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View Full Version : A New Civil War in Iraq?


Mr. Laz
03-30-2008, 12:38 PM
A New Civil War in Iraq? (http://poligazette.com/2008/03/27/a-new-civil-war-in-iraq/)

Filed under: Feature (http://poligazette.com/category/feature/), Iraq (http://poligazette.com/category/iraq/), Middle East (http://poligazette.com/category/middle-east/) — Michael van der Galien on March 27, 2008 @ 7:13 pm CET

<script src="http://feeds.feedburner.com/%7Es/Poligazette?i=http://poligazette.com/2008/03/27/a-new-civil-war-in-iraq/" type="text/javascript" charset="utf-8"></script> The British newspaper the Independent reports (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/iraq-implodes-as-shia-fights-shia-801214.html) that “[a] new civil war is threatening to explode in Iraq as American-backed Iraqi government forces fight Shia militiamen for control of Basra and parts of Baghdad.” “Heavy fighting,” the Independent report says, “engulfed Iraq’s two largest cities and spread to other towns yesterday as the Iraqi Prime Minister, Nouri al-Maliki, gave fighters of the Mehdi Army, led by the radical cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, 72 hours to surrender their weapons.”
The good news is that Maliki seemingly feels strong enough to demand such a thing. He’s a Shiite himself. Some have argued that he’s not exactly an enemy of Shiite extremists; his actions now seem to imply that the only reason he wasn’t fighting them actively was because he didn’t have the manpower to do so. Now that he does, he doesn’t seem willing to give them one inch.
That’s the good news, the bad news is yet another kind of civil war isn’t exactly what Iraq needs. Shiite on Shiite fighting will throw a significant part of the country into chaos, all the more so because Shiites form the majority of the Iraqi people.
The supporters of Mr Sadr, who form the largest political movement in Iraq, blame the Americans for giving the go-ahead for Mr Maliki’s offensive against them and supporting it with helicopters and bomber aircraft. US troops have sealed off Sadr City, the close-packed slum in the capital with a population that is the main bastion of the Sadrists, while the Mehdi Army has taken over its streets, establishing checkpoints, each manned by about 20 heavily armed men. It is unlikely that the militiamen in Basra will surrender as demanded by the government. Sadiq al-Rikabi, an adviser to Mr Maliki, said those who kept their weapons would be arrested. “Any gunman who does not do that within three days will be an outlaw.”
Streets were empty in Basra and Baghdad as people stayed at home to avoid the fighting. The Mehdi Army is enforcing a strike in Baghdad with mosques calling for the closure of shops, businesses and schools.
It’s clear that it’s difficult for Sunni Iraqis to deal with this. If they unite behind the government, Shiites may very well unite against the government, seeing it as a puppet of both Sunnis and Americans. If they don’t throw their weight behind the central government however, that government is probably too weak to deal with Shiite militias.
For now, however, it’s more of a Shiite on Shiite battle, or a government on Shiite battle. And that’s a good sign (in so far that it proves that the government thinks it’s strong enough to take on militias in certain cities):
Mr Sadr has sent emissaries to Mr Maliki asking him to remove his troops, numbering some 15,000 men from Basra, and to resolve problems peacefully. But his aides say there will be no talks until the Iraqi army reinforcements are withdrawn. The offer of talks is in keeping with Mr Sadr’s past behaviour, which is to appear conciliatory but in practice to make few real concessions. The US is claiming that the Sadrists are not being singled out, only Iran-supported militia factions, but this will find few believers in Iraq.
“This is not a battle against the [Mehdi Army] nor is it a proxy war between the United States and Iran,” said a US military spokesman, Major General Kevin Bergner. “It is [the] government of Iraq taking the necessary action to deal with criminals on the streets.”

HonestChieffan
03-30-2008, 12:42 PM
and what in this is news?

whoman69
03-30-2008, 02:47 PM
The Biden plan is the only way to go.

Mr. Laz
03-30-2008, 07:20 PM
and what in this is news?
i realize your too busy sucking off George Bush to actually think about it .... but the fact that after the shiite basically ethnically cleanse a good portion of Iraq under U.S. watch that a new civil war is brewing amongst the shiites themselves is pretty big "news"

banyon
03-30-2008, 07:31 PM
Don't you know by now that you're not allowed to point out anything negative that happens over there? It just means you are anti-American and are rooting for us to lose.

Also Al-Qaeda reads this forum daily looking for the inspiration you have provided them.

Radar Chief
03-31-2008, 07:49 AM
Don't you know by now that you're not allowed to point out anything negative that happens over there? It just means you are anti-American and are rooting for us to lose.

Also Al-Qaeda reads this forum daily looking for the inspiration you have provided them.

Really? I thought you were supposed to bitch incessantly about nothing in particular, blaming all problems on those other people, then switch topics / demagogue the source once asked for specifics. :shrug:

patteeu
03-31-2008, 09:53 AM
i realize your too busy sucking off George Bush to actually think about it .... but the fact that after the shiite basically ethnically cleanse a good portion of Iraq under U.S. watch that a new civil war is brewing amongst the shiites themselves is pretty big "news"

Is this the first you're hearing about violent-at-times rivalries among the shiite factions? No wonder Iraq is such a puzzle to you.

This is actually good news, IMO. It looks like it's a crack down on the other side of the anti-government problem (Shiite militias) as the follow-on to our crack down on the Sunni elements of the insurgency, largely led by AQI. To the extent that this is violence at the time and place of the government's choosing rather than a desperate reaction to an insurgency that is out of hand, it ought to be welcomed by those who want the war to go well for the US and our allies.

HonestChieffan
03-31-2008, 09:54 AM
Well, if the US tries to stop it the anti war girls all get upset. If the US does nothing they get all mad cause its the Bush's fault.

Yall need to find a position and stay there.

BigOlChiefsfan
04-01-2008, 09:39 AM
Update (http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2008/03/maliki_security_oper.php)

banyon
04-01-2008, 09:45 AM
Well, if the US tries to stop it the anti war girls all get upset. If the US does nothing they get all mad cause its the Bush's fault.

Yall need to find a position and stay there.

I want us to stay the f*** out and don't give a f*** about this hellhole. That's pretty much been my position since day -100. Hasn't changed an iota.

patteeu
04-01-2008, 09:47 AM
Update (http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2008/03/maliki_security_oper.php)

Thanks for the update! :)

It's great to hear that Maliki is refusing to call off the dogs. Hopefully he will follow through.

BucEyedPea
04-01-2008, 09:48 AM
Looky here! Iran helps with cease-fire in Iraq! Those troublemakers!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2008-03-30-iraqnews_N.htm

patteeu
04-01-2008, 09:53 AM
Looky here! Iran helps with cease-fire in Iraq! Those troublemakers!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2008-03-30-iraqnews_N.htm

It's great that Iran has been helping shiite militias kill Americans so that they now have the clout with those militias to broker a temporary truce. Hooray for Iran! Hooray for Iran! :rolleyes:

BucEyedPea
04-01-2008, 10:03 AM
:lame:

You can blame Cheny and his cohorts for placing them in danger in the first place.

BigOlChiefsfan
04-01-2008, 10:15 AM
FYI (http://fallbackbelmont.blogspot.com/2008/03/after-surge.html)

Amnorix
04-01-2008, 10:22 AM
Looky here! Iran helps with cease-fire in Iraq! Those troublemakers!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2008-03-30-iraqnews_N.htm


Not to be a pessimist, but if I was Iran and I was an Islamic fundamentalist nut job, I'd be telling my little puppets to sit still and be quiet until the big bad Americans leave, and THAT is when we rise and take over the place.

BucEyedPea
04-01-2008, 10:41 AM
FYI (http://fallbackbelmont.blogspot.com/2008/03/after-surge.html)

"Maliki is anti-American, and has expressed his anti-American views to friends and in private discourse."

Wow! Interesting.

Adept Havelock
04-01-2008, 11:17 AM
"Maliki is anti-American, and has expressed his anti-American views to friends and in private discourse."

Wow! Interesting.

He's also declaring "success". I suppose letting Sadr go back to the Status Quo Ante Bellum qualifies. :shrug:

BigOlChiefsfan
04-01-2008, 08:23 PM
1 view (http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NjAwOTAwNjhhNzc1ZDc1MzEyNTMzYzFmZDliZGRiZmU=)

Another view (http://blog.wired.com/defense/2008/04/did-maliki-do-s.html)

The only view that matters. The freakin' CFR (old, but useful analysis) (http://www.cfr.org/publication/11787/)

Current CFR analysis (http://www.cfr.org/publication/15839/shiite_strife.html?breadcrumb=%2Findex)

a1na2
04-01-2008, 08:51 PM
Well, if the US tries to stop it the anti war girls all get upset. If the US does nothing they get all mad cause its the Bush's fault.

Yall need to find a position and stay there.

They have a position. It's riding the fence with one of the fence posts shoved up their ass so they can remain high centered.

whoman69
04-01-2008, 10:22 PM
How long do we expect the factions and militias to stay bribed?

BigOlChiefsfan
04-02-2008, 08:38 AM
Austin Bay (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/04/whittling_away_at_sadr.html)

email from Iraq (http://instapundit.com/archives2/017288.php)

StcChief
04-02-2008, 09:09 AM
"Maliki is anti-American, and has expressed his anti-American views to friends and in private discourse."

Wow! Interesting.another Politician trying to hold his job

http://www.lyricsfreak.com/c/cream/politician_20034202.html

By jack bruce and pete brown

Hey now baby, get into my big black car.
Hey now baby, get into my big black car.
I want to just show you what my politics are.

Im a political man and I practice what I preach.
Im a political man and I practice what I preach.
So dont deny me baby, not while youre in my reach.

I support the left, though Im leaning, leaning to the right.
I support the left, though Im leaning to the right.
But Im just not there when its coming to a fight.

Hey now baby, get into my big black car.
Hey now baby, get into my big black car.
I want to just show you what my politics are.

Radar Chief
04-02-2008, 10:14 AM
Good posts BOCf. Rep. :thumb:

patteeu
04-02-2008, 10:28 AM
Good posts BOCf. Rep. :thumb:

Seconded.

Iowanian
04-02-2008, 10:28 AM
These assholes are going to fight.

Its not if...its when.

When the US pulls out, Iraq is going to have a bloodbath. Al Sadr, Badr Brigade, other militias looking for power and credibility, and the Sunni fighting back to try to regain control.

Its going to happen, and the US will get the blame.

Adept Havelock
04-02-2008, 10:35 AM
These assholes are going to fight.

Its not if...its when.

When the US pulls out, Iraq is going to have a bloodbath. Al Sadr, Badr Brigade, other militias looking for power and credibility, and the Sunni fighting back to try to regain control.

Its going to happen, and the US will get the blame.

Yep. Malaki just got a bloody nose from Sadr. He's declaring "success", but the Sadr guys get to keep their weapons and stay intact. Just a matter of time before round 2, round 3, etc. The the Sunnis get involved... :Lin: