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View Full Version : Gretz: Second Chance for Vick?


Deberg_1990
08-29-2007, 07:40 PM
Pretty good story for Gretz. He puts the Vick tragedy in perspective by comparing it to Leonard Little. A true crime how the NFL gave Little a pass. If that happened today i doubt Goodell would be so forgiving...


http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2007/08/28/gretz_second_chance_for_vick/



Sometime in 2009, Michael Vick will have served his jail time and will be contemplating returning to pro football.

He should be given that opportunity.

I canít imagine any scenario where the NFL would keep him out. The league doesnít have a moral leg to stand on should it decide to slap a lifetime ban on Vick for pleading guilty to charges involving dog fighting.

Maybe they could do it legally; Commissioner Roger Goodell may have that power. But as long as Vick serves his time and does not get into further trouble, he should be allowed a second chance.

How can a league that has allowed St. Louis Rams defensive end Leonard Little to play for the last eight years ban anybody from returning to the playing field?

In October of 1998, Little drove his SUV through a stoplight in downtown St. Louis, smashed into another car and killed Susan Gutweiler. She was 47 years old. She was a wife and mother, leaving behind her husband Bill and son Mike.

Little was drunk, with test results twice the legal limit.

If you want to know how unfair the justice system can be, then consider the fact that Little spent just 90 days in a special work program after pleading guilty to involuntary manslaughter. Ninety days for taking the life of another person. Not only that, but now the whole thing has been expunged from his record. According to the justice system in St. Louis, Little never did anything wrong.

And Vick is going to get 12 to 18 months for running a dog-fighting ring and taking part in the killing of some of those animals?

Thatís a justice system out of whack.

Donít take this as a defense of Vick. He deserves every single day heís handed behind bars. Vick was part of a business that was illegal and he knew so. He put himself above the law. He thought he was untouchable because of his standing in the world of sports. These were not crimes of ignorance, but crimes of arrogance.

Vick has now learned that heís not above the law. He will soon pay the price for his crimes. Once he does, he should have the chance to return to the NFL. If Little got a second chance, then so should Vick.

The league, under then Commissioner Paul Tagliabue, suspended Little for eight games. Heís played every year since, signing two new contracts and making multi-millions of dollars. Whether or not he learned anything from his tragedy remains unknown. Just a few years ago he was pulled over for speeding in St. Louis and he failed a field sobriety test. Only a screw-up by the police in how they handled the situation kept him from facing another DUI charge and real legal consequences.

Vick has a long two years to prove heís learned something from this sad affair. But if he satisfies the courts by serving his time without further problems, that should be enough to satisfy the NFL. That doesnít mean any team has to step up and sign him. Obviously, some clubs would be interested, but they would face plenty of public outcry and complaints.

Everyone deserves a second chance. If Leonard Little got one, then Michael Vick should have one as well.

tk13
08-29-2007, 07:44 PM
I think Vick deserves a second chance, absolutely. But I also don't like the argument that criminal X got off easy, so criminal Y should too.

Deberg_1990
08-29-2007, 07:45 PM
I think Vick deserves a second chance, absolutely. But I also don't like the argument that criminal X got off easy, so criminal Y should too.


The NFL made a huge mistake with Little....no doubt about it. But that was nearly 10 years ago and a different commish.

Fruit Ninja
08-29-2007, 07:46 PM
He should get suspended for at least a year. He should be able to play when his suspension is up. He also should have to do tons and tons and even more tons of community service that Goddell tells him, plus more from what the law tells him to do.

BigMeatballDave
08-29-2007, 07:48 PM
Based on this, I really don't have a problem with him being given another shot after a couple years. WTF was Tagliabue thinking, only giving Little an 8 game suspension? Oh, and the Legal system is PERFECT...

bishop_74
08-29-2007, 07:53 PM
One was "premeditated" slaughter of another living thing... one was foolishness that resulted in a tragedy. He should not be allowed back.

Fruit Ninja
08-29-2007, 07:54 PM
One was "premeditated" slaughter of another living thing... one was foolishness that resulted in a tragedy. He should not be allowed back.Driving while drunk is predetermined murder as well. Its just waiting to happen.

KcMizzou
08-29-2007, 07:54 PM
I think Vick deserves a second chance, absolutely. But I also don't like the argument that criminal X got off easy, so criminal Y should too.Yeah, new comish... things are different now. And just because one guy didn't get what he deserved doesn't mean nobody should.

I thought Vick seemed sincere in his statement, up until he mentioned that he'd found jebus. People seem to thing that fixes everything. :rolleyes:

After he's served his time, I'd be ok with the NFL letting him play again. (If someone wants him.)

I wouldn't want him on my favorite team, but I didn't really want him before all this either.

runnercyclist
08-29-2007, 07:56 PM
Vick should never be allowed to play or attend another NFL game.

KcMizzou
08-29-2007, 07:58 PM
Driving while drunk is predetermined murder as well. Its just waiting to happen.No... it's not. By definition, it's not.

A drunk doesn't plan to kill someone. A drunk may take a risk that results in a death, and that's horrible... but it's not "predetermined murder".

Reerun_KC
08-29-2007, 07:59 PM
The NFL made a huge mistake with Little....no doubt about it. But that was nearly 10 years ago and a different commish.
I am sure her Husband and Son feelt he same way... 10 years or 600 years.. Little is still a waste of human sperm....

Should of never seen another down of NFL playing time or $$$$..

Yet the Rams fans still cheered for him....

bishop_74
08-29-2007, 07:59 PM
Driving while drunk is predetermined murder as well. Its just waiting to happen.

Not sure what predetermined murder is, but I still dont agree. One guy was a stupid jackass, and the other was a cold blooded killer.

Reerun_KC
08-29-2007, 08:00 PM
No... it's not. By definition, it's not.

A drunk doesn't plan to kill someone. A drunk may take a risk that results in a death, and that's horrible... but it's not "predetermined murder".


Should be!

sportsman1
08-29-2007, 08:00 PM
Playing in the NFL is a privelige and he has violated that. Just b/c in the past the NFL was stupid doesn't mean Roger Goodell can't start a new precedent. Micheal Dick is a low life who deserves to be lawn boy for someone, there are others with past crimes just as deserving as this. This is the time to make a statement and bring back intregrity to professional sports. Pro sports are under question with NBA refs gambling, steroids in baseball, it is time that the NFL steps in and sets new precidence for professional football.

NaptownChief
08-29-2007, 08:01 PM
The running of an illegal gambling ring gives Goodell all the ammo he needs to give a lifetime ban.

Being involved in illegal gambling is the cardinal sin of all professional sports. Regardless of where a person stands on the dog fighting and unthinkable cruelty in which he chose to kill dogs the gambling hook is all he needs to justify a lifetime ban.....especially in light of the current NBA mess.

KcMizzou
08-29-2007, 08:01 PM
Should be!It's not, though.

I'm not talking about the law... just simply what the words mean.

Fairplay
08-29-2007, 08:04 PM
If Vick plays his cards right. Doing his time, saying the right things, being humble, community service etc. I can see him playing in 2010 maybe even earlier.

He needs a PR agent to make him up to be practically an angel and to do it where he gets air time for all to see. Do a Larry King show telling america what an idiot he was. Maybe a religious show here and there saying he was a stray sheep on that took up a sinful life and only the reality of life behind prison walls are what woke me up.
I should be his agent he would look like an angel pretty quick. Give me 10 percent please, heh.

Americas quick to forgive. The pressure would be put on Goodell eventually.

NaptownChief
08-29-2007, 08:06 PM
What Little did was horrible however it was something that millions of us could have done in the past from drinking too much and being dumb enough to drive. That certainly doesn't make it even remotely right but it does make it understandable.

Where Little crossed over from making a really bad mistake to becoming complete and utter scum of he earth was when he got caught drinking and driving again. Absolutely nobody on this planet even remotely worth a damn would have ever done that again after living with the fact that they took a life under those circumstances.

CoMoChief
08-29-2007, 08:47 PM
If Goodell was commisioner back when Little did all of his shit Little wouldn't be in the league now.

The victims son called in on EPSN radio and was just chewing Little out the other day. Not only that but the victim's husband (and the guy that called in - his father) is a football photographer for the Rams so every SUN he has to watch the man who killed his wife, play a GAME and make millions in the process and live the celebrity lifestyle.

Little is a ****in jerk, and should be in prison. Not only that but he got another DUI later and got out of it on a "technicality". Not to mention St. Louis Co. cops treat DUI's like parking tickets pretty much.

CoMoChief
08-29-2007, 08:48 PM
If Goodell was commisioner back when Little did all of his shit Little wouldn't be in the league now.

The victims son called in on EPSN radio and was just chewing Little out the other day. Not only that but the victim's husband (and the guy that called in - his father) is a football photographer for the Rams so every SUN he has to watch the man who killed his wife, play a GAME and make millions in the process and live the celebrity lifestyle.

Little is a ****in jerk, and should be in prison. Not only that but he got another DUI later and got out of it on a "technicality". Not to mention St. Louis Co. cops treat DUI's like parking tickets pretty much.

stevieray
08-29-2007, 09:30 PM
IMO, almost all of this falls at the feet of Paul Tagliabue.

Cochise
08-29-2007, 09:32 PM
This argument is dumb. Because someone else did something and got off easy, everyone has to get off easy?

Maintaining a bad precedent just for the sake of precedent is dumb. Just because this is the way you've always done it does not make it a good idea.

If someone screwed up in the past, you fix it and then leave it right. You don't do it wrong over and over for the sake of fairness.

OnTheWarpath58
08-29-2007, 09:41 PM
I honestly think his prison sentence + suspension = de facto lifetime ban.

Apparently the judge made it perfectly clear to Vick on Monday, that plea agreement or not, he and HE ALONE made the decision on Vick's sentence. He also made it perfectly clear that Vick had waived his right to appeal the sentence.

Supposedly the air was sucked out of the room when this happened. Vick's mother and GF were both visably shaken.

Given the hard-ass reputation of the judge as a guy who sentences to the maximum, I would not be shocked to see him give Vick 24+ months.

This year + 2 years in prison + at least 1 year suspension = Vick's out of football for at minimum 4 years.

He's not coming back after 4 years.

JMO.

OnTheWarpath58
08-29-2007, 09:42 PM
This argument is dumb. Because someone else did something and got off easy, everyone has to get off easy?

Maintaining a bad precedent just for the sake of precedent is dumb. Just because this is the way you've always done it does not make it a good idea.

If someone screwed up in the past, you fix it and then leave it right. You don't do it wrong over and over for the sake of fairness.


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