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View Full Version : Chiefs Does this draft buy Herm and Carl another year from the fans?


Short Leash Hootie
04-28-2008, 04:49 AM
I've been a member on the planet for two and a half years, and I must say, the overall optimism on this board is EASILY at an all time high...and I love it!

Obviously we aren't projected to have many wins, even though I think we can surprise some people and at least with 7 games...which is still a pretty shitty season...

So my question is this: Since everyone already thinks we're going to suck, does that mean we're going to have to deal with a 'fire Herm' theme all year long? What if 6-8 of these rookies are starters and 3-4 of them look like potential studs?

I cannot wait to see the 180 this board does as soon as we lose by 3 scores to New England week 1...

Short Leash Hootie
04-28-2008, 04:49 AM
buy* in the thread title...my bad

noa
04-28-2008, 05:03 AM
Well, we had a great draft, and it built up some goodwill, but we're still not going to be very good next year. This is going to take some patience. My guess is by the end of the year, when we are 4-12 or 5-11, plenty of fans will be calling for their heads despite this draft.

MahiMike
04-28-2008, 05:26 AM
You know how to have the #5 pick, 13 picks and a grade A? Go 4-12.

EyePod
04-28-2008, 05:41 AM
You know how to have the #5 pick, 13 picks and a grade A? Go 4-12.

Steelers had a grade "A" also even though their picks weren't really high. All we need to do is really hit home with our 1st and 2nd picks.....

EyePod
04-28-2008, 05:42 AM
If we have 6-8 wins this season, I will be ecstatic. I can realistically see 8 wins because of our schedule.

tiptap
04-28-2008, 05:55 AM
This will be a practice season for Herm. He can work and we can evaluate how he handles the clock and what adjustments we see over the half and in real time. Those are the things we get concerned about in Herm's oversight of team play.

I guess additionally we could evaluate Peterson getting players signed in a timely manner but he should be judged by how he handles the veterans that are playing well that we need to resign in light of not paying Allen and instead trading him.

Reerun_KC
04-28-2008, 06:14 AM
Oh Jezeez Not this shit!


hell no it doesnt buy them another year....

King_Chief_Fan
04-28-2008, 06:18 AM
Not from me it doesn't.
Herm has 2 years to make this team competitive.
Carl has had his chance and muffed it way more than once. I bet he "tough guys" the negotiations and Dorsey and Albert are not in camp on time.

thehead
04-28-2008, 06:19 AM
Oh Jezeez Not this shit!


hell no it doesnt buy them another year....



Agree 100% little late to save 18 years of shit

Skip Towne
04-28-2008, 06:33 AM
Even though we had a great draft, he's still Herm. Our complete lack of offense will make us forget about the draft.

kc rush
04-28-2008, 06:38 AM
Good draft, bad coach. I can't wait for the day that #1 Herm and Carl are gone or #2 Herm and Carl prove me wrong.

Lzen
04-28-2008, 07:25 AM
I am still not real big on Herm as a head coach. That being said, I have never questioned his scouting/drafting abilities. I will hold off calling for his head just yet. Perhaps he will do better with his type of players. Time will tell.

As for Carl, his time here should have been over a few years ago. He was worn out his welcome. I hope Clark fires him soon.

NUMBER7
04-28-2008, 07:30 AM
Even though we had a great draft, he's still Herm. Our complete lack of offense will make us forget about the draft.

Excellent. IMHO with this offense and Herm at the helm we will be lucky to go 2 - 14 this year. 8 - 8 is one big pipe dream. If Gailey pulls this off he will be a wizard turning CS into a gourmet meal.

Chiefnj2
04-28-2008, 07:31 AM
Carl and Herm must love KC. "As long as we pick whoever that Gosselin guy has as a good value, we can get contract extensions!"

KcMizzou
04-28-2008, 07:31 AM
I'm pretty much done with Carl.

Herm's alright by me, though. He bought the groceries. Let's see what he cooks up with them.

dirk digler
04-28-2008, 07:33 AM
Of course it does. Clark will not fire Herm in the middle of a total rebuild and anyone that thinks otherwise obviously hasn't been paying attention.

Carl on the other hand could be shit canned or stripped of the GM title and replaced by Kuharich.

InChiefsHell
04-28-2008, 07:41 AM
oops...

Mr. Laz
04-28-2008, 08:22 AM
I've been a member on the planet for two and a half years, and I must say, the overall optimism on this board is EASILY at an all time high...and I love it!

Obviously we aren't projected to have many wins, even though I think we can surprise some people and at least with 7 games...which is still a pretty shitty season...

So my question is this: Since everyone already thinks we're going to suck, does that mean we're going to have to deal with a 'fire Herm' theme all year long? What if 6-8 of these rookies are starters and 3-4 of them look like potential studs?

I cannot wait to see the 180 this board does as soon as we lose by 3 scores to New England week 1...
so let's recap....

the board is very positive and you like it

but the board isn't positive enough

you cannot wait for positive attitude to crash and burn when lose.



well ...... i,for one, am truly impressive with your unbelievable support for your fellow fans.

el borracho
04-28-2008, 09:04 AM
Oh, no, not at all. At the end of the season, Herm will still be a career loser and Carl's very average record without Marty will also dip below .500. One (apparently) good draft won't change much with me. These clowns should be fired.

Chief_in_Commander
04-28-2008, 09:06 AM
Everyone knew we were going to suck for a couple years once we decided to go completley through "rebuliding" and not patchwork that was 2 years ago. You don't bring in someone to compeltely wash out the old stench and can them after you suck for one year. Herm isn't on the chopping block for this year and next year at LEAST. Carl is hopefully on the verge of being axed but you never know as you would of thought it wouldn't of taken this long.

Chiefnj2
04-28-2008, 09:09 AM
Of course it does. Clark will not fire Herm in the middle of a total rebuild and anyone that thinks otherwise obviously hasn't been paying attention.

Carl on the other hand could be shit canned or stripped of the GM title and replaced by Kuharich.

It sets up a bad scenario where the owner is telling the next GM he has to keep Herm around. No GM worth his salt is going to want to work in a situation where the coach has more power.

Psyko Tek
04-28-2008, 09:11 AM
nope
but hopefully the next coach will have a good team to start with

eazyb81
04-28-2008, 09:19 AM
First off, it's obvious that Carl is losing the power over football operations that he had in the past. This draft was all Herm and Kuharich, and no surprise it was great.

I've never been on the "Fire Herm" bandwagon that so many are here at CP. We had the second-oldest team in the league last year and an extreme lack of talent - it's no surprise we were horrible. After the trade of Allen and this fantastic draft, along with Herm's comments about getting younger, it's apparent that we are finally doing the right thing and going with a full rebuilding effort.

When done the right way, a rebuild can turn a franchise into a perennial contender, but it will also take more than one offseason. In all likelihood, we are going to be horrible next year and win between 3-6 games. But the important thing is that we play the youngsters and see some real growth in this team. If that happens, then we should definitely keep Herm for the time being; if it doesn't, then it will be time to cut ties and bring in a new man.

Fish
04-28-2008, 09:25 AM
Most people here (other than the idiots who will never be happy), are up right now, but I expect that to drop by preseason. I still think Herm won't be accepted by the majority unless he wins a Superbowl. Those that are giving Herm a break now for the first time, will likely turn again once they realize we still have some pieces to add despite this draft. The majority is still too impatient...

I've always thought he could get us on the right track. I think this draft will go a long way towards that. But it will take more than just this draft.....

xbarretx
04-28-2008, 09:35 AM
Most people here (other than the idiots who will never be happy), are up right now, but I expect that to drop by preseason. I still think Herm won't be accepted by the majority unless he wins a Superbowl. Those that are giving Herm a break now for the first time, will likely turn again once they realize we still have some pieces to add despite this draft. The majority is still too impatient...

I've always thought he could get us on the right track. I think this draft will go a long way towards that. But it will take more than just this draft.....

i agree as most are fickle... but for myself no matter what record we get ... PROVIDING its not 8 - 8 ill be satisfied as we play the young guys and find out what Croyle can really do. i know it sounds corny but Dorsey has made me very happy. i look forward to watching him lay a hurting on Cutler and Jamarcus(sp?) and that will allow our outside guys to get opps to get in there and put some hits and pressure in the backfield :clap:

markk
04-28-2008, 09:38 AM
carl and herm did a fine job saturday and sunday. but they are still carl and herm. i am going to need to see more sea change before i think they are really capable of getting us to the super bowl.

TN_Chief
04-28-2008, 09:38 AM
Depends on a lot of factors. Economy is down...which may mean fewer $$$ coming into the Chiefs' coffers via season tickets, single-games, concessions, etc. If that number is down, and the team starts tanking worse and the incoming begins dropping even lower, then I think Carl and Herm will be shown the door. The Hunts would likely operate on the idea that change would renew fan interest.

(Full disclosure...I can't stand Herm or Carl and I wish they'd been fired in January)

SNR
04-28-2008, 09:45 AM
Herm has earned himself another year. Carl has not.

xbarretx
04-28-2008, 09:49 AM
Herm has earned himself another year. Carl has not.

i like that answer the best :clap:

/end of thread ;)

Rain Man
04-28-2008, 09:52 AM
No.

xbarretx
04-28-2008, 09:57 AM
No.

Raniman, how was the draft party?

crazycoffey
04-28-2008, 09:58 AM
Herm yes, carl no

smittysbar
04-28-2008, 10:01 AM
Hell no he is still a shitty coach. Carl is still a piece of shit

StcChief
04-28-2008, 10:05 AM
Carl will be here until Stadium is complete....hopefully gone no matter how 2008/2009 go.

Herm ? this team improves because of Bill/Herm running the show on Draft day yes, he will get extention. Cowher or Marty to GM? after Carl

Frazod
04-28-2008, 10:06 AM
Herm has earned himself another year. Carl has not.

Agreed. And I wish we could keep Herm in a sealed case with a sign that reads BREAK GLASS ONLY IN THE EVENT OF AN NFL DRAFT.

banyon
04-28-2008, 10:08 AM
It sets up a bad scenario where the owner is telling the next GM he has to keep Herm around. No GM worth his salt is going to want to work in a situation where the coach has more power.

Kuharich wouldn't mind. But he's not worth his salt either.

xbarretx
04-28-2008, 10:14 AM
Agreed. And I wish we could keep Herm in a sealed case with a sign that reads BREAK GLASS ONLY IN THE EVENT OF AN NFL DRAFT.

LOL!!!!!! rep

JBucc
04-28-2008, 10:20 AM
This year and next year are setup years. In 2010 I want some results that include a playoff win or some other coach will come in and reap the rewards of Herm's drafting.

kc rush
04-28-2008, 10:22 AM
When done the right way, a rebuild can turn a franchise into a perennial contender, but it will also take more than one offseason. In all likelihood, we are going to be horrible next year and win between 3-6 games. But the important thing is that we play the youngsters and see some real growth in this team. If that happens, then we should definitely keep Herm for the time being; if it doesn't, then it will be time to cut ties and bring in a new man.

This is what was supposed to happen last year, and it is one of the main reasons I'm done with Herm. In the midst of a losing season, he kept trotting out the old and tired while younger players should have been given their shot.

Fat Elvis
04-28-2008, 10:22 AM
Carl is just licking his chops. He knows Herm is getting all the credit for this draft. Now the King will undermine it by refusing to sign the draft picks until mid-season.

BigChiefFan
04-28-2008, 10:58 AM
I think he gets this year-If the team doesn't take some major strides, I can see them being gone.

dirk digler
04-28-2008, 11:19 AM
It sets up a bad scenario where the owner is telling the next GM he has to keep Herm around. No GM worth his salt is going to want to work in a situation where the coach has more power.

That would be true if it was a brand new GM. But if it is Kuharich that is a different story.

DTLB58
04-28-2008, 11:25 AM
Herm should be able to coach out his contract (2 more years?) and get re-evaulated then. I'm thinking I would want him gone from the sidelines by then though. I wouldn't mind that he stay on in some other capacity with the Chiefs though.

Carl can leave on the first plane out as far as I'm concerned.

Mile High Mania
04-28-2008, 11:35 AM
Give Herm more time, but if I were a fan... I'd think Carl should still move on. Sure, this was a great draft... but, does it erase the sins for him over the last 2 decades?

BigChiefFan
04-28-2008, 11:38 AM
Give Herm more time, but if I were a fan... I'd think Carl should still move on. Sure, this was a great draft... but, does it erase the sins for him over the last 2 decades?Agreed. I think Kuharich has already done better than Carl ever dreamed of. Kuharich should be our GM or Bill Polian's right hand man.

Pasta Giant Meatball
04-28-2008, 12:36 PM
i agree as most are fickle... but for myself no matter what record we get ... PROVIDING its not 8 - 8 ill be satisfied as we play the young guys and find out what Croyle can really do. i know it sounds corny but Dorsey has made me very happy. i look forward to watching him lay a hurting on Cutler and Jamarcus(sp?) and that will allow our outside guys to get opps to get in there and put some hits and pressure in the backfield :clap:

cmon, if we go 8-8 with this young of a team we are heading in the right direction...sure going 4-12 again gets us a higher pick, but going 8-8 young is a heck of alot diferent than when we were going 8-8, 9-7 with vets.

BigChiefFan
04-28-2008, 12:59 PM
cmon, if we go 8-8 with this young of a team we are heading in the right direction...sure going 4-12 again gets us a higher pick, but going 8-8 young is a heck of alot diferent than when we were going 8-8, 9-7 with vets.
We do have a fairly easy schedule, so with that in mind, anything less than 6-10 should get Carl canned, IMO. That's alot of rookies adjusting, but good Lord, Kuharich did most of the work, not Carl. I think they all did their due dilligence, but Carl's time is still up, IMO. I'm done with him-awesome draft or not.

kstater
04-28-2008, 02:38 PM
This is what was supposed to happen last year, and it is one of the main reasons I'm done with Herm. In the midst of a losing season, he kept trotting out the old and tired while younger players should have been given their shot.

You don't think that was Carl's directive?

Mecca
04-28-2008, 02:42 PM
If they go out and go 2-14 or something no, most people will flip out because they aren't realistic or understanding about what's going on.

With some of us though it's fine, you have to understand odds are it will take atleast 2 great drafts maybe 3 before this team is totally setup to really win alot of games...I'd expect to see results in the field next season not this coming one at maybe going up to 6-8 wins then the year after would be the first year of real contention.

Pestilence
04-28-2008, 02:49 PM
Herm can stay as long as we see improvement over the next two years....and we continue to get talent through the draft.

Carl will probably stay until the renovations are done....and then he'll be gone.

Spectre
04-28-2008, 02:51 PM
One can only hope. want to be sure you guys continue to suck!

Zouk
04-28-2008, 02:54 PM
We need to show progress. A lot of that comes down to Croyle. I expect 6-8 wins in 2008.

Reerun_KC
04-28-2008, 02:55 PM
"At the end of the day" it is still Herman Edwards... He wasnt anything special in NYJ, left that team a mess... He wont be anything special but a career sub .500 coach when he leaves here...

Just praying he doesnt leave us in the same mess....

Carl should just go now...

Both should of been gone in Janurary...

CupidStunt
04-28-2008, 02:56 PM
Herm needs to be a GM/VPofPP type guy. Carl needs to f**k off. Coach needs to be a risk-taking YOUNG guy.

I LIKE Herm. I love him with the players. He's just not a GAMEDAY coach with ability to scheme.

Mecca
04-28-2008, 03:00 PM
We need to show progress. A lot of that comes down to Croyle. I expect 6-8 wins in 2008.

I will be shocked if they win more than 5 games.

Reerun_KC
04-28-2008, 03:02 PM
I LIKE Herm. I love him with the players. He's just not a GAMEDAY coach with ability to scheme.

I agree, but he also has an ego as big or bigger than Carls... He might be able to draft talent, we know he shouldnt be coaching even a DIII college team, but I think he is a mini Carl with the ego..

If he wasnt, there wouldnt be his dog and pony show press conferences that absolutely make zero sense, Herm is a media glory hound....

chiefsfan1963
04-28-2008, 07:36 PM
Unfortuantely we will suck again this season! I'm estatic that we finally drafted high and actually can make a difference with this year's draft. I have optimism that Clark has showed some hints that he's ready to pull the plug on CP. Clark is going to be more active regarding the operations this year and he expects that the Chiefs will be competitive in the playoffs this season. I can only hope that another 4-12 season will send CP packing followed by Herm!

This team has just gotten worse since DV has left!

By the way Croyle sucks and we need a QB BIG TIME! We will have to draft a QB next year. Hopefully there will be a franchise type player available.

talastan
04-28-2008, 07:48 PM
Herm yes, Carl.....uhhh........Hell NO!!

POND_OF_RED
04-28-2008, 08:47 PM
Carl needs to go and Herm needs to take his spot.

Rausch
04-28-2008, 08:49 PM
I'm fully willing to wait until the 4 year deals are up...