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KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 01:58 PM
I'm all for trading down if the deal makes sense.

Frazod
03-26-2008, 01:58 PM
The more I read, and the closer the draft gets, the more I believe that the Chiefs will try to trade down.

I actually have no problem with it, if done correctly.

If we can't get Jake, trade down with any team that drafts AHEAD OF DENVER and take Clady.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 02:00 PM
I don't agree with taking Clady, his wonderlic score was at the level of retard, I'd take Williams or Otah over him.

milkman
03-26-2008, 02:04 PM
I actually have no problem with it, if done correctly.

If we can't get Jake, trade down with any team that drafts AHEAD OF DENVER and take Clady.

Of the top OTs in this draft, Clady scares me the most.

I fear a Trezelle Jenkins size bust.

milkman
03-26-2008, 02:05 PM
I don't agree with taking Clady, his wonderlic score was at the level of retard, I'd take Williams or Otah over him.

I'd rather have Williams than any other of the top OTs in this draft.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 02:07 PM
The more I read, and the closer the draft gets, the more I believe that the Chiefs will try to trade down.

I agree. Especially if Mcfadden is available. I've heard the Bears and Cowboys could be willing to make a move. Anything higher than #5 appears to be to pricy for him though.

And I could see NE wanting to leapfrog the Jets if McFadden is gone and Gohlston is still on the board.

Could be an interesting draft day. Can't wait.

Chiefnj2
03-26-2008, 02:08 PM
If you stay at 5 it probably will be a choice between Ellis or Ryan. If Dorsey is healthy he'll go before 5. If Dorsey isn't healthy, you don't want him at 5. Both Long's should be gone.

5 could have good trade value if McFadden and Ryan are available.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 02:11 PM
FTR,

I would like to see the trade with Dallas. Get Albert and Cherilus to man the right side of the line. Brohm in the 2nd with our pick. CB, WR, another O-line or what ever with Dallas 2nd round and our early 3rd round.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 02:15 PM
I think Herm & Co will make the right choice given whatever talent they have to choose from, if I remember right everyone thought Hali was a reach and he's worked out pretty well so far.

beach tribe
03-26-2008, 02:18 PM
ROFLI think Herm & Co will make the right choice given whatever talent they have to choose from, if I remember right everyone thought Hali was a reach and he's worked out pretty well so far.

Sorry dude, but this is no time for homerdom.

milkman
03-26-2008, 02:19 PM
I think Herm & Co will make the right choice given whatever talent they have to choose from, if I remember right everyone thought Hali was a reach and he's worked out pretty well so far.

No one thought Hali was a reach.

Some didn't like drafting him because he was considered a "finished" product, but he was drafted just about exactly where he was expected to be.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 02:20 PM
The last few posts in this thread just made my head hurt......

We should change the name of the Lounge to "OL Lounge"

I'm not going to explain for the 500th time why wanting OL above all else is stupid if you don't get it by now you never will.

Chiefnj2
03-26-2008, 02:20 PM
FTR,

I would like to see the trade with Dallas. Get Albert and Cherilus to man the right side of the line. Brohm in the 2nd with our pick. CB, WR, another O-line or what ever with Dallas 2nd round and our early 3rd round.


King Carl needs to make up his mind with Allen. Either CP is going to pay him as a top DE or not. If not, they need to seriously consider a DE or two.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 02:20 PM
No one thought Hali was a reach.

Some didn't like drafting him because he was considered a "finished" product, but he was drafted just about exactly where he was expected to be.

And I still don't think he has any upside, he is what he is.....so far that's been his first 2 years..

To bad we didn't get the guy I wanted that year eh?

milkman
03-26-2008, 02:22 PM
And I still don't think he has any upside, he is what he is.....so far that's been his first 2 years..

To bad we didn't get the guy I wanted that year eh?

Even if everyone agreed with you, it didn't matter.

He was already gone.

beach tribe
03-26-2008, 02:24 PM
The last few posts in this thread just made my head hurt......

We should change the name of the Lounge to "OL Lounge"

I'm not going to explain for the 500th time why wanting OL above all else is stupid if you don't get it by now you never will.

Just more proof that not everyone thinks you're the guru you think you are.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 02:25 PM
Just more proof that not everyone thinks you're the guru you think you are.

Considering there are people here that would take Ryan Clady over Glen Dorsey other peoples opinions don't really matter that much to me. Just make me shake my head really.

milkman
03-26-2008, 02:27 PM
The last few posts in this thread just made my head hurt......

We should change the name of the Lounge to "OL Lounge"

I'm not going to explain for the 500th time why wanting OL above all else is stupid if you don't get it by now you never will.

I'm not on that O-Lineman or bust bandwagon.

I'm just opining what I believe the mediocre braintrust will attempt.

beach tribe
03-26-2008, 02:28 PM
Considering there are people here that would take Ryan Clady over Glen Dorsey other peoples opinions don't really matter that much to me. Just make me shake my head really.

Good point.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 02:29 PM
I'm not on that O-Lineman or bust bandwagon.

I'm just opining what I believe the mediocre braintrust will attempt.

I wasn't really including you, I've yet to see you make a post about how if Jake Long isn't there the only option is to trade down and take another OT. Without even considering who else is available.

Chiefnj2
03-26-2008, 02:31 PM
Considering there are people here that would take Ryan Clady over Glen Dorsey other peoples opinions don't really matter that much to me. Just make me shake my head really.

So, if someone thinks Dorsey is an injury risk it is unreasonable for them to want the Chiefs to draft another player that is regarded as a top 10 player?

beach tribe
03-26-2008, 02:33 PM
So, if someone thinks Dorsey is an injury risk it is unreasonable for them to want the Chiefs to draft another player that is regarded as a top 10 player?

IF he's ****ed up. Which I don't think he is, and I'm sure will be examined to death. The guy is not injury prone, or seriously injured.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 02:43 PM
I wasn't really including you, I've yet to see you make a post about how if Jake Long isn't there the only option is to trade down and take another OT. Without even considering who else is available.


I can't call up the link to the draft, but IIRC, Long is there at our #5 pick in this draft. And yes I would take him under this scenario.

And if he was gone, yes I would consider trading down. And yes, the O-line would be my focus. Hard and heavy on day 1 of this draft.

Does that mean this will happen? No.

But then again, I don't think this team has as many holes as you think there are. I think we are a couple of three years away from contending, but mostly that is the young guys getting experience which would include this years draft picks.

crazycoffey
03-26-2008, 02:54 PM
The last few posts in this thread just made my head hurt......

We should change the name of the Lounge to "OL Lounge"

I'm not going to explain for the 500th time why wanting OL above all else is stupid if you don't get it by now you never will.


I don't read it that way at all, it seems more like this is a thread just talking about the idea of trading down, not that "everyone" only wants an OL.

Should we explain for the 500th time why if Jake Long and Ellis are the two highest on the Chiefs draft board still available we should take Long? And for me being involved with some of these discussions previously with you, I never said OL or nothing.
It's really an old tired dead horse arguement, you only think your way is the only way.

Who knows, maybe we take ellis in that situation, but I doubt it, just my .02 cents....

beach tribe
03-26-2008, 02:57 PM
[QUOTE=CrazyCoffey;4650732]It's really an old tired dead horse arguement, you only think your way is the only way.

QUOTE]

Words of truth.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:01 PM
All I'm saying is that if Long is gone and we find a trading partner we should go with it, this year is heavy with OL and if you havn't noticed we're not exactly loading up on free agent talent this year, meaning the more draft picks we have the better!

Mecca
03-26-2008, 03:10 PM
You do realize we need a hell of alot more than just offensive linemen...

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:11 PM
You do realize we need a hell of alot more than just offensive linemen...

No, we should draft 10 of them. All tackles.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 03:13 PM
No, we should draft 10 of them. All tackles.

You'll only encourage them, I could actually see someone being happy if the Chiefs picked all OL.

Mr. Arrowhead
03-26-2008, 03:15 PM
I just got a feeling that Ryan is a bust

Deberg_1990
03-26-2008, 03:17 PM
I just got a feeling that Ryan is a bust

So what are you baseing that on??

crazycoffey
03-26-2008, 03:18 PM
You do realize we need a hell of alot more than just offensive linemen...

never argued against that either.
Damn it, I can't flag a moderator.....





:p
again, J/K [/not flagging anyone]

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:19 PM
You do realize we need a hell of alot more than just offensive linemen...

Yes. And as someone here once said, there is more than 1 round to this draft.

IMO.

The Starting D-line is our strength. Allen, Tank, Turk, and Hali. If it is not that, then Gun should be gone right after the season is over. While Edwards and Boone were not great starters, they should be good enough at a position of depth... along with some 2nd day pick/picks.

LB starters are above average. Could use depth and eventual replacement, but again that could be 2nd day picks this season as well.

CB. We need one. 1st day if at all possible.

Safties. Gun wanted these guys. Said Pollard wouldn't be there in the 3rd so we took him in the 2nd. Should be in decent shape for now at that position.



O-Line. It is in shambles.

TE - Gonzo and then what? Allen?

WR- Bowe and question marks including Darling.

RB - Pretty good shape. But needs O-line.

QB - Question marks. But needs O-line most definately.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 03:20 PM
So what are you baseing that on??

Well I have a feeling that Brodie Croyle will bust his body, which there's actually some proof that, that will probably happen.

Mr. Arrowhead
03-26-2008, 03:21 PM
I just got a feeling that Ryan is a bust
just a few games i have seen him play at BC, and a just a feeling. The games i saw him play i was not impressed at all, especially not impressed enough to take him at #5. If its between him and dorsey/ellis. And we take Ryan, i will be very disapointed

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:24 PM
Well I have a feeling that Brodie Croyle will bust his body, which there's actually some proof that, that will probably happen.

I have to agree, he can make all the throws but the kid looks like a toothpick!

milkman
03-26-2008, 03:27 PM
Yes. And as someone here once said, there is more than 1 round to this draft.

IMO.

The Starting D-line is our strength. Allen, Tank, Turk, and Hali. If it is not that, then Gun should be gone right after the season is over. While Edwards and Boone were not great starters, they should be good enough at a position of depth... along with some 2nd day pick/picks.

LB starters are above average. Could use depth and eventual replacement, but again that could be 2nd day picks this season as well.

CB. We need one. 1st day if at all possible.

Safties. Gun wanted these guys. Said Pollard wouldn't be there in the 3rd so we took him in the 2nd. Should be in decent shape for now at that position.



O-Line. It is in shambles.

TE - Gonzo and then what? Allen?

WR- Bowe and question marks including Darling.

RB - Pretty good shape. But needs O-line.

QB - Question marks. But needs O-line most definately.

Edwards is just a body, nothing more.

Tank and Turk may, or may not be anything more than that, but even if one of them proves to be a stud, we still need a lot more talent to rotate.

Hali is a pretty good DE, but he's not some stud that's irreplacable.

Fact is, he would be better as depth.

Our LBs are above average?

What's average?
Me, you and mecca?

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:28 PM
We basically have one linebacker that will probably be on the team in 2009. The rest are complete crap or old.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:29 PM
No, we should draft 10 of them. All tackles.

If an OT happens to be the BPA at each of our picks, then yes. Stay true to theh board. Never, never, never reach for a player! ;)

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:31 PM
Our LBs are above average?

What's average?
Me, you and mecca?

ROFL

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:32 PM
"Fact is, he would be better as depth"

Are you kidding me? He's most way better than just depth, I think alot of great DE go through a tough time in their 2nd year, let alone one that dealt with a nagging injury most of the season. I believe the jury is still out on whether or not he can be a great DE and this year should say alot.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:33 PM
We basically have one linebacker that will probably be on the team in 2009. The rest are complete crap or old.

That is probably somewhat true. Depends on Williams. But the good news is there is another draft next year... and Gun is rolling up his sleves this year and coaching this unit.:rolleyes:

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:34 PM
That is probably somewhat true. Depends on Williams. But the good news is there is another draft next year... and Gun is rolling up his sleves this year and coaching this unit.:rolleyes:

Williams. ROFL

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:35 PM
Williams. ROFL

I don't know that much about the guy. I'm going to at least give him a play or two before I bag on him.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:36 PM
That is probably somewhat true. Depends on Williams. But the good news is there is another draft next year... and Gun is rolling up his sleves this year and coaching this unit.:rolleyes:

Do we really think Gun is going to make a differance with the LB's we have, most are vets and won't be as impressionable as a young unit would be.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:37 PM
Do we really think Gun is going to make a differance with the LB's we have, most are vets and won't be as impressionable as a young unit would be.

Nope. That is why I had the :rolleyes: thingy! IMO, Gun is the major problem with the defense.

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:37 PM
I don't know that much about the guy. I'm going to at least give him a play or two before I bag on him.

But you're willing to use him as an excuse not to draft a linebacker apparently.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:39 PM
We'll draft a LB for sure, most are good special teamers and we for sure need the depth!

Mecca
03-26-2008, 03:40 PM
But you're willing to use him as an excuse not to draft a linebacker apparently.

Because "that isn't our worst spot on the team"

I'm sorry to inform some around here, we have no real strengths and no positions where we can't drastically improve. At nearly every position we have a guy starting or playing a major role that would either be a backup or cut from a team that is actually contending.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:41 PM
But you're willing to use him as an excuse not to draft a linebacker apparently.

I didn't say that. There is a day two to the draft. There is also another draft next year if it doesn't happen this year in the draft. They went out and signed Edwards and what's his name at MLB last year. Like I said. I think Gun is the problem on the defense.

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:43 PM
I didn't say that. There is a day two to the draft. There is also another draft next year if it doesn't happen this year in the draft. They went out and signed Edwards and what's his name at MLB last year. Like I said. I think Gun is the problem on the defense.

There isn't any reason not to draft a linebacker this year. On day one.

gun is a problem with this defense. The other is the roster.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:43 PM
There isn't any reason not to draft a linebacker this year. On day one.

Go to post 283 and read it would you?

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:44 PM
Go to post 283 and read it would you?

I did read it. And I disagree with most of it.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 03:45 PM
I did read it. And I disagree with most of it.

Your choice.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:48 PM
I've heard this a couple of times now, how is Gun our problem on D? I'm not arguing I would just like to hear a reason, not just finger pointing.

Brock
03-26-2008, 03:51 PM
I've heard this a couple of times now, how is Gun our problem on D? I'm not arguing I would just like to hear a reason, not just finger pointing.

Ask yourself if gunther would be a defensive coordinator for any team other than this one. Doesn't it seem ridiculous?

Mecca
03-26-2008, 03:53 PM
I've heard this a couple of times now, how is Gun our problem on D? I'm not arguing I would just like to hear a reason, not just finger pointing.

How about the fact that all the players he has asked for or liked or wanted on the team have sucked balls?

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:54 PM
IMO I think he would, it maybe iffy in todays trend of going with the new up and comers, but I think someone would give him a shot.

OnTheWarpath58
03-26-2008, 03:54 PM
Of the top OTs in this draft, Clady scares me the most.

I fear a Trezelle Jenkins size bust.

I'd rather have Williams than any other of the top OTs in this draft.

Couldn't agree more.

KC4EVER
03-26-2008, 03:55 PM
How about the fact that all the players he has asked for or liked or wanted on the team have sucked balls?

You got me on that one!

Kendrell Bell:cuss:

OnTheWarpath58
03-26-2008, 03:57 PM
And I still don't think he has any upside, he is what he is.....so far that's been his first 2 years..

To bad we didn't get the guy I wanted that year eh?

If he is what he is, then I'll gladly take the 8 sacks a year he's gonna give me for the next 8-10 years.

CupidStunt
03-26-2008, 04:22 PM
To bad we didn't get the guy I wanted that year eh?

Too bad he wasn't available, you mean?

You keep spewing this garbage as if it actually means something. Anything. It's too bad we didn't get the guy I wanted who wasn't taken for another 10 or so picks and is better than both Hali and Cromartie.

Eh?

milkman
03-26-2008, 04:24 PM
That is probably somewhat true. Depends on Williams. But the good news is there is another draft next year... and Gun is rolling up his sleves this year and coaching this unit.:rolleyes:

So, I guess that means the LBs will suck more than they already do.

milkman
03-26-2008, 04:30 PM
"Fact is, he would be better as depth"

Are you kidding me? He's most way better than just depth, I think alot of great DE go through a tough time in their 2nd year, let alone one that dealt with a nagging injury most of the season. I believe the jury is still out on whether or not he can be a great DE and this year should say alot.

Hali is a good player, but I don't believe he'll ever get any better than he is right now.

He's a decnt player, certainly not a liability like Ron Edwards or Nap Harris, but if there is a chance in the next couple of drafts to find a better player, then I would pull that trigger.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 04:30 PM
Too bad he wasn't available, you mean?

You keep spewing this garbage as if it actually means something. Anything. It's too bad we didn't get the guy I wanted who wasn't taken for another 10 or so picks and is better than both Hali and Cromartie.

Eh?

Uh who's that, because I'm pretty sure Cromartie is better than everyone that went behind him for a good while.

And it's just the point of people telling me Cromartie wasn't worth that pick and Hali was better than him......hey some people probably still think that as funny as it would be.

milkman
03-26-2008, 04:32 PM
I didn't say that. There is a day two to the draft. There is also another draft next year if it doesn't happen this year in the draft. They went out and signed Edwards and what's his name at MLB last year. Like I said. I think Gun is the problem on the defense.

If you, as a fan of a team, can't even think of that team's MLB's name, then that's stands as pretty clear evidence that he ain't exactly lightin' things up.

CupidStunt
03-26-2008, 04:36 PM
Uh who's that, because I'm pretty sure Cromartie is better than everyone that went behind him for a good while.


You're pretty wrong.

DeMeco Ryans > half-season-wonder.

And it's just the point of people telling me Cromartie wasn't worth that pick and Hali was better than him...

So dig up the one or two posts that supposedly prove this, have your laugh and then shut the f**k up. You mention it every other day and it's pathetic. Get a grip. Someone disagreed with you about something; OH NOEZZZZZZZZZ, TEH H0RR0RRR!!1111!!

Mecca
03-26-2008, 04:38 PM
CB>LB

Not saying Ryans isn't good but hey a CB is a more valued position. Half season wonder is also a real nice way to describe a budding superstar though.

milkman
03-26-2008, 04:50 PM
CB>LB

Not saying Ryans isn't good but hey a CB is a more valued position. Half season wonder is also a real nice way to describe a budding superstar though.

That's pure bull.

I'll take a stud LB over a great CB every ****ing day.

You build a defense inside out, front to back.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 04:55 PM
That's pure bull.

I'll take a stud LB over a great CB every ****ing day.

You build a defense inside out, front to back.

I wouldn't, a lock down CB is extremely valuable, especially in a pass happy league.

OnTheWarpath58
03-26-2008, 04:57 PM
That's pure bull.

I'll take a stud LB over a great CB every ****ing day.

You build a defense inside out, front to back.

Agree.

A solid/great front 7 can do wonders for an average defensive backfield.

A solid/great defensive backfield isn't going to do shit with an average front 7, especially in a Cover 2 scheme.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 04:59 PM
It's Dline and Corners......

Even with Tampa 2 they have 1 LB, outside of Brooks I'd love to see someone start naming the other awesome LB's they've had...

Or the Colts who walked away from LB after LB showing you how much they value that position.

milkman
03-26-2008, 05:01 PM
I wouldn't, a lock down CB is extremely valuable, especially in a pass happy league.

There is no such thing as a lockdown corner unless the front seven does it's job.

And that's even more true in a cover 2.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 05:01 PM
There is no such thing as a lockdown corner unless the front seven does it's job.

And that's even more true in a cover 2.

Front 4.......Colts/Bucs example.....

milkman
03-26-2008, 05:04 PM
Front 4.......Colts/Bucs example.....

Who the hell are the corners in Indy?

And Donny Abraham never played to the same level in NY that he played in Tampa.

Mecca
03-26-2008, 05:06 PM
It's the point that those teams have no name LB's and when they had LB's they always let them walk aside from Brooks.

I don't think anyone got excited about Jamie Duncan and Shelton Quarles. And the Colts corners are scheme suited but they've used first day picks on them....and Tampa paid Ronde Barber...

Tribal Warfare
03-26-2008, 05:06 PM
I wouldn't, a lock down CB is extremely valuable, especially in a pass happy league.

Mecca, I agree with milkman here because the front seven are the core of the defense, hence they always mention CBs are on an "island". One has to have a great foundation to succeed and the front seven is that. Saying that if the BPA is a DB take him.

Tribal Warfare
03-26-2008, 05:07 PM
Front 4.......Colts/Bucs example.....

Then their is the Ravens

Mecca
03-26-2008, 05:08 PM
The Ravens have about 150 million dollars in corners, they have spent mad cash at basically every position.

Tribal Warfare
03-26-2008, 05:12 PM
The Ravens have about 150 million dollars in corners, they have spent mad cash at basically every position.


look at their front 7 too

Mecca
03-26-2008, 05:13 PM
The bottom to this with me is I simply think Cromartie is better with a much higher ceiling and is a huge playmaker and I'd just simply rather have him.

milkman
03-26-2008, 05:14 PM
It's the point that those teams have no name LB's and when they had LB's they always let them walk aside from Brooks.

I don't think anyone got excited about Jamie Duncan and Shelton Quarles. And the Colts corners are scheme suited but they've used first day picks on them....and Tampa paid Ronde Barber...

You are right, they aren't great LBs, but they played well in the system.

They did their job.

I think the Bucs paid Barber for his leadership as much as for his skills.

He is not some great corner who's could sign with the Chiefs and be a difference maker.

Hell, Champ Bailey is a "lockdown corner", but with a pretty pathetic front seven, he get's beat pretty consistently.

A couple of years ago, when the front four for the Donkeys was somewhat acceptable, and their LB core was pretty good, Bailey did play up to his hype.

Coogs
03-26-2008, 05:19 PM
If you, as a fan of a team, can't even think of that team's MLB's name, then that's stands as pretty clear evidence that he ain't exactly lightin' things up.

:D

That is true. I think it is the onset of Alzeheimers. :)

Brock
03-26-2008, 05:57 PM
The bottom to this with me is I simply think Cromartie is better with a much higher ceiling and is a huge playmaker and I'd just simply rather have him.

Nothing personal, but do you really think there's a single person on this site who doesn't know this?

Chiefnj2
03-26-2008, 08:07 PM
In a cover 2 make an X on the defense - DTs, MLB and Safeties. A good front 7 make average corners look great. Surtain was a top corner, then he came to KC. Law was great with NE, made the Pro Bowl with the Jets, then came to KC.