View Full Version : Teicher says it's Brodie time, Huard ruled out next week
Huard injured in Chiefs’ 17-7 loss to the Jaguars
By ADAM TEICHER
The Kansas City Star
The Chiefs can only hope it’s not an omen that the Brodie Croyle era officially began on an afternoon as gloomy as any in recent memory.
The skies were dominated by gray clouds that dumped rain in the final moments of a 17-7 loss to Jacksonville at Arrowhead Stadium, but the dark mood had a lot more to do with a feeble offense that did little right and imparted a helpless feeling on the locker room.
The Chiefs narrowly avoided their first home shutout since 1994 on Croyle’s 13-yard touchdown pass to Samie Parker on the game’s final play from scrimmage.
Croyle replaced Damon Huard at quarterback in the fourth quarter. Huard left the game because of what the Chiefs described as a right shoulder injury. They weren’t more specific with details but have ruled Huard out of next week’s game against Cincinnati at Arrowhead.
That means Croyle will start against the Bengals. Knowing coach Herm Edwards’ affinity for Croyle and his skills, the job is probably Croyle’s for the foreseeable future.
Quarterback changes are weird by nature. On some, the earth moves, and others catch people by surprise.
This one falls into the latter category. It caught by surprise some offensive players who weren’t aware of Huard’s injury.
A different voice in the huddle told them everything they needed to know.
“I wasn’t sure what happened with Damon,” Chiefs tackle Damion McIntosh said. “Brodie comes in and tells us the play and said, ‘Let’s get it done here,’ and that was it. There’s no heroic speech he came in there with. We weren’t expecting Joe Montana to walk in there.
“He came in and did what he had to do. We scored a touchdown.”
In the longer term, the Chiefs might need Croyle to do a Montana imitation. Their offense, the second half of last week’s game in San Diego notwithstanding, is that bad.
Croyle takes over at quarterback for a team coming off a historically lousy rushing performance. The Chiefs rushed for 10 yards, the second-lowest total in team history and fewest since they gained zero in a 1965 game against the Broncos.
Their passing game worked a little better but still couldn’t do enough to get them into scoring range more than twice. Dave Rayner missed a 31-yard field-goal attempt on the first possession, and that was it until Croyle guided the touchdown drive in the final moments.
By then, the Jaguars had backed off and were willing to yield the shorter gains as long as they didn’t give Croyle and the Chiefs a big play.
Still, the Chiefs scored a touchdown, and they’ll cling to that as an indication of momentum
“It’s better than a goose egg,” McIntosh said. “But whether it carries over or not, I don’t know. We sure didn’t get any carryover from last week’s game.”
Huard probably would have kept his job if not for the injury. The Chiefs didn’t appear ready to blame him for the offensive mess. But a change at quarterback probably can’t hurt.
Croyle has superior passing skills that make him a decidedly different option from Huard. In theory, those skills will give the Chiefs the chance to expand their offensive repertoire.
If there was ever a team in need of that, the Chiefs are it.
“It’s just a matter of doing it for four quarters instead of for 8 minutes,” Croyle said. “It’s still the same mind-set. You want to go out there and score. You don’t want to go out there and hope we get a field goal or hope you get some good field position. It’s a matter of going out there and wanting to score. If we do that, maybe we can build on it.”
But, as the Chiefs learned in the preseason when Croyle failed to win the job, the ride will be bumpy. He threw three interceptions then, all coming when he forced the ball into places it never should have gone.
He was a wild-eyed risk-taker, something a conservative coach like Edwards couldn’t live with. The Chiefs detected signs that Croyle has mellowed in his fourth-quarter playing time in last month’s game against Chicago and again against the Jaguars.
The Chiefs went three plays and out on Croyle’s first series Sunday, but he methodically worked his way down the field on his second. He fumbled the rain-slicked ball on one play but otherwise operated the Chiefs with a sense of urgency they have sadly lacked most of the season.
“We played that last drive like we wanted to score,” he said. “We were clocking the ball. We weren’t conceding the loss.”
http://www.kansascity.com/sports/chiefs/story/307770.html
Unless he plays REALLY bad, he's not coming out the rest of the year in my opinion.
Thig Lyfe
10-07-2007, 10:47 PM
We're going 12-4!
(Not 13-3 cuz it's cursed)
Unless he plays REALLY bad, he's not coming out the rest of the year in my opinion.
He CAN'T. If he gets in this week, he's in. Even if he plays terrible, it would be DISASTEROUS to pull him back out. I hope he's ready. I just want to win....now.
Halfcan
10-07-2007, 10:49 PM
Damon will start I tell you-he is the king of the world. God I love him!!!!- Hootie Man Crush
Unless he plays REALLY bad, he's not coming out the rest of the year in my opinion.
As it should be. Once we make the move, it's done.
Mr. Flopnuts
10-07-2007, 10:51 PM
If they're coming out on SUNDAY a full week before the game saying that Huard is "hurt" so he won't play next week, don't think for a second they won't pull Brodie and put Huard back in if we're 2-6. This is retarded if true.
“It’s just a matter of doing it for four quarters instead of for 8 minutes,” Croyle said. “It’s still the same mind-set. You want to go out there and score. You don’t want to go out there and hope we get a field goal or hope you get some good field position. It’s a matter of going out there and wanting to score.
Um...Brodie had better talk this over with idiot Herm first...
It's too bad it took Huard getting his head bashed in for us to finally get a chance to see Croyle. But I'm glad we finally get to see what we have.
With how bad we are I think that if he looks good it probably means he's really good.
It's too bad it took Huard getting his head bashed in for us to finally get a chance to see Croyle. But I'm glad we finally get to see what we have.
With how bad we are I think that if he looks good it probably means he's really good.
You're right there. But man, if we look worse...impossible - nevermind. :rolleyes:
blueballs
10-07-2007, 11:06 PM
10/07/07 1st NFL TD
congrats man
blueballs
10-07-2007, 11:06 PM
PBJ TD SAMMIE PBJ
mrub4
10-07-2007, 11:07 PM
I still think Huard took a dive
SPchief
10-07-2007, 11:11 PM
Huard is "hurt" and will remain "hurt" for the rest of the season.
GarySpFc
10-07-2007, 11:31 PM
I still think Huard took a dive
It was apparent he didn't want to play.
blueballs
10-07-2007, 11:34 PM
He wanted to just lay there
and spoon with Hootie
KCJohnny
10-07-2007, 11:53 PM
You people are delusional.
Brodie Croyle does nothing to address the pathetic run blocking probelm. Same problem, new QB.
Not that I don't wish him ultimate success. But this OL is a mess, and the same defenses that injured Huard will be coming after Brodie. I don't even know the name of the Chiefs' #3 QB. Do you?
You people are delusional.
Brodie Croyle does nothing to address the pathetic run blocking probelm. Same problem, new QB.
Not that I don't wish him ultimate success. But this OL is a mess, and the same defenses that injured Huard will be coming after Brodie. I don't even know the name of the Chiefs' #3 QB. Do you?
Unless the other d-lines come with Kryptonite Brodie ain't going anywhere.
Discuss Thrower
10-08-2007, 12:21 AM
We're going 12-4!
(Not 13-3 cuz it's cursed)
11-5. One to the Pack most likely, and one more to an AFC team. Just hopefully not Cinci / AFC West team.
Thig Lyfe
10-08-2007, 12:22 AM
You people are delusional.
Brodie Croyle does nothing to address the pathetic run blocking probelm. Same problem, new QB.
Not that I don't wish him ultimate success. But this OL is a mess, and the same defenses that injured Huard will be coming after Brodie. I don't even know the name of the Chiefs' #3 QB. Do you?
Tyler Thigpen.
I'M A REAL FAN!
RealSNR
10-08-2007, 12:50 AM
You people are delusional.
Brodie Croyle does nothing to address the pathetic run blocking probelm. Same problem, new QB.
Not that I don't wish him ultimate success. But this OL is a mess, and the same defenses that injured Huard will be coming after Brodie. I don't even know the name of the Chiefs' #3 QB. Do you?Sure, but if we're going to get shutout at home, I'd rather get shutout at home while the future of this team is building timing and precision with a fantastic rookie WR, an all-pro TE, and Bobby Sippio :evil:
That last mention aside, seriously, Brodie needs to have the rest of this season to himself. He's not going to learn the important aspects of QB playing that he learns during a game when Dick Curl is sharting on the sideline in River Falls. He's a smart QB, and this experience is going to go a long way for next year when (hopefully) we're a better football team and will be in contention for postseason success.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:06 AM
Sure, but if we're going to get shutout at home, I'd rather get shutout at home while the future of this team is building timing and precision with a fantastic rookie WR, an all-pro TE, and Bobby Sippio :evil:
That last mention aside, seriously, Brodie needs to have the rest of this season to himself. He's not going to learn the important aspects of QB playing that he learns during a game when Dick Curl is sharting on the sideline in River Falls. He's a smart QB, and this experience is going to go a long way for next year when (hopefully) we're a better football team and will be in contention for postseason success.
Well, one thing's for sure: Brodie didn't come in and wilt like a feather under pressure. He drove the team down field and when Herm made the right move and went for it on 4th down, Brodie delivered.
I don't know if he's the second coming of Joe Montana or the second coming of Jim Druckenmiller, but at least he didn't wilt.
This team *most likely* isn't going anywhere without improved offensive line play and with this group, that isn't likely this year.
Hopefully, Brodie won't get hurt in the process of finding out if "he's the guy".
Only time will tell.
PS - Why is it that the line sucks now but when Solari was the O-Line coach, it really never sucked? Regardless of "talent"?
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 01:13 AM
PS - Why is it that the line sucks now but when Solari was the O-Line coach, it really never sucked? Regardless of "talent"?
Having Roaf and Shields helped a great deal methinks.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:17 AM
Having Roaf and Shields helped a great deal methinks.
Thanks, moron.
How did the Chiefs do in the 6 seasons under Solari prior to Roaf's arrival?
Oh, and PS: Roaf sucked in New Orleans. Do you REALLY THINK they'd let a HOF left tackle go with four great seasons ahead of him. For next to NOTHING?
Thanks for playing.
RedThat
10-08-2007, 01:17 AM
Well, one thing's for sure: Brodie didn't come in and wilt like a feather under pressure. He drove the team down field and when Herm made the right move and went for it on 4th down, Brodie delivered.
I don't know if he's the second coming of Joe Montana or the second coming of Jim Druckenmiller, but at least he didn't wilt.
This team *most likely* isn't going anywhere without improved offensive line play and with this group, that isn't likely this year.
Hopefully, Brodie won't get hurt in the process of finding out if "he's the guy".
Only time will tell.
PS - Why is it that the line sucks now but when Solari was the O-Line coach, it really never sucked? Regardless of "talent"?
Whitlock made an excellent point in his article, "bad game planning"...That's all it boils down to. You can see it, the game offensive game planning is atrocious. I think that all has ties to poor line play, bad chemistry in general.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:19 AM
Whitlock made an excellent point in his article, "bad game planning"...That's all it boils down to. You can see it, the game offensive game planning is atrocious. I think that all has ties to poor line play, bad chemistry in general.
Wrong.
The game planning is fine.
The execution is what's wrong.
The Chiefs are putting faith in players who can't execute because they're on the wrong side of 30.
It's gonna be a long year...
SPchief
10-08-2007, 01:31 AM
Wrong.
The game planning is fine.
The execution is what's wrong.
The Chiefs are putting faith in players who can't execute because they're on the wrong side of 30.
It's gonna be a long year...
:spock:
keg in kc
10-08-2007, 01:36 AM
Too bad his "injury" in the preseason didn't keep him out of the real games just like his "injury" today put him on the bench. It was like watching a version of the infamous Grbac post-interception dive, straight into the fetal position.
Well, 6 weeks too late is better than never, I guess.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:37 AM
:spock:
Nice rebuttal. :shake:
RedThat
10-08-2007, 01:42 AM
Wrong.
The game planning is fine.
The execution is what's wrong.
The Chiefs are putting faith in players who can't execute because they're on the wrong side of 30.
It's gonna be a long year...
Don't give me this. Honestly, do you really think that's the case?
Come on man...You can see in a lot of games that there is no plan in this offense we run. It's just simple strategy, same plays over and over. And not only plan, but the coaching staff does a poor job getting the players prepared. One would think this problems would be fixed by now, yet we keep making the same mistakes over and over, ala illegal shifts(once a game) but it's clear the Head coach lacks an offensive imagination. Offense has always been Herms weakness, it always is...Ever since he has been a head coach, his offenses are piss poor.
We run this pee-wee offense right now, and it's not clicking nor boding well with some of the players, Johnson in particular.
SPchief
10-08-2007, 01:43 AM
Nice rebuttal. :shake:
Are you really defending Solari's play calls?
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:43 AM
Don't give me this. Honestly, do you really think that's the case?
Come on man...You can see in a lot of games that there is no plan in this offense we run. It's just simple strategy, same plays over and over. And not only plan, but the coaching staff does a poor job getting the players prepared. One would think this problems would be fixed by now, yet we keep making the same mistakes over and over, ala illegal shifts(once a game) but it's clear the Head coach lacks an offensive imagination. Offense has always been Herms weakness, it always is...Ever since he has been a head coach, his offenses are piss poor.
We run this pee-wee offense right now, and it's not clicking nor boding well with some of the players, Johnson in particular.
So, you think the execution is fine? The players are fine? Over 30 means nothing?
Sorry, I disagree.
BIG TIME.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:46 AM
Are you really defending Solari's play calls?
IF the play calls were actually EXECUTED according to plan, I think they'd be fine.
It's very, very difficult for 5 guys over the age of 30 to execute the plays properly, week after week.
Isn't that clear?
The offensive line is in need of a major overhaul and anyone who can't see that is fooling themselves.
SPchief
10-08-2007, 01:48 AM
IF the play calls were actually EXECUTED according to plan, I think they'd be fine.
It's very, very difficult for 5 guys over the age of 30 to execute the plays properly, week after week.
Isn't that clear?
The offensive line is in need of a major overhaul and anyone who can't see that is fooling themselves.
3/5ths of the line is under 30
SPchief
10-08-2007, 01:50 AM
Keep spinning mec...er Dane
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:52 AM
3/4ths of the line is under 30
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
McIntosh: 3/77 = 30
Brian Waters: 2/77 = 30
Weigmann: 7/73 = 34
Welbourne: 3/76 = 31
Turley: 9/75 = 32
Seriously, Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
Do you even f*cking FOLLOW the Chiefs?
:shake: :shake:
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 01:53 AM
Thanks, moron.
Someone has anger issues. Must be from sucking all that smog in LA, along with a lot of dicks. I think we can call off the insult fest now, mmmmkay?
How did the Chiefs do in the 6 seasons under Solari prior to Roaf's arrival?
Solari didn't arrive until 1997. We traded for roaf in '02. Do the math.
Oh, and PS: Roaf sucked in New Orleans. Do you REALLY THINK they'd let a HOF left tackle go with four great seasons ahead of him. For next to NOTHING?
Thanks for playing.
BTW, Roaf didn't suck in Nawlins. He was a Pro Bowler 11 times since 1994. That means he was a Pro Bowler long before he got to us in '02. Thanks for playing.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:53 AM
Keep spinning mec...er Dane
You're a moron. And you're proving it time and time again.
Thanks for playing.
Keep spinning the wheel!
:rolleyes:
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:55 AM
Someone has anger issues. Must be from sucking all that smog in LA, along with a lot of dicks. I think we can call off the insult fest now, mmmmkay?
Solari didn't arrive until 1997. We traded for roaf in '02. Do the math.
BTW, Roaf didn't suck in Nawlins. He was a Pro Bowler 11 times since 1994. That means he was a Pro Bowler long before he got to us in '02. Thanks for playing.
Count em, Douche.
1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002. What does that equal? SIX!!!
And by the way, little brain, you might have more credibility if you actually had an AMERICAN football player in your avatar.
Thanks for playing.
Oh and PS: Roaf was traded because he SUCKED and was injured.
RedThat
10-08-2007, 01:57 AM
So, you think the execution is fine? The players are fine? Over 30 means nothing?
Sorry, I disagree.
BIG TIME.
Too be honest with you, at the start of the season, I thought the execution was atrocious. I think it has improved slighty as the season went on...I am not crazy about it, I think it is half assed.
I think if you want to pinpoint on execution, mainly I would say, we are poor at executing our blocks in the running game. That is one of the biggest problems with this team right now. And it continues to be week to week. This coaching staff is driving me nuts because it doesn't seem like their placing much focus on it nor trying to improve the runblocking.
Gonzalez is making his catches, Bowe is making his catches. LJ isn't running as hard mainly because of his attitude and run blocking is bad.
If your going to say execution, pinpoint at the line, then you can also say some of huards throws are off-target as well.
*But this is a reflect of coaching. Imo, this can have ties to coaching. I believe that. it's the coaching staff responsibility to emphasize and focus on whats not working, correct it, so that the next week your better at it. It's all about preparation...Something our coaching staff is porous at.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 01:58 AM
Someone has anger issues. Must be from sucking all that smog in LA, along with a lot of dicks. I think we can call off the insult fest now, mmmmkay?
The finest argument a moron can put forth is the "oh, well then, YOU'RE GAY" argument.
Nice job.
Moron.
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 02:00 AM
And by the way, little brain, you might have more credibility if you actually had an AMERICAN football player in your avatar.
Thanks for playing.
Oh and PS: Roaf was traded because he SUCKED and was injured.
Who gives a rats ass about an avatar? YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT ROAF ASSHAT. He didn't suck in Nawlins dumbass. He was injured, that was it. Nawlins let him go because they felt a younger player would serve them better. If you knew anything about football you would understand that. Thanks for playing.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 02:00 AM
Too be honest with you, at the start of the season, I thought the execution was atrocious. I think it has improved slighty as the season went on...I am not crazy about it, I think it is half assed.
I think if you want to pinpoint on execution, mainly I would say, we are poor at executing our blocks in the running game. That is one of the biggest problems with this team right now. And it continues to be week to week. This coaching staff is driving me nuts because it doesn't seem like their placing much focus on it nor trying to improve the runblocking.
Gonzalez is making his catches, Bowe is making his catches. LJ isn't running as hard mainly because of his attitude and run blocking is bad.
If your going to say execution, pinpoint at the line, then you can also say some of huards throws are off-target as well.
*But this is a reflect of coaching. Imo, this can have ties to coaching. I believe that. it's the coaching staff responsibility to emphasize and focus on whats not working, correct it, so that the next week your better at it. It's all about preparation...Something our coaching staff is porous at.
The execution is poor because the lineman are old and worn out. There's really no need to make any excuses for them.
10 yards net rushing is all that needs to be said.
The center is 34 and was never suited for this scheme. The other lineman are over 30 and with the exception of Waters, have been shuffled around the league.
Time caught up with the O-line this year. Bottom line.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 02:02 AM
Who gives a rats ass about an avatar? YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT ROAF ASSHAT. He didn't suck in Nawlins dumbass. He was injured, that was it. Nawlins let him go because they felt a younger player would serve them better. If you knew anything about football you would understand that. Thanks for playing.
You're such an easy target due to your small, uncreative mind.
New Orleans had an injured left tackle that had seen his best playing days in the rear view mirror. They shipped him to the Chiefs for a 3rd round draft choice.
Remember 2002? The Chiefs were 8-8. Roaf wasn't even close to full strength. Not even close. He came back in 2003 and was amazing. But that ended after the 2003 season, as the Chiefs went 7-9 in 2004 and in 2005, he was injured much of the year.
How about a few facts to go along with all that bullsh*t?
keg in kc
10-08-2007, 02:05 AM
Offensive linemen regularly play at a high level into their mid-30s. The problem isn't age. The problem is that Wiegmann's a pulling center being asked to drive block at 270 pounds, and Welbourn, Terry and Turley just aren't very good. Which shouldn't be a surprise since Turley and Welbourn were both semi-retired and Terry's a headcase.
We're trying to make chicken soup out of chicken shit, and it's not working, at least not in the run game. Pass protection has been adequate, however.
I think it's a combination of things, from an over-the-hill quarterback who should never have seen the field to a coaching staff that can't seem to decide what they want to be from series to series to a line that can pass protect but can't open running lanes to a running back that's either hurt or pouting or both.
I think a lot of it is playcalling, but I think the playcalling itself a result of the kind of personnel we have. Good players make coaches look good, and I'm not sure how much confidence the staff has in the guys they're putting on the field, particularly Huard. Although maybe that's his own fault, and the coaches aren't telling him not to look downfield or to feature Kris Wilson in the first half of every game.
It's hard to watch, whatever it is.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 02:09 AM
Offensive linemen regularly play at a high level into their mid-30s. The problem isn't age. The problem is that Wiegmann's a pulling center being asked to drive block at 270 pounds, and Welbourn, Terry and Turley just aren't very good. Which shouldn't be a surprise since Turley and Welbourn were both semi-retired and Terry's a headcase.
We're trying to make chicken soup out of chicken shit, and it's not working, at least not in the run game. Pass protection has been adequate, however.
I think it's a combination of things, from an over-the-hill quarterback who should never have seen the field to a coaching staff that can't seem to decide what they want to be from series to series to a line that can pass protect but can't open running lanes to a running back that's either hurt or pouting or both.
I think a lot of it is playcalling, but I think the playcalling itself a result of the kind of personnel we have. Good players make coaches look good, and I'm not sure how much confidence the staff has in the guys they're putting on the field, particularly Huard. Although maybe that's his own fault, and the coaches aren't telling him not to look downfield.
I agree with the sentiment but I don't agree that another coach could come in and "magically" take an offensive line that consists of a bunch of washed up over-the-hill +30 year-olds and make them perform the impossible.
For the second straight year, the Chiefs have screwed the pooch in regards to the O-line. Last year, it was the sudden retirement of Willie Roaf.
This year, well, it's everyone.
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 02:09 AM
New Orleans had an injured left tackle that had seen his best playing days in the rear view mirror. They shipped him to the Chiefs for a 3rd round draft choice.
Remember 2002? The Chiefs were 8-8. Roaf wasn't even close to full strength. Not even close. He came back in 2003 and was amazing. But that ended after the 2003 season, as the Chiefs went 7-9 in 2004 and in 2005, he was injured much of the year.
How about a few facts to go along with all that bullsh*t?
Fact is, Roaf went to 11 Pro Bowls, most of them with New Orleans. You said he sucked in New Orleans and you were wrong. Just admit it and move on. It's OK. We know you know jack shit about football but we are willing to teach you.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 02:10 AM
Fact is, Roaf went to 11 Pro Bowls, most of them with New Orleans. You said he sucked in New Orleans and you were wrong. Just admit it and move on. It's OK. We know you know jack shit about football but we are willing to teach you.
You're as stupid as you are uneducated.
Nice combo. Hope that's working for ya!
10-4!
Asswipe. :shake:
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 02:11 AM
Oh, BTW, Roaf came in March of 02. Count with me....1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001. That makes 5 years, not six dipshit.
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 02:13 AM
You're as stupid as you are uneducated.
Nice combo. Hope that's working for ya!
10-4!
Asswipe. :shake:
Nice rebuttal there smokey. Let me paraphrase your comments in a more fitting form:
"I was wrong about everything I posted so I am going to insult someone as a lame assed attempt to deflect from that fact". LMAO
Redcoats58
10-08-2007, 02:13 AM
What were our offensive rankings during the Roaf years?
beach tribe
10-08-2007, 02:26 AM
Thanks, moron.
How did the Chiefs do in the 6 seasons under Solari prior to Roaf's arrival?
Oh, and PS: Roaf sucked in New Orleans. Do you REALLY THINK they'd let a HOF left tackle go with four great seasons ahead of him. For next to NOTHING?
Thanks for playing.
Are you serious? Surely not.
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 02:29 AM
Are you serious? Surely not.
Trust me, he is. LMAO
And it's hilarious.
Thanks, moron.
How did the Chiefs do in the 6 seasons under Solari prior to Roaf's arrival?
Oh, and PS: Roaf sucked in New Orleans. Do you REALLY THINK they'd let a HOF left tackle go with four great seasons ahead of him. For next to NOTHING?
Thanks for playing.
Whoah. Chop us out a line of whatever you're on, champ. Roaf is in the 90s all Decade team, and went to 11 pro bowls.
I guess thats all down to solari?
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 03:32 AM
Whoah. Chop us out a line of whatever you're on, champ. Roaf is in the 90s all Decade team, and went to 11 pro bowls.
I guess thats all down to solari?
Careful m8. If you bring fact or logic into this you may end up getting insulted or told you don't know what you are talking about because you have a rugger in your avatar. LMAO
Solari came in 1997 (I believe from San Fran if I am not mistaken). We already had a good line in 1997 and it had nothing to do with Solari. Nobody can argue that he wasn't a decent Offensive Line coach but the line didn't just turn to shit because he moved upstairs. Losing Roaf and Shields without comparable replacements is what did it IMO.
Personally, I think he needs to move back downstairs and do what he does best - coach Offensive Line play because he is positively dreadful as an Offensive Coordinator.
cookster50
10-08-2007, 05:50 AM
Croyle looked like crap on that drive. We are well on our way to a top 5 draft pick now!!
HypnotizedMonkey
10-08-2007, 06:03 AM
Croyle is in for good... Playoffs here we come!! NOT.
LJ has a monkey on his back... like ROSS from FRIENDS.
We're gonna start playing some crappier Defenses.. offensive production will increase.. but don't overreact, we still suck.
Easy 6
10-08-2007, 06:47 AM
Dane, how in the world did you ever come to the conclusion that Roaf sucked in N.O.???
They let him go because they doubted his ability to come back from a significant injury.
Thats the very first time i've EVER heard that one.
Careful m8. If you bring fact or logic into this you may end up getting insulted or told you don't know what you are talking about because you have a rugger in your avatar. LMAO
Solari came in 1997 (I believe from San Fran if I am not mistaken). We already had a good line in 1997 and it had nothing to do with Solari. Nobody can argue that he wasn't a decent Offensive Line coach but the line didn't just turn to shit because he moved upstairs. Losing Roaf and Shields without comparable replacements is what did it IMO.
Personally, I think he needs to move back downstairs and do what he does best - coach Offensive Line play because he is positively dreadful as an Offensive Coordinator.
He's dreadful mainly because of the following:
1. He was hired as OC to keep running the DV system. We have lost players and they have been replaced with one's that do not have the same skill set to run that system.
2. Herm's influence in runing "his" type of offense with too many left over from the DV era.
Solari is in a bad spot. He will get thrown under the bus at season's end. And then the OC carousel will begin which is always the case with a Herm Edwards coached team.
boogblaster
10-08-2007, 07:28 AM
The Oline is shit .. that said, they still are a pros.. they need to figure out what is wrong, fix it the best they can and play together..also the Jags had a very good defense..but it's Croyle-time..he's our future..get him started then ...
FringeNC
10-08-2007, 07:38 AM
I love all this talk about it being only the offensive line that is the problem. How many times was Donovan McNabb sacked last week? A lot -- yet they look no where near as bad as us.
So, yeah, the running game sucks. What would a good coach do if he couldn't run the ball? Throw every ****ing down. Even when we had Willie Roaf, we had games where we couldn't run at all. I remember the Denver game here (2005, I think) where in the first half we were getting stuffed EVERY running play. What did we do? We passed every down, virtually. Green had 30+ attempts in the first half. We should be doing that now -- the pass-blocking has been adequate. Then after we start getting some goddamn first downs, and running some plays, and tiring out the defense, we'll see how many holes open up for Johnson in the 4th quarter.
Herm is an idiot, and Huard is a terrible quarterback. Those two factors contribute for more to our ineptitude on offense than a bad offensive line. It's not great (the line), but it's not at an NFL historic bad level, which our offensive currently is -- that's on Herm and Huard.
Pushead2
10-08-2007, 07:58 AM
The whole O looks like shit. End of story and we're going to keep arguing as Chiefs' fans about so we're better off just accepting and dropping it.
RedThat
10-08-2007, 08:11 AM
The execution is poor because the lineman are old and worn out. There's really no need to make any excuses for them.
10 yards net rushing is all that needs to be said.
The center is 34 and was never suited for this scheme. The other lineman are over 30 and with the exception of Waters, have been shuffled around the league.
Time caught up with the O-line this year. Bottom line.
The Bottomline is, we suck on offense because of overall "bad offensive team chemistry". Yes I blame coaching for that. That's part of their job to make things click and go in sync.
It's as simple as that. That is coaching, bad game planning and preparation, and execution all those things. The Chiefs just suck completely as a unit. It's a whole mess.
Sully
10-08-2007, 08:46 AM
Roaf made the all 1990s team before he came to KC. To say he sucked is ignorant.
There were personality issues, there was a percieved age issue, and the fact that he wanted out that all had far more to do with the trade than performance.
chiefscafan
10-08-2007, 11:42 AM
Ok guys see the croyle start as just this:
Huard doesn't strike fear in a d with his arm croyle on the other hand does. This will help us stop ds from stacking the line against us. I don't know if he is the answer but what can it hurt. Plain simple truth is this if he sucks we get another qb if he is awesome we have our next qb.
sounds like a good deal to me.
CHIEF4EVER
10-08-2007, 11:52 AM
We used to positively KILL people with the stretch play. Why Herm refuses to run it is beyond me. Our O linemen DO have the skill set to block that type of running play.
Chiefnj2
10-08-2007, 11:58 AM
Ok guys see the croyle start as just this:
Huard doesn't strike fear in a d with his arm croyle on the other hand does.
Croyle does no such thing. The only thing Croyle has done is lose the starting QB job to Huard. He may develop into a decent QB, but he certainly doesn't strike fear into any defense at this point.
kaplin42
10-08-2007, 11:59 AM
"Huard probably would have kept his job if not for the injury. The Chiefs didn’t appear ready to blame him for the offensive mess. But a change at quarterback probably can’t hurt."
So even though Huard stunk it up the past 4 weeks, they would still stick with him. Herm you have been promoted the head scout, we will find some one thats grasps the concept of coaching.
Baby Lee
10-08-2007, 12:05 PM
My God Dane, Roaf, Pace and Ogden are the 3 pre-eminent LTs in the past 15 years. Each the foundation for WHATEVER offensive success their teams experienced.
True Roaf was injured when he left NO, but there was also the matter of a teammate porking his wife and him wanting out of NO whatver the cost.
Baby Lee
10-08-2007, 12:06 PM
"Huard probably would have kept his job if not for the injury. The Chiefs didn’t appear ready to blame him for the offensive mess. But a change at quarterback probably can’t hurt."
So even though Huard stunk it up the past 4 weeks, they would still stick with him. Herm you have been promoted the head scout, we will find some one thats grasps the concept of coaching.
You know the depressing thought filling my head as I left the bar yesterday?
"As much as I'm down on Huard, RIGHT NOW, he's a better QB than LJ is a RB."
Skip Towne
10-08-2007, 12:10 PM
Fact is, Roaf went to 11 Pro Bowls, most of them with New Orleans. You said he sucked in New Orleans and you were wrong. Just admit it and move on. It's OK. We know you know jack shit about football but we are willing to teach you.
You're right and Dane is wrong. Willie went to 7 Pro Bowls with NO.
FringeNC
10-08-2007, 12:16 PM
My God Dane, Roaf, Pace and Ogden are the 3 pre-eminent LTs in the past 15 years. Each the foundation for WHATEVER offensive success their teams experienced.
True Roaf was injured when he left NO, but there was also the matter of a teammate porking his wife and him wanting out of NO whatver the cost.
Except for the fact that we still got him on the cheap -- no other team trumped our rather insulting offer. Other than Vermeil and Saunders, the rest of the league thought Roaf was done.
HypnotizedMonkey
10-08-2007, 01:02 PM
Ok guys see the croyle start as just this:
Huard doesn't strike fear in a d with his arm croyle on the other hand does. This will help us stop ds from stacking the line against us. I don't know if he is the answer but what can it hurt. Plain simple truth is this if he sucks we get another qb if he is awesome we have our next qb.
sounds like a good deal to me.
Croyle only scares Chiefs fans right now.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 02:19 PM
My God Dane, Roaf, Pace and Ogden are the 3 pre-eminent LTs in the past 15 years. Each the foundation for WHATEVER offensive success their teams experienced.
True Roaf was injured when he left NO, but there was also the matter of a teammate porking his wife and him wanting out of NO whatver the cost.
You're right. "Sucked" was wrong term.
N.O. considered Roaf finished and wanted him gone, so they traded him to the Chiefs for a conditional draft choice. Personally, I would have rather re-signed John Tait and used that draft choice on another player. Possibly a starting right tackle. But that point is moot.
Seven-time Pro Bowl offensive lineman Willie Roaf says he has irreconcilable differences with New Orleans coach Jim Haslett and would rather retire than play for the Saints. "Release me or I'll retire".
Regardless of my thoughts and posts on the Roaf trade and subsequent performance, Solari did NOT have a job because of Shields and Roaf.
Dartgod
10-08-2007, 03:00 PM
Well, one thing's for sure: Brodie didn't come in and wilt like a feather under pressure. He drove the team down field and when Herm made the right move and went for it on 4th down, Brodie delivered.
You do realize that Brodie threw it to Kolby well short of the first down marker? It was K. Smith that delivered, not Brodie on that play.
My God Dane, Roaf, Pace and Ogden are the 3 pre-eminent LTs in the past 15 years. Each the foundation for WHATEVER offensive success their teams experienced.
True Roaf was injured when he left NO, but there was also the matter of a teammate porking his wife and him wanting out of NO whatver the cost.
Add Walter Jones to that list.
Ebolapox
10-08-2007, 03:28 PM
Thanks, moron.
How did the Chiefs do in the 6 seasons under Solari prior to Roaf's arrival?
Oh, and PS: Roaf sucked in New Orleans. Do you REALLY THINK they'd let a HOF left tackle go with four great seasons ahead of him. For next to NOTHING?
Thanks for playing.
wrong. roaf ROCKED in new orleans, but joe horn f*cked roaf's wife. as the situation in the locker room was unbearable for roaf, he requested (demanded) a trade and got his wish.
I love know-it-alls.
Baby Lee
10-08-2007, 03:31 PM
YRegardless of my thoughts and posts on the Roaf trade and subsequent performance, Solari did NOT have a job because of Shields and Roaf.
But the Chiefs O DID have it's success because of Shields, Roaf and Waters. They, with big help from Richardson, gave the pass protection and run blocking to open everything up.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 03:43 PM
But the Chiefs O DID have it's success because of Shields, Roaf and Waters. They, with big help from Richardson, gave the pass protection and run blocking to open everything up.
No doubt. But I think that while Solari was successful as the O-line coach before Roaf's arrival, the scheme brought in by Vermeil and Saunders is the main reason for the offensive successes of that era.
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 03:45 PM
I love know-it-alls.
Love is a strong word. :p
DaneMcCloud
10-08-2007, 03:49 PM
You do realize that Brodie threw it to Kolby well short of the first down marker? It was K. Smith that delivered, not Brodie on that play.
Wow. Some of you people are incredibly nit-picky.
Did you miss my point completely?
Brodie didn't falter. Brodie didn't whither. Brodie didn't collapse under pressure. Brodie drove the Chiefs down field for a touchdown.
Not bad for such a dire situation, not to mention an empty stadium. While it might be rendered meaningless after next week's game, it's a better outcome than if he were to perform as he did in Pittsburgh last year.
Logical
10-08-2007, 04:05 PM
IF the play calls were actually EXECUTED according to plan, I think they'd be fine.
It's very, very difficult for 5 guys over the age of 30 to execute the plays properly, week after week.
Isn't that clear?
The offensive line is in need of a major overhaul and anyone who can't see that is fooling themselves.
Dane you and I usually agree but not this time, veterans should make it easier to execute your game plan, not more difficult. Lack of talent and bad playcalling clearly are our problem.
Logical
10-08-2007, 04:11 PM
The execution is poor because the lineman are old and worn out. There's really no need to make any excuses for them.
10 yards net rushing is all that needs to be said.
The center is 34 and was never suited for this scheme. The other lineman are over 30 and with the exception of Waters, have been shuffled around the league.
Time caught up with the O-line this year. Bottom line.
Now this makes more sense to me and I agree.
There are three things I really don't like about Damon Huard. The first thing is mobility. If there is any kind of pash rush (like there normally is with KC's O Line), he gets trounced. Huard is about as unathletic as it gets.Secondly, his arm strength is just not there. He has a decent enough arm to get the job done, but he throws a struggling deep ball.Third, he almost ALWAYS takes the dump down. Especially when even a hint of a blitz is coming. It's really tough to stretch the field with Huard in as Quarterback.Croyle may throw more INT's but at least he'll get the ball down the field a bit. And as everyone knows, he has a live arm. Also, Croyle has some escape ability. He's not Mike Vick, but he can get out of the pocket. The rollout and strike to Dwayne Bowe was a throw that I'm not sure Huard could have made.
BigMeatballDave
10-08-2007, 04:32 PM
According to NFL Network, They did not say that Huard was OUT, but said that Croyle would start if Huard could not go.
According to NFL Network, They did not say that Huard was OUT, but said that Croyle would start if Huard could not go.
Yeah, so far Teicher is the only that has reported that Huard was out. Huard was set to have an MRI done today (along with Kennison), so I guess we'll see sometime tomorrow.
Also, Croyle has some escape ability. He's not Mike Vick, but he can get out of the pocket. The rollout and strike to Dwayne Bowe was a throw that I'm not sure Huard could have made.
I agree with you, Croyle is definitely more athletic than Huard. But Huard made a very similar throw to Kris Wilson to start the game off. Playaction rollout, complete downfield to Wilson.
Archie Bunker
10-08-2007, 04:46 PM
According to NFL Network, They did not say that Huard was OUT, but said that Croyle would start if Huard could not go.
:deevee:
Chiefs Pantalones
10-08-2007, 04:56 PM
So the early reports are that Huard is not yet declared out?
We need to start Brodie, Huard hurt or not. We need to find out what he has. You don't retool with a 34 year old QB.
Easy 6
10-08-2007, 07:34 PM
Croyle has some escape ability. He's not Mike Vick, but he can get out of the pocket. The rollout and strike to Dwayne Bowe was a throw that I'm not sure Huard could have made.
For sure, theres no chance in FROZEN HELL that Huard makes that play.
Brodie snapped an accurate ball off his hand on the run.
All that guy needs is time.
Chiefs Pantalones
10-08-2007, 08:47 PM
It makes absolutely no sense to start Huard. None.
Hammock Parties
10-08-2007, 09:06 PM
For what it's worth, Nick says the Chiefs told him Brodie was starting.
I just got a call from Nick, who told me that Huard's shoulder is going to keep him out Sunday, and Brodie will be starting.
http://forums.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=115#s=115&f=1837&t=1184329
Chiefs Pantalones
10-08-2007, 09:25 PM
Good. The Chiefs are about five games late though. He should've started the season. This franchise is pointless.
Hammock Parties
10-08-2007, 09:30 PM
This franchise is pointless.
Now, now. Clark Hunt is a RICH MAN. And I am entertained.
talastan
10-08-2007, 09:31 PM
It was apparent he didn't want to play.
Didn't he go down on the play he threw the Interception? Wonder if its his way of taking the focus off of the turnover. :hmmm:
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