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View Full Version : Just curious...how much should we believe the Petreaus report?


mlyonsd
08-20-2007, 08:19 PM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.

Logical
08-20-2007, 08:20 PM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.

Because President Cheney is writing it for him. duuhh

banyon
08-20-2007, 08:22 PM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.

Because he won't be writing it?

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=167791

mlyonsd
08-20-2007, 09:23 PM
Because President Cheney is writing it for him. duuhh
I truly am sad for you that you're so jaded you have already decided any progress Petreaus might, and let me emphicize might find, would classify him as a boot licker.

I really am at a loss for words with you.

Silock
08-20-2007, 09:41 PM
Look, I hate the war as much as everyone else, but I don't have any reason to doubt he'll be telling the truth.

Somewhere, someone has to be telling the truth, and if we can't trust the guys that are literally giving their lives for our country, who can we trust?

a1na2
08-20-2007, 10:02 PM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.

Read some of the posts to date and you will see that each side has already made up their mind about what the report will say. Truly a sad state we have come to.

Logical
08-20-2007, 10:12 PM
Look, I hate the war as much as everyone else, but I don't have any reason to doubt he'll be telling the truth.

Somewhere, someone has to be telling the truth, and if we can't trust the guys that are literally giving their lives for our country, who can we trust?The chances of Petraeus giving his life for this country in Iraq are about as great as my chances.:rolleyes:

Logical
08-20-2007, 10:15 PM
Read some of the posts to date and you will see that each side has already made up their mind about what the report will say. Truly a sad state we have come to.What is important is that the White House (Cheney administration) has made up its mind about what the report is going to say. Oh there will be many elements of Petraus's actual beliefs ib that report, but the report will say what the administration wants it to say, and that is what is sad.

Silock
08-20-2007, 10:18 PM
The chances of Petraeus giving his life for this country in Iraq are about as great as my chances.:rolleyes:

So, you're saying he's never put his life on the line for this country?

Logical
08-20-2007, 10:21 PM
So, you're saying he's never put his life on the line for this country?

Not in Iraq, I cannot speak for his entire service career, nor do I think it matters. He is nothing more than a paid political puppet at this point in his career.

a1na2
08-20-2007, 10:22 PM
What is important is that the White House (Cheney administration) has made up its mind about what the report is going to say. Oh there will be many elements of Petraus's actual beliefs ib that report, but the report will say what the administration wants it to say, and that is what is sad.

You don't really believe that do you?

It's a no win situation. If he reports what he actually sees the liberal side will attack, if he reports that all is lost the conservatives will attack.

My guess is that he will write the report as he sees it and will not be influenced by the those you say will be pulling the strings. Your attitude toward anyone military is disturbing.

HolmeZz
08-20-2007, 10:26 PM
My guess is that he will write the report as he sees it and will not be influenced by the those you say will be pulling the strings. Your attitude toward anyone military is disturbing.

He's not writing the report. That was part of the problem.

patteeu
08-20-2007, 10:27 PM
You don't really believe that do you?

It's a no win situation. If he reports what he actually sees the liberal side will attack, if he reports that all is lost the conservatives will attack.

My guess is that he will write the report as he sees it and will not be influenced by the those you say will be pulling the strings. Your attitude toward anyone military is disturbing.

Logical is auditioning for the Tokyo Rose of this war. Unfortunately, he's got some stiff competition.

BucEyedPea
08-20-2007, 10:30 PM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.
Well, if military.com says he's a PR man then it's a safe bet he just may be this "puppet."

Fishpicker
08-21-2007, 12:24 AM
Petreaus is a puppet? I thought Bush was the puppet. that's some pretty slick puppeteer-ing, shades of Being John Malkovich

Logical
08-21-2007, 12:35 AM
You don't really believe that do you?

It's a no win situation. If he reports what he actually sees the liberal side will attack, if he reports that all is lost the conservatives will attack.

My guess is that he will write the report as he sees it and will not be influenced by the those you say will be pulling the strings. Your attitude toward anyone military is disturbing.This is just silly, I work with military people every day in my job. I understand how the game is played as do they. You don't get to a position like Petreaus has by rocking the boat, if you don't believe that reference Douglas McArthur or George S Patton.

a1na2
08-21-2007, 05:56 AM
This is just silly, I work with military people every day in my job. I understand how the game is played as do they. You don't get to a position like Petreaus has by rocking the boat, if you don't believe that reference Douglas McArthur or George S Patton.

I see, you categorize all military people in to one shape and form. Now that is silly!

patteeu
08-21-2007, 07:16 AM
This is just silly, I work with military people every day in my job. I understand how the game is played as do they. You don't get to a position like Petreaus has by rocking the boat, if you don't believe that reference Douglas McArthur or George S Patton.

Your examples tend to refute your premise. Both of those guys got to a position like that (especially MacArthur) and both were boat rockers.

To be sure, any general officer is part politician, but some are mere "yes men" and some are not.

KC Jones
08-21-2007, 08:00 AM
I have no idea how much we should believe Petreaus report. Stories that the report is being written by the administration for Petreaus to deliver are troubling. I'd like to think Petreaus wouldn't knowingly deliver an incomplete or false report, but I used to believe the same of Colin Powell.

patteeu
08-21-2007, 08:58 AM
I have no idea how much we should believe Petreaus report. Stories that the report is being written by the administration for Petreaus to deliver are troubling. I'd like to think Petreaus wouldn't knowingly deliver an incomplete or false report, but I used to believe the same of Colin Powell.

Why have you changed your opinion?

KC Jones
08-21-2007, 09:04 AM
Why have you changed your opinion?

Because of the presentation Powell gave at the U.N. to support our invasion of Iraq. I believe he bowed to pressure from within the administration and delivered a report he knew to contain either false or at least questionable information. That's strictly my opinion, as he's only publicly stated that he was misled and not that he knew the report contained false and unreliable information.

patteeu
08-21-2007, 09:18 AM
Because of the presentation Powell gave at the U.N. to support our invasion of Iraq. I believe he bowed to pressure from within the administration and delivered a report he knew to contain either false or at least questionable information. That's strictly my opinion, as he's only publicly stated that he was misled and not that he knew the report contained false and unreliable information.

OK. Was there any particular part of the presentation that you think he should have questioned or is this a general impression?

Cochise
08-21-2007, 09:34 AM
"Why, it doesn't have to be written for us to know it's no good..."

oldandslow
08-21-2007, 10:40 AM
I can tell by the threads being started that there are some on the board that have already decided he is just a Bush puppet and that anything positive he might report on should be ignored.

I'm curious as to why that is seeing he was unanimously approved for his post by the Senate.

Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.


Did you believe Westmoreland? I did, until I personally saw things differently.

Generals lie. Always have. It is how they get to be generals. That doesn't mean that strategic ambiguity is not sometimes a good thing. During wartime you don't really want to tell the truth.

But don't ask me to believe this report. It will be 90% propaganda.

Logical
08-21-2007, 10:58 AM
Your examples tend to refute your premise. Both of those guys got to a position like that (especially MacArthur) and both were boat rockers.

To be sure, any general officer is part politician, but some are mere "yes men" and some are not.Both were kicked to the curb by Truman, I don't know what you are talking about.

patteeu
08-21-2007, 11:13 AM
Both were kicked to the curb by Truman, I don't know what you are talking about.

General Patton wasn't kicked to the curb, he died in a car accident.

But regardless of how their respective careers ended, the point remains that both of those men achieved their status as Generals without being bootlickers.

Your post #16 just wasn't well conceived and it doesn't give me confidence that working with military people every day in your job has really given you much insight into them.

Logical
08-21-2007, 11:16 AM
General Patton wasn't kicked to the curb, he died in a car accident.

But regardless of how their respective careers ended, the point remains that both of those men achieved their status as Generals without being bootlickers.

Your post #16 just wasn't well conceived and it doesn't give me confidence that working with military people every day in your job has really given you much insight into them.

Actually his leadership position was taken from him and he was to report back to the states. Before he could he died in a vehicle accident some say it was suicide because he could not face the life of a non warrior. It is in his biography, an enormous tomb I happen to own.

jAZ
08-21-2007, 11:18 AM
Without seeing it beforehand, tell me why I shouldn't believe his report.
Wrong question.

The question is, now that the Bush Administration is admitting that he won't be writing the report... why would you, the Bush Administration or the media ever call it "the Petreaus report"?

Sorta like the Rose Bowl Presented by AT&T... this is the Bush Report Presented by Patreaus.

Whether it's to be believed today depends on whether you think the Bush Administration has any credibility in accurate, complete, or even reasonably non-politicized information dissemination.

Logical
08-21-2007, 11:20 AM
Actually his leadership position was taken from him and he was to report back to the states. Before he could he died in a vehicle accident some say it was suicide because he could not face the life of a non warrior. It is in his biography, an enormous tomb I happen to own.

As to every day military life, it is all about licking the boots of the level of command above you. You see go to Pacaf and watch the Colonels acting as foot shuffling porters for the generals and the Captains acting as foot shuffling porters from the Colonels, it is pathetic. The Generals are afraid of their shadows above them and have to cover their ass for every decision. God forbid they make a decision that makes the Sec Def or the Commander in Chief look bad.

patteeu
08-21-2007, 11:43 AM
As to every day military life, it is all about licking the boots of the level of command above you. You see go to Pacaf and watch the Colonels acting as foot shuffling porters for the generals and the Captains acting as foot shuffling porters from the Colonels, it is pathetic. The Generals are afraid of their shadows above them and have to cover their ass for every decision. God forbid they make a decision that makes the Sec Def or the Commander in Chief look bad.

No more than you licked the boots of your superiors as you worked your way up the corporate ladder. I'm confident that your cynicism is insulting to the vast majority of professional military officers in our armed forces.

ClevelandBronco
08-21-2007, 11:59 AM
Not in Iraq, I cannot speak for his entire service career, nor do I think it matters. He is nothing more than a paid political puppet at this point in his career.

You've already taken this gentleman's life, Logical, by predeciding that this most important event in his life is meaningless, and that the pinnacle of his service to his country will be a fraud.

You've become nothing more than an IED on a message board.

Have you no shame? At long last, sir, have you no shame?

Logical
08-21-2007, 02:51 PM
No more than you licked the boots of your superiors as you worked your way up the corporate ladder. I'm confident that your cynicism is insulting to the vast majority of professional military officers in our armed forces.

Insulting but accurate and of course I have to lick the boots of my superiors and like it. That is part of corporate life and military life. It ain't pretty but it is real. The key is doing it while keeping some small measure of pride. That ain't easy.

patteeu
08-21-2007, 03:10 PM
Insulting but accurate and of course I have to lick the boots of my superiors and like it. That is part of corporate life and military life. It ain't pretty but it is real. The key is doing it while keeping some small measure of pride. That ain't easy.

Well then I have to disagree with your black and white view on this subject. Or maybe I should call it a black and black view since you apparently don't distinguish between degrees of behavior in this regard. Most people recognize that there is a difference between normal levels of office politics and being a yes man or a dishonorable kiss ass.

Logical
08-21-2007, 03:12 PM
Well then I have to disagree with your black and white view on this subject. Or maybe I should call it a black and black view since you apparently don't distinguish between degrees of behavior in this regard. Most people recognize that there is a difference between normal levels of office politics and being a yes man or a dishonorable kiss ass.

There is no question that anyone reaching the level of a political approval appointment has reached the penultimate in KAdom. You don't get none better at it.

Adept Havelock
08-21-2007, 04:25 PM
Logical is auditioning for the Tokyo Rose of this war. Unfortunately, he's got some stiff competition.

However, patteeu still has a lock as this wars deluded Professor Pangloss. ;)

BucEyedPea
08-21-2007, 04:42 PM
I have a good idea for pat...he should change his screen name to General Patteaus. Sounds good to me. ;)

go bowe
08-21-2007, 05:11 PM
Quote:
<HR SIZE=1>
Originally Posted by Logical
Because President Cheney is writing it for him. duuhh
<HR SIZE=1>I truly am sad for you that you're so jaded you have already decided any progress Petreaus might, and let me emphicize might find, would classify him as a boot licker.

I really am at a loss for words with you.i don't follow how you got to the bootlicker comment...

iirc, the white house is in fact writing the report, with input from the general and other sources...

as far as the general and his plan, i hope he succeeds...

with as little loss of life as possible...

now wrt you loss of words, i'm sure baby lee woud lend you a few of his... :p :p :p