LMAO McCain flip flops and now supports airing up tires

[dirk digler]

http://thepage.time.com/


OOOPS — He Did It Again (http://thepage.time.com/2008/08/05/ooops-he-did-it-again/)

McCain displays his normal “discipline” at a Tuesday tele-town meeting, undermining days of (questionable, desperate, and — apparently — effective) attacks by his campaign and the whole Republican Party on Obama’s call for tire inflation to save fuel.

McCain: “And could I mention that Senator Obama a couple of days ago said that we ought to all inflate our tires, and I don’t disagree with that. The American Automobile Association strongly recommends it.”

[banyon]

THATS HIS ENTIRE ENERGY PLAN INFLATE YOUR TIRES

[dirk digler]

LMAO This is hilarious. IMO he is his own worst enemy and I can't believe anyone would support this old man for POTUS.

[cfl]

Wow! I hope all you people that pretended in the other thread that this was soooo stupid, feel better about McCain now.

Up next for McCain...an "apple a day" health care plan.ROFL

[SBK]

Did he add if we inflate our tires there's no need to drill? That would be the joke of the statement, not the fact that Obama said we should inflate our tires.

[banyon]

Did he add if we inflate our tires there's no need to drill? That would be the joke of the statement, not the fact that Obama said we should inflate our tires.

That wasn't really what he said, but nice try.

[little jacob]

gee i thought he was against inflated tires.

[dirk digler]

Did he add if we inflate our tires there's no need to drill? That would be the joke of the statement, not the fact that Obama said we should inflate our tires.

:rolleyes: Yeah because that is all that Obama said as well.

McCain has been hammering on Obama for the past few days for saying we need to inflate tires now he comes out and supports it. What a tool and a joke of a candidate.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Did he add if we inflate our tires there's no need to drill? That would be the joke of the statement, not the fact that Obama said we should inflate our tires.Link?

[DeezNutz]

And the quotation ends there? There's nothing more?

[dirk digler]

And the quotation ends there? There's nothing more?

Yep funny how that works. McCain takes a sentence out of what Obama says and tries to be cute about it and now he gets the same treatment.

[dirk digler]

Ohh this is good

But the salient point is that such measures are serious. Why the Republicans are mocking them at a time of energy crisis seems bizarre.
We're also reminded of this news from 1990:

"The Washington Times, September 14, 1990...The Bush administration yesterday launched an advertising blitz telling Americans they could fight oil shortages and high gas prices by conserving, while advising Congress there is no sign of price gouging by the oil industry and that gas prices are 'not unreasonable.' The slogan for the yearlong campaign, 'Do Your Part, Drive Smart,' tells consumers they can save more than 7 million gallons of gasoline a day if they keep their tires properly inflated, drive slower and join car pools.
Said Energy Secretary James D. Watkins: "The president has called upon Americans to do their part 'to conserve. Our intention is to give people simple steps they can take immediately and have direct impact on fuel savings."

[DeezNutz]

Yep funny how that works. McCain takes a sentence out of what Obama says and tries to be cute about it and now he gets the same treatment.

It's that time of year. Works both ways.

[dirk digler]

It's that time of year. Works both ways.

Totally agree. It is definitely the silly season and gotcha politics.

[cfl]

Ohh this is good

That is good!

[HolmeZz]

Colbert pounded McCain on this tonight too.

[Ultra Peanut]

This made me literally cackle. Here comes the onslaught from the right...

Bueller? Hannity? Limbaugh? Stein?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

This made me literally cackle. Here comes the onslaught from the right...

Bueller? Hannity? Limbaugh? Stein?

You'll notice a conspicuous absence of them whenever true policy is brought up in this election. Probably just a coincidence, though.

[beer bacon]

Don't ask me why, but Halperin removed this story about an hour after posting it. Luckily, Reuters has picked it up:

http://blogs.reuters.com/trail08/2008/08/05/mccain-takes-air-out-of-tire-pressure-debate/

Posted by Matthew Bigg
HUNTINGTON, W. Va - Republican John McCain appeared to back down on Tuesday in his dispute with his opponent Barack Obama over tire pressure.

Last week in St. Louis, Obama told an audience that steps such as inflating tires to the correct levels could make a difference when it comes to conserving fuel.

Cue gleeful mockery from McCain. Obama was naive, inexperienced and not talking straight to the American people about energy, he said.

His campaign went further, distributing to reporters tire gauges engraved with the words “Obama’s energy plan.”

Predictably, Obama hit back calling McCain’s mockery “ignorant,” arguing his plans were being misrepresented and saying that experts backed his call over tire pressure. Equally predictably, McCain’s camp hit back.

The surprise came during a telephone town hall meeting McCain held on Tuesday with voters in Pennsylvania.

“Obama said a couple of days ago says we all should inflate our tires. I don’t disagree with that. The American Automobile Association strongly recommends it,” McCain said.

But he kept up his broad criticism of Obama on energy: “I … don’t think that that (inflating tires) is a way to become energy independent.”

The United States’ energy challenges will be a central factor in the months leading up to the election. But when it comes to how far to inflate your tires, the air seems to have gone out of the dispute.

[cfl]

Don't ask me why, but Halperin removed this story about an hour after posting it. Luckily, Reuters has picked it up:

http://blogs.reuters.com/trail08/2008/08/05/mccain-takes-air-out-of-tire-pressure-debate/

Posted by Matthew Bigg
HUNTINGTON, W. Va - Republican John McCain appeared to back down on Tuesday in his dispute with his opponent Barack Obama over tire pressure.

Last week in St. Louis, Obama told an audience that steps such as inflating tires to the correct levels could make a difference when it comes to conserving fuel.

Cue gleeful mockery from McCain. Obama was naive, inexperienced and not talking straight to the American people about energy, he said.

His campaign went further, distributing to reporters tire gauges engraved with the words “Obama’s energy plan.”

Predictably, Obama hit back calling McCain’s mockery “ignorant,” arguing his plans were being misrepresented and saying that experts backed his call over tire pressure. Equally predictably, McCain’s camp hit back.

The surprise came during a telephone town hall meeting McCain held on Tuesday with voters in Pennsylvania.

“Obama said a couple of days ago says we all should inflate our tires. I don’t disagree with that. The American Automobile Association strongly recommends it,” McCain said.

But he kept up his broad criticism of Obama on energy: “I … don’t think that that (inflating tires) is a way to become energy independent.”

The United States’ energy challenges will be a central factor in the months leading up to the election. But when it comes to how far to inflate your tires, the air seems to have gone out of the dispute.

Where are all the jokes today? Strange that when Obama says it, its a 15 page thread but when McSame suddenly agrees after days of mockery...ROFL

[Baby Lee]

Where are all the jokes today? Strange that when Obama says it, its a 15 page thread but when McSame suddenly agrees after days of mockery...ROFL

Jesus effing Christ. NO ONE is saying that inflating your tires is a BAD IDEA.
It was Obama's stance that it was this revolutionary idea that would obviate our need to take steps in offshore drilling.

[Ultra Peanut]

Our "need" to take steps in offshore drilling?

Cool spin.

[Baby Lee]

Our "need" to take steps in offshore drilling?

Cool spin.

We need oil.
there is oil offshore.
We can debate if the risks and side effects OUTWEIGH that need, but the need exists in the mix.

And Obama's stance is that, if we all pumped up our tires, we'd no longer need the oil deposited offshore.

[Radar Chief]

I hate big tire air. :cuss:

[cfl]

Thats not his stance. In fact he is going to vote for off shore drilling. He simply said we could save as much oil by inflating our tires as we are going to gain by drilling.

[beer bacon]

Jesus effing Christ. NO ONE is saying that inflating your tires is a BAD IDEA.
It was Obama's stance that it was this revolutionary idea that would obviate our need to take steps in offshore drilling.

That was never Obama's stance. This is called a strawman. It isn't legitimate for McCain, or Rush, or you, to create these things out of thin air so you can attack Obama for them.

It was Obama's stance that a common sense, low effort thing like everybody making sure their tires have the proper amount of air in them actually will actually increase our oil efficiency as much or more then the oil we would gain through increased offshore oil drilling.

Obama just did a 30-45 minute speech on his energy plan a few days ago that got into the meat of his energy plan. Anyone that reads this forum regularly knows this. Anyone that keeps up with the news at all should know that what you and McCain are saying is a load of BS.

[Baby Lee]

That was never Obama's stance. This is called a strawman. It isn't legitimate for McCain, or Rush, or you, to create these things out of thin air so you can attack Obama for them.

It was Obama's stance that a common sense, low effort thing like everybody making sure their tires have the proper amount of air in them actually will actually increase our oil efficiency as much or more then the oil we would gain through increased offshore oil drilling.

Obama just did a 30-45 minute speech on his energy plan a few days ago that got into the meat of his energy plan. Anyone that reads this forum regularly knows this. Anyone that keeps up with the news at all should know that what you and McCain are saying is a load of BS.

Yeah, he's critiquing McCain's stance on drilling, and JUST HAPPENS to make a comparison to the benefits of inflation to the benefits of drilling, in a campaign stump speech, but what he was really doing was taking a little time out from seeking the presidency to give us an energy savings tip completely free of political implications.

Thank you Mr. Obama, for having the grace to give me good sound advice without any partisan unpinnings.

[beer bacon]

Yeah, he's critiquing McCain's stance on drilling, and JUST HAPPENS to make a comparison to the benefits of inflation to the benefits of drilling, in a campaign stump speech, but what he was really doing was taking a little time out from seeking the presidency to give us an energy savings tip completely free of political implications.

Thank you Mr. Obama, for having the grace to give me good sound advice without any partisan unpinnings.

He put increased offshore oil drilling in juxtaposition with properly inflating your tires to show that the increased offshore oil drilling the GOP is making out to be our savior won't really increase our energy independence much at all. Increased offshore oil drilling is an election year gimmick.

[penchief]

It's that time of year. Works both ways.

We'll see if the corporate media pounces on McCain's backtracking on this like they did his mockery of Obama. Somehow I doubt it. At least the track record so far would suggest they'll give him another free pass.

The corporate media has been subsidizing McCain's campaign. They have run with his smears of Obama and given them credence while simultaneously giving him a free ride on anything that makes him look bad (which has been quite a lot lately). I think it's been pretty obvious for everyone to see.

[ROYC75]

Ohh this is good

Quote:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
But the salient point is that such measures are serious. Why the Republicans are mocking them at a time of energy crisis seems bizarre.
We're also reminded of this news from 1990:

"The Washington Times, September 14, 1990...The Bush administration yesterday launched an advertising blitz telling Americans they could fight oil shortages and high gas prices by conserving, while advising Congress there is no sign of price gouging by the oil industry and that gas prices are 'not unreasonable.' The slogan for the yearlong campaign, 'Do Your Part, Drive Smart,' tells consumers they can save more than 7 million gallons of gasoline a day if they keep their tires properly inflated, drive slower and join car pools.
Said Energy Secretary James D. Watkins: "The president has called upon Americans to do their part 'to conserve. Our intention is to give people simple steps they can take immediately and have direct impact on fuel savings."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


We all know that as Americans we can soften the oil consumption across the country, but as Americans, too many are just to lazy to the point to do so. Getting millions of Americans to do this is impossible. No matter how much you preach it, they won't do it. You will get a large part to do so, but not all.

Sure Obama had a point about his statement, but it will not replace the amount of oil we are consuming now.

Americans are there own worst enemy here........... This country is destine for bankruptcy.

[banyon]

We need oil.
there is oil offshore.
We can debate if the risks and side effects OUTWEIGH that need, but the need exists in the mix.

And Obama's stance is that, if we all pumped up our tires, we'd no longer need the oil deposited offshore.

We don't need oil. We need energy.

Preferably, a source that doesn't take a million years to replenish and isn't located primarily under our sworn enemy's land too.

[Baby Lee]

We don't need oil. We need energy.

That reminds me, I need to fill my tank with energy soon.

[beer bacon]

That reminds me, I need to fill my tank with energy soon.

I need to head down to the market to buy some whale oil for my lamps.

[banyon]

That reminds me, I need to fill my tank with energy soon.

We should probably formulate all of our long term policy goals in the span of what you need to do in the next 15 minutes. :D

[Baby Lee]

We should probably formulate all of our long term policy goals in the span of what you need to do in the next 15 minutes. :D

We should inflict short term pain in the center of our economy to drive home the importance of changing direction to things we hope will eventually exist.

[banyon]

We should inflict short term pain in the center of our economy to drive home the importance of changing direction to things we hope will eventually exist.

I guess you think this statement is sarcastic, but I actually agree with it.

But it's not "hope". Plenty of the technology already exists.

[BucEyedPea]

I need to head down to the market to buy some whale oil for my lamps.

I keep my lights out at night now....and use candles instead.
If wicks become scarce, I'll just do what was done in the Middle-Ages.
Go down to the marshes and yank some reeds, pull out the fiber in the middle, dip that in leftover fat from meals and light it. Maybe even make some torches.

[Baby Lee]

I guess you think this statement is sarcastic, but I actually agree with it.

But it's not "hope". Plenty of the technology already exists.

Luckily we price gasoline and foodstuffs progressively and the poor get all the energy efficient vehicles so that pain has some semblance of equitable distribution.

[banyon]

Luckily we price gasoline and foodstuffs progressively and the poor get all the energy efficient vehicles so that pain has some semblance of equitable distribution.

Yeah, while we're at it, those might be some good ideas too. Kind of like the fuel rebate that Obama has already proposed. Now you're getting it! :)

[Dallas Chief]

Ohh this is good

Do you know the context of the quote? It seems to me from a chronological standpoint that this was pre Gulf War and I remember fuel price spiking leading up to it. Just curious...

[Dallas Chief]

That reminds me, I need to fill my tank with energy soon.

:clap:ROFL:clap:

[Chiefnj2]

What is McCain's stance on energy and oil? Who knows. I guess it depends on the day of the week.

- windfall profits
MCCAIN: “Um, I don’t like obscene profits being made anywhere–and I’d be glad to look not just at the windfall profits tax–that’s not what bothers me–but we should look at any incentives that we are giving to people, that or industries or corporations that are distorting the market.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FP8eDdVzy9s

- drilling
During his last run for the presidency, in 1999, McCain supported the drilling moratorium, and he scolded the “special interests in Washington” that sought offshore drilling leases.

""Senator John McCain, who criticized the Clinton Administration for its decision to extend 36 offshore oil leaves along the central California coast over the objections of that state's Governor and Attorney General, has promised to "never lose sight of the fundamental principle that federal land management decisions affecting local communities must be made in cooperation with the Americans who call those communities home.""


- Who was the first candidate to be open to offshore drilling? Not McCain.

McCain Leans Toward a Compromise on Offshore Drilling

By BRIAN KNOWLTON
Published: August 4, 2008
WASHINGTON — A day after Senator Barack Obama said he would consider supporting broad energy legislation that would permit some of the offshore oil drilling he had previously opposed, an aide to Senator John McCain said Sunday that he too might support such a compromise package.


- Special tax incentives for the oil industry
MCCAIN: "I have worked to end corporate welfare enjoyed by certain fossil fuel industries most recently offering an amendment to end oil and gas subsidies." (source: response to Sustainable Energy Coalition's presidential candidates' survey, October 18, 1999)

[Sully]

I need to head down to the market to buy some whale oil for my lamps.

Reminds me of this SNL skit (couldn't find video).

[ open on anti-war rally in front of the Lincoln Memorial ]

Protest Leader: Yeah. We're here today, on the steps of Lincoln Memorial, to send a message to the war hawks - or, should I say, chicken hawks - right here in Washington, D.C.! For diplomacy.. for.. no.. war.. in Iraq!

[ the crowd cheers their enthusiasm ]

Protest Leader: Yeah! That's right! That's right! You see, the Bush administration.. must know the reason.. for this protest. We demonstrate for peace! My voice.. your voice.. thousands of voices! Rising up as one!

[ the crowd cheers their enthusiasm ]

Gay Protestor #1: [ raising his voice above the cheers ] We're HERE! We're QUEER! Get USED to it!

Protest Leader: [ dismayed at the unexpected outburst ] No, no, no, no, no, no, not exactly! But, yes! We are people from all walks of life, who are coming together today for a single purpose, yeah!

Gay Protestor #1: For GAY RIGHTS!

Protest Leader: No. Not gay rights.

Gay Protestor #1: You're against gay rights?!

Gay Protestor #2: Homophobe!

Protest Leader: That's not.. that not what I meant. I support gay rights, alright? But today - today, people - we are gathered here to protest the Bush administration's.. illegal war!

Stoned Protestor #1: [ in another unexpected, perhaps malicious, outburst ] Yeahh!! Drugs should be LEGAL!!

Stoned Protestor #2: Stop the drug war!

Protest Leader: No! Not that war!

Stoned Protestor #2: You know, they use hemp to make rope!

Protest Leader: Yes, I know that! Alright? But that is not what we're here for today! Alright, we have one purpose today!

Whale Protestor: SAVE THE WHALES!!

Protest Leader: Oh, come on, man! That's so old school! I don't even think the whales are in trouble any more!

Whale Protestor: With that attitude, they are!

Protest Leader: Hey! Can everybody sit with me a minute?! Alright?! We are talking about.. Iraq!

Whale Protestor: Don't send the whales to Iraq!!

Protest Leader: [ with teeth clenched ] Nobody wants to send any whales to Iraq, man! Alright, it's not about that! It's about not sending our children into war!

Pro-Life Protestor #1: [ in yet another unexpected and inappropriate outburst ] And the UNBON CHILDREN!! Save the UNBORN CHILDREN!!

Pro-Life Protestor #2: YEAH! Save them for FUTURE WARS!!

Protest Leader: Hey, hey, hey, hey! Hey, listen, listen.. will the pro-lifers please stick to the program! Alright, regardless of what the White says.. we know what this war's really about. Don't we? It's about.. oil.

Whale Protestor: Whale oil??

Protest Leader: No.

Pro-Life Protestor #1: BABY OIL??

Protest Leader: NO!!

Gay Protestor #1: Sex oil!

Protest Leader: [ outraged by all the needless outbursts ] NO!! It's NOT ?? OIL!!

Confused Protestor: Stop killing our babies for their precious oil!!

Protest Leader: Are you talking about baby whales?!

Whale Protestor: No! I'm the whale guy!

Protest Leader: Oh. Sorry.

Confused Protestor: I was talking about ACTUAL BABIES!!

Protest Leader: Lady.. nobody makes oil out of babies.

Confused Protestor: [ a beat ] ..Realize that now!

Protest Leader: Okay..

Confused Protestor: Just got carried away!

Protest Leader: Okay. Now.. everybody. Can you work with me? Can you work with me? Can we get back on track here?

Female Protestor: Right! We must FEED THE CHILDREN!!

Stoned Protestor #2: YEAHHH!!! Feed 'em to the WHALES!!

Protest Leader: Hey! We need to show our government - and the world - that we're being united here for one cause! Can we do that?!

[ the crowd cheers their enthusiasm ]

Protest Leader: Yes! Yes! A cause for respect for human life everywhere!

[ the crowd cheers their enthusiasm ]

Protest Leader: That every man is our brother! That every woman is our sister!

Pro-Life Protestors: Except the SMOKERS!!

Black Protestor: YEAH!! DOWN WITH THE SMOKERS!!

Gay Protestor #1: Yeah, why don't you go back to.. [ thinking ] ..Smokesylvania!

Protest Leader: [ losing control again ] Alright..

Stoned Protestor #2: It's okay to smoke WEED, though!!

Stoned Protestor #1: Yeahh!! It's an herb! You can make rope out of it!

Protest Leader: You said that already!

Stoned Protestor #1: [ thinking ] Noooo! [ points to his buddy ] He said it last time!

Protest Leader: You know what.. everybody, just get with me for a second!! Alright, we're not making rope!! We're trying to stop a war! We're trying to keep innocent people out of harm's way!

Whale Protestor: Then, legalize porn!!

Protest Leader: Sir, it is legal.. okay?

Whale Protestor: Not the kind I like..

Protest Leader: Hey! You can't just do a big scattershot protest with everyone's personal agenda like this! Alright? Can we all just.. focus on why we gathered out here today, in front of Lincoln Memorial?!

Pro-Life Protestor #2: FREE LINCOLN!!!

Protest Leader: Free him from WHAT?! His GRAVE?!!

[ the crowd boos angrily, ready to attack the Protest Leader ]

Gay Protestor #1: [ weeping ] You should be sorry about that!

Whale Protestor: What are you joking down Lincoln for?!

Protest Leader: I'm not jumping down Lincoln, okay? My bad! I was out of line! But, people.. please.. can you hear me out? Can you let me say one thing, alright?! Here we go! Stay with me! Our.. elected leaders.. are marching us straight into a war without any consideration for our opinions. Without any consideration for our votes, for our say!

[ the crowd cheers their enthusiasm ]

Protest Leader: That's right! That's right! That's right! Stay with me, stay with me.. Our freedoms are being taken away! And this whole situation with Iraq is to blame for it! So.. come on everybody! What do we say?

Crowd: BOMB IRAQ!! BOMB IRAQ!! BOMB IRAQ!! BOMB IRAQ!! BOMB IRAQ!!

Protest Leader: [ disgusted, steps down to leave ] Good luck..

[ fade on the protest crowd, organized again for the wrong reason ]

[Dallas Chief]

The corporate media has been subsidizing McCain's campaign. They have run with his smears of Obama and given them credence while simultaneously giving him a free ride on anything that makes him look bad (which has been quite a lot lately). I think it's been pretty obvious for everyone to see.

As opposed to the world wide RockStar tour the three nightly corporate media ancors took with BO. So yes it is pretty obvious that they'll leach onto anything...

[Radar Chief]

I guess you think this statement is sarcastic, but I actually agree with it.

But it's not "hope". Plenty of the technology already exists.

Like?

[Baby Lee]

Yeah, while we're at it, those might be some good ideas too. Kind of like the fuel rebate that Obama has already proposed. Now you're getting it! :)

Yeah, progressive pricing is a solution.

The newest fad suddenly becomes having your housekeeper and gardner fill up your cars as part of their job description.

[banyon]

Yeah, progressive pricing is a solution.

The newest fad suddenly becomes having your housekeeper and gardner fill up your cars as part of their job description.

I don't think that would work either. But I don't think you can substitute your gardener's tax return for your own, that might cause some other problems. As you point out, Obama's rebate plan would probably work better.

[Baby Lee]

I don't think that would work either. But I don't think you can substitute your gardener's tax return for your own, that might cause some other problems. As you point out, Obama's rebate plan would probably work better.

Gas prices and concomitant price increases in all consumer goods is way too regressive to even dent with a rebate.
The rich and poor, all have the same price to get from point A to point B. That price starts of a much smaller portion of a rich person's income. Then there's the rich persons access to more efficient transportation, work at home, telecommuting, and other travel lessening tech.
Leaving the poor to schlub back and forth to work, bearing the brutal brunt of our shared short term pain, and foregoing travel to visit friends and relatives, and vacations, basically anything that would ameliorate the drudgery of this ever so important kick in the pants we so richly deserve.

[HonestChieffan]

We don't need oil. We need energy.

Preferably, a source that doesn't take a million years to replenish and isn't located primarily under our sworn enemy's land too.

Tell that to the people who drive internal cumbustion engines. All the new tech in the world wont make the fact change that we have and will have a gazillion cars and trucks on the road that use oil to go. Thats precisely why we need to drill here, wherever therre is oil and do the tecno stuff at the same time.

Why do democrats not understand that doing all is the right approach?

[Baby Lee]

Why do democrats not understand that doing all is the right approach?

The only reason we don't have affordable cars that run on sunshine is that we're so lazy we accept the internal combustion engine and refuse to do the work to make miracles happen.

[penchief]

As opposed to the world wide RockStar tour the three nightly corporate media ancors took with BO. So yes it is pretty obvious that they'll leach onto anything...

Uh, he took as much grief over that "tour" as he did praise. McCain's bogus personal smears ended up getting more play than Obama's good showing did.

[Chiefnj2]

Tell that to the people who drive internal cumbustion engines. All the new tech in the world wont make the fact change that we have and will have a gazillion cars and trucks on the road that use oil to go. Thats precisely why we need to drill here, wherever therre is oil and do the tecno stuff at the same time.

Why do democrats not understand that doing all is the right approach?

Apparently Obama does understand.

"Obama said he would be open to some drilling if it were necessary to reach compromise on a broader energy plan -- like the one introduced by a bipartisan "Gang of 10" late last week. That plan, which Obama indicated he could support, calls for limited offshore drilling as well as increased investment in clean energy, with the overarching aim of reducing America's oil dependence. "

Your candidate of choice opposed offshore drilling when he ran for President in 2000. What exactly did he do about energy and oil for the last 8 years and why did he change his mind only after Obama said he would consider some offshore drilling?

[Dallas Chief]

Uh, he took as much grief over that "tour" as he did praise. McCain's bogus personal smears ended up getting more play than Obama's good showing did.

So he got smeared by the three anchors of corporate media? IIRC his tour was front page, lead story,etc. for the majority of the trip. You can't be serious? I mean if we are talking about Fox news, I get it, but the big three bagging on their guy, no way.

[Ultra Peanut]

So he got smeared by the three anchors of corporate media? IIRC his tour was front page, lead story,etc. for the majority of the trip. You can't be serious? I mean if we are talking about Fox news, I get it, but the big three bagging on their guy, no way.I guess McCain's been giving Obama great press since all of his commercials have shown lots of images of him?

[Donger]

Why would anyone be against making their vehicle as fuel-efficient as possible?

[RJ]

Obama can tune up a 67 Mustang blindfolded, get that thing purring like a kitten.

McCain doesn't even know how to change his own oil.

For me, the choice is clear.

[beer bacon]

As opposed to the world wide RockStar tour the three nightly corporate media ancors took with BO. So yes it is pretty obvious that they'll leach onto anything...

This is really not true. Katie Couric did an interview with Obama while he was on his trip. After the interview she did a rebuttal interview with McCain. During that interview McCain made a pretty big gaffe when he condescendingly said Obama didn't know his history, and then McCain claimed that the Anbar Awakening began after the Surge.

Instead of showing this incorrect claim by McCain, CBS News edited the interview by splicing McCain's answer to a different question. The media is first and foremost interested in turning the largest profit possible. This means keeping the race close, and that means hamstringing Obama so McCain can keep up. It is in the interest of all for-profit media outlets to keep this race close to keep peoples' attention.

[banyon]

Like?

I don't want this to devolve into another of our "2-stroke/four stroke debates", but in brief:

Hybrid/Plug in technology for autos
Wind/Hydro/Solar Energy generation for power plants
Mass transit/Rail transport useage
Alternate Biomass/Geothermal
Nuclear (Obama is pro-nuclear but I share his concerns about the storage and safety issues)

Basically we need the infrastructure not the technology to make this work.

Look at what The UAE is doing, they aren't just throwing up their hands and saying we can't do anything about it.
_______________________
Building the Zero-Emissions City
A city being built in Abu Dhabi will serve as a large-scale test for renewable energy.

http://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/20740/

Last week, in the harsh desert climate of Abu Dhabi, construction started on a city that will house 50,000 people and 1,500 businesses but use extremely little energy, and what it does use will come from renewable sources. The initial building is a new research institute that the founders hope will be the seed for the equivalent of a Silicon Valley of the Middle East, only one centered not on information technology but on renewable energy.

The city, which is expected to cost $22 billion, will implement an array of technologies, including thin-film solar panels that serve as the facades and roofing materials for buildings, ubiquitous sensors for monitoring energy use, and driverless vehicles powered by batteries that make cars unnecessary. Indeed, the city's founders hope that it will serve as a test bed for a myriad of new technologies being proposed to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions.

The new zero-emissions city, which is being built near the city of Abu Dhabi in the center of the United Arab Emirates (UAE), is part of the Masdar Initiative, a $15 billion government-funded investment program designed in part to ensure that the UAE's prosperity won't be linked exclusively to its oil. Its leaders say that the project will give the country a leadership position in renewable energy. If it's successful, says Sultan al Jaber, Masdar's CEO, "we'll be sitting on top of the world."

Designing the city from the ground up will bring a number of advantages. About half of the cost of solar energy comes from installation materials and labor. In Masdar, thin-film solar cells can be incorporated directly into the facades of buildings in place of conventional construction materials, reducing the costs of the solar power. Energy needed for cooling will be reduced by controlling the orientation and design of the city's buildings, streets, and green spaces to find a balance between shade and sun, and to promote natural-air circulation. Air conditioners will use absorption chillers that run on heat from the sun in place of conventional compressors.

Energy for transportation will also be reduced. Efficient electric transports will provide door-to-door service: just type in your destination, and the transport will come to your door and take you automatically to your destination. The power will be generated by renewable energy and stored onboard in batteries. On Monday, Masdar received the first bids on the system, which will likely use battery-powered vehicles running on tracks or powered by magnetic levitation.

Water use will be kept to a minimum--which will reduce energy needed for desalination. And sensors throughout the city will also keep residents informed of their energy use--and when they're going to have to pay extra for using too much. All told, the city's designers predict that efficiency improvements will result in a 75 percent reduction in energy consumption compared with a conventional city of the same size. The energy that is used will come almost entirely from solar--with wind and power from technology that converts garbage into fuel contributing smaller amounts.

This, as least, is the theory. One of the main purposes of the city is to find out what works and what doesn't. This experiment will continue even after the city is completed in eight years; "innovation hubs" throughout the city will test new technologies, including some developed at the new Masdar Institute of Science and Technology. The school is being developed in partnership with MIT, which is selecting faculty and designing curricula.

Of the $22 billion in expected costs, the Abu Dhabi government will provide about $4 billion for infrastructure. The rest of the money will come from outside investors. Masdar's leaders hope that the city's environmental credentials and low energy costs--along with tax breaks--will lure buyers to the property. "We want it to be profitable, not a sunk cost," says Khaled Awad, who is directing the development of the city. "If it is not profitable as a real-estate development, it's not sustainable. Then it will never be replicable anywhere else."

In some ways, however, it won't be replicable. Al Jaber notes that the project could not have been done anywhere else--"It's a huge risk." The enormous wealth in Abu Dhabi, which Fortune ranked the world's richest city last year, makes a zero-emissions city a tenable proposition. What's more, the design is specific to Abu Dhabi, accounting for, for example, the position of the sun throughout the year (which is dependent on the city's latitude), the high temperatures (which are bad for most solar cells), and the nature of the wind (the city will use wind turbines much smaller than conventional ones because of low wind speeds). As a result, future developments outside the region will have to be redesigned. "Everywhere we go, we will have to custom-tailor our model for the specific environment," al Jaber says.

Nevertheless, Paul Dickerson, the chief operating officer for the United States' Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy, believes that Masdar will prove a valuable model. "We will no longer have to guess what the city of the future looks like," he says. "In Abu Dhabi, we will be able to see it with our own eyes."

______________
It's like Baby Lee put it "a little short term pain now". Iceland did the same thing. They used to have to import all of their energy very expensively and now they import 30% of what they used to, having taken advantage of the geothermal energy available. I've never understood why conservatives are so against "conserving" things and planning for the future. It's just pragmatic.

[banyon]

Tell that to the people who drive internal cumbustion engines. All the new tech in the world wont make the fact change that we have and will have a gazillion cars and trucks on the road that use oil to go. Thats precisely why we need to drill here, wherever therre is oil and do the tecno stuff at the same time.

Why do democrats not understand that doing all is the right approach?

Doing "all" , huh?

We could generate energy by stringing up hamsters and getting static electricity when they run on their wheels. Should we do that too? Of course not. The Dem's point on the offshore drilling is that any energy produced will be a pittance and won't be available until 2030 or so, and will likely be sold to the Chinese when it is available. The only people that it helps are the oil companies who are making a last ditch cash grab and running a massive propaganda campaign to do it right now.

[cardken]

LMAO This is hilarious. IMO he is his own worst enemy and I can't believe anyone would support this old man for POTUS.

Have you seen the F@#K up who's in office now? Mc cain couldn't say anything more stupid then what we've already heard from our current POTUS:shake:

[Taco John]

Did he add if we inflate our tires there's no need to drill? That would be the joke of the statement, not the fact that Obama said we should inflate our tires.


It gets so old reading such dishonesty.

[Flustrated]

http://thepage.time.com/


OOOPS — He Did It Again (http://thepage.time.com/2008/08/05/ooops-he-did-it-again/)

McCain displays his normal “discipline” at a Tuesday tele-town meeting, undermining days of (questionable, desperate, and — apparently — effective) attacks by his campaign and the whole Republican Party on Obama’s call for tire inflation to save fuel.

McCain: “And could I mention that Senator Obama a couple of days ago said that we ought to all inflate our tires, and I don’t disagree with that. The American Automobile Association strongly recommends it.”


So McCain used to advocate driving around with flat tires? I'm having a hard time finding his previous position on tire inflation.

[cfl]

So McCain used to advocate driving around with flat tires? I'm having a hard time finding his previous position on tire inflation.

Your kidding, right?

[jettio]

Jesus effing Christ. NO ONE is saying that inflating your tires is a BAD IDEA.
It was Obama's stance that it was this revolutionary idea that would obviate our need to take steps in offshore drilling.

Thanks for interpreting dumbazz GOP lingo for us by taking it a step further and making up sh*t.

I suppose after years of rebelling against liberalism for being too quick to find bigotry, you are doing everything you can to find non-bigotted reasons to root against the far and away obviously better candidate.

Fact is, Obama's only chance at losing with the recent GOP track record and its retread nominee who finished at the bottom of his class at Annapolis is bigotry.

Keep making an azz of yourself all summer long.

[alpha_omega]

The whole "inflated tire" thing sounds like simple common sense to me...

[jettio]

We need oil.
there is oil offshore.
We can debate if the risks and side effects OUTWEIGH that need, but the need exists in the mix.

And Obama's stance is that, if we all pumped up our tires, we'd no longer need the oil deposited offshore.

Phony rides agan. Keep lying and lying and lying. Make sure to stop by all of the GOP events as your party becomes whiter and whiter.

[jettio]

This is really not true. Katie Couric did an interview with Obama while he was on his trip. After the interview she did a rebuttal interview with McCain. During that interview McCain made a pretty big gaffe when he condescendingly said Obama didn't know his history, and then McCain claimed that the Anbar Awakening began after the Surge.

Instead of showing this incorrect claim by McCain, CBS News edited the interview by splicing McCain's answer to a different question. The media is first and foremost interested in turning the largest profit possible. This means keeping the race close, and that means hamstringing Obama so McCain can keep up. It is in the interest of all for-profit media outlets to keep this race close to keep peoples' attention.

That is exactly right.

Media is propping McCain's pathetic candidacy and running his ads for him for free for one reason, maximizing the money that can be made form the campaign over the course of the year.

[Radar Chief]

I don't want this to devolve into another of our "2-stroke/four stroke debates", but in brief:

The point of the “2-stroke/four stroke debate” was that you were touting the efficiency virtues of a country that still uses an IC engine that pollutes so badly its been banned from US streets since ’85.


Hybrid/Plug in technology for autos
Wind/Hydro/Solar Energy generation for power plants
Mass transit/Rail transport useage
Alternate Biomass/Geothermal
Nuclear (Obama is pro-nuclear but I share his concerns about the storage and safety issues)

Basically we need the infrastructure not the technology to make this work.

I don’t disagree with this, but I’m sure you realize it’s not as simple as will it and it shall be done.

All solutions breed new problems.

Lets take for example the plug in hybrids, since they’re so talked about.
They’re basically the same hybrid but with an extra bank of batteries. You then plug this in at night and in the morning there’s enough charge that when driving the vehicle doesn’t have to go to the gas motor as soon. So you’re shifting your energy needs from one form to the next, stressing the electric grid.
Never mind that hybrids are already packed with batteries with nickel and acid in them, plug in hybrids are going to have double the toxic chemicals. And what happens when that all starts hitting land fills?
Not that I’m against hybrids, if they made a reasonably priced hybrid truck I’d buy it.
Just that people need to realize the solutions they’re screaming for can in fact be worse that the problems they want to solve.

Look at what The UAE is doing, they aren't just throwing up their hands and saying we can't do anything about it.
_______________________
Building the Zero-Emissions City
A city being built in Abu Dhabi will serve as a large-scale test for renewable energy.

http://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/20740/
Last week, in the harsh desert climate of Abu Dhabi, construction started on a city that will house 50,000 people and 1,500 businesses but use extremely little energy, and what it does use will come from renewable sources.
Who’s “throwing up their hands and saying we can’t do anything”?
And good for UAE. All of their countries could fit inside the boarders of Kansas and still have room left over. Their energy needs just aren’t the same as ours, not that we can’t do a lot of that ourselves to conserve.

It's like Baby Lee put it "a little short term pain now".

Isn’t it ironic that you have to torture people into your way of thinking? But let Bush want to water board one terrorist and it’s on. ;)

I've never understood why conservatives are so against "conserving" things and planning for the future. It's just pragmatic.

Since we’ve got our demagogue on now, I never understood why libs had such a spazm over SUV’s. Their bitching is pretty much what drove people to that niche market by demanding the EPA regulate engines that actually made some power out of passenger cars. Then they bitched about the result of their bitching. I’m seeing a pattern here. ;)

[Radar Chief]

Thanks for interpreting dumbazz GOP lingo for us by taking it a step further and making up sh*t.

I suppose after years of rebelling against liberalism for being too quick to find bigotry, you are doing everything you can to find non-bigotted reasons to root against the far and away obviously better candidate.

Fact is, Obama's only chance at losing with the recent GOP track record and its retread nominee who finished at the bottom of his class at Annapolis is bigotry.

Keep making an azz of yourself all summer long.

And there it is, if you don’t vote for Obama you’re a racist, “bigot”.
What will keep Barry from being elected is people like you, but keep making an ass of yourself all summer long. :thumb:

[SHTSPRAYER]

All the libtards keep saying is "you're lying!"

Silly moonbats.

[jettio]

And there it is, if you don’t vote for Obama you’re a racist, “bigot”.
What will keep Barry from being elected is people like you, but keep making an ass of yourself all summer long. :thumb:

How is Geore W. B*sh working out for you?

I suppose you think he is the all-time greatest President.

Well, the fact is that everybody knows that any democrat would win this election, B*sh and the GOP majority has proven itself to be that incompetent and dishonorable, period.

If Obama does not win, everybody will know that "the reason" that the democrat did not win in a disastrous year for the GOP will be the fact that our country still has too many racists for a black or mixed race candidate to win.

You have spent the last 7 years ignoring reality, that is why you think that Iraq has been an unqualified smashing success when anybody with sense can see that it has been much less than what was promised. And you still think that George W. B*sh is the all-time great, but no matter how much hemming and hawing clowns like you do, you know that your only hope for an Obama loss is racism.

Obama will win and he will win easily and you sorry azz B*sh lovers will get to see what our country can be when someone with brains and morals is running the show.

[Radar Chief]

How is Geore W. B*sh working out for you?

I suppose you think he is the all-time greatest President.

Well, the fact is that everybody knows that any democrat would win this election, B*sh and the GOP majority has proven itself to be that incompetent and dishonorable, period.

If Obama does not win, everybody will know that "the reason" that the democrat did not win in a disastrous year for the GOP will be the fact that our country still has too many racists for a black or mixed race candidate to win.

You have spent the last 7 years ignoring reality, that is why you think that Iraq has been an unqualified smashing success when anybody with sense can see that it has been much less than what was promised. And you still think that George W. B*sh is the all-time great, but no matter how much hemming and hawing clowns like you do, you know that your only hope for an Obama loss is racism.

Obama will win and he will win easily and you sorry azz B*sh lovers will get to see what our country can be when someone with brains and morals is running the show.

What does any of this have to do with you being a racist asshole driving people away from your candidate?

[jettio]

What does any of this have to do with you being a racist asshole driving people away from your candidate?

Who has been driven away?

Our population has a percentage of wingtards like you who vote one-way all of the time and defend the wingtard GOP no matter how incompetent or full of sh*t any of them prove to be.

Right now the wingtard GOP vote is at an all-time low of about 33%.

You sh*theads are not about to vote for anybody else other than who your wingtard leaders tell you to vote for.

Now, you are arguing that somehow McCain is going to cobble together some majority of votes made up of people who are not racist, but who so resent being falsely associated with racism that they would vote for the inferior candidate from the unpopular party to get revenge on people like me who point out the obvious fact that McCain's only hope is for racism to give him enough of an electoral advantage to matter.

If you can find some dumbazz who plans on voting for McCain for no reason other than to show spite against me and I will show you a dumbazz who is smarter than you, but not anybody else.

[Radar Chief]

Who has been driven away?

Fence sitters that could’ve just as easily been persuaded to vote for your candidate.

Our population has a percentage of wingtards like you who vote one-way all of the time and defend the wingtard GOP no matter how incompetent or full of sh*t any of them prove to be.

Right now the wingtard GOP vote is at an all-time low of about 33%.

You sh*theads are not about to vote for anybody else other than who your wingtard leaders tell you to vote for.

Now, you are arguing that somehow McCain is going to cobble together some majority of votes made up of people who are not racist, but who so resent being falsely associated with racism that they would vote for the inferior candidate from the unpopular party to get revenge on people like me who point out the obvious fact that McCain's only hope is for racism to give him enough of an electoral advantage to matter.

If you can find some dumbazz who plans on voting for McCain for no reason other than to show spite against me and I will show you a dumbazz who is smarter than you, but not anybody else.

:LOL: You ****ing idiot, I’m not voting for Gramps either. :loser: