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View Full Version : If Keyshawn and Galloway were worth 2 1st's, why not JA?


Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 09:10 AM
If we get anything less than 2 1st's we are getting ripped off. It will take 1 1st just to replace the impact JA currently represents. The other 1st is needed to make up for the risk we are taking by trading a known commodity. The draft can be a crapshoot even in the top 5 (Ryan Simms.)

As a fan I will be greatl disappointed if we trade 1 of our best players for the 19th and 40th picks in the draft.

Just pay the man. He will be great for at least 5 more years. Don't be cheap.

Galloway had injury issues and Johnson had attitude problems and they still commanded 2 #1's. Allen has neither.

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:12 AM
Why the hell does everyone insist we have to use a 1st round pick to replace JA? He was a 4th rounder. Granted, he played well above his draft position, but that doesn't mean you can't find another guy later in the draft.

Douche Baggins
04-18-2008, 09:13 AM
We're the Chiefs. It's our lot in life to get dicked.

Old Dog
04-18-2008, 09:15 AM
Why the hell does everyone insist we have to use a 1st round pick to replace JA? He was a 4th rounder. Granted, he played well above his draft position, but that doesn't mean you can't find another guy later in the draft.

And Tom Brady was drafted in the 6th......by your logic if someone offered New England a 4th for him they should take it.

Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 09:16 AM
Because he is one of the best defensive ends in the game. We hit the lottery by getting him in the 4th. This is because he was a gamble based on the school he played at and the competition he faced.

Sometimes Carls gambles pay off. Most of the time they don't.

Chris Long appears to be someone that would be able to replace him. He will be a top 5 pick. Not a 19 pick.

eazyb81
04-18-2008, 09:17 AM
We don't have to replace Allen - we're starting over.

We're going to be horrible this year with or without Allen. It's not like we have to plug in a new DE to keep our SB hopes alive.

BigRock
04-18-2008, 09:18 AM
Were Keyshawn or Galloway a bottle of Pabst Blue Ribbon away from sitting out for a year?

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:22 AM
And Tom Brady was drafted in the 6th......by your logic if someone offered New England a 4th for him they should take it.

No, dumbass, that's not my logic. I'm saying we don't have to use a 1st round pick we receive in a trade to draft a replacement DE for JA. There's a difference, and if you're too stupid to see it then that's your problem.

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:23 AM
Because he is one of the best defensive ends in the game. We hit the lottery by getting him in the 4th. This is because he was a gamble based on the school he played at and the competition he faced.

Sometimes Carls gambles pay off. Most of the time they don't.

Chris Long appears to be someone that would be able to replace him. He will be a top 5 pick. Not a 19 pick.

Very true about Chris Long. But if Chris Long fell to us at #5 and Glenn Dorsey was off the board I would draft Chris Long even if we already signed JA to a long term deal.

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:24 AM
We don't have to replace Allen - we're starting over.

We're going to be horrible this year with or without Allen. It's not like we have to plug in a new DE to keep our SB hopes alive.

Exactly. We can grab a DE later in the draft or even next year. What we have to do this draft is just get the BPA at positions of need (which is everything). We're not drafting to replace any single player, we're drafting to build this team at every position.

Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 09:26 AM
Were Keyshawn or Galloway a bottle of Pabst Blue Ribbon away from sitting out for a year?

Keyshawn's attitude made him a big risk. So much so that he was run out of TB shortly after the trade because of it. Galloway was on a hurt knee. Even a bigger risk than a suspension. Even more so for a WR who was also known for his speed and lac k of toughness.

Pestilence
04-18-2008, 09:26 AM
Exactly. We can grab a DE later in the draft or even next year. What we have to do this draft is just get the BPA at positions of need (which is everything). We're not drafting to replace any single player, we're drafting to build this team at every position.

QFT

SNR
04-18-2008, 09:29 AM
Hell, I'd even accept something like the Vikes' first rounder and next year's first rounder for Jared Allen and a 6th rounder or something like that

Chiefnj2
04-18-2008, 09:30 AM
QFT

How many pro bowl defensive players have the Chiefs drafted in the last decade? Have the Chiefs replaced Derrick Thomas, Neil Smith, Dale Carter? Were they able to replace Donnie Edwards? It's easy to replace great players - we'll just slide Welbourn over to guard. It's his natural position and Shields was declining anyway.

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:31 AM
How many pro bowl defensive players have the Chiefs drafted in the last decade? Have the Chiefs replaced Derrick Thomas, Neil Smith, Dale Carter? Were they able to replace Donnie Edwards? It's easy to replace great players - we'll just slide Welbourn over to guard. It's his natural position and Shields was declining anyway.

Did we ever receive compensation for any of those players? No.

Did we often try to replace those guys with veterans instead of draft picks? Yes.

Apples and oranges.

When we drafted DT, Neil Smith, Dale Carter we were building a core, much like we're doing now. When we lost those guys we were plugging holes trying to get to the next level. We've abandoned that garbage plan and seem to be returning to the strategy that brought those guys here.

Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 09:31 AM
Exactly. We can grab a DE later in the draft or even next year. What we have to do this draft is just get the BPA at positions of need (which is everything). We're not drafting to replace any single player, we're drafting to build this team at every position.

We have a player with a great motor, attitude, medical chart who just wants to be paid what he's worth. Just pay him and don't be cheap. Don't give me this BS that we're building for the future. Look at how our recent drafts have gone. They are a big gamble.

Allen will be great for at least 4 more years. This is not a decision for next year only. We need to continue to build and keep what little talent we have. If we trade for a 1st and 2nd, or 2 3rd's we are only netting a 2nd or 2 3rds. That doesn't help us that much considering at 19 if we draft D we will be downgrading our pass rush.

dj56dt58
04-18-2008, 09:34 AM
Because our GM is a ****ing retard?

DaKCMan AP
04-18-2008, 09:35 AM
We have a player with a great motor, attitude, medical chart who just wants to be paid what he's worth. Just pay him and don't be cheap. Don't give me this BS that we're building for the future. Look at how our recent drafts have gone. They are a big gamble.

Allen will be great for at least 4 more years. This is not a decision for next year only. We need to continue to build and keep what little talent we have. If we trade for a 1st and 2nd, or 2 3rd's we are only netting a 2nd or 2 3rds. That doesn't help us that much considering at 19 if we draft D we will be downgrading our pass rush.

I'd rather keep Allen than trade him, but if the guy is disgruntled and does not want to be here then you have to move him and get something in return.

I absolutely disagree with the logic that we only net what picks are in addition to a 1st round pick. You don't have to use that 1st pick to replace JA.

Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 09:57 AM
I'd rather keep Allen than trade him, but if the guy is disgruntled and does not want to be here then you have to move him and get something in return.

I absolutely disagree with the logic that we only net what picks are in addition to a 1st round pick. You don't have to use that 1st pick to replace JA.


If they pay him what he's worth he won't be disgruntled.

Coogs
04-18-2008, 10:03 AM
I'd rather keep Allen than trade him, but if the guy is disgruntled and does not want to be here then you have to move him and get something in return.

I absolutely disagree with the logic that we only net what picks are in addition to a 1st round pick. You don't have to use that 1st pick to replace JA.

:clap::clap::clap:

Brock
04-18-2008, 10:05 AM
If they pay him what he's worth he won't be disgruntled.

If they pay him what he's worth and he does what most alcoholics do, they're out the money and the player. Are you sure that's what you'd do?

chasedude
04-18-2008, 10:06 AM
If they pay him what he's WANTS he won't be disgruntled.

FYP

sedated
04-18-2008, 10:25 AM
I'd rather keep Allen than trade him, but if the guy is disgruntled and does not want to be here then you have to move him and get something in return.

it seems the only reason he wants to leave is because he's not getting a long-term deal.

markk
04-18-2008, 11:43 AM
what was that, 15 years ago?

Mojo Rising
04-18-2008, 04:51 PM
It was 8 years ago.

ChiefsCountry
04-18-2008, 04:58 PM
It was 8 years ago.

League has changed since then.

Mecca
04-18-2008, 04:59 PM
Teams emphasize draft picks even more now....there's a reason that 1st round picks are rarely traded.

xbarretx
04-18-2008, 05:04 PM
We don't have to replace Allen - we're starting over.

We're going to be horrible this year with or without Allen. It's not like we have to plug in a new DE to keep our SB hopes alive.

QFT

catfish307
04-18-2008, 05:36 PM
If we get anything less than 2 1st's we are getting ripped off. It will take 1 1st just to replace the impact JA currently represents. The other 1st is needed to make up for the risk we are taking by trading a known commodity. The draft can be a crapshoot even in the top 5 (Ryan Simms.)

As a fan I will be greatl disappointed if we trade 1 of our best players for the 19th and 40th picks in the draft.

Just pay the man. He will be great for at least 5 more years. Don't be cheap.

Galloway had injury issues and Johnson had attitude problems and they still commanded 2 #1's. Allen has neither.


According to this we will get 2 first rounders????????


Chiefs keeping options open with Pro Bowl end Allen

Associated Press
Updated: April 18, 2008, 5:51 PM ET

<!-- end page tools --><!-- begin story body --><!-- template inline -->KANSAS CITY, Mo. -- As improbable as it might have sounded at the end of last season when he led the NFL in sacks, the Kansas City Chiefs (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=kan) could be willing to part with All-Pro defensive end Jared Allen (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=6885) while he's in the prime of his career.
If the price is right for the 26-year-old Allen, the Chiefs could extract precious extra selections to use next week in what shapes up as one of the most crucial drafts in recent team history. Extra picks could greatly speed up coach Herman Edwards' rebuilding project for a team that lost its last nine games in 2007 and finished 4-12.


The Chiefs need offensive linemen and defensive backs, two position groups that scouts believe to be in abundance. The Chiefs have the No. 5 overall pick in the draft, and 10 selections altogether. If they could package a deal for a second choice in the first round and an extra second- or third-round pick, that might look very attractive.
The Chiefs have talked with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=tam) and Minnesota Vikings (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=min) about Allen. But general manager Carl Peterson refused on Friday to go any further.
"We're talking in speculation right now," Peterson said. "At this particular point, nothing has been done or consummated."
Peterson's relationship with Allen has been strained ever since Peterson, in the wake of Allen's DUI convictions, described him as "a young man at risk." Allen, who could be suspended for a season if he has another alcohol-related episode, has said he would not negotiate with Kansas City if he doesn't get a contract done by next July.
After reaching an impasse, the Chiefs made Allen their franchise player on Feb. 7, but did not put the exclusive tag on him, as they did on tight end Tony Gonzalez (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=3950) when he was franchised in 2002.
That made it possible for Allen and his agent to talk with other clubs and be examined by their team doctors.
Kansas City would still be able to keep him by matching whatever offer he gets. If they decide not to match, they would get two first-round picks from the club that signs Allen, something no other club seems likely to go for. But another team could negotiate a deal with the Chiefs for compensation.
"Any team can bring him in, talk to him, measure him, physical him, write a contract. That's the option they have as a non-exclusive franchise player," Peterson said.
"If we wanted to prohibit Jared and his agent from having the opportunity to look to teams, we would have put the exclusive franchise tag on him. We didn't do that. In years past we have used the exclusive. So we'll see what happens. But to this point nothing has happened. If something does happen, we'll let you know. If it doesn't happen, we'll let you know."
Peterson declined to say what sort of offer might tempt him.
"I don't know at this point. I haven't seen any contract offer," he said.
Allen was suspended the first two games by the commissioner last season for multiple DUI convictions. But Allen says he has stopped drinking entirely, a claim backed up by close friends.
"I've seen Jared at a big party, out on the dance floor, where everybody is drinking except one person. It's Jared, and he's having the best time of everybody," said Chiefs fullback Boomer Grigsby (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=7314).
The 6-foot-6, 270-pound Allen was drafted with a supplemental fourth-round pick out of Idaho State in 2004.
In addition to a league-leading 15 sacks for 111 yards in losses, he had 67 tackles, three forced fumbles and 18 pressures. In his first game back from the suspension against the Vikings, he had nine tackles, two sacks, a pressure and a pass defended. He also forced Adrian Peterson (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=8261) to fumble.
Coming in on offense in goal line situations, he also caught a pair of one-yard touchdown passes. He was named a starter on the Pro Bowl.
Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press

Spicy McHaggis
04-18-2008, 06:56 PM
We're the Chiefs. It's our lot in life to get dicked.

I think this guy said that. Or at least something along those lines.

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/c/c8/Counterparts.jpg/180px-Counterparts.jpg

Douche Baggins
04-18-2008, 06:58 PM
I think this guy said that. Or at least something along those lines.

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/c/c8/Counterparts.jpg/180px-Counterparts.jpg

How did I get into this mess? I really don't know how. We
seem to be made to suffer. It's our lot in life.