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View Full Version : Why did the US\Iraqi government give power to Al-Sadr?


dirk digler
03-25-2008, 12:32 PM
This just boggles my mind. Hasn't the US learned from past mistakes of dealing with Saddam and Bin Laden that supporting known radicals always come back to bite us in the ass?

IMO this is just gross incompetence to negotiate or give any kind of money to this guy. If you want to kill the snake you cut off its head.

patteeu
03-25-2008, 01:12 PM
This just boggles my mind. Hasn't the US learned from past mistakes of dealing with Saddam and Bin Laden that supporting known radicals always come back to bite us in the ass?

IMO this is just gross incompetence to negotiate or give any kind of money to this guy. If you want to kill the snake you cut off its head.

I was puzzled/disappointed when the US/Iraqi leadership decided not to execute the warrant they had for the arrest of Sadr in connection with the murder of the leading Shiite moderate cleric at the outset of the post-war period, but I realize that I don't know what they believed were the pros and cons involved. It may well have been a mistake, but I can't say that with any degree of certainty.

But I do take issue with your assertion that it's always a mistake to deal with unsavory characters. We are a lot more likely to become aware of and take notice of cases where this is true, but it's not at all clear that we haven't had unmitigated successes dealing with these types of people from time to time.

dirk digler
03-25-2008, 01:17 PM
I was puzzled/disappointed when the US/Iraqi leadership decided not to execute the warrant they had for the arrest of Sadr in connection with the murder of the leading Shiite moderate cleric at the outset of the post-war period, but I realize that I don't know what they believed were the pros and cons involved. It may well have been a mistake, but I can't say that with any degree of certainty.

But I do take issue with your assertion that it's always a mistake to deal with unsavory characters. We are a lot more likely to become aware of and take notice of cases where this is true, but it's not at all clear that we haven't had unmitigated successes dealing with these types of people from time to time.

It is extremely disappointing because it appears this one guy holds Iraqi peace in his hands and he is going to stop the cease fire and all hell is going to break loose again. They should have tried to kill him and still should try.

patteeu
03-25-2008, 01:33 PM
It is extremely disappointing because it appears this one guy holds Iraqi peace in his hands and he is going to stop the cease fire and all hell is going to break loose again. They should have tried to kill him and still should try.

Maybe they will. Are you sure he's still in control of the Basra Sadrists and that he's calling for an end to the ceasefire?

BigOlChiefsfan
03-25-2008, 01:41 PM
The last time we were interested in him, he disappeared across the border into Iran. Things quieted down, he came back. He' an Iranian 'front man', always has been, and if he gets his way there won't BE an Iraq, there'll be a larger Iran. He's alive because he knows when to keep a low profile & when he starts to act sassy he always runs for the border.

Think Pancho Via, but with worse teeth and a sillier hat. And a direct pipeline to the Moolah Mullahs and Iranian military.

Radar Chief
03-26-2008, 06:57 AM
How exactly did we “give power to al Sadre”? Just because he’s been too elusive to capture/kill?

Radar Chief
03-26-2008, 06:58 AM
The last time we were interested in him, he disappeared across the border into Iran. Things quieted down, he came back. He' an Iranian 'front man', always has been, and if he gets his way there won't BE an Iraq, there'll be a larger Iran. He's alive because he knows when to keep a low profile & when he starts to act sassy he always runs for the border.

Think Pancho Via, but with worse teeth and a sillier hat. And a direct pipeline to the Moolah Mullahs and Iranian military.

Yea, he’s good at rousing up hatred then dressing like a chick to run away.

Iowanian
03-26-2008, 07:33 AM
They should have killed the bastard a couple of years ago when they talked about it...

The mental midgets would have rioted for a couple of days and moved on.

I think the concern at the time was that the replacements would be even worse to deal with.

Amnorix
03-26-2008, 07:36 AM
Yea, he’s good at rousing up hatred then dressing like a chick to run away.


That's called being smart.

And, P.S., it's how Washington won the Revolutionary War, and how General Giap won in Vietnam.

pikesome
03-26-2008, 07:39 AM
They should have killed the bastard a couple of years ago when they talked about it...

The mental midgets would have rioted for a couple of days and moved on.

I think the concern at the time was that the replacements would be even worse to deal with.

It gets expensive if you have to buy a "politician" and then kill him a few months later.


I don't know why the US has a problem finding someone to back who isn't crap. The Shah of Iran and Diem are great examples.

Chiefnj2
03-26-2008, 08:15 AM
He sounds like an ordinary politician calling for diplomacy first.

“We call upon all Iraqis to stage sit-ins all over Iraq as a first step,” he said in a statement. “And if the people’s demands are not respected by the Iraqi government, the second step will be to declare civil revolt in Baghdad and all other provinces.”

The cleric then went on to threaten an unspecified “third step” suggesting he could abandon the ceasefire.

- You don't kill him because he is a figurehead that people listen to. He has been partly responsible for the cease fire and relative peace in the area. If you kill him you have less control over his group, a greater chance of them splintering off into more dangerous groups and then you have greater difficulty infiltrating, buying off, etc.

StcChief
03-26-2008, 08:26 AM
It's up the Iraqi gov't to deal with this clown

Radar Chief
03-26-2008, 08:48 AM
That's called being smart.

And, P.S., it's how Washington won the Revolutionary War, and how General Giap won in Vietnam.

They dressed like women to escape when their ideology subjugated women to the same degree? I can understand the whole powdered wig thing looking a bit metro sexual and all, but it’s not quite the same thing. ;)

go bowe
03-26-2008, 06:02 PM
Maybe they will. Are you sure he's still in control of the Basra Sadrists and that he's calling for an end to the ceasefire?cease fire extended : ] link (http://snipurl.com/22pdf [www_un_org)

control of basra : ] link (http://snipurl.com/22peq [www_msnbc_msn_com)...

go bowe
03-27-2008, 01:41 PM
cease fire extended : ] link (http://snipurl.com/22pdf%5Bwww_un_org)

control of basra : ] link (http://snipurl.com/22peq%5Bwww_msnbc_msn_com)...well shit...

those links just don't want to cooperate...

i guess i'm not holding my mouth the right way or something...

jAZ
03-27-2008, 01:45 PM
This just boggles my mind. Hasn't the US learned from past mistakes of dealing with Saddam and Bin Laden that supporting known radicals always come back to bite us in the ass?

IMO this is just gross incompetence to negotiate or give any kind of money to this guy. If you want to kill the snake you cut off its head.

Watch "Bush's War" on PBS right now.

L. Paul Bremer asked for permission to kill him when he had only 200 people under his influence right after he got there. They had plans to kill him 3 times when the Rice/Rumsfeld kept refusing to make a decision about him.

See my other thread for info the the program.

jAZ
03-27-2008, 01:56 PM
This just boggles my mind. Hasn't the US learned from past mistakes of dealing with Saddam and Bin Laden that supporting known radicals always come back to bite us in the ass?

IMO this is just gross incompetence to negotiate or give any kind of money to this guy. If you want to kill the snake you cut off its head.

They just got to the "why" part of this issue.

al-Sadr challenged the US in Najaf and made his HQ a mosque and basically challenged the US to attack him inside it. We finally moved to defeat his army, and destroyed everyone and everything surrounding the mosque.

They moved to enter the mosque and capture him, but for fear of destroying the mosque (or having him do so and blame us... and presumably cause "blowback"), we struck a deal to have him behave and survive.

jAZ
03-27-2008, 01:57 PM
I was puzzled/disappointed when the US/Iraqi leadership decided not to execute the warrant they had for the arrest of Sadr in connection with the murder of the leading Shiite moderate cleric at the outset of the post-war period, but I realize that I don't know what they believed were the pros and cons involved. It may well have been a mistake, but I can't say that with any degree of certainty.

But I do take issue with your assertion that it's always a mistake to deal with unsavory characters. We are a lot more likely to become aware of and take notice of cases where this is true, but it's not at all clear that we haven't had unmitigated successes dealing with these types of people from time to time.

Watch Bush's War.