PDA

View Full Version : Other Sports Would you pass up NBA money for Greece?


SBK
07-23-2008, 09:41 PM
The big to do list for the Atlanta Hawks this off-season was to keep the Josh's. They had a 5 year $36MM offer on the table, which was turned down for an offer in GREECE..!

Josh Childress turns down NBA money for a (net after tax) $20,000,000 for 3 years in Greece.

Is this something we'll see more of?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3501488

Josh Childress (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3823) is leaving the Atlanta Hawks (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=atl) for Greek club Olympiacos, reversing the course of the many international stars who have signed with the NBA.

Heading overseas allows Childress to make more money than he could have as a restricted free agent in the United States. The Hawks had the right to match an offer from another NBA team, but not from an international club.


Agent Jim Tanner said Wednesday the three-year deal was worth about $20 million after taxes. The money is guaranteed, and Childress can opt out of the contract after each year.

markk
07-23-2008, 10:03 PM
I'm a little confused. Did he take $20 million guaranteed over 3 years instead of $36 million not guaranteed over 5 years? I might do that too.

Mr. Flopnuts
07-23-2008, 10:11 PM
Posted via Mobile Device

It's more money. It's AFTER tax money, and he has a player option to opt out after each year. It was a far superior deal to what the Hawks offered.

BTAU
07-23-2008, 10:14 PM
I'm a little confused. Did he take $20 million guaranteed over 3 years instead of $36 million not guaranteed over 5 years? I might do that too.

All NBA contracts are guaranteed. But that $36 was before taxes. And he can opt out after every year of the international contract, whereas he would be stuck in the NBA one. I also heard that the Greece team is giving him a house to use.

markk
07-23-2008, 10:25 PM
All NBA contracts are guaranteed. But that $36 was before taxes. And he can opt out after every year of the international contract, whereas he would be stuck in the NBA one. I also heard that the Greece team is giving him a house to use.

Thanks. Don't really follow the NBA.

Sounds like he made a good financial decision.

I wonder how long before highly regarded prospects go to play in Europe to develop skills for the NBA while making money instead of going to college to develop skills for the NBA?

Ari Chi3fs
07-23-2008, 10:28 PM
LAS VEGAS – The prospects of an NBA superstar making a leap of faith and fortune to the burgeoning European basketball market isn’t close, but it no longer seems such an outrageous possibility. As models for the perfect pioneer go, Jason Kidd (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/2625/;_ylt=ArGvwk3WP_6Zc3YwUxq6W8fTjdIF) does believe that his talents at 35 years old are suited to the Euro game, where size, strength and smarts are a tonic for declining speed and explosiveness.
Yes, Kidd is relentlessly committed to chasing an NBA title with Dirk Nowitzki (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3252/;_ylt=AvnA.mru1AQJow0Rpu_hcOHTjdIF) and the Dallas Mavericks (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/dal/;_ylt=AuEHUMKyn5dGDP51kz_zJPXTjdIF). Still, nothing is forever for him at 35. When delivered a premise about the possibility of someday following the Atlanta Hawks (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/atl/;_ylt=AtZxqrMFF9hzVnZMiVLQxAHTjdIF)’ Josh Childress (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3823/;_ylt=AkA2Howq56jz4GSsMsELBwPTjdIF) to Europe, Kidd confessed that no longer is it possible to consider your future in a context limited to the NBA.

<table class="ad_slug_table" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td align="center">ADVERTISEMENT
<iframe marginwidth="0" marginheight="0" src="http://ad.yieldmanager.com/st?ad_type=iframe&ad_size=160x600&site=140509&section_code=12804537&cb=1216873310491550&ycg=&yyob=&promote_sizes=1&pub_redirect_unencoded=1&pub_redirect=http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=14vrnf9pe/M=674272.12804537.13083462.1323516/D=sports/S=97684947:SKY/_ylt=ArpGLK4tiy7v77l_937O1lbTjdIF/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1216880510/L=suh_fUWTWevljs4eR4ApJQHBRvyFRUiIA14ABpX5/B=EYKYBNGDJGs-/J=1216873310491550/A=5404999/R=0/*" frameborder="0" height="600" scrolling="no" width="160"></iframe></td></tr></tbody></table><script language="javascript"> if(window.yzq_d==null)window.yzq_d=new Object(); window.yzq_d['EYKYBNGDJGs-']='&U=13e1mu2l7%2fN%3dEYKYBNGDJGs-%2fC%3d674272.12804537.13083462.1323516%2fD%3dSKY%2fB%3d5404999%2fV%3d1'; </script><noscript>http://us.bc.yahoo.com/b?P=suh_fUWTWevljs4eR4ApJQHBRvyFRUiIA14ABpX5&T=14u1tkqtb%2fX%3d1216873310%2fE%3d97684947%2fR%3dsports%2fK%3d5%2fV%3d2.1%2fW%3dH%2fY%3dYAHOO%2fF%3 d598349595%2fH%3dY29udGVudD0ibGVhZ3VlPW5iYQ--%2fQ%3d-1%2fS%3d1%2fJ%3dBA599345&U=13e1mu2l7%2fN%3dEYKYBNGDJGs-%2fC%3d674272.12804537.13083462.1323516%2fD%3dSKY%2fB%3d5404999%2fV%3d1</noscript>
“In the next four or five years, could I end up playing over there?” Kidd wondered. “Hey, why wouldn’t I play in Italy or somewhere (else)? That might be a great experience.
“It’s a legitimate option now with Childress going over there.”
As he prepares for the Beijing Olympics with Team USA, Kidd is under contract with Dallas through next season. He has his eyes on an extension past 2008-09, but who knows anymore?
“Why not?” Kidd said. “We saw the Euro players coming here, and now it’s kind of flip-flopping.”
Through the years, a lot of terrific NBA players left for Europe in the twilight of their careers. Some rookies used it as leverage in contract disputes. Even a high school player, Brandon Jennings, signed with Virtus Roma this month. Now, the next step has come with a young American-born NBA sixth man, Childress, choosing Olympiakos of Greece for three years and $20 million. He passed on a comparable contract with the Atlanta Hawks, as much of a statement on the growing worth of European franchises as it was an indictment of a shoddy Atlanta operation.
Make no mistake: A threshold has been crossed in the sport. Suddenly, Europe is evolving into a true rival in free agency.
Childress is no superstar, but he was a desired restricted free agent in the NBA. As the American dollar shrinks to the Euro and European operations increase in prestige and resources, so starts the irreversible wave of change.
“David Stern and the NBA have been promoting the globalization of the sport for years,” agent Lon Babby said by phone on Wednesday. “It’s only natural it would begin to flow both ways. It’s something players and agents now have to look at.”
Babby represents Childress, and never hesitated to push his client toward the favorable financial arrangements of the Euroleague. Some insist this is such a risky move for a young NBA player, but is it that much more of a gamble to leave one of these forsaken NBA franchises with such horrible ownership, such suspect direction and commitment?
When Billy Knight resigned as Hawks GM this spring, ownership was unprepared to conduct a search. Atlanta floundered around, unsure of whom to recruit, who should be on their list. One owner called Sacramento’s GM Geoff Petrie, and Petrie quickly rejected them.
Atlanta should have made well-regarded Cleveland assistant GM Chris Grant a more credible offer, but it was determined to do everything on the cheap. In the end, the Hawks hired unemployed journeyman Rick Sund. Give Sund this: The opening salvo on his watch – losing Childress to Greece – is a disaster for the Hawks.
As long as franchises like Atlanta and Memphis have such poor ownership, such little commitment and competency, no one should be surprised that players like Childress and Juan Carlos Navarro (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3637/;_ylt=AqL83UuXYO9kBTRcJkvkr1XTjdIF), who recently signed a reported five-year, $20 million contract with FC Barcelona, will find Europe a suitable destination.
So, how long until those rich franchises in Russia, Spain and Greece are players for the biggest stars in the sport?
Well, Miami’s Dwyane Wade (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3708/;_ylt=ArhmiPOlLj2iy67xWyrpAQvTjdIF) laughed as he delivered a baseline bid to leave the NBA in the summer of 2010. “Thirty million a season, non-taxable?” Wade said. “I might have to think about it.”
The NBA’s salary cap and the declining American dollar leaves open the possibility that a European team eventually will be able to make the kind of Monopoly money bid to lure one of the NBA’s superstars. It won’t be this year. Nor next. The summer of 2010, when Wade, LeBron James (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3704/;_ylt=AkQf5hd_ioydyCoYNM3WbF3TjdIF) and Chris Bosh (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3707/;_ylt=Apkzf0MO4ac.V_UmrGH3TXTTjdIF) could be available, is too soon also. What if Europe decides that it doesn’t need to pay outlandish entrance fees to get teams in Stern’s league and it figures out a way to pool its resources to make itself more of a competitor?
However it goes, there will be a better and better parade of players leaving the NBA for Europe, and better Euros who never feel the need to come here.
“With the money being said that guys can get over there, it’s unbelievable,” Wade said. Not only do you have international players coming to America, you’ve got American players going international. And you’ve got big-time players doing it now. It’s interesting.
“If they offer me $40 million a year and no taxes, I might have to go over there. I’ll have to see you guys later.”
For now, Dwyane Wade was laughing. For how long, though?

BTAU
07-23-2008, 10:44 PM
Thanks. Don't really follow the NBA.

Sounds like he made a good financial decision.

I wonder how long before highly regarded prospects go to play in Europe to develop skills for the NBA while making money instead of going to college to develop skills for the NBA?

It's kind of hidden in Ari's post above, but Brandon Jennings, a pretty highly regarded Arizona recruit decided to go play in Europe. Granted he did not get high enough test scores to qualify for college. But, he was said to be considering the European league even if his last attempt to pass the test came back good enough to go to college.

Fruit Ninja
07-23-2008, 10:45 PM
Thanks. Don't really follow the NBA.

Sounds like he made a good financial decision.

I wonder how long before highly regarded prospects go to play in Europe to develop skills for the NBA while making money instead of going to college to develop skills for the NBA?Not long, Paid vacation to greece for a year or 2? That or go to school. They will be making tons of money their first year rather then going to college. Its going to happen fast. It already happens with MLB but the kids go to the minor league teams instead of college. Its just to hard to pass up that kind of money for being 18 years old.

markk
07-23-2008, 10:47 PM
Not long, Paid vacation to greece for a year or 2? That or go to school. They will be making tons of money their first year rather then going to college. Its going to happen fast. It already happens with MLB but the kids go to the minor league teams instead of college. Its just to hard to pass up that kind of money for being 18 years old.

In baseball i can see it. you start in the minors at 18 instead of 22, 23. you've got more years to try to get to the majors before you get too old. If you make it to the show, you're probably 22, 23 instead of 26, 27. You get to sign more contracts before you're too old. More years as a professional... hit free agency a few years earlier. Just makes good sense I think.

SBK
07-24-2008, 09:27 AM
I think this will be a very interesting thing moving forward. I don't follow the NBA much, but the idea of American's turning the NBA down to play in Europe fascinates me. Nothing I ever dreamed of seeing.

Just another reason David Stern is such a great commish....LMAO

vailpass
07-24-2008, 09:30 AM
It's kind of hidden in Ari's post above, but Brandon Jennings, a pretty highly regarded Arizona recruit decided to go play in Europe. Granted he did not get high enough test scores to qualify for college. But, he was said to be considering the European league even if his last attempt to pass the test came back good enough to go to college.

Sure he was.

Rausch
07-24-2008, 09:33 AM
Heading overseas allows Childress to make more money than he could have as a restricted free agent in the United States.

End of argument.

eazyb81
07-24-2008, 09:39 AM
Not long, Paid vacation to greece for a year or 2? That or go to school. They will be making tons of money their first year rather then going to college. Its going to happen fast. It already happens with MLB but the kids go to the minor league teams instead of college. Its just to hard to pass up that kind of money for being 18 years old.

Agree, I think it's funny how no one makes a big deal out of tons of baseball players going pro after high school every year, but the NBA had to put in a rule to "protect" all the high school kids that were opting for the draft.

I expect more kids to follow his lead and play for a year or two in Europe instead of going to college. These kids aren't interested in college and are using it simply as a stepping stone.

SBK
07-24-2008, 09:49 AM
Agree, I think it's funny how no one makes a big deal out of tons of baseball players going pro after high school every year, but the NBA had to put in a rule to "protect" all the high school kids that were opting for the draft.

I expect more kids to follow his lead and play for a year or two in Europe instead of going to college. These kids aren't interested in college and are using it simply as a stepping stone.

Isn't that what college is? A stepping stone for preparation of future employment?

eazyb81
07-24-2008, 09:57 AM
Isn't that what college is? A stepping stone for preparation of future employment?

I look at college as a learning environment to acquire skills needed for certain professions. People who want to be professional basketball players really have no use for college the same way certain trade professions like bricklayers and plumbers would have no use for it.

vailpass
07-24-2008, 10:00 AM
Isn't that what college is? A stepping stone for preparation of future employment?

Yes, but the requirements are academic not athletic (as compared to a sports league).

Seeing all these athletes who can't speak intelligibly or spell 'kat' and couldn't give a rat's ass about a degree get free rides in college is galling to those who bust their ass to pay for school. Best to drop the hypocrisy and let them skip college altogether.

This bums me out some, hope it doesn't dilute college ball. OTOH it should raise the quality of post-game interviews.

Iowanian
07-24-2008, 10:00 AM
Maybe it was greek marketing....

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/Jakk4568/FunnyCautionSign.jpg

SCTrojan
07-24-2008, 10:11 AM
From a financial standpoint, he made the clear right choice.

It also appears as though he thinks he made the right professional choice, and that may not necessarily be true.

One of the features of the Greek contract that has been prominently mentioned is he can opt out after every year. That aspect provides great flexibility, but it presumes that he'll be successful over there, which would then cause NBA teams to want his skills. We've seen with recent Olympic teams that success in the NBA does not automatically translate to success in the international game.

I wouldn't discount the culture shock aspect either. It's easy to say that it's only three years, but something as simple as getting a household established can be a fairly involved process in Europe. And it takes a long time to get used to living abroad.

On the flip side, the schedule is less arduous, so he saves wear and tear on his body. Europeans can often treat American basketball players like rock stars, so it can be a good environment to play in.

Who knows. I think he made a good decision, but I don't see it as the first drop of a flood of Americans going over to Europe to play.

Fruit Ninja
07-24-2008, 06:41 PM
Isn't that what college is? A stepping stone for preparation of future employment?

honestly not many are going to want future employment when they can bank about 5 million at 18 years old. If they are not retarded and can manage money, they n ever have to work again after their careers are over. Alot of these kids are dirt poor and its just to hard to pass up that kind of cash.

Valiant
07-24-2008, 07:03 PM
Agree, I think it's funny how no one makes a big deal out of tons of baseball players going pro after high school every year, but the NBA had to put in a rule to "protect" all the high school kids that were opting for the draft.

I expect more kids to follow his lead and play for a year or two in Europe instead of going to college. These kids aren't interested in college and are using it simply as a stepping stone.

Maybe on average the kids that played baseball were smarter then the kids that played basketball..

Then you add the fact that there are numerous developmental leagues for baseball.. Basketball???

You **** up in baseball somebody will pick you up and take a chance.. In basketball those high schoolers that **** up are screwed.. No chance at playing in college and probably were not smart enough to make it on their own(ie all they relied on was basketball skills)..

Valiant
07-24-2008, 07:06 PM
Yes, but the requirements are academic not athletic (as compared to a sports league).

Seeing all these athletes who can't speak intelligibly or spell 'kat' and couldn't give a rat's ass about a degree get free rides in college is galling to those who bust their ass to pay for school. Best to drop the hypocrisy and let them skip college altogether.

This bums me out some, hope it doesn't dilute college ball. OTOH it should raise the quality of post-game interviews.

It might actually be better.. You will get more people that want to play all four years at the school instead of one or two and then bolt.. Those kids do not really care about your college team anyway.. Just a stop gap in their dreams of making a pro team..

And maybe living over seas will mature the next bunch of basketball players up.. Instead of being here with their posses and negative influences..

Just a guess..

Valiant
07-24-2008, 07:10 PM
From a financial standpoint, he made the clear right choice.

I wouldn't discount the culture shock aspect either. It's easy to say that it's only three years, but something as simple as getting a household established can be a fairly involved process in Europe. And it takes a long time to get used to living abroad.

On the flip side, the schedule is less arduous, so he saves wear and tear on his body. Europeans can often treat American basketball players like rock stars, so it can be a good environment to play in.

Who knows. I think he made a good decision, but I don't see it as the first drop of a flood of Americans going over to Europe to play.

Yeah I have a couple of friends that live in England now and getting a residence sucked for them.. They play soccer over there after college..

But I think it might be the starting point of the flood.. Not sure on the greek dollar to American dollar value, but they might have gotten him for a deal.. Especially in the right country.. Other players will see this and soon jump ship also.. Hell I would..

Valiant
07-24-2008, 07:11 PM
honestly not many are going to want future employment when they can bank about 5 million at 18 years old. If they are not retarded and can manage money, they n ever have to work again after their careers are over. Alot of these kids are dirt poor and its just to hard to pass up that kind of cash.

The only question.. Which I am not sure.. Will the US tax him if he comes back over?? Or will he have to leave the money in a foreign account??

vailpass
07-24-2008, 08:10 PM
It might actually be better.. You will get more people that want to play all four years at the school instead of one or two and then bolt.. Those kids do not really care about your college team anyway.. Just a stop gap in their dreams of making a pro team..

And maybe living over seas will mature the next bunch of basketball players up.. Instead of being here with their posses and negative influences..

Just a guess..

I like your way of looking at it; think I'll adopt it and hope if you don't mind.

BTAU
07-24-2008, 08:47 PM
If they are not retarded and can manage money, they n ever have to work again after their careers are over. Alot of these kids are dirt poor and its just to hard to pass up that kind of cash.

I think that is a pretty big if, especially if you are talking about a 1) professional athlete, and 2) an 18 year old kid.

SBK
07-24-2008, 08:56 PM
College doesn't teach money management. You're also only an injury away from never playing again, so if you can get the money now you should.

I don't see any reason for the NBA to not allow 18 year olds in, but if they can go over seas instead I think that's a great option. Learn some culture, and get a chance to grow up a little bit without all the negative influence back home.....

Valiant
07-24-2008, 09:32 PM
College doesn't teach money management. You're also only an injury away from never playing again, so if you can get the money now you should.

I don't see any reason for the NBA to not allow 18 year olds in, but if they can go over seas instead I think that's a great option. Learn some culture, and get a chance to grow up a little bit without all the negative influence back home.....

I think it is the fail rate of the 18 year olds.. They would rather them go to college and get at least some learning(seems to be 1-2 years worth)..

Maybe the league should set up development league in cities without teams.. Only kids out of highschool and recent college grads can be in the league.. All the older guys can go to the ABA.. The league sets up money management courses and holds back a percentage of their money in an account for them.. BAsically managing it like a bank..

SithCeNtZ
07-24-2008, 11:23 PM
I doubt this will lead to any flood other than mediocre players like Childress getting tons more money than they would in the NBA. I don't think college kids will follow for a few reasons:

1) You might look really really bad over seas. If you go play on a pro team in Europe, you might get exposed very quickly and your stock can drop in seconds. Going against guys much older than you will never make you look good. Just look at what percentage of guys who get drafted come out and have good years in the NBA. Very few of them do. On the other hand, you can go to college and it's almost impossible to lose your stock. You would have to have a catastrophic injury to fall if you were a 1 and done kind of guy. Look at a guy like Eric Gordon. Had a pretty mediocre season at IU and his team wasn't all that good, but no matter what he always looked better than the other guys around him so his stock never dropped. Why would you want to risk looking bad when you don't have to? That sort of leads to #2...

2)I don't think Euro clubs are going to shell out huge money to get these guys if they don't do all that well and only stay for one year. Again, you would have to be realistic about what a guy fresh out of HS would get you. Look at a guy like OJ Mayo for instance. Lotto pick, big hype coming out of HS, people saying he is an all world talent...but he wasn't a dominant player. He struggled a bit more against good solid teams like KU and UCLA who have close to NBA guys who can defend him. Sure, he lights up Arizona St, but every Euro team he plays is going to be like KU and UCLA or better. They won't have athletes like Cal Poly. If Euro teams keep paying out 2 million for a HS kid to put up mediocre numbers or hardly even play at all then I think they will stop and not even bother. I doubt they want to become a free farm system for the NBA.

3)For the bigger name guys, I think branding/image will be another huge issue. When you are in the states, you are always on sports center, there are always tons of articles about you, and you always start out with a fan base of fans from your college who will spread the word about how good you are. You can't buy that kind of publicity, but if you go to Europe, who is going to care about you? Do you think Brandon Jennings is going to be all over sports center? Do you think anyone is going to watch his games in Europe? Do you think Nike/Adidas are going to be lining up to sign a guy to a shoe deal who most people are indifferent about? Of course not. You become almost invisible over seas, while in America you are always front page news. I bet that keeps many guys here in college.

kregger
07-24-2008, 11:27 PM
This is one hell of a good reason:
http://i.blog.empas.com/emtouch/26778334_340x340.jpg