PDA

View Full Version : Where is all the Croyle lovers today


King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 08:14 AM
Yes, another Croyle thread.

After watching last nights game, is there anyone who really thinks this guy should be the starting QB? I don't see it. I don't see him making it as a 2nd stringer. 1-7 last night. His throws were hitting people in the back, in the back of the head etc. He missed a wide open receiver 15 yards down the field.
He is turning out to be everything Croylites was hoping he wasn't.

Maybe we draft a qb in first round next year?

Flame away.

jidar
08-31-2007, 08:15 AM
He's looked pretty poor.

'Hamas' Jenkins
08-31-2007, 08:16 AM
Working on their subject-verb agreement.

Short Leash Hootie
08-31-2007, 08:17 AM
Well, I didn't think drafting Quinn made any sense when he basically fell into our laps, as it would pretty much mean we wasted a 3rd round pick a year ago on what our scouts thought was going to be our QB of the future...

but it appears as if we should've snatched up Quinn, it's not often a top 5 QB talent falls to a team in dire need of a QB at 22, but hey, hindsight is 20/20.

Woodrow Call
08-31-2007, 08:17 AM
Zero confidence right now. The game against the Saints really shook him up.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 08:17 AM
Of course he had several dropped balls again last night.

Your right, hes not ready. Everyone knows that. But the Chiefs foolishly think they can compete for a title this year. They are never willing to take their lumps with a young Qb for a few years while he learns the game.

El Jefe
08-31-2007, 08:18 AM
I would love to get Brian Brohm, since we passed on Troy Smith last year. If we loose a lot we might get Brohm, he is going to go high, he is a good QB. Croyle is garbage.

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 08:18 AM
Herm should have played him longer.

Does anyone think Casey Printers moves to the #2 QB spot?

Iowanian
08-31-2007, 08:19 AM
you could likely see them better except your view is curtained by Damon Huard's man muff.

Donger
08-31-2007, 08:20 AM
Working on their subject-verb agreement.

ROFL

Cochise
08-31-2007, 08:21 AM
I forgot passing over Brady Quinn I guess. I thought he got picked in front of us. :spock:


Anyway... Croyle is obviously not good enough to start in the NFL. That's obvious. There are aboriginal villages with no outside human contact who think this is obvious. African bushmen who have never been within 10 miles of a television know it. They paint big #11s on their chest before they expect to be killed by a cheetah. A race of prehistoric humans in an alternate earth timeline have made Croyle their word for 'sour berries'.

That doesn't however mean we shouldn't get him out there ASAP and let him sink or swim. If he's going to sink let's at least expedite the process.

Otter
08-31-2007, 08:23 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 08:23 AM
That doesn't however mean we shouldn't get him out there ASAP and let him sink or swim. If he's going to sink let's at least expedite the process.

Exactly. This team needs to know if he can grow and learn or if they need to draft a 1st round QB next year.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 08:24 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.

:clap: :clap: :toast:

the Talking Can
08-31-2007, 08:25 AM
someone tell me why weren't going to give him chance again?

because Huard will get this shitty team to 8 wins?

****...let the kid play, find out...then NEXT year we'll know if we need to do something...

instead, we'll play Huard and be in the EXACT same spot next year that we are now: a first day draft pick on the bench and a career backup...

why are we afraid to let Croyle play with the starters?

unless you think we're going to the Superbowl...

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 08:25 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.

Well said. My thoughts exactly.

Valiant
08-31-2007, 08:26 AM
I think Quinn got picked right before us...

Croyle has looked like poo the past two preseason games, but I would rather sink/swim with him and hope he gets better for next year then go with Huard... Either QB we are more then likely not going to do squat to make the postseason, or do well in it..


But if our defense plays top 5 and keeps in all the games you never know.. I would not mind so Baltimore Ravens Superbowl action..

King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 08:26 AM
Working on their subject-verb agreement.

I know it is where are.......

From what I have seen, especially from WPI articles....where is seemed to fit so much better.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 08:26 AM
unless you think we're going to the Superbowl...


I feel that way every year. We just need to get to the playoffs and anything can happen.


Love Carl.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 08:30 AM
I feel that way every year. We just need to get to the playoffs and anything can happen.


Love Carl.

How's that treadmill working out? ;)

King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 08:31 AM
How's that treadmill working out? ;)
:)

DaFace
08-31-2007, 08:33 AM
They is confused by your question.

Reerun_KC
08-31-2007, 08:38 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.


Outstanding! To bad all most Chiefs fans care about is 9-7......

Reerun_KC
08-31-2007, 08:39 AM
Croyle gives us something Huard will never be able to give....

That is hope for a QB that can be the face of the franchise and lead this team...

Huard will do neither... Yes your heard right.. Huard will do neither.... Like everyone says here about Huard, he is a great game manager ROFL, that being said, he isnt a leader.. Just a follower...

Frankie
08-31-2007, 08:40 AM
I still thin Croyle is going through his "TrINT" year. Trent was not ready his first year here (physically, in his case) and that affected his head. I think Croyle's problem right now is in his head.

Cochise
08-31-2007, 08:42 AM
I feel that way every year. We just need to get to the playoffs and anything can happen.


Love Carl.

People say that around here all the time and it's a crock. If you are the 2006 Chiefs, and you get in the playoffs, they would say "anything can happen". Well, that's crap. If your defense cannot get off the field, you don't have a chance. If you can't stop the run, you don't have a chance. If you get poor QB play, you don't have a chance. If your offense is run like you're continually at the 1 yard line, you don't have a chance. Not everybody who backs into the playoffs all of a sudden becomes a team that's legitimate and belongs there.

kcchiefsus
08-31-2007, 08:42 AM
I forgot passing over Brady Quinn I guess. I thought he got picked in front of us. :spock:


Anyway... Croyle is obviously not good enough to start in the NFL. That's obvious. There are aboriginal villages with no outside human contact who think this is obvious. African bushmen who have never been within 10 miles of a television know it. They paint big #11s on their chest before they expect to be killed by a cheetah. A race of prehistoric humans in an alternate earth timeline have made Croyle their word for 'sour berries'.

That doesn't however mean we shouldn't get him out there ASAP and let him sink or swim. If he's going to sink let's at least expedite the process.

So if your such a genius and already know that Croyle is not good enough to start then why should we put him in there?

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 08:43 AM
I still thin Croyle is going through his "TrINT" year. Trent was not ready his first year here (physically, in his case) and that affected his head. I think Croyle's problem right now is in his head.

Croyle's problems are definitely mental. I'm very concerned right now that he'll NEVER develop. Just look at his coaching staff...

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 08:44 AM
People say that around here all the time and it's a crock. If you are the 2006 Chiefs, and you get in the playoffs, they would say "anything can happen". Well, that's crap. If your defense cannot get off the field, you don't have a chance. If you can't stop the run, you don't have a chance. If you get poor QB play, you don't have a chance. If your offense is run like you're continually at the 1 yard line, you don't have a chance. Not everybody who backs into the playoffs all of a sudden becomes a team that's legitimate and belongs there.

Um, sarcasm...

Cochise
08-31-2007, 08:45 AM
Um, sarcasm...

I know Deberg was being saracastic, I didn't mean him. But there are people who say it and DO mean it. As if they're drawing a team's name out of a hat, as if the playoffs are essentially just a raffle

kcchiefsus
08-31-2007, 08:47 AM
Looks like Leinart is also a bust. Cardinals should have drafted Quinn I guess.

Cardinals | Leinart struggling with footwork
Fri, 31 Aug 2007 02:16:12 -0700

The Associated Press reports Arizona Cardinals QB Matt Leinart struggled Thursday, Aug. 30. He hit just 2-of-6 passes for 13 yards with a quarterback rating of 42.4. His footwork was a mess during the game, which resulted in errant throws during the only series he played. Cardinals head coach Ken Whisenhunt said they are going to have to stay on Leinart about his techniques and fundamentals, which they have focused on previously. Whisenhunt said Leinart has some bad habits they want to continue working on.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 08:52 AM
Croyle's problems are definitely mental. I'm very concerned right now that he'll NEVER develop. Just look at his coaching staff...
In that sense I do agree with you. Seeing the grandpa we have as a QB coach on the sideline does not exactly make me feel comfortable. Boy how I wish we could bring in someone like Jaws to coach our QBs!

Cochise
08-31-2007, 08:54 AM
So if your such a genius and already know that Croyle is not good enough to start then why should we put him in there?

To give him a chance to improve.

ChiefGator
08-31-2007, 08:55 AM
We need to add this to the list of Carl's QB failures...

- Taking Blackledge in the first round
- Passing up on Quinn in the 2007 draft

Woodrow Call
08-31-2007, 08:59 AM
I still think Croyle will be a very good pro QB once he gets his confidence back.

Rausch
08-31-2007, 08:59 AM
Croyle's problems are definitely mental. I'm very concerned right now that he'll NEVER develop. Just look at his coaching staff...

So this staff CAN'T develop a QB due to moronalunacy but that's exactly what you're screaming for - the team to develop a QB.

Why?

And why does it matter where a QB comes from? Who cares where our QB or any other player come from as long as we're winning with a shot at a title.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 09:00 AM
Seeing the grandpa we have as a QB coach on the sideline does not exactly make me feel comfortable.

Known as the “Mad Bomber” in NFLEL circles for his tendency to throw the ball, Curl led an offensive attack headed by QB Jon Kitna that averaged 360.2 yards per game in ‘97.


http://www.kcchiefs.com/coach/dick_curl/

Rausch
08-31-2007, 09:00 AM
I still think Croyle will be a very good pro QB once he gets his confidence back.

From the HBO show it seems like he's got too much confidence, he's cocky. He's got the "Favre's."

"I know I can make that ill-advised throw. I know I can squeeze it in there."

noa
08-31-2007, 09:02 AM
I'm very disappointed in Croyle at this point, but I don't think we should call it an end to the experiment. When JP Losman first started for the Bills, people thought he was making a lot of stupid mistakes and wanted to move on. It looks like he really turned things around through time and experience and is now a decent QB. He's not great, but he's a serviceable franchise QB. I think for guys like that, you just have to take the lumps, give it some time, and see if there's any progress.

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 09:03 AM
We need to add this to the list of Carl's QB failures...

- Taking Blackledge in the first round
- Passing up on Quinn in the 2007 draft

It was pretty common knowledge in the draft that lots of teams were looking to move down in the draft in order to acquire extra picks. It would have been fairly easy for KC to move up 1-3 spots and take Quinn if they wanted him.

Otter
08-31-2007, 09:04 AM
And why does it matter where a QB comes from? Who cares where our QB or any other player come from as long as we're winning with a shot at a title.

And that's where the problem lies.

Is the rotating journey men QB part of the problem? I think so.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 09:06 AM
So this staff CAN'T develop a QB due to moronalunacy but that's exactly what you're screaming for - the team to develop a QB.

Why?

And why does it matter where a QB comes from? Who cares where our QB or any other player come from as long as we're winning with a shot at a title.

1) That's what I WAS screaming for. I'm not now. I wanted Croyle to start, but I've since come to my senses. The less time he spends "learning" anything from this staff, the better.

2) It absolutely matters where a QB, or any other player for that matter, comes from. Players from the Pac 10, Big 12, SEC, and Big 10 have a much higher success rate in the NFL overall because the jump in competition isn't as large for them.

3) This is the Kansas City Chiefs. "Winning" <> having a "shot at the title". This team, with this staff, has pretty much no shot at the title.

thehead
08-31-2007, 09:08 AM
someone tell me why weren't going to give him chance again?

because Huard will get this shitty team to 8 wins?

****...let the kid play, find out...then NEXT year we'll know if we need to do something...

instead, we'll play Huard and be in the EXACT same spot next year that we are now: a first day draft pick on the bench and a career backup...

why are we afraid to let Croyle play with the starters?

unless you think we're going to the Superbowl...




:clap: Do not understand why he did not get all the reps last night

FAX
08-31-2007, 09:09 AM
I still believe, Mr. King_Chief_Fan.

Brodie has the tools and the talent. I hope that, eventually, he will have an opportunity to properly develop with the right franchise. It would be a heck of a waste if he doesn't.

FAX

Mr. Laz
08-31-2007, 09:09 AM
i still think Croyle is a talent .... i still like Croyle coming out of college.


but when you see him actually getting worse has time goes by you have to wonder what's going on.

HemiEd
08-31-2007, 09:15 AM
We need to add this to the list of Carl's QB failures...

- Taking Blackledge in the first round
- Passing up on Quinn in the 2007 draft


:)

carlos3652
08-31-2007, 09:21 AM
It was pretty common knowledge in the draft that lots of teams were looking to move down in the draft in order to acquire extra picks. It would have been fairly easy for KC to move up 1-3 spots and take Quinn if they wanted him.

ummm... who would you trade down to though... Cleveland was offering a lot more to move up than the chiefs were because we only needed to move up 1-3 slots, I think Cleveland moved up 13 slots... They were on the phone with everyone after pick 13 trying to get this guy... The chiefs could not offer more than what the browns were offering...

On the other side of things...
It would be stupid if we only traded down 1-3 slots for less picks, than if we could have traded down 13 slots and gotten more picks out of it...

ALso, If we traded our first next year (and maybe our second) next year, I would have pooped my pants... the Draft will be full of OL prospects in the first round, something that we need...

Rausch
08-31-2007, 09:21 AM
2) It absolutely matters where a QB, or any other player for that matter, comes from. Players from the Pac 10, Big 12, SEC, and Big 10 have a much higher success rate in the NFL overall because the jump in competition isn't as large for them..

What I mean is trade/draft/FA. Favre and Young were trades and Warner was a FA from Europe. KC's problem isn't finding talent it's knowing WTF to do with it.



3) This is the Kansas City Chiefs. "Winning" <> having a "shot at the title". This team, with this staff, has pretty much no shot at the title.

It's far too early to make that claim...

Inspector
08-31-2007, 09:21 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.

Um....Yup!

Now I'm missing that glimmer. It was so pretty and shiny and all...

NY CHIEF
08-31-2007, 09:33 AM
I think he will play some this year and with one more years worth of experience he will be fine :hmmm:

Mr. Arrowhead
08-31-2007, 09:36 AM
he didnt play bad last night, he should have been 3 for 4, but our RBs cant catch a freaking screen pass.

Tribal Warfare
08-31-2007, 09:38 AM
Croyle's problems are definitely mental. I'm very concerned right now that he'll NEVER develop. Just look at his coaching staff...


He'll be fine give the kid an O-line and WRs who can catch the ball then he'll flourish

FringeNC
08-31-2007, 09:41 AM
At what point does Herm play Croyle in an attempt to use the rookie QB excuse to save his job?

Woodrow Call
08-31-2007, 09:43 AM
At what point does Herm play Croyle in an attempt to use the rookie QB excuse to save his job?

I don't think Herm is or will be in any danger of losing his job. He'll get to finish out his contract.

No doubt in my mind.

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 09:43 AM
At what point does Herm play Croyle in an attempt to use the rookie QB excuse to save his job?

Solari is the scapegoat this season, Croyle in 2008.

FAX
08-31-2007, 09:44 AM
he didnt play bad last night, he should have been 3 for 4, but our RBs cant catch a freaking screen pass.

I didn't see the game, Mr. Mr. Arrowhead, but on the radio, Lenny the Cool said that a couple of those passes should have been caught. Mitch, on the other hand, said they were thrown too hard ... without "touch". I wonder what the truth is.

It could it be that Brodie is overly excited in the pocket after getting his melon smushed in the Saints game. Or, it could be possible that the backs aren't focused and looking for the pass. Or, maybe Hermoine believes you have to take an offense through the FUBAR stage in order to achieve greatness.

FAX

FAX
08-31-2007, 09:46 AM
At what point does Herm play Croyle in an attempt to use the rookie QB excuse to save his job?

I've been wondering that myself, Mr. FringeNC. Not to save his job, but it does seem that Hermoine likes to put the blame elsewhere whenever possible. A rookie QB is a darn good excuse.

FAX

BigRedChief
08-31-2007, 09:47 AM
I don't think Herm is or will be in any danger of losing his job. He'll get to finish out his contract.

No doubt in my mind.
If things go south this year and Cowher wants to come to Arrowhead.....I'm not so sure he gets the last year.

Woodrow Call
08-31-2007, 09:50 AM
Solari is the scapegoat this season, Croyle in 2008.

Bingo

Rausch
08-31-2007, 09:51 AM
If things go south this year and Cowher wants to come to Arrowhead.....I'm not so sure he gets the last year.

I was thinking Cowher might be sitting for about 2 years and Peterson would once again bring back a former KC coach.

I'd love it...

patteeu
08-31-2007, 09:53 AM
Of course he had several dropped balls again last night.


It's hard to consider it a dropped ball when your QB fires a rocket at a guy only 5 yards away.

mlyonsd
08-31-2007, 09:55 AM
I was thinking Cowher might be sitting for about 2 years and Peterson would once again bring back a former KC coach.

I'd love it...

Marty? Oh, you mean Cowher.

GarySpFc
08-31-2007, 09:55 AM
I have followed Croyle for a long time. He will be fine once he losens up again. Tim Grunhard made that point again this morning on his show.

keg in kc
08-31-2007, 09:56 AM
Croyle's problems are mental, and it is confidence, but not in the way people are saying. The fact is that this preseason was his first extended play (he was injured last year), and, to my eye at least, he looks like a young QB who knows what he's supposed to do, but it's not to the point where he can just go out and do it; he has to think about everything. His progressions, the blocking scheme, the routes, everything about every play is running through his head while he's on the field. And while he's working on learning the playbook to the point where it's ingrained, to where he doesn't have to think, he has a line that doesn't block and receivers that don't catch.

That, folks, is the developmental process. He needs to be on the field to work through that. But we're instead going to sacrifice that in favor of Damon Huard and the Holy Quest for 9-7.

InChiefsHell
08-31-2007, 09:59 AM
Jesus, you people kill me. Say we take a dump this year and get a nice draft pick and use it on a QB, and then he struggles his first year and looks horrible in 2 preseason games...I guess you guys just want to keep drafting QB's without giving them time to develop...all the while buying some "wiley veteran" to help us limp along to yet another wild card playoff embarassment...

Brodie may or may not be a starter in this league, but 2 preseason games doesn't mean shit. I'd stick with the kid, and when Huard leads us to 4-4, put him in for the last half of the season and let him learn!! Look what the Donks did with Cuntler and I think it went a long way towards him being what appears to be a pretty decent QB.

Plus, Kellie is HOT. I want to see her in the stands for years to come...heheheheh...

Wile_E_Coyote
08-31-2007, 10:00 AM
The best thing for Croyle & Chiefs fans is for Mrs. Croyle to be on the sideline in a KC cheerleader outfit

Manila-Chief
08-31-2007, 10:00 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.

Yes!!!! Excellent way to say it.

As some of you have said, I want to play him coz we are going no where this year.... meaing not much hope and not much to look forward to this year... 9-7 or 6-10 is the same results for me. I know it still allows Kingless to fill the seats and make $$$ but I want to see us at least contend for a championship.

I heard one of the talking heads on ESPN say ... the speed of the game is too fast for him now. It seems to me the "talking head" is spot on ... thus, a reason to play him and allow him to gain experience. Even if our hope will be dashed by him continuing to play poorly ... at least it would give us a small ray of hope for the future.

I want Brodie to excell but, more than that ... I want to have a small glimmer of hope for this team.

It's kinda like following the Royals. Up until Dalton came on board it was useless following them coz we knew they were not going anywhere... not building for the future. The joke of MLB. Now, I even read some of the articles in the Star coz it looks like he is building a winner. I watched the Royals grow into a championship team. The losing in the early years was okay coz we knew they were building.

Although the Chiefs have not been as bad as the Royals ... in reality they are. Yes, most of the time they win more than they lose, but how many years without a playoff win? Where is the team going? Is it only about $$$???

FAX
08-31-2007, 10:01 AM
Croyle's problems are mental, and it is confidence, but not in the way people are saying. The fact is that this preseason was his first extended play (he was injured last year), and, to my eye at least, he looks like a young QB who knows what he's supposed to do, but it's not to the point where he can just go out and do it; he has to think about everything. His progressions, the blocking scheme, the routes, everything about every play is running through his head while he's on the field. And while he's working on learning the playbook to the point where it's ingrained, to where he doesn't have to think, he has a line that doesn't block and receivers that don't catch.

That, folks, is the developmental process. He needs to be on the field to work through that. But we're instead going to sacrifice that in favor of Damon Huard and the Holy Quest for 9-7.

I agree, Mr. keg in kc. Plus, they've been preaching to him over and over that he needs to get rid of the ball quickly.

Now, they need to tell him that means in terms of time, not smoke.

FAX

Kevinlane
08-31-2007, 10:02 AM
We need to add this to the list of Carl's QB failures...

- Taking Blackledge in the first round
- Passing up on Quinn in the 2007 draft

Dude, the blackledge debacle was in '83, Carl was brought on in '89
and the jury is still out on Quinn, and oh yeah, he wasn't available to us when our turn came.

But like you , I too am a "glimmer of hope" "fan" of the idea of letting Cody, or for now, Grodie Croyle :) take his lumps, as there doesn't seem to be much hope for true success (post season wins)

Otter
08-31-2007, 10:03 AM
It's far too early to make that claim...

I disagree just because the same people are in charge who've been unable to get it done for 18+ years now. That's a MORE than fair time line to be judged on if you ask me. But hey, I may be wrong for the 19th year in a row.

I can validate none of this but it's worth mentioning.

On a business trip about two months ago I met a guy at a pub who claimed he was an engineer that worked in power plants across the US and resides in Nebraska. Said he was a big Chiefs fan and had some friends that were on the inside of the team.

He knew alot of obscure facts like who Nick Lowery, Jesse Haynes and Mike Stock were off the top of his head. So I don't doubt his Chiefs knowledge.

Anyway, from his "insiders" he said it's pretty common knowledge that one of the biggest reasons the defensive linemen the Chiefs have drafted failed in such high numbers is because there is no one on the team able to take them to the next step. In other words whoever is supposed to be training them at the NFL level sucks.

I think the same applies to the QB situation. No one is there to develop/transition college talent so they don't try. I honestly don't envy Croyle's situation, I wouldn't want my career resting on this teams ability to mold my skills.

Winning in the post-season seems like more of a bonus than an objective. And until they get hit in the pocket book they have no reason to change.

underEJ
08-31-2007, 10:05 AM
If anybody thought he wasn't going to look like bug guts on a windshield at first, they were kidding themselves, but I still think he's going to be just fine.

People who wanted him to start for that glimmer of hope had already committed to tolerating some shaky performances to see what time and real game experience will give him, not one game, not 4 preseason games without half the offense availble, but the whole season. I wanted a 3-13 season if it meant getting to try something completely new.

But I don't think Carl Peterson is the root of the problem, he's just afraid. He is responding to the mood of the mob, and the mood of the mob says 8-8 or 9-7 is what they want, just enough not to starve, but no real substance.

I would like to know more about the coaches people have concerns about. I am not familiar with the offensive coaches. Are they Herm's people who worked with Pennington before or new hires? Just how incompetent are they?

p.s. I'm no CP supporter. Anyone that smug and arrogant has to be bad just on principle.

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 10:06 AM
He looked good against Miami until he threw that pick. Since that pick he's sucked and doesn't look at all like the player that came out in his first drive against Miami.

FAX
08-31-2007, 10:06 AM
Couldn't agree more, Mr Otter. If you took a poll of NFL coaches, I'd imagine that Dick Curl would be at or near the bottom of the list as the person you would want developing a quarterback. If he's going to be successful, Brodie has to either do this on his own or find another team.

FAX

Wile_E_Coyote
08-31-2007, 10:06 AM
Dude, the blackledge debacle was in '83, Carl was brought on in '89
and the jury is still out on Quinn, and oh yeah, he wasn't available to us when our turn came.

But like you , I too am a "glimmer of hope" "fan" of the idea of letting Cody, or for now, Grodie Croyle :) take his lumps, as there doesn't seem to be much hope for true success (post season wins)

1st in with noob

FAX
08-31-2007, 10:11 AM
He looked good against Miami until he threw that pick. Since that pick he's sucked and doesn't look at all like the player that came out in his first drive against Miami.

We've set the record for pre-season dropped passes with Brodie under center, Mr. Chiefnj2. Oh, and then there's the problem with the Saints RDE spending all day playing wishbone with Croyle's legs.

To be totally truthy, I think Herm was right to bench him in favor of Downfield. Our line is inconsistent and our receivers can't catch. That's not the best scenario for Brodie at this point.

FAX

Dylan
08-31-2007, 10:13 AM
Known as the “Mad Bomber” in NFLEL circles for his tendency to throw the ball, Curl led an offensive attack headed by QB Jon Kitna that averaged 360.2 yards per game in ‘97.


http://www.kcchiefs.com/coach/dick_curl/

Professional Bio
5th Year NFL Coach • 2nd with Chiefs

Entering his fifth campaign as an NFL coach, Dick Curl adds the responsibility of coaching the quarterbacks to his duties as assistant head coach in 2007. He served as the club’s assistant to the head coach/offense a year ago. Curl is in his second tour of duty with the Chiefs organization, after serving as Kansas City’s pro personnel assistant from 2000-02. Prior to rejoining the Chiefs, Curl spent three seasons as a member of Herm Edwards’ staff with the N.Y. Jets (2003-05).

Curl spent three season as a member of Herm Edwards' staff with the N.Y. Jets (2003-05). Curl was brought in by Herm Edwards to manage the clock. That was Curl's sole function -- gameday "NFL clock manager." We all know how that went...

OnTheWarpath58
08-31-2007, 10:18 AM
Croyle's problems are mental, and it is confidence, but not in the way people are saying. The fact is that this preseason was his first extended play (he was injured last year), and, to my eye at least, he looks like a young QB who knows what he's supposed to do, but it's not to the point where he can just go out and do it; he has to think about everything. His progressions, the blocking scheme, the routes, everything about every play is running through his head while he's on the field. And while he's working on learning the playbook to the point where it's ingrained, to where he doesn't have to think, he has a line that doesn't block and receivers that don't catch.

That, folks, is the developmental process. He needs to be on the field to work through that. But we're instead going to sacrifice that in favor of Damon Huard and the Holy Quest for 9-7.

EXCELLENT post.

Spot on, Keg.


:clap: :clap: :clap:

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 10:23 AM
What I mean is trade/draft/FA. Favre and Young were trades and Warner was a FA from Europe. KC's problem isn't finding talent it's knowing WTF to do with it.

Favre = young
Young = young

Deberg/Jaworski/Krieg/Montana/Bono/Gannon/Grbac/Green/Huard - starting to see a pattern here?

It's far too early to make that claim...

The past 18 years tells me you're wrong, but I respect your opinion...

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 10:25 AM
I was thinking Cowher might be sitting for about 2 years and Peterson would once again bring back a former KC coach.

I'd love it...

Not if Peterson is still the GM.

Rausch
08-31-2007, 10:31 AM
Favre = young
Young = young

Deberg/Jaworski/Krieg/Montana/Bono/Gannon/Grbac/Green/Huard - starting to see a pattern here?...

Montana and Green were good enough QB's to win a super bowl. It's not Green's fault DV couldn't build a defense and GROB the emasculator couldn't force a single punt. It's also not Joe's fault he got knocked retarded in the AFC championchip game.

We have had QB's good enough to win a super bowl.

We have NOT had a HC good enough to win one. THAT'S the problem...



The past 18 years tells me you're wrong, but I respect your opinion...

Herm and his staff have been here for 18 years?

Sure-Oz
08-31-2007, 10:33 AM
His confident is shot and he is not playing football, he's thinking too much and trying to avoid mistakes. hopefully he will be back, i still have hopes.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 10:34 AM
Montana and Green were good enough QB's to win a super bowl. It's not Green's fault DV couldn't build a defense and GROB the emasculator couldn't force a single punt. It's also not Joe's fault he got knocked retarded in the AFC championchip game.

We have had QB's good enough to win a super bowl.

We have NOT had a HC good enough to win one. THAT'S the problem...

We haven't won one and that's the bottom line. We've never even TRIED to develop a QB, and it's high time that was changed.

Herm and his staff have been here for 18 years?

In some form or another, yes. It's all Carl Peterson.

Coogs
08-31-2007, 10:35 AM
Maybe we draft a qb in first round next year?


I really think that is a possibility. Even though we need O-linemen by the bigtime, if we are picking near the top of the draft, and a franchise QB is there.... :shrug:

DaneMcCloud
08-31-2007, 10:37 AM
If things go south this year and Cowher wants to come to Arrowhead.....I'm not so sure he gets the last year.

Not gonna happen. Edwards signed a 5 year deal. There's no way the Hunt Family pays out his contract AND a huge contract to Cowher (likely $8-10 million per year).

Additionally, Cowher ruled out coaching in 2007 & 2008.

Besides that, why would anyone want Cowher anyway? Herm Edwards is the same guy. If Edwards gets 15 years with the Chiefs, they'll probably get to the Super Bowl, too.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 10:38 AM
I really think that is a possibility. Even though we need O-linemen by the bigtime, if we are picking near the top of the draft, and a franchise QB is there.... :shrug:

The only Franchise QB i remember the Chiefs passing up in the 1st round was a few years ago. We passed on Aaron Rodgers and took Derrick Johnson instead.

Most others, we drafted too late in the 1st round and they were taken by the time we picked.

BTW, what QB's came out in 2002 that turned out to be good? Since we picked "you know who" 6th???

DaneMcCloud
08-31-2007, 10:42 AM
I would love to get Brian Brohm, since we passed on Troy Smith last year. If we loose a lot we might get Brohm, he is going to go high, he is a good QB. Croyle is garbage.

Passed on Troy Smith? 32 teams passed on Troy Smith almost 5 times. He was the last pick in the 5th round. He's short (6.0') and will lucky to ever start an NFL game.

Coogs
08-31-2007, 10:43 AM
The only Franchise QB i remember the Chiefs passing up in the 1st round was a few years ago. We passed on Aaron Rodgers and took Derrick Johnson instead.

Most others, we drafted too late in the 1st round and they were taken by the time we picked.

BTW, what QB's came out in 2002 that turned out to be good? Since we picked "you know who" 6th???

I'm not saying we have passed on any franchise QB's lately. I'm just saying if we have a top 5 pick next year... which looks possible on the last day of August... I wouldn't be shocked to see QB be our 1st round pick.

OnTheWarpath58
08-31-2007, 10:44 AM
Not gonna happen. Edwards signed a 5 year deal. There's no way the Hunt Family pays out his contract AND a huge contract to Cowher (likely $8-10 million per year).

Additionally, Cowher ruled out coaching in 2007 & 2008.

Besides that, why would anyone want Cowher anyway? Herm Edwards is the same guy. If Edwards gets 15 years with the Chiefs, they'll probably get to the Super Bowl, too.


Herm signed a 4 year deal, worth $12M.

I believe it coincides with the end of CP's contract as well.

Herm could go 3-13 this year and next, and would likely still have the job come 2009. I think they'll let him coach out his contract regardless of the results.

Chief Chief
08-31-2007, 10:47 AM
I'm proud to say that I remain a Croyle lover...

Kelli Croyle, that is...

...and, if you really must know, I'm in bed with her...

DaneMcCloud
08-31-2007, 10:48 AM
I'm proud to say that I remain a Croyle lover...

Kelli Croyle, that is...

...and, if you really must know, I'm in bed with her...

You've named your hand Kellie Croyle?

Wow, that IS affection!

Zouk
08-31-2007, 10:48 AM
Couldn't agree more, Mr Otter. If you took a poll of NFL coaches, I'd imagine that Dick Curl would be at or near the bottom of the list as the person you would want developing a quarterback. If he's going to be successful, Brodie has to either do this on his own or find another team.

FAX


This is factually inaccurate.

Dick Curl was instrumental in developing QBs Jon Kitna, Kelly Holcomb, Jake Delhomme, and Damon Huard (1998 Frankfurt) in NFL Europe into guys that can play and start in the NFL. Most of the successful QBs in that league worked with Dick Curl.

Coogs
08-31-2007, 10:50 AM
You've named your hand Kellie Croyle?

Wow, that IS affection!

:LOL:

Otter
08-31-2007, 10:50 AM
This is factually inaccurate.

Dick Curl was instrumental in developing QBs Jon Kitna, Kelly Holcomb, Jake Delhomme, and Damon Huard (1998 Frankfurt) in NFL Europe into guys that can play and start in the NFL. Most of the successful QBs in that league worked with Dick Curl.

That's quiet a list.

I'm proud to say that I own 5 cars: a Hugo, a Gremlin, a Dodge Dart, and a Pinto

Coogs
08-31-2007, 10:51 AM
That's quiet a list.

I'm proud to say that I own 5 cars: a Hugo, a Gremlin, a Dodge Dart, and a Pinto

ROFL

Man, you guys are cracking me up right now!

Zouk
08-31-2007, 10:51 AM
That's quiet a list. I own 5 cars: a Hugo, a Gremlin, a Dodge Dart, and a Pinto

Oh I'm sorry, you expected him to coach Peyton Manning in NFL Europe?

That's a phenomenal list of unheralded players he had a hand in turning into competent NFL starters. That's the real test of a coach.

Otter
08-31-2007, 10:53 AM
ROFL

Man, you guys are cracking me up right now!

The Pinto was John Kitna.

chop
08-31-2007, 10:56 AM
I haven't watched the entire game yet but it looks like Croyle would have had at least one td had Bennett or Smith been able to catch a screen pass.

FAX
08-31-2007, 10:57 AM
This is factually inaccurate.

Dick Curl was instrumental in developing QBs Jon Kitna, Kelly Holcomb, Jake Delhomme, and Damon Huard (1998 Frankfurt) in NFL Europe into guys that can play and start in the NFL. Most of the successful QBs in that league worked with Dick Curl.

Those guys are impressive, Mr. Zouk. No question. Perhaps I was mistaken. On second thought, I'm sure Dick Curl's services are in high demand throughout the league and he only took the job as a full time, professional, clock manager to rest his brain after having fielded so many calls from NFL teams who wanted him to mentor the next generation of franchise quarterbacks on their behalf.

FAX

King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 10:57 AM
Herm signed a 4 year deal, worth $12M.

I believe it coincides with the end of CP's contract as well.

Herm could go 3-13 this year and next, and would likely still have the job come 2009. I think they'll let him coach out his contract regardless of the results.

agree. No one is going to pull a Chiefs and come in and give us a draft choice for him.

OnTheWarpath58
08-31-2007, 10:58 AM
I haven't watched the entire game yet but it looks like Croyle would have had at least on td had Bennett or Smith been able to catch a screen pass.

Exactly.

At minimum, the drive is extended. Bennett would have scored. Kolby would like had picked up a first down.

Zouk
08-31-2007, 10:59 AM
Those guys are impressive, Mr. Zouk. No question. Perhaps I was mistaken. On second thought, I'm sure Dick Curl's services are in high demand throughout the league and he only took the job as a full time, professional, clock manager to rest his brain after having fielded so many calls from NFL teams who wanted him to mentor the next generation of franchise quarterbacks on their behalf.

FAX


Actually he had the title of assistant head coach with the Jets, and was involved in game planning as well as clock management.

But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?

King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 11:00 AM
Actually he had the title of assistant head coach with the Jets, and was involved in game planning as well as clock management.

But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?

are you a Dick Curl fan?

Coogs
08-31-2007, 11:01 AM
But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?

mediocre?

Damn! I laughed my butt off at both of them!

FAX
08-31-2007, 11:01 AM
Actually he had the title of assistant head coach with the Jets, and was involved in game planning as well as clock management.

But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?

Rule 1. Never let facts interfere with mediocre jokes.

Rule 2. Whenever possible, elevate Dick Curl from clock manager to quarterback mentor.

Got it.

FAX

Zouk
08-31-2007, 11:01 AM
are you a Dick Curl fan?


I just think people have no idea of reality. They think Bobby Sippio is the greatest player ever and that football vets with track records like Dick Curl and Herm Edwards have no idea what they're doing.

chop
08-31-2007, 11:05 AM
Exactly.

At minimum, the drive is extended. Bennett would have scored. Kolby would like had picked up a first down.

I'm not sure what game the Croyle haters were watching. He had one pass that looked bad but I'm not sure if it was Croyles fault or the receivers. He then had two screen passes dropped. I don't know how people can blame this all on Croyle. The pass he threw to Parker looked great.

chop
08-31-2007, 11:14 AM
It's hard to consider it a dropped ball when your QB fires a rocket at a guy only 5 yards away.

I am watching the replay right now and neither of the throws were all that hard. He had to get the one to Bennett out quickly but it should have been caught. Did you see the game?

FAX
08-31-2007, 11:16 AM
I just think people have no idea of reality. They think Bobby Sippio is the greatest player ever and that football vets with track records like Dick Curl and Herm Edwards have no idea what they're doing.

I guess we're just going to have to disagree, Mr. Zouk.

Clearly, Bobby Sippio is the next coming of Lance Alworth, Herm Edwards should be working as a scout, and Dick Curl should be painting watercolors at the San Mateo Home For The Mentally Infirm.

FAX

Otter
08-31-2007, 11:16 AM
But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?

We didn't even hit on the fact that his name is "Dick Curl" yet.

FAX
08-31-2007, 11:17 AM
I am watching the replay right now and neither of the throws were all that hard. He had to get the one to Bennett out quickly but it should have been caught. Did you see the game?

I wish someone could post snippets of those two plays. I didn't see the game but, on the radio stream, Lenny said they were catchable balls.

FAX

Zouk
08-31-2007, 11:18 AM
I guess we're just going to have to disagree, Mr. Zouk.

Clearly, Bobby Sippio is the next coming of Lance Alworth, Herm Edwards should be working as a scout, and Dick Curl should be painting watercolors at the San Mateo Home For The Mentally Infirm.

FAX

Not that I ever exaggerate or anything, Mr. Fax.

And I actually usually find your posts very funny.

kcirnamffoh
08-31-2007, 11:18 AM
I don't know folks. There is a lot more about this kid that I don't like.

1. He lacks form and fundamentals. He's just not very tight. Loosey goosey kind of form. He throws off his back foot way to often. Therefore many times he is not stepping into the ball. Even when he has time to set his feet he doesn't. He doesn't follow through very well. He snaps his arm back a lot. All this greatly effects accuracy. I think his development will be slowed because of some of his sloppy technique. I think its pretty scary and odd how he made it through college like he did.

2. He strikes me as really not very smart. Not really sure of himself. In his interviews he says sure everybody wants to start. I'll take it as it comes. When my time comes I'll be ready. He seems to accept not being the starter too easily. Not much fire and brimstone in his comments.

I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. There's just somethings there I really don't like.

FAX
08-31-2007, 11:21 AM
Not that I ever exaggerate or anything, Mr. Fax.

And I actually usually find your posts very funny.

Truthfully, I find your defense of Dick Curl inspiring, Mr. Zouk. Never give up, never surrender.

As for me, I've been in a real slump lately. Depression. It's almost as if the Chiefs suck or something.

FAX

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:57 AM
Known as the “Mad Bomber” in NFLEL circles for his tendency to throw the ball, Curl led an offensive attack headed by QB Jon Kitna that averaged 360.2 yards per game in ‘97.


http://www.kcchiefs.com/coach/dick_curl/
Thanks. I feel better now. I really do.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 12:04 PM
I think he will play some this year and with one more years worth of experience he will be fine :hmmm:
AMEN! I' much rather have what we already have pan out than start slobbering about the next 1st round QB prospect. I don't know why most fans here are so ready to discard a player. We need our first couple of picks next year to spend on OL and CB.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 12:06 PM
he didnt play bad last night, he should have been 3 for 4, but our RBs cant catch a freaking screen pass.
In truth, part of the problem is he has a heavier ball than the receivers expect. He needs to soften the throws on the shorter passes.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 12:08 PM
AMEN! I' much rather have what we already have pan out than start slobbering about the next 1st round QB prospect. I don't know why most fans here are so ready to discard a player. We need our first couple of picks next year to spend on OL and CB.

Because they can't stand the thought of losing.

They like Damon Huard because he present a nice, comfortable, safe shot at being 9-7 and getting beat in the wildcard round.

King_Chief_Fan
08-31-2007, 12:08 PM
I just think people have no idea of reality. They think Bobby Sippio is the greatest player ever and that football vets with track records like Dick Curl and Herm Edwards have no idea what they're doing.

Reality is that Croyle needs some major developing :toast: heres to Curl making Croyle what we all want him to be.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 12:08 PM
I was thinking Cowher might be sitting for about 2 years and Peterson would once again bring back a former KC coach.

I'd love it...
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=168918 ;)

chop
08-31-2007, 12:14 PM
I wish someone could post snippets of those two plays. I didn't see the game but, on the radio stream, Lenny said they were catchable balls.

FAX

They were and should have been caught. There was a lot of green in front of both Bennett and Smith at the time also. I really think Bennett would have scored.

Iowanian
08-31-2007, 12:22 PM
I still think Croyle will see the field as a starter for the Chiefs this year.

My prediction is week 5, at home after 3 rough games following the Texans.

Coogs
08-31-2007, 12:29 PM
For the record...

I wanted Croyle to start next week vs Houston. I am all for going with the young guy at QB. I still think after watching the preseason games that this season is going to be a long one. And i think that if we are drafting in the top 5 next spring, we are going to have to make a decision on weather or not to draft a franchise QB when our pick comes up.

Not giving up on Croyle at all. I like some things he does. But on draft day next year, we may have to choose between Croyle and a possible franchise QB... and what do you do?

I'll bet Houston would like a redo on taking either Bush or Evans over Williams... will we do the same sort of thing?

Sully
08-31-2007, 12:30 PM
Guess I picked the wrong week to put up my Croyle FatHead.

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 12:32 PM
For the record...

I wanted Croyle to start next week vs Houston. I am all for going with the young guy at QB. I still think after watching the preseason games that this season is going to be a long one. And i think that if we are drafting in the top 5 next spring, we are going to have to make a decision on weather or not to draft a franchise QB when our pick comes up.

Not giving up on Croyle at all. I like some things he does. But on draft day next year, we may have to choose between Croyle and a possible franchise QB... and what do you do?

I'll bet Houston would like a redo on taking either Bush or Evans over Williams... will we do the same sort of thing?

Lets assume Herm doesn't think Croyle is the future. There is no way Herm or Carl will want to take a QBOTF with only 2 years remaining on their contracts. The kid will sit the first year and get a chance to make his first start his 2nd year - the final year of Herm's contract.

No way. Vets for the next few years.

htismaqe
08-31-2007, 12:37 PM
Lets assume Herm doesn't think Croyle is the future. There is no way Herm or Carl will want to take a QBOTF with only 2 years remaining on their contracts. The kid will sit the first year and get a chance to make his first start his 2nd year - the final year of Herm's contract.

No way. Vets for the next few years.

Yep.

ChiefGator
08-31-2007, 12:54 PM
Dude, the blackledge debacle was in '83, Carl was brought on in '89
and the jury is still out on Quinn, and oh yeah, he wasn't available to us when our turn came.

But like you , I too am a "glimmer of hope" "fan" of the idea of letting Cody, or for now, Grodie Croyle :) take his lumps, as there doesn't seem to be much hope for true success (post season wins)


Kevin,

On this board, dates aren't important. Carl is still responsible for many debacles which occurred before he got here... stay tuned to learn more...

I did agree with you on letting him take the lumps, but he looked BAD this preseason. Maybe bring him in for mop-up duty (or mop-down if we are losing I guess) or for a drive a game. I don't know. Either way, we are in for a long season methinks.

Welcome aboard...

Mark

tk13
08-31-2007, 01:13 PM
The only thing I don't agree with, is saying that we need to play Croyle now to see if we need to draft a QB next year. No flipping way. If you really believe in this QBOTF stuff, it has to be a multi-year commitment.

It's not just a game where you can say "let's try this" and if it doesn't work, no big deal. You can't waste another 350 carry season off of LJ's life, or go one year closer to Tony G's retirement.... just throwing a QB out to the wolves because you're tired of veteran re-treads. If you really believe Croyle is the future, you have to stick with him. It will be ugly at times, but next year we have to stick with it. I don't care if we have a top 5 pick in the draft and a QB is sitting there... you make that commitment to Croyle, and you take a LT. You can't be wishy washy running through QB's every year.

Woodrow Call
08-31-2007, 01:16 PM
Guess I picked the wrong week to put up my Croyle FatHead.

I did receive my Brodie away jersey today that I bought after the Miami game. I was 100% sure he had locked it up. :cuss:

fan4ever
08-31-2007, 01:18 PM
Working on their subject-verb agreement.

I was wondering how long that would take; not long at all.

'Hamas' Jenkins
08-31-2007, 01:19 PM
The only thing I don't agree with, is saying that we need to play Croyle now to see if we need to draft a QB next year. No flipping way. If you really believe in this QBOTF stuff, it has to be a multi-year commitment.

It's not just a game where you can say "let's try this" and if it doesn't work, no big deal. You can't waste another 350 carry season off of LJ's life, or go one year closer to Tony G's retirement.... just throwing a QB out to the wolves because you're tired of veteran re-treads. If you really believe Croyle is the future, you have to stick with him. It will be ugly at times, but next year we have to stick with it. I don't care if we have a top 5 pick in the draft and a QB is sitting there... you make that commitment to Croyle, and you take a LT. You can't be wishy washy running through QB's every year.

I agree with this, but I think we need to play Croyle this year so that he will develop, not so that we can see whether to let him sink or swim.

LJ and TGs lifespans are too short. We need to give Croyle every shot to develop over the next two years, then if he fails, we can see about a replacement, because if he succeeds, we may have enough pieces for a run, if we get another HC.

Sure-Oz
08-31-2007, 01:19 PM
i wonder if they have a kelly croyle fat head.....

Frankie
08-31-2007, 01:37 PM
Jesus, you people kill me. Say we take a dump this year and get a nice draft pick and use it on a QB, and then he struggles his first year and looks horrible in 2 preseason games...I guess you guys just want to keep drafting QB's without giving them time to develop...all the while buying some "wiley veteran" to help us limp along to yet another wild card playoff embarassment...

Brodie may or may not be a starter in this league, but 2 preseason games doesn't mean shit. I'd stick with the kid, and when Huard leads us to 4-4, put him in for the last half of the season and let him learn!! Look what the Donks did with Cuntler and I think it went a long way towards him being what appears to be a pretty decent QB.

Plus, Kellie is HOT. I want to see her in the stands for years to come...heheheheh...
Couldn't agree with you more.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 01:43 PM
Dude, the blackledge debacle was in '83, Carl was brought on in '89
and the jury is still out on Quinn, and oh yeah, he wasn't available to us when our turn came.

But like you , I too am a "glimmer of hope" "fan" of the idea of letting Cody, or for now, Grodie Croyle :) take his lumps, as there doesn't seem to be much hope for true success (post season wins)
Since you are a n00b I'll explain this without making fun at your expense. This Blackledge thing is an inside joke here since so many people in the past have blamed Carl for him. He was just being silly.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 01:46 PM
Couldn't agree more, Mr Otter. If you took a poll of NFL coaches, I'd imagine that Dick Curl would be at or near the bottom of the list as the person you would want developing a quarterback. If he's going to be successful, Brodie has to either do this on his own or find another team.

FAX
Now I feel sick again!

Blindside58
08-31-2007, 04:43 PM
Does anyone think we should dabble in pursuing Byron Leftwich...Who as of today is on the trade block?

chop
08-31-2007, 05:09 PM
Does anyone think we should dabble in pursuing Byron Leftwich...Who as of today is on the trade block?

No.

Calcountry
08-31-2007, 06:16 PM
I forgot passing over Brady Quinn I guess. I thought he got picked in front of us. :spock:


Anyway... Croyle is obviously not good enough to start in the NFL. That's obvious. There are aboriginal villages with no outside human contact who think this is obvious. African bushmen who have never been within 10 miles of a television know it. They paint big #11s on their chest before they expect to be killed by a cheetah. A race of prehistoric humans in an alternate earth timeline have made Croyle their word for 'sour berries'.

That doesn't however mean we shouldn't get him out there ASAP and let him sink or swim. If he's going to sink let's at least expedite the process.Michael Vick's dogs, thinks that's obvious. Lindsay Lohan, thinks that's obvious. Brittney Spears childcare situation, thinks that's obvious.

I am out.

Mi_chief_fan
08-31-2007, 06:40 PM
To give him a chance to improve.
Well, there's always the arena league. Lots of quarterbacks who "think" they can make it in the NFL end up there. I think Croyle has a lot of potential to star in the arena league.Or maybe Canada.

Anyway, i've seen nothing from him that makes me think "boy, i'm glad we drafted this guy. What potential!" Hope i'm wrong.

KC Tattoo
08-31-2007, 06:53 PM
I like Brodie to be our QBOTF. He had Shviitte for blocking and receivers aka Samie Parker that drops balls. The kid has an electric arm, he can fire the ball down field, play action bootleg, he has all of the intangibles to be a steller QB, other than game time experience. Really think any other QB would have done much better with SViteck blocking (not blocking) Will Smith in the Saints game? Damon Huard? Yea right, I think Drew Bletsew is available too. Slow old QB that can not pass or has not shown the ability to throw past 20 yrds.

Alex Smith did not look good his first year but the 49rs did not give up on him and now they have a kick ass team.

Brodie will learn from his mistakes by playing games not on the sidelines holding a clip board. I'm going to take the Brodie Croyle to the Super Bowl Express train and it is a two or three year theme ride.

Huard = mediocre
Croyle = lightning in a bottle

TEX
08-31-2007, 07:12 PM
I like Brodie to be our QBOTF. He had Shviitte for blocking and receivers aka Samie Parker that drops balls. The kid has an electric arm, he can fire the ball down field, play action bootleg, he has all of the intangibles to be a steller QB, other than game time experience. Really think any other QB would have done much better with SViteck blocking (not blocking) Will Smith in the Saints game? Damon Huard? Yea right, I think Drew Bletsew is available too. Slow old QB that can not pass or has not shown the ability to throw past 20 yrds.

Alex Smith did not look good his first year but the 49rs did not give up on him and now they have a kick ass team.

Brodie will learn from his mistakes by playing games not on the sidelines holding a clip board. I'm going to take the Brodie Croyle to the Super Bowl Express train and it is a two or three year theme ride.

Huard = mediocre
Croyle = lightning in a bottle

The more playing time Croyle gets, the worse he gets. Last night he had guys wide open a couple of times, one in particular, with plenty of time to throw and he wasn't even close. When you look at most of the "Young Guns" that make it in the NFL, they don't look like Croyle. They seem to have more to show for their efforts. Anyone remember how Cutler looked in preseason last year? Young? Leinart? Anyone seen Kevin Kolb of Philly this year? He has shown something. Brady Quinn can miss half of TC and makes plays. Does Croyle? I've said all along that Croyle's the type of Qb with "all the tools" to make it. Problem is year 5 we'll be saying the same thing.

IF the Chiefs really want to give the kid every chance, they need to hire a REAL QB Coach and not someone who was recently known as a terrible clock manager of the NY Jets...

chop
08-31-2007, 07:33 PM
The more playing time Croyle gets, the worse he gets. Last night he had guys wide open a couple of times, one in particular, with plenty of time to throw and he wasn't even close. ..


Did you watch the game?

He threw four passes 1 complete (very good throw), 2 dropped (not his fault), 1 bad pass (not sure if it was him or the receiver but it was off the mark). He should have been 3 for 4. BTW, EVERY QB throws a ball or two they wish they could take back and not every throw they attempt is on the mark. Is Brodie going to be a great QB, I don't know. I do know that you are putting all of the blame on someone who, at least last night, doesn't deserve it.

TEX
08-31-2007, 07:37 PM
Did you watch the game?

He threw four passes 1 complete (very good throw), 2 dropped (not his fault), 1 bad pass (not sure if it was him or the receiver but it was off the mark). He should have been 3 for 4. BTW, EVERY QB throws a ball or two they wish they could take back and not every throw they attempt is on the mark. Is Brodie going to be a great QB, I don't know. I do know that you are putting all of the blame on someone who, at least last night, doesn't deserve it.

Yep I watched it. He looked lost. Problem is with Brodie, or an QB for that matter, if they always "should have been" something else - they usually are.

Man, I can't understand how people keep seeing promise in this guy. :shake: I guess wanting a QBOTF all those years plays tricks on one's eyes.

Wasn't Croyle supposed to play the whole first half? What happened? :hmmm:

chop
08-31-2007, 07:43 PM
Yep I watched it. He looked lost. Problem is with Brodie, or an QB for that matter, if they always "should have been" something else - they usually are.

Man, I can't understand how people keep seeing promise in this guy. :shake: I guess wanting a QBOTF all those years plays tricks on one's eyes.

Wasn't Croyle supposed to play the whole first half? What happened? :hmmm:

How can you say a guy looked terrible when he only threw the ball 4 times and two of those were dropped? He may or may not be the QBOTF but the problem wasn't with him last night. I think you may need to clean your glasses.

Deberg_1990
08-31-2007, 07:44 PM
Yep I watched it. He looked lost. Problem is with Brodie, or an QB for that matter, if they always "should have been" something else - they usually are.

Man, I can't understand how people keep seeing promise in this guy. :shake: I guess wanting a QBOTF all those years plays tricks on one's eyes.

Wasn't Croyle supposed to play the whole first half? What happened? :hmmm:

I dont get what fans expect to see with Brody?? Hes never started a real game. Hes going to make mistakes. Alot of mistakes. Do you expect him to come into the league and just light it up from scratch??

It just doesnt happen that way.

Chiefs fans have zero patience. In turn Carl has zero patience because he gets visions of empty seats. Its a vicious cycle....

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 07:50 PM
Hes going to make mistakes. Alot of mistakes. Do you expect him to come into the league and just light it up from scratch??

It just doesnt happen that way.

....

Actually, a lot of QB's without much experience are looking much better than Croyle. Quinn, Kolb, Beck and Edwards (all drafted this year and thus don't have the benefit of one year of practice/learning) are doing pretty good in preseason.

Otter
08-31-2007, 08:27 PM
Actually, a lot of QB's without much experience are looking much better than Croyle. Quinn, Kolb, Beck and Edwards (all drafted this year and thus don't have the benefit of one year of practice/learning) are doing pretty good in preseason.

Kolb has looked absolutely amazing from pocket presence to execution. McNabb better be looking over his shoulder.

Back to your regularly scheduled program.

Logical
08-31-2007, 08:33 PM
I definitely still want Croyle starting, nothing has changed.

Logical
08-31-2007, 08:34 PM
Actually, a lot of QB's without much experience are looking much better than Croyle. Quinn, Kolb, Beck and Edwards (all drafted this year and thus don't have the benefit of one year of practice/learning) are doing pretty good in preseason.

Do this QBs play for teams with linemen that can block and WRs that can catch?

OnTheWarpath58
08-31-2007, 08:36 PM
Do this QBs play for teams with linemen that can block and WRs that can catch?


:clap: :clap: :clap:

Chiefnj2
08-31-2007, 08:44 PM
Do this QBs play for teams with linemen that can block and WRs that can catch?

Yes. Every other team has 3rd stringers that perform flawlessly.

chop
08-31-2007, 09:12 PM
Here are some stats from a couple of SB winning QB's.

John Elway
| 1983 den | 11 | 123 259 47.5 1663 6.4 7 14 | 28 146 1 |
| 1984 den | 15 | 214 380 56.3 2598 6.8 18 15 | 56 237 1 |
| 1985 den | 16 | 327 605 54.0 3891 6.4 22 23 | 51 253 0 |
| 1986 den | 16 | 280 504 55.6 3485 6.9 19 13 | 52 257 1 |
| 1987 den | 12 | 224 410 54.6 3198 7.8 19 12 | 66 304 4 |
| 1988 den | 15 | 274 496 55.2 3309 6.7 17 19 | 54 234 1 |
| 1989 den | 15 | 223 416 53.6 3051 7.3 18 18 | 48 244 3 |
| 1990 den | 16 | 294 502 58.6 3526 7.0 15 14 | 50 258 3 |
| 1991 den | 16 | 242 451 53.7 3253 7.2 13 12 | 55 255 6 |
| 1992 den | 12 | 174 316 55.1 2242 7.1 10 17 | 34 94 2 |
| 1993 den | 16 | 348 551 63.2 4030 7.3 25 10 | 44 153 0 |
| 1994 den | 14 | 307 494 62.1 3490 7.1 16 10 | 58 235 4 |
| 1995 den | 16 | 316 542 58.3 3970 7.3 26 14 | 41 176 1 |
| 1996 den | 15 | 287 466 61.6 3328 7.1 26 14 | 50 249 4 |
| 1997 den | 16 | 280 502 55.8 3635 7.2 27 11 | 50 218 1 |
| 1998 den | 13 | 210 356 59.0 2806 7.9 22 10 | 37 94 1 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| TOTAL | 234 | 4123 7250 56.9 51475 7.1 300 226 | 774 3407 33 |

Terry Bradshaw
| Passing | Rushing |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| 1970 pit | 13 | 83 218 38.1 1410 6.5 6 24 | 32 233 1 |
| 1971 pit | 14 | 203 373 54.4 2259 6.1 13 22 | 53 247 5 |
| 1972 pit | 14 | 147 308 47.7 1887 6.1 12 12 | 58 346 7 |
| 1973 pit | 10 | 89 180 49.4 1183 6.6 10 15 | 34 145 3 |
| 1974 pit | 8 | 67 148 45.3 785 5.3 7 8 | 34 224 2 |
| 1975 pit | 14 | 165 286 57.7 2055 7.2 18 9 | 35 210 3 |
| 1976 pit | 10 | 92 192 47.9 1177 6.1 10 9 | 31 219 3 |
| 1977 pit | 14 | 162 314 51.6 2523 8.0 17 19 | 31 171 3 |
| 1978 pit | 16 | 207 368 56.2 2915 7.9 28 20 | 32 93 1 |
| 1979 pit | 16 | 259 472 54.9 3724 7.9 26 25 | 21 83 0 |
| 1980 pit | 15 | 218 424 51.4 3339 7.9 24 22 | 36 111 2 |
| 1981 pit | 14 | 201 370 54.3 2887 7.8 22 14 | 38 162 2 |
| 1982 pit | 9 | 127 240 52.9 1768 7.4 17 11 | 8 10 0 |
| 1983 pit | 1 | 5 8 62.5 77 9.6 2 0 | 1 3 0 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| TOTAL | 168 | 2025 3901 51.9 27989 7.2 212 210 | 444 2257 32 |

I bet these teams are glad they didn't give up on them after throwing some interceptions.

Douche Baggins
08-31-2007, 09:14 PM
By all means, go ahead and give up on Croyle at the first sign of failure, you knee-jerking bastards.

Direckshun
08-31-2007, 10:19 PM
I'm sorry, but Croyle looked bad every single down against St. Louis.

It's more than a reads thing, now it's a head thing, and that'll kill a QB faster than anything in this league.

Methinks Croyle's done.

FAX
08-31-2007, 10:23 PM
I'm sorry, but Croyle looked bad every single down against St. Louis.

It's more than a reads thing, now it's a head thing, and that'll kill a QB faster than anything in this league.

Methinks Croyle's done.

I respect your opinion a great deal, Mr. Direckshun. That's why I wish you would hold off on a final verdict. Brodie needs time on the field. Time to make mistakes, time to recover from them, and time to transfer knowledge of the playbook into instinctive reaction.

Honestly, if a couple of guys had made the catch they should have made in the Rams game, it would be a different story.

FAX

BigRedChief
08-31-2007, 10:27 PM
I don't know if Croyle is capable of leading us to the Super Bowl. But one thing I do know we will waste a whole year of rebuilding if he spends the entire season holding the clipboard.

He stinks it up and we go 4-12 of well go get a QOTF in the draft or FA. Do something other than achieve average again and again.

Direckshun
08-31-2007, 10:35 PM
I respect your opinion a great deal, Mr. Direckshun. That's why I wish you would hold off on a final verdict. Brodie needs time on the field. Time to make mistakes, time to recover from them, and time to transfer knowledge of the playbook into instinctive reaction.

Honestly, if a couple of guys had made the catch they should have made in the Rams game, it would be a different story.
I can respect that, but I can find absolutely no bright spot to Croyle's performance against St. Louis -- and hopefully, you can remember that I'm always a cautiously optimistic Chiefs fan.

Now, for my final verdict of Croyle from this preseason's play.

Even the completion to Parker was slow. He could have hit Bowe for another eight. He's lost confidence in his ability to thread the needle. He had two beautiful screen passes that he could have floated to the RB, but he fired them instead. He holds the ball. He makes poor reads. He can't intentionally mislead the secondary with his eyes. He doesn't pumpfake. His playfakes are downright poor. He consistently throws off his backfoot. And his personality, for all the touting that's been done on this board, seems to simply be too lax for there to be any kind of contagious competitive fire you'd like to see in a Team Leader.

I've lost a lot of faith in the kid this preseason. It's not unthinkable that he can recover, but I stay sane by remaining as realistic as I am optimistic, and at this point I can't help but see him as a serviceable 3rd stringer right now.

My apologies for the early verdict, but as a rabid fan, it's what I do.

stevieray
08-31-2007, 10:43 PM
I'm sorry, but Croyle looked bad every single down against St. Louis.

It's more than a reads thing, now it's a head thing, and that'll kill a QB faster than anything in this league.

Methinks Croyle's done.

Methinks you are FOS.

Direckshun
08-31-2007, 10:44 PM
Methinks you are FOS.
Methinks that's usually a fair assessment.

stevieray
08-31-2007, 10:46 PM
Methinks that's usually a fair assessment.

patience, grashoppa...patience.

Demonpenz
08-31-2007, 10:47 PM
If croyle can get his noggin on straight there is always room for qb's down the line. Trent, kurt warner, a list of other guys hung around and got their shot eventually and you couldn't get them out of the lineup

Tribal Warfare
08-31-2007, 10:54 PM
Honestly, if a couple of guys had made the catch they should have made in the Rams game, it would be a different story.




Most people on here don't know how to evaluate QBs.

InChiefsHell
08-31-2007, 10:59 PM
I think I'm going to have to stay away from the planet for awhile. The knee-jerk experts here are starting to piss me off...

...nah. I'll be back. I'm a glutton for punishment. Hey, I'm a Chiefs fan after all...

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:17 PM
But why let facts interfere with mediocre jokes?
Hey, that's Mr. FAX yer dissin'!

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:22 PM
As for me, I've been in a real slump lately. Depression. It's almost as if the Chiefs suck or something.

FAX
ROFL ROFL

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:29 PM
I still think Croyle will see the field as a starter for the Chiefs this year.

My prediction is week 5, at home after 3 rough games following the Texans.
I hope so. I hate to see him and his confidence get flushed out on the sideline for the whole season. Again I'd rather we tried everything to develop him than sit him on the bench all season and have to use a high draft pick on another college QB. Like I said we need to draft OL and CB high next year.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:35 PM
I like Brodie to be our QBOTF. He had Shviitte for blocking and receivers aka Samie Parker that drops balls. The kid has an electric arm, he can fire the ball down field, play action bootleg, he has all of the intangibles to be a steller QB, other than game time experience. Really think any other QB would have done much better with SViteck blocking (not blocking) Will Smith in the Saints game? Damon Huard? Yea right, I think Drew Bletsew is available too. Slow old QB that can not pass or has not shown the ability to throw past 20 yrds.

Alex Smith did not look good his first year but the 49rs did not give up on him and now they have a kick ass team.

Brodie will learn from his mistakes by playing games not on the sidelines holding a clip board. I'm going to take the Brodie Croyle to the Super Bowl Express train and it is a two or three year theme ride.

Huard = mediocre
Croyle = lightning in a bottle
John Elway looked like crap most, if not all, of his first year.

Kaylore
08-31-2007, 11:38 PM
I think this thread is interesting. It appears to me at least that there are two camps. The first is the group that is so desperate to see the team try and have their own QB that they developed that they want to believe in Crolye no matter how poorly he plays because it would mean they're at least trying and there's hope that he could be the one. The second is the group that actually understands that the kid has serious problems.

Let me preface this by saying that I think Croyle is a great guy and good person and I have nothing against him personally other than he's a Chief.

My view as a outsider is that Croyle isn't going to be anything more than a backup. If you take away the drops and bad line, he has no touch, questionable accuracy and poor decision making ability.

To those that say "other HOF QB's struggled when they first started" I remind you that the vast majority, including Elway, struggled in their first year in the system (not second) and that virtually all of them played pretty well in the preseason.

To those that say "OMG he needs more time" I remind you he's being outplayed by other rookies in the preseason who were drafted just this year and had less time in more complex offensive schemes.

To those that say "it's only preseason" I remind you that it only gets harder and faster in the regular season.

I think the apologists arguments that he has a poor line, average receivers, and a QB that probably doesn't know how to develop a QB are fair. That said, after a full year in the system and getting reps with the first team in camp he should be WAY ahead of where he is and he isn't. Consider also how simple the Herm offense is. Croyle's inability to execute such a simple offense in the preseason after a full year and two camps says all you need to know.

I also have never liked how up and down he is. He is someone that starts getting hot and then makes a bunch of throws he shouldn't and then after his first mistake goes into a hole. He doesn't have the cool mentality needed to play the position and keep an even keel.

Croyle isn't a pro prospect. And while you don't have anyone on the coaching staff who could develop him even if he was, you guys need to fold your tent on this guy. If he had "it" it would have manifested by now. Just take a step back and look at what other backups and rookies on other teams are doing and it will give you a wakeup call on this kid. Croyle isn't the answer.

Frankie
08-31-2007, 11:44 PM
Bottom Line:

Don't fret. We still have OMAR JACOBS.

FAX
08-31-2007, 11:45 PM
You may well be correct, Mr. Kaylore. The fact is, we may never know.

I wonder, though, if after Downfield is carted off the field with severe, massive ass bruising, you will change your mind about the tremendous negative effect a dismal offensive line can have on a quarterback's effectiveness and decision making ability.

FAX

Kaylore
08-31-2007, 11:51 PM
You may well be correct, Mr. Kaylore. The fact is, we may never know.

I wonder, though, if after Downfield is carted off the field with severe, massive ass bruising, you will change your mind about the tremendous negative effect a dismal offensive line can have on a quarterback's effectiveness and decision making ability.

FAX
I've watched your preseason games on NFL network. There is no question that he had some moments that were made worse by a poor line and dropped balls. However he could have help those drops with a touch pass (he still guns the ball) and showing some escape ability and pocket presence to buy time. Again, just look at what the other teams' backup QB's are doing under duress.

Douche Baggins
09-01-2007, 12:00 AM
I also have never liked how up and down he is. He is someone that starts getting hot and then makes a bunch of throws he shouldn't and then after his first mistake goes into a hole. He doesn't have the cool mentality needed to play the position and keep an even keel.

This is not accurate. Croyle has never been this way. Even in preseason this year, after an interception, he didn't go into a hole.

you guys need to fold your tent on this guy.

LMAO...yeah, after one preseason. Good idea.


If he had "it" it would have manifested by now.

You must have missed his drive against Miami.

44Page44
09-01-2007, 12:05 AM
They are over @ WPI.

He is the starter there.

Kaylore
09-01-2007, 12:06 AM
This is not accurate. Croyle has never been this way. Even in preseason this year, after an interception, he didn't go into a hole.
Yeah he didn't do anything after that pick.


LMAO...yeah, after one preseason. Good idea.
Hate to break it to you, but this is his second preseason. He's had a full year and two offseasons and there are later round rookies out-playing him that have offensive schemes that require several books.

You must have missed his drive against Miami.
Homer on, Bob. He should have looked like that all preseason last year. You know, the one where he couldn't even get on field?

FAX
09-01-2007, 12:07 AM
I've watched your preseason games on NFL network. There is no question that he had some moments that were made worse by a poor line and dropped balls. However he could have help those drops with a touch pass (he still guns the ball) and showing some escape ability and pocket presence to buy time. Again, just look at what the other teams' backup QB's are doing under duress.

You appear to me to be an extraordinarily wise and thoughtful individual, Mr. Kaylore. Let me try the Dick Curl Theory out on you.

1. Reads and Pump Fakes. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback has been bitched at incessantly to get the ball out quicker, he takes his first read because that's what the coaches are asking him to do.

2. Pocket Presence & Mobility. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback has been told to trust his line and never run under any circumstances, he flings the rock as he has been instructed.

3. Touch. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback is pressing to impress his coaches, he heaves the football with steam. The Dick Curl Theory also states that the quarterback has been told not to worry about it because, if Alabama receivers could handle the heat, pros should be able to.

4. Other Quarterbacks. The Dick Curl Theory states that Dick Curl isn't working with those guys.

What do you think?

FAX

milkman
09-01-2007, 12:11 AM
Homer on, Bob. He should have looked like that all preseason last year. You know, the one where he couldn't even get on field?

At the end of the day, I don't really care about this debate, because the Chiefs will never draft and develop a QB while Carl or any of his cronies are in charge.

That being said, Croyle didn't play last preseason due to injury.

Kaylore
09-01-2007, 12:13 AM
You appear to me to be an extraordinarily wise and thoughtful individual, Mr. Kaylore. Let me try the Dick Curl Theory out on you.

1. Reads and Pump Fakes. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback has been bitched at incessantly to get the ball out quicker, he takes his first read because that's what the coaches are asking him to do.

2. Pocket Presence & Mobility. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback has been told to trust his line and never run under any circumstances, he flings the rock as he has been instructed.

3. Touch. The Dick Curl Theory states that when a quarterback is pressing to impress his coaches, he heaves the football with steam. The Dick Curl Theory also states that the quarterback has been told not to worry about it because, if Alabama receivers could handle the heat, pros should be able to.

4. Other Quarterbacks. The Dick Curl Theory states that Dick Curl isn't working with those guys.

What do you think?

FAX
Apparently Dick Curl isn't allowed to talk to Damon Huard - that or he just ignores him. :)

FAX
09-01-2007, 12:16 AM
Well, it's just a theory, Mr. Kaylore.

Keep in mind, though, that Downfield's passer rating this pre-season was ranked 111th out of 117 after the third game. It could well be that Downfield is actually paying more attention in class.

FAX

Kaylore
09-01-2007, 12:17 AM
At the end of the day, I don't really care about this debate, because the Chiefs will never draft and develop a QB while Carl or any of his cronies are in charge.

That being said, Croyle didn't play last preseason due to injury.
That was my point. His frankenstein knees and injury history are yet another area of concern. I'm just trying to point out that there are better prospects out there and that Croyle isn't the only thing for the Chiefs to hope for.

milkman
09-01-2007, 12:20 AM
That was my point. His frankenstein knees and injury history are yet another area of concern. I'm just trying to point out that there are better prospects out there and that Croyle isn't the only thing for the Chiefs to hope for.

Torn ACLs are not the result being fragile.
They are the result of getting twisted in unnatural ways.

But it really doesn't matter.

There might be better prospects out there, but he's the only prospect on the Chiefs at this particular point in time.

Redcoats58
09-01-2007, 01:34 AM
You're confusing "Croyle Lovers" with long-time fans who saw a glimmer of hope at developing a QB in a team that's been too inept to do just that even though it's been such a problem for as long as we could remember.

It's not Croyle it's a glimmer of hope in a situation where there was none for so long.
This is the way I feel about it. Good post!

Douche Baggins
09-01-2007, 01:38 AM
Yeah he didn't do anything after that pick.


But he did not "go into a hole" as you suggested. He was still agressive with the ball.


Hate to break it to you, but this is his second preseason. He's had a full year and two offseasons and there are later round rookies out-playing him that have offensive schemes that require several books.

Croyle barely played at all last preseason. He was hurt and did not play much in camp, either.


Homer on, Bob. He should have looked like that all preseason last year. You know, the one where he couldn't even get on field?

Homer on yourself. You've been trying to beat up Croyle since we drafted him. That drive against Miami was a flash of what he can do.

The kid has something. He was very, very consistent for the most part in training camp. He has a hell of an arm, is pretty nimble and has a great attitude. It's way too early to give up on him.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-01-2007, 01:50 AM
Brodie has a huge arm and his wife has huge tits.


Give him another chance!!!!

htismaqe
09-01-2007, 06:59 AM
I'm sure Kaylore will be back to explain it all to us when Cutler stinks it up this year, right?

Nevermind, they have Mike Shanahan, we have Dick Curl.

Skip Towne
09-01-2007, 07:02 AM
Brodie has a huge arm and his wife has huge tits.


Give him another chance!!!!
The arm is real. Are the tits?

TEX
09-01-2007, 07:42 AM
I think this thread is interesting. It appears to me at least that there are two camps. The first is the group that is so desperate to see the team try and have their own QB that they developed that they want to believe in Crolye no matter how poorly he plays because it would mean they're at least trying and there's hope that he could be the one. The second is the group that actually understands that the kid has serious problems.

Let me preface this by saying that I think Croyle is a great guy and good person and I have nothing against him personally other than he's a Chief.

My view as a outsider is that Croyle isn't going to be anything more than a backup. If you take away the drops and bad line, he has no touch, questionable accuracy and poor decision making ability.

To those that say "other HOF QB's struggled when they first started" I remind you that the vast majority, including Elway, struggled in their first year in the system (not second) and that virtually all of them played pretty well in the preseason.

To those that say "OMG he needs more time" I remind you he's being outplayed by other rookies in the preseason who were drafted just this year and had less time in more complex offensive schemes.

To those that say "it's only preseason" I remind you that it only gets harder and faster in the regular season.

I think the apologists arguments that he has a poor line, average receivers, and a QB that probably doesn't know how to develop a QB are fair. That said, after a full year in the system and getting reps with the first team in camp he should be WAY ahead of where he is and he isn't. Consider also how simple the Herm offense is. Croyle's inability to execute such a simple offense in the preseason after a full year and two camps says all you need to know.

I also have never liked how up and down he is. He is someone that starts getting hot and then makes a bunch of throws he shouldn't and then after his first mistake goes into a hole. He doesn't have the cool mentality needed to play the position and keep an even keel.

Croyle isn't a pro prospect. And while you don't have anyone on the coaching staff who could develop him even if he was, you guys need to fold your tent on this guy. If he had "it" it would have manifested by now. Just take a step back and look at what other backups and rookies on other teams are doing and it will give you a wakeup call on this kid. Croyle isn't the answer.


:clap: :clap: :clap:
I'm in the second group but hoping that I'm wrong. Thus far, I've seen very little to suggest it other than all the blind homers here neg repping me all the time ROFL for trusting my own eyes...

TEX
09-01-2007, 07:49 AM
Actually, a lot of QB's without much experience are looking much better than Croyle. Quinn, Kolb, Beck and Edwards (all drafted this year and thus don't have the benefit of one year of practice/learning) are doing pretty good in preseason.

Yep. Quinn even missed 1/2 of camp and Croyle has never looked as good even when he played his best for that one drive against the Fins. Matter of fact, you could say that about all those you mentioned, especially Kolb. I agree, they all are looking much better than our boy.

I bet they also all have better coaching. :hmmm:

Kaylore
09-01-2007, 01:40 PM
I'm sure Kaylore will be back to explain it all to us when Cutler stinks it up this year, right?

Nevermind, they have Mike Shanahan, we have Dick Curl.
Pretty much. Cutler is definitely going to have some growing pains, but Shanahan is a good offensive mind and he is always good at giving his quarterbacks players to help him succeed. He puts guys in positions to make plays.

Yep. Quinn even missed 1/2 of camp and Croyle has never looked as good even when he played his best for that one drive against the Fins. Matter of fact, you could say that about all those you mentioned, especially Kolb. I agree, they all are looking much better than our boy.
That's the thing. They are just now learning and you can see their ability immediately right out of the package. Leinert, Cutler and Young did it last year playing with seocnd teamers and Kolb and Edwards are doing it this preseason. If there was something there it should have manifested by now. One drive in four games is hardly evidence "he's going to be the man."

KC Tattoo
09-01-2007, 02:28 PM
I'm in Brodies camp and am looking forward for him to play this season and see what he is made of. He had very little support from his teams play aka left tackle SVitek & aka drops alot Sammie. Croyle still showed signs of ability to get out of the pocket and make big plays. He is a raw QB that imo is going to be a good one with at least a full year of NFL.

If put in & our O-line protects him and he doesn't show improvement during the year then yes he is not the ancwer, & next year we are looking for a QBOTF with possiable top 5 pick. If Huard plays the whole year then we will be an 8-8 or 9-7 team just missing playoffs and hold on to a 15 or 16 pick still looking for a QBOTF.

But alas we wont draft another QBOTF because HUARD IS THE Super Bowl MVP :rolleyes:

KC Tattoo
09-01-2007, 03:12 PM
Brodie provides the ability to go deep, & playaction pass, & boot legs. Huard provides hand off to LJ & throw to the reciever that is closest to him within 15 yds. Yes Brodie is going to make mistakes but good gawd let the kid learn from them with some help from the O line please.
We can still draft & get a QBOTF next year to compete with Brodie and then we will have two young QBOTF and we would not have waisted this year on Brodie, let the best QBOTF win.

It's all for nothing if they don't provide protection on the O-line and get some depth there. We need to get younger and stronger on the O-line imo.

I don't want to see a 34 year old back up QB or another aged QB from another team ever again with the Chiefs. It has not worked for 20+ years, it is time to change our ways.

JuicesFlowing
09-01-2007, 03:35 PM
"Where is all ..." ??????????????