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dtrain
04-16-2008, 12:55 PM
Hope this hasn't already been posted
http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=227&Itemid=1

New England and Kansas City

The New England Patriots and the Kansas City Chiefs may get into conversations about switching draft spots in the first round of the 2008 NFL Draft. If the draft goes according to how many projectóChris Long , Jake Long , Glenn Dorsey , and Darren McFadden in some order in the top four picksóit makes no sense for the Chiefs to stay put and select an offensive tackle, which most believe is in fact the position the Chiefs are going to target with the 5th pick. The Kansas City Chiefs are a team with many needs and should relish the possibility of moving down in the draft and accumulating an additional draft pick. The player that would be remaining on the board that the New England Patriots would covet is Vernon Gholston from Ohio State. The Pats have a hole at a vital position in their defensive scheme, the 3-4 OLB position, one in which Gholston would be the ideal fit. The Patriots have transitioned athletic collegiate defensive ends and into linebackers in their 3-4 scheme (see Mike Vrabel, Tedy Bruschi, etc.) and although many pundits believe the Patriots will use the 7th overall selection on a CB the likes of Leodis McKelvin or Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie , the Patriots normally prefer to wait until the latter portions of the NFL Draft in order to find cornerbacks who fit their scheme nicely (see Asante Samuel, Randall Gay, etc.). The Patriots own a late 2nd round selection as well as an early 3rd round selection by virtue of a trade, they could deal one of those selections and still have a fairly early selection to get a CB, possibly a Charles Godfrey , Chevis Jackson , or Trae Williams, all of whom would fit their scheme nicely. From the New England Patriots perspective what makes a ton of sense is for the Patriots to package their 2nd round pick with the 7th pick overall and move up to #5 pick and select Vernon Gholston , not only would it fit their biggest need, but they would also nab the player that their division rival the New York Jets covet the most one selection in front of them. From the Kansas City Chiefs perspective it makes a lot of sense to move down to #7 and select a Jeffrey Otah or Ryan Clady to fill their need at offensive tackle, and then with their own 2nd round pick and the 2nd round selection acquired from the Pats in this deal, the Chiefs could address two other huge areas of need at offensive guard and cornerback and acquire a combo the likes of Chilo Rachal at guard and Tracy Porter or Patrick Lee at CB.

el borracho
04-16-2008, 01:01 PM
I'm open to a trade but not that trade. If we trade out of the top 5 we had better be raping the other team in value. The 2nd to last pick in the 2nd round doesn't do it for me.

Pestilence
04-16-2008, 01:01 PM
I'd take a trade down to #7 if we grab Sedrick Ellis.

Amnorix
04-16-2008, 01:02 PM
You will be able to knock me over with a feather if the Pats take a CB at 7, despie what all the pundits say, unless they think he's the next coming of Mike Haynes or Deion Sanders or whatever.

Stryker
04-16-2008, 01:10 PM
I would rather stay put take Matt Ryan and go for Sam Baker in the 2nd.

That trade sounds like it only benefits N.E.

Reerun_KC
04-16-2008, 01:11 PM
Trade up 2 spots for just a 2nd rounder?

Carl is ****ing stupid, but not that stupid.....

No way should we trade that to the already loaded Pats, unless we see another 1st out of it...

Reerun_KC
04-16-2008, 01:13 PM
Or maybe NE's 2nd, 3rd and 4th in this years draft....

EyePod
04-16-2008, 01:13 PM
I'd take a trade down to #7 if we grab Sedrick Ellis.

I'd be fine with taking him at 5. Also, it's gonna be awesome when we help NE get Gholston and then he destroys us on opening day!! oh wait... I mean.. The Chiefs are going to be the first team to defeat the Patriots in the regular season in a loooonnggg time (they're 19-0 right now). You heard it here first! (Although I'm pretty sure that someone else has said this already...)

EyePod
04-16-2008, 01:15 PM
Trade up 2 spots for just a 2nd rounder?

Carl is ****ing stupid, but not that stupid.....

No way should we trade that to the already loaded Pats, unless we see another 1st out of it...

There's that handy-dandy draft pick value spreadsheet, and their 2nd round pick (it's late 2nd) is basically the difference. You're an idiot if you think we could get any more than that.

http://www.theredzone.org/2006/draft/draftvaluechart.asp

There's the chart. If we got clady or ellis at 7, that could be a really helpful pick.

BigChiefFan
04-16-2008, 01:15 PM
Look at what the GREAT TEAM is doing and what the bad team is proposing? See a correlation? Great team goes after great players, looks like the Chiefs are worried about filling holes and not taking BAA. **** e'm. Whoopty, we get a lazy ass LT and a reach of a guard, the Pats get a stud. This sounds tangiable. The more I start to see Gretz and the FO talk, the more I realize they aren't committed to become stellar, they're committed to getting back to mediocrity.

Pestilence
04-16-2008, 01:15 PM
I'd be fine with taking him at 5. Also, it's gonna be awesome when we help NE get Gholston and then he destroys us on opening day!! oh wait... I mean.. The Chiefs are going to be the first team to defeat the Patriots in the regular season in a loooonnggg time (they're 19-0 right now). You heard it here first! (Although I'm pretty sure that someone else has said this already...)

I'm fine with grabbing him there as well.

EyePod
04-16-2008, 01:39 PM
Isn't Otah really fat and lazy?

eazyb81
04-16-2008, 01:51 PM
Trade up 2 spots for just a 2nd rounder?

Carl is ****ing stupid, but not that stupid.....

No way should we trade that to the already loaded Pats, unless we see another 1st out of it...

This would be a great deal, value-wise.

PhillyChiefFan
04-16-2008, 01:54 PM
Isn't Otah really fat and lazy?

340 lbs, 6'-6"

SNR
04-16-2008, 01:57 PM
This could be a brilliant move. If Dorsey or Ellis is still there when we pick at 5 and we trade down to 7, we'd probably still be able to grab either of those guys.

noa
04-16-2008, 02:02 PM
I remember a thread from a couple months ago detailing trades the Patriots have made over the years. The moral of the story was: DON'T TRADE WITH THE PATRIOTS. YOU WILL GET SCREWED.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 02:03 PM
The only way trading down makes any sense for the Chiefs is if someone gives up a next years 1st....they already have enough picks in this years draft...

BigRock
04-16-2008, 02:05 PM
This could be a brilliant move. If Dorsey or Ellis is still there when we pick at 5 and we trade down to 7, we'd probably still be able to grab either of those guys.
The key is that there has to be someone still on the board that the Jets would want to take. If the only top guys still left at pick six are, say, Ellis and Ryan, what would stop the Jets from trading down with Cinci or New Orleans or somebody so that they could grab Ellis before we do?

eazyb81
04-16-2008, 02:05 PM
This could be a brilliant move. If Dorsey or Ellis is still there when we pick at 5 and we trade down to 7, we'd probably still be able to grab either of those guys.

Or if they have the heart set on someone like Otah or Clady. I would much rather them trade down and pick them at 7 instead of stay put and pick them at 5.

SNR
04-16-2008, 02:12 PM
I remember a thread from a couple months ago detailing trades the Patriots have made over the years. The moral of the story was: DON'T TRADE WITH THE PATRIOTS. YOU WILL GET SCREWED.Damn. What's going on in the Patriots' locker room?

CRYSTALBALLGATE!!!!!!111

Tribal Warfare
04-16-2008, 02:19 PM
The only way trading down makes any sense for the Chiefs is if someone gives up a next years 1st....


Bingo!

noa
04-16-2008, 02:23 PM
Damn. What's going on in the Patriots' locker room?

CRYSTALBALLGATE!!!!!!111

I found the thread. http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=174429
That's some pretty funny stuff there.

Frankie
04-16-2008, 02:31 PM
1- Ryan Clady (OT)
2a- Patrick Lee (CB)
2b- Chilo Rachal (OG)

I'd enthusiastically go for that.

Hoover
04-16-2008, 02:34 PM
I'd be for it. We need another high draft pick to start adding some talent to the offense.

Picking up a 2nd rounder to drop 2 spots isn't that bad.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 02:37 PM
1- Ryan Clady (OT)
2a- Patrick Lee (CB)
2b- Chilo Rachal (OG)

I'd enthusiastically go for that.


Blah, Ryan Clady ain't even good......I'm sorry that guy would be the absolute worst pick.

Chief_in_Commander
04-16-2008, 02:38 PM
I would only be for it if we get the guy we really want. No matter what, you have to get a solid player with a top 10 pick, especially when your in rebuilding mode (as are most teams in that position). If we are going to be able to draft the same guy at 7 as we would at 5, then why the hell would you not take the extra pick? If your going to draft some lazy shit linemen instead of ellis or dorsey, no f'n way.......

Hoover
04-16-2008, 02:43 PM
We could trade down to #7 with the Pats and pick up a 2nd rounder. Then trade down and for some other teams 1st rounder next year.

Its a pipe dream as there has to be a player on the board a team really wants.

I actually like getting the 2nd 2nd round pick so we have the ability to jump up in round 2 to grab the player we want if we need to.

sedated
04-16-2008, 02:58 PM
Why would a team that's beginning to rebuild trade this year's 1st rounder for next year's? Seems to be delaying the process a little.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 02:59 PM
Uh....I'm talking about getting their pick and next years first rounder I didn't think I had to actually spell that out.

Amnorix
04-16-2008, 03:00 PM
I remember a thread from a couple months ago detailing trades the Patriots have made over the years. The moral of the story was: DON'T TRADE WITH THE PATRIOTS. YOU WILL GET SCREWED.


That's generally true of teams trading their future in a desperate bid to improve now. Not sure if that rule applies when the Pats are the ones moving up...

IMHO Pats won't move up.

Amnorix
04-16-2008, 03:02 PM
The only way trading down makes any sense for the Chiefs is if someone gives up a next years 1st....they already have enough picks in this years draft...

That's silly. #7 and Pats end of 2nd round pick for the #5 wouldn't be that bad.

They could package their 2 2nds and move back into the end of hte first round. Or trade one of those picks for another pick next year, or whatever.

Brock
04-16-2008, 03:02 PM
No, not enough. Not even close.

Amnorix
04-16-2008, 03:03 PM
Uh....I'm talking about getting their pick and next years first rounder I didn't think I had to actually spell that out.

You'd have to move waaay down from #5 to get that package.

Bob Dole
04-16-2008, 03:05 PM
The only way trading down makes any sense for the Chiefs is if someone gives up a next years 1st....they already have enough picks in this years draft...

Whatever we do, it will be worse than what any other team in the league would have done in the same situation.

Our #5 pick wouldn't be a #20 pick on any other team.

bsp4444
04-16-2008, 03:07 PM
I like the deal and I'd take Ryan Clady at #7.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:08 PM
That's silly. #7 and Pats end of 2nd round pick for the #5 wouldn't be that bad.

They could package their 2 2nds and move back into the end of hte first round. Or trade one of those picks for another pick next year, or whatever.

Value alone says that moving those 2 spots is worth more than 1 pick...

If this team picks Ryan Clady with a top 10 pick I will really stop caring and then just start laughing.

aturnis
04-16-2008, 03:10 PM
This trade is my dream scenario.

#7 Ellis
2nd BPA OT, CB, OG, WR, QB (probably OT)
2nd BPA OT, CB, OG, WR, QB
3rd BPA OT, CB, OG, WR, QB

Potentially, if the chiefs scout well enough, we could see 4 starters in the 1st 3 rounds with this trade. Not to mention the fact that we would have 7 picks left for a new kicker, return specialist,(if we haven't already gotten a 2'fer guy with one of those top 4 picks) Fullback, more depth for D'backs, lineman,(offensive and defensive) receivers and linebackers. In order of BPA of course...

You would be an "idiot of Mecca proportions" not to take this deal. Considering a guy that you want will still probably be around when you pick at #7. Whether that be OT, DT or any other position is up to the Chiefs. IMO, if you don't get Long, might as well wait 'til the 2nd for a OT. A lot of guys have stated that there will be starting tackles available through the first 3 rounds no problem.

JBucc
04-16-2008, 03:11 PM
I would just take Ellis, but if Herm and Carl are hell bent on taking a tackle anyway trading down a few spots and picking up another 2nd would be smart. And hey if the Jets don't take Ellis it's the best of both worlds.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:13 PM
Aturnis calls me an idiot yet he doesn't understand what pick value is.....if you trade from 5 to 7 you should get more than a single pick....or you got undervalued in your trade.

SBK
04-16-2008, 03:13 PM
I was hoping we could trade down infinity times and not even have to worry about picking anyone.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:14 PM
I was hoping we could trade down infinity times and not even have to worry about picking anyone.

The only way this team will ever be good is if we trade down 14 times and have 27 picks on the 2nd day!

That way we can take 12 OT's!

Hog Farmer
04-16-2008, 03:18 PM
Picking up a 2nd rounder to drop 2 spots is a good deal when you know the 2 spots you pass up will not cost you someone you are targeting. if we are after Clady or Otah we could even trade down again for more additional picks and still get one of them.

Brock
04-16-2008, 03:20 PM
I'd make the Patriots pay a cheating tax, but that's just me.

aturnis
04-16-2008, 03:23 PM
Aturnis calls me an idiot yet he doesn't understand what pick value is.....if you trade from 5 to 7 you should get more than a single pick....or you got undervalued in your trade.


#5 is worth 1700 pts.
#7 is worth 1500 pts.

New Englands 2nd(62) is worth 284 pts.

Now according to my calculations, if you add 1500, and 284, you come up with a larger number. 1784 to be exact. Which, if my other calculations that I did are also correct...would mean that 1784 > 1700. Damn! Mecca is an Azzhat!

aturnis
04-16-2008, 03:24 PM
I'd make the Patriots pay a cheating tax, but that's just me.

Amen...

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:30 PM
Guess what when I watched a team trade a 2 to go from 6 to 5 a couple years ago, I want more than a 2.....

But hey you can be insulting all you want, it speaks volumes for you to throw back handed insults for basically no reason other than to try to be "clever"

aturnis
04-16-2008, 03:38 PM
Guess what when I watched a team trade a 2 to go from 6 to 5 a couple years ago, I want more than a 2.....

But hey you can be insulting all you want, it speaks volumes for you to throw back handed insults for basically no reason other than to try to be "clever"

Not for no reason, I just don't care for your know all attitude, that makes everyone else wrong. I thought you got that point when I pwned you in another thread.

Anyway, if I'm correct, you have always been all about taking Ellis at #5, why not #7? Is it just the fact that we would be trading out of the "sure fire" #5 spot or what?

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:40 PM
You should probably catch up...I'd take Ellis before I reached on a crappy OT like Clady but it all depends on who's there.....

If Ryan's there they should take him...

You pwned me by calling me names and using your hip board lingo, man I'm hurt.

sedated
04-16-2008, 03:49 PM
No one is dumb enough to trade next year's 1st to move up 2 spots

Amnorix
04-16-2008, 03:56 PM
Aturnis calls me an idiot yet he doesn't understand what pick value is.....if you trade from 5 to 7 you should get more than a single pick....or you got undervalued in your trade.

That's silly. So #5 wouldn't be worth, say 7 AND 8, because you "only" get a single pick?

How about 7 and 12?

7 and 22?

It's not the number of pickst hat matter as the value of all the picks you get in return.

Mecca
04-16-2008, 03:57 PM
That's silly. So #5 wouldn't be worth, say 7 AND 8, because you "only" get a single pick?

How about 7 and 12?

7 and 22?

It's not the number of pickst hat matter as the value of all the picks you get in return.

Well that is a nice way to spin what I said but seeing as no one has a combo of picks like that, nice try...

Gary
04-16-2008, 04:28 PM
No one is dumb enough to trade next year's 1st to move up 2 spots

I wouldn't go so far as to say "no one"...CeePee

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 05:04 PM
These dumb shits are probably going to take the same guy whether they pick 7th or 5th. You can get solid core players in the bottom of the second. You do this, but hesitate , and try to get them to cough another pick in 2009. If they don't I think you still do it. Unless of course you don't think you can get your guy.

the Talking Can
04-16-2008, 05:05 PM
why are we obligated to give the Pats what they want for "fair value"?

because they say so?

**** them...if they want him that bad they can pay more than what is a basically a 3rd round pick to get him...or they can sit and spin....

I'm not trading away ellis and ryan for a ****ing 3rd....just because "we have to pick an OL with every single pick or all the True Fans will start crying"....

Brock
04-16-2008, 05:05 PM
they're bidding against the jets, that should be worth more.

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 05:10 PM
why are we obligated to give the Pats what they want for "fair value"?

because they say so?

**** them...if they want him that bad they can pay more than what is a basically a 3rd round pick to get him...or they can sit and spin....

I'm not trading away ellis and ryan for a ****ing 3rd....just because "we have to pick an OL with every single pick or all the True Fans will start crying"....

If Ellis is there at 5 There's apretty good possibilty he'll be there at 7.

You do realize that in that scenario either Ryan or Ellis will be available.

Oh yea, and screw Matt ****in Ryan.

the Talking Can
04-16-2008, 05:31 PM
If Ellis is there at 5 There's apretty good possibilty he'll be there at 7.

You do realize that in that scenario either Ryan or Ellis will be available.

Oh yea, and screw Matt ****in Ryan.

we're doing the Pats a favor, not the other way around...and we need to act like it...

and if Ellis is sitting their at #5 you draft his ass and quit worrying about picking up another guard in the 3rd....

jjchieffan
04-16-2008, 05:33 PM
Well that is a nice way to spin what I said but seeing as no one has a combo of picks like that, nice try...

Why is it everytime someone disagrees with you they are "spinning it"?

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 05:41 PM
we're doing the Pats a favor, not the other way around...and we need to act like it...

and if Ellis is sitting their at #5 you draft his ass and quit worrying about picking up another guard in the 3rd....

We would get more than a third gauranteed, and probably more in 2009.

If that scenario goes down on draft day, there's no way they let the Jets take Gholston. We could probably do pretty well, but if i didn't think the jets were gonna take Ellis, i'd do it anyway. I don't worry so much about the Pats, we're years away from competing with them. I do what's best for My team, and if that's a trade AT VALUE I'd do it.

Micjones
04-16-2008, 05:47 PM
Making this trade nets us the 7th and 78th (Third Round) overall picks.
I'm not so sure I'd pass on this opportunity.
We'd still have a shot at 2-3 players on our shortlist and acquire another 3rd.

That could very well yield:
R1. DT Sedrick Ellis
R2. OT Carl Nicks
R3. CB Terrence Wheatley
R3. WR Jordy Nelson

Micjones
04-16-2008, 05:48 PM
We would get more than a third gauranteed, and probably more in 2009.

If that scenario goes down on draft day, there's no way they let the Jets take Gholston. We could probably do pretty well, but if i didn't think the jets were gonna take Ellis, i'd do it anyway. I don't worry so much about the Pats, we're years away from competing with them. I do what's best for My team, and if that's a trade AT VALUE I'd do it.

EXACTLY!!!

We have to worry about the best interests of this franchise...

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 05:49 PM
Making this trade nets us the 7th and 78th (Third Round) overall picks.
I'm not so sure I'd pass on this opportunity.
We'd still have a shot at 2-3 players on our shortlist and acquire another 3rd.

That could very well yield:
R1. DT Sedrick Ellis
R2. OT Carl Nicks
R3. CB Terrence Wheatley
R3. WR Jordy Nelson

If we knew we could Ellis out of it, it would be a no-brainer IMO.

milkman
04-16-2008, 05:53 PM
If we knew we could Ellis out of it, it would be a no-brainer IMO.

The problem I see with this, other that the possibility that the Bengal wound up trading into the Jets spot to take Ellis, is that this scenario has us taking Clady or Otah at #7, still a dumbass reach.

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 05:54 PM
The problem I see with this, other that the possibility that the Bengal wound up trading into the Jets spot to take Ellis, is that this scenario has us taking Clady or Otah at #7, still a dumbass reach.

That would suck. EDIT: but i did say if I knew we could get Ellis.

el borracho
04-16-2008, 05:56 PM
If Ellis is there at 5 There's apretty good possibilty he'll be there at 7.

And there is also the possibility that the Bengals would jump us to grab him at 6. This exact scenario hurt us before when we traded down to get Olshansky, the Chargers jumped us and we ended up with Siavii. If we trade out of the top 5 we had better be getting an incredible return on our risk. I will be pissed if we trade out of the top 5 for a late 2nd. Of course, I would have to acknowledge a job well done if we did, in fact, get Ellis at 7(but I would still view the trade as a foolish risk).

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 06:01 PM
And there is also the possibility that the Bengals would jump us to grab him at 6. This exact scenario hurt us before when we traded down to get Olshansky, the Chargers jumped us and we ended up with Siavii. If we trade out of the top 5 we had better be getting an incredible return on our risk. I will be pissed if we trade out of the top 5 for a late 2nd. Of course, I would have to acknowledge a job well done if we did, in fact, get Ellis at 7(but I would still view the trade as a foolish risk).

Yea, that would be rough. Ive stated a couple times That I would only do it if I knew we could get Ellis, but there is no way to know that for sure, which is where the big risk comes in.

You, and MM, have a very valid point.

Valiant
04-16-2008, 06:02 PM
I remember a thread from a couple months ago detailing trades the Patriots have made over the years. The moral of the story was: DON'T TRADE WITH THE PATRIOTS. YOU WILL GET SCREWED.

Yeah I am not for improving the Patriots significantly.. Unless we get some hellified returns.. If the Pats want to grab a play-maker at the top five to make them EVEN better then they need to overpay for it.. Not something that is just equal in trade values..

milkman
04-16-2008, 06:06 PM
Yea, that would be rough. Ive stated a couple times That I would only do it if I knew we could get Ellis, but there is no way to know that for sure, which is where the big risk comes in.

You, and MM, have a very valid point.

Thanks, but Big Rock was the first to make this point.

beach tribe
04-16-2008, 06:09 PM
Thanks, but Big Rock was the first to make this point.

Credit where credit is due. I like it.

Rain Man
04-16-2008, 07:09 PM
The only - ONLY - way that I would consider a trade down would ONLY be if we moved down ONLY a couple of spots because we KNEW that our guy was going to be available two spots later. That's the ONLY way I would do it. ONLY ONLY ONLY.

Skip Towne
04-16-2008, 07:17 PM
The only - ONLY - way that I would consider a trade down would ONLY be if we moved down ONLY a couple of spots because we KNEW that our guy was going to be available two spots later. That's the ONLY way I would do it. ONLY ONLY ONLY.

You're a "have my cake and eat it too" kind of guy.

Rain Man
04-16-2008, 07:23 PM
You're a "have my cake and eat it too" kind of guy.

I've found that having your cake and eating it too is a good strategy.

King_Chief_Fan
04-16-2008, 08:07 PM
Hope this hasn't already been posted
http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=227&Itemid=1

New England and Kansas City

The New England Patriots and the Kansas City Chiefs may get into conversations about switching draft spots in the first round of the 2008 NFL Draft. If the draft goes according to how many projectóChris Long , Jake Long , Glenn Dorsey , and Darren McFadden in some order in the top four picksóit makes no sense for the Chiefs to stay put and select an offensive tackle, which most believe is in fact the position the Chiefs are going to target with the 5th pick. The Kansas City Chiefs are a team with many needs and should relish the possibility of moving down in the draft and accumulating an additional draft pick. The player that would be remaining on the board that the New England Patriots would covet is Vernon Gholston from Ohio State. The Pats have a hole at a vital position in their defensive scheme, the 3-4 OLB position, one in which Gholston would be the ideal fit. The Patriots have transitioned athletic collegiate defensive ends and into linebackers in their 3-4 scheme (see Mike Vrabel, Tedy Bruschi, etc.) and although many pundits believe the Patriots will use the 7th overall selection on a CB the likes of Leodis McKelvin or Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie , the Patriots normally prefer to wait until the latter portions of the NFL Draft in order to find cornerbacks who fit their scheme nicely (see Asante Samuel, Randall Gay, etc.). The Patriots own a late 2nd round selection as well as an early 3rd round selection by virtue of a trade, they could deal one of those selections and still have a fairly early selection to get a CB, possibly a Charles Godfrey , Chevis Jackson , or Trae Williams, all of whom would fit their scheme nicely. From the New England Patriots perspective what makes a ton of sense is for the Patriots to package their 2nd round pick with the 7th pick overall and move up to #5 pick and select Vernon Gholston , not only would it fit their biggest need, but they would also nab the player that their division rival the New York Jets covet the most one selection in front of them. From the Kansas City Chiefs perspective it makes a lot of sense to move down to #7 and select a Jeffrey Otah or Ryan Clady to fill their need at offensive tackle, and then with their own 2nd round pick and the 2nd round selection acquired from the Pats in this deal, the Chiefs could address two other huge areas of need at offensive guard and cornerback and acquire a combo the likes of Chilo Rachal at guard and Tracy Porter or Patrick Lee at CB.

Gholston will have first crack at sitting Croyle down for the season. Wouldn't that suck.

CoMoChief
04-16-2008, 08:10 PM
Making this trade nets us the 7th and 78th (Third Round) overall picks.
I'm not so sure I'd pass on this opportunity.
We'd still have a shot at 2-3 players on our shortlist and acquire another 3rd.

That could very well yield:
R1. DT Sedrick Ellis
R2. OT Carl Nicks
R3. CB Terrence Wheatley
R3. WR Jordy Nelson

Big12 homer I see.

I would like to see them do well too, but those players aren't the best at their position at those picks.

aturnis
04-16-2008, 08:22 PM
The problem I see with this, other that the possibility that the Bengal wound up trading into the Jets spot to take Ellis, is that this scenario has us taking Clady or Otah at #7, still a dumbass reach.

Even if the Bengals jumped up on us and stole Ellis...Matt Ryan would still be available, I personally don't want him, but there will be plenty of talent left either way. We'll see...

Also, just b/c this scenario has us taking an OT, doesn't mean we would.

Chief Wiggum
04-16-2008, 10:38 PM
#5 is worth 1700 pts.
#7 is worth 1500 pts.

New Englands 2nd(62) is worth 284 pts.

Now according to my calculations, if you add 1500, and 284, you come up with a larger number. 1784 to be exact. Which, if my other calculations that I did are also correct...would mean that 1784 > 1700. Damn! Mecca is an Azzhat!

It's an even better deal if you use this chart which PFT claims some teams are circulating as an update to the old chart that has been around for 16 years:

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/15/new-draft-trade-chart/

dtrain
04-16-2008, 10:38 PM
Yeah I am not for improving the Patriots significantly.. Unless we get some hellified returns.. If the Pats want to grab a play-maker at the top five to make them EVEN better then they need to overpay for it.. Not something that is just equal in trade values..

It's not about worrying about the Pats it's about us getting better and to drop 2 spots and pick up a 2nd round draft pick that is great. In case we forgot we have at least 3 spots on the o line that needs to be addressed as well as corner and I say pick up Flacco with the first 2nd round pick.

Valiant
04-16-2008, 11:24 PM
It's not about worrying about the Pats it's about us getting better and to drop 2 spots and pick up a 2nd round draft pick that is great. In case we forgot we have at least 3 spots on the o line that needs to be addressed as well as corner and I say pick up Flacco with the first 2nd round pick.

As long as it was not the Pats you would have a point.. That and their 2nd is closer to our 3rd..

Hypothetically if we do this, and we both get better it would be a moot point IF we could never beat them in the playoffs..

Bottom line is you do not make a conference Rival better.. If this was a NFC team I would be all over it. But not to the AFC powerhouse that is the Pats/Colts/Chargers right now...

BIG K
04-16-2008, 11:39 PM
As long as it was not the Pats you would have a point.. That and their 2nd is closer to our 3rd..

Hypothetically if we do this, and we both get better it would be a moot point IF we could never beat them in the playoffs..

Bottom line is you do not make a conference Rival better.. If this was a NFC team I would be all over it. But not to the AFC powerhouse that is the Pats/Colts/Chargers right now...

I think you make a very good point however, it is not like the Chief's are going to be in competition with the Pat's for a playoff spot in the next couple of years. Given the scenerio originally posted, I would jump at it in a heartbeat to gather some more picks. The Chief's are not 'picking' for now, but rather for the future...I say go for it.

stlchiefs
04-16-2008, 11:51 PM
I 2nd that. The Chiefs need to worry about making it out of the AFC West and even making the playoffs right now, I think we are a long way from worrying about letting the Pats move up a couple pics.

Now if it was an AFC West team we'd be playing a few times a year that was looking for a missing link, then I'd say think twice.

ChiefsCountry
04-17-2008, 12:06 AM
I could see the Raiders making a trade with the Pats for Gholston. They have no second or third round picks.

dtrain
04-17-2008, 02:15 AM
As long as it was not the Pats you would have a point.. That and their 2nd is closer to our 3rd..

Hypothetically if we do this, and we both get better it would be a moot point IF we could never beat them in the playoffs..

Bottom line is you do not make a conference Rival better.. If this was a NFC team I would be all over it. But not to the AFC powerhouse that is the Pats/Colts/Chargers right now...

Right now we are not close them so what's the big deal damn we ge an extra draft pick for dropping 2 spots?

TEX
04-17-2008, 06:48 AM
I would rather stay put take Matt Ryan and go for Sam Baker in the 2nd.

That trade sounds like it only benefits N.E.

I'm with ya with Ryan.