.

Bob Dole
08-01-2007, 11:58 PM
All good companies provide private healthcare plans. It's part of what makes a good employee want to work for the company.

Until you take a spill on your bike at 80mph, get hit with $25k in medical bills, and your private plan refuses to pay anything, even though none of the injuries were to the head.

ChiefaRoo
08-02-2007, 12:07 AM
Until you take a spill on your bike at 80mph, get hit with $25k in medical bills, and your private plan refuses to pay anything, even though none of the injuries were to the head.

Each corporate plan is different. It's negotiated and tweaked annually by the company. If you wanted to drive a bike, skydive or any other risky recreation then you should check with your plan admin. at work and find out if motorcycle accidents are covered. If not, then you should get a small supplemental insurance policy of your own. The point is understand your plan and take responsibility for your own actions. Too many Americans don't think enough about insurance.

Bob Dole
08-02-2007, 12:29 AM
Each corporate plan is different. It's negotiated and tweaked annually by the company. If you wanted to drive a bike, skydive or any other risky recreation then you should check with your plan admin. at work and find out if motorcycle accidents are covered. If not, then you should get a small supplemental insurance policy of your own. The point is understand your plan and take responsibility for your own actions. Too many Americans don't think enough about insurance.

It wasn't Bob Dole.

But if private plans are the shit, why would one need a supplemental?

go bowe
08-02-2007, 01:03 PM
thanks senator...

i appreciate it...

BucEyedPea
08-02-2007, 01:33 PM
I had a great discussion last night with the staunchest Catholic I know. He, for one, is ready to take Rudy at his word with regard to appointing strict constructionists to the bench and letting the individual states sort out the issues (read: abortion) that should be up to them anyway.
If Reagan couldn't do this, or Bush Sr...and "W" had to have his arm twisted on it; then I wouldn't get my hopes up on this politician promise. It's just campaign talk. Even if he's sincere, he'd have to know who is a strict constructionist...it may just be his idea of what one is. Never know.

ChiefaRoo
08-03-2007, 12:25 AM
It wasn't Bob Dole.

But if private plans are the shit, why would one need a supplemental?

Private insurance companies and the companies they sell their plans to always have a tit for tat relationship based on negotiation. The insurance company is looking out for itself and the company that buys said policy is looking out for itself (and the coverage for their people if they are a good company). Every year the insurance company tries to raise rates or take away some portions of the coverages in some fashion (elimination or higher deductible). If one of our employees had a major operation then they really try and gig you. It's a constant battle. All I'm saying is the employee needs to ask questions and be informed if they have a high risk hobby. Further, any new employee should ask to have the plan admin. explain the policy in an overview and get the detailed pamphlet provided by law (I believe it's by law but it's our policy as well). It gets to be a real pain in the butt for a guy who has a pre-existing condition like a bad knee etc but in the end it gets worked out. All I'm saying is it's a far better system having insurance companies compete than to have the govt. put some kind of a FEMA organization over the whole thing that is not accountable to the people or the marketplace.

PS - Glad it wasn't you on the bike.

ClevelandBronco
08-03-2007, 12:45 AM
If Reagan couldn't do this, or Bush Sr...and "W" had to have his arm twisted on it; then I wouldn't get my hopes up on this politician promise. It's just campaign talk. Even if he's sincere, he'd have to know who is a strict constructionist...it may just be his idea of what one is. Never know.

It took a while, but it looks like it's been done. Now I just want insurance. I want an overwhelming majority to finally overturn Roe.

Abortion will remain legal where I live, but bad federal law will finally be reversed.

BucEyedPea
08-03-2007, 08:06 AM
Don't count on it Cleveland Bronco.
No president can gaurantee a strict constructionist even with an honest try.
Besides I prefer an originalist constructionist like Scalia.