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View Full Version : Is this the year Kellen Winslow Jr. kicks Tony Gonzalez out of the Pro Bowl?


Bowser
12-01-2007, 08:37 AM
I think it's safe to say that Antonio Gates and Gonzalez will either be playing in the Pro Bowl, or be an alternate. The question is can the Soldja from "The U" overtake Gonzalez or Gates?

Stats thus far in 2007 -

Antonio Gates - 61 rec. 833 yds 8 TDs

Tony Gonzalez - 72 rec. 878 yds 4 TDs

Kellen Winslow Jr - 65 rec 911 yds 5 TDs

blueballs
12-01-2007, 08:40 AM
HUTARD will have Tony G in a full body cast
by 4:15 sunday afternoon

milkman
12-01-2007, 08:40 AM
Not a Gonzalez fan here, but imagine the kind of numbers he might have in an offense with a QB performing at the level of Derek Anderson, and a HC and OC that have found their way out of the 60s.

CupidStunt
12-01-2007, 08:43 AM
Not a Gonzalez fan here

:spock:

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 08:44 AM
Tony G will be forced to become the starter after Winslow and Gates opt out. Just like every other NFL player does to this pointless affair.

Bowser
12-01-2007, 08:45 AM
Not a Gonzalez fan here, but imagine the kind of numbers he might have in an offense with a QB performing at the level of Derek Anderson, and a HC and OC that have found their way out of the 60s.

Mind explaining why you're not a fan of Gonzalez? I'm curious about that statement.

morphius
12-01-2007, 08:50 AM
Mind explaining why you're not a fan of Gonzalez? I'm curious about that statement.
He thinks he is taking away from Parkers catches?

Bowser
12-01-2007, 08:52 AM
He thinks he is taking away from Parkers catches?

I'm pretty pissed about that, too.

As a matter of fact, I think there was a certain mod who once adopted said Samie Parker......

morphius
12-01-2007, 08:59 AM
I'm pretty pissed about that, too.

As a matter of fact, I think there was a certain mod who once adopted said Samie Parker......
That bastard should promise not to ever ruin a player like that again.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:00 AM
Mind explaining why you're not a fan of Gonzalez? I'm curious about that statement.

I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.

Woodrow Call
12-01-2007, 09:03 AM
0 pro bowlers for the Chiefs this year.

King_Chief_Fan
12-01-2007, 09:04 AM
Herm's offense scheme keeps Gonzo out of the pro bowl.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:04 AM
0 pro bowlers for the Chiefs this year.

Jared Allen?

Bowser
12-01-2007, 09:05 AM
I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.

Damn, that's pretty harsh. I don't disagree that Gonzalez has had his share of dropping very catchable throws, but considering the teams he's played on, and the absolute lack of support that he's had from the WR position through the years, calling him overrated is not justified. He may not be a road grater as a blocker, but I'd take him in a heartbeat over the other two, based on that alone.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:09 AM
Damn, that's pretty harsh. I don't disagree that Gonzalez has had his share of dropping very catchable throws, but considering the teams he's played on, and the absolute lack of support that he's had from the WR position through the years, calling him overrated is not justified. He may not be a road grater as a blocker, but I'd take him in a heartbeat over the other two, based on that alone.

I don't really dislike Tony, I'm just somewhat ambivalent toward him.

I'm not comparing him to either Gates or Winslow Jr. here.

pr_capone
12-01-2007, 09:11 AM
0 pro bowlers for the Chiefs this year.

Jared Allen gets in..... Bowe might squeak in as well.

Bowser
12-01-2007, 09:11 AM
Jared Allen?

On that subject, JA isn't helping his cause by getting shut out the last couple of weeks. He's probably locked up an alternate spot at worst, but if he wants to start, he probably needs another big game or two. JMO.

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 09:14 AM
I just think that he's overrated.

2nd all-time in catches for a TE. 1st all-time for TDs for a TE. There is NO WAY you can spin that into being overrated...

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 09:15 AM
On that subject, JA isn't helping his cause by getting shut out the last couple of weeks. He's probably locked up an alternate spot at worst, but if he wants to start, he probably needs another big game or two. JMO.I concur.

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 09:17 AM
I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.By this rationale, ALL top TEs in the league today are overrated. Pass catching TEs are not good blockers.

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 09:19 AM
2nd all-time in catches for a TE. 1st all-time for TDs for a TE. There is NO WAY you can spin that into being overrated...

Yea, i agree. Hes not my fave player or anything, but damn, give the guy his due Milkman.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:24 AM
2nd all-time in catches for a TE. 1st all-time for TDs for a TE. There is NO WAY you can spin that into being overrated...

Yeah, he has great stats.

But that doesn't mean he's the greatest ever.

Hank Aaron was the all time HR king in baseball, but he was never as great a player as Willie Mays, or a healthy Mickey Mantle.

As much as I hate the Donkeys, Shannon Sharpe was more of a playmaker than Gonzo, and before him, so was Kellen Winslow Sr. and Ozzie Newsome.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:25 AM
Yea, i agree. Hes not my fave player or anything, but damn, give the guy his due Milkman.

I'm not saying he's not among the best, but he is not the best ever.

Mile High Mania
12-01-2007, 09:26 AM
Gonzo is the only of the 3 on a team with a losing record and he has the lowest stats among the 3... he shouldn't qualify.

Bowser
12-01-2007, 09:28 AM
I'm not saying he's not among the best, but he is not the best ever.

Who is, in your opinion? I'm curious to see what your grading curve is.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:30 AM
Who is, in your opinion? I'm curious to see what your grading curve is.

Fred Arbanas.

milkman
12-01-2007, 09:30 AM
Fred Arbanas.

J/K.

The senior Winslow.

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 09:31 AM
I'm not saying he's not among the best, but he is not the best ever.

He might get downgraded by some because hes never going to win a title.

I wont say hes the best. (that argument could last for days) but hes definately top 3.

RJ
12-01-2007, 09:37 AM
John Mackey, Kellen Winslow, Ozzie Newsome.

RNR
12-01-2007, 09:39 AM
I'm not saying he's not among the best, but he is not the best ever.
A best ever debate is always fun, that said the fact he is entered in that group says alot.

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 09:40 AM
The best things about Gonzalez is: He always puts up consistent numbers and has been relatively healthy his entire career.

TEX
12-01-2007, 09:42 AM
Gonzo is the only of the 3 on a team with a losing record and he has the lowest stats among the 3... he shouldn't qualify.

Kind of how Portis kept LT out of the Pro Bowl?

TEX
12-01-2007, 09:45 AM
Gonzo goes to the Pro Bowl because he's earned it by being at the top for a decade. The Pro Bowl is more a respect/popularity contest, not really a testamant to the best players, but Gonzo is cartainly one of the best regardless so he goes. Winslow will get his chance later.

jidar
12-01-2007, 09:59 AM
I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.


You've got to be ****ing kidding me.
How in the hell? Do you drink lead paint?

milkman
12-01-2007, 10:02 AM
You've got to be ****ing kidding me.
How in the hell? Do you drink lead paint?

Did my opinion get your panties in bunch?

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 10:07 AM
. Winslow will get his chance later.

His time is now. Its his 4th year in the league already.

Besides, he deserves to go and plays for a winning team.

kstater
12-01-2007, 10:57 AM
0 pro bowlers for the Chiefs this year.


Colquitt? How can a team MVP not make it to the pro bowl?

Mecca
12-01-2007, 11:15 AM
Colquitt? How can a team MVP not make it to the pro bowl?

Because Brian Mooreman is better than he is...

Onto the other fact at hand.....Winslow deserves to go, check out Browns games he is doing more and means more to his team than the other 2 guys...

Also just a physical talent stand point..How Gates makes it look like he's that much faster and more talented than Gonzalez, Winslow does that to Gates. That guy is phenomenal.

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 12:24 PM
Gonzo is the only of the 3 on a team with a losing record and he has the lowest stats among the 3... he shouldn't qualify.He will make it on reputation. Future HOFer.

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 12:28 PM
His time is now. Its his 4th year in the league already.

Besides, he deserves to go and plays for a winning team.This is only is 2nd full season.

stevieray
12-01-2007, 12:28 PM
Man, I sure hope so....I don't give a damn about what's he done, the sooner he's gone the better...I'm surprised he even plays, considering there are so many players that are better than him...

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 12:30 PM
Because Brian Mooreman is better than he is...

Of course. He's a not Chief, so he doesn't suck...

Demonpenz
12-01-2007, 12:35 PM
Tony has great hands, great durability, makes tough catches, bales out qbs, had some great blocks, and brought a new body type and athlete to the tight end position. He did to tight ends what lawrence taylor did to Line backers.

the Talking Can
12-01-2007, 12:36 PM
gonzo deserves it for playing with huard and solari...

RNR
12-01-2007, 12:40 PM
Tony has great hands, great durability, makes tough catches, bales out qbs, had some great blocks, and brought a new body type and athlete to the tight end position. He did to tight ends what lawrence taylor did to Line backers.
As a rival I have cussed but admired TG for years. I consider him among the best that has ever played the position. That said the above statement IMO is a bit of a reach.

Mecca
12-01-2007, 12:49 PM
Of course. He's a not Chief, so he doesn't suck...

Mooreman is the best punter in the NFL...there's no shame in not being as good as he is.

Mile High Mania
12-01-2007, 01:15 PM
The original argument was pro bowl for this season... the pro bowl is a joke and has been for a while, lots of guys get in on name alone. Could Tony do that? Sure, but he's not the best TE this season... he is close in stats, but he's #3.

Bowser
12-01-2007, 01:18 PM
Because Brian Mooreman is better than he is...

Onto the other fact at hand.....Winslow deserves to go, check out Browns games he is doing more and means more to his team than the other 2 guys...

Also just a physical talent stand point..How Gates makes it look like he's that much faster and more talented than Gonzalez, Winslow does that to Gates. That guy is phenomenal.

Switch out Winslow and Gonzalez. How well does Winslow do on this Chiefs team? I doubt if he would have even had 40 catches to this point.

Mile High Mania
12-01-2007, 01:19 PM
Switch out Winslow and Gonzalez. How well does Winslow do on this Chiefs team? I doubt if he would have even had 40 catches to this point.

These games are always fun... fact is, KW is not a Chief and TG is not a Brown this season. Not getting into the pro bowl isn't a big deal, a lot of guys that do get in actually back out anyway.

The Browns sucked last year and KW had 89 receptions, 800+ yards and 3 TDs...

Bowser
12-01-2007, 01:21 PM
These games are always fun... fact is, KW is not a Chief and TG is not a Brown this season. Not getting into the pro bowl isn't a big deal, a lot of guys that do get in actually back out anyway.

[/obvious]

The point I'm trying to make is that Winslow is surrounded by better talent on his offense than Tony is in his, and therefore has more opportunities not being the focal point of opposing defenses.

Tony deserves every accolade thrown his way.

Mile High Mania
12-01-2007, 01:23 PM
[/obvious]

The point I'm trying to make is that Winslow is surrounded by better talent on his offense than Tony is in his, and therefore has more opportunities not being the focal point of opposing defenses.

Tony deserves every accolade thrown his way.

I see the point, but that's why I referenced KW and 2006. That comment about CLE having better offensive talent has to give you crazy head syndrome.

percysnow
12-01-2007, 01:26 PM
I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.


wow . . just wow. . he's had a couple of drops here and there like any human being would , ,but has also made catches that no other tightend would ever make .. overrated .. lol. . with the lack of recievers we have defenses game plan against him . ur statement are so stupid. . i cant even argue them. .

Bowser
12-01-2007, 01:48 PM
That comment about CLE having better offensive talent has to give you crazy head syndrome.

You have no idea. :shake:

JBucc
12-01-2007, 01:52 PM
The Pro Bowl is irrelevant now that you have fans voting. It's even more a popularity contest than it already was. If they continue allowing fans to vote the pro bowl needs to be taken out of consideration for HOF candidates in the future.

Braincase
12-01-2007, 02:50 PM
Good thread. Solid reminder that some of our offensive players have bonus' on the line.I wonder how much Tony G has on the line every year for performance bonus? Or Brian Waters for that matter?

Short Leash Hootie
12-01-2007, 03:20 PM
I just think that he's overrated.

He's never been as fast as some think he was, and his blocking, while adequate, has never been as great as some seem to believe it is, and he's dropped a lot of catchable balls over the years.

Not as many as Samie, but enough to make me question why everyone has always thought he had these great hands.

I have a propensity to dislike players that I think have been overrated by fans and media.
have you seen his play the last two years? Absolutely unbelievable. He may not have the stats but he is STILL far and away the best TE in the NFL.

Short Leash Hootie
12-01-2007, 03:22 PM
Because Brian Mooreman is better than he is...

Onto the other fact at hand.....Winslow deserves to go, check out Browns games he is doing more and means more to his team than the other 2 guys...

Also just a physical talent stand point..How Gates makes it look like he's that much faster and more talented than Gonzalez, Winslow does that to Gates. That guy is phenomenal.
What do you know...

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:22 PM
have you seen his play the last two years? Absolutely unbelievable. He may not have the stats but he is STILL far and away the best TE in the NFL.

I assume you are talking about TG, I haven't read the entire thread.

You couldn't be further from the truth. He MAY, and I stress MAY, still be the best TE in the NFL, but he is no where near "far and away" from Antonio Gates.

And to all those who say Gates cant block, you are wrong. You are just assuming that.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:27 PM
Gates doesn't even get raped coming off the line...it's disgusting. He doesn't get near the attention Tony does. Hell, the Ravens left him WIDE OPEN, NO ONE COVERING HIM AT ALL last week.

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:29 PM
Gates doesn't even get raped coming off the line...it's disgusting. He doesn't get near the attention Tony does. Hell, the Ravens left him WIDE OPEN, NO ONE COVERING HIM AT ALL last week.
You are a ****ing moron.

They didn't leave him wide open. He got wide open.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:32 PM
You are a ****ing moron.

No, I see Tony getting raped, every game. It's almost impossible for him to get off the line sometimes. It never gets called.

Gates? Not even close.

I don't think Gates jumping ability is near as good as Tony's, either, even at 31. Tony has made some rare air this year reaching up for Huard's high throws. Gates is definitely faster and more agile, but I think Tony has him beat everywhere else.


They didn't leave him wide open. He got wide open.

I was talking about one play. One of his touchdowns. He was so wide open it was like they just forgot he was on the field. Manumalenua would have scored on that pattern.

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:33 PM
No, I see Tony getting raped, every game. It's almost impossible for him to get off the line sometimes. It never gets called.

Gates? Not even close.

I don't think Gates jumping ability is near as good as Tony's, either, even at 31. Tony has made some rare air this year reaching up for Huard's high throws. Gates is definitely faster and more agile, but I think Tony has him beat everywhere else.

Okay, well you dont watch all the Chargers games dude. Gates is always covered by a LB and a Safety. Watch this week, you'll see.

Gates specialty is catching the High Ball. All Rivers needs to do is throw it up and Gates will go up and get it. Ask Champ Bailey.

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:34 PM
No, I see Tony getting raped, every game. It's almost impossible for him to get off the line sometimes. It never gets called.

Gates? Not even close.

I don't think Gates jumping ability is near as good as Tony's, either, even at 31. Tony has made some rare air this year reaching up for Huard's high throws. Gates is definitely faster and more agile, but I think Tony has him beat everywhere else.



I was talking about one play. One of his touchdowns. He was so wide open it was like they just forgot he was on the field. Manumalenua would have scored on that pattern.

Ok. One time I saw a play where TG was wide open...THEY DIDNT EVEN COVER HIM!!! Wheres your logic now?

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:37 PM
Ok. One time I saw a play where TG was wide open...THEY DIDNT EVEN COVER HIM!!! Wheres your logic now?

Uh, by 20 yards? When? What game? I don't remember it. Certainly not this year.

Deberg_1990
12-01-2007, 03:38 PM
You are a ****ing moron.



5000+ posts and you just now realized this? Just ignore GoTurd like the rest of us Chiefs fans do.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:38 PM
Gates is always covered by a LB and a Safety.
.

That's simply not true.

Last week, on one play, NO ONE COVERED HIM.

And the clown shoes he put on Ray Lewis were hilarious... ROFL

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:39 PM
Uh, by 20 yards? When? What game? I don't remember it. Certainly not this year.

It was back in 99, remember?

Anyways. TG is a beast, so is Gates. However, you definitely have your homer goggles on in this argument.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:41 PM
It was back in 99, remember?

LOL. Whatever.


Anyways. TG is a beast, so is Gates. However, you definitely have your homer goggles on in this argument.

I don't think so.

When you factor in that Gates has had more consistency at the QB position, more talent around him and better offensive coaches over the last two seasons, I don't think there's any argument in his favor.

Definitely faster and more athletic, though.

Did I mention that Gates will never break Tony's records?

:evil:

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:49 PM
LOL. Whatever.



I don't think so.

When you factor in that Gates has had more consistency at the QB position, more talent around him and better offensive coaches over the last two seasons, I don't think there's any argument in his favor.

Definitely faster and more athletic, though.

Did I mention that Gates will never break Tony's records?

:evil:

Sig bet? I don't know how long it will take, and if we will both still be around here, but if we are, I will bet you he breaks the Yards and TD record.

Buck
12-01-2007, 03:51 PM
Gates: 325 REC | 4212 YARDS | 42 TDS

Gonzalez: 783 REC | 9448 YARDS | 65 TDS

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 03:55 PM
Gonzalez is still playing. That's Gates' only problem. In three years Tony will probably have 12,000 yards and 80 TD. Then he'll retire.

By then, Gates will be 30.

Gates won't sniff TG's records.

Buck
12-01-2007, 04:02 PM
Gonzalez is still playing. That's Gates' only problem. In three years Tony will probably have 12,000 yards and 80 TD. Then he'll retire.

By then, Gates will be 30.

Gates won't sniff TG's records.

You think TG will get 2500 more yards and 20 more TDs in his career?

Thats a stretch, but I guess its possible. I don't see him getting it, but if you guys get some consistency at your QB position for his last few years then maybe.

As for Gates, I think he will continue to get at least 10 TDs per year for the next 5 years at least. Rivers will be our QB the whole time and they will only get better with each other.

Gates getting more yards than TG will be difficult, but the TDs I see happening no problem.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 04:04 PM
You think TG will get 2500 more yards and 20 more TDs in his career?

I think he has 50 games left in him, yeah. That's not a stretch at all.

Bowser
12-01-2007, 04:05 PM
Gates will one day have the TD mark. Sucks to say, but it will happen.

They're both great players, but I still wouldn't trade Gonzalez for Gates.

Buck
12-01-2007, 04:07 PM
I think he has 50 games left in him, yeah. That's not a stretch at all.

Good point.

Did TG play College Football? What about HS?

I dont know if it makes a difference, but Gates only played 1 year of HS Football and no College Football. He is more fresh. I dont think that basketball takes as much out of you as football does, but then again, I've never played Basketball, so I don't know.

Braincase
12-01-2007, 04:14 PM
I think he has 50 games left in him, yeah. That's not a stretch at all.

With this offense? Bwahahahahahahaha! ROFL

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 04:15 PM
Gates will have the TD and maybe the yards, but he won't come close the the receptions record.

Demonpenz
12-01-2007, 04:15 PM
I don't like to project peoples stats. NFL is too voilent and getting worse with ever field turf and dome they put in.

Braincase
12-01-2007, 04:15 PM
Sig bet? I don't know how long it will take, and if we will both still be around here, but if we are, I will bet you he breaks the Yards and TD record.

He thinks our server will still be up. ROFL

richpjr
12-01-2007, 04:16 PM
Gates: 325 REC | 4212 YARDS | 42 TDS

Gonzalez: 783 REC | 9448 YARDS | 65 TDS

Gonzalez has played in 169 games. Gates has played in 72 games.

If you extrapolate Gates numbers out over the same number of games as TG has played, he'd have 760 catches, 9856 yards and 98 TDs. The catches and receiving yards are virtually identical, but Gates would have a hefty lead in TD receptions. Of course, Gates would have to stay healthy over a long time to hit those numbers.

I think all 3 are superb TEs and you could make an argument for each of them, but I think based on what they have done in the past that TG and Gates will get in. I'm not sure how people feel about Winslow and his mouth across the league, so that could hurt him.

Bill S Preston
12-01-2007, 04:22 PM
LOL. Whatever.



I don't think so.

When you factor in that Gates has had more consistency at the QB position, more talent around him and better offensive coaches over the last two seasons, I don't think there's any argument in his favor.

Definitely faster and more athletic, though.

Did I mention that Gates will never break Tony's records?

:evil:



Compare Gonzalez's numbers in the DV years to Gates' numbers now. Gates is only in his fifth year, fourth year starting, and he already has more than half of Gonzales' touchdowns. Tony G is a great player and a future HOF, but Gates has surpassed him. He is still learning the game, and will only get better over time.

In regards to the question. I think that Gates and Gonzales get in. Winslow is not known enough around the league, and that will hurt him.

Count Zarth
12-01-2007, 04:23 PM
Gonzalez has played in 169 games. Gates has played in 72 games.

If you extrapolate Gates numbers out over the same number of games as TG has played, he'd have 760 catches, 9856 yards and 98 TDs.

You absolutely can't do that, though. That's just insane. I mean, if every player who was great at the start of his career kept it up consistently, the Hall of Fame would be shunning guys with incredible numbers left and right. That just doesn't happen.

I'd like to know what Gates' work ethic is like. That's what truly made Tony great.

BigMeatballDave
12-01-2007, 04:23 PM
If you extrapolate Gates numbers out over the same number of games as TG has played, he'd have 760 catches, 9856 yards and 98 TDs. Nice!

Bill S Preston
12-01-2007, 04:27 PM
You absolutely can't do that, though. That's just insane. I mean, if every player who was great at the start of his career kept it up consistently, the Hall of Fame would be shunning guys with incredible numbers left and right. That just doesn't happen.

I'd like to know what Gates' work ethic is like. That's what truly made Tony great.



I agree that it is pointless to try and figure out someones numbers five years down the road. Coaches change, rules change, no one knows what can happen five years down the road. In regards to your second question, I'm a homer so I can't answer it rationally. But I will say that Gates went from never playing college football, to NFL all star in a short period of time. One doesn't do that without work ethic.

richpjr
12-01-2007, 04:53 PM
I don't think you get to where TG and Gates are without having a strong work ethic. I think the real thing separating the guys who end up with the records is how long they play and can they avoid injury. Winslow probably won't be able to play long enough to challenge because of his previous problems with his knees - I don't think they hold up.

percysnow
12-02-2007, 01:18 PM
TG. . .

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 02:19 PM
Gates got OWNED by Jarrad Page today. Eat shit, Cro.

Buck
12-02-2007, 02:20 PM
Gates got OWNED by Jarrad Page today. Eat shit, Cro.
You ****ing moron. Did you see Gates wide open all day because nobody was on him? No, you didn't eat cro, dipshit.

Also, did you happen to see Gates Key blocks today? Im guessing you didn't. Im almost considering downloading CPiggy because of your monkey ass.

Mecca
12-02-2007, 02:21 PM
I just wonder if people still would rather have Hali than Cromartie...

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 02:21 PM
You ****ing moron. Did you see Gates wide open all day because nobody was on him? No, you didn't eat cro, dipshit.


Uh, whatever. Gates got OWNED.

COMPLETELY shut down.

Fruit Ninja
12-02-2007, 02:23 PM
To bad we still got our asses handed to us again at home.

Buck
12-02-2007, 02:23 PM
Uh, whatever. Gates got OWNED.

COMPLETELY shut down.
Yes he was shut down. But that doesn't prove any of the points you were trying to make last night.

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 02:25 PM
Yes he was shut down. But that doesn't prove any of the points you were trying to make last night.

Sure it does. Gates couldn't find a way to get open. Page owned his sorry ass.

I did notice the Chiefs left Manumaleuna wide the **** open on one play, though. Kind of like what happened to Gates last week? Pretty easy to get open when the defense IGNORES YOU.

Buck
12-02-2007, 02:31 PM
Sure it does. Gates couldn't find a way to get open. Page owned his sorry ass.

I did notice the Chiefs left Manumaleuna wide the **** open on one play, though. Kind of like what happened to Gates last week? Pretty easy to get open when the defense IGNORES YOU.
Suck my cock bro.

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 02:33 PM
Antonio Gates ain't got SHIT on Tony Gonzalez.

Buck
12-02-2007, 02:34 PM
Antonio Gates ain't got SHIT on Tony Gonzalez.
TG dominated a very subpar pass D today.

XXXshogunXXX
12-02-2007, 02:46 PM
Gates was covered by 8 chiefs....tomlinson...none.

Rain Man
12-02-2007, 03:57 PM
Anyone who wouldn't say that Gonzalez is the best in the league really needs to watch that one catch in the (second?) quarter where he went up, caught the ball, and wrought havoc as little Chargers were bouncing off of him like bullets off Super.man.

Gonzalez has it all - hands, the ability to get open, blocking ability, durability, and production. I'd like to see him be the centerpiece of our offense for a year, just to see what happens.

Bowser
12-02-2007, 04:34 PM
Today's stats:

Tony Gonzalez - 10 rec 140 yds

Antonio Gates - 1 rec -1 yd

Kellen Winslow Jr - 1 rec 14 yds

Sure-Oz
12-02-2007, 04:38 PM
TG dominated a very subpar pass D today.
Right cause the chiefs pass defense is excellent, manure got open more than gates

Buck
12-02-2007, 04:39 PM
Right cause the chiefs pass defense is excellent, manure got open more than gates
Yeah and Gates was well covered, which meant LT had room to run today, thats how it works.

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 04:41 PM
Seriously, today's game just confirmed it. Gates is just a big wide receiver. Tony Gonzalez is a real tight end.

Count Zarth
12-02-2007, 04:42 PM
Yeah and Gates was well covered, which meant LT had room to run today, thats how it works.

That's really dumb analysis on your part. LT had room to run because our defensive line got it's ass kicked and Napoleon Harris sucks. Not because of Gates.

XXXshogunXXX
12-02-2007, 04:59 PM
no..no... as this has been debated before...Gates is still better.

And like it has been historically debated before, tomlinson is still better than LJ. tomlinson 177 yards 2 TDs. LJ...none.

Bowser
12-02-2007, 05:06 PM
no..no... as this has been debated before...Gates is still better.



Oh, OK. I guess that settles it.

STFU

'Hamas' Jenkins
12-02-2007, 05:17 PM
Winslow just made a phenomenal, would be game winning catch for Cle. He was pushed out, but it wasn't ruled as such on the field. Az wins.

Chief Faithful
12-02-2007, 05:17 PM
no..no... as this has been debated before...Gates is still better.

As a TE Gates never was nor is better. Have you ever really watched Gates block? He is one of the worst TE's in the NFL on the line. Gates is a slot received called a TE. Receiving is the only thing Gates can do that is close to equal to TG, but TG still shines above.

BigMeatballDave
12-02-2007, 05:19 PM
Winslow just made a phenomenal, would be game winning catch for Cle. He was pushed out, but it wasn't ruled as such on the field. Az wins.I saw that. Cleveland got hosed. Obvious push-out.

XXXshogunXXX
12-02-2007, 05:32 PM
As a TE Gates never was nor is better. Have you ever really watched Gates block? He is one of the worst TE's in the NFL on the line. Gates is a slot received called a TE. Receiving is the only thing Gates can do that is close to equal to TG, but TG still shines above.


ehh..yes I have seen Gates block, and he isnt bad. The way you compare the two blocking, you make it sound TG is the best blocker in the universe. Ive seen Gates in pass and run blocking, and he's solid. You should really watch him block instead of throwing out blanket statements like that. He bas been lined up as a pure FB blocking in some situations and has taken out his defenders in that role. When Gates was first called in his rookie year, he was inserted as a blocker. Then he started catching like a ninja.