View Full Version : Outsider's report of camp

j molina
07-31-2001, 07:54 AM
Just thought some of you may want to see this story about early camp from a St. Louis Post-Dispatch writer. He doesn't paint a rosey picture but it's only practice.


07-31-2001, 08:03 AM
Anything to justify the fact that the A$$ whupping we put on them last year was just a fluke. :rolleyes:

07-31-2001, 08:14 AM
Is it just me or are STL fans and media a little smug for a city that hadnt sniffed the playoffs before Vermiel?

07-31-2001, 08:26 AM
Yeah, but we certainly aren't going to stink it up as bad as the '97 or '98 Rams. Real sharp thinking author on that... Let's see.. 1999 Rams had two whole years to learn DV's system. 2001 Chiefs have had a couple minicamps....

Surprise!! Missed blocks don't bother me and even dropped balls don't bother me TOO much yet. It will take some concentration to learn the routes and what to expect from the QB, etc... Once that is learned, THEN I'll worry about dropped balls.

It's a learning process.. something apparently Jeff Gordon is not familiar with.

And what was with his comments on Needing a Ladder to cover Tony? It is overall size that is his advantage, not some super-freakish height.

He did like Trent Green though... :)


07-31-2001, 08:26 AM
What an A$$. Vermeil had 3 years to perfect this system in St. Louis. These guys have NEVER done this before. It is a WHOLE new system for everybody but the 2 players from St. Louis. You have to give them a little room to f**k up. Give it a couple weeks of repetition and it will start coming together before we sell this team down the river.

07-31-2001, 08:35 AM
The offense looking a bit out of step on the first practice of training camp? I believe that is the norm, the offense is ALWAYS behind the D early on in training camp, and for the first practice I would expect nothing less.

Of course DA only being the 7th best WR (in total yards) in the league last year must mean that he isn't any good... He actually averaged 3rd best with avg yard per reception for receivers with over 40 catches, behind Holt and Moss, 4th best in the 30 catches and over. He is right, DA just isn't very good.

Of course we might not do very well this year, but to base it on the first day of training camp is completely idiotic.

Baby Lee
07-31-2001, 08:37 AM
Let my season in h-e-double hockey sticks begin.

Heck, even a speed back like a Trung Canidate would look good here, provided he could hold up on the field.

So you're saying an extra first rounder in the mix could make a team better. That's a fairly safe bet.

We need to make sure people realize that Al Saunders, Carl Hairston and Lynn Stiles are NOT 'coming to town.' They are returning to town. They're coming home.

07-31-2001, 09:09 AM
He is right.

Bear in mind that this is a rebuilding year. We made coaching upgrade of several magnitudes. That cost us some draft picks. Like it or not, Green came with Vermeil and Saunders. Just like Crockett came with Robinson.

We upgraded some player positions, but this season is more about cutting unproductive or overly expensive players. It is about turning around, not contending.

So, the column is on the nose. We have the jockeys to execute a powerful Offense, but we do not have the horses.

That comes next season.

Giving the Devil his due.

Baby Lee
07-31-2001, 09:18 AM
Gaz - I am not contesting your point, my beef is with the concept of a 'Rams centered universe.' Where no Isaac [God saved me when I didn't wear my seatblet because I'm a better person] Bruce and no Az Hakim means no success. Where our esteem is gauged by how good a group of ex-Rams we can compile. Vermeil and Green, that's good, but Horne? and they can't get Kennison?? Blah blah blah. Like I've said, things will be better when the Saints and 49ers get back to punking these guys and they'll stop thinknig the sun rises and sets on the TWA dome.

07-31-2001, 10:03 AM
OK, here we go...

If Vermeil is going to win, he' ll have to do it with defense and ball control and opportunism.

I forgot how many underacheivers we have on the team. We couldn't possibly score any offensive points.

These Chiefs just don't have the weapons the Rams, not even close. They have old friend Trent Green to install and operate the old Rams offense, but they lack the explosive elements that can make that scheme so deadly.

I still have a hard time beleiving that the Rams have more talent than the Chiefs. The, unfortunately, just have had more time to practice this scheme.

Priest Holmes has been cast in the part of Marshall Faulk, which is a stretch. He is a solid National Football League running back, for sure, but not a major playmaker.

Nope, he won't score at all.

The Chiefs receiving corps features tight end Tony Gonzalez _ the league's preeminent weapon at that position _ and a very average group of wide-outs. ...There is no Isaac Bruce, Torry Holt or Az Zahir-Hakim in this group.

I had never heard of these guys before the year 1999, have any of you? It's amazing how 1 Superbowl makes you the fastest and best receivers in the league.

Well, I think the dude is a St. Louis homer who has no objective insight. My beef is that fact that he seems to think that our playmakers are not of the same caliber as St. Louis's. I happen to think he is wrong.

07-31-2001, 10:49 PM
I'm sorry "GAZ" but your a complete idiot. We have upgraded in about every position on the field. Maybe not just talent wise, but definitely character wise. I'm sick of these collums that don't give KC any credit, and I am sick of KC fans saying they are right. We have the HORSES to contend this YEAR. I stopped reading the page when the man sayid that Derrick Alexander isn't an upper-class (something like that) reciever, and that he possibly can't grasp the Slash offense. That is what Alexander does best, catches that slant pass and turns it into a 50 yard gain. Sorry for being a little optimistic.

Tribal Warfare
07-31-2001, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by Recker24
We have the HORSES to contend this YEAR.

KC has talent, but not championship or even playoff quality yet.

07-31-2001, 11:01 PM
Look at this way. The people in St Loui seem to be thinking alot more about the Chiefs then the people in KC are about them. You would think that idiot would have something else to write about. Aren't the Rams at Training Camp?

PhilFree :cool:

07-31-2001, 11:03 PM
I haven't seen someone switching teams cause so much trouble since.....uh, never mind.

07-31-2001, 11:07 PM
I don't know: we have TWO solid RBs in Holmes & Richardson, an accurate QB that makes correct decisions, a solid OLine, the best TE in the game, the best 1400yd WR nobody acknowleges(DA), a young impressive WR Snoop Minnis, a consistent 3rd WR in Mayes.

Defensively, we have the two best DEs in the division in Clemons and Hicks - Browning and Martin are solid - Williams plays well when not injured. Edwards, Patton and Bush are all good LBs - Donnie is a speedy, INT snagging, RB & QB pursuing nightmare; Patton is a veteran leader and run-stopper; and Bush is solid against the run - but had a bad year last season. We have the best Safeties in the division: Woods & Wesley. Crockett has been impressing everyone - so has Warfield(heard it on Metro Sports and 810 today). Dennis and Bartee are young but exciting - they have the potential to be very good NFL corners. (Interesting note: this squad was ranked FOURTH in the NFL in sacks last season) :)

Our Special Teams will be special again now that we have Tony Horne returing kickoffs - he is a thret to break one every time he touches the ball! Blaylock and Moses are super-fast punt returners that can stop & cut like you wouldn't believe! (Metro Sports showed Moses make a cut on a punt return that would make any would-be tackler pop his ACL! Looke like a Barry Sanders juke!!) We have a punter that consistently booms kicks - forcing more fair catches than any other punter - thus negating dangerous return men; simultaneously ensuring good field position for our D. Peterson is deadly accurate - if Tynes beats him out, it's because he's a damn fine pk.

We have the best coaching staff I've ever seen in KC - right now! The attitude thus far has been tremendously positive. All I've heard goes back to my comments after mini-camp: this is a very positive <i>learning</i> atmosphere. The players are enjoying themselves because they are actually improving - they are being taught how to succeed.

In all, I see this team as capable of just about anything - barring injury (if we lose Green, we are in trouble)

08-01-2001, 12:33 AM
I'm with HC on his views. I guess what it all comes down to is chemistry on the team. And even that sounds very positive at the moment. Every team is different every year. Who says we can't make a run at the playoffs this year? I always hope we can go 10-6 which is usually good enough to get you invited to the dance. If the Defense is back to normal which Gaz would define as run stopping and QB crushing and the Offense starts to gel who knows what kind of season we could have. Injuries as always could devastate us as well as starting off with a few losses. We will see. Preseason will be a good indicator and I hope they start having the will to kill attitude. And not just going thru the motions because they don't count. Winning begets winning. :)

08-01-2001, 07:49 AM
It's not even "showtime" yet. Me thinks someone is still smarting from the whoopin' last year. It's essentially the same team they couldn't beat last year.......... that said we must be patient, if KC can play mistake free football (no fumbles, offsides, ints, blocked FG and blocked punts), they will get through the growing pains. Will probably play much better in the last half of the season.

08-01-2001, 07:58 AM
True, the condescending "big brother" 'tude is irritating, but the material facts are what a lot of us have been saying on this BB, not to mention what Vermeil has been saying in interviews. He is building the team he wants, but we do not yet have the speed he wants. We do not yet have the players to effectively run the Offense Vermeil and Saunders want to run.

Ignore the weak smack and the article is quite accurate.

If all phases of our team gel in an incredibly short time, we can kick some serious butt and perhaps even sneak into the playoffs. But, to quote Arlo, "that wasn't very likely and we didn't expect it."

If, as is more likely, some phases are still bug-proofing in the regular season, we will lose some games we could have won. We will be a better team as the season progresses as the new schemes fall into place.

I am okay with that. My criterion for this season is constant, steady improvement. Given the massive overhaul of the team [not to mention the Stoogefest we saw the last couple of seasons] that is my expectation. Anything more is gravy.

Used to ignoring weak St. Louis smack.

08-01-2001, 08:12 AM
Originally posted by alanm
Anything to justify the fact that the A$$ whupping we put on them last year was just a fluke. :rolleyes:

Hate to tell you this, but that *** whupping we put on them last year was just a fluke.

08-01-2001, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by bishop_74
Vermeil had 3 years to perfect this system in St. Louis. These guys have NEVER done this before. It is a WHOLE new system for everybody but the 2 players from St. Louis. You have to give them a little room to f**k up.

That's not true. That offense was installed in the '99 preseason by Martz, with Trent Green as the only player to have played in it before.

I do agree that they should have a little room to f**k up.

j molina
08-02-2001, 05:46 PM
I was TDY(temporary duty assignment) at Vandenberg AFB,
near your home town of Lompoc from late June to early September of 1992. Had a great time. The weather was so much cooler compared to the brutal summers we are accustomed to
in the midwest.


08-02-2001, 06:49 PM
J Mo,
Yeah the weather here is good.

It's to bad there isn't any life around here though.

Pitt Gorilla
08-02-2001, 08:14 PM
Heck, even a speed back like a Trung Canidate would look good here, provided he could hold up on the field??????????
(No comment needed)

Air Martz-like offense???????? (This is NOT Martz's offense. It would be like crediting democracy to Clinton.)

Veteran Chiefs observers wonder if Alexander is suited to run the slicing catch-and-run routes underneath defenses?????????? (Alexander's carreer strength = catch and run)

This is supposed to be credible journalism? Sounds like we might have found St. Louis's Whitlock.

08-02-2001, 09:23 PM
I knew hiring Vermeil was a mistake. :mad: First day of practice and we are plagued with problems: overthrown balls, incorrect routes, missed blocking assignments. My God, what did we do in those 3 days of mini-camp? I can't believe the players didn't come into camp in perfect playing form. Those Rams fans are right, Vermeil sucks, Martz is/was the genious behind it all.

Peterson should pack his bags also. How dare he pick a head coach who cannot turn Priest Holmes into Marshall Faulk. Damn him to hell!! I'm going to call Direct TV and see if I can get a refund, the season is obviously lost.

Thank goodness that "reporter" set me straight before I bought tickets for the Jets/Chiefs game. I'll purchase a Trung Candidate jersey instead. With any luck the Rams will release him in 4 years and KC can pick him up. I'll put my life on hold until then.