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View Full Version : General Politics Kid Rock: Entertainers Should 'Keep Their Mouths Shut on Politics'


bkkcoh
08-27-2008, 08:21 AM
Link (http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-todd-huston/2008/08/27/kid-rock-entertainers-should-keep-their-mouths-shut-politics)

Read it and weep, Dixie Chicks. Shove it Bruce Springsteen. Put a sock in it Johnny Cougar Mellencamp. Because, in a refreshing change of pace for the entertainment industry, Kid Rock is telling CMT Insider via People Magazine [1] that entertainers should stay quiet on matters political.

How many times have you seen the uninformed blather of some goof from Hollywood, or some crank from the music industry filling your TV screen or oozing from your radio? How many low brow maestros have had your eyes rolling when they imagine themselves to have some prescient insight into matters of politics? Apparently rock singer Kid Rock is signing onto your piquancy because he has said that singers should just shut up about politics.

"I truly believe that people like myself, who are in a position of entertainers in the limelight, should keep their mouth shut on politics," the rap-rock musician, 37, tells CMT Insider.

"Because at the end of the day," he goes on to say, "I'm good at writing songs and singing. What I'm not educated in is the field of political science. And so for me to be sharing my views and influencing people of who I think they should be voting for ... I think would be very irresponsible on my part."


That is quite an intelligent point of view. After all, a man needs to know his limitations. For instance, I don't talk about physics because I have absolutely no knowledge of the field. Similarly, these Hollyweird types should avoid talking about things they obviously have no idea about.

What is more pathetic than a Meryl Streep "testifying" before Congress concerning something she has no clue whatsoever about, for instance? Remember her self-assuredness about the chemical Alar on apples in the 1980s? turned out that whole thing was a scam. But she was so sure she was right... even though she had no personal knowledge upon which to base her conclusions. Revealing ignorance is not very flattering.

Naturally, these "beautiful people" spend their days being fawned over and they must grow to imagine that they are the height of human achievement, believing that they can do no wrong and that their every pronouncement should be looked upon as words from Mount Olympus.

So, it is certainly refreshing to see an entertainer admit that they have no expertise in politics. Good on Kid Rock for realizing his limitations.

:toast: Kid Rock


Too bad more celebs don't feel this way. :banghead:

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 08:39 AM
He's right.

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 08:42 AM
I'm an... American Bad Ass
Watch me kick
You can roll with rock
Or you can Suck My Dick

Goapics1
08-27-2008, 08:53 AM
What I'm not educated in is the field of political science.

That fits the description of most posters in this forum....................:p

DaKCMan AP
08-27-2008, 09:13 AM
"I truly believe that people like myself, who are in a position of entertainers in the limelight, should keep their mouth shut on politics," the rap-rock musician, 37, tells CMT Insider.

"Because at the end of the day," he goes on to say, "I'm good at writing songs and singing. What I'm not educated in is the field of political science. And so for me to be sharing my views and influencing people of who I think they should be voting for ... I think would be very irresponsible on my part."


First, Kid Rock is not good at writing songs or singing. Second, just because he's uneducated (in most things, not just politics), doesn't mean that all entertainers are uneducated. Third, who the hell is he to say who gets to voice his or her opinion and who doesn't?

I love when people, especially on this board, lash out at celebrities who express their political beliefs. Many on this board talk politics, state their positions and opinions - but for some reason, these people shouldn't? BS.

KILLER_CLOWN
08-27-2008, 09:16 AM
First, Kid Rock is not good at writing songs or singing. Second, just because he's uneducated (in most things, not just politics), doesn't mean that all entertainers are uneducated. Third, who the hell is he to say who gets to voice his or her opinion and who doesn't?

I love when people, especially on this board, lash out at celebrities who express their political beliefs. Many on this board talk politics, state their positions and opinions - but for some reason, these people shouldn't? BS.

Good point, just because Kid Rocks only interests are coin and cleavage doesn't mean the average joe should not educate him/herself on current issues.

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 09:21 AM
First, Kid Rock is not good at writing songs or singing. Second, just because he's uneducated (in most things, not just politics), doesn't mean that all entertainers are uneducated. Third, who the hell is he to say who gets to voice his or her opinion and who doesn't?

I love when people, especially on this board, lash out at celebrities who express their political beliefs. Many on this board talk politics, state their positions and opinions - but for some reason, these people shouldn't? BS.

KD is a very talented muscian, but that's beside the point. I would say the lash is directed towards those that presume that are smarted then Joe American because they are famous. He is also entitles to his opinion that idiots like Rosie O'Donnell need to shut up.

ROYC75
08-27-2008, 09:24 AM
.

That fits the description of ALL posters in this forum....................:p

FYP
:D

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 09:29 AM
I guess I don't have a problem with celebs or musicians speaking their mind; I mean, it is their right. Kelsey Grammar should feel as free to say what he wants as you or me. Green Day wouldn't be nearly as interesting without their political bent.

Wait, is Kid Rock suggesting that he shouldn't be saying what he is saying in the OP?!?

DaKCMan AP
08-27-2008, 09:51 AM
KD is a very talented muscian, but that's beside the point. I would say the lash is directed towards those that presume that are smarted then Joe American because they are famous. He is also entitles to his opinion that idiots like Rosie O'Donnell need to shut up.

Being a talented musician is not the same as being a good song writer or singer.

dirk digler
08-27-2008, 09:58 AM
What happened to free speech? It is not Kid Rock's place to tell anyone what or what not to say.

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 10:02 AM
What happened to free speech? It is not Kid Rock's place to tell anyone what or what not to say.

Hillary is probably thinking the same thing today.

bkkcoh
08-27-2008, 10:12 AM
But yet, people like this should be listened to like their utterances are golden and true:

Link (http://motls.blogspot.com/2008/05/31072-american-scientists-against-agw.html)

here is the list of 100 or so most prominent climatologists who believe man-made catastrophic global warming:

Celebrities
Al Gore, B.A. Government (no science degree)
Alanis Morissette, High School Diploma
Bill Maher, B.A. English (no science degree)
Bono (Paul Hewson), High School Diploma
Daryl Hanna, B.F.A. Theater (no science degree)
Ed Begley Jr., High School Diploma
Jackson Browne, High School Diploma
Jon Bon Jovi (John Bongiovi), High School Diploma
Oprah Winfrey, B.A. Speech and Drama (no science degree)
Prince Charles of Whales, B.A. (no science degree)
Sheryl Crow, B.A. Music Education (no science degree)
Sienna Miller, High School Diploma

ABC - Sam Champion, B.A. Broadcast News (no science degree, not a meteorologist)
CBS - Harry Smith, B.A. Communications and Theater (no science degree)
CBS - Katie Couric, B.A. English (no science degree)
CBS - Scott Pelley, College Dropout
NBC - Ann Curry, B.A. Journalism (no science degree)
NBC - Anne Thompson, B.A. American studies (no science degree)
NBC - Matt Lauer. B.A. Communications (no science degree)
NBC - Meredith Vieira, B.A. English (no science degree)

Al Sharpton, College Dropout
Alicia Keys, College Dropout
Alicia Silverstone, High School Dropout
Art Bell, College Dropout
Ben Affleck, College Dropout
Ben Stiller, College Dropout
Billy Jean King, College Dropout
Brad Pitt, College Dropout
Britney Spears, High School Dropout
Bruce Springsteen, College Dropout
Cameron Diaz, High School Dropout
Cindy Crawford, College Dropout
Diane Keaton, College Dropout
Drew Barrymore, High School Dropout
George Clooney, College Dropout
Gwyneth Paltrow, College Dropout
Jason Biggs, College Dropout
Jennifer Connelly, College Dropout
Jessica Simpson, High School Dropout
John Travolta, High School Dropout
Joshua Jackson, High School Dropout
Julia Louis-Dreyfus, College Dropout
Julia Roberts, College Dropout
Kanye West, College Dropout
Keanu Reeves, High School Dropout
Kevin Bacon, High School Dropout
Kiefer Sutherland, High School Dropout
Leonardo DiCaprio, High School Dropout
Lindsay Lohan, High School Dropout
Ludacris (Christopher Bridges), College Dropout
Madonna (Madonna Ciccone), College Dropout
Matt Damon, College Dropout
Matthew Modine, College Dropout
Michael Moore, College Dropout
Nicole Richie, College Dropout
Neve Campbell, High School Dropout
Olivia Newton-John, High School Dropout
Orlando Bloom, High School Dropout
Paris Hilton, High School Dropout
Pierce Brosnan. High School Dropout
Queen Latifah (Dana Elaine Owens), College Dropout
Richard Branson, High School Dropout
Robert Redford, College Dropout
Rosie O'Donnell, College Dropout
Sarah Silverman, College Dropout
Sean Penn, College Dropout
Ted Turner, College Dropout
Tommy Lee (Thomas Lee Bass), High School Dropout
Uma Thurman, High School Dropout
Willie Nelson, High School Dropout

Politicians:

John McCain, B.S. (Graduated 894th out of 899 in his class)
Newt Gingrich, Ph.D. Modern European History (no science degree) (Hypocrite)
Pat Robertson, B.A., J.D., M.A. Divinity (no science degree)
Robert F. Kennedy Jr, B.A. Government, J.D. Law (no science degree, 'recovered' Heroin addict)

Scientists:

Bill Nye, B.S. Mechanical Engineering (Bill Nye the Science Guy)
Gavin Schmidt, B.A. Ph.D. Applied Mathematics (RealClimate.org)
James Hansen, B.A. Physics and Mathematics, M.S. Astronomy, Ph.D. Physics (NASA, Gavin Schmidt's Boss)
James Lovelock, Ph.D. Medicine, D.Sc. Biophysics
Lonnie Thompson, Ph.D. Geological Sciences
Michael Mann, A.B. Applied Math, Physics, M.S. Physics, Ph.D. Geology & Geophysics (RealClimate.org)
Michael Oppenheimer, S.B. Chemistry, Ph.D. Chemical Physics
Richard C. J. Somerville, Ph.D. Meteorology
Steven Schneider, Ph.D. Mechanical Engineering and Plasma Physics

Social Scientists:
Ronald Bailey, B.A. Philosophy and Economics (Science Correspondent, Reason Magazine)

Taco John
08-27-2008, 10:20 AM
I have no problem with anyone speaking their mind on politics. This is America, not communist China. If a celebrity wants to put their career and credibility on the line to speak out about a political issue, it's their right.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:21 AM
What happened to free speech? It is not Kid Rock's place to tell anyone what or what not to say.

It's not an issue of free speech; it's an issue of being irresponsible by using your celebrity and fame....to exert undue influence over matters, which in many cases, you are not qualified to comment on.

No one disputes that celebrities can express their opinions on a personal level, or in private. However, for them to use their fame (achieved in other arenas) in an attempt to exert influence over the political opinions of average Americans is what is irresponsible IMHO.

Taco John
08-27-2008, 10:22 AM
.

That fits the description of most posters in this forum....................:p


That fits the description of ALL posters in this forum.....
:D

Don't speak for me Royce. I've got an education that includes political science. I know I'm not the only one in this forum who has taken a keen interest in the political science courses they participated in during college.

Sully
08-27-2008, 10:26 AM
I disagree with him.
Just because someone is famous, doesn't preclude them from talking about politics, just as not playing pro football doesn't preclude them from talking about the NFL.

edit: And I wonder if those who think celebrities are "irresponsible" in using their influence to ndoctrinate people, are also against "God" being in the pledge of Allegiance.

splatbass
08-27-2008, 10:29 AM
It's not an issue of free speech; it's an issue of being irresponsible by using your celebrity and fame....to exert undue influence over matters, which in many cases, you are not qualified to comment on.

No one disputes that celebrities can express their opinions on a personal level, or in private. However, for them to use their fame (achieved in other arenas) in an attempt to exert influence over the political opinions of average Americans is what is irresponsible IMHO.

Do you feel the same way when it is Ted Nugent and Toby Keith, or does this just apply to liberal celebrities?

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 10:29 AM
They have a right but after seeing stuff like this I can understand why he would want to say shut the hell up.

“I do believe that it’s the first time in history that fire has ever melted steel. I do believe that it defies physics that World Trade Center tower 7—building 7, which collapsed in on itself—it is impossible for a building to fall the way it fell without explosives being involved. World Trade Center 7. World Trade [Center] 1 and 2 got hit by planes—7, miraculously, the first time in history, steel was melted by fire. It is physically impossible.”

She continued: “To say that we don’t know that it imploded, that it was an implosion and a demolition, is beyond ignorant. Look at the films, get a physics expert here [on the show] from Yale, from Harvard, pick the school—[the collapse] defies reason

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 10:31 AM
Do you feel the same way when it is Ted Nugent and Toby Keith, or does this just apply to liberal celebrities?

Toby is a registered democrat I believe.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:31 AM
I disagree with him.
Just because someone is famous, doesn't preclude them from talking about politics, just as not playing pro football doesn't preclude them from talking about the NFL.

The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.

Personally, it's the same when I listen to pro football commentary; I would much prefer to listen to someone who's played the game (at least at a collegiate level) than someone who hasn't. The MNF experiments with Rush Limbaugh and Dennis Miller demonstrated what I mean.

Barbara Streisand commenting, publicly, about politics....is akin to handing MNF over to Richard Simmons and Oparah Winfrey.

DaKCMan AP
08-27-2008, 10:33 AM
The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.

Personally, it's the same when I listen to pro football commentary; I would much prefer to listen to someone who's played the game (at least at a collegiate level) than someone who hasn't. The MNF experiments with Rush Limbaugh and Dennis Miller demonstrated what I mean.

Barbara Streisand commenting, publicly, about politics....is akin to handing MNF over to Richard Simmons and Oparah Winfrey.

So it's not ok for celebrities to "manipulate" voters but it's ok for groups not officially tied to a campaign to produce and air television commercials and propaganda meant to "manipulate" voters?

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:34 AM
Do you feel the same way when it is Ted Nugent and Toby Keith, or does this just apply to liberal celebrities?

I feel the same way, regardless of ideology.

The exceptions I can think of, are Bono and Sting....because the time and effort they've spent on their causes, has earned them a certain standing and credibility (even if I may disagree with their opinions.) Most celebrities haven't earned that sort of credibility though.

StcChief
08-27-2008, 10:34 AM
I have no problem with anyone speaking their mind on politics. This is America, not communist China. If a celebrity wants to put their career and credibility on the line to speak out about a political issue, it's their right. and they get to roll with the consequences of their action.

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 10:35 AM
The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.

Personally, it's the same when I listen to pro football commentary; I would much prefer to listen to someone who's played the game (at least at a collegiate level) than someone who hasn't. The MNF experiments with Rush Limbaugh and Dennis Miller demonstrated what I mean.

Barbara Streisand commenting, publicly, about politics....is akin to handing MNF over to Richard Simmons and Oparah Winfrey.

I agree, but I really don't think their opinions carry much weight anymore.

Sully
08-27-2008, 10:36 AM
The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.

Personally, it's the same when I listen to pro football commentary; I would much prefer to listen to someone who's played the game (at least at a collegiate level) than someone who hasn't. The MNF experiments with Rush Limbaugh and Dennis Miller demonstrated what I mean.

Barbara Streisand commenting, publicly, about politics....is akin to handing MNF over to Richard Simmons and Oparah Winfrey.

I edited and added to my quote addressing the "irresponsibility.".
But I also disagree about non-football people being commentators. Just like everything, as a general rule former players and coaches are better, but I don't believe that to be true across the board. So while George Will or some former pol may typically be better at political commentary, that doesn't mean an actor can't have just as valid a viewpoint.

oldandslow
08-27-2008, 10:42 AM
John McCain, B.S. (Graduated 894th out of 899 in his class)

Wow. Is this true????

dirk digler
08-27-2008, 10:43 AM
It's not an issue of free speech; it's an issue of being irresponsible by using your celebrity and fame....to exert undue influence over matters, which in many cases, you are not qualified to comment on.

No one disputes that celebrities can express their opinions on a personal level, or in private. However, for them to use their fame (achieved in other arenas) in an attempt to exert influence over the political opinions of average Americans is what is irresponsible IMHO.

I don't think people actually take entertainers opinions and views about politics seriously and I highly doubt that people actually change their vote or vote because the entertainer says to. I am sure there is a few whackos out there that do but for the other 99.7% of the country their opinions don't really carry much weight.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:44 AM
So it's not ok for celebrities to "manipulate" voters but it's ok for groups not officially tied to a campaign to produce and air television commercials and propaganda meant to "manipulate" voters?

Independent groups from both sides have the same opportunity to produce ads. No advantage to either side.

Celebrities (over-whelmingly left-wingers) using their celebrity achieved in other arenas, in an attempt to influence average voters on issues they are, often, not qualified to speak publicly....is a different story.

It's one of the reasons many Americans despise Hollywood.

BigChiefFan
08-27-2008, 10:45 AM
Tell it to Ronald Reagan or how about Arnold Schwarzenegger?

dirk digler
08-27-2008, 10:46 AM
If people took entertainers opinions seriously Al Gore and Kerry would be president and Bush and Rove would be hanged from the gallows.

oldandslow
08-27-2008, 10:47 AM
Independent groups from both sides have the same opportunity to produce ads. No advantage to either side.

Celebrities (over-whelmingly left-wingers) using their celebrity achieved in other arenas, in an attempt to influence average voters on issues they are, often, not qualified to speak publicly....is a different story.

It's one of the reasons many Americans despise Hollywood.

And yet...spent a bazillion dollars watching a rehash of batman.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:47 AM
I don't think people actually take entertainers opinions and views about politics seriously and I highly doubt that people actually change their vote or vote because the entertainer says to. I am sure there is a few whackos out there that do but for the other 99.7% of the country their opinions don't really carry much weight.

I don't disagree with the what you say, except I think it affects more folks than you seem to think....I'd guess 2-3%. Americans are lazy, intellectually, speaking. 1 in 50 is too often for me.

bkkcoh
08-27-2008, 10:47 AM
Do you feel the same way when it is Ted Nugent and Toby Keith, or does this just apply to liberal celebrities?

I would say, consider the source of the comment, even though the one mentioned above would be more likely to have the same thoughts as I, I don't say that because Ted said it, it is gold. If someone is an expert on the topic, I maybe more likely to listen to thier thoughts and maybe their opinions.

The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.


Does alar ring a bell? Link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alar#The_campaign_to_ban_Alar)

Personally, it's the same when I listen to pro football commentary; I would much prefer to listen to someone who's played the game (at least at a collegiate level) than someone who hasn't. The MNF experiments with Rush Limbaugh and Dennis Miller demonstrated what I mean.

Barbara Streisand commenting, publicly, about politics....is akin to handing MNF over to Richard Simmons and Oparah Winfrey.

At least Dennis Miller added a little high-brow humor to the telecast. He is one of those comics, you either like him or you don't there isn't any middle ground on him.

I don't disagree with the what you say, except I think it affects more folks than you seem to think....I'd guess 2-3%. Americans are lazy, intellectually, speaking. 1 in 50 is too often for me.

Very true.

I also think that it should take some effort in order to vote. No physical contest or anything like that, but don't make it easy to do something so important.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:48 AM
And yet...spent a bazillion dollars watching a rehash of batman.

Sure. Entertainment is one thing. People and politics, another.

Sully
08-27-2008, 10:53 AM
To add to my disagreement, I would say this,

I think it's a positive if celebrities talk politics. Hell, more should do it... whether they are liberal or conservative or complete whack jobs. Our voting needs to go up, and if helping that happen is because Miley ****ing Cyrus tells everyone why she votes for Ron Paul, then I'm all for it.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 10:56 AM
To add to my disagreement, I would say this,

I think it's a positive if celebrities talk politics. Hell, more should do it... whether they are liberal or conservative or complete whack jobs. Our voting needs to go up, and if helping that happen is because Miley ****ing Cyrus tells everyone why she votes for Ron Paul, then I'm all for it.

I'm all in favor of increasing informed voting.

Unfortunately, far too many Americans rely on television, the mainstream media, and, yes, celebrities....for the bulk of their "information." I'd prefer folks like that stay out of the voting booth, thank you.

keg in kc
08-27-2008, 11:00 AM
Unfortunately, far too many Americans rely on television, the mainstream media, and, yes, celebrities....for the bulk of their "information." I'd prefer folks like that stay out of the voting booth, thank you.Why, they'd probably vote the same as you.

*rim shot*

Sully
08-27-2008, 11:02 AM
I'm all in favor of increasing informed voting.

Unfortunately, far too many Americans rely on television, the mainstream media, and, yes, celebrities....for the bulk of their "information." I'd prefer folks like that stay out of the voting booth, thank you.

Well then, people talking MORE about politics would be more informative. Especially celebrities with access to a bigger soap box.

ROYC75
08-27-2008, 11:26 AM
Don't speak for me Royce. I've got an education that includes political science. I know I'm not the only one in this forum who has taken a keen interest in the political science courses they participated in during college.

Come on Taco, just because you took classes, been on TV, get involved in politics, etc, it still means that as politicians, Americans know they are full of sh*t most of the time.

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 12:49 PM
It's not an issue of free speech; it's an issue of being irresponsible by using your celebrity and fame....to exert undue influence over matters, which in many cases, you are not qualified to comment on.

No one disputes that celebrities can express their opinions on a personal level, or in private. However, for them to use their fame (achieved in other arenas) in an attempt to exert influence over the political opinions of average Americans is what is irresponsible IMHO.I couldn't disagree more. People have a choice to listen or not to listen, just as the celebs have a choice to speak.

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 12:52 PM
I agree, but I really don't think their opinions carry much weight anymore.Exactly. I really don't care what celebs think, but I have zero problem with them speaking their mind. They are free to express themselves as poorly as they wish.

bkkcoh
08-27-2008, 01:00 PM
Exactly. I really don't care what celebs think, but I have zero problem with them speaking their mind. They are free to express themselves as poorly as they wish.

The problem I have is when they think they are more credible on a topic because of who they are and that only.

I couldn't disagree more. People have a choice to listen or not to listen, just as the celebs have a choice to speak.

But do it will a little more humility.

beer bacon
08-27-2008, 01:03 PM
Kid Rock should stick to taking meth. Stop abusing us with your awful music.

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 01:10 PM
The problem I have is when they think they are more credible on a topic because of who they are and that only.



But do it will a little more humility.Once again, if you don't care what they think, it really doesn't matter. I'm not sure this could be simpler.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 01:25 PM
Once again, if you don't care what they think, it really doesn't matter. I'm not sure this could be simpler.

If average Americans were as intelligent as you and I, I wouldn't care either. But they aren't.

Stupid people (and a lot of them do vote) put too much faith in what their favorite celebrities say though.

Again, I have no problem when celebrities express their opinions in a private way; it's using their public platforms to exert undue influence that I have an issue with.

Taco John
08-27-2008, 01:30 PM
If average Americans were as intelligent as you and I, I wouldn't care either. But they aren't.

Stupid people (and a lot of them do vote) put too much faith in what their favorite celebrities say though.

Again, I have no problem when celebrities express their opinions in a private way; it's using their public platforms to exert undue influence that I have an issue with.

Define "undue influence."

Seems like a penchief concept to me.

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 01:35 PM
If average Americans were as intelligent as you and I, I wouldn't care either. But they aren't.

Stupid people (and a lot of them do vote) put too much faith in what their favorite celebrities say though.

Again, I have no problem when celebrities express their opinions in a private way; it's using their public platforms to exert undue influence that I have an issue with.Given the multitude of variables that likely influence a person's decision, I find it difficult to believe that a celebrity would ever have much pull. However, if we are to assume that it is possible (I would still prefer at least an existence proof), it still seems silly since it, according to numbers thrown out on here, impacts such a miniscule portion of the population. However, if we are to hush the celebs, then it would seem that there are others that we should silence as well.

For example, we certainly wouldn't want preachers discussing anything that could be perceived as a political-type topic. They would seemingly have way too much influence.

Political commentary shows (i.e. O'Reilly) would seem to exert too much influence as well.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 01:35 PM
Define "undue influence."

Seems like a penchief concept to me.

Undue influence = credibility that is not commensurate with one's expertise/level of education on the topic.

Baby Lee
08-27-2008, 01:40 PM
.

That fits the description of most posters in this forum....................:p

B.A. Poli Sci/Psych - 1994, NEMSU/Truman State. :p

And as Dave Barry so aptly put it, all it does now is serve to remind me that I once knew the difference between functional structuralism and structural functionalism

Pitt Gorilla
08-27-2008, 01:42 PM
B.A. Poli Sci/Psych - 1994, NEMSU/Truman State. :pPam is hot.

Mr. Kotter
08-27-2008, 01:44 PM
Given the multitude of variables that likely influence a person's decision, I find it difficult to believe that a celebrity would ever have much pull. However, if we are to assume that it is possible (I would still prefer at least an existence proof), it still seems silly since it, according to numbers thrown out on here, impacts such a miniscule portion of the population. However, if we are to hush the celebs, then it would seem that there are others that we should silence as well.

For example, we certainly wouldn't want preachers discussing anything that could be perceived as a political-type topic. They would seemingly have way too much influence.

Political commentary shows (i.e. O'Reilly) would seem to exert too much influence as well.


When folks go to church or watch a political commentary show, they expect to encounter topics that will have political over-tones.

Most people don't go to celebrities for political opinions and information. If I want their opinion, we'll ask.

I prefer to hear from folks with some amount of background or knowledge. Celebrities don't often have that.....save, once again, someone like Sting or Bono, who have put their money and time where their mouths are.

Baby Lee
08-27-2008, 01:47 PM
Pam is hot.

I KNEW I should've been a drama major. :cuss:

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 01:59 PM
Celebrities getting involved is bad for their business. People are passionate about their political views and tend to despise those with opposing views. Why would an entertainer risk losing their bread and butter?

HC_Chief
08-27-2008, 02:03 PM
Celebrities getting involved is bad for their business. People are passionate about their political views and tend to despise those with opposing views. Why would an entertainer risk losing their bread and butter?

Because they're egomaniacs who don't know when to STFU?

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 02:28 PM
Because they're egomaniacs who don't know when to STFU?

My other question is why are they always liberals? You may find one or two Conservative celebrities who are activists. Ted Nugent, comes to mind. But the vast majority of them are lefties.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 02:31 PM
The problem is NOT them "talking about politics;" it's some celebrities using their fame to manipulate voters.

People will always use their money, power, fame and connections to get what they want.

I'm fine with so-called "celebrities" embarrassing themselves with their mostly stupid political commentary.

What I'm NOT okay with are political lobby groups, which affect Americans far more than what Barbra Streisand thinks about a presidential candidate.

As long as lobbyist are able to influence two branches of our Federal Government, the celebrity influence shouldn't even be on anyone's radar.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 02:33 PM
My other question is why are they always liberals? You may find one or two Conservative celebrities who are activists. Ted Nugent, comes to mind. But the vast majority of them are lefties.

Because once people have millions upon millions of dollars (and in perpetuity though royalties and residuals), most people tend to want to share their wealth through charities and social programs.

I guarantee that 99% of these people wouldn't be as willing to share money out of their wallet if they were earning $46,000 a year.

HonestChieffan
08-27-2008, 02:34 PM
Dont Lobbyists work for voters? I mean the Potato growers have lobbyists. Dont they have a right to a be represented by an agent in Washington?

BigCatDaddy
08-27-2008, 02:35 PM
WTH ever happened to the Dixie Chix anyways? Last I heard they made some come back CD, the hollywood left gave them some award, but I never heard any of their songs on any radio stations.

bkkcoh
08-27-2008, 02:41 PM
My other question is why are they always liberals? You may find one or two Conservative celebrities who are activists. Ted Nugent, comes to mind. But the vast majority of them are lefties.

Part of it could be the fear of being black-listed out of Hollywood.

Tom Selleck and Kelsey Grammar are 2 conservatives that come to mind, but they aren't real vocal in their stances at all. But you also dont see them in a lost of stuff now either.

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 02:41 PM
Because once people have millions upon millions of dollars (and in perpetuity though royalties and residuals), most people tend to want to share their wealth through charities and social programs.

I guarantee that 99% of these people wouldn't be as willing to share money out of their wallet if they were earning $46,000 a year.


Or....or it could be that they are egotistical elitist wind bags who think they are above reproach.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 02:42 PM
Dont Lobbyists work for voters? I mean the Potato growers have lobbyists. Dont they have a right to a be represented by an agent in Washington?

If the oil lobbyists are working for the American people, they should all be fired immediately.

A lobbyist is an activist usually paid by an interest group to promote their positions to legislatures. A lobbyist can also work to change public opinion through advertising campaigns or by influencing 'opinion leaders' or pundits, thereby creating a climate for the change his or her employer desires. The word lobbyist comes from the chambers in which the act of lobbying usually takes place, an anteroom near legislative bodies, for instance, or even the lobby of hotels where important people are staying. In American politics, most lobbyist organizations are headquartered on or near K Street in Washington DC, so "K Street" has become somewhat synonymous for lobbying.

It is very easy for a lobbyist to stray into bribery -- the most direct way to influence legislation, obviously, is to bribe enough law makers to ensure that the bill you support passes. Therefore, lobbying is heavily regulated. Of course, a lobbyist rarely makes the news unless he or she has transgressed the regulations, and as a result, 'lobbyist' has rather negative connotations these days. Measures to control the influence of lobbyists include campaign finance reforms, often promised but rarely passed.

When legislators lose re-election or choose not to run again for office, they often find a second career as a highly paid lobbyist, meeting with their former colleagues and touting the positions they are paid to promote. Of course, these are positions they supported while in office, so such jobs are not completely mercenary, yet they are widely considered an abuse of one's former position. This practice is, however, quite legal. Routinely, political scandals surface that have their roots in some lobbyist activity or other -- usually unlawfully large gifts to lawmakers, or quid pro quos of some type.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 02:45 PM
Or....or it could be that they are egotistical elitist wind bags who think they are above reproach.

Why do you and so many others equate a "Liberal" as being elitist?

Most liberal people that I know are the exact opposite - the caring, kind, grass-roots types of people that are concerned with other people's welfare. Not crazy-ass pro communist nut bags.

I really can't figure out when the word Liberal became such a four-letter word in this country but there certainly is a lot of hate associated with its use.

Friendo
08-27-2008, 03:12 PM
Why do you and so many others equate a "Liberal" as being elitist?

Most liberal people that I know are the exact opposite - the caring, kind, grass-roots types of people that are concerned with other people's welfare. Not crazy-ass pro communist nut bags.

I really can't figure out when the word Liberal became such a four-letter word in this country but there certainly is a lot of hate associated with its use.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/articles/02/11/23_liberal.html

Taco John
08-27-2008, 03:16 PM
Why do you and so many others equate a "Liberal" as being elitist?

Most liberal people that I know are the exact opposite - the caring, kind, grass-roots types of people that are concerned with other people's welfare. Not crazy-ass pro communist nut bags.

I really can't figure out when the word Liberal became such a four-letter word in this country but there certainly is a lot of hate associated with its use.


I actually don't know any "elitist" Democrats. Just a bunch of misguided regular Joes who think that part of the government's job is to protect people from themselves.

'Hamas' Jenkins
08-27-2008, 03:20 PM
I have no problem with anyone speaking their mind on politics. This is America, not communist China. If a celebrity wants to put their career and credibility on the line to speak out about a political issue, it's their right.

Not if they disagree with you. Then obviously, they have no right to speak.

Funny how no libs I've seen on here want to censor Ron Silver or Dennis Miller, eh?

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 03:23 PM
http://www.democraticunderground.com/articles/02/11/23_liberal.html

Wow, thank you very much for that linked article.

That should be a sticky.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 03:25 PM
I actually don't know any "elitist" Democrats. Just a bunch of misguided regular Joes who think that part of the government's job is to protect people from themselves.

That's what I figured. But I'd really like to hear from someone who knows and is in contact with an "Elitist" liberal.

As to your statement, are you referring to government agencies like those listed in the article that Friendo linked (Child Labor laws, Minimum Wage laws, Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, Civil Rights legislation, Worker Safety laws, Antitrust legislation, Clean Water laws, Food & Drug laws) or something else?

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 03:28 PM
Part of it could be the fear of being black-listed out of Hollywood.

Tom Selleck and Kelsey Grammar are 2 conservatives that come to mind, but they aren't real vocal in their stances at all. But you also dont see them in a lost of stuff now either.

Kelsey Grammar's had a new television show on Fox this past year (with co-star Patricia Heaton) that was canceled. He also starred in X-Men 3.

Tom Selleck is in his 60's, though that didn't stop him from joining "Vegas" on NBC during its final season. He's also signed to star in a few made for TV "Jesse Stone" movies each year.

So, there goes that theory...

penchief
08-27-2008, 03:31 PM
Everybody, including entertainers, have the right to free speech. And they should speak their minds openly when they feel compelled to do so as long as they are willing to accept the consequences.

It's unAmerican for anyone to suggest that anybody should keep their mouth shut about politics.

Friendo
08-27-2008, 03:33 PM
Everybody, including entertainers, have the right to free speech. And they should speak their minds openly when they feel compelled to do so as long as they are willing to accept the consequences.

It's unAmerican for anyone to suggest that anybody should keep their mouth shut about politics.

Amen brother!

mikey23545
08-27-2008, 03:53 PM
First, Kid Rock is not good at writing songs or singing. Second, just because he's uneducated (in most things, not just politics), doesn't mean that all entertainers are uneducated. Third, who the hell is he to say who gets to voice his or her opinion and who doesn't?

I love when people, especially on this board, lash out at celebrities who express their political beliefs. Many on this board talk politics, state their positions and opinions - but for some reason, these people shouldn't? BS.

My Lord, if you don't know the difference between a celebrity using the influence of his stage and the media to control young idiots like yourself, and people who post on an internet BB, then maybe <i>you</i> should refrain from posting.

Adept Havelock
08-27-2008, 04:33 PM
What a load of crap.

I refuse to believe that someone should willingly forfeit their right to freedom of speech on political topics, merely because they are a celebrity.

That goes equally for Tim Robbins, his mother Susan Sarandon, and Ted Nugent.

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 04:39 PM
Not if they disagree with you. Then obviously, they have no right to speak.

Funny how no libs I've seen on here want to censor Ron Silver or Dennis Miller, eh?

No body wants to sensor anyone, that's just you making shit up. I am just curious why rich Hollywood type liberals feel the need to voice their opinion, yet Conservative rich Hollywood types keep their yaps shut?

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 04:44 PM
I actually don't know any "elitist" Democrats. Just a bunch of misguided regular Joes who think that part of the government's job is to protect people from themselves.


Shocker, you don't know any Hollywood liberals.

Duck Dog
08-27-2008, 04:46 PM
My Lord, if you don't know the difference between a celebrity using the influence of his stage and the media to control young idiots like yourself, and people who post on an internet BB, then maybe <i>you</i> should refrain from posting.

Yea, no shit. If celebrities didn't have any influence they wouldn't be used in ads for everything.

I'm not against them speaking their minds, I just think it's an extremely stupid idea.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 04:55 PM
No body wants to sensor anyone, that's just you making shit up. I am just curious why rich Hollywood type liberals feel the need to voice their opinion, yet Conservative rich Hollywood types keep their yaps shut?

I gave you an answer but you quickly dismissed it, even though as far as I know, you have no close association with said "Hollywood Liberals".

I also asked you a question in which you haven't answered:

Why do you and so many others equate a "Liberal" as being elitist?

Most liberal people that I know are the exact opposite - the caring, kind, grass-roots types of people that are concerned with other people's welfare. Not crazy-ass pro communist nut bags.

Logical
08-27-2008, 05:17 PM
Then why is Kid Rock shown in a couple of McCain's commercials? Seems like maybe he has a double standard.

Ultra Peanut
08-27-2008, 05:24 PM
Shouldn't Kid Rock be keeping his mouth shut about others keeping their mouths shut, then?

Ultra Peanut
08-27-2008, 05:24 PM
My Lord, if you don't know the difference between a celebrity using the influence of his stage and the media to control young idiots like yourself, and people who post on an internet BB, then maybe <i>you</i> should refrain from posting.See you next week, mikey.

Logical
08-27-2008, 05:26 PM
John McCain, B.S. (Graduated 894th out of 899 in his class)

Wow. Is this true????
Yes

Ultra Peanut
08-27-2008, 05:30 PM
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/srbX26vp57c&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/srbX26vp57c&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Logical
08-27-2008, 05:39 PM
No body wants to sensor anyone, that's just you making shit up. I am just curious why rich Hollywood type liberals feel the need to voice their opinion, yet Conservative rich Hollywood types keep their yaps shut?

You either are sheltered or ignorant (not stupid there is a difference), Dennis Miller, Charlton Heston, Ronald Reagan (ever heard of him), Clint Eastwood, Stephen Baldwin, Clint Black, Mel Gibson, Arnold Schwarznegger (ever heard of him?), Lee Greenwood, Chuck Norris are just a few that speak out and support conservative causes with the media. There are tons more but I think I have made my point.

Ultra Peanut
08-27-2008, 05:43 PM
You either are sheltered or ignorant (not stupid there is a difference), Dennis Miller, Charlton Heston, Ronald Reagan (ever heard of him), Clint Eastwood, Stephen Baldwin, Clint Black, Mel Gibson, Arnold Schwarznegger (ever heard of him?), Lee Greenwood, Chuck Norris are just a few that speak out and support conservative causes with the media. There are tons more but I think I have made my point.http://elections.foxnews.com/files/2008/01/huckabee_norris_texas.jpg

Logical
08-27-2008, 05:59 PM
If average Americans were as intelligent as you and I, I wouldn't care either. But they aren't.

Stupid people (and a lot of them do vote) put too much faith in what their favorite celebrities say though.

Again, I have no problem when celebrities express their opinions in a private way; it's using their public platforms to exert undue influence that I have an issue with.

That sounds pretty elitest if you ask me. Why do you assume the average is less intelligent. (by the way, your statement may be true but it still has the sound of elitism)

Baby Lee
08-27-2008, 06:42 PM
My other question is why are they always liberals? You may find one or two Conservative celebrities who are activists. Ted Nugent, comes to mind. But the vast majority of them are lefties.

Two things I think at play.
First, their source of income is so arbitrary, they're more inclined to think all income is arbitrary, concomitantly making them more inclined to redistribution. [ie, I have more money than God, but I know I'm no more talented or hardworking than Joe Character actor who's doing dinner theatre to live week to week, or waitress Suzy who hasn't had the fortune to meet the right producer yet.]
For all his effort and talent, I can't picture George Clooney viewing the justification for his riches the same as a small business owner or entrepreneur.
Second, they are rooted in creative expression, creating new realities through inspiration and industry, making them inclined to believe that such inspiration and industry can change reality in other spheres.

patteeu
08-27-2008, 08:44 PM
Why do you and so many others equate a "Liberal" as being elitist?

Most liberal people that I know are the exact opposite - the caring, kind, grass-roots types of people that are concerned with other people's welfare. Not crazy-ass pro communist nut bags.

I really can't figure out when the word Liberal became such a four-letter word in this country but there certainly is a lot of hate associated with its use.

Because liberals want to direct our society through government intervention to a greater degree than conservatives.

DaneMcCloud
08-27-2008, 08:52 PM
Because liberals want to direct our society through government intervention to a greater degree than conservatives.

Can't someone vote Democrat for reasons other than that of which you listed? Why is it that every Democrat is automatically branded as a "moonbat" (which is a phrase that I've seen many here throw around constantly and quite frankly, I don't really know what that's supposed to imply).

I don't automatically assume that everyone who votes Republican (much like myself) is a member of the far right, Christian conservative wing.

There seems to be much anger from Republicans aimed at any Democrat in this forum and quite frankly, all over the internet.

Where did all of this hatred coming from? Talk radio? Television?

Cannibal
08-27-2008, 09:33 PM
Link (http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-todd-huston/2008/08/27/kid-rock-entertainers-should-keep-their-mouths-shut-politics)

Read it and weep, Dixie Chicks. Shove it Bruce Springsteen. Put a sock in it Johnny Cougar Mellencamp. Because, in a refreshing change of pace for the entertainment industry, Kid Rock is telling CMT Insider via People Magazine [1] that entertainers should stay quiet on matters political.

How many times have you seen the uninformed blather of some goof from Hollywood, or some crank from the music industry filling your TV screen or oozing from your radio? How many low brow maestros have had your eyes rolling when they imagine themselves to have some prescient insight into matters of politics? Apparently rock singer Kid Rock is signing onto your piquancy because he has said that singers should just shut up about politics.

"I truly believe that people like myself, who are in a position of entertainers in the limelight, should keep their mouth shut on politics," the rap-rock musician, 37, tells CMT Insider.

"Because at the end of the day," he goes on to say, "I'm good at writing songs and singing. What I'm not educated in is the field of political science. And so for me to be sharing my views and influencing people of who I think they should be voting for ... I think would be very irresponsible on my part."


That is quite an intelligent point of view. After all, a man needs to know his limitations. For instance, I don't talk about physics because I have absolutely no knowledge of the field. Similarly, these Hollyweird types should avoid talking about things they obviously have no idea about.

What is more pathetic than a Meryl Streep "testifying" before Congress concerning something she has no clue whatsoever about, for instance? Remember her self-assuredness about the chemical Alar on apples in the 1980s? turned out that whole thing was a scam. But she was so sure she was right... even though she had no personal knowledge upon which to base her conclusions. Revealing ignorance is not very flattering.

Naturally, these "beautiful people" spend their days being fawned over and they must grow to imagine that they are the height of human achievement, believing that they can do no wrong and that their every pronouncement should be looked upon as words from Mount Olympus.

So, it is certainly refreshing to see an entertainer admit that they have no expertise in politics. Good on Kid Rock for realizing his limitations.

:toast: Kid Rock


Too bad more celebs don't feel this way. :banghead:

I guess you feel the same way about John Rich writing and performing John McCain's (very lamely titled), "Raising McCain"? Or the grocery bagger Kurt Warner and his outspoken right leaning political beliefs? Or that C()nt from Everybody Loves Raymond? Or Ron Silver, Dennis Miller, Koby Teeth, or any myriad of horrible country "artists"?

Cannibal
08-27-2008, 09:35 PM
You either are sheltered or ignorant (not stupid there is a difference), Dennis Miller, Charlton Heston, Ronald Reagan (ever heard of him), Clint Eastwood, Stephen Baldwin, Clint Black, Mel Gibson, Arnold Schwarznegger (ever heard of him?), Lee Greenwood, Chuck Norris are just a few that speak out and support conservative causes with the media. There are tons more but I think I have made my point.

Guess you beat me to it.

bkkcoh
08-28-2008, 08:31 AM
I guess you feel the same way about John Rich writing and performing John McCain's (very lamely titled), "Raising McCain"? Or the grocery bagger Kurt Warner and his outspoken right leaning political beliefs? Or that C()nt from Everybody Loves Raymond? Or Ron Silver, Dennis Miller, Koby Teeth, or any myriad of horrible country "artists"?

I don't mind them saying their beliefs, it is when they seem like their opinion on something is a lot better then someone elses and that others should follow them because they are x or y.

John Rish is a possible different story, because he by doing that is actually associated with the campaign, regardless of how small.

What gives some of the people in Hollywood the opinion that they are better and know more then the rest of us.

NewChief
08-28-2008, 08:55 AM
Who cares what Kid Rock thinks?

Ultra Peanut
08-28-2008, 09:04 AM
Bawitaba came out like ten years ago. Since then? Nobody.

NewChief
08-28-2008, 09:08 AM
Bawitaba came out like ten years ago. Since then? Nobody.

Well, he's since created a tribute to Sweet Home Alabama that sounds more like Werewolves of London.

Ultra Peanut
08-28-2008, 09:10 AM
Well, he's since created a tribute to Sweet Home Alabama that sounds more like Werewolves of London.Oh yeah, that. It was the theme song to some WWE PPV, but it really did sound way more like "Awoooooo" belonged in there.

Mr. Kotter
08-28-2008, 11:05 AM
Well, he's since created a tribute to Sweet Home Alabama that sounds more like Werewolves of London.

It's actually a tribute to both.... ;)

Pitt Gorilla
08-28-2008, 11:10 AM
I don't mind them saying their beliefs, it is when they seem like their opinion on something is a lot better then someone elses and that others should follow them because they are x or y.Are you talking about celebs or ChiefsPlanet?

patteeu
08-28-2008, 01:46 PM
Well, he's since created a tribute to Sweet Home Alabama that sounds more like Werewolves of London.

I'm no music critic, but that song seemed pretty clever to me. Even after hearing it, I still have trouble hearing Werewolves of London in Sweet Home Alabama and vice versa.

bkkcoh
08-28-2008, 01:52 PM
I'm no music critic, but that song seemed pretty clever to me. Even after hearing it, I still have trouble hearing Werewolves of London in Sweet Home Alabama and vice versa.

I thought it was quite clever also and became one of my favorite songs of the summer.

Are you talking about celebs or ChiefsPlanet?

Both

It's actually a tribute to both.... ;)

I would agree.

J Diddy
08-28-2008, 01:53 PM
I'm no music critic, but that song seemed pretty clever to me. Even after hearing it, I still have trouble hearing Werewolves of London in Sweet Home Alabama and vice versa.

I like the song, but calling it clever is a stretch.