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View Full Version : Music guitar advice needed.


MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 08:12 AM
im gonna get me one. i have nothing better to do, so whats a cheap starter that i wont have to be married to. tapes, books, tuners, ect.
i played piano and violin way back and can read abit of sheet music.

any help is appreciated.

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 08:14 AM
How much is cheap to you?

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 08:15 AM
How much is cheap to you?

300 and under.

BigChiefFan
08-06-2008, 08:16 AM
Musician's Friend is a great place. The one in Kansas City has dings and dents with alot of the guitars, so you can get them at a discount. Even then, I would plan on paying at least a $250.

Stewie
08-06-2008, 08:19 AM
Yamaha makes a good starter guitar. You're getting an acoustic, I assume.

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 08:20 AM
Yamaha makes a good starter guitar. You're getting an acoustic, I assume.
yup acoustic. got a model number?

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 08:20 AM
Musician's Friend is a great place. The one in Kansas City has dings and dents with alot of the guitars, so you can get them at a discount. Even then, I would plan on paying at least a $250.

what about the lower half of the western portion of the state?

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 08:21 AM
I have a 2007 Reverend Warhawk II HB with a Roland cube 15 amp. That set me back about $650. Here is a link to nice site for this topic. They even have a classified forum to buy used stuff.

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/

Stewie
08-06-2008, 08:26 AM
yup acoustic. got a model number?

For less than $300...

FG720S

or

FG730S

KCJohnny
08-06-2008, 08:35 AM
Reading music may be helpful in comprehending theory, but guitar is really about you feeling the dedication inside to learning the craft with considerable physical discomfort (ouch! blisters on your fingers) and perservering out of love for the music.
You can make/discover beautiful/motivating music with a $75 guitar. Its all about heart.

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 08:36 AM
For less than $300...

FG720S

or

FG730S

Those both look pretty nice to me. I would tend to believe that if you just want an acoustic that you could get something decent for like $75-100 used. You just have to make sure it is not all messed up.

Skip Towne
08-06-2008, 08:37 AM
Have you tried the pawn shops?

Reerun_KC
08-06-2008, 08:38 AM
Reading music may be helpful in comprehending theory, but guitar is really about you feeling the dedication inside to learning the craft with considerable physical discomfort (ouch! blisters on your fingers) and perservering out of love for the music.
You can make/discover beautiful/motivating music with a $75 guitar. Its all about heart.
Theres alot of love in the air man!
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/05/21/automobiles/21auto-filmore650.jpg

J Diddy
08-06-2008, 08:43 AM
300 and under.

starter guitar you might even check out a pawn shop

go with acoustic it will help you build finger strength and calluses more quickly
make sure it's got decent action ( I like mine set about 1/8-1/4 on the 12th fret

make sure you play it at the store and it sounds good, neck straight fret all the strings up and down the neck to make sure it doesn't have buzz



you can get a decent used one to start with see how you like it then move up to a nicer new more expensive version

J Diddy
08-06-2008, 08:44 AM
Musician's Friend is a great place. The one in Kansas City has dings and dents with alot of the guitars, so you can get them at a discount. Even then, I would plan on paying at least a $250.

I didn't know there was a physical store in KC

I've just always used there website

MF is da bomb fo sure

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 08:45 AM
I would try to learn to read all music, but tabs are a godsend when just messing around. I remember having to buy the sheet music or learning it by ear bla

BigChiefFan
08-06-2008, 08:45 AM
what about the lower half of the western portion of the state?

musiciansfriend.com

Reerun_KC
08-06-2008, 08:46 AM
We have purchased a couple of six strings from here and have had good luck and support from them.

www.guitarcenter.com (http://www.guitarcenter.com)

Guitar Center Overland Park
6700 W. 119th St
Overland Park, Kansas 66209

Phone: 913-451-0700
Fax: 913-451-0710

Manager: Keith Klikas

Store Hours:
M-F: 10-9 | Sat: 10-7 | Sun: 12-6

Guitar Center Wichita
4448 W. Kellogg Dr
Wichita, Kansas 67209

Phone: 316-946-5858
Fax: 316-946-5868

Manager: Clint Thompson

Store Hours:
M-F: 10-8 | Sat: 10-7 | Sun: 12-5

Reerun_KC
08-06-2008, 08:46 AM
I would try to learn to read all music, but tabs are a godsend when just messing around. I remember having to buy the sheet music or learning it by ear bla
guitar tabs :rockon:

Cant live without them

phisherman
08-06-2008, 08:47 AM
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Ibanez-V70CE-AcousticElectric-Guitar?sku=519468

try this one, good quality and you can plug it in too!

i've had one for a few years now and it still sounds great.

BigChiefFan
08-06-2008, 08:48 AM
I didn't know there was a physical store in KC

I've just always used there website

MF is da bomb fo sure
Ya, Musician's friend is great store and they have a huge warehouse off of Randolph road in the northland-it's about a mile or two EAST of the Ameristar Casino.

seclark
08-06-2008, 08:53 AM
hey mo...check your pm's.
sec

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 08:56 AM
http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Ibanez-V70CE-AcousticElectric-Guitar?sku=519468

try this one, good quality and you can plug it in too!

i've had one for a few years now and it still sounds great.

Good idea IMO. Looks sweet for that price.

CanadianChief
08-06-2008, 09:34 AM
I found it easier trying to learn on an electric guitar than on my acoustic. I was able to play longer and it kept me interested more.

I still suck though so I gotta be doing something wrong.

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 09:44 AM
Have you tried the pawn shops?


ya i look whenever im in one but dont know whats what.

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 09:45 AM
I found it easier trying to learn on an electric guitar than on my acoustic. I was able to play longer and it kept me interested more.

I still suck though so I gotta be doing something wrong.

Honestly everbody sucks unless they just have natural talent. It is still fun though. I don't like tabs either. Most of them online are not close to be correct. "We all just wanna be big rock-stars".

Skip Towne
08-06-2008, 09:46 AM
ya i look whenever im in one but dont know whats what.

Have a friend who knows about them go with you.

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 09:47 AM
Have a friend who knows about them go with you.
up my way?

phisherman
08-06-2008, 10:13 AM
I found it easier trying to learn on an electric guitar than on my acoustic. I was able to play longer and it kept me interested more.

I still suck though so I gotta be doing something wrong.

i respectfully disagree. learning to play an acoustic will build your callouses and make your fingers bulletproof. it will also really improve your finger strength as when you play barre chords you actually have to press down the strings.

Consistent1
08-06-2008, 10:20 AM
The best way is to have both IMO. Then you can switch it up.

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 10:30 AM
As hard is it maybe learn to crawl for a month or two before walking. I wanted to thrash like a pro without much patience. That set me back some

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 10:53 AM
As hard is it maybe learn to crawl for a month or two before walking. I wanted to thrash like a pro without much patience. That set me back some
im not looking to thrash. i just wanna pick and pass time.

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 10:58 AM
yeah I ment thrash as a generic term for doing really well. I think there are like 1000 songs 4 chords or less. especially church, country, or jimmy buffet

seclark
08-06-2008, 11:02 AM
im not looking to thrash. i just wanna pick and pass time.

same here...don't care what others think. just like to sit on the old patio and plunk around.

it's funny. when the grandkids are around i'll get out the guitar and they come crawling up to see what i'm doing. as soon as i start playing, they head the other direction. they even push the doors closed behind them.
sec

phisherman
08-06-2008, 11:14 AM
yeah I ment thrash as a generic term for doing really well. I think there are like 1000 songs 4 chords or less. especially church, country, or jimmy buffet

that's quite the understatement.

if you learn C, F, and G, you can probably play 20,000 different songs. and that spans EVERY genre.

add a couple minor chords, maybe an Em and an Am, and you can double that number.

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 11:15 AM
that's quite the understatement.

if you learn C, F, and G, you can probably play 20,000 different songs. and that spans EVERY genre.

add a couple minor chords, maybe an Em and an Am, and you can double that number.

1000 good songs ;)

DaneMcCloud
08-06-2008, 12:27 PM
im gonna get me one. i have nothing better to do, so whats a cheap starter that i wont have to be married to. tapes, books, tuners, ect.
i played piano and violin way back and can read abit of sheet music.

any help is appreciated.

If you're going to purchase and acoustic guitar for $300 or less, I'd most definitely recommend a Seagull acoustic.

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Seagull-?sku=512366

They're made in Canada (not China) and even at $300, this guitar has a solid top. What that means is the sound of the guitar will continue to improve with age. Most inexpensive guitars have a laminate top, which means the tone will never improve as the wood ages.

$300 isn't very much to spend on an acoustic so buy something that's built correctly and will improve with age. And once you receive the guitar, take it to a qualified guitar tech or luthier in your area to have it properly set up.

Good luck and enjoy!

Wa-Z
08-06-2008, 12:50 PM
I think Alvarez has some nice sounding guitars that are affordable.

Wa-Z
08-06-2008, 12:56 PM
that's quite the understatement.

if you learn C, F, and G, you can probably play 20,000 different songs. and that spans EVERY genre.

add a couple minor chords, maybe an Em and an Am, and you can double that number.


Any I IV V progression really..

FAX
08-06-2008, 12:57 PM
Musician's Friend is a great place. The one in Kansas City has dings and dents with alot of the guitars, so you can get them at a discount. Even then, I would plan on paying at least a $250.

Based on the "dings and dents" comment, I think this is the place where my nephew-in-law purchased a Jackson for $175 that is worth at least $1000. It needed about $100 of work, but it was a stunning deal. Apparently the manager/owner? arbitrarily marks down guitars from time to time just to move them out.

If this is the same place, and I think it is, and if I were near the KC area, this is where I would go, Mr. MOhillbilly. Talk to the guys there about which deal is best and tell them, if they don't give you good advice, you'll come back and kill them.

I agree with the idea of starting with an acoustic. If you've played violin in the past, you'll have no problem getting started. Learn the G, C, Am, and D chords, get yourself a hat and a bag of reefer, and you'll be playing practically any rock and blues song ever written in no time. Good luck, peep.

FAX

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 01:01 PM
ya im gonna be up for the opener and later in Oct. ill get one of my cousins to swing me by there.

Jawshco
08-06-2008, 01:31 PM
I'd recommend a lower end Takamine guitar for acoustic. They sound great and can be had for under $300. But I think you'll probably want to feel the difference of an electric. There are just so many different things you can do with an electric. I'd recommend either a cheap Fender Squire or a low end Ibenez if can get one, and just a small portable amp.

When it comes to learing chords, you should start with the CAGED theory, basically- all major chords follow the same finger, "shapes": C shape, A shape (good to learn both major and minor), G shape (learn the 7th of this chord as well), E shape ( you should know major and minor and 7th in this shape), and the D shape (also know major, minor and 7th shapes). Then to move on the 'other' chords, all you really need to do is to barre one of these shapes and you're pretty much set to move all over the fret board. Barre chords aren't easy, but it's great practice.

Also, if you get bored learing these "big" chords, try just jamming power chords for awhile. They're very simple and prevalent in just about every rock song. It's just root, fifth and sometimes the octave. Simple but effective.

I'm a bassist, so I don't spend too much time playing guitars, but I also recommend those boring scales. They're not too cool to listen to, but they're good know- even if just to have a better understanding how chords work.

Remember to always make your practice time musical and fun!

beach tribe
08-06-2008, 01:48 PM
Get a chord book. Learn them.

Then learn how to read tabs. You'll be playing decent songs in a couple months with practice.

beach tribe
08-06-2008, 01:52 PM
Learn a few chords at a time. Going back and forth between 3-4 of them. Dont move on until you can play those chords. Pick each string when you change chords, and make sure all of the strings are playing without any ringing, or muffling.

FAX
08-06-2008, 02:01 PM
Make up your own damn chords, Mr. MOhillbilly. That's what I do and it's worked out pretty darn good for me so far. I call my last chord invention "Greep The Small Mammal".

FAX

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 02:41 PM
im not really looking for an electric now. but then again this ones pretty sweet.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Waylon-Jennings-Custom-Guitar-Fender-Telecaster-Shooter_W0QQitemZ180271718410QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item180271718410&_trkparms=72%3A1074%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1318

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 02:44 PM
Somehow I imagine you with the dimeback darrel "rebel" dean

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 02:58 PM
Somehow I imagine you with the dimeback darrel "rebel" dean

not really down with flaunting the battle flag nor am i into pantera.
im more into hardcore punk,bluegrass and old country.

Dayze
08-06-2008, 03:05 PM
learn on an acousic; A: Cheaper B: Better for strenght in fingers and dexterity.
Elecrtic you can afford to get sloppy with your play and if you're playing high distortion/gain, these mistakes are hardly noticeable. Accoustic will force you to fret at the corrrect positions and develop fret hand/pick hand coordination. If you don't, you'll hear it immediatley lol.

Check out used guitars; stick to a low budet $ -wise. No need to buy a $400 new 'entry level guitar'; you'll never get your money back should you decide to sell it. if you decide you dig the guitar etc, you can progressively upgrade.

At first, you will have no comparisions of entry-level guitars and their playability/tone; vs. a $4k Taylor/Martin or Huss & Dalton

Good Electric guitars will run you $800+; and you'll need a great amp with good tones & clarity.

$250 should get you a good used guitar; or a entry level 'new' guitar.

Tune often! prior to each playing session. A guitar will not stay in tune in definiately. Keep guitar in the case when not in use to prevent oxidatino of the strings; oxidatino erodes the life of the strings.

Dayze
08-06-2008, 03:09 PM
not really down with flaunting the battle flag nor am i into pantera.
im more into hardcore punk,bluegrass and old country.

I learned on Bluegrass with my Dad (Doc Wason, Tony Rice, etc) some 16 years ago. Bluegrass is a great sound and underrated. If you can become average at basic bluegrass licks and picking techniques, you'll have a leg-up when/if you make the jump to standard 12-bar blues/rock etc.

although I play alot of SRV, Satriani, Zeppelin etc, there are a lot of fundamentals that transfer directly to your standard rock.

:thumb:

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 03:10 PM
not really down with flaunting the battle flag nor am i into pantera.
im more into hardcore punk,bluegrass and old country.

Ok I will take away that mental image then

Dayze
08-06-2008, 03:17 PM
I think someone touched on this earlier, but my best sounding acoustic is a late 70's early 80's Yamaha; I can't recall the model #...RG something. I got it used from my dad for HS graduation; he bought it off of some old guy with case for $250..

Early Yamahas have great tone and punch/volume.

mcan
08-06-2008, 03:35 PM
I've been working in a music store as either a manager or a teacher now for about 10 years.


1st: Musicians Friend and Guitar Center are the devil. They are the WalMarts of music stores, and while you CAN find a decent deal from time to time, a good chunk of the people walking out of those stores are getting guitars that have something seriously wrong with them.

On a cheaper acoustic, you'll find sunken wood, bad bridges, frets that hang over the side and cut your fingers, warped necks, truss rods that have to be tightened completely to get a decent action, etc... Believe me, you'll have much better luck going to a dealer that knows what they're doing and sets up every guitar before he puts it out to sell.

Acoustics also take some maintanance about once a year to KEEP them playing well. Many dealers will do this for you for free if you've bought the guitar from them. It might cost you an extra $15.00 to buy from a local dealer, but in the long run the extra cost is WELL worth it. And don't think that the price difference is going to be that much. Yes, Musicians Friend can be cheaper, but the odds of getting a lemon are about 500% higher, and you're only saving about 3% of the purchase price. Manufacturers have a retail price, and they have a MAP - minimum advertised price (actual sale) price, which most people follow pretty strictly. Bottom line, you're NOT getting a better deal at larger chain stores. The guitars aren't taken care of nearly as well. They won't do long term set up work for you. The manufacturers INTENTIONALLY sell the big chain stores the lowest quality stuff.


As far as WHICH guitar to buy. It doesn't really matter. The more you spend, the better the guitar. But there isn't really a big difference from one brand to another. In fact, a good number of the guitars that each manufacturer is selling are all really made in the same overseas factories. The big difference is in the features of the guitar.


The absolute cheapest guitars you can find sell for about 100 dollars. Often times they are "packaged" with a gig bag, tuner, strap, etc... And sold for $199. They are complete junk, and don't even play very well out of the box, no matter how well you set them up. Don't let anybody tell you otherwise. The only reason to buy something like that is as a "trial" guitar or a "beater" guitar. They are difficult to learn on because they play like garbage, even for an experienced guitar player.

The first big jump up is a lamanant guitar (cheap plywood) with some decent hardware, and made with a little more care. Most of the time the guitar will be Spruce top, with Mohagany back and sides, di-cast tuners (screw on top), and the frets will be smooth all the way up the top and bottom. Every manufacturer has a guitar like this, and the odds of getting a lemon go WAY down. These guitar usually go for about $199 by themselves. If you get them in a package with a case or gig bag, etc... Probably closer to $299.

The next big jump up is a decent SOLID top guitar (not plywood). Be weary of the CHEAPEST solid top guitars as they are often put together very cheaply just to be able to say "yeah, this is a solid top." If you see one for around $200, that should raise eyebrows. A decent solid top guitar will run you about $300 for the guitar alone. There are some models that have some extra features like a pickup, a cutaway body, rosewood back and sides, or a built in tuner (usually attached to the pickups electronics) that can run the price up a bit more than that. Again, you'll occaisionally see those extra features put onto a cheaper guitar, but rest assured, there's a REASON why it's cheaper. Often times it's crappy hardware, or the built in tuner was poorly designed (has to be plugged in to work) or the wood itself wasn't quite dry and now the guitar's measurements are off (causing bad intonation).


Everything over and above the $400 dollar mark is going to be a pretty nice guitar. You'll occaisionally run into a guitar that is over priced, or you don't like the sound of, but in general every manufacturer is doing the same things. There is also a diminished return in quality past this point. You have to pay a LOT more money to get just a little bit better of a guitar. Seasoned musicians are willing to pay $3000 dollers for a handbuilt Beourgious guitar because they are easily 5X a better guitar than your average solid top. But look close and you'll see that they're 10X the price.



Good luck with your journey. Get some lessons. Let us know how it goes. And sorry about the rant.

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 03:41 PM
my dad, my roomate, and I have had good luck with mfriend. I would also add that it doesn't hurt to haggle. If it is a mom and pop store that looks like it is struggling I will ususally just throw out a smaller price and willing to walk away.

Demonpenz
08-06-2008, 03:45 PM
You tube has a bunch of hacks showing you how to play songs too. If it isn't step by step you can get close to the sound

mcan
08-06-2008, 03:50 PM
Alright dude, there's a lot conflicting advice around here. For what it's worth, I'm going to give you a BIG head start.



You don't need a whole Chord book. Most of those chords are worthless to you, and they fill those books full of exotic chords that even a phenomonal guitar player has never played, and doesn't care to. They also cheat. Most chords on the guitar are based on "shapes" that can be moved around the guitar. It's all too common for those chord books to fill 50 pages with about 17 shapes in every single spot. It's overkill.


Learn these basic chords first:
C, D, dmin, E, emin, G, A, amin

That's a whole career on the guitar and 80% of every song you've heard your entire life. Oh, you want more?
------------------------------
Once you have those:
F, B7
------------------------------
After that:
Power Chords
------------------------------
After that:
Barre Chords


Any of these can be EASILY found on the internet. But you WILL devolop bad habits. I recommend finding a decent teacher. Wherever you go to buy your guitar (hopefully I talked you into a local dealer) will probably have teachers there. Learn those first 8 chords, then take a few months of lessons.

MOhillbilly
08-06-2008, 05:33 PM
alright i think im gonna call my uncle and see what he says. he knows TONS of musicians in the branson area and has been a pro since the early 70s. Maybe he can get me a used one at a decent price.

gah my brain hurts now.:)