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bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 07:39 AM
Thank you for introducing us to Gennifer Flowers, Paula Jones, Monica Lewinski and about two dozen other names that we might not have met and known otherwise.

Thank you for allowing a war hero and the author of one of the most successful military campaigns in military history to leave the presidency because, no matter how successful he was, we, in all our moral outrage, just wouldn't tolerate someone who would lie to the American people by promising "no new taxes" and then going back on his word. We certainly can't have a liar in the White House, now can we?

Thank you for showing all the men and women in America that sexual harassment in the work place, and on the job, is okay as long as it involves powerful middle-age executives and the young women half their age under their power. It is, after all, a "private matter."

Thank you for revealing that the agenda of the National Organization for Women only includes some women. Women like Anita Hill, and not women like Paula Jones, Monica Lewinski, et. al.

Thank you for allowing us to come to the realization that "sexual relations" is not clearly defined after all. And all these years, I thought that "oral sex" really had something to do with sex! (Imagine!) (Or is it Oral Sex when you talk about it . . .?)

Thank you for giving us a president who discusses his choice of underwear with teenagers. We always wondered if presidents wore boxers or briefs.

Thank you for installing a man who reminds us of those good old days of pot smoking (without inhaling, of course) and war protesting.

Thank you for showing us that the ridiculous plot of the movie, "Wag the Dog," could really be plausible after all.

Thank you for reintroducing the concept of "impeachment" to a new generation that missed the discussion surrounding it the last time it was brought up.

Thank you for curing me of my addiction to the evening news.

Thank you for reminding us that the government that gave us the Internal Revenue Service and welfare, also lusts for control of the greatest health care system in the world.

Thank you for reminding us that the FBI, who has a file on millions of Americans, including myself, can give those files to people powerful enough to demand them.

Thank you for reminding us that, when all is said and done, character really, really does matter.

And, in comparison: Thank you for making Dan Quayle look like the smartest man in America. Thank you for making Jimmy Carter look competent. Thank you for making Gerald Ford look graceful. Thank you for making Richard Nixon look honest. Thank you for making Lyndon Johnson look truthful. Thank you for making John Kennedy look moral. Thank you for making Al Gore look positively presidential.

Thank you for reminding us of the importance of term limits.

And really, Thank you not once, but twice! Why, if it was not for you, instead of the current, interesting discussion all over the television networks and newspapers, we would be focused on a whole slew of trivial matters such as giving secrets to China in exchange for campaign contributions, global defense, the economy, nukes in North Korea, genocide in Africa & Kosovo, the containment of terrorism, and all those other boring topics.

So, Thank you, Thank you, Thank you! Since Bill Clinton took office, here are some of the good things that have happened: 1) 72 House and Senate witnesses have pled the Fifth Amendment. 2) 17 witnesses have fled the country to avoid testifying. 3) 19 foreign witnesses have refused to be interviewed by US investigative bodies. 4) 19 charges from Whitewater investigations, 4 convictions from Whitewater investigations, 8 imprisonment's from Whitewater investigations….. 55 total charges in all Clinton scandals, 32 total convictions (so far) in all Clinton scandals, 14 total imprisonment's (sofar) in all Clinton scandals. 5) 938 overnight stays at the White House for Clinton supporters. 6) $48 million - cost of Starr's 5-Year investigation. 7) $49 million - cost of Clinton's 10 day trip to China.

Yes, it's been an interesting 8 years for "the most ethical administration in the history of the Republic." Thanks....

sd4chiefs
06-14-2001, 08:08 AM
Boring!:eek:

ChiTown
06-14-2001, 08:08 AM
Very nice, Brian!

It's funny how the dem's and the liberal media have jumped all over the Bush Daughter's college drinking wow's. I guess when you have had more political fodder than any reporter could handle during an 8 yr. period, you'd be scrambling for something scandalous to write about during this current administration.

Politicians and The Media - I can't think of two groups more deserving of one another.

HC_Chief
06-14-2001, 08:11 AM
<i>Politicians and The Media - I can't think of two groups more deserving of one another.</i>

hehehehe ;)

Neither of them actually <i>do</i> anything - they just blab and expel hot air on the actions of others...

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 08:15 AM
sd4chiefs,

Are we a liberal and don't like the fact that this stuff was brought up to remind you of how your guy's last 8 years was.

This almost makes Bush seem like an angel, even with his daughters...


;)

Alton deFlat
06-14-2001, 08:16 AM
Damn! Pretty large soapbox there. How can you sleep at night? :p

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 08:20 AM
Chief4ever,

No it is just amazing how soon people forget about the crap that went on the previous administration.

As far as I am concerned, both parties are extremely corrupt. There are only a couple of republicans that I would even give the time of day to.

Aren't you liberals, not necessarily you Chief4ever
, the ones that say don't take things so seriously.
;)

Both sides need to lighten quite a bit.

Iowanian
06-14-2001, 08:21 AM
I would like to have a beer or two with the Bush Twins ;)

they sound like fun girls...the kind i would have hung out with in college.

~wouldn't buy a milkbone for chelsae.

HC_Chief
06-14-2001, 08:22 AM
LOL! :D

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 08:23 AM
Iowanian,

Almost everyman's fantasy, 2 women and twins.... lol

Iowanian
06-14-2001, 08:26 AM
HC's avatar looks amazingly similar to the Clinton daughter :D

~waiting for Jenna Bush to sing the Fleetwood mac classic "lay you down in the tall grass and let me do my stuff"

Alton deFlat
06-14-2001, 08:52 AM
Sorry Brian, I meant no disrespect. Just pokin' fun.
:) ;) :p :D

Mark M
06-14-2001, 09:26 AM
bk--
First, let me say very well done. The fact this man is not in jail still astounds me. He was a crook, a liar, a cheat and just a basically bad person who has set a terrible example.

HOWEVER, I do have one question (and remember, I'm not a liberal, just someone who feels as though he can see things from an independent's perspective) ...

When will all of you people get the f*ck over it?!?!?!?!?! The guy is gone, alright? He's no longer president. He's finished ... done ... gone ... he has left the building ... buh-bye ... don't let the door hit ya where the dog should've bit ya. Unless you live in New York you don't have to deal with him anymore.

If the media goes after Bush for every little thing, well, what comes around goes around. Fact is, everyone (liberal, conservative, indy, whatever) can thank a Republican by the name of Richard Nixon for creating an atmosphere where all respect for the office of President of the United States has been thrown out the window. I have more respect for Nixon because he actually admitted he was wrong, however.

But every president, if you looked deep enough and long enough, has a metric ton of skeletons hiding in a closet somewhere. It's just that, since Nixon, everyone goes out of their way to find them. Some are worse than others (Clinton being the King of the Crooks), but all of them got where they are by being ruthless in one way or another.

Sorry ... I understand your point. And I mean no disrespect to you. I'm just getting sick and f*cking tired of hearing (or rather, reading) about this every single month.

MM
~~Knows that it's time to move on.

ck_IN
06-14-2001, 10:41 AM
The only problem with that Mark is that he isn't gone. I turned on CNN last night and was treated to the sight of breathless media coverage of how the Slickster had insinuated himself on someones wedding. Another story told me how he and Chel had joined the NY YMCA.

He's not gone because A) he doesn't want to be gone, and B) his lapdogs in the media don't want him to be gone.

Reagan left the office and became a private citizen. Yet we were treated to an endless barrage of revisionist history, that slandered one of the greatest presidents in American history.

The Clinton years must not be forgotten, and must be shown for the parade of sleaze and corruption that they were.

DaWolf
06-14-2001, 10:47 AM
It appears the "American people" don't really care either way. I was just reading about a poll where at this point only 29% of Americans feel Bush should be reelected.

Looks like W's going to have to turn up the entertainment factor if he wants to capture people's imagination and not bore the "American people". It sure didn't hurt President Clinton... :)

BIG_DADDY
06-14-2001, 10:52 AM
I feel exactly the opposite of Mark here. BIG DADDY will NEVER forget and appreciates it when others remind us of our past so maybe we can alleviate this in the future. We are still living with many of the losses to our freedoms that clown implimented and I am hoping BUSH will not sell us down the same road as well. The lates issue being medical records privacy. Clinton sold us down the river on this and I don't think Bush is going to stop it.

BIG DADDY

That would piss me off. :mad:

Mark M
06-14-2001, 10:54 AM
ck--
I agree that Regan has been given the shaft. He did put us in a debt that has taken 12 years to get rid of, but the guy put the Russians out of business and guided American through one of the most prosperous eras in history.

And Clinton is a complete media whore ... but if the public wouldn't keep going after the guy (admittedly for the right reasons), maybe there wouldn't be so much focus on him. The best thing we can do as a country is ignore the crooked a$$hole. But, alas, that probably won't happen any time soon. :(

MM
~~Wishes Clinton wouldn't go away mad, but just go away.

Mark M
06-14-2001, 10:59 AM
Big-Daddy--
I'm not saying we should just forget what he did ... just stop whining about it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over ...

We all know he was a crook and that we should never allow a person like that be elected again (although it probably will happen again ... :( ). But c'mon ... b!tching about it like little children won't change anything. Learn the lesson, store it in memory and move on.

MM
~~Likes to get on with the future, rather than dwelling on the past.

Clint in Wichita
06-14-2001, 11:00 AM
Thank you, Bill Clinton, for giving every right-winger in the country something to whine about, even after you've been out of office for 6 months.


Jesus H. Christ, get over it already!

Try thanking Bush Jr. for all he's done.

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 11:02 AM
Clint,

What about all of the lib's whining about what Reagan did how long ago.??;)

ck_IN
06-14-2001, 11:03 AM
Mark, don't be offended, but you are sorely confused. A clear victim of revisionist history. Reagan <b>did not</b> put us in debt. He agreed to a budget deal with the Demo controlled Congress that if taxes were cut, spending would be cut proportionatly. Taxes were cut, revenues did rise, but the Demos broke their promise (surprised?) and raised spending faster than the rising revenues.

Revenues increased for 6 of Reagan's 8 years. (The first two years with a GOP led Congress, we were overcoming the mess left by Carter.) For all 6 of those years the Demo controlled congress trash canned Reagan's budget, and wrote their own. They then delivered it at the 11th hour and told Reagan to sign it or Govt would shut down. My only sadness is that Reagan didn't call their bluff and shut things down. If the spend-thrift Demos of the 80's had been exposed for what they were, the deficits wouldn't have happened.

Clint in Wichita
06-14-2001, 11:05 AM
I hardly ever hear or read anything negative about Reagan until conservatives start crying about Clinton.

Why are we discussing past Presidents, anyway? There's PLENTY to talk about involving our new President.

Cannibal
06-14-2001, 11:08 AM
Reagan raised spending.

Remember the Cold War?

Reagan even said he would spend as much of our money as needed to break the Soviet's collective backs and win the Cold War.

It was a contest and we "won", but Reagan spent more money in his eight years that all other administrations combined.

ck_IN
06-14-2001, 11:12 AM
Then you weren't paying attention Clint. The revisionists didn't let the Oval Office chair cool before they started trashing Reagan.

As for Bush I'm not thrilled with him, but he seems to be bringing a level headed, thought out, non focus grouped approach to his job. So far, so good and a wonderful change.

Mark, I'm not putting the Clinton tenure on a par with the Holocaust for obvious reasons, but the surviors have a saying; 'Never forget'. It applies to Clinton. We mustn't allow some to tell us what we know happened didn't happen, or happened some other way.

Honestly recounting Clinton's sleaze and corruption isn't whining. It's keeping history honest. And honesty is a rare commodity when dealing with that particular individual.

ck_IN
06-14-2001, 11:16 AM
Reagan's millitary spending ended the greatest threat the free world has ever known, including Hitler. It was money well spent.

The demos however poured money down their various pet causes far in excess of previous spending and in direct violation of their budget promise to do the contrary.

If you don't like the national debt, give the DNC a call and tell them. <b>They</b> are the real perpatrators.

DaWolf
06-14-2001, 11:17 AM
Clinton is just as sleazy and corrupt as the next politician. He was just careless, and didn't understand a good cover up...

Mark M
06-14-2001, 11:18 AM
ck--
No offense taken! :D I think we can discuss this like adults. The scary thing ... I agree with Cannibal! :eek:

Regan spent billions upon billions on a Star Wars program that (at least to our knowledge) never came to fruition. He spent billions on other military items ... not saying that the military didn't need some rebuilding after the Demos pretty much ruined—like they always do—but he did spend tons of cash in order to force the Russians to match us. They couldn't. So in the end it worked to our advantage. Were there defecits before? Sure. But none like there was afterwards.

Like I said, I liked Regan ... best president I've seen in my lifetime. I even met him once at a TKE function (technically, he's a fraternity brother. I used to have a pic of him at his TKE house grabbing his ankles as his fraternity brothers are getting ready to swat his a$$. Too funny!) My point was that he wasn't as perfect as many Repubs think he is.

"I don't recall ..." is his famous line during the Iran-Contra thing. Frankly, I don't believe it for a second. If he didn't recall, well ... that scares me. If he couldn't remember what he did 5 years before that, who was running the country?????

MM
~~Would still take Regan and debt over Clinton and scandal any day.

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 11:20 AM
Mark,



"I don't recall ..." is his famous line during the Iran-Contra thing. Frankly, I don't believe it for a second. If he didn't recall, well ... that scares me. If he couldn't remember what he did 5 years before that, who was running the country?????



Wasn't this a common answer for the Clintons, both Hilliary and Bill?

:D

Cannibal
06-14-2001, 11:26 AM
Reagan did not put us in debt.


That is a lie.

Reagan spent more money than all other previous adminstrations combined.

That fuggin sign in New York that represents the National Debt w/ the numbers scrolling constantly without stopping was invented for Reagan.

Don't try telling us he didn't "put us in debt".

Mark M
06-14-2001, 11:31 AM
bk--
If you are saying that the Clinton's used the same defense, then either: a.) they and Regan really didn't recall; or b.) they and Regan were lying. Personally, I think the Clinton's were lying and Regan was too ... although now that we know he has Alzeihmer's, it could've been true. But, again, then who was running the country?

And I'm not trying to defend Clinton here. I'm just tired of hearing about it. Like ck said in his post #23, we shouldn't forget. But I don't think we need it ceaselessly pounded down our throats. Clinton was a crook ... I get it. Enought already. Sheeesh.

Sorry, but I've been on way too long. So, before I get canned let me say I'll check back later.

MM
~~Can't wait to see where this goes while he's gone.

Gaz
06-14-2001, 12:16 PM
Reagan spent more money than all other previous adminstrations combined.

This comment displays a lack of comprehension concerning our system of governement. One of the backbones of our representative form of Government is that Congress controls the purse strings, not the Administrative Branch.

Here is a link:

http://www.usconstitution.net/

Educate yourself.

xoxo~
Gaz
Prefers to hear from informed sources.

Clint in Wichita
06-14-2001, 12:33 PM
Gaz,

That being the case, Congress should receive most of the credit for the 8 "wonderful" years that Reagan was in office, and the majority of the blame for the things that were screwed up during Clinton's 8 years, since nothing has gone right in this country for 8 years.


BTW, to this day, the ONLY thing we KNOW about Clinton's wrongdoings is that he received a B.J. from Monica Lewinsky & proceeded to lie about it under oath...as if those of you who have cheated on your spouses wouldn't do the same thing.

Now I'll wait on the parade of people who "would never do such a thing to their spouse".

Cannibal
06-14-2001, 01:11 PM
Interesting, Reagan had nothing to due w/ the military spending/build-up during the Cold War...

Boy, there is a conservative bias on this board.

bkkcoh
06-14-2001, 01:12 PM
BTW, to this day, the ONLY thing we KNOW about Clinton's wrongdoings is that he received a B.J. from Monica Lewinsky & proceeded to lie about it under oath...as if those of you who have cheated on your spouses wouldn't do the same thing.


There were several questionable dealings involving Clinton with the trade situation with China and the Contributions received fromChinese officials. There was instances, I believe, that the FBI looked the other for people visiting the White House. I am sure there are lots of other examples from all presidents, but that doesn't make it right.

It would be nice to have the office of the president have the respect it should have. But we will have to see what kind of can of worms you guys will open up with the last statement.

:)

Mark M
06-14-2001, 01:48 PM
Ahhhh ... just when I think I'm losing my mind and agreeing with Clint and Cannibal, they bring me back down to earth. Thanks guys! :rolleyes:

There is MUCH more than a BJ in Clinton scandalous past. To say otherwise shows a complete lack of knowledge on the subject, as well as a liberal bias. He created an atmosphere where lying and cheating were commonplace and accepted. And while I don't think we should dwell on it (as some on this board do ... not a rip, fellas, just an observation), I sure as hell ain't going to say we should either forget it or sweep it under the rug, nor am I so stupid as to deny it.

BTW, I WOULD NEVER DO SUCH A THING TO MY WIFE. ANYONE WHO WOULD IS A PIG. It's called a committment ... if you can't make one, don't get married, f*ckstick.

Sorry ... I just can't stand infidelity. There is no excuse for it. Doesn't mean that the entire world needs to know about it, however. Nor does it excuse him from lying under oath.

MM
~~Would divorce his wife long before he cheated on her.

HC_Chief
06-14-2001, 02:14 PM
Mark - well, you can't really blame the liberals for trying to make an issue of legality look like an indictment of morality. It was the entire Clinton defense - and how the mainstream media tried to paint the proceedings. Some people just take what they're told at face value

Cannibal
06-14-2001, 02:20 PM
I did not defend Clinton in this thread.

Clinton is an immoral scumball.

I am just pointing out some inaccuracies of other posters w/ regards to the policies of the Reagan administration.

Baby Lee
06-14-2001, 04:59 PM
I am predominantly in the 'get over it' camp as well. However, there were a number of 'rules of the game' that changed in the Clinton era, and I will do my dardnest to make sure either the 'new rules' continue to apply or, if these 'new rules' again revert to old form, people remain mindful of the passes they afforded Clinton.

That remark bears a little explanation. There were a string of 'scandals' that, as they descended upon Clinton, the literati tried to convince us that we should have moved past them. Drug use, draft dodging, philandering, illegalities in campaign financing, etc., long served as black marks on politicians. However, they were 'tired old saws' the instant Clinton's weaknesses in each area came to light.

Likewise, every photo-op with a minority, or an interest group, or a cause [environment, etc.], was called out as pandering, until Clinton raised it to new heights. Suddenly, 'hey here's a guy who really cares about us.' Bull-hockey. Minority causes, liberal causes, the environment, all of this recieived a lot of lip service, a lot of pandering, in the Clinton era with little or no action [unless you count the crass, unenforceable last minute executive orders insituted as 'legacy building' and to serve as a thorn in Bush's side]. Witness welfare reform [which I do support, but had a Republican pushed it through (as so many tried), he or she would have been roundly excoriated as an out-of-touch racist], nearly a decade of EPA inaction, 'don't ask, don't tell,' the first rejection of the Kyoto Protocol, unprecedented miltary presence and action abroad, violence and terrorism at home unknown since the Veitnam era [not that I'm blaming him, just think about how another administration would have been received had it happened on its watch].

The carping 'standard' are already starting. I heard Bill Mahar railing on last night about Bush's 'photo-ops' - ie, [sarcasm on] "I have a black child on my lap, aren't I a great person" [sarcasm off]. Didn't hear a word when Billy was waxing sentimental about his fond memories of walking around Harlem, even though it clear they were made up out of whole cloth.

sd4chiefs
06-14-2001, 05:33 PM
Looks like I was wrong. See post 1. Seems like this same topic has been posted about a 100 times. I guess we all must be bored because baseball and basketball sucks.

Gaz
06-15-2001, 06:28 AM
& proceeded to lie about it under oath

Felony perjury.

'Nuff said.

xoxo~
Gaz
Sees no "only" in purjury.