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View Full Version : Elections Michigan Republicans attempt to suppress votes of foreclosure victims


Ultra Peanut
09-10-2008, 06:44 PM
http://www.michiganmessenger.com/4076/lose-your-house-lose-your-vote

Jesus ****ing Christ. There is no more barrel to scrape.

Lose your house, lose your vote
By Eartha Jane Melzer 9/10/08 6:42 AM

The chairman of the Republican Party in Macomb County Michigan, a key swing county in a key swing state, is planning to use a list of foreclosed homes to block people from voting in the upcoming election as part of the state GOP’s effort to challenge some voters on Election Day.

“We will have a list of foreclosed homes and will make sure people aren’t voting from those addresses,” party chairman James Carabelli told Michigan Messenger in a telephone interview earlier this week. He said the local party wanted to make sure that proper electoral procedures were followed.

State election rules allow parties to assign “election challengers” to polls to monitor the election. In addition to observing the poll workers, these volunteers can challenge the eligibility of any voter provided they “have a good reason to believe” that the person is not eligible to vote. One allowable reason is that the person is not a “true resident of the city or township.”

The Michigan Republicans’ planned use of foreclosure lists is apparently an attempt to challenge ineligible voters as not being “true residents.”

One expert questioned the legality of the tactic.

“You can’t challenge people without a factual basis for doing so,” said J. Gerald Hebert, a former voting rights litigator for the U.S. Justice Department who now runs the Campaign Legal Center, a Washington D.C.-based public-interest law firm. “I don’t think a foreclosure notice is sufficient basis for a challenge, because people often remain in their homes after foreclosure begins and sometimes are able to negotiate and refinance.”

As for the practice of challenging the right to vote of foreclosed property owners, Hebert called it, “mean-spirited.”

GOP ties to state’s largest foreclosure law firm

The Macomb GOP’s plans are another indication of how John McCain’s campaign stands to benefit from the burgeoning number of foreclosures in the state. McCain’s regional headquarters are housed in the office building of foreclosure specialists Trott & Trott. The firm’s founder, David A. Trott, has raised between $100,000 and $250,000 for the Republican nominee.

The Macomb County party’s plans to challenge voters who have defaulted on their house payments is likely to disproportionately affect African-Americans who are overwhelmingly Democratic voters. More than 60 percent of all sub-prime loans — the most likely kind of loan to go into default — were made to African-Americans in Michigan, according to a report issued last year by the state’s Department of Labor and Economic Growth.

Challenges to would-be voters

Statewide, the Republican Party is gearing up for a comprehensive voter challenge campaign, according to Denise Graves, party chair for Republicans in Genessee County, which encompasses Flint. The party is creating a spreadsheet of election challenger volunteers and expects to coordinate a training with the regional McCain campaign, Graves said in an interview with Michigan Messenger.

Whether the Republicans will challenge voters with foreclosed homes elsewhere in the state is not known.

Kelly Harrigan, deputy director of the GOP’s voter programs, confirmed that she is coordinating the group’s “election integrity” program. Harrigan said the effort includes putting in place a legal team, as well as training election challengers. She said the challenges to voters were procedural rather than personal. She referred inquiries about the vote challenge program to communications director Bill Knowles who promised information but did not return calls.

Party chairman Carabelli said that the Republican Party is training election challengers to “make sure that [voters] are who they say who they are.”

When asked for further details on how Republicans are compiling challenge lists, he said, “I would rather not tell you all the things we are doing.”

SBK
09-10-2008, 06:46 PM
If this was used to check houses that are already owned by the bank no big deal. If it's used for homes in default, that have not yet been foreclosed upon, then it's rotten.

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:47 PM
If this was used to check houses that are already owned by the bank no big deal. If it's used for homes in default, that have not yet been foreclosed upon, then it's rotten.

they should still have a vote, if not in that county then somewhere

Donger
09-10-2008, 06:48 PM
"Foreclosure victims"?

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:50 PM
"Foreclosure victims"?

what else would you call them

Donger
09-10-2008, 06:50 PM
what else would you call them

How about sufferers?

SBK
09-10-2008, 06:51 PM
they should still have a vote, if not in that county then somewhere

If their home has been foreclosed upon they don't live there anymore. They have a new address, which should be where they're registered to vote.

People looking to commit voter fraud could use empty houses as the address of someone who isn't actually voting.....

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:52 PM
How about sufferers?

how do you suffer from a foreclosed house?

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:52 PM
If their home has been foreclosed upon they don't live there anymore. They have a new address, which should be where they're registered to vote.

People looking to commit voter fraud could use empty houses as the address of someone who isn't actually voting.....


yes but a person could only register once, no?

Donger
09-10-2008, 06:53 PM
how do you suffer from a foreclosed house?

I would imagine it's a rather unpleasant experience.

SBK
09-10-2008, 06:53 PM
yes but a person could only register once, no?

And who says Obama doesn't attract all the intellectuals here?

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:54 PM
And who says Obama doesn't attract all the intellectuals here?


point is einstein you're registering the people not the house

SBK
09-10-2008, 06:55 PM
point is einstein you're registering the people not the house

And if people have moved they're supposed to change their id, register to vote in proper district etc......

Surely you can see that having a buttload of empty houses is an invitation for easy voter fraud correct?

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:56 PM
I would imagine it's a rather unpleasant experience.


I'm sure it is. Sounds like a cute way to put it.

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 06:57 PM
And if people have moved they're supposed to change their id, register to vote in proper district etc......

Surely you can see that having a buttload of empty houses is an invitation for easy voter fraud correct?


if they can just vote once why does it matter if they vote there or a new district

SBK
09-10-2008, 07:02 PM
if they can just vote once why does it matter if they vote there or a new district

You really don't understand this do you?

This isn't a measure to prevent people from legally voting, it's a measure to prevent people from using empty homes (that are on public record as empty) as a phony address to a fictitious person to make an illegal vote.

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 07:07 PM
You really don't understand this do you?

This isn't a measure to prevent people from legally voting, it's a measure to prevent people from using empty homes (that are on public record as empty) as a phony address to a fictitious person to make an illegal vote.

fictitious people?


sounds hokie to me.

Calcountry
09-10-2008, 07:08 PM
Back in the day, only property owners had the franchise.

J Diddy
09-10-2008, 07:09 PM
Back in the day, only property owners had the franchise.


what day was that?

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-10-2008, 07:16 PM
So it is possible to have negative respect for someone.

bishop_74
09-11-2008, 12:11 PM
You really don't understand this do you?

This isn't a measure to prevent people from legally voting, it's a measure to prevent people from using empty homes (that are on public record as empty) as a phony address to a fictitious person to make an illegal vote.

To be clear... an illegal second vote.

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 12:22 PM
How about sufferers?

Well, I can speak on this first hand--

Its both and then another little bonus.

We are victims to some degree. Lied to, led down the wrong path, preyed upon by greedy mortgage brokers and real estate agents who knew we didnt know better and took advantage of our ignorance.

Siufferers--yes. It sucks. But life isnt over.

Added bonus--We did it to ourselves in the long run. Granted, we were taken advantage of by people who understood the mumbo jumbo of the biz, but we didnt have to take the loan. At least in my case, I didnt have to. Biggest mistake of my life and I will have to pay the consequences. Pure and simple.

Having said that, right or wrong, ignorant or blind, we have a right to vote. Thats just inexcusable if its meant to supress the vote.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 12:45 PM
they should still have a vote, if not in that county then somewhere
then the need to register under thei new address. It's really not the effing hard.

Donger
09-11-2008, 12:46 PM
Well, I can speak on this first hand--

Its both and then another little bonus.

We are victims to some degree. Lied to, led down the wrong path, preyed upon by greedy mortgage brokers and real estate agents who knew we didnt know better and took advantage of our ignorance.

Siufferers--yes. It sucks. But life isnt over.

Added bonus--We did it to ourselves in the long run. Granted, we were taken advantage of by people who understood the mumbo jumbo of the biz, but we didnt have to take the loan. At least in my case, I didnt have to. Biggest mistake of my life and I will have to pay the consequences. Pure and simple.

Having said that, right or wrong, ignorant or blind, we have a right to vote. Thats just inexcusable if its meant to supress the vote.

Thanks for the semi.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 12:47 PM
point is einstein you're registering the people not the house


And part of that registration is a valid address. It's like this in every state.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 12:48 PM
I never would have thought that I would see people defend anything and everything, but I have seen it on this forum.

I think the only universal things we agree on is that you should kill or steal.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 12:50 PM
if they can just vote once why does it matter if they vote there or a new district


Poeple have to vote in their district to stop voter fraud. Since checks are done by hand on registration print outs. Other wise republicans and democrats would shuttle people from voter box to voter box commiting fruad.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 12:51 PM
I never would have thought that I would see people defend anything and everything, but I have seen it on this forum.
.
what do you mean?
Please explain yourself.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:01 PM
what do you mean?
Please explain yourself.

Defending restricting people's right to vote due to foreclosure. That's really democracy at it's finest, right?!

It's just one more in a string of things that just highlights the level of stupid in this country.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:02 PM
Defending restricting people's right to vote due to foreclosure. That's really democracy at it's finest, right?!

It's just one more in a string of things that just highlights the level of stupid in this country.


It's not because of foreclosure. It's because they moved. It's not wrong. It's lawful and it's in place to STOP voter fraud. Do you even want a fair election?


And before you go calling people stupid, remember everytime you point a finger at someone, there are always 3 point back at you.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:03 PM
It's not because of foreclosure. It's because they moved. It's not wrong. It's lawful and it's in place to STOP voter fraud. Do you even want a fair election?

Garcia, it's not just this instance.

I've seen people defend diebold. I've seen people defend voter caging when it is actually more convincing than this. I've seen people defend the hanging chad incident.

Donger
09-11-2008, 01:04 PM
Defending restricting people's right to vote due to foreclosure. That's really democracy at it's finest, right?!

It's just one more in a string of things that just highlights the level of stupid in this country.

I see Hamas is rubbing off on you.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:04 PM
And before you go calling people stupid, remember everytime you point a finger at someone, there are always 3 point back at you.

Ah, yes, because merely the number of people behind something lends credence to it.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:05 PM
This is where people have zero insight to how election were run in say the 1800's. They would truck people all over town to stuff ballot boxes. That's why registratioin is in place. Not some evil attempt to suppress people. You'll see when you actually go vote for the first time.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:05 PM
I see Hamas is rubbing off on you.

Is it democracy to not allow someone to vote who is a citizen but is currently homeless?

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:05 PM
Garcia, it's not just this instance.

I've seen people defend diebold. I've seen people defend voter caging when it is actually more convincing than this. I've seen people defend the hanging chad incident.


We aren't talking about Diebold or anything else. We are talking about this subject. Electronic voting machines are a bad idea from the start and the process was fine the way it was.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:06 PM
This is where people have zero insight to how election were run in say the 1800's. They would truck people all over town to stuff ballot boxes. That's why registratioin is in place. Not some evil attempt to suppress people. You'll see when you actually go vote for the first time.

Wow, nice deflection.

This has nothing to do with registration. They are already registered. They're a citizen. The only difference is that they are moving or lost a home recently.

It doesn't seem very democratic to, umm, restrict their vote based on that.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:07 PM
Is it democracy to not allow someone to vote who is a citizen but is currently homeless?


Just because they were foreclosed on doesn't mean that they are homeless.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:07 PM
We aren't talking about Diebold or anything else. We are talking about this subject. Electronic voting machines are a bad idea from the start and the process was fine the way it was.

Correct. But you asked me why I said what I said. Diebold is an example.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:07 PM
Just because they were foreclosed on doesn't mean that they are homeless.

Splitting hairs much?

Donger
09-11-2008, 01:08 PM
Is it democracy to not allow someone to vote who is a citizen but is currently homeless?

Homeless?

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:08 PM
Wow, nice deflection.

This has nothing to do with registration. They are already registered. They're a citizen. The only difference is that they are moving or lost a home recently.

It doesn't seem very democratic to, umm, restrict their vote based on that.


I'll say this slow...............To be properly registered you must provide a valid address. I was registered in Virginia 2 years ago, does that mean I can vote in Colorado without registering. Of course not.

Radar Chief
09-11-2008, 01:11 PM
Ah, yes, because merely the number of people behind something lends credence to it.

He's talking about your three other fingers. :loser:

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:11 PM
Wow, nice deflection.

This has nothing to do with registration. They are already registered. They're a citizen. The only difference is that they are moving or lost a home recently.

It doesn't seem very democratic to, umm, restrict their vote based on that.


It's why voter registration is in place. It's not un-democratic. All they have to do is re-register under their new address. It's not that effing hard.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:16 PM
I'll say this slow...............To be properly registered you must provide a valid address. I was registered in Virginia 2 years ago, does that mean I can vote in Colorado without registering. Of course not.

It's why voter registration is in place. It's not un-democratic. All they have to do is re-register under their new address. It's not that effing hard.

Perhaps I missed it, but where does it say that they moved to different states?


He's talking about your three other fingers. :loser:
:doh!:

I didn't know people still did that "joke". Oh well, I guess I shouldn't be surprised by it. :rolleyes:

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:19 PM
what else would you call them

You are not a victim if you are the cause of the forclosure. How many people that have been in forclosure took loans that they could barely afford when they got the loan and then the adjustable interest went up?

They are not alone in their situation, but you don't buy something that you can't pay for.

irishjayhawk
09-11-2008, 01:20 PM
Also, Garcia, I wouldn't have as much of problem if it was a bipartisan effort.

The chairman of the Republican Party in Macomb County Michigan, a key swing county in a key swing state, is planning to use a list of foreclosed homes to block people from voting in the upcoming election as part of the state GOP’s effort to challenge some voters on Election Day.

It's not.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:21 PM
point is einstein you're registering the people not the house

You have to have an address to register, so if you move you have to update the registration. If you do not do so you just don't vote. It's your job to stay current, not the fed's, state's or counties job.

Simple to figure out "einstein".

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:23 PM
You have to have an address to register, so if you move you have to update the registration. If you do not do so you just don't vote. It's your job to stay current, not the fed's, state's or counties job.

Simple to figure out "einstein".

Hey dickhead

was speaking to how could it be used for voter fraud

If you aren't intelligent enough to read the posts before commenting on them you should probably just not.

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 01:23 PM
You are not a victim if you are the cause of the forclosure. How many people that have been in forclosure took loans that they could barely afford when they got the loan and then the adjustable interest went up?

They are not alone in their situation, but you don't buy something that you can't pay for.

Yes, you are right, but being int he middle of that mess, I can say this:

They make it out as if you can afford it. That you can get a re-fi before it gets out of control and lied about how much $$ it would cost. Again, the buyer is ultimately responsible and has to pay the price, but its not as black and white as you make it out to be.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:23 PM
Also, Garcia, I wouldn't have as much of problem if it was a bipartisan effort.



It's not.

I'm sure that IJ is all for those that have voted numerous times in elections because they have registered in more than one precinct. It's been done, and it's been mostly democrats that have been caught doing it.

Voter fraud is wrong whichever party you belong to, but as stated, most of the fraud comes from teh democrats side of the house.

HonestChieffan
09-11-2008, 01:26 PM
I beleve they are just doing what all election boards do when they purge the rolls of moved and incrrect registered voters.

so much for the crys of anguish.

Radar Chief
09-11-2008, 01:26 PM
I didn't know people still did that "joke". Oh well, I guess I shouldn't be surprised by it. :rolleyes:

Incredibly ironic that he was talking about you pointing at others and calling them stupid. ROFL

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:27 PM
You are not a victim if you are the cause of the forclosure. How many people that have been in forclosure took loans that they could barely afford when they got the loan and then the adjustable interest went up?

They are not alone in their situation, but you don't buy something that you can't pay for.

they pimped it as an ultra affordable loan that anybody could afford. They were victims.

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:28 PM
I'm sure that IJ is all for those that have voted numerous times in elections because they have registered in more than one precinct. It's been done, and it's been mostly democrats that have been caught doing it.

Voter fraud is wrong whichever party you belong to, but as stated, most of the fraud comes from teh democrats side of the house.
hey show me that study, dickhead

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:29 PM
Yes, you are right, but being int he middle of that mess, I can say this:

They make it out as if you can afford it. That you can get a re-fi before it gets out of control and lied about how much $$ it would cost. Again, the buyer is ultimately responsible and has to pay the price, but its not as black and white as you make it out to be.

If you use common sense it is black and white. I didn't get in over my head but I did cut my family short when I bought our first house. I had to get a second job to be sure we had enough.

The second home we made sure we would not be short before signing the mortgage.

As for being tricked into buying with the possibility of re-fi or about other costs, that 's where the buyer has to wave the :BS: flag if it doesn't sound right. There are some that are so eager to buy that they will sign anything without concern for anything down the road. My opinion is that if you aren't looking out for yourself and your family you shouldn't be negotiating with a realitor.

Donger
09-11-2008, 01:30 PM
they pimped it as an ultra affordable loan that anybody could afford. They were victims.

Victims of their own ignorance, perhaps.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:30 PM
they pimped it as an ultra affordable loan that anybody could afford. They were victims.

Victims of their own stupidity. If you don't have a working knowledge of what it takes to own a home or make payments you shouldn't be looking to buy that home that is outside your pricerange.

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 01:31 PM
they pimped it as an ultra affordable loan that anybody could afford. They were victims.

Yep. they lied thru their teeth with me. Really made it out like it was a steal and I dont know shit about mortgages, prime rates etc...So they really got me.

I do now tho.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:31 PM
hey show me that study, dickhead

Not going to happen. I did a google and found it, search it out for yourself.

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:32 PM
Victims of their own ignorance, perhaps.

yes and no

I had a friend that was offered the same kind of loan, they made it sound to good to be true
His justification for not choosing it and sticking with a fixed rate is so he would know at all times what his rate was and not have it bounce around.

they practically blew a gasket screaming of how he's throwing all that money away

he was not a victim

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:33 PM
Not going to happen. I did a google and found it, search it out for yourself.


what's this a fancy way to say I made shit up, dickhead?

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 01:34 PM
Victims of their own stupidity. If you don't have a working knowledge of what it takes to own a home or make payments you shouldn't be looking to buy that home that is outside your pricerange.

Again, I take repsonisbility for my mistake. However, they made it in our/my percentage. Thats the point. They made it out as if you/I could afford it right now and then re-fi in 3 years. But that wasnt the case at all. I'm paying for it, trust me.

Donger
09-11-2008, 01:35 PM
yes and no

I had a friend that was offered the same kind of loan, they made it sound to good to be true
His justification for not choosing it and sticking with a fixed rate is so he would know at all times what his rate was and not have it bounce around.

they practically blew a gasket screaming of how he's throwing all that money away

he was not a victim

No, he doesn't sound like a victim. Those who hear something that sounds too good to be true AND chose to sign?

They are victims?

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:36 PM
Victims of their own ignorance, perhaps.

Absolutely. People that don't understand how the system works need assistance when attempting to buy a home.

It sounds rude, but some people are just not ever going to succeed unless they make an effort.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:37 PM
what's this a fancy way to say I made shit up, dickhead?

Check it out yourself, or just continue being an idiot. I don't care which.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:42 PM
Again, I take repsonisbility for my mistake. However, they made it in our/my percentage. Thats the point. They made it out as if you/I could afford it right now and then re-fi in 3 years. But that wasnt the case at all. I'm paying for it, trust me.

BUT, you are working to pay for it. How many of the people that get into loans they cannot afford just let it go? There are people that will not pay a mortgage but will go out clubbing every weekend as well as many other things. Some will not pay their mortgage because it's the mortgage or food for the family. Hard choices, but at some point there has to be a responsibility issue solved between realitors, buyers and mortgage bankers.

One of th main reasons for the current situation is the current state of the country. The homes that you bought for $250,000 three years ago have not appreciated in value but have lost their equity value so re-financing is almost out of the question. If you couldn't afford the payments before how are you going to replace the other loan with one that doesn't cover what you still owe the first bank? Bad time to be a homeowner selling a house, but a great time to buy if you are financially solvent.

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 01:54 PM
BUT, you are working to pay for it. How many of the people that get into loans they cannot afford just let it go? There are people that will not pay a mortgage but will go out clubbing every weekend as well as many other things. Some will not pay their mortgage because it's the mortgage or food for the family. Hard choices, but at some point there has to be a responsibility issue solved between realitors, buyers and mortgage bankers.

One of th main reasons for the current situation is the current state of the country. The homes that you bought for $250,000 three years ago have not appreciated in value but have lost their equity value so re-financing is almost out of the question. If you couldn't afford the payments before how are you going to replace the other loan with one that doesn't cover what you still owe the first bank? Bad time to be a homeowner selling a house, but a great time to buy if you are financially solvent.

Agreed for the most part. There are many guilty parties. Homeowners, realtors and mortgage lenders (and their superiors).

In my case, not only did the home deppreciate (sp?) instead appreciate, but the whole neighborhood went to shit becasue of foreclosures. And it went to shit due to the 'quality of neighbors". For instance, my neighborhood was brand new. My home was worth 330k. Within one year, my home devalued to less than 200k becasue of foreclosures around me, my loan went up to 350k, even though I put 20k down (I financed 310k) and I had 4 shootings on my street (2 of them within one week). For a while, thee was a car on a street over form mine tat had the windows shot out. Our HOA did NOTHING about it. But they hassled me over some weeds growing in my backyard.

So not only did I make a mistake on my paperwork and loan (clearly), but now I'm a single woman living in a very bad neighborhood. I'm ****ed financially and I'm not safe--at all! My neighbor had his front door busted down and his whole house robbed during the middle of the day. I decide at that point, I'm moving and I called my lender, wanting to figure out a short sell or something. They had no plans to work with me at all. they wanted nothing to do with helping me figure something out. Even refinancing and working the loan out. NOTHING.

I decided my safety was worth more than that. I left the house. I am paying for it in the sense of credit score, possible banruptcy. Not sure of all the consequences just yet. but I will deal with them, whatever it is.

As I said before, I made the biggest mistake of my life. But I was lied to and taken advantage of. thats definite. but at the end of the day, my mistake, my mess. I will do wahtever it takes to clean it up.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 01:55 PM
Perhaps I missed it, but where does it say that they moved to different states?







Moving to another state or not, if you've moved within your district you have to re-register. Most states do this at the DMV, and when you move in most states you are REQUIRED by law to update your driver lic or ID. And you can re-register right then. It takes all of 2 mintues for the actual registration to vote portion. Waiting in line at the DMV might take a little longer. Moving to another state was jsut example of moving.

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 01:57 PM
Check it out yourself, or just continue being an idiot. I don't care which.

I saw a study that says the exact opposite of what you said. I would offer proof but I guess none is needed here, dickhead.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:59 PM
Agreed for the most part. There are many guilty parties. Homeowners, realtors and mortgage lenders (and their superiors).

In my case, not only did the home deppreciate (sp?) instead appreciate, but the whole neighborhood went to shit becasue of foreclosures. And it went to shit due to the 'quality of neighbors". For instance, my neighborhood was brand new. My home was worth 330k. Within one year, my home devalued to less than 200k becasue of foreclosures around me, my loan went up to 350k, even though I put 20k down (I financed 310k) and I had 4 shootings on my street (2 of them within one week). For a while, thee was a car on a street over form mine tat had the windows shot out. Our HOA did NOTHING about it. But they hassled me over some weeds growing in my backyard.

So not only did I make a mistake on my paperwork and loan (clearly), but now I'm a single woman living in a very bad neighborhood. I'm ****ed financially and I'm not safe--at all! My neighbor had his front door busted down and his whole house robbed during the middle of the day. I decide at that point, I'm moving and I called my lender, wanting to figure out a short sell or something. They had no plans to work with me at all. they wanted nothing to do with helping me figure something out. Even refinancing and working the loan out. NOTHING.

I decided my safety was worth more than that. I left the house. I am paying for it in the sense of credit score, possible banruptcy. Not sure of all the consequences just yet. but I will deal with them, whatever it is.

As I said before, I made the biggest mistake of my life. But I was lied to and taken advantage of. thats definite. but at the end of the day, my mistake, my mess. I will do wahtever it takes to clean it up.

That stand puts you in a whole different category. Many would just walk away and to hell with the credit rating.

Props for trying to do what is right. I would not count out bankruptcy, personal safety is a valuable asset as is integrity.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 01:59 PM
I saw a study that says the exact opposite of what you said. I would offer proof but I guess none is needed here, dickhead.

Sure you did.

I guess that you are one of "those".

Who's the daddies of your kids?

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 02:14 PM
Also, Garcia, I wouldn't have as much of problem if it was a bipartisan effort.



It's not.

I am not talking republican/democrat nonsense today. It's a day to mourn and remember that our brothers and sisters were killed in cold blood.

You have to be properly registered in your own distict to vote. It's been that way for a long time now and it's in place for a reason.

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 02:14 PM
Sure you did.

I guess that you are one of "those".

Who's the daddies of your kids?

well, let me reiterate for the idiot, since they're my kids I guess that would make me the daddy.

See that's how that works, dickhead. Now if there were another daddy and I was the "step parent" then they wouldn't be my kids.

All this time I thought at the bare minimum you were somewhat intelligent just a troll.

Now I know, you're a pretty dumb troll. So whatever your "guess" is on I would take my chances that it was wrong. Dickhead.

Carlota69
09-11-2008, 02:22 PM
That stand puts you in a whole different category. Many would just walk away and to hell with the credit rating.

Props for trying to do what is right. I would not count out bankruptcy, personal safety is a valuable asset as is integrity.

Yeah, I might have a special case, not sure. But I decided some things are just more imporatant than money and credit ratings.

Programmer
09-11-2008, 02:26 PM
well, let me reiterate for the idiot, since they're my kids I guess that would make me the daddy.

See that's how that works, dickhead. Now if there were another daddy and I was the "step parent" then they wouldn't be my kids.

All this time I thought at the bare minimum you were somewhat intelligent just a troll.

Now I know, you're a pretty dumb troll. So whatever your "guess" is on I would take my chances that it was wrong. Dickhead.

You can't prove that they are your kids. But if you were to do the DNA test you could get a line up of who did the deed.

We aren't talking about "step-parents" here you dickless wonder.

Intelligent? All along I knew you were nothing more than someone that had a frontal lobotomy at birth.

You might want to edit your last sentence, seems that you lose your train of thought when you are pissed off.

J Diddy
09-11-2008, 02:38 PM
You can't prove that they are your kids. But if you were to do the DNA test you could get a line up of who did the deed.

We aren't talking about "step-parents" here you dickless wonder.

Intelligent? All along I knew you were nothing more than someone that had a frontal lobotomy at birth.

You might want to edit your last sentence, seems that you lose your train of thought when you are pissed off.


LOL you piss me off?ROFL

You give yourself too much credit.

You're a parrot who does nothing but repeats what someone says and tries to turn it on them.

As far as all this goes, I thought you were a much better troll than this. Turns out you're just the run of the mill, garden variety, hiding under the bridge with candy in case a little boy comes along kind.

You really shouldn't be trying to have sex with little boys.....It is wrong, dickhead.

Garcia Bronco
09-11-2008, 02:40 PM
I recommed reading this article. It doesn't apply to everywhere, but it's still worht reading so people can understand that there are people out there sensative to Homeless voting and that localities can take steps to make sure this process is as unfettered as possible and maintain legal voting.

""A homeless person should be able to vote even if they don't live in a traditional dwelling," Ozdeger said. "You can register even if you are living on the street."

Judicial opinions in recent years have upheld the notion that requiring a traditional dwelling can pose a hardship to some voters. Court decisions from a number of states have stated that street corners, parks and other public places can be used to establish local voting precincts, the National Coalition for the Homeless reports on its Web site.

However, election officials say a valid mailing address is still a necessity. Once a registration has been processed, a confirmation card is sent through the mail. If it is returned as undeliverable, the person might end up not being registered.

Local election officials from Arlington County and the District both said they are well aware of the challenge homeless people face when establishing domicile. Local organizations, including shelters, churches and community groups can provide addresses that will be considered valid by registrars.
"

http://stonesoupstation.blogspot.com...out-fixed.html (http://stonesoupstation.blogspot.com/2008/08/registering-to-vote-without-fixed.html)

Programmer
09-11-2008, 03:08 PM
I recommed reading this article. It doesn't apply to everywhere, but it's still worht reading so people can understand that there are people out there sensative to Homeless voting and that localities can take steps to make sure this process is as unfettered as possible and maintain legal voting.

""A homeless person should be able to vote even if they don't live in a traditional dwelling," Ozdeger said. "You can register even if you are living on the street."

Judicial opinions in recent years have upheld the notion that requiring a traditional dwelling can pose a hardship to some voters. Court decisions from a number of states have stated that street corners, parks and other public places can be used to establish local voting precincts, the National Coalition for the Homeless reports on its Web site.

However, election officials say a valid mailing address is still a necessity. Once a registration has been processed, a confirmation card is sent through the mail. If it is returned as undeliverable, the person might end up not being registered.

Local election officials from Arlington County and the District both said they are well aware of the challenge homeless people face when establishing domicile. Local organizations, including shelters, churches and community groups can provide addresses that will be considered valid by registrars.
"

http://stonesoupstation.blogspot.com...out-fixed.html (http://stonesoupstation.blogspot.com/2008/08/registering-to-vote-without-fixed.html)

In the way-back, they used to have what they called general delivery at the post office. I don't know if that's still something that is viable or not.

Edit: it is.

http://www.usps.com/receive/choicesfordelivery/receivemailinotherplaces.htm

tiptap
09-12-2008, 06:49 AM
Dirty Tricks Starting Already in Ohio

The Cincinnati Enquirer has a story about dirty tricks in Ohio intended to influence the election there. The McCain campaign printed a form on which a voter can request an absentee ballot and sent out about 1 million of them. The form included an unnecessary box asking if the voter was eligible to vote. If the voter didn't notice the box and didn't check it, he or she is in fact admitting that he or she is not eligible and the application has to be rejected by law. Secretary of state Jennifer Brunner is hopping mad about this stunt but she is required by law to reject invalid applications.
Today' Polls

tiptap
09-12-2008, 06:50 AM
Want to guess to what political affiliation these mailings where sent out.

tiptap
09-12-2008, 06:52 AM
Here is a case, where the legal residence is correct but the form is sent so you miss putting it down and that alone disqualifies you.

Bootlegged
09-12-2008, 07:03 AM
Ok - lets get the checklist started..

1.) Voter suppression
2.) Voter intimidation
3.) Voters turned away at polls/given wrong directions
4.) Voters tires slashed
5.) ELECTION MACHINES RIGGED!!!
6.) Ballots not counted
7.) RNC offices setting fires on highways near polling places in Democratic areas
8.) Republican Gov's throwing away all Dem votes
9.) Warden's suppressing inmate rights
10.) RNC planting bombs at 400, 000 man march/Farrakhan rallies

Ultra Peanut
09-12-2008, 07:15 AM
Lattimer, are you okay with what the Michigan GOP is doing in this case?

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:25 AM
Here is a case, where the legal residence is correct but the form is sent so you miss putting it down and that alone disqualifies you.

Ever heard of personal responsibility? I've registered in 6 states in my lifetime. Each time I show the change of address and well before any election I check to ensure that I'm on the voters list. It isn't hard.

tiptap
09-12-2008, 08:30 AM
And having accepted personal responsibility, do you expect a third party to then challenge your voter registration without notification of you being dropped.

Ultra Peanut
09-12-2008, 08:34 AM
Ever heard of personal responsibility?Ever heard of underhanded assholes who mislead people and then provide them no recourse?

I'm shocked that you consider it fine, though. Shocked. Your Christian lawyer probably told you that people who aren't versed in the specifics of voter registration law deserve whatever disenfranchisement they get, right?

J Diddy
09-12-2008, 08:36 AM
Ever heard of underhanded assholes who mislead people and then provide them no recourse?

I'm shocked that you consider it fine, though. Shocked. Your Christian lawyer probably told you that people who aren't versed in the specifics of voter registration law deserve whatever disenfranchisement they get, right?

you're shocked by anything this clown says

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:42 AM
Ever heard of underhanded assholes who mislead people and then provide them no recourse?

I'm shocked that you consider it fine, though. Shocked. Your Christian lawyer probably told you that people who aren't versed in the specifics of voter registration law deserve whatever disenfranchisement they get, right?

It's not rocket science. It's one of those GEICO type things, so easy even you can do it.

You still read more into a single comment than most anyone on this board. I consider it fine? Where did I say that? Where did I present any connection to religion in any respect?

The bottom line is you are responsible for registering and keeping your address current. Worst case you can use General Delivery at the post office.


[quote=Ultra Peanut;5007510]Ever heard of underhanded assholes who mislead people and then provide them no recourse? [quote]

Yes I have, they are called democrats.

They are also the ones calling for same day registration.

They are also the ones crying about some sort of government (drivers license) ID to prove who you are when you vote.

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:45 AM
you're shocked by anything this clown says

If you read what I said you would realize that he didn't address a single point of being responsible for yourself. Something that you don't seem to be able to do in any conversation.

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:48 AM
And having accepted personal responsibility, do you expect a third party to then challenge your voter registration without notification of you being dropped.

I was out of the country for an election one year and failed to get an absentee ballot. I was removed from the roll. It was my responsibility to re-registered when I came back. If you check your registration that should not happen. I don't know how many people do that other than me, but I'm sure it happens.

Who

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:48 AM
And having accepted personal responsibility, do you expect a third party to then challenge your voter registration without notification of you being dropped.

I was out of the country for an election one year and failed to get an absentee ballot. I was removed from the roll. It was my responsibility to re-registered when I came back. If you check your registration that should not happen. I don't know how many people do that other than me, but I'm sure it happens.

Who would be the third party that is going to invalidate my registration?

J Diddy
09-12-2008, 08:49 AM
If you read what I said you would realize that he didn't address a single point of being responsible for yourself. Something that you don't seem to be able to do in any conversation.

Those damn irresponsible homeless people.

Programmer
09-12-2008, 08:53 AM
Those damn irresponsible homeless people.

Homeless people can still register. Why don't they? Because until a democrat need votes they aren't herded into the registration buildings to get registered for a free meal. It seems like those doing the herding aren't familiar with General Delivery at the post office so a registration can be validated.

How many homeless republicans do you see? Not many I guarantee you.

How many homeless democrats do you see? Not many until there is a general election coming up that wants to get all the votes they can.

Bootlegged
09-12-2008, 11:32 AM
The ACORN Obama knows
by Michelle Malkin
Creators Syndicate
Copyright 2008

If you don’t know what ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) is all about, you better bone up. This left-wing group takes in 40 percent of its revenues from American taxpayers — you and me — and has leveraged nearly four decades of government subsidies to fund affiliates that promote the welfare state and undermine capitalism and self-reliance, some of which have been implicated in perpetuating illegal immigration and encouraging voter fraud. A new whistleblower report from the Consumer Rights League documents how Chicago-based ACORN has commingled public tax dollars with political projects.

Who in Washington will fight to ensure that your money isn’t being spent on these radical activities?

Don’t bother asking Barack Obama. He cut his ideological teeth working with ACORN as a “community organizer” and legal representative. Naturally, ACORN’s political action committee has warmly endorsed his presidential candidacy. According to ACORN, Obama trained its Chicago members in leadership seminars; in turn, ACORN volunteers worked on his campaigns. Obama also sat on the boards of the Woods Fund and Joyce Foundation, both of which poured money into ACORN’s coffers. ACORN head Maude Hurd gushes that Obama is the candidate who “best understands and can affect change on the issues ACORN cares about” — like ensuring their massive pipeline to your hard-earned money.

Let’s take a closer look at the ACORN Obama knows.

Last July, ACORN settled the largest case of voter fraud in the history of Washington State. Seven ACORN workers had submitted nearly 2,000 bogus voter registration forms. According to case records, they flipped through phone books for names to use on the forms, including “Leon Spinks,” “Frekkie Magoal” and “Fruto Boy Crispila.” Three ACORN election hoaxers pleaded guilty in October. A King County prosecutor called ACORN’s criminal sabotage “an act of vandalism upon the voter rolls.”

The group’s vandalism on electoral integrity is systemic. ACORN has been implicated in similar voter fraud schemes in Missouri, Ohio and at least 12 other states. The Wall Street Journal noted: “In Ohio in 2004, a worker for one affiliate was given crack cocaine in exchange for fraudulent registrations that included underage voters, dead voters and pillars of the community named Mary Poppins, Dick Tracy and Jive Turkey. During a congressional hearing in Ohio in the aftermath of the 2004 election, officials from several counties in the state explained ACORN’s practice of dumping thousands of registration forms in their lap on the submission deadline, even though the forms had been collected months earlier.”

In March, Philadelphia elections officials accused the nonprofit advocacy group of filing fraudulent voter registrations in advance of the April 22nd Pennsylvania primary. The charges have been forwarded to the city district attorney’s office.

Under the guise of “consumer advocacy,” ACORN has lined its pockets. The Department of Housing and Urban Development funds hundreds, if not thousands, of left-wing “anti-poverty” groups across the country led by ACORN. Last October, HUD announced more than $44 million in new housing counseling grants to over 400 state and local efforts. The White House has increased funding for housing counseling by 150 percent since taking office in 2001, despite the role most of these recipients play as activist satellites of the Democratic Party. The AARP scored nearly $400,000 for training; the National Council of La Raza (”The Race”) scooped up more than $1.3 million; the National Urban League raked in nearly $1 million; and the ACORN Housing Corporation received more than $1.6 million.

As the Consumer Rights League points out in its new expose, the ACORN Housing Corporation has worked to obtain mortgages for illegal aliens in partnership with Citibank. It relies on undocumented income, “under the table” money, which may not be reported to the Internal Revenue Service. Moreover, the group’s “financial justice” operations attack lenders for “exotic” loans, while recommending 10-year interest-only loans (which deny equity to the buyer) and risky reverse mortgages. Whistleblower documents reveal internal discussions among the group that blur the lines between its tax-exempt housing work and its aggressive electioneering activities. The group appears to shake down corporate interests with relentless PR attacks, and then enters “no lobby” agreements with targeted corporations after receiving payment.

Republicans have largely looked the other way as ACORN has expanded its government-funded empire. But finally, a few conservative voices in Congress have called for investigation of the group’s apparent extortion schemes. This week, GOP Reps. Tom Feeney, Jeb Hensarling and Ed Royce called on Democrat Barney Frank, chair of the House Financial Services Committee, to convene a hearing to probe potential illegalities and abuse of taxpayer funds by ACORN’s management and minions alike.

Where does the candidate of Hope and Change — the candidate of Reform and New Politics — stand on the issue? Barack Obama, ACORN’s senator, is for more of the same old, same old subsidizing of far-left politics in the name of fighting for the poor while enriching ideological cronies. It’s the Chicago way.

***SPRAYER
09-13-2008, 07:33 AM
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tiptap
09-13-2008, 09:10 AM
The ACORN Obama knows
by Michelle Malkin
Creators Syndicate
Copyright 2008

If you don’t know what ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) is all about, you better bone up. This left-wing group takes in 40 percent of its revenues from American taxpayers — you and me — and has leveraged nearly four decades of government subsidies to fund affiliates that promote the welfare state and undermine capitalism and self-reliance, some of which have been implicated in perpetuating illegal immigration and encouraging voter fraud. A new whistleblower report from the Consumer Rights League documents how Chicago-based ACORN has commingled public tax dollars with political projects.

Who in Washington will fight to ensure that your money isn’t being spent on these radical activities?

Don’t bother asking Barack Obama. He cut his ideological teeth working with ACORN as a “community organizer” and legal representative. Naturally, ACORN’s political action committee has warmly endorsed his presidential candidacy. According to ACORN, Obama trained its Chicago members in leadership seminars; in turn, ACORN volunteers worked on his campaigns. Obama also sat on the boards of the Woods Fund and Joyce Foundation, both of which poured money into ACORN’s coffers. ACORN head Maude Hurd gushes that Obama is the candidate who “best understands and can affect change on the issues ACORN cares about” — like ensuring their massive pipeline to your hard-earned money.

Let’s take a closer look at the ACORN Obama knows.

Last July, ACORN settled the largest case of voter fraud in the history of Washington State. Seven ACORN workers had submitted nearly 2,000 bogus voter registration forms. According to case records, they flipped through phone books for names to use on the forms, including “Leon Spinks,” “Frekkie Magoal” and “Fruto Boy Crispila.” Three ACORN election hoaxers pleaded guilty in October. A King County prosecutor called ACORN’s criminal sabotage “an act of vandalism upon the voter rolls.”

The group’s vandalism on electoral integrity is systemic. ACORN has been implicated in similar voter fraud schemes in Missouri, Ohio and at least 12 other states. The Wall Street Journal noted: “In Ohio in 2004, a worker for one affiliate was given crack cocaine in exchange for fraudulent registrations that included underage voters, dead voters and pillars of the community named Mary Poppins, Dick Tracy and Jive Turkey. During a congressional hearing in Ohio in the aftermath of the 2004 election, officials from several counties in the state explained ACORN’s practice of dumping thousands of registration forms in their lap on the submission deadline, even though the forms had been collected months earlier.”

In March, Philadelphia elections officials accused the nonprofit advocacy group of filing fraudulent voter registrations in advance of the April 22nd Pennsylvania primary. The charges have been forwarded to the city district attorney’s office.

Under the guise of “consumer advocacy,” ACORN has lined its pockets. The Department of Housing and Urban Development funds hundreds, if not thousands, of left-wing “anti-poverty” groups across the country led by ACORN. Last October, HUD announced more than $44 million in new housing counseling grants to over 400 state and local efforts. The White House has increased funding for housing counseling by 150 percent since taking office in 2001, despite the role most of these recipients play as activist satellites of the Democratic Party. The AARP scored nearly $400,000 for training; the National Council of La Raza (”The Race”) scooped up more than $1.3 million; the National Urban League raked in nearly $1 million; and the ACORN Housing Corporation received more than $1.6 million.

As the Consumer Rights League points out in its new expose, the ACORN Housing Corporation has worked to obtain mortgages for illegal aliens in partnership with Citibank. It relies on undocumented income, “under the table” money, which may not be reported to the Internal Revenue Service. Moreover, the group’s “financial justice” operations attack lenders for “exotic” loans, while recommending 10-year interest-only loans (which deny equity to the buyer) and risky reverse mortgages. Whistleblower documents reveal internal discussions among the group that blur the lines between its tax-exempt housing work and its aggressive electioneering activities. The group appears to shake down corporate interests with relentless PR attacks, and then enters “no lobby” agreements with targeted corporations after receiving payment.

Republicans have largely looked the other way as ACORN has expanded its government-funded empire. But finally, a few conservative voices in Congress have called for investigation of the group’s apparent extortion schemes. This week, GOP Reps. Tom Feeney, Jeb Hensarling and Ed Royce called on Democrat Barney Frank, chair of the House Financial Services Committee, to convene a hearing to probe potential illegalities and abuse of taxpayer funds by ACORN’s management and minions alike.

Where does the candidate of Hope and Change — the candidate of Reform and New Politics — stand on the issue? Barack Obama, ACORN’s senator, is for more of the same old, same old subsidizing of far-left politics in the name of fighting for the poor while enriching ideological cronies. It’s the Chicago way.

The Bush administration has had the Federal District Attorney's offices, clear across the nation, looking for Voter Fraud perpetuated in false registrations. And what is shown for having all those resources and focus is two convictions. And those convictions fell to workers who were hired and poorly unsupervised admittedly, that fabricated names on their own. From that we get all the fabricated accusations of conspiracy. And that is what is really wanted. Not real convictions but the suggestion of impropriaty without conviction without trial even. It is fodder for the election cycle and that is good enough because with all that focus so little real crime occurs. And additionally it may have caused extra work to verify those names, but there was NO EVIDENCE OF THESE PEOPLE ACTUALLY VOTING THESE NAMES. Even if falsely registered, it never rose to a voting fraud.

Shaid
09-13-2008, 10:26 AM
This is why it's nice to live in North Dakota. You just show up to vote, no pre-regstering is required. If you never registered to vote before, you simply do it there.