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View Full Version : NFL Draft Tamba Hali and... Khreem Smith?


jspchief
04-19-2008, 11:20 PM
If we trade Allen away, who the hell is going to be our other starting DE? McBride? Do we even have any other DEs on the roster?

What the hell good is an extra draft pick if we're pidgeon-holed into using our #5 on a replacement for Allen? It's like a worse version of trading down to the 17 spot.

We are shallow at DE. Nevermind that we'd be dumping our best defensive player, we'd also be creating another hole in a roster that's already got more holes than we're likely able to fill.

Count Zarth
04-19-2008, 11:23 PM
They're gonna draft someone...and I wouldn't be shocked to see them sign this guy just before camp.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=1636

jspchief
04-19-2008, 11:26 PM
Spires is nothing better than a breather for a starter.

And outside of #5, what DE are they going to draft that's going to sniff replacing Allen?

Count Zarth
04-19-2008, 11:27 PM
Spires is nothing better than a breather for a starter.

And outside of #5, what DE are they going to draft that's going to sniff replacing Allen?

Well, Allen WAS drafted in the fourth round.

They're gonna suck this year anyway so I don't think it matters. They probably realize that and figure they can find someone in the next 2 years to replace him. There's no rush.

KcMizzou
04-19-2008, 11:31 PM
Spires is nothing better than a breather for a starter.

And outside of #5, what DE are they going to draft that's going to sniff replacing Allen?Probably none.

Yeah, DE instantly becomes a big need, if we trade Allen. But we have lots of other huge needs. That's where the BPA thing comes in. Get the best player you can get regardless of position, (with very, very few exceptions).

This isn't going to be a one draft fix. I'm pretty confident that the Chiefs have accepted that.

noa
04-19-2008, 11:36 PM
Sweet, Greg Spires. Fits right in with the youth movement. And averaging just under 4 sacks a year. That's a guy you can get excited about.

jspchief
04-19-2008, 11:40 PM
Probably none.

Yeah, DE instantly becomes a big need, if we trade Allen. But we have lots of other huge needs. That's where the BPA thing comes in. Get the best player you can get regardless of position, (with very, very few exceptions).

This isn't going to be a one draft fix. I'm pretty confident that the Chiefs have accepted that.So what does trading Allen actually gain us? A 3rd round pick?

Regardless of what year they replace Allen, to get anything close in talent they're going to have to burn a high pick. Whether it's #5, #17, or a 1st in '08, we basically only get a net gain of a single 3rd round pick. And that's assuming we get something comparable in talent with his replacement.

The only way we actually "gain" more than that is if we actually have someone already under contract who can fill that hole, or if we get a once in a lifetime sleeper from later rounds. To get the full benefit of both 1st round picks, it's highly likely that we'll also suffer significant downgrade at DE.

I just don't think there's as much value being gained as some people are imagining. everyone is dreaming of rebuilding our O-line and getting a DT or QB thanks to that extra pick, but they are ignoring the gaping hole created at DE.

KcMizzou
04-19-2008, 11:46 PM
So what does trading Allen actually gain us? A 3rd round pick?

Regardless of what year they replace Allen, to get anything close in talent they're going to have to burn a high pick. Whether it's #5, #17, or a 1st in '08, we basically only get a net gain of a single 3rd round pick. And that's assuming we get something comparable in talent with his replacement.

The only way we actually "gain" more than that is if we actually have someone already under contract who can fill that hole, or if we get a once in a lifetime sleeper from later rounds. To get the full benefit of both 1st round picks, it's highly likely that we'll also suffer significant downgrade at DE.

I just don't think there's as much value being gained as some people are imagining. everyone is dreaming of rebuilding our O-line and getting a DT or QB thanks to that extra pick, but they are ignoring the gaping hole created at DE.Good points.

I kind of feel like we're going round and round here (not in this thread, just in general). But... It's not exactly all up to the Chiefs at this point. The guys supposedly wants out. If that's the case, he will get out in the next year or two.

I'm not sure they have a choice. If you let him play under the tag, and tag him again next year, you get nothing for him when he get's the hell out of Dodge. And, he's never going to be worth more than he is right now.

That said, if... some how, some way... Jarred and the Chiefs could kiss and make up... I'd be all for it.

Baconeater
04-20-2008, 12:18 AM
I don't know that it's as much about "gaining" anything as it is about minimizing our losses. It's pretty obvious the guy doesn't want to be here.

blueballs
04-20-2008, 12:19 AM
It's all a ruse
to get the Jets to swop picks with the Raiders
Jared is now a 4 way player

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 12:22 AM
They're gonna draft someone...and I wouldn't be shocked to see them sign this guy just before camp.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=1636

Yes he seems young and a nice choice for a rebuild? Age: 33 Nice thought for rebuilding. Idiot....

Count Zarth
04-20-2008, 12:24 AM
Yes he seems young and a nice choice for a rebuild? Age: 33 Nice thought for rebuilding. Idiot....

Herm has said they might sign a few veterans before training camp. You need warm bodies. If they dump Allen they have to have SOME KIND of depth at DE.

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 12:26 AM
Herm has said they might sign a few veterans before training camp. You need warm bodies. If they dump Allen they have to have SOME KIND of depth at DE.

can I quote this or do I need permission from your lawyers


WPI in speculation city

Count Zarth
04-20-2008, 12:26 AM
can I quote this or do I need permission from your lawyers


WPI in speculation city

How about a truce, dude? This childish bickering just annoys me.

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 12:33 AM
Veterans or granny's?


Well, Allen WAS drafted in the fourth round.

They're gonna suck this year anyway so I don't think it matters. They probably realize that and figure they can find someone in the next 2 years to replace him. There's no rush.

Sims was also drafted in the first.......As many bust for this team.

Odds might be in your favor but based on recent history?

U suck and try to bend to your writing "skills".

ROFL

But its "OK" with Defensive players based on recent history, Germ Herm fare.

We can replace them all in 20 years.....

PS. Brady was drafted in the 6th. Can we get him for a 3rd and 5th?

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 12:44 AM
How about a truce, dude? This childish bickering just annoys me.

why must you try to annoy all

how many truces have you granted in the midst of your bs?

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Count Zarth
04-20-2008, 12:47 AM
Yes or no. I'm sick of this shit.

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 12:49 AM
Yes or no. I'm sick of this shit.

We are sick of your (shit) after leaving more than 3 times as well.

Forever! :cuss:

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 12:50 AM
Yes or no. I'm sick of this shit.

truce granted

conditional on you not being a douche nozzle

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 12:51 AM
Much less the spam as well. IMHO

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 12:51 AM
truce granted

conditional on you not being a douche nozzle

LOL, no chance then. Good deal.

Count Zarth
04-20-2008, 12:54 AM
truce granted

conditional on you not being a douche nozzle

Cool.

Smed1065
04-20-2008, 01:28 AM
Like his promise to leave forever..


Sucker. (guess the neg rep left after he has no power?)

LOL

Thig Lyfe
04-20-2008, 01:40 AM
The very thought makes me Khreem my pantaloons.

MadMax
04-20-2008, 02:21 AM
So what does trading Allen actually gain us? A 3rd round pick?

Regardless of what year they replace Allen, to get anything close in talent they're going to have to burn a high pick. Whether it's #5, #17, or a 1st in '08, we basically only get a net gain of a single 3rd round pick. And that's assuming we get something comparable in talent with his replacement.

The only way we actually "gain" more than that is if we actually have someone already under contract who can fill that hole, or if we get a once in a lifetime sleeper from later rounds. To get the full benefit of both 1st round picks, it's highly likely that we'll also suffer significant downgrade at DE.

I just don't think there's as much value being gained as some people are imagining. everyone is dreaming of rebuilding our O-line and getting a DT or QB thanks to that extra pick, but they are ignoring the gaping hole created at DE.


Bah we get eleventy billion picks and good times had by all ROFL

KCChiefsMan
04-20-2008, 03:30 AM
CP isnt about to pay a guy like JA good money, he was only a 4th round pick. So in CP's eye's, JA doesn't deserve a big contract..remember Joe Horn?

milkman
04-20-2008, 06:10 AM
CP isnt about to pay a guy like JA good money, he was only a 4th round pick. So in CP's eye's, JA doesn't deserve a big contract..remember Joe Horn?

There isn't any comparison.

Joe Horn didn't do anything as a Chief.

milkman
04-20-2008, 06:12 AM
Like his promise to leave forever..


Sucker. (guess the neg rep left after he has no power?)

LOL

Goatse is a douche, no doubt, but you are managing to make him look like a freakin' genius, by comparison.

Raiderh8ter77
04-20-2008, 08:01 AM
its called trading JA away to vikings for 1st 3rd and Bryant McKinney we would draft Branden Albert at 5 then at 17 draft Merling

Mizzou_8541
04-20-2008, 08:08 AM
If we trade Allen away, who the hell is going to be our other starting DE? McBride? Do we even have any other DEs on the roster?

What the hell good is an extra draft pick if we're pidgeon-holed into using our #5 on a replacement for Allen? It's like a worse version of trading down to the 17 spot.

We are shallow at DE. Nevermind that we'd be dumping our best defensive player, we'd also be creating another hole in a roster that's already got more holes than we're likely able to fill.

Because we will get NOTHING for him if we do not trade him. The chances of resigning him while CP is still here is slim to none. If we don't trade him, we are left with a gaping hole and not even a "third round pick" for compensation.

It's no about what we are gaining from ths trade, it's about trying to minimize losses....which is similar to what someone else said on this thread.

eazyb81
04-20-2008, 08:26 AM
Stop worrying about filling positions. We are going to suck ass next year and without Allen we are the odds-on favorite for the #1 pick in 2009.

Who gives a sh#t who will play LDE if we move Hali over. Good God, some of you act like we were SB contenders with Allen.

As for my answer to the question, I vote for McBride at LDE and move Hali to RDE. We spent a 2nd round pick on Turk, let's throw him out there and see what we've got.

BigChiefFan
04-20-2008, 10:37 AM
Because we will get NOTHING for him if we do not trade him. The chances of resigning him while CP is still here is slim to none. If we don't trade him, we are left with a gaping hole and not even a "third round pick" for compensation.

It's no about what we are gaining from ths trade, it's about trying to minimize losses....which is similar to what someone else said on this thread.

If those are the only options(they aren't) then the GM must be really pathetic. I thought the plan was to retain your own-I guess that only works out if they are cheap players, huh?

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 10:38 AM
There isn't any comparison.

Joe Horn didn't do anything as a Chief.

Joe Horn didn't get the chance to do much, but I remember some spectacular plays when he did got a shot.

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 10:39 AM
Goatse is a douche, no doubt, but you are managing to make him look like a freakin' genius, by comparison.

:hmmm:

milkman
04-20-2008, 10:42 AM
Joe Horn didn't get the chance to do much, but I remember some spectacular plays when he did got a shot.

Oh, I agree.

I blame Marty that Horn never got the chance to realize his potential in KC, but of course we had some great WRs like Kevin Lockett ahead of him, so how can you fault Marty for not giving Horn a chance?

But the fact remains, Horn and Allen's situation can't be compared.

J Diddy
04-20-2008, 10:44 AM
Oh, I agree.

I blame Marty that Horn never got the chance to realize his potential in KC, but of course we had some great WRs like Kevin Lockett ahead of him, so how can you fault Marty for not giving Horn a chance?

But the fact remains, Horn and Allen's situation can't be compared.


Agreed

I missed the part you were quoting.

QuikSsurfer
04-20-2008, 10:48 AM
Joe Horn didn't get the chance to do much, but I remember some spectacular plays when he did got a shot.

Didn't he get wrapped up in some legal trouble before leaving for NO? Thought I remembered something like this when it came time to keep him or let him go.

Spicy McHaggis
04-20-2008, 10:48 AM
I'm a bit irritated that the Chiefs let Wilkerson walk. If trading JA was even remotely on their mind they should have done their best to keep Jimmy in town. Bah, I can't expect any sort of competence from this FO.

Direckshun
04-20-2008, 10:52 AM
There is a decent crop of DEs in the first two rounds in the NFL Draft, and a wealth of overachieving small schoolers late.

If we trade Allen, expect us to take a shot at both.

Hell, expect us to do it anyway. At the very most, they may adequately replace Allen, at the very least, they provide us a better 3rd and 4th DE than we already have.

Direckshun
04-20-2008, 10:53 AM
I'm a bit irritated that the Chiefs let Wilkerson walk. If trading JA was even remotely on their mind they should have done their best to keep Jimmy in town. Bah, I can't expect any sort of competence from this FO.
Eh, Wilkerson was not getting the job done.

Spicy McHaggis
04-20-2008, 11:05 AM
Eh, Wilkerson was not getting the job done.

Not as a starter, no. He was solid in rotation though and developed pretty well for a late round pick. Especially considering that the Chiefs kept dicking around with what position he should play. I also wanted the Chiefs to go after LaBoy but the Chiefs can't sign free agents because the other teams cheat:deevee:

Direckshun
04-20-2008, 11:11 AM
Not as a starter, no. He was solid in rotation though and developed pretty well for a late round pick. Especially considering that the Chiefs kept dicking around with what position he should play. I also wanted the Chiefs to go after LaBoy but the Chiefs can't sign free agents because the other teams cheat:deevee:
He wasn't getting sacks, period. He can't get them. He acts as a third DT on the line and as a result Herm had to overplay Hali and Allen. That's the reason we can't get sacks in the 4th quarter.

If we want a DE who can't rush the passer but can remain strong against the run, we've already got Turk.

Mizzou_8541
04-20-2008, 11:47 AM
If those are the only options(they aren't) then the GM must be really pathetic. I thought the plan was to retain your own-I guess that only works out if they are cheap players, huh?

No, I just think that there is no way to retain him and we may as well attempt to get at least something in return. I agree that we must retain our own (see royals) to "rebuild" our franchise and I hope that we do...I simply just don't see it happening with Jared Allen. I guess to insert a really bad cliche here I would say we need to strike while the iron is hot...:)

unothadeal
04-20-2008, 11:47 AM
I hope we get a badass black guy with that pick.

jspchief
04-20-2008, 01:10 PM
Stop worrying about filling positions. We are going to suck ass next year and without Allen we are the odds-on favorite for the #1 pick in 2009.

Who gives a sh#t who will play LDE if we move Hali over. Good God, some of you act like we were SB contenders with Allen.

As for my answer to the question, I vote for McBride at LDE and move Hali to RDE. We spent a 2nd round pick on Turk, let's throw him out there and see what we've got.What the **** kind of reasoning is that?

We're going to suck because we lack talented players. How does letting good players go and creating more holes in the roster improve that? Regardless of 2008, this team will only get better by adding good players, not letting them go.