View Full Version : Intruiging article by Whitlock...
06-09-2001, 11:51 PM
I've gotta say, I moved from KC in 1990, so I don't know what the deal is up close and personal. But from afar, watching what other cities are doing while watching what my beloved KC is doing (let's throw more money into that dump which is Kemper, let's not fire Tony Loser, let's nobody from KC step up to thje plate to buy the Royals for year after year after year, let's lose the NCAA to Indy, let's lat the Big XII tournament go to Dallas, let's have no shot at the NCAA finals, etc) one has gotta wonder whether we will ever step up to the plate. Reality is reality...
keg in kc
06-10-2001, 12:06 AM
Actually that article is kind of a photo-negative of how I feel about St. Louis:
I just don't care.
St. Louis to me is nothing more than a city on the road between here and the east coast...
If they want to keep their delusions of grandeur, then by all means let them; the last thing we need is idiot hack "journalists" like Witless padding their ego.
06-10-2001, 12:15 AM
I suppose that's one way of looking at it, but judging from the many responses we had on the BB back before the draft regarding St Louis, many people do care, at least deep down. To me, reality is what it is, and from here, St Louis is looked upon with respect. Kansas City is looked upon as a joke. Now this has been brought up before, and many Kansas Citians response to that is "let them think that, meanwhile, we've got the best kept secrect in the country right here for ourselves." Fine, but my attitude as a Kansas Citian is that I want to be better. And from my vantage point, we're not getting any better. St Louis is. Other cities are. That frankly pisses me off...
keg in kc
06-10-2001, 12:25 AM
You misunderstand me, I think.
I care only about Kansas City and making it better, and I don't think we're any great secret hidden in the midwest. Comparisons to St. Louis are pointless and meaningless. If we want to be something, we need to strive to be like the major cities on either coast, not like the "little sister" to the east. St. Louis is looked at with no more respect nationally than we are, and most people outside of this region of the US think both cities are nothing more than big boring open pastures filled with cowpatties.
Ask people in Chicago what they think about St. Louis, or in New York, or in LA. You'll probably get the same answer I've gotten from my friends in those places...
Worry about KC. There's plenty of things that need to be done here to make this a better place.
Let St. Louis worry about St. Louis.
St. Louis ....a major city?
06-10-2001, 01:10 AM
Oh, right right, I agree with you there. Rereading the article again I guess it is a bit too much about comparing the two cities. I'm more focused on why we as a city seem to not be moving forward. I agree, I'm not really specifically concerned with what St Louis is or isn't doing, I'm concerned with what we are not doing. While I disagree in part with your contention that St Louis is looked upon in much the same way as KC is by those outside of Missouri, I agree that there is still a lot of midwestern dislike when it comes to the opinion on the coasts. I still feel that St Louis is looked upon with much more respect than we are, and that does irk me. I suppose if the Chiefs won something some of that would be alleviated sportswise. Unfortunately the Royals are nothing more than the Golden State Warriors right now. But I think KC needs to quit dilly daddling around and start getting things done. I think the city has an opportunity to do some great things. We just need some people with a vision to step up to the plate...
06-10-2001, 10:20 AM
The opinion piece(let's not forget - he's an opinion columnist <i>not</i> a 'true' journalist) has some validity.
When was the last time KC had a winning team - and by that, I mean a <i>championship</i> team? The Blades won their championship back in '91(?)... since then? The Wizards won a recent championship... right? That semi-pro basketball team(cannot remember their name...)?
Before that, the Royals won the WS in '85. That was <i>sixteen years ago</i>. Since, this town has fielded runners up (and sometimes, not even that). We've won a championship or two - but at a 'lower' level: i.e., not in any of the three 'majors': NBA, MLB, NFL
StLouis and Denver are the two closest cities with major sports franchises right? Comparing their sports success to KC's is disturbing - no, downright depressing if you're a KC sports fan. BOTH cities have recent SB victories, BOTH have competitive baseball teams, BOTH have very good NHL teams(AVs just won the Stanley Cup), and Denver has a NBA franchise to boot.
KC: bad baseball team, mediocre football team (be honest - that is what it has been since effing <i>'97</i>!), NO hockey, no NBA. We have a bunch of sportstalk programs that do a lot of whining or @ss-kissing(depending on the station) - and a fan base that is becoming increasingly disinterested.
Fatlock the Hut touched on something, but then misdirected it to a KC/StL comparison. I do not think anyone, besides that idiot Kevin Kietzman, really gives a damn about StL. Sure, some people on the boards had hardons for the StL fans when the Green deal was going down, but since, no one cares because we no longer have to deal with them.
Cheerful side note: it could be worse - we could be sports fans in LA instead! (though, this is nulified when/if the Lakers win the NBA title)
06-10-2001, 04:39 PM
St. Louis is one of the worst cities on the planet. I can't think of a worse place on earth and I've traveled alot. I've never met anyone who really liked it. Even St. Louis natives say its weird. It cliche, backward and in my opinion should be fenced off a made a penal colony. Course that's just my opinion I could be wrong :D
06-10-2001, 05:57 PM
I brought this up on the Starís board a while ago and got torched.
Being a devoted Chiefs fan and living on the east coast (about 1.5 hours away from Philadelphia, DC and Baltimore) I get to see first-hand some of the ins and outs of how a couple of NFL teams are ran. I intentionally follow everything I can about the Chiefs while getting the Eagles, Redskins and Ravens shoved down my throat.
There is one aspect of the Chiefs Organization that stands out when they are compared to the above three teams: communication/relations between the fans and the team.
Now I donít have access to the local newspapers (besides the Starís website) and local talk shows that KC based fans do, so feel free to put me in my place if Iím wrong here.
I think the Chiefs Organization treats its fans unjustly when it comes to keeping them informed. There were many instances and I canít recall them all, but last yearís calamity stands out to me like a sore thumb. Why wasnít Hunt or at least Gunther or Raye ever backed into a corner and interrogated about the running back situation? Or the one-dimensional offense? Or the fact Mike Stock was retained another year with no improvement? Take your pick, whichever aspect of last year disturbed you the most.
Was it ever explained to you, the fan that shells out the money to keep the organization running? That $hit is not tolerated out here. When things go wrong week after week after week you have to explain yourself, resolve the issue or your out of a job.
Sometimes protest is needed for change to take place. Stop going to the games, buying the merchandise and revolt. There is a difference between being a loyal fan and blind one. Stupidity like last year should not be tolerated and the GM should have been given a good east coast style grilling to answer some questions and make some changes.
You should see what they do to Ďem Philly!!!
Again, Iím not as in touch as the KC fan base. Iím just giving you the view from over here.
keg in kc
06-10-2001, 06:13 PM
Otter, I think that's a valid statement, and I think the Vermeil-led Chiefs have made a big step in the right direction, at least compared with what I've seen in the two prior years. He's posting regularly to the Chiefs website, usually in some length/detail (very, very long article today)l, and there's been a few radio appearances where it doesn't seem like the coaches are holding very much back. Lots of question and answer stuff, and they seem to be answering everything thrown their way. We have been told, as far as I can tell, exactly what the staff wants to do, what sort of players we want to have, and what we can expect to see on the field. We see direction, and we have straightforward statements. Big improvement in my humble opinion.
Part of the problem lies in the KC media, and with the KC populace, as well. I hear all the time (including on this board) complaints that 810 is out for blood or whatever, trying to make a wave to get ratings...
WELL NO SHIZNIT!!
They're a radio station, a business, first and foremost. They ask tough questions and criticize the problems they see. They don't just say "gee you're doing a great job" when the team's in the midst of an 5 game losing streak and they don't do a happy song and dance talking about the "good ol' days" when the team has been mediocre for three years. They do their jobs, in other words, making for some compelling radio (although I could do without all the golf talk, but then again I'd want Chiefs news all day, and that'd make for some boring radio).
The media here, otherwise is a joke. 980 treats with them kid gloves and I don't think I've seen a harsh story in the Star in the last 2 years. And I guess that's what people are used to here, but compared with the east coast, this is like Care Bear football coverage.
I say there needs to be a little fire added to the KC media, and maybe some of the fanbase (that's another story I might get into sometime...)
06-10-2001, 06:31 PM
I agree the media out there needs a fire lit under their arse. Somebody has to put pressure on the big guys.
Like I said, I wrote something similar to that on the Star in the thick of the mess last year and heard over and over about my team loyalty.
If the Chiefs were rebuilding or young or hell, even TRYING to go in the right direction it would have been a different story but they didn't even get a new freaking special teams coach and not even a peep from the media. :confused: WTF!?!? . Those frontal lobotomy puppets in the media out there disgust me.
I found, and still do to this day the handling of the situation absolutely amazing and unacceptable. Anyway...
I agree the Vermeil regime is doing a much better job so far. I really hope he keeps up, maybe Peterson will follow his lead. I doubt it although.
Love to hear your thoughts on the media when you get a chance.
06-10-2001, 07:06 PM
Bob Dole would have to agree with Dave: St. Louis is a festering pile of crap that something laid on the east side of the state.
Bob Dole would also tend to agree that KC's leadership in many areas seems to lack any real vision. Hopefully, the Stowers Institute and similar foundations will lead the way.
And "the way" ain't to become St. Louis West.
06-10-2001, 08:45 PM
As much as I like living in KC, if the opportunity ever came up (I'm in college at the moment), I think I would move to a better sports city. The fan base for the Chiefs is awesome, but that's it.
Look at Denver last night. With Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals, they still sold out Coors Field. Granted, the two venues are only a mile apart, and there were constant updates on the scoreboard at Coors, I would tend to think that the die hard Avs fans would have stayed at home to watch the game.... and 47,000 people still showed up to watch the Rockies game.
I know if the Royals were doing better, more people would show up, but I don't think this city will ever support more than just football. If we got an NHL team tomorrow, do you really think we would sell out every game in the inaugural season like Minnesota did, or sell out 98% like Columbus?
Look at the KC Star today... The French Open got the major Sports headline while Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals got the bottom right corner...
Not to bash Kansas City... Maybe I'm just ranting because this city will never make an effort to bring the NHL here (or the NBA for that matter).
06-10-2001, 11:37 PM
That's just a reality of the market. There are enough people to support the Chiefs and Royals, but beyond that the fans have done nothing to indicate they can support anything beyond that. When we're talking about losing the Blades and Knights, well frankly that's pathetic. In the case of the Royals, a lot of their fan base depends on people coming from out of town. They have been so consistently bad the last decade, no one outside of KC has much of a reason to make the trek out to the K for a series anymore. And some of the locals are still bitter about the strike, so they've stayed away. And the ownership isn't helping matters by sticking behind Tony Loser, and the press doesn't help much either. Heck, even Posnanski, who recently wrote a "Fire Tony" column, was apologetic about it all the way through. Soft, soft, soft...
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