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View Full Version : My .02 on the Denver Game


Chiefnj2
11-12-2007, 08:27 PM
1. KC had momentum in the first half. If they had any offense whatsoever they could have buried Denver.

2. Priest is still a much better back than LJ. He can make something out of nothing. He can still cut at age 34 and his blocking is 10x better than LJ.

3. The pass blocking wasn't that bad for Huard.

4. Greg Wesley is still the biggest hitter on the team and may still be the best SS on the team.

5. Why isn't Sippio playing? Webb and Parker aren't getting open and making things happen. Suit someone else up and give them a chance.

6. I'm glad the Croyle era is beginning but I wasn't overly impressed. I didn't see the bad footwork that Whitlock claimed, but I wasn't that impressed with his accuracy or touch. Because of Denver's penalties he had a good dozen chances to get it in the endzone and couldn't. He didn't really come close.

BigChiefFan
11-12-2007, 08:32 PM
He's basically a rookie. Croyle drove the team down the field. Gold zone is tough, he should get better with more game time experience. The offense can't get much worse. Let's see what the kid has. Maybe he'll give Carl something to gloat about.

FAX
11-12-2007, 08:34 PM
Have patience with Croyle, Mr. Chiefnj2. It's been a while since we had a young QB.

FAX

StcChief
11-12-2007, 08:36 PM
a young QB... something new for Chiefs.....

steps in the right direction finally.

Chiefnj2
11-12-2007, 08:42 PM
Have patience with Croyle, Mr. Chiefnj2. It's been a while since we had a young QB.

FAX

I have patience. I have no problem giving him 2 years. I'm fine with it. I just read some reports that he looked "very good" and "excellent". I didn't see that.

I saw a good arm on out patterns, better mobility to avoid the rush, and a quick release. I didn't see great accuracy or touch. He likes to zip it in rather than try to throw it over a defender. Hopefully it will come. Even though the game was clearly lost I was disappointed so many people left rather than usher in the Croyle era.

FAX
11-12-2007, 08:45 PM
I have patience. I have no problem giving him 2 years. I'm fine with it. I just read some reports that he looked "very good" and "excellent". I didn't see that.

I saw a good arm on out patterns, better mobility to avoid the rush, and a quick release. I didn't see great accuracy or touch. He likes to zip it in rather than try to throw it over a defender. Hopefully it will come. Even though the game was clearly lost I was disappointed so many people left rather than usher in the Croyle era.

He threw a very nice touch pass in college. I would imagine that when you're actually on the field in the NFL, your adrenaline levels are pretty stout. The game has to slow down for him before he settles in.

FAX

NUMBER7
11-12-2007, 08:48 PM
I just watched the game tonight. I was there yesterday. I can not believe how poorly we played. The offensive line is just that...offensive...false starts...LT is the weakest link. Surtain was beat on all most every play. Once again the Chef's run defense is terrible...over 100 yards to a rookie...come on. This team has more holes that swiss cheese. After being a season ticket holder for many years I am stunned that we are this bad. The Frank Ganz area is back.

FAX
11-12-2007, 08:57 PM
1. KC had momentum in the first half. If they had any offense whatsoever they could have buried Denver.

Our offensive problems are enormous and varied, Mr. Chiefnj2. Far greater than I had anticipated when the season started. It's going to be a long road from here to respectable again. We have to invest in the oline. All the skill players in the world won't compensate for an oline that can't compete.

2. Priest is still a much better back than LJ. He can make something out of nothing. He can still cut at age 34 and his blocking is 10x better than LJ.

I think this is an interesting point. Frankly, Priest didn't put up big numbers and his average wasn't great. Based on what I heard, he did make the most out of what was there, however. It's the comparison that's fascinating. It seems as though our run game has been so bad, anything better than ugly starts looking attractive.

3. The pass blocking wasn't that bad for Huard.

I think he took a couple of sacks, though. True? Did he have time in the pocket to go through his progressions?

4. Greg Wesley is still the biggest hitter on the team and may still be the best SS on the team.

Somebody said Wesley knocked the arrowhead off his helmet at one point. We need more of that.

5. Why isn't Sippio playing? Webb and Parker aren't getting open and making things happen. Suit someone else up and give them a chance.

Good question. Why not give him a shot at some PT? Who knows what he could do when the lights are on and it's for real? Some guys play better than they practice.

FAX

KCJohnny
11-12-2007, 09:07 PM
Wesley was out there laying the wood. I don't think he's all that comfortable running Cover 2. When our slower, smarter CBs release WRs to the Safties, I always gasp because (as we saw in the 4th quarter last week) that safety is not always there (cheating up for run support).

Priest looked great for a 34-yr old guy with a crappy OL who hadn't played in 2 years playing at home against the NFL's worst rushing defense.

Hydrae
11-12-2007, 09:25 PM
The game has to slow down for him before he settles in.

Which is what has bugged me about not putting Croyle in sooner. The only way the game will slow down is by playing it.

Good question. Why not give him a shot at some PT? Who knows what he could do when the lights are on and it's for real? Some guys play better than they practice.

Absolutely and what we have been told about Sippio would lead one to think he is that kind of player. Certainly can't hurt to give him one game in Webb's place. Or put Webb in Samie's spot, I don't really care.

HemiEd
11-12-2007, 09:31 PM
The Frank Ganz area is back.

The special teams would have to make major improvements to be that good.

kcchiefsus
11-12-2007, 09:35 PM
If Wesley was the best strong safety on the team he wouldn't have been burnt on a play action that resulted in a touchdown to Daniel Graham.

kcchiefsus
11-12-2007, 09:37 PM
I just watched the game tonight. I was there yesterday. I can not believe how poorly we played. The offensive line is just that...offensive...false starts...LT is the weakest link. Surtain was beat on all most every play. Once again the Chef's run defense is terrible...over 100 yards to a rookie...come on. This team has more holes that swiss cheese. After being a season ticket holder for many years I am stunned that we are this bad. The Frank Ganz area is back.

Bullcrap. Left tackle is far from our weakest link. McIntosh doesn't get burnt near as much as Terry does at right tackle. And Terry is also usually good for at least one false start a game.

Dartgod
11-12-2007, 09:51 PM
1. KC had momentum in the first half. If they had any offense whatsoever they could have buried Denver.The turning point in the game was when we went three and out after the safety.

irishjayhawk
11-12-2007, 09:55 PM
If Wesley was the best strong safety on the team he wouldn't have been burnt on a play action that resulted in a touchdown to Daniel Graham.

Yep..

He can hit. Except the hits are few and far between. Apparently, not starting brought that mentality back.

But...

He bites on EVERY play action pass known to man. He's worse than Eric Hicks and the boot leg.

Third Eye
11-12-2007, 10:04 PM
6. I'm glad the Croyle era is beginning but I wasn't overly impressed. I didn't see the bad footwork that Whitlock claimed, but I wasn't that impressed with his accuracy or touch. Because of Denver's penalties he had a good dozen chances to get it in the endzone and couldn't. He didn't really come close.
True, but in any real game situation where we were 1st and goal from the 3, I assume we would run 3 times and not Billick it up. We were throwing against two good CB's just to get Croyle some game speed plays.

ferrarispider95
11-12-2007, 10:14 PM
I just rewatched all of Croyle's snaps. I thought he played pretty damn good, pass to Bowe for the td was just at tad too long, but champ also had a handful of jersey slowing him down.

Accurate passes, nice zip on the ball. Bad int, not sure if he thought tony was going to cut inside.

KCJohnny
11-12-2007, 10:17 PM
I just rewatched all of Croyle's snaps. I thought he played pretty damn good, pass to Bowe for the td was just at tad too long, but champ also had a handful of jersey slowing him down.

Accurate passes, nice zip on the ball. Bad int, not sure if he thought tony was going to cut inside.

A whole week of practice taking all the snaps can't hurt developing chemistry with his receivers, either.

kc rush
11-13-2007, 07:45 AM
A whole week of practice taking all the snaps can't hurt developing chemistry with his receivers, either.

Yesterday Holtus was on with KK and said that Croyle and Bowe stay after practice and work on pass plays all the the time like Manning and Harrison do. This could turn into something special (I hope so).

Chief Henry
11-13-2007, 08:05 AM
Yesterday Holtus was on with KK and said that Croyle and Bowe stay after practice and work on pass plays all the the time like Manning and Harrison do. This could turn into something special
(I hope so).


It needs to...

Chiefnj2
11-13-2007, 08:12 AM
Yep..

He can hit. Except the hits are few and far between. Apparently, not starting brought that mentality back.

But...

He bites on EVERY play action pass known to man. He's worse than Eric Hicks and the boot leg.

Sadly, Pollard seems to bite on them as well and doesn't lay the wood like Wesley does. I'm hoping something starts to click with Pollard and his play improve the final half of the season.

If anyone didn't watch the game don't be misled by Priest's stats. He ran better than the numbers indicate. He had one 14 yard loss when they tried to run it outside and the blocking was non-existant. Priest tried his best to cut it back around but to no avail. Huard even tried to throw a Trent Green like block on the play.

Pushead2
11-13-2007, 08:41 AM
I just rewatched all of Croyle's snaps. I thought he played pretty damn good, pass to Bowe for the td was just at tad too long, but champ also had a handful of jersey slowing him down.

Accurate passes, nice zip on the ball. Bad int, not sure if he thought tony was going to cut inside.

When he didn't catch that I knew right there the game was done. It took all the wind out of us.

KCChiefsFan88
11-13-2007, 09:04 AM
If Croyle had been the starter since the start of the season, he would have had 9 games under him at this point and the Chiefs could have looked forward to seeing signs of progress that comes with experience.

But the Chiefs felt it was wiser to give the snaps and experience to a 34 year old journeyman QB.

Chiefnj2
11-13-2007, 09:19 AM
My other observation that I forgot was the DL did a great job of getting in Cutler's passing lanes and batting down balls. They must have defensed about 5-6 in total.

xbarretx
11-13-2007, 09:27 AM
yep, Croyle wasnt going to start out from the gate and throw 400 yards with 5 TD;s :p but he could of looked worse. time will tell what a watch wont, and Croyle will get better

irishjayhawk
11-13-2007, 09:28 AM
Sadly, Pollard seems to bite on them as well and doesn't lay the wood like Wesley does. I'm hoping something starts to click with Pollard and his play improve the final half of the season.

If anyone didn't watch the game don't be misled by Priest's stats. He ran better than the numbers indicate. He had one 14 yard loss when they tried to run it outside and the blocking was non-existant. Priest tried his best to cut it back around but to no avail. Huard even tried to throw a Trent Green like block on the play.

I haven't seen Pollard bite on play action really. What I have seen him do is take absolutely abysmal tackling angles. One was the on Young TD run. He needs to play smarter, that's all.

Holmes definitely, in my opinion, showed up LJ in every respect. True, the 14 yard loss was bad but he at least tried to make something of it. Further, I blame the 3 straight running play calls. With our line, it's not even fair. It's almost like our coaches don't know our team very well.

irishjayhawk
11-13-2007, 09:30 AM
And on Croyle. The turning point of the game - and for him - was Bowe missing the pass that was basically on the money for the 50 yard TD. It took the wind out of our sails and we fell flat right after that.

Croyle will get used to timing and blocking. I think he just needs to be battle worn.

FAX
11-13-2007, 09:47 AM
Yesterday Holtus was on with KK and said that Croyle and Bowe stay after practice and work on pass plays all the the time like Manning and Harrison do. This could turn into something special (I hope so).

That is music to my ears, Mr. kc rush.

FAX

bkkcoh
11-13-2007, 10:00 AM
And on Croyle. The turning point of the game - and for him - was Bowe missing the pass that was basically on the money for the 50 yard TD. It took the wind out of our sails and we fell flat right after that.

Croyle will get used to timing and blocking. I think he just needs to be battle worn.


If Bowe would have had another 1/2 step on the DB, it would have been a beautiful pass. That appears to be something that Huard doesn't do very ofter at all. Brody needs to do it more frequently.

FAX
11-13-2007, 10:06 AM
I just rewatched all of Croyle's snaps. I thought he played pretty damn good, pass to Bowe for the td was just at tad too long, but champ also had a handful of jersey slowing him down.

Accurate passes, nice zip on the ball. Bad int, not sure if he thought tony was going to cut inside.

I was wondering about that, Mr. ferrarispider95. Lenny mentioned it in the radio broadcast, but Mitch didn't seem to notice and I didn't hear an uproar emanate from the game thread, so I had assumed Lenny was mixing a little too much bourbon in his coffee.

FAX

Baby Lee
11-13-2007, 10:15 AM
When he didn't catch that I knew right there the game was done. It took all the wind out of us.
Careful guys who post this thought, there'll be plenty to come around and inform you that we suck too much to deserve turning points in games

gta0012
11-13-2007, 10:17 AM
i know i want sippio :/

But i do think webb and parker are doing an OK job. But you are right they aren't creating enough seperation. Lets give him a chance.

Micjones
11-13-2007, 10:19 AM
I have patience. I have no problem giving him 2 years. I'm fine with it. I just read some reports that he looked "very good" and "excellent". I didn't see that.

2 years?
He was a Third Round pick.
You don't owe that kind of commitment to a middle round selection.

He's got 7 games to prove he deserves 1 full year.
After that you sever ties with him and move on.

Micjones
11-13-2007, 10:22 AM
When he didn't catch that I knew right there the game was done. It took all the wind out of us.

I got that sinking feeling after that play.
I was still upset several possessions later.
I KNEW we weren't going to win the game after that happened.

Bowe was surprised by a perfectly thrown ball.
He misjudged it a bit, but I don't expect that to happen much going forward.

Chiefnj2
11-13-2007, 10:31 AM
2 years?

He's got 7 games to prove he deserves 1 full year.
After that you sever ties with him and move on.

With this team and coaching staff you want to give him 7 games and if he plays poorly dump him right away?

Micjones
11-13-2007, 10:33 AM
With this team and coaching staff you want to give him 7 games and if he plays poorly dump him right away?

Yes.
7 games is enough time to determine whether or not he deserves a full year of evaluation next year.

Again...
He's a Third Round pick.
We don't owe him the same kind of commitment a team affords a #1.

I don't need to see Tom Brady...
But efficiency, toughness, and good decision-making can be shown in that span.

gblowfish
11-13-2007, 10:42 AM
I'll answer these one by one:

1. KC had momentum in the first half. If they had any offense whatsoever they could have buried Denver.

Momentum when they blocked the punt. Not scoring a first half TD killed them, and how they started the second half was abysmal.

2. Priest is still a much better back than LJ. He can make something out of nothing. He can still cut at age 34 and his blocking is 10x better than LJ.
Priest is not "much better." LJ is a young Jim Brown when on top of his game. Priest is a much better pass blocker, no doubt. But LJ will get better at that.

3. The pass blocking wasn't that bad for Huard.
Are you high?

4. Greg Wesley is still the biggest hitter on the team and may still be the best SS on the team.
Pollard is the biggest hitter for a DB on the team. Pollard's problem is he gets faked out on play action too often, and gets burned deep when he can't recover. Wesley is just where he should be, as a 2nd string safety.

5. Why isn't Sippio playing?
This ain't the arena league, bubba.

Webb and Parker aren't getting open and making things happen.
What else is new? They're your #3 and #4 guys.

Suit someone else up and give them a chance.
Yeah, like Kinneson and Bowe, for example. Bowe should be getting all the attention for a wide out, especially when defenses double cover Gonzo.

6. I'm glad the Croyle era is beginning but I wasn't overly impressed. I didn't see the bad footwork that Whitlock claimed, but I wasn't that impressed with his accuracy or touch.

Brodie is going to be up and down the rest of the year. I just hope he lives through the Indy game.

Because of Denver's penalties he had a good dozen chances to get it in the endzone and couldn't. He didn't really come close.

Yep, he sucked. But he's got a week to prepare, and a very tough place to play for his NFL debut as a starter. Let's hope he rises to the occasion, and doesn't go all Todd Blackledge on us.

FAX
11-13-2007, 10:43 AM
...But efficiency, toughness, and good decision-making can be shown in that span.

Definitely.

FAX

KCJohnny
11-13-2007, 08:16 PM
Yesterday Holtus was on with KK and said that Croyle and Bowe stay after practice and work on pass plays all the the time like Manning and Harrison do. This could turn into something special (I hope so).

That's what it takes to be the best. Actually, Manning does that with both Harrison and Wayne, so hopefully he's involving another WR as well...

gta0012
11-13-2007, 08:53 PM
That's what it takes to be the best. Actually, Manning does that with both Harrison and Wayne, so hopefully he's involving another WR as well...


thats why you always see them making these catches that make you go "how the fsdsad did he know the ball was going to be there!?"

They get used to each other and the ball becomes easy to anticipate.

Hope that pans out for us haha

Count Zarth
11-13-2007, 09:01 PM
Yesterday Holtus was on with KK and said that Croyle and Bowe stay after practice and work on pass plays all the the time like Manning and Harrison do. This could turn into something special (I hope so).

That's very cool. I could see their relationship becoming something special. The yin and yang, if you will. Croyle is a bit more grounded, Bowe is a bit more fun loving. But they are both great character guys. Bowe is always so positive when he is on the field.

OctoberFart
11-13-2007, 09:08 PM
Here is a good breakdown about DJ on the Denver game.

Derrick Johnson was out of position a lot on the inside zone cutbacks. The OLB has to play his gap and as usual he overran his consistently. This was another game where a LB has good stats but misses the point on consistency. The first run of the game KC's DL and LB's were just destroyed and DJ was way out of position.

I would also like to thank KC for keeping Greg Wesley in the game to Bite on a run play and let Graham be so wide open He has always been able to hit, but he has zero awareness during the game.

KC has very good DE's and still not much at DT. Allen and Hali are an excellent tandem, but I hope Allen leaves after the season. I gaurantee KC will Franchise him though as the only other player worth keeping on that roster just got paid in LJ.

As far as DJ's comments, they are typical of NFL players after a loss. Especially, for a player that has never reached expectations. They need to have hope even after their confidence has been shattered losing at home to a very beatable team. He needs to believe in Something, but there is not much to believe in after that.