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WackyRuss
06-24-2001, 05:36 PM
Quote from the Sporting News:

"It may be early, but here is my projected order of finish for the AFC West this season:

1. Raiders (13-3)
2. Broncos (10-6)
3. Chargers (9-7)
4. Seahawks (8-8)
5. Chiefs (4-12)

Disagree with Vinnie? Don't worry -- you're not alone. Submit your own AFC West predictions for 2001 in Voice of the Fan."

aturnis
06-24-2001, 06:52 PM
What a rudy-poo, does anyone seriously think we can only beat 4 of the teams on our schedule? What a DIP!

Chiefs Pantalones
06-24-2001, 07:59 PM
Geez!

Does anyone actually think that we will be that bad (4-12) if so, I wanna know why?

CG

these so-called experts confuse me:confused: as to why they think we will be that bad?

Bwana
06-24-2001, 08:07 PM
LOL! 4 wins?? Where do they find these "experts?" These outfits must hire any slack jawed strokestick off the street and put them to work.

JOhn
06-24-2001, 08:10 PM
ROFLMAO I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!


EVERYTIME all the "experts" pick us to bomb, we WIN. Both seasons we went 13-3 we were picked as the cellar dewlers.

So bring on the doom-sayers




"lovin every minute of it!"

DaWolf
06-24-2001, 08:18 PM
Dudes, it's not an expert, it is, as Clint called him, that "nerd" Vinnie Iyer...

Chiefs Pantalones
06-24-2001, 08:40 PM
JOhn,

For our sake, I hope we don't go 13-3, more like; 14-2 or 12-4, or something like that.

CG

13-3 is bad luck:eek:

:D

BigMeatballDave
06-24-2001, 09:22 PM
4-12?! The 3 stooges are gone, along with Dumbther. It can only get better.

nickman
06-24-2001, 09:40 PM
It makes sense why we are picked so poorly by everyone. I hope they are wrong. They feel that Seattle and San Diego improved greatly, Denver seems to have reloaded and Oakland has remained the same. Where we have added Green at the expense of Grbac and a number 1 choice, he did throw for 4000 yards and had a decent year.

For me the hope is that after watching Gunther coach the last two years, that we have better talent than was shown under psycho coaching. That Vermiel is a big addition and will bring it out.

philfree
06-24-2001, 10:53 PM
The Chargers went 1-15 last year and this idiot thinks they'll go 9-7 this year. Gimmie a break! We will improve at least one win over last year. Can't wait for the season to start I've come up with season tickets again this year and my pulse is starting to quicken as I post.

PhilFree :cool:

TEX
06-25-2001, 09:31 AM
JOhn,
That used to be the case, but recently, the Sporting News has been on target. They correctly picked the Chiefs to finish 7-9 in '98 and 7-9 last year. In 1999 they picked KC to finish 8-8. Thay nailed it in 2 out of 3 years and only missed it by 1 in the other. Meanwhile, we all say that "every time the Chiefs are picked to do poorly, they do good." That's simply not the case anymore. The Chiefs have not done too well the past few years, just like all the media predicted. This year I don't think they'll win more than 6 games. :confused:

DaWolf
06-25-2001, 10:14 AM
I don't think Vinnie was the one doing the picking those years...

ck_IN
06-25-2001, 10:29 AM
He has some of the numbers right, just the wrong teams associated.

I'd say something like:

Denver 13-3
Oakland 10-6/11-5
Seattle 9-7
Chiefs 6-10
SD 5-11

RaiderCorporate
06-25-2001, 02:08 PM
Based on what happened last season and what has been done so far, I agree with the general opinion cheeves will finish at 8-8.

Large question marks about running backs and O line ability to run block.

Defensively there is great change pending but likely no improvement. I think Robinson as defensive coordinator is a mistake.

The greatest offseason improvement was Vermeil, and maybe Green.

This will probably be an ugly season for cheeves fans.

The Bad Guy
06-25-2001, 04:28 PM
Chuck,

I'd be interested to hear your reasoning why you predict a 5-11 season for KC, but yet you predict a 9-7 record for the Seahawks who currently have a QB who has never made a start in a regular season game in the NFL. Nor do they have anyone for him to throw the ball to.

Their defense hasn't improved that much. They have an aging John Randle in the middle, and a monster in Kirkland, but I don't think he is near the player he used to be.

I think 9-7 is a reach for Seattle, but I'd like to know your opinion on it.

Raider,

If Robinson is a mistake, then why has Gannon only been able to win one game against the teams he is a defensive coordinator for?

The only time Rich beat Greg was back in 1997 on a 54 yarder from Stoyo.

KCPHILLY
06-25-2001, 08:29 PM
This will probably be an ugly season for cheeves fans

I agree to a certain degree in most everything you say except the quote. As you said yourself, most of us see anything over 8-8 as more than expected but possible so no reason to see it as an ugly season. If GREEN proves to be the best off-season move this year then I think most of us will be very pleased.

A win or two over the FAIDS would be a nice, and IMO achievable bonus. ;)

Jim Hunter
06-25-2001, 08:56 PM
I really believe the chiefs will surprize people this year, although I'm still going to enjoy watching them even if they don't do as I'm hoping. I was not going to get the Direct Ticket football package this year if Gunther was still the coach. Gunther sure had a way to dampen even a die-hard fans enthusiasm. Now I'm excited about the Chiefs future. Its gettin' better !!!

NaptownChief
06-26-2001, 08:21 AM
I don't think this moron knows that Dumbther is no longer the coach...If that were still the case then 4-12 would be a pretty good guess. But with the coaching change I say 10-6

Rausch
06-26-2001, 08:47 AM
I'd have to agree with the camp that believes that the Chargers will make a huge leap up this year. I'm also not a big believer that the Broncos will be easy champs of the West.

I think that The Raiders will probably fall a few games back, injuries and such. THey are an old team.

I think that if the Chargers can get a win or two under their belt by week 4, they could get confident, and dangerous. THey were six points from sweeping the Raiders last year, DID beat us last year, and I couldn't tell you how many they lost by less than 3....

I think Seattle will dissapoint big time. I'm just not impressed. TAKING the lineman when they did this draft did impress, but I'm not getting all worried about another unproven qb with potential in Seattle...

I think:

Denver 12-4
San Diego 10-6
Oakland 10-6
KC 8-8
Seattle 6-10

htismaqe
06-26-2001, 09:33 AM
Brad,

That's a pretty good assessment.

I think the Broncos may have a very tough time developing chemistry, particulary with Lett and McGlockton on the defense. They could be scary, but more than likely it'll just cause them problems.

The Raiders have a potential chemistry problem in Charlie Garner. He won't be content being a backup to Wheatley and the Raiders game will suffer if they try to give him too many carries. Age is a big problem for the offense, and the defense hasn't done much to improve by adding Trace Armstrong and others.

The Seahawks are the Seahawks. Hassleback is unproven, they still don't have any wide receivers, and fixing that defense is going to take alot more than signing some big names on the downside of their careers.

The Chiefs have reason for hope, but this year could be tough. I think it'll be week 4 or 5 before they truly get the offense to gel on the field, and hopefully the defense will struggle early because the coaches decided to start the young d-backs get them used to things.

The Chargers could be very, very good. The defense is, as always, solid. I like the addition of Tomlinson. Flutie isn't flashy, but he knows how to win and he's gonna get the ball to the only go-to guy they have - Freddie Jones. I think they'll finish strong.

All in all, this should be an interesting year...

TEX
06-26-2001, 10:00 AM
I see it this way:

Denver 12-4
San Diego 10-6
Oakland 10-6
Seattle 8-8
KC 6-10

The Donx are my clear favorite. They're deep everywhere and now they have Buerline as back up. Plus Rhodes and new pesonnel will improve their defense.

The Bolts have added a QB, RB, DE ,WR/ return man and more. Plus, they have a very EASY schedule. I would not be surprised if they pass the Raidas. Each year a team comes out of nowhere - it could be the Bolts.

The Raidas shot their wad last year. They're getting older and Gannon can only take them so far without a verticle passing game. Cover the underneith junk and you can beat them.

The Hawks are getting it together and Holmgren has his QB. If Hasssleback can play as he does each preseason, they could really be good offensively. Still, their defense is suspect.

The Chiefs have the most unanswered questions in the division, as well as the most new faces. Still, no legit running game - only another plan. The defense has many question marks and the schedule is very TOUGH. Not much depth in some key areas. This year we hit bottom, however we are headed in the right direction.

RaiderCorporate
06-26-2001, 03:31 PM
NFLScoopFrank:

If you are concerned only with Gannon’s performance relative to Robinson’s defenses – great, you have much to cheer about. If you look at Robinson’s defensive tendency to send everyone and the kitchen sink after the QB at the expense of opening up holes in the secondary, maybe you’ll understand how your defense could get hurt. Robinson had the luxury many times of playing defense with a lead in hand and the opposing offense having to play catch up and throw the ball more than they ordinarily would want. I don’t know he can pull off this same schtick in KC.

KCPHILLY:

“A win or two over the FAIDS would be a nice, and IMO achievable bonus.”

Or not. An interesting change in perspective, considering not long ago many cheeves fans took it for granted their beloved team would have two victories versus the Raiders. Truly, the times they are a’changin

NaptownChief
06-26-2001, 05:12 PM
Originally posted by RaiderCorporate

“A win or two over the FAIDS would be a nice, and IMO achievable bonus.”

Or not. An interesting change in perspective, considering not long ago many cheeves fans took it for granted their beloved team would have two victories versus the Raiders. Truly, the times they are a’changin

I don't know about everyone else but in my house I am still taking those two games for granted....Last year was an aberration. Just about every major contributor on that team, with the exception of Woody, is older than Mathusala.:D

morphius
06-26-2001, 09:16 PM
jl80 - Also, it will be nice now that nobody on the Raiders Squad knows our offense and defensive coaches, and the way they like to do things. Much harder to pass that info off to your coach and teammates when nobody on your team has played for these guys.

I would almost be willing to guarntee that one of the last players we drop late in preseason (maybe after TC because of how early we play them) will end up sitting on the sideline of the raiders for a spell because they will feel they need a spy.

KCPHILLY
06-26-2001, 11:00 PM
Actually, I'm looking forward to returning to "the norm" versus the FAIDS but I'm not sure if this is the year to expect that. Of the 3 loses we've experienced we could have easily won 2 but the last one we were clearly out Coached. CHUCKIE saw the weakness and attacked it and GUN did nothing to adjust.

BALT proved last year what I had been saying all year. Play the FAIDS in a phone booth and you shut them down. Problem is we don't have the run stuffing DT's and our DB's have to prove they can play man coverage before we can be effective.

I think in order to have a chance of beating OAK this year we will have to score fast and often. I don't have that much respect for your D considering you have never had an answer for GONZO. I think a 2 TE set will cause you fits and see our chances as strong only if we can score first and maintain a lead.

hawaiianboy
06-27-2001, 01:01 AM
Originally posted by jl80


I don't know about everyone else but in my house I am still taking those two games for granted....Last year was an aberration.

Nappy.....

I see you have your rose colored scuba mask on again... 'Tis a shame the bubble will burst in week one this year....



Oh well... I can use another new lid...
Try not to hurt yourself belly flopping off that bridge.....

redhed
06-27-2001, 01:12 AM
Gimme a break.

But let's look at the shedule objectively:

{homervision activated}

Oak at home: WIN WIN WIN A jakked up crowd helps
at Sea: L
NY at home: WIn
at Wash: Win DV beats Marty
at Den: L New stad gives a boost
Pitt: win Chiefs own da Steelers in Arrowhead
at AZ: WIN (puhleeze, it's da Cards)
Indy: Win
at SD: WIN (dey got more probs than Flutie can answer)
at NYJ: WIn Vinny gets punished
Sea at home: Win
Philly: win DV gets emotional
at Oak: WIN Sweep baby, and things are back to normal!
Denver: WIn
SD: win and Sweep
at Jax: Loss

{homervision deactiviated}

Wow, I guess that adds up to 13-3. Hmmmm. That seems like a lot. Ah well, stranger things have happened. But a 10 game winnning streak?!?!?
Now I don't want to hear anythang outa you cretins, 'cuz this is just a prelim prediction pending final rosters.

hawaiianboy
06-27-2001, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by KCPHILLY

BALT proved last year what I had been saying all year. Play the FAIDS in a phone booth and you shut them down. Problem is we don't have the run stuffing DT's and our DB's have to prove they can play man coverage before we can be effective.

I think in order to have a chance of beating OAK this year we will have to cheat and pray for a miracle.


My old NFL Talk whipping b... er.. adverasary! Nice to see ya....


I guess the company line by rival fans will be:"Do what the Ravens did. Crowd the line of scrimmage, play press coverage and use your FS to play over the top of Tim Brown."

Well kudos to Marvin Lewis and Jack del Rio for an excellent game plan. Unfortunately, its not a defense any team can just plug in and use....

You'll need:
1) Two big DT's that can effectively play in a two gap defense. (Fatty and Adams)
2) An outstanding CB with the size and speed to play press coverage. (McCallister)
3) A FS with the football IQ to call coverages before the ball is snapped, and the speed to play over the top of the #1` WR. (Woodson)
4) A physical, incredibly fast MLB that can handle a 20 yard box on his own (Ray-Ray)

Kudos to you for at least questioning your personnels ability to cookie cut this defensive scheme.....

The Jets exposed the way to beat this defense.... Run the back that Lewis is covering down the field or hit the man the SS is matched up against....

Hopefully, the addition of a back who can be a threat down the field (Garner) and a TE that hopefully can catch the friggen rock (Williams) will offset this type of defense..... Having an effective #2 WR who can compliment Brown would throw a wrench into things as well...

The biggest plus in my eyes would be the development of a guy that can take it to the house after the catch... So far Jerry Porter ( a guy I really like) has looked like he will be that guy.....


As for the division? I think 11 wins takes it this year... The division is improved and the out of conference games tougher...

hawaiianboy
06-27-2001, 02:00 AM
Originally posted by kchiefs30
4-12?! The 3 stooges are gone, along with Dumbther. It can only get better.


I'll agree that purging incompetent coaches can make a world of difference...

After the '99 season we canned the Raider version of the stooges... Our defensive coordinator and our special teams coach... No more weak soft, prevent win zones and fire drill special teams play..

I wonder whatever happened to those two?


Anybody know where Willie Shaw and Frank Ganz Jr ended up??

milkman
06-27-2001, 04:49 AM
Hey HB,
Good to see ya.

Now let me quote you.

The biggest plus in my eyes would be the development of a guy that can take it to the house after the catch... So far Jerry Porter (a guy I really like) has looked like he will be that guy.....

That would be a big plus for you guys, but there is one other problem.

Noodle Arm can't get the ball downfield to him, so how's Porter gonna develop into that guy?

Not everyone can play defense as effectively as BMore, but the plan still remains the same. We've been saying it here for a long time.

Make Noodle Arm beat you deep. He can't do it.

TEX
06-27-2001, 07:47 AM
MM,
Agreed. Stop the underneith stuff and and Gannon can't beat you. I watched in total diabelief as Kurt's soft zones played right into Gannon's hands. Shoot, I bet Gruden was counting on it.

HB,
True, it's hard to march B-more's defense, but not Denver's. Seems like the Donx have Gannon's/Oakland's number and have for quite sometime now. Do you know where Greg Robinson went? :p

stevieray
06-27-2001, 07:53 AM
For the first time in 10 years, this team is not predictable. While I agree it takes time for a new system....I honestly think this team will be better than projected.

When you know nothing about a team, it's easier and more realistic to say they will tank.

milkman
06-27-2001, 08:18 AM
TX,
I also watched in dismay and near fury as Gannon and the TRaiders just totally used KS's soft zone defense.

If the Chiefs, or any other team for that matter, go into games on defense against the TRaiders with the same type of strategy and gameplan as the Ravens, then the TRaiders are very beatable, even for teams that are only average defensively, like the Donkey Boys of last season.

If evey team uses the same strategy against them, the TRaiders are only middle of the pack in the division, IMO.

milkman
06-27-2001, 08:29 AM
Stevieray,
I recall that you were one of Goonther's staunchest defenders last season.
Does your previous post mean that you are on board with the coaching change?
Does it also mean that you came to realize that the Chiefs were going to continue on their downward spiral under Goonther?

Rausch
06-27-2001, 09:17 AM
I supported Gun, but would have prefered Dom Capers over him at the time of hiring...


And I think the Stooges did more to tank Gun then Gun did. If Gun would have threatened to quit, blown the San Diego call, etc. yet still made the playoffs, I don't think he's canned....



Still, as progress is being made, I wouldn't change anything SO FAR!....:rolleyes:

milkman
06-27-2001, 09:39 AM
I never thought that Goonther should have been hired to begin with. I supported him, and after my initial reservations, I maintained a positive outlook for a period of time.

I gave up that positivity when he blamed Larry Parker for the loss in Indy publicly. That was a horrible mistake, and really showed Goonther's lack of understanding the relationship between his words and the effect they would have on people.

He only got worse from there.

Now, like Goonther's hiring, I have my reservations about Vermeil.
There are others that I thought would be better for this team.
However, he is now the HC, and unless and until he does something as ignorant as Goonther, I'll support him and hold hope that he is just exactly the answer this team needed.

Of course, even though Vermeil wasn't my favorite choice for the position, I know that he'll never do anything that remotely resembles the moronacy of Goonther.

milkman
06-27-2001, 09:42 AM
BTW Brad,
Capers would have been my second choice at the time of Goonther's hiring.
I really wanted Art Shell.

Why hasn't he gotten another chance? He did better in TRaiderville than the Rat under similiar circumstances.

NaptownChief
06-27-2001, 10:29 AM
The Flyin' Hawaiian returns...

What lava rock you been hiding under?

I can't wait to get my Jungle Book hat back after week 1.:D

I can't believe people think we are only going to win 4 games...I guess they assume we won't win anything outside of the 4 games against the Donks and the Faiders...At least those four are locks....

RaiderCorporate
06-27-2001, 10:52 AM
Morphius:

“…it will be nice now that nobody on the Raiders Squad knows our offense and defensive coaches, and the way they like to do things.”

I read about some recording technology involving films and videotapes that allow you to review past games. This is just a guess, of course, but I’m guessing Gruden and company will review past games involving Dick Vermeil or other coaches for clues how they like to do things.


KCPHILLY:

“Of the 3 loses we've experienced we could have easily won 2 but the last one we were clearly out Coached.”

Coulda, woulda, shoulda – and didn’t. I suppose it's a matter of how you see things because I thought the Raiders should have won those games more easily (and convincingly) had they not made so many mistakes.


“BALT proved last year what I had been saying all year. Play the FAIDS in a phone booth and you shut them down.”

I agree with you other teams will attempt the same defense. What you may not be factoring in is Gruden saw what happened that day too. I expect Gruden will find a better way to deal with that defensive scheme.

I can understand why you want to trumpet Gonzalez as he was one of your few bright spots last year. I seem to recall, however, in the first game - Raiders 20, KC 17 – that Gonzalez was effective in the first half then ineffective in the second half. And in the second game - Raiders 49, KC 31 – Gonzalez’s heroics were nowhere close enough to compensate for your team’s shortcomings that day. If Gonzalez is all you can bring to the game again this year, expect many bad outcomes for your team.

donkhater
06-27-2001, 11:25 AM
Gruden saw what happened vs. San Diego as well. The Chargers shut down the Raider offense both games. Billick was smart enough (and had the personnel) to mimic that stategy.

What's Chucky going to do? Start telling Gannon to throw it vertically? Yeah, right.

KCPHILLY
06-27-2001, 10:04 PM
PINEAPPLE: Don't be miss-quoting my quotes or I'll have to road trip to that Lava wasteland you call home and show those sheep you keep out in back who the "real master" is.

Good to hear from you. Glad to see you're not spending ALL your time behind the shed. ;)

As others have stated, it doesn't take a BALT D to shut you down as the BOLTS and DONKS showed last year. The key to our success will hinge on how well our DB's are able to man cover and that could be a tall order this year... We shall see.

The JETS did show what it takes to beat that D... A strong arm. Something RICH doesn't have. I don't see WILLIAMS as a difference maker and my spies tell me PORTER has shown improvement, but not enough to be a true threat yet. I do think GARNER could make a difference for you, It will be interesting to see how much of a "team" player mentality WHEATLEY displays with his presence... Could be a problem.

I'm sure GRU is prepairing to see many versions of that scheme this year. It will be interesting to see how well he's able to make the adjustments... Should be a true test of his Coaching abilities.

stevieray
06-27-2001, 10:23 PM
John, yes I'm willing to see if DV can do his magic here...I also believe if Stoyo didn't miss that kick, and carl got a 1000 yard back, things might've turned out different. You gotta admit, he gave us Hicks, Wesley, Maz, Cat, Bartee and Dennis.

Stock and Kurt killed his chances. Gun wanted the Chiefs to win so bad, I believe it became his downfall. Inconsistant coaching produced inconsistant play.

KCPHILLY
06-27-2001, 10:29 PM
Coulda, woulda, shoulda – and didn’t. I suppose it's a matter of how you see things because I thought the Raiders should have won those games more easily (and convincingly) had they not made so many mistakes.

Pahleeease don't go there... I wasn't. I was just pointing out that neither team showed dominance in those games. Also, for every mistake the FAIDS made the CHIEFS made two.

IMO, the difference in those games was coaching. Props to CHUCKY for showing the ability to adjust and take advantage of what is given. The CHIEFS, on the other hand, had NO ONE on their sidelines displaying the same ability.

As far as GONZO, I wasn't stating he's our FAIDS savior... just pointing out the obvious. You'll see more weapons this year. And as far as the second half of games... Again, coaching. I think you'll find we have a few guys this year who actually have experience at game planning and making halftime adjustments.

TEX
06-27-2001, 10:37 PM
HB,
Good to see you back! I see that you're still honest about your boys.

My take on Gun is this. He was not head coaching material. He needed every advantage he could get his hands on. Unfortunately, he was at a disadvantage from the get go. He needed a good staff and he had total HORSE $HIT there. The Stooges did him in along with his moranic "Tuffer than you are" and "blame everyone else" approach. I wish him well, but he was in way over his head in KC. Shoot, how would anybody feel on game day if they looked around them and saw the likes of Raye, Kurt, Stock and Shaw??? Pretty SCARY if you ask me. Pure horror is more like it.:confused:

morphius
06-27-2001, 10:43 PM
RC - Big diff between video and having the playbook in front of you. Especially when you play the first game of the season against the Chiefs, not much game video at that point in the season. Of course, why let a little thing called logic get in your way :)

hawaiianboy
06-28-2001, 01:40 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by KCPHILLY
As others have stated, it doesn't take a BALT D to shut you down as the BOLTS and DONKS showed last year. The key to our success will hinge on how well our DB's are able to man cover and that could be a tall order this year... We shall see.[QUOTE]
*************

The Bolts give us fits every year.... I credit Joe Pascale (who I feel is the 2nd best D Coordinator behind Dom Capers) for coming up with innovative schemes every game... plus that **** Richard Harvey, that we cut and they signed admitted to knowing the plays.....

SD and B'More both exposed what I feel is Grudens one glaring weakness... he's stubborn to a fault... he won't go away from the power game if it isn't working..

~I disagree on the Donx... We moved the ball and scored 24 points a game on them .... 4 turnovers in each game killed us.

~IMO... the key to your team vs.us is your Dline... Wheatley looks like Jim Brown when he plays you... Your DT's weren't effective and Patton was out of position alot... I am, however looking forward to seeing Crockett on your side of the ball.... Hasty was a major pain in the Raiders *** for years... The sad thing is we all set to sign him before you did and some bright bulb decided he wasn't fast enough to play in our defense....
*************

hawaiianboy
06-28-2001, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by KCPHILLY



The JETS did show what it takes to beat that D... A strong arm. Something RICH doesn't have. I don't see WILLIAMS as a difference maker and my spies tell me PORTER has shown improvement, but not enough to be a true threat yet. I do think GARNER could make a difference for you, It will be interesting to see how much of a "team" player mentality WHEATLEY displays with his presence... Could be a problem.
**********

Actually I disagree on this one... The Jets used Ray-Ray's aggression against them.... They completed 18 passes,I believe, to their RB's.... They dragged the middle with Cherbert and made Ray-Ray chase Richie Anderson (your basic pick play).... The Jets were tearing them up till the Raisins started blitzing... and Testaverde being the retard he is went into the panic mode and started forcing the ball deep... Strong arm, weak mind...

True,Gannon does have a candy arm but the key to stopping our offense is stopping the run... The threat of the run sets Gannon up... The teams that slowed us down....SD, B'More, Pittsburgh... all pinched the middle to stop the run...
This led us to sign a guard who is an excellent run blocker (Middleton) and a TE who weighs in at 270.... We need to control the line of scrimmage to be successful...

As for Wheatley and Garner... I'm more worried about Garner not being up to sharing the load than Wheatley.... Tyrone is a team guy all the way....

This is the first offseason that I like all of the moves we made... I will admit that I'd rather not be playing in Arrowhead in game 1... hopefully VD will uphold that fine KC tradition that Gun started in using the preseason to evaluate players rather than prepare for game 1.....

hawaiianboy
06-28-2001, 02:30 AM
Originally posted by KC-CHIEFS-FAN-TX

HB,
True, it's hard to march B-more's defense, but not Denver's. Seems like the Donx have Gannon's/Oakland's number and have for quite sometime now. Do you know where Greg Robinson went? :p

Yeah crap.... Robinson went to the place where exRaider coaches go to die....

I think Robinson is a very good DC... Usually when someone gets hired... they give you the common coach speak "We're going to be an aggressive attacking defense".... Unfortunatly, only Buddy Ryan, Dom Capers, Robinson and a few others have the sack to do it as a scheme.... That type of defense leaves tweety bird hanging outside the zipper if you miss tackles... Robinson lives and dies with an aggressive defense... The Donx just didn't have the talent to play his style of defense the last few years...

I just have to wonder how your converted DE's will do at DT and if Patton, Bush, Maz are strong enough at the point of attack... Missed tackles in his scheme lead to big rushing yards allowed....leads to Wheatley doing his thing again....

hawaiianboy
06-28-2001, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by jl80
The Flyin' Hawaiian returns...

What lava rock you been hiding under?

I can't wait to get my Jungle Book hat back after week 1

....let me explain what pinhead is talking about.....

We wagered a hat on the KC- Raider game last year.... Since, of course I won, Nappy sends a lid from his alma mater Ball St. University..... Anyway, there was no space between Ball and U... so it looked like:

BALLU

and people in my gym not familar with that sad University started calling me Ballu, like the Jungle Book charecter....

I can't wait to see what I get this year.

htismaqe
06-28-2001, 07:38 AM
HB,

Nice to see you around.

I agree with your take on Garner. It's him that will probably develop the attitude problem about lack of carries, not Wheatley.

I think our defense will do much better in Robinson's scheme. Sure, missed tackles will always kill ya, but these guys looked despondent last year, dropping back into pass coverage...

morphius
06-28-2001, 08:07 AM
HB - That was some interesting stuff, it is always fun when you take off the homer hat. Of course I'm going to remember the statement about Gannon and his Candy Arm for a LONG time. I would like to add that I don't know if it is as much his arm as it is his confidence in doing it, he always seems to hesitate if the pass is any longer then 1-8 yard range, almost a double pump look to it.

I think having a different DC that does not make our LB's drop back in some sort of weak, out of position, zone will help show that our LB's are actually a pretty good group. I think if our DL stays healthy we should be able to contain your RB's, but we will have to wait and see about that.

Ballu tee-hee!

RaiderCorporate
06-28-2001, 04:05 PM
Morphius:

The game videos I have in mind are during Vermeil’s stint in St. Louis. It seems to make sense Vermeil will employ the same offense. Do you have information suggesting otherwise?

htismaqe
06-28-2001, 04:07 PM
CorporateRaider,

Actually, we do.

Everything that Al Saunders and Vermeil have said lately is that this offense will feature the TE much more and more closely resemble the original Coryell model than the Rams model. Therefore, real game film doesn't exactly exist...

morphius
06-28-2001, 04:13 PM
RC - Yes in fact I do, we don't have Faulk, so we can't rely as much on our RB's. They have talk about using a FB a lot more here because TRich has impressed them so much. Throw in the fact that we have an All Pro Gonzo, and they didn't have a TE worth using most of the time. Vermeils first trip to the SB was a smash mouth team, because that is the players he had, his next trip was a speed team, because that is the players he had. The players are different here then in his last two coaching positions, so I would expect it to be somewhat different.

Sound reasonable?