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View Full Version : Possible big-time Offensive coordinator candidates could be available this offseason


ILChief
11-14-2007, 07:18 AM
I think Solari will be gone (or hopefully demoted back to O-line coach where he belongs). Look at who COULD be available after the season:

Brad Childress
Norv Turner
Cam Cameron
Scott Linehan
Charlie Weiss

Any of these guys would be a HUGE upgrade as all have coordinated successful offenses. While they may not be head coaching material, it would be great to have any of them calling our plays and would be great to have with our new young QB. I'm sure all of them won't get fired (Weiss and Cameron are the least likely, IMHO).

Bwana
11-14-2007, 07:23 AM
90% of the people who post on this board would be a "HUGE upgrade" to our boy Solari. I hope they make that change in the off season, even if they hire a potato to put in his position.

Rausch
11-14-2007, 07:25 AM
I'm not big on Childress because I'm not big on the WCO. I think Cameron would be perfect with the talent (Gonzo, Bowe, LJ) we have...

The Bad Guy
11-14-2007, 07:28 AM
I like Linehan a lot as an OC.

Childress won't be fired. They will bring McNabb there next year and fair pretty well.

TEX
11-14-2007, 07:30 AM
I like Linehan a lot as an OC.

Childress won't be fired. They will bring McNabb there next year and fair pretty well.

Neither will Cameron - I don't know about Turner though. Besides, it won't matter much IMO, with Herm ultimately in charge. Why does this seem to happen to Herm frequently? How many OC's has he had during his tenure as HC here and New York? :hmmm:

People forget that this idiot hired Paul Hacket and Jimmy Raye for the same staff. :shake:

Pushead2
11-14-2007, 07:31 AM
I like Linehan a lot as an OC.

Childress won't be fired. They will bring McNabb there next year and fair pretty well.

I agree, he is pretty good as a OC.

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 07:32 AM
I hate the idea of demoting Solari. At the end of the day he didn't do a great job at developing players and that is what the team needs.

As far as OC's go, Herm doesn't strike me as being secure enough for a big name OC or one that isn't ultra-conservative.

TEX
11-14-2007, 07:36 AM
I hate the idea of demoting Solari. At the end of the day he didn't do a great job at developing players and that is what the team needs.

As far as OC's go, Herm doesn't strike me as being secure enough for a big name OC or one that isn't ultra-conservative.

If it's just "demoting" him back to the O-line Coach position, I'm okay with that. If it's losing him all together I'm not. Gaining Herm was/is not worth losing Saundars and Solari. They were both very good that what they did under DV.

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 07:37 AM
If it's just "demoting" him back to the O-line Coach position, I'm okay with that. If it's losing him all together I'm not. Gaining Herm was/is not worth losing Saundars and Solari. They were both very good that what they did under DV.

Other than Waters what young players did Solari develop?

jjchieffan
11-14-2007, 07:54 AM
I wonder if Saunders will be available? And if so, would he come back here? After the way thing have gone in WA this past 2 years he could be gone, and I think he has lost his profile as a top HC candidate. His best options would be either SD or here imho.

TEX
11-14-2007, 07:58 AM
Other than Waters what young players did Solari develop?

Are you serious? He's been around for the previous 2 coaching staffs before this stint at OC. Developing players is only part of the deal. He coached the OL to make them solid. But I'll play along - How about successfully moving Tait from LT to RT? How about taking an "average" ubdersized center from the Bears, amd making him one of the best at his positions - fitting our offense perfectly. And now we can include said player by the name of Brian Waters that you mentioned. If you don't think that takes coaching - you need to think again.

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 08:01 AM
Are you serious? He's been around for the previous 2 coaching staffs before this stint at OC. Developing players is only part of the deal. He coached the OL to make them solid. But I'll play along - How about successfully moving Tait from LT to RT? How about taking an "average" ubdersized center from the Bears, amd making him one of the best at his positions - fitting our offense perfectly. And now we can include said player by the name of Brian Waters that you mentioned. If you don't think that takes coaching - you need to think again.

Tait was supposed to be a left tackle. He failed and was moved to RT. It's a demotion, not a successful move and development.

Pushead2
11-14-2007, 08:02 AM
Are you serious? He's been around for the previous 2 coaching staffs before this stint at OC. Developing players is only part of the deal. He coached the OL to make them solid. But I'll play along - How about successfully moving Tait from LT to RT? How about taking an "average" ubdersized center from the Bears, amd making him one of the best at his positions - fitting our offense perfectly. And now we can include said player by the name of Brian Waters that you mentioned. If you don't think that takes coaching - you need to think again.

I would like him to go back to O-Line coach. Our line was always a solid point, now it has gone to the shitter. ( I am aware of who we lost at the position through out the years)

Mecca
11-14-2007, 08:02 AM
Herm will hire some schmoe he can tell what to do, not some guy who knows anything or will stand up to him.

Sure-Oz
11-14-2007, 09:16 AM
Charlie Weiss likely will finish his contract

Molitoth
11-14-2007, 09:28 AM
Anyone is better then Solari. That said, Herm and Carl will keep Solari.

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 09:29 AM
Cam Cameron probably won't get fired that quickly but he would be the perfect guy to balance the uber offensive doofus that is Herman Edwards.

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 09:30 AM
Herm will hire some schmoe he can tell what to do, not some guy who knows anything or will stand up to him.
yep ... just like Marty did for years.

RustShack
11-14-2007, 09:33 AM
Get ready for Curly Dick

Deberg_1990
11-14-2007, 09:58 AM
Paul Hackett is always available.

Rausch
11-14-2007, 10:04 AM
Paul Hackett is always available.

Nuthooks...

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 10:08 AM
I want to see what Solari can do with a QB who can throw the ball down the field, like he is use to. He is also use to a dominating line, that is not likely.

I just think Huard played scared

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 10:12 AM
I want to see what Solari can do with a QB who can throw the ball down the field, like he is use to. He is also use to a dominating line, that is not likely.

I just think Huard played scared
what part of Huard playing scared had to do with his head coach telling him over and over again to protect the ball at all cost?

Bump
11-14-2007, 10:14 AM
Herm has never had a good OC has he? do you think he would have learned by now?

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 10:14 AM
what part of Huard playing scared had to do with his head coach telling him over and over again to protect the ball at all cost?

Agreed. Croyle will sling it anyway

Chris Meck
11-14-2007, 10:18 AM
I don't want a new coach, with a new scheme, and new terminology that will take two years to learn.

This one works fine, if you have the personnel. Go get the personnel.

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 10:22 AM
I don't want a new coach, with a new scheme, and new terminology that will take two years to learn.

This one works fine, if you have the personnel. Go get the personnel.

Perhaps I dozed off for a drive or two, but when has the Herm and Solari system worked "fine"??

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 10:26 AM
I wonder now if that was part of Huard's problem. He is a nice guy & a people pleaser. If Brodie is more of a gunslinger, he might have more success. Herm won't like it, but if he scores points. What can he say

Rausch
11-14-2007, 10:29 AM
Perhaps I dozed off for a drive or two, but when has the Herm and Solari system worked "fine"??

In the fourth quarter of nearly every game.

Why, I don't know, but it happens nearly every week.

I just hope Cowher doesn't take a HC job before the Herm/Peterson contracts are up...

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 10:33 AM
Agreed. Croyle will sling it anyway
the preseason results disagree ........ Croyle got scared, just like Huard.

best thing that could of happened to croyle was going to the bench and getting Herm off his back.

i fully expect Croyle to get worse the longer he stays a starter. We've been through this all before. Marty/Herm puts the squeeze on their starting QB with the constant "just don't lose the game" talk and before you know it the Quarterback starts getting timid and his game goes to complete shite.

noa
11-14-2007, 10:37 AM
Of that list, I think Norv Turner is the only one likely to get fired.

Chris Meck
11-14-2007, 10:42 AM
this is the same system that we ran '02-'05. The same thing the Rams ran during their run, the same thing Coryell ran in the '80's and the same thing Dallas ran in the early '90's. It's the offensive line that's the main problem now.

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 10:42 AM
In the fourth quarter of nearly every game.

Why, I don't know, but it happens nearly every week.

I just hope Cowher doesn't take a HC job before the Herm/Peterson contracts are up...
because in the 4th quarter of every game we are behind and have to open of the offense.

big example when we played Chicage .....


1st quarter - offense sucked

2nd quarter - we fall behind by 17 points and they open it up. 1 drives = 7 points.

3rd quarter - back to being competition ..... run,run,pass,punt.

4th quarter - we are within 7 and still sucking

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 10:44 AM
this is the same system that we ran '02-'05. The same thing the Rams ran during their run, the same thing Coryell ran in the '80's and the same thing Dallas ran in the early '90's. It's the offensive line that's the main problem now.
then how do you explain that fact that when we voluntarily get aggressive that we have seen some success?



all the sudden the offense line gets good?

FAX
11-14-2007, 10:47 AM
... Marty/Herm puts the squeeze on their starting QB with the constant "just don't lose the game" talk and before you know it the Quarterback starts getting timid and his game goes to complete shite.

That's the potential hazard we're facing, Mr. Laz, for sure. If Herm handcuffs Croyle, he's screwed and so are we.

The problem is, Herm's likely to do just that.

FAX

RedThat
11-14-2007, 10:49 AM
the preseason results disagree ........ Croyle got scared, just like Huard.

best thing that could of happened to croyle was going to the best and getting Herm off his back.

i fully expect Croyle to get worse the longer he stays a starter. We've been through this all before. Marty/Herm puts the squeeze on their starting QB with the constant "just don't lose the game" talk and before you know it the Quarterback starts getting timid and his game goes to complete shite.

I just wish we coulda drafted a QB 6 or 7 years ago when Vermeil was here!

He's the perfect coach to groom a QB. He did it with Green, and I m sure he coulda did it with a younger QB.

It woulda been perfect and ideal thing to do because the environment was awesome for offense. Young QB comes in, with a good system and good offensive line, a good offensive coach, good QB coach, etc. Think about it? If we did that, we would probably be ahead 6, 7 years in terms of quarterbacking.

Of course, this organization has to do a lot of things backwards. Draft a young QB, and develop him behind the worst offensive coaches in the game.

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 11:03 AM
With a run game, a damaged Trent Green in 8 games threw for 1342. Huard 1878 for 8 games. This year in 8 1/2 games Huard threw for 1766, no run game.

Chiefs Pantalones
11-14-2007, 11:30 AM
I'd want Weiss. He could do wonders for Croyle, IMO.

Mr. Laz
11-14-2007, 11:39 AM
With a run game, a damaged Trent Green in 8 games threw for 1342. Huard 1878 for 8 games. This year in 8 1/2 games Huard threw for 1766, no run game.
back when Herm was still trying to pretend that he wasn't changing the offense.


the offensive line loses hurt ........ but good offensive coaches can adapt.

the colts offensive line isn't any better than ours

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 11:47 AM
Is Huard's receivers about even with last year. He has no Kennison, Bowe is outstanding, but just a rookie. Samie Parker has improved. Webb :shrug:

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 11:52 AM
The highest ranking offense Herm ever had (in terms of points scored) was 15th. That was once with the Jets and last year with KC. Those hoping there is going to be some miraculous offensive production are in for a rude awakening. Even if Herm turns ship you are probably looking at a ranking between 15 and 20. Hermball.

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 11:56 AM
Pennington, Testeverde(sp?), damaged Green & Huard aren't exactly much to work with

Wile_E_Coyote
11-14-2007, 11:58 AM
The Jets drafted Pennington the year before Herm arrived, a 2nd I think. Maybe that is why he had Hackett or Raye, trying to rid him self of rag arm :)

'Hamas' Jenkins
11-14-2007, 01:55 PM
Ugh...pass.

I hate Childress. Linehan didn't look like anything special w/o Randy Moss, look at Weiss' college offenses, and Norv is still Norv.

If you put a gun to my head, I'd take Cameron, but even then, I'm not overly sold on him.

And I'm fine with demoting Solari, I'd just demote him to mop operator at Jackson County's 25 cent theater.

Chiefnj2
11-14-2007, 01:57 PM
Pennington, Testeverde(sp?), damaged Green & Huard aren't exactly much to work with

He's the head coach. Get a damn you QB if you don't like the guys you have. People give Herm every pass in the book.

FringeNC
11-14-2007, 02:44 PM
Why not just fire Herm and hire Jason Garrett as HC?

Chiefs Pantalones
11-14-2007, 05:11 PM
The whole offensive staff needs to be fired, especially the QB coach. Brodie, since day one, has had poor mechanics: throwing off the back foot, not stepping into his throws and relying too much on his arm. We need to wipe it clean and get a well-known offensive coordinator and staff in here.

BigRock
11-14-2007, 05:20 PM
I'll put $1000 on Mike Shula. He was Dungy's OC in Tampa, running those thrilling Bucs offenses, and he was Brodie's coach at Alabama.

TEX
11-14-2007, 05:24 PM
Why not just fire Herm and hire Jason Garrett as HC?

LOVE it!

ChiefsCountry
11-14-2007, 05:27 PM
I'll put $1000 on Mike Shula. He was Dungy's OC in Tampa, running those thrilling Bucs offenses, and he was Brodie's coach at Alabama.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=3689421&postcount=20

;)

Micjones
11-14-2007, 05:30 PM
Turner would be my guy.

Brock
11-14-2007, 05:32 PM
When has Herm ever had a good OC? Wake up.

Micjones
11-14-2007, 05:34 PM
It's time for change.
He looks up to Tony Dungy.
Perhaps he'll nudge him a bit and get the wheels turning.

Stranger things have happened.

TEX
11-14-2007, 05:34 PM
Tait was supposed to be a left tackle. He failed and was moved to RT. It's a demotion, not a successful move and development.

True to a point, but the switch would not have been made if we wouldn't have signed Roaf and it would not have been possible without good O-Line coaching. Tait played LT his whole career, moving to the other side meant he needed to everything opposite. Tait has NEVER looked as good as he did when he was playing RT for the Chiefs. Once again, if you don't think that took good coaching, you need to think again.

TEX
11-14-2007, 05:38 PM
When has Herm ever had a good OC? Wake up.

You're wasting your breadth - I've already tried that argument about a million times. Some people will never get it. :shake:

Herm's not gonna hire anyone who might outshine him. He doesn't want to be looking over his shoulder. How many good coaches, on either side of the ball, have ever worked under Herm and have been promoted and are working with other teams? :hmmm:

Count Zarth
11-14-2007, 06:49 PM
the colts offensive line isn't any better than ours

This is about as inaccurate a statement as I've seen on this board.

Count Zarth
11-14-2007, 06:50 PM
When has Herm ever had a good OC? Wake up.

His final year in New York he had a good one in Heimerdinger, who was the Titans OC when they went to the Super Bowl.

Heimgerdinger would be great here.

Brock
11-14-2007, 06:55 PM
His final year in New York he had a good one in Heimerdinger, who was the Titans OC when they went to the Super Bowl.

Heimgerdinger would be great here.

Not impressed.

Count Zarth
11-14-2007, 06:56 PM
What is your beef with Heimerdinger? At least he has some chops. NO ONE on this staff has skins on the wall.

Brock
11-14-2007, 07:01 PM
What is your beef with Heimerdinger? At least he has some chops. NO ONE on this staff has skins on the wall.

I don't have a "beef" with him. I just don't care about him, and I think you're wrong in stating that he was with the Titans when they went to the super bowl.

Count Zarth
11-14-2007, 07:03 PM
I think you're wrong in stating that he was with the Titans when they went to the super bowl.

ROFL

Uh, he was their offensive coordinator from 2000-2004.

You silly goose.

Brock
11-14-2007, 07:07 PM
ROFL

Uh, he was their offensive coordinator from 2000-2004.

You silly goose.

Yes, I'm aware of what years he was their OC. I also know what year they went to the Super Bowl and it isn't any of those years.

Count Zarth
11-14-2007, 07:11 PM
My bad. One year removed.

Anyway, he's a good OC...better than anyone we have.

HolyHandgernade
11-14-2007, 08:28 PM
Charlie Weiss has a 25 million dollar buyout on his contract and a top ten recruiting class. He ain't goin' nowhere next year or in the near future.

-HH

KCJohnny
11-14-2007, 09:15 PM
I'll put $1000 on Mike Shula. He was Dungy's OC in Tampa, running those thrilling Bucs offenses, and he was Brodie's coach at Alabama.

That's pretty convincing right there.

milkman
11-14-2007, 10:01 PM
True to a point, but the switch would not have been made if we wouldn't have signed Roaf and it would not have been possible without good O-Line coaching. Tait played LT his whole career, moving to the other side meant he needed to everything opposite. Tait has NEVER looked as good as he did when he was playing RT for the Chiefs. Once again, if you don't think that took good coaching, you need to think again.

When Solari came to KC, the guys that were there were already in place on the O-Line, and he didn't have any part in developing them.

As time passed and guys aged, the Chiefs hired an asst. O-Line coach that did almost all of the teaching as guys like Alt, Parker, etc. retired or moved on.

Brian Waters and Tait were developed by that asst, who Herman ****ing Edwards let go when he took over.

Solari has never actually ever developed any of these guys.

Guru
11-14-2007, 10:04 PM
I wonder if Saunders will be available? And if so, would he come back here? After the way thing have gone in WA this past 2 years he could be gone, and I think he has lost his profile as a top HC candidate. His best options would be either SD or here imho.
The ONLY way he comes back to KC is if Carl is fired.

TEX
11-15-2007, 12:41 AM
When Solari came to KC, the guys that were there were already in place on the O-Line, and he didn't have any part in developing them.

As time passed and guys aged, the Chiefs hired an asst. O-Line coach that did almost all of the teaching as guys like Alt, Parker, etc. retired or moved on.

Brian Waters and Tait were developed by that asst, who Herman ****ing Edwards let go when he took over.

Solari has never actually ever developed any of these guys.


I'm really surprised at how wrong you are here.

He's been here since '97. The guys were most certainly NOT in place when he arrived. Shoot, Roaf, Waters, Weigman, Tait weren't even on the team then!

Also, I guess that besides not helping to develop any of them (like Brian Waters) he wasn't instrumental in helping any of them (like Weigman) adjust to DV's offense? Nor did he help with Tait being moved to RT? :hmmm:

Reerun_KC
11-15-2007, 12:50 AM
You're wasting your breadth - I've already tried that argument about a million times. Some people will never get it. :shake:

Herm's not gonna hire anyone who might outshine him. He doesn't want to be looking over his shoulder. How many good coaches, on either side of the ball, have ever worked under Herm and have been promoted and are working with other teams? :hmmm:
Thread closed!

TEX nailed it...

Herm isnt going to hire anyone that will show him up... Herm is to insecure to hire a solid OC...

milkman
11-18-2007, 08:52 AM
I'm really surprised at how wrong you are here.

He's been here since '97. The guys were most certainly NOT in place when he arrived. Shoot, Roaf, Waters, Weigman, Tait weren't even on the team then!

Also, I guess that besides not helping to develop any of them (like Brian Waters) he wasn't instrumental in helping any of them (like Weigman) adjust to DV's offense? Nor did he help with Tait being moved to RT? :hmmm:

You're right.

I was terribly wrong.

John Alt retired in '96.

However, established guys like Glenn Parker, Tim Grunhard, Dave Szott and Will Shields were with the Chiefs until 2000 and beyond.

I don't know when exactly Irv Eatman joined the staff as the offensive line asst., but I believe he was with the Chiefs in that capacity for 7 seasons, which would put him there around '99, when Tait was drafted, and before Waters and Wiegman were acquired.

Solari himself acknowledged that he did very little teaching, and that Eatman was primarily responsible for that aspect.

It is still my belief that Soalri's only part in the development of any of the linemen was the blocking schemes in the game plan, while Eatman did the actual teaching.

NUMBER7
11-18-2007, 08:56 AM
The ONLY way he comes back to KC is if Carl is fired.

...and he succeeds Herm the Germ.

TEX
11-18-2007, 09:17 AM
You're right.

I was terribly wrong.

John Alt retired in '96.

However, established guys like Glenn Parker, Tim Grunhard, Dave Szott and Will Shields were with the Chiefs until 2000 and beyond.

I don't know when exactly Irv Eatman joined the staff as the offensive line asst., but I believe he was with the Chiefs in that capacity for 7 seasons, which would put him there around '99, when Tait was drafted, and before Waters and Wiegman were acquired.

Solari himself acknowledged that he did very little teaching, and that Eatman was primarily responsible for that aspect.

It is still my belief that Soalri's only part in the development of any of the linemen was the blocking schemes in the game plan, while Eatman did the actual teaching.

Now that's more like you - very informative and well thought out. I've said many times (on this thread even) that developing players is not the only thing that a coach is responsible for. Developing continuity between the O-lineman and designing blocking scheme's are a huge aspect in any game plan and should not be taken for granted. Mike was responsible for that and should get the credit he deserves.