View Full Version : Tell me about Grbac
07-22-2001, 10:40 PM
OK, I've tried to give you a little insight on Priest Holmes, now please tell me about what it will be like with Elvis in the house.
07-22-2001, 11:05 PM
It's hard to get an objective opinion about Grbac around here; you have your Grbackers and your Grbashers. I'm one of the latter. I just don't like the guy and I think he is overrated.
That being said, I'll try to be as objective as possible. Grbac has all the physical tools to be an exceptional NFL QB. Grbac has none of the mental or intangible tools to be an exceptional NFL QB.
You can't coach physicality, but you can coach the mental aspect of the game. Grbac had a horrible coaching staff here in KC, and I think that maybe Billick might be able to get inside his head a little bit and straighten him out. If not, I'm sure Billick will slap a leash on him so quick that it will make Dilfer look like a gunslinger.
Grbac never really had a chance here in KC. The only people who wanted him in town were Carl Peterson (who me? admit a mistake????) and Chiefs loyalists who would support anyone who was behind center. Everyone else thought that Rich Gannon should of been the QB--many still do. It sucks being a teams QB and have to live in the shadow of your backup.
Grbac didn't do much to endear himself to the city or his teammates. He was always critical of the city and the players--blaming them for things in the media. Last year, as much as I hate to admit it, he was a little better with the media.
I think he'll do fine in Baltimore, but he won't put up the numbers like he did last year (wont' have to). Given Baltimore's propensity for tight games, I can't help but to think that Grbac will lose a game or two for you with one of his mental blunders. He just doesn't do well in clutch situations. That said, when there is no pressure, he will throw some amazing passes.
All in all, he has a running back which should take some of the pressure off of him. As long as your O line gives him plenty of time to throw you'll do alright. I think the Ravens in the playoffs are a given, but beyond that, I don't know....I just don't have a lot of faith in your new QB.
keg in kc
07-22-2001, 11:18 PM
Just as fair warning, you've opened a whole can of worms asking that question here. I'm not sure how much you know/don't know about the Chiefs, but basically Kansas City is known for castigating their quarterback, no matter who he is (Montana is a possible exception...). Grbac is no different. Basically the fans here were broken into two camps (for ease of discussion): Grbackers and Grbashers. There's a lot of history behind it, but suffice to say, Elvis was not one of the more popular figures in KC sports, and you might well get some answers that reflect that, but don't explain why. Furthermore, the way he left here hasn't endeared him to anyone, including his most ardent supporters.
Okay, all that said, here's what I think you'll see over the next year (I was a Grbac supporter).
1) He's streaky. He'll have a few weeks where he'll throw very high %, 2-3 TDs per game and virtually no ints. Then he'll have a few weeks where he's not so good.
2) He'll "lock" on a receiver. When he's in trouble he'll throw to this guy 80% of the time, regardless of coverage. My guess is Shannon Sharpe, but it could be a receiver, as well. He likes throwing to backs (hopefully Lewis has worked on his hands or you pick up a vet 3rd down back...).
3) He'll force balls into double and triple coverage. Just something he does. He can throw a very tight and accurate ball, and has the strength and confidence to throw it anywhere on the field, but sometimes he gets greedy and throws passes he shouldn't.
4) He won't always perform well under pressure, but he can win a game for you.
5) He'll give up an interception or two and feign an injury. It's just something he does. Expect it...
6) He won't run very much, and when he does, it won't be pretty.
Other than that, I'm not sure what to say. I do think he's a clear improvement over Trent Dilfer and/or Tony Banks, but there will be times he'll just leave you shaking your head. He should play well for you, but I wouldn't fool yourself into thinking you have a great quarterback. He's above average, and one of the top 10 in the league, in my opinion, but I think that's as much a reflection on the state of the QB position in the NFL right now as it is a vote of confidence in Grbac. He has developed over the last couple of years though, and done some good things while cutting back on his mistakes, but he'll need to further improve to move from an "above average" QB to a "good" QB.
The last thing you'd better hope for is that he's learned from his mistakes with the media and the fans. He basically got himself into trouble here by saying some things that weren't exactly wise, and people here have a long memory. If he can keep his foot out of his mouth, though, and continue to play up to his ability while not folding under pressure, you guys will be fine at QB for the next year or two.
07-22-2001, 11:20 PM
Grbac will be fine as long as you donít put him in a situation where he has to win the game for you. Heís no Joe Montana or John Elway by any means.
Heís a QB that wonít lose the game for you, but he wonít win it either.
Elvis in a nutshell.
07-22-2001, 11:35 PM
Welcome to the board!
Without going into an extended rant on the subject, I will do my best to give an honest and non-biased opinion of your new QB.
Excellent play action fake - He has one of the best, if not the best, fakes in the league. His is even better than Manning's in my opinion.
Strong arm - Elvis has a cannon for an arm and throw deep with the best of them. In a gametime situation, this is where you will find the biggest difference between Elvis and Dilfer.
Still Improving - Elvis made tremendous strides during his tenure in KC. Even though he still had his share of mental blunders, it is safe to say that his best football is ahead of him. He will probably be another late bloomer like Testaverde and Gannon.
Intelligence (or lack thereof) - Elvis is not exactly the brightest bulb in the box and he will make crucial mistakes in pressure situations. Don't make him think on his feet and don't put him in a situation where he has to execute a 2-minute drill to win a game.
Lack of Touch - Elvis does very poorly on any pass that requires touch our timing. He throws behind his receivers on shorter routes, and does not possess the ability to operate in a precision offense. Tony Gonzalez and Derrick Alexander were the ones that made Elvis look good and not vice versa.
Lack of Leadership Ability - Elvis was not liked by the fans or by many of his teammates. Not too many people were hurt to see him go even though quite a few began to support for him last season. I supported Elvis because he was the Chiefs QB, not because I liked him.
Lack of Heart - You will learn very quickly that even if Elvis gives 150% of himself, he would be lucky to have half the heart that Dilfer had. The fans will pick up on that very quickly.
There's my $.02 on the subject, and I'm glad that you decided to join us.
07-22-2001, 11:53 PM
Like Fat Elvis said, it's hard to get an objective opinion on him one way or another. Here's my take. He has gotten better every year. He throws a very nice ball downfield. He is not as patient in the pocket as he should be, some of that is just him, and some of that is his coaches telling him to not stand there and take punishment in order to stay healthy. It'll be interesting to see what Billick does with him in this regard. For a big guy he has nifty footwork and many times can spin around and avoid a defender. Of course he's not much of a scrambler. And if there is one real weakness in his game, he isn't very good throwing on the run. But if given time he can pick you apart. He's also good with the play action pass, and I think Billick would be wise to use that aspect of his game with the RB you guys have. If you remember the game we played against you guys in 2000 I believe it was, Elvis used the play action to perfection. As a leader, he's the quiet individual type, so he's not the fiery Marino/Elway type that you'll see on the field and on the sidelines. That's just a part of his personality. But it shouldn't be such a big deal in BMore, since guys like Sharpe and Lewis can pick up that slack. I think bottom line is that you guys are getting a guy who is now in his prime and has a few pro bowls in him if his weapons are good enough. He takes a lot of heat for his crunch time play, but the truth is he's had his good moments and his bad, and the bad always overshadows the good. He's no Brett Favre, but I do think he's better than Brad Johnson, and perhaps with Billick he can continue to get better.
Good luck, and once again thanks for crushing Alice Davis and the Raiders...
Elvis throws to his "hot" reciever almost every time. His reads are slow so he seems to wait untill that reciever gets open. If he feels pressure, he will do one of two things.
1. He will force an errent ball into coverage.
He does this a lot. But he is an accurate passer, and if your reciever can muscle the ball or make acrobatic catches, you may get a few of em like we did.
2. He rolls to the right and while he is running he actually looks off recievers. This is when Elvis looks "pro bowl." He is excellent throwing on the run and did this often after a play action pass last year. It looks like he just quits thinking about it, and when the recievers start to cut back, he will hit them. Also, it gives him a set time to find someone. When he gets to the sideline, he throws it away if he still hasn't found someone. (With the exception of one time he stepped out of bounds about 9 yards behind the LOS. It didn't go over well.)
Of course, the third possibility is he will stand there like a dumb a** and get sacked. If he doesn't roll to his right or find someone quick, he looks TERRIBLE in the pocket. He will do this spin move thing and get pummeled. That being said, he doesn't take hits very well, albeit better since he gained weight, but he still stands too upright when taking a shot, and he tends to get banged up.
The two minute knock on Elvis might be cleared up under a better system. So you can't judge too harshly on that. I think, he got worse at the two minute drill when Gunther came in. I don't think that's just a coincidance.
His biggest problem is his inablity to read the safety or linebackers when throwing an out. He will throw right to a defensive back he doesn't see, and about 3 or 4 times a year, someone will get an easy pick And as you know those out routes, when picked, can easily be returned for touchdowns. And last year, at least, they usually were.
07-23-2001, 08:17 AM
I agree with most of what has been said on this thread. He has improved more than most people thought he would over the last 2 seasons. Before that, due to QB controversies, injuries and lack of mental fortitude he was very inconsistent. During last season he really started to go to his 2nd, 3rd and 4th reads with some regularity, for the first time. I even remember him pump-faking a few times :eek: :p. He's a decent QB who will hit the long bomb several times for you and should make a big difference to your team this season. If you don't win another SB, I doubt it will be Grbac's fault.
It will be interesting to see how Billick works with Grbac's 2-minute offense, as this is the single biggest on-field weakness that he still has. He forced fewer balls into tight coverage last season IMO, but did so in some games where he had to carry the entire offense. Some of those were mistakes, trying to make something happen, but others would have been done by anybody.
If anything leads to his demise in Baltimore, it will be the lack of leadership that he exhibits, and the lack of comraderie between him and his team-mates. If Redman develops as planned, and the team doesn't rally around Grbac (few people do!), I can see Balt letting him go after one season (his contract is very well structured from that stand-point, as I understand).
07-23-2001, 08:41 AM
Wow, you guys really know how to talk FOOTBALL over here! We Raven Maniacs usually just get alot of emotional BS from Cleveland fans.
Thanks much for all the well thought comments on Elvis.
Best of luck to your Chiefs and Priest Holmes- I'm telling you again, I really think you're gonna fall in LOVE with this guy.
As long as the Defense keeps it close and your pass protection holds up, Grbac will be a fine QB. His read is very slow [at least it was when he was here], so he needs play action or a great OL to give him time to go through his reads.
Yes, he will occasionally throw it into coverage. With the Raven's D, you can afford an INT or two.
Yes, he will "zero in" on one receiver. Fortunately, you have Sharpe as his security blanket. Sharpe will get lots of catches this season.
Grbac should do well in Baltimore. The Defense will keep him from having to play "catch up" and you have a legitimate RB to back up Grbac's nice play fake.
In the Dilfer/Grbac replacement, you exchanged a genuinely nice guy for a slightly more accurate arm and good play fake.
It was a good move, IMO.
Expecting a good season from Grbac.
07-23-2001, 09:00 AM
Pound for pound, Grbac is a better player than Dilfer. He has a very good arm, throws a beautiful long ball, does play action really well and has all the physical gifts you look for in a QB.
Here are the problems:
1. He gets confused very easily
2. He wont win games for you
3. He zero's in on his favortive receiver, regardless of how many guys are on him
4. He wont have Gonzalez anymore
5. He crumbles in high profile, high pressured games
6. He likes to point the finger elsewhere when things go bad
7. He is injury prone
8. He wont stick his head down and drive for that extra inch when needed.
9. He has made my all-ugly team for three straight years. So has Shannon Sharpe.
If you are looking for a guy who plays "not to lose" better than Trent Dilfer, Grbac isnt that guy.
He will find ways to lose close games.
I predict that he wont win a playoff game with Baltimore this year.
07-23-2001, 09:30 AM
He looks like Butthead, plays like Butthead, and his cadence under center sounds like Butthead;
07-23-2001, 09:49 AM
Post 7 and 9 pretty much echo my thoughts. Too bad you can't trade EG's arm for Dilfer's, and keep the rest of TD. As far as I'm concerned, the first time EG does a "Grb-ism" with his mouth. the OL should not block on the first couple of pass plays the next offensive series. Might keep him in line...........
Clint in Wichita
07-23-2001, 10:08 AM
There's no way that Grbac is better than Dilfer in any way. EG's not more accurate, stronger, faster, or more intelligent. Grbac WILL, however, make costly mistakes that costs his team games they otherwise would've won. Baltimore would not have won the SB last year with Grbac st the helm IMO.
You want the story on Grbac? You can check out his entire childhood on reruns of a TV series called "Life Goes On". They changed Elvis' name to Corky for the series, but the resemblance is readily apparent.
I disagree with part of what Clint said. I believe that Grbac has better QB SKILLS than Dilfer, however, he is NOT even close to being PHYSICALLY or MENTALLY TOUGH as Trent. He is also NOT the leader that Dilfer was nor will he be as well liked by his teamates. I further believe that once Grbac gets repeatedly BLITZED, his skills go by the wayside and his QB INSTINCTS take over...this is a BAD THING. The thing he does have is a very nice PLAY - ACTION move and good touch on the long ball. In B-more he'll have a running game so the play-action should really help out there. BEWARE if you're in a close game and you absolutely need Grbac to come through for you...you will be most likely become very disappointed. Grbac is about the WORST CLUTCH PERFORMER there is. :eek:
07-23-2001, 09:52 PM
This is from a womens point of view, but sometimes I don't do to bad.:)
I never was an Elvis fan until last year. I didn't really say anything but in my heart just couldn't root for the guy. I have a friend that was in KC that worked out with some of the Chiefs...
This is his quote.....Elvis is a HUGE guy but is a ****. He won't work out off season, all he wants to do is play golf. He didn't make friends in KC, but just layed low. HUM, I wonder why. Look at the guys history......past teams. He always thinks he can come in and do better. Understanding our past coaching staff, he still has NO mobility. Sorry all, but Kat is going to speak my mind this time.......
He is a wuss! He won't put his heart into the game. Nor the players as far as trying to connect. Why would someone that is 6'5" not be out there hiring a personal trainer (as Tony G. has)? That tells me that his heart really isn't in it. His HEAD is, DUH but tell me how do you go to a Superbowl Champs team and make it better?:confused: That had to be the most stupid thing out of his mouth ever!
Yes, I agree he can throw the ball. He proved that last year. Buy without the one or two people he will pass to Elvis becomes clueless. Just wait until he can't do jack when he's in the pocket and just decides to drop and fall.....<<OH MY, I might get hurt~ That is about his mentality. I do have a question tho.....if he is so good as the Ravens think why hasn't more been said about him? Just lurking around the boards it was the assumption that the players weren't even happy with him already. That is not a good sign. Some liked him in KC and most didn't. However, he did start to win the people over last year. Then what he pulled with the team is unforgivable. He knew he was going to leave and I think that was just a CHICKENS#^IT THING TO DO TO A TEAM.
Again, sorry.......one more comment. What makes any of us think a throwing game is going to make it this year? OOPS.......then Elvis is out.:cool:
As I said, sorry for venting.......just my point of view. But I do wish you well with him..maybe he has finally found his home.
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