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jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:26 PM
http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2008/03/breaking_condi/

BREAKING: Condi Rice Flirts With VP Possibility -- Speaks to Grover Norquist's Wednesday Group Meeting

Wednesday, Mar 26 2008, 10:07AM


Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is speaking this morning to Grover Norquist's weekly powerhouse gathering at Americans for Tax Reform of conservative associations, think tanks, and political operations.

At the semi-secret gatherings which Republican political hopefuls migrate to to get the blessing of not only Norquist but the diverse parts of the nation's conservative money and political machinery, Norquist gives everyone in the room 3 minutes to pitch their cause or issue. I have attended before, but if one wants to attend again -- no one may write or speak about the internal discussion or who attended.

In this case, however, I am not attending -- but a source other than Norquist has leaked this information to The Washington Note and Huffington Post.

As one major Republican operative told me yesterday:

Someone like Condi Rice doesn't go to Grover Norquist's den to talk about the Annapolis Middle East peace process. She's going to secure her future in Republican politics and to position herself as a 'potential' VP candidate on the McCain ticket.
Grover Norquist is author of the new book, Leave Us Alone: Getting the Government's Hands Off Our Money, Our Guns, Our Lives. It would be interesting to know which pages of the book Condi has dog-eared.

-- Steve Clemons

memyselfI
03-26-2008, 04:28 PM
For McCain, I assume.

Obama is toast if he's the nominee and this happens.

ClevelandBronco
03-26-2008, 04:31 PM
I'd like to hear much more about Ms. Rice's core political philosophy first.

On the other (cheerleading) hand, please, please, please.

irishjayhawk
03-26-2008, 04:34 PM
I could not think of a better reason to not vote for McCain if this was to happen. Likewise, I think I would just burst out laughing for time on end.

Has there been a less relevant secretary of state, as it is?

pikesome
03-26-2008, 04:39 PM
I like (mostly) Rice.

We could call this ticket "The Devil and Ms Rice".

jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:41 PM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11. I'd LOVE for her to run on McCain's ticket and return the focus to her competency.

pikesome
03-26-2008, 04:41 PM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11. I'd LOVE for her to run on McCain's ticket and return the focus to her competency.

???

I guess I missed that.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:42 PM
I can see the GOP Convention signs now...

http://reilly.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/four_more_years.jpg

noa
03-26-2008, 04:42 PM
Obama is toast if he's the nominee and this happens.

I was going to vote for Obama just because he's black, but now that Condi is running, I'll vote Repub because they have a candidate who is black and a woman! Plus she's full on black, even better than Obama!

jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:46 PM
http://images.cafepress.com/product/28182768v2_240x240_Front.jpg

pikesome
03-26-2008, 04:46 PM
I was going to vote for Obama just because he's black, but now that Condi is running, I'll vote Repub because they have a candidate who is black and a woman! Plus she's full on black, even better than Obama!

ROFL

a1na2
03-26-2008, 04:48 PM
I could not think of a better reason to not vote for McCain if this was to happen. Likewise, I think I would just burst out laughing for time on end.

Has there been a less relevant secretary of state, as it is?

Ever heard of Albright?

a1na2
03-26-2008, 04:50 PM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11. I'd LOVE for her to run on McCain's ticket and return the focus to her competency.

9/11 was in the planning stages in 1994 after the failed 1993 attempt to topple the WTC. Condi Rice was not involved at the time. Your opinion and information seems to be flawed.

Here's one for you.

http://www.bercasio .com/movies/ dems-wmd- before-iraq. wmv (http://www.bercasio.com/movies/dems-wmd-before-iraq.wmv)

BigMeatballDave
03-26-2008, 04:56 PM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11. I'd LOVE for her to run on McCain's ticket and return the focus to her competency.If she were a democrat, you'd be in love with her...

jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:59 PM
9/11 was in the planning stages in 1994 after the failed 1993 attempt to topple the WTC. Condi Rice was not involved at the time. Your opinion and information seems to be flawed.
That's besde the point, since (no matter whether you assign blame or not) 9/11 could have been averted all the way up until 9/11/01.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 04:59 PM
If she were a democrat, you'd be in love with her...
Not if I was able to see her in action over the last 8 years like I have. She's incompetent.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:01 PM
I tried to get this into my Avatar. Wouldn't fit.

http://static.crooksandliars.com/2008/03/m-is-w-08.gif

SBK
03-26-2008, 05:02 PM
If she's on the ticket then can republicans call anyone that votes for Obama or Hillary either racist or sexist?

stevieray
03-26-2008, 05:09 PM
look at jaz jiz all over himself...he's not worried, that's why he's reduced to "castigating" pics....

ROFL

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:21 PM
look at jaz jiz all over himself...he's not worried, that's why he's reduced to "castigating" pics....

ROFL
Reduced?

ROFL

It would be a blast seeing a "FOUR MORE YEARS!" campaign from the GOP.

a1na2
03-26-2008, 05:21 PM
That's besde the point, since (no matter whether you assign blame or not) 9/11 could have been averted all the way up until 9/11/01.

I want to hear the reasoning behind this statement.

I'll wait, no speculation, only facts please.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:22 PM
If she's on the ticket then can republicans call anyone that votes for Obama or Hillary either racist or sexist?

It might even take race and gender out of the race almost entirely. That would be really interesting (and a good thing).

FOUR MORE YEARS!

Taco John
03-26-2008, 05:31 PM
Her popularity baffles me.

irishjayhawk
03-26-2008, 05:43 PM
Her popularity baffles me.

QFT.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-26-2008, 05:44 PM
I thought the Peter Principle stated that you got promoted to your level of incompetence. She proved that at her Nat'l Security post, lapped it as SoS, and now she'd be running away at Secretariat-like lengths were she Veep.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:47 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/30/AR2006093000282.html

Two Months Before 9/11, an Urgent Warning to Rice
Sunday, October 1, 2006; Page A17


On July 10, 2001, two months before the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, then-CIA Director George J. Tenet met with his counterterrorism chief, J. Cofer Black, at CIA headquarters to review the latest on Osama bin Laden and his al-Qaeda terrorist organization. Black laid out the case, consisting of communications intercepts and other top-secret intelligence showing the increasing likelihood that al-Qaeda would soon attack the United States. It was a mass of fragments and dots that nonetheless made a compelling case, so compelling to Tenet that he decided he and Black should go to the White House immediately.

Tenet called Condoleezza Rice, then national security adviser, from the car and said he needed to see her right away. There was no practical way she could refuse such a request from the CIA director.

For months, Tenet had been pressing Rice to set a clear counterterrorism policy, including specific presidential orders called "findings" that would give the CIA stronger authority to conduct covert action against bin Laden. Perhaps a dramatic appearance -- Black called it an "out of cycle" session, beyond Tenet's regular weekly meeting with Rice -- would get her attention.

Tenet had been losing sleep over the recent intelligence he'd seen. There was no conclusive, smoking-gun intelligence, but there was such a huge volume of data that an intelligence officer's instinct strongly suggested that something was coming. He and Black hoped to convey the depth of their anxiety and get Rice to kick-start the government into immediate action.

He did not know when, where or how, but Tenet felt there was too much noise in the intelligence systems. Two weeks earlier, he had told Richard A. Clarke, the National Security Council's counterterrorism director: "It's my sixth sense, but I feel it coming. This is going to be the big one."

[...]

Tenet hoped his abrupt request for an immediate meeting would shake Rice. He and Black, a veteran covert operator, had two main points when they met with her. First, al-Qaeda was going to attack American interests, possibly in the United States itself. Black emphasized that this amounted to a strategic warning, meaning the problem was so serious that it required an overall plan and strategy. Second, this was a major foreign policy problem that needed to be addressed immediately. They needed to take action that moment -- covert, military, whatever -- to thwart bin Laden.

[...]

Tenet and Black felt they were not getting through to Rice. She was polite, but they felt the brush-off. President Bush had said he didn't want to swat at flies.

[...]Rice seemed focused on other administration priorities, especially the ballistic missile defense system that Bush had campaigned on. She was in a different place.

Tenet left the meeting feeling frustrated. Though Rice had given them a fair hearing, no immediate action meant great risk. Black felt the decision to just keep planning was a sustained policy failure. Rice and the Bush team had been in hibernation too long. "Adults should not have a system like this," he said later.

[...]

Afterward, Tenet looked back on the meeting with Rice as a tremendous lost opportunity to prevent or disrupt the Sept. 11 attacks. Rice could have gotten through to Bush on the threat, but she just didn't get it in time, Tenet thought. He felt that he had done his job and had been very direct about the threat, but that Rice had not moved quickly. He felt she was not organized and did not push people, as he tried to do at the CIA.

stevieray
03-26-2008, 05:48 PM
Reduced?

ROFL

It would be a blast seeing a "FOUR MORE YEARS!" campaign from the GOP.

yes...r...e...d...u...c...e...d...made even more evident by quoting a phrase that doesn't even apply in this election.

a1na2
03-26-2008, 05:51 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/30/AR2006093000282.html
Two Months Before 9/11, an Urgent Warning to Rice
Sunday, October 1, 2006; Page A17


On July 10, 2001, two months before the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, then-CIA Director George J. Tenet met with his counterterrorism chief, J. Cofer Black, at CIA headquarters to review the latest on Osama bin Laden and his al-Qaeda terrorist organization. Black laid out the case, consisting of communications intercepts and other top-secret intelligence showing the increasing likelihood that al-Qaeda would soon attack the United States. It was a mass of fragments and dots that nonetheless made a compelling case, so compelling to Tenet that he decided he and Black should go to the White House immediately.

Tenet called Condoleezza Rice, then national security adviser, from the car and said he needed to see her right away. There was no practical way she could refuse such a request from the CIA director.

For months, Tenet had been pressing Rice to set a clear counterterrorism policy, including specific presidential orders called "findings" that would give the CIA stronger authority to conduct covert action against bin Laden. Perhaps a dramatic appearance -- Black called it an "out of cycle" session, beyond Tenet's regular weekly meeting with Rice -- would get her attention.

Tenet had been losing sleep over the recent intelligence he'd seen. There was no conclusive, smoking-gun intelligence, but there was such a huge volume of data that an intelligence officer's instinct strongly suggested that something was coming. He and Black hoped to convey the depth of their anxiety and get Rice to kick-start the government into immediate action.

He did not know when, where or how, but Tenet felt there was too much noise in the intelligence systems. Two weeks earlier, he had told Richard A. Clarke, the National Security Council's counterterrorism director: "It's my sixth sense, but I feel it coming. This is going to be the big one."

[...]

Tenet hoped his abrupt request for an immediate meeting would shake Rice. He and Black, a veteran covert operator, had two main points when they met with her. First, al-Qaeda was going to attack American interests, possibly in the United States itself. Black emphasized that this amounted to a strategic warning, meaning the problem was so serious that it required an overall plan and strategy. Second, this was a major foreign policy problem that needed to be addressed immediately. They needed to take action that moment -- covert, military, whatever -- to thwart bin Laden.

[...]

Tenet and Black felt they were not getting through to Rice. She was polite, but they felt the brush-off. President Bush had said he didn't want to swat at flies.

[...]Rice seemed focused on other administration priorities, especially the ballistic missile defense system that Bush had campaigned on. She was in a different place.

Tenet left the meeting feeling frustrated. Though Rice had given them a fair hearing, no immediate action meant great risk. Black felt the decision to just keep planning was a sustained policy failure. Rice and the Bush team had been in hibernation too long. "Adults should not have a system like this," he said later.

[...]

Afterward, Tenet looked back on the meeting with Rice as a tremendous lost opportunity to prevent or disrupt the Sept. 11 attacks. Rice could have gotten through to Bush on the threat, but she just didn't get it in time, Tenet thought. He felt that he had done his job and had been very direct about the threat, but that Rice had not moved quickly. He felt she was not organized and did not push people, as he tried to do at the CIA.



That is all very old and I've read the whole report.

What everyone seems to be dismissing is that until that day we had not lost any planes in the US to hijacking that had been used as ballistic weapons. Knowing there was a thread and knowing what that thread was is impossible to gauge.

Your report, though some would think impressive, is not the tell all that you expected it to be.

There is no way that 9/11 was going to be averted as well as there is little chance of stopping what is currently being planned at the moment. I'm not trying to be a fear monger, but there are credible threats in the works on many levels and not this administration nor the next are going to be able to ferret all of them out. Who are you going to blame then?

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:52 PM
Yes, let's include Condi in the 2008 race and let Obama talk about judgement again in the General Election.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 05:54 PM
That is all very old and I've read the whole report.

What everyone seems to be dismissing is that until that day we had not lost any planes in the US to hijacking that had been used as ballistic weapons. Knowing there was a thread and knowing what that thread was is impossible to gauge.

Your report, though some would think impressive, is not the tell all that you expected it to be.

There is no way that 9/11 was going to be averted as well as there is little chance of stopping what is currently being planned at the moment. I'm not trying to be a fear monger, but there are credible threats in the works on many levels and not this administration nor the next are going to be able to ferret all of them out. Who are you going to blame then?
You can't avert a threat when you aren't even trying to connect the dots. It's not the outcome it's the process that matters.

They didn't even try.

She was the singular point of failure in the process because she was a weak person in a room filled with major personalities. She didn't have the ear of the President and didn't fight to get it because she couldn't gague the threat because she was completely out of her class in her role.

Taco John
03-26-2008, 05:57 PM
If I was the security guard for an office complex, and on my watch the biggest break-in in company history took place -- I wouldn't be promoted to vice president of sales for my failure. I certainly wouldn't be talking to newspapers about entertaining offers for Vice President of the company.

But I hope that McCain does it and offers her the spot. I would love to have this next election be about what a huge failure the Bush Administration was.

ROYC75
03-26-2008, 06:00 PM
That's besde the point, since (no matter whether you assign blame or not) 9/11 could have been averted all the way up until 9/11/01.

But you placing the blame on her shows your lack of knowledge ....... Kinda like your views most of the time. :D

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:01 PM
But you placing the blame on her shows you lack of knowledge .......
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=4651185&postcount=26

a1na2
03-26-2008, 06:03 PM
You can't avert a threat when you aren't even trying to connect the dots. It's not the outcome it's the process that matters.

They didn't even try.

She was the singular point of failure in the process because she was a weak person in a room filled with major personalities. She didn't have the ear of the President and didn't fight to get it because she couldn't gague the threat because she was completely out of her class in her role.

Edit: First you assume things that you know nothing about. You say that nobody raised a finger to find out what was going on, you are wrong. Very wrong. The government did not operate solely with what Condi Rice was doing, there were and are other parts of the government that are now and were then actively working against threats to our country.

Read your post again. There was tons of information that Tenent worried about. Do you honestly think that there was enough time, 60 days, to legibly decipher all of the information and determine exactly what they were up to?

I don't know what kind of intelligence training that you feel you have but what intelligence they had was plentiful but very non-descriptive. Most of it was dead ends. We were flooded with information that would have kept the whole administration busy until December of 2001.

Your attempts to divert the blame onto one person is ludicrous. Rice is only a player in the whole roundhouse of events that happened and in that roundhouse of players are many people from the Clinton administration, the first Bush administration and Reagan's administration.

If you think that you can do better I suggest that you put in your resume to the administration of your choice today. You can easily point fingers at what you see as a failed defense of the U.S against terrorism, but what defense do you put up against the four attacks during the Clinton administration? They had loads of information as well and did nothing.

Get off the Bush hate bandwagon and look forward. We actually have more pressing problems in the world than to worry about who we want to be responsible for something we could not do anything about.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:11 PM
Edit: First you assume things that you know nothing about. You say that nobody raised a finger to find out what was going on, you are wrong. Very wrong. The government did not operate solely with what Condi Rice was doing, there were and are other parts of the government that are now and were then actively working against threats to our country.
Whether they would have succeeded, we will never know because they didn't try. And that's the point. You can't tell me that were you sitting there in the room that day... knowing vaguely what you know now (that we would be attacked huge in months)... you would NEVER advise Condi to look the other way, even though at the time you didn't have any of the details.

You wouldn't tell her to wait and see.

You wouldn't stand there silently as they went on vaction for a month with these sorts of warnings at hand.

As they say, "shaking the trees" is what was needed. And they never did that. Condi is the place where the CIA's warnings went to die.

Not out of spite, but out of complete incompetence.

You can't argue that Condi has good judgement when looking at this moment in history. Condi should have been run out of office, not Tenent.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:12 PM
Edit: First you assume things that you know nothing about. You say that nobody raised a finger to find out what was going on, you are wrong. Very wrong. The government did not operate solely with what Condi Rice was doing, there were and are other parts of the government that are now and were then actively working against threats to our country.
Condi was the entry point into the President.

She killed Tenent's request.

a1na2
03-26-2008, 06:13 PM
Whether they would have succeeded, we will never know because they didn't try. And that's the point. You can't tell me that were you sitting there in the room that day... knowing vaguely what you know now (that we would be attacked huge in months)... you would NEVER advise Condi to look the other way, even though at the time you didn't have any of the details.

You wouldn't tell her to wait and see.

You wouldn't stand there silently as they went on vaction for a month with these sorts of warnings at hand.

As they say, "shaking the trees" is what was needed. And they never did that. Condi is the place where the CIA's warnings went to die.

Not out of spite, but out of complete incompetence.

You can't argue that Condi has good judgement when looking at this moment in history. Condi should have been run out of office, not Tenent.

You are totally missing the point. What Rice may have said had no impact on Tenent. He continued with the research as did other agencies. You are focusing on a single person and assuming things that you don't know anything about.

If you truly believe that nothing was ongoing after Tenent made his comment to Rice you are really hiding your head in the sand.

We continued then and we continue now.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:14 PM
Your attempts to divert the blame onto one person is ludicrous.
I never said she was solely to blame. I said she was the "primary point of failure in allowing 9/11".

This article explains exactly the moment of that failure.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:19 PM
What Rice may have said had no impact on Tenent. He continued with the research as did other agencies.
That's exactly the point.

He and Black hoped to convey the depth of their anxiety and get Rice to kick-start the government into immediate action.

[...]

They needed to take action that moment -- covert, military, whatever -- to thwart bin Laden.

[...]no immediate action meant great risk. Black felt the decision to just keep planning was a sustained policy failure. Rice and the Bush team had been in hibernation too long.

[...]Rice could have gotten through to Bush on the threat, but she just didn't get it in time, Tenet thought. ... He felt she ... did not push people, as he tried to do at the CIA.

a1na2
03-26-2008, 06:21 PM
That's exactly the point.
He and Black hoped to convey the depth of their anxiety and get Rice to kick-start the government into immediate action.

[...]

They needed to take action that moment -- covert, military, whatever -- to thwart bin Laden.

[...]no immediate action meant great risk. Black felt the decision to just keep planning was a sustained policy failure. Rice and the Bush team had been in hibernation too long.

[...]Rice could have gotten through to Bush on the threat, but she just didn't get it in time, Tenet thought. ... He felt she ... did not push people, as he tried to do at the CIA.

Jaz! It wasn't a kick start, it was an ongoing event. Do you think that Clinton did nothing after the first WTC attack? He got the wheels in motion, he did nothing with the information gained, but at least the agencies were in action.

If Tenent had to sit on his ass because Condi didn't tell him to do anything he should have been fired and or shot.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 06:27 PM
Jaz! It wasn't a kick start...
Tell that to Tenent who served under both Clinton and Bush and says you are wrong.

a1na2
03-26-2008, 06:54 PM
Tell that to Tenent who served under both Clinton and Bush and says you are wrong.

Have Mr. Tenent give me a call. I'd like to hear it from his mouth.

stevieray
03-26-2008, 06:58 PM
Whether they would have succeeded, we will never know because they didn't try. And that's the point. You can't tell me that were you sitting there in the room that day... knowing vaguely what you know now (that we would be attacked huge in months)... you would NEVER advise Bill to screw Monica and look the other way, even though at the time you didn't have any of the details.

You wouldn't tell Bill to wait and see.

You wouldn't stand there silently as he went on a whoring campaign for seven years with these sorts of attacks at hand.

As they say, "shaking the trees" is what was needed. And he never did that. Bill Clinton is the place where OBL's warnings went to die.

Not only out of infidelity, but out of complete incompetence.

You can't argue that Bill has good judgement when looking at this moment in history. Bill should have been run out of office, not Tenent.


funny how easy it is to expose the irony and double standards.

StcChief
03-26-2008, 07:33 PM
race cards in the wings

Warrior5
03-26-2008, 07:42 PM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11.

Seriously, who thinks this? I've never heard this.

jAZ
03-26-2008, 08:34 PM
Seriously, who thinks this? I've never heard this.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=4651185&postcount=26

StcChief
03-26-2008, 08:46 PM
Dems will try and blame her for 9/11.... but really it was Billie Jeff Clinton gutting intelligence and military leaving communication is disarray to find problems

jAZ
03-26-2008, 11:02 PM
Seriously, who thinks this? I've never heard this.

The reason you've not heard more about this is that they installed Condi's "close friend" as Executive Director of the 9/11 Commission.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/27/AR2006112701175.html

"Philip (Zelikow) is a close friend and we will continue to enjoy this friendship in the years ahead," Rice said in a statement.[...]

Zelikow was a consultant to Rice when she returned to Washington as President Bush's national security adviser, helping her restructure the NSC staff, though he did not join the administration at the time.

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/01/30/zelikow-interfered/

A forthcoming book by NYT reporter Philip Shenon — “The Commission: The Uncensored History of the 9/11 Investigation” — asserts that former 9/11 Commission executive director Philip Zelikow interfered with the 9/11 report.

According to the book, Zelikow had failed to inform the commission at the time he was hired that he was instrumental in helping Condoleezza Rice set up Bush’s National Security Council in 2001. Some panel staffers believe Zelikow stopped them from submitting a report depicting Rice’s performance prior to 9/11 as “amount[ing] to incompetence.”

[...]

In his book, Shenon also says that while working for the panel, Zelikow appears to have had private conversations with former White House political director Karl Rove, despite a ban on such communication, according to Holland. Shenon reports that Zelikow later ordered his assistant to stop keeping a log of his calls, although the commission’s general counsel overruled him, Holland wrote.

patteeu
03-27-2008, 12:52 AM
Condi is generally seen as the primary point of failure in allowing 9/11. I'd LOVE for her to run on McCain's ticket and return the focus to her competency.

Some people may see her that way, but it's a really dumb idea to have. I'm not a big Condi Rice fan and you might be right about her impact if she were to be McCain's running mate, but I really think that first notion is ridiculous.

Taco John
03-27-2008, 01:11 AM
Looking at it from every direction I possibly can, there's no two ways around the fact that Condi was pretty hapless and helpless as a National Security Advisor. It's true no matter what prism you examine it from. I'm trying to find an angle that paints her in a more positive light in that role, and as far as I can tell, it simply doesn't exist.

patteeu
03-27-2008, 01:14 AM
Condi was the entry point into the President.

She killed Tenent's request.

Tenet saw the president every day. He personally presented the PDB each morning. He had plenty of opportunity to interact with the President.

Taco John
03-27-2008, 01:17 AM
Tenet saw the president every day. He personally presented the PDB each morning. He had plenty of opportunity to interact with the President.



This is exactly the debate I want to see America have.

God I hope McCain picks her.

jAZ
03-27-2008, 01:25 AM
Tenet saw the president every day. He personally presented the PDB each morning. He had plenty of opportunity to interact with the President.
That doesn't change the fact that Condi was the "primary point of failure in allowing 9/11". Her job was was to be the judgement to Tenents intelligence reporting. She judged disasterously wrong. Her buddy Zelikow covered it up.

I'd LOVE to have her run with McCain and explore this in minute detail.

She's crazy to even consider trying to run but I don't think McCain is crazy enough to pick her.

Too bad, though.

patteeu
03-27-2008, 01:34 AM
That doesn't change the fact that Condi was the "primary point of failure in allowing 9/11". Her job was was to be the judgement to Tenents intelligence reporting. She judged disasterously wrong. Her buddy Zelikow covered it up.

I'd LOVE to have her run with McCain and explore this in minute detail.

She's crazy to even consider trying to run but I don't think McCain is crazy enough to pick her.

Too bad, though.

Except that it's not a fact. It's an idiotic and baseless smear. I don't particularly like Condi Rice that much and I tend to agree with you and Taco that she wouldn't be a very good VP choice for McCain, but I think this whole business about blaming her as the single-point of failure for not preventing 9/11 is ridiculous. The intelligence provided by Tenet didn't include anything specific as to "when, where or how" we might be attacked other than some vague information about hijacking planes (i.e. it wasn't actionable). It's a farce to pretend otherwise. And it's a part of the pathetic and fraudulent "connect the dots" meme that marked the point at which the democrat party decided to tear the country apart instead of facing the radical islamist threat as a united country. It really steams me to see you going back to that poisonous well.

jAZ
03-27-2008, 01:50 AM
Except that it's not a fact. It's an idiotic and baseless smear.
This is not a fact either.
...but I think this whole business about blaming her as the single-point of failure for not preventing 9/11 is ridiculous.
I didn't say "single point of failure" I said "primary point of failure". Critical difference in meaning.
The intelligence provided by Tenet didn't include anything specific as to "when, where or how" we might be attacked other than some vague information about hijacking planes (i.e. it wasn't actionable).
Her failure was in chosing not to act at that moment and following an overall process that lead to analysis paralysis, even in the face of dire warnings to change course.

And it's a part of the pathetic and fraudulent "connect the dots" meme that marked the point at which the democrat party decided to tear the country apart instead of facing the radical islamist threat as a united country. It really steams me to see you going back to that poisonous well.
Sometimes reality is ugly. Doesn't mean looking away is the right thing to do.

Taco John
03-27-2008, 01:57 AM
It's an idiotic and baseless smear...


Since when did you become so adverse to these?

a1na2
03-27-2008, 02:47 AM
Looking at it from every direction I possibly can, there's no two ways around the fact that Condi was pretty hapless and helpless as a National Security Advisor. It's true no matter what prism you examine it from. I'm trying to find an angle that paints her in a more positive light in that role, and as far as I can tell, it simply doesn't exist.

This quote has a lot of moxy considering it comes from someone that feels that the attack on 9/11 was an inside job and that we used nuclear (mini-nukes) to bring down the WTC.

ROFLROFLROFL

a1na2
03-27-2008, 03:12 AM
Except that it's not a fact. It's an idiotic and baseless smear. I don't particularly like Condi Rice that much and I tend to agree with you and Taco that she wouldn't be a very good VP choice for McCain, but I think this whole business about blaming her as the single-point of failure for not preventing 9/11 is ridiculous. The intelligence provided by Tenet didn't include anything specific as to "when, where or how" we might be attacked other than some vague information about hijacking planes (i.e. it wasn't actionable). It's a farce to pretend otherwise. And it's a part of the pathetic and fraudulent "connect the dots" meme that marked the point at which the democrat party decided to tear the country apart instead of facing the radical islamist threat as a united country. It really steams me to see you going back to that poisonous well.

The other side has to have something to hang their hat on. Clinton was ineffective against terrorism for 8 years and now the left is doing their best to give Bush the same wrap.

jAZ
04-12-2008, 10:58 PM
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