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Bootlegged
09-17-2008, 06:38 PM
The Real Agenda of Black Liberation Theology
By Jeffrey Schmidt
Now, suddenly, the Reverend Jeremiah Wright is misunderstood. Suddenly, so-called black liberation theology is misunderstood.


Wright's successor at Trinity United Church of Christ, the Reverend Otis Moss III, won't bow to the wishes of "they" to shut up. It begs the question: "Who are they?" The larger white cultural? Or liberals and Democrats who see all this unfavorable publicity hurting the election chances of Barack Obama?


The sad truth is that neither the Reverend Wright nor black liberation theology is being misunderstood. Both, thanks to the candidacy of Barack Obama, are being exposed. God, in fact, works in mysterious ways. And unless it's the aforementioned liberals and Democrats who are trying to hush up Wright, Moss and others of their ilk, sensible Americans want to hear more, for knowledge is power, the power to combat hate.


And make no mistake, what Americans are hearing, they don't like. In the Rasmussen poll, 73% of voters find Wright's comments to be racially divisive. That's a broad cross section of voters, including 58% of black voters.


In an article in the Washington Post, unnamed ministers commented that black liberation theology "encourages a preacher to speak forcefully against the institutions of oppression..."


And what might these institutions be? They are not specified. But it is safe to say that they are not the welfare state or the Democratic Party. Given that black liberation theology is a product of the dreary leftist politics of the twentieth century, the very vehicles employed by the left to advance statism certainly can't be the culprits.


For the left, black liberation theology makes for close to a perfect faith. It is a political creed larded with religion. It serves not to reconcile and unite blacks with the larger cultural, but to keep them separate. Here, again, The Washington Post reports that "He [Wright] translated the Bible into lessons about...the misguided pursuit of ‘middle-classness.'"


Not very Martin Luther King-ish. Further, all the kooky talk about the government infecting blacks with HIV is a fine example of how the left will promote a lie to nurture alienation and grievance. To listen to Wright -- more an apostle of the left than the Christian church -- the model for blacks is alienation, deep resentment, separation and grievance. All of which leads to militancy. Militancy is important. It's the sword dangled over the head of society. Either fork over more tax dollars, government services and patronage or else. And unlike the Reverend Moss and his kindred, I'll specify the "else." Civil unrest. Disruptions in cities. Riot in the streets.


Keeping blacks who fall into the orbit of a Reverend Wright at a near-boil is a card used by leftist agitators to serve their ends: they want bigger and more pervasive government -- and they want badly to run it.


If any further proof is needed that black liberation theology has nothing to do with the vision of Martin Luther King -- with reconciliation, brotherhood and universality -- the words of James H. Cone, on faculty at New York's Union Theological Seminary, may persuade. Cone, not incidentally, originated the movement known as black liberation theology. He said to The Washington Post:


"The Christian faith has been interpreted largely by those who enslaved black people, and by the people who segregated them."


No mention of the Civil War involving the sacrifices of tens of thousands of lives; no abolition or civil rights movements. No Abraham Lincoln. No Harriet Beecher Stowe. No white civil rights workers who risked and, in some instances, lost their lives crusading in the south to end segregation. And since the civil rights movement, society hasn't opened up; blacks have no better access to jobs and housing; no greater opportunities. The federal government, led by a white liberal, Lyndon Johnson, did not pour billions of dollars into welfare programs and education targeted at inner cities in an attempt to right old wrongs. And still does so. A black man, Barak Obama, on the threshold of winning his party's nomination for president, has in no way done so with the help of white voters in communities across the land.


In the closed world of Cone, Wright and Moss, Jefferson Davis and Bull Connor are alive and well. Black victimhood is the doing of white society, not the doing of angry black leaders and leftists, who see advantage and profit in keeping too many people in black communities captive.


Barack Obama knows all this, as a seventeen year congregant at Wright's church, and as a liberal community activist prior to his election to the Illinois Senate. That he feigns innocence, or that he professes forbearance for some of Wright's words because of the goodness of others, is not the line one expects from a post-racial politician. It is what is expected from a man whose career is steeped in racial politics, a politics that does great harm to the very people it purports to serve.

***SPRAYER
09-17-2008, 06:49 PM
Whitey is the devil.

banyon
09-17-2008, 06:59 PM
http://www.americanthinker.com/static/at-store.gif

Is this you in the shirt?

Mr. Laz
09-17-2008, 07:01 PM
maybe if bootlegged keeps going around and bumping all his attention whore threads he will actually get someone to pay attention to him.

ROFL

KCJohnny
09-17-2008, 07:11 PM
Liberation Theology
by
Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger

link (http://www.christendom-awake.org/pages/ratzinger/liberationtheol.htm)
The following is to a "private" document which preceded the Instruction of Fall 1984.
Preliminary Notes

1. Liberation theology is a phenomenon with an extraordinary number of layers. There is a whole spectrum from radically marxist positions, on the one hand, to the efforts which are being made within the framework of a correct and ecclesial theology, on the other hand, a theology which stresses the responsibility which Christians necessarily hear for the poor and oppressed, such as we see in the documents of the Latin American Bishops' Conference (CELAM) from Medellin to Puebla. In what follows, the concept of liberation theology will be understood in a narrower sense: it will refer only to those theologies which, in one way or another, have embraced the marxist fundamental option. Here too there are many individual differences, which cannot be dealt with in a general discussion of this kind. All I can do is attempt to illuminate certain trends which, notwithstanding the different nuances they exhibit, are widespread and exert a certain influence even where liberation theology in this more restricted sense does not exist.

2. An analysis of the phenomenon of liberation theology reveals that it constitutes a fundamental threat to the faith of the Church. At the same time it must be borne in mind that no error could persist unless it contained a grain of truth. Indeed, an error is all the more dangerous, the greater that grain of truth is, for then the temptation it exerts is all the greater.


In a nutshell, liberation theology posits God always on the side of the oppressed, therefore, any and all action that advances the plight of oppressed peoples bears the sanction of heaven. This includes Marxism as a source of inspiration and terrorism as a means of implementation. In the Cardinal's words, it constitutes a fundamental threat to the faith of the Church, and by extension, the health of the republic.

I think its safe to say that Cardinal Ratzinger is an expert, seeing he was the Vatican's doctrinal expert for all of JP II's pontificate and is now Pope.

KCJ

Bootlegged
09-17-2008, 07:14 PM
It makes perfect sense that he would be the Democratic nominee.

banyon
09-17-2008, 07:15 PM
In a nutshell, liberation theology posits God always on the side of the oppressed

Clearly, this is a phenomenon limited to leftist churches.

KCJohnny
09-17-2008, 07:40 PM
Clearly, this is a phenomenon limited to leftist churches.

Did you actually read Cardinal Ratzinger's explanation?

Liberation theology:

1. Deconstructs the Tradition of scriptural orthodoxy.
2. Invites contemporary interpretation grounded in no historical context other than that which is relevant to a modern/local cause.
3. Baptizes marxist class struggle and posits the struggle for political and economic 'justice' as the Biblical warfare between good and evil.
4. Focuses on praxis according to Marx and not the theology of the Jesus of the historical Church.
5. Changes the meanings of such keystone concepts as the Kingdom of God into a marxist revolution whereby instruments of insurgency are seen to be the tools of the Church in bringing about this 'Kingdom of God'.

The Cardinal admits to its ability to attract and deceive those seeking concrete expressions of change in the political and economic conditions of those in the Third World and like conditions.

So if you like change, want change, change you can 'believe in', Senator Obama is your man. Don't be surprised when that change takes on more of a Venezuelan flavor than the intent of our Founding Fathers.

penchief
09-17-2008, 07:48 PM
Did you actually read Cardinal Ratzinger's explanation?

Liberation theology:

1. Deconstructs the Tradition of scriptural orthodoxy.
2. Invites contemporary interpretation grounded in no historical context other than that which is relevant to a modern/local cause.
3. Baptizes marxist class struggle and posits the struggle for political and economic 'justice' as the Biblical warfare between good and evil.
4. Focuses on praxis according to Marx and not the theology of the Jesus of the historical Church.
5. Changes the meanings of such keystone concepts as the Kingdom of God into a marxist revolution whereby instruments of insurgency are seen to be the tools of the Church in bringing about this 'Kingdom of God'.

The Cardinal admits to its ability to attract and deceive those seeking concrete expressions of change in the political and economic conditions of those in the Third World and like conditions.

So if you like change, want change, change you can 'believe in', Senator Obama is your man. Don't be surprised when that change takes on more of a Venezuelan flavor than the intent of our Founding Fathers.

You like citing the intentions of our founding fathers but your dogmatic interpretations make it clear that you don't have a clue what they intended.

By the way, still no comment on those statements by Jefferson and Franklin concerning their beliefs on religion?

banyon
09-17-2008, 07:57 PM
Did you actually read Cardinal Ratzinger's explanation?

Liberation theology:

1. Deconstructs the Tradition of scriptural orthodoxy.
2. Invites contemporary interpretation grounded in no historical context other than that which is relevant to a modern/local cause.
3. Baptizes marxist class struggle and posits the struggle for political and economic 'justice' as the Biblical warfare between good and evil.
4. Focuses on praxis according to Marx and not the theology of the Jesus of the historical Church.
5. Changes the meanings of such keystone concepts as the Kingdom of God into a marxist revolution whereby instruments of insurgency are seen to be the tools of the Church in bringing about this 'Kingdom of God'.

The Cardinal admits to its ability to attract and deceive those seeking concrete expressions of change in the political and economic conditions of those in the Third World and like conditions.

So if you like change, want change, change you can 'believe in', Senator Obama is your man. Don't be surprised when that change takes on more of a Venezuelan flavor than the intent of our Founding Fathers.


Substitute "corporatist" for "Marxist" and you have my point exactly.
Jesus was pretty much all about the bling, right?

***SPRAYER
09-17-2008, 08:23 PM
Clearly, this is a phenomenon limited to leftist churches.


Are the oppressed inferior? If not, why are they always oppressed?

Taco John
09-17-2008, 08:26 PM
Why would anyone waste any time talking about this?

***SPRAYER
09-17-2008, 08:30 PM
Substitute "corporatist" for "Marxist" and you have my point exactly.
Jesus was pretty much all about the bling, right?


Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish...

bango
09-17-2008, 08:30 PM
Are the oppressed inferior? If not, why are they always oppressed?

What does Ann Coulter have to say about it?

banyon
09-17-2008, 08:31 PM
Are the oppressed inferior? If not, why are they always oppressed?

really?

KILLER_CLOWN
09-17-2008, 08:31 PM
The Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment
The U.S. government's 40-year experiment on black men with syphilis

by Borgna Brunner

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The United States government did something that was wrong—deeply, profoundly, morally wrong. It was an outrage to our commitment to integrity and equality for all our citizens... clearly racist."

—President Clinton's apology for the Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment to the eight remaining survivors, May 16, 1997


For forty years between 1932 and 1972, the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) conducted an experiment on 399 black men in the late stages of syphilis. These men, for the most part illiterate sharecroppers from one of the poorest counties in Alabama, were never told what disease they were suffering from or of its seriousness. Informed that they were being treated for “bad blood,” their doctors had no intention of curing them of syphilis at all.

The data for the experiment was to be collected from autopsies of the men, and they were thus deliberately left to degenerate under the ravages of tertiary syphilis—which can include tumors, heart disease, paralysis, blindness, insanity, and death. “As I see it,” one of the doctors involved explained, “we have no further interest in these patients until they die.”


Using Human Beings as Laboratory Animals


Taliaferro Clark, Head of the U.S. Public Health Service at the outset of the experiment.
The true nature of the experiment had to be kept from the subjects to ensure their cooperation. The sharecroppers' grossly disadvantaged lot in life made them easy to manipulate. Pleased at the prospect of free medical care—almost none of them had ever seen a doctor before—these unsophisticated and trusting men became the pawns in what James Jones, author of the excellent history on the subject, Bad Blood, identified as “the longest nontherapeutic experiment on human beings in medical history.”

The study was meant to discover how syphilis affected blacks as opposed to whites—the theory being that whites experienced more neurological complications from syphilis, whereas blacks were more susceptible to cardiovascular damage. How this knowledge would have changed clinical treatment of syphilis is uncertain.

Although the PHS touted the study as one of great scientific merit, from the outset its actual benefits were hazy. It took almost forty years before someone involved in the study took a hard and honest look at the end results, reporting that “nothing learned will prevent, find, or cure a single case of infectious syphilis or bring us closer to our basic mission of controlling venereal disease in the United States.”

When the experiment was brought to the attention of the media in 1972, news anchor Harry Reasoner described it as an experiment that “used human beings as laboratory animals in a long and inefficient study of how long it takes syphilis to kill someone.”


A Heavy Price in the Name of Bad Science

To ensure that the men would show up for a painful and potentially dangerous spinal tap, the PHS doctors misled them with a letter full of promotional hype: “Last Chance for Special Free Treatment.”
The fact that autopsies would eventually be required was also concealed.

By the end of the experiment, 28 of the men had died directly of syphilis, 100 were dead of related complications, 40 of their wives had been infected, and 19 of their children had been born with congenital syphilis. How had these men been induced to endure a fatal disease in the name of science?

To persuade the community to support the experiment, one of the original doctors admitted it “was necessary to carry on this study under the guise of a demonstration and provide treatment.” At first, the men were prescribed the syphilis remedies of the day—bismuth, neoarsphenamine, and mercury— but in such small amounts that only 3 percent showed any improvement.

These token doses of medicine were good public relations and did not interfere with the true aims of the study. Eventually, all syphilis treatment was replaced with “pink medicine”—aspirin.

To ensure that the men would show up for a painful and potentially dangerous spinal tap, the PHS doctors misled them with a letter full of promotional hype: “Last Chance for Special Free Treatment.” The fact that autopsies would eventually be required was also concealed.

As a doctor explained, “If the colored population becomes aware that accepting free hospital care means a post-mortem, every darky will leave Macon County...” Even the Surgeon General of the United States participated in enticing the men to remain in the experiment, sending them certificates of appreciation after 25 years in the study.


Following Doctors' Orders


It takes little imagination to ascribe racist attitudes to the white government officials who ran the experiment, but what can one make of the numerous African Americans who collaborated with them? The experiment's name comes from the Tuskegee Institute, the black university founded by Booker T. Washington. Its affiliated hospital lent the PHS its medical facilities for the study, and other predominantly black institutions as well as local black doctors also participated. A black nurse, Eunice Rivers, was a central figure in the experiment for most of its forty years.


The Veterans' Administration Hospital in Tuskegee, Alabama. Some of the study's post-mortem exams were conducted here.
The promise of recognition by a prestigious government agency may have obscured the troubling aspects of the study for some. A Tuskegee doctor, for example, praised “the educational advantages offered our interns and nurses as well as the added standing it will give the hospital.” Nurse Rivers explained her role as one of passive obedience: “we were taught that we never diagnosed, we never prescribed; we followed the doctor's instructions!”

It is clear that the men in the experiment trusted her and that she sincerely cared about their well-being, but her unquestioning submission to authority eclipsed her moral judgment. Even after the experiment was exposed to public scrutiny, she genuinely felt nothing ethical had been amiss.

One of the most chilling aspects of the experiment was how zealously the PHS kept these men from receiving treatment. When several nationwide campaigns to eradicate venereal disease came to Macon County, the men were prevented from participating. Even when penicillin—the first real cure for syphilis—was discovered in the 1940s, the Tuskegee men were deliberately denied the medication.

During World War II, 250 of the men registered for the draft and were consequently ordered to get treatment for syphilis, only to have the PHS exempt them. Pleased at their success, the PHS representative announced: “So far, we are keeping the known positive patients from getting treatment.” The experiment continued in spite of the Henderson Act (1943), a public health law requiring testing and treatment for venereal disease, and in spite of the World Health Organization's Declaration of Helsinki (1964), which specified that “informed consent” was needed for experiments involving human beings.


Blowing the Whistle

The PHS did not accept the media's comparison of Tuskegee with the experiments performed by Nazi doctors on Jewish victims during World War II. Yet the PHS offered the same defense offered at the Nuremberg trials — they were just carrying out orders.
The story finally broke in the Washington Star on July 25, 1972, in an article by Jean Heller of the Associated Press. Her source was Peter Buxtun, a former PHS venereal disease interviewer and one of the few whistle blowers over the years. The PHS, however, remained unrepentant, claiming the men had been “volunteers” and “were always happy to see the doctors,” and an Alabama state health officer who had been involved claimed “somebody is trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.”

Under the glare of publicity, the government ended their experiment, and for the first time provided the men with effective medical treatment for syphilis. Fred Gray, a lawyer who had previously defended Rosa Parks and Martin Luther King, filed a class action suit that provided a $10 million out-of-court settlement for the men and their families. Gray, however, named only whites and white organizations as defendants in the suit, portraying Tuskegee as a black and white case when it was in fact more complex than that—black doctors and institutions had been involved from beginning to end.

The PHS did not accept the media's comparison of Tuskegee with the appalling experiments performed by Nazi doctors on their Jewish victims during World War II. Yet in addition to the medical and racist parallels, the PHS offered the same morally bankrupt defense offered at the Nuremberg trials: they claimed they were just carrying out orders, mere cogs in the wheel of the PHS bureaucracy, exempt from personal responsibility.

The study's other justification—for the greater good of science—is equally spurious. Scientific protocol had been shoddy from the start. Since the men had in fact received some medication for syphilis in the beginning of the study, however inadequate, it thereby corrupted the outcome of a study of “untreated syphilis.”


The Legacy of Tuskegee

Related Links:
Black History Month Features

U.S. Public Health Service

Tuskegee National Historic Site

Tuskegee University (formerly the Tuskegee Institute)

Internet Resources on the Tuskegee Study

Clinton's Apology for the Experiment

In 1990, a survey found that 10 percent of African Americans believed that the U.S. government created AIDS as a plot to exterminate blacks, and another 20 percent could not rule out the possibility that this might be true. As preposterous and paranoid as this may sound, at one time the Tuskegee experiment must have seemed equally farfetched.

Who could imagine the government, all the way up to the Surgeon General of the United States, deliberately allowing a group of its citizens to die from a terrible disease for the sake of an ill-conceived experiment? In light of this and many other shameful episodes in our history, African Americans' widespread mistrust of the government and white society in general should not be a surprise to anyone.

1. All quotations in the article are from Bad Blood: The Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment, James H. Jones, expanded edition (New York: Free Press, 1993).

http://www.infoplease.com/spot/bhmtuskegee1.html

Looks like Rev. Wright was correct.

banyon
09-17-2008, 08:32 PM
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish...

Let Bechtel buy up the lake and trademark the fish genes and then...

KCJohnny
09-17-2008, 08:34 PM
Why would anyone waste any time talking about this?

There is a small minority of us out here who believe God matters. The fact that this mystifies you is indicative of the lack of understanding between theological and political dynamics.

Jeremiah Wright is germane to discussions about Senator Obama who is asking not so much for confidence in his policies, but "change you can believe in" .

Therefore, since he is asking us to believe, it follows that the discerning voter will find out just what it is we are being asked to believe in.

bango
09-17-2008, 08:40 PM
There is a small minority of us out here who believe God matters. The fact that this mystifies you is indicative of the lack of understanding between theological and political dynamics.

Jeremiah Wright is germaine to discussions about Senator Obama who is asking not so much for confidence in his policies, but "change you can believe in" .

Therefore, since he is asking us to believe, it follows that the discerning voter will find out just what it is we are being asked to believe in.

Has anyone figured out exactly who God is going to be voting for yet? My money is on Obama, but I would hate to lose another bet.

banyon
09-17-2008, 08:45 PM
There is a small minority of us out here who believe God matters. The fact that this mystifies you is indicative of the lack of understanding between theological and political dynamics.

Jeremiah Wright is germaine to discussions about Senator Obama who is asking not so much for confidence in his policies, but "change you can believe in" .

Therefore, since he is asking us to believe, it follows that the discerning voter will find out just what it is we are being asked to believe in.

See SHTSPRAYER, here is a member of the oppressed, maybe we should ask him your question?

Also, 'Germaine' is a name, 'germane' means "relevant".

penchief
09-18-2008, 06:40 AM
There is a small minority of us out here who believe God matters. The fact that this mystifies you is indicative of the lack of understanding between theological and political dynamics.

Jeremiah Wright is germane to discussions about Senator Obama who is asking not so much for confidence in his policies, but "change you can believe in" .

Therefore, since he is asking us to believe, it follows that the discerning voter will find out just what it is we are being asked to believe in.

But who said God is a right wing reactionary and that Jesus is fascist? YOU?

And why are you so sure that God's plan is profit-driven? Does he speak directly to you, too.

By the way, are you ever going to respond to those statements by Jefferson and Franklin that refute your claims about their intentions?

patteeu
09-18-2008, 06:51 AM
Is Marxism fashionable in real life these days or is it just here on the internet?

Bootlegged
09-18-2008, 07:12 AM
The Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment
The U.S. government's 40-year experiment on black men with syphilis

by Borgna Brunner

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The United States government did something that was wrong—deeply, profoundly, morally wrong. It was an outrage to our commitment to integrity and equality for all our citizens... clearly racist."

—President Clinton's apology for the Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment to the eight remaining survivors, May 16, 1997


For forty years between 1932 and 1972, the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) conducted an experiment on 399 black men in the late stages of syphilis. These men, for the most part illiterate sharecroppers from one of the poorest counties in Alabama, were never told what disease they were suffering from or of its seriousness. Informed that they were being treated for “bad blood,” their doctors had no intention of curing them of syphilis at all.

The data for the experiment was to be collected from autopsies of the men, and they were thus deliberately left to degenerate under the ravages of tertiary syphilis—which can include tumors, heart disease, paralysis, blindness, insanity, and death. “As I see it,” one of the doctors involved explained, “we have no further interest in these patients until they die.”


Using Human Beings as Laboratory Animals


Taliaferro Clark, Head of the U.S. Public Health Service at the outset of the experiment.
The true nature of the experiment had to be kept from the subjects to ensure their cooperation. The sharecroppers' grossly disadvantaged lot in life made them easy to manipulate. Pleased at the prospect of free medical care—almost none of them had ever seen a doctor before—these unsophisticated and trusting men became the pawns in what James Jones, author of the excellent history on the subject, Bad Blood, identified as “the longest nontherapeutic experiment on human beings in medical history.”

The study was meant to discover how syphilis affected blacks as opposed to whites—the theory being that whites experienced more neurological complications from syphilis, whereas blacks were more susceptible to cardiovascular damage. How this knowledge would have changed clinical treatment of syphilis is uncertain.

Although the PHS touted the study as one of great scientific merit, from the outset its actual benefits were hazy. It took almost forty years before someone involved in the study took a hard and honest look at the end results, reporting that “nothing learned will prevent, find, or cure a single case of infectious syphilis or bring us closer to our basic mission of controlling venereal disease in the United States.”

When the experiment was brought to the attention of the media in 1972, news anchor Harry Reasoner described it as an experiment that “used human beings as laboratory animals in a long and inefficient study of how long it takes syphilis to kill someone.”


A Heavy Price in the Name of Bad Science

To ensure that the men would show up for a painful and potentially dangerous spinal tap, the PHS doctors misled them with a letter full of promotional hype: “Last Chance for Special Free Treatment.”
The fact that autopsies would eventually be required was also concealed.

By the end of the experiment, 28 of the men had died directly of syphilis, 100 were dead of related complications, 40 of their wives had been infected, and 19 of their children had been born with congenital syphilis. How had these men been induced to endure a fatal disease in the name of science?

To persuade the community to support the experiment, one of the original doctors admitted it “was necessary to carry on this study under the guise of a demonstration and provide treatment.” At first, the men were prescribed the syphilis remedies of the day—bismuth, neoarsphenamine, and mercury— but in such small amounts that only 3 percent showed any improvement.

These token doses of medicine were good public relations and did not interfere with the true aims of the study. Eventually, all syphilis treatment was replaced with “pink medicine”—aspirin.

To ensure that the men would show up for a painful and potentially dangerous spinal tap, the PHS doctors misled them with a letter full of promotional hype: “Last Chance for Special Free Treatment.” The fact that autopsies would eventually be required was also concealed.

As a doctor explained, “If the colored population becomes aware that accepting free hospital care means a post-mortem, every darky will leave Macon County...” Even the Surgeon General of the United States participated in enticing the men to remain in the experiment, sending them certificates of appreciation after 25 years in the study.


Following Doctors' Orders


It takes little imagination to ascribe racist attitudes to the white government officials who ran the experiment, but what can one make of the numerous African Americans who collaborated with them? The experiment's name comes from the Tuskegee Institute, the black university founded by Booker T. Washington. Its affiliated hospital lent the PHS its medical facilities for the study, and other predominantly black institutions as well as local black doctors also participated. A black nurse, Eunice Rivers, was a central figure in the experiment for most of its forty years.


The Veterans' Administration Hospital in Tuskegee, Alabama. Some of the study's post-mortem exams were conducted here.
The promise of recognition by a prestigious government agency may have obscured the troubling aspects of the study for some. A Tuskegee doctor, for example, praised “the educational advantages offered our interns and nurses as well as the added standing it will give the hospital.” Nurse Rivers explained her role as one of passive obedience: “we were taught that we never diagnosed, we never prescribed; we followed the doctor's instructions!”

It is clear that the men in the experiment trusted her and that she sincerely cared about their well-being, but her unquestioning submission to authority eclipsed her moral judgment. Even after the experiment was exposed to public scrutiny, she genuinely felt nothing ethical had been amiss.

One of the most chilling aspects of the experiment was how zealously the PHS kept these men from receiving treatment. When several nationwide campaigns to eradicate venereal disease came to Macon County, the men were prevented from participating. Even when penicillin—the first real cure for syphilis—was discovered in the 1940s, the Tuskegee men were deliberately denied the medication.

During World War II, 250 of the men registered for the draft and were consequently ordered to get treatment for syphilis, only to have the PHS exempt them. Pleased at their success, the PHS representative announced: “So far, we are keeping the known positive patients from getting treatment.” The experiment continued in spite of the Henderson Act (1943), a public health law requiring testing and treatment for venereal disease, and in spite of the World Health Organization's Declaration of Helsinki (1964), which specified that “informed consent” was needed for experiments involving human beings.


Blowing the Whistle

The PHS did not accept the media's comparison of Tuskegee with the experiments performed by Nazi doctors on Jewish victims during World War II. Yet the PHS offered the same defense offered at the Nuremberg trials — they were just carrying out orders.
The story finally broke in the Washington Star on July 25, 1972, in an article by Jean Heller of the Associated Press. Her source was Peter Buxtun, a former PHS venereal disease interviewer and one of the few whistle blowers over the years. The PHS, however, remained unrepentant, claiming the men had been “volunteers” and “were always happy to see the doctors,” and an Alabama state health officer who had been involved claimed “somebody is trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.”

Under the glare of publicity, the government ended their experiment, and for the first time provided the men with effective medical treatment for syphilis. Fred Gray, a lawyer who had previously defended Rosa Parks and Martin Luther King, filed a class action suit that provided a $10 million out-of-court settlement for the men and their families. Gray, however, named only whites and white organizations as defendants in the suit, portraying Tuskegee as a black and white case when it was in fact more complex than that—black doctors and institutions had been involved from beginning to end.

The PHS did not accept the media's comparison of Tuskegee with the appalling experiments performed by Nazi doctors on their Jewish victims during World War II. Yet in addition to the medical and racist parallels, the PHS offered the same morally bankrupt defense offered at the Nuremberg trials: they claimed they were just carrying out orders, mere cogs in the wheel of the PHS bureaucracy, exempt from personal responsibility.

The study's other justification—for the greater good of science—is equally spurious. Scientific protocol had been shoddy from the start. Since the men had in fact received some medication for syphilis in the beginning of the study, however inadequate, it thereby corrupted the outcome of a study of “untreated syphilis.”


The Legacy of Tuskegee

Related Links:
Black History Month Features

U.S. Public Health Service

Tuskegee National Historic Site

Tuskegee University (formerly the Tuskegee Institute)

Internet Resources on the Tuskegee Study

Clinton's Apology for the Experiment

In 1990, a survey found that 10 percent of African Americans believed that the U.S. government created AIDS as a plot to exterminate blacks, and another 20 percent could not rule out the possibility that this might be true. As preposterous and paranoid as this may sound, at one time the Tuskegee experiment must have seemed equally farfetched.

Who could imagine the government, all the way up to the Surgeon General of the United States, deliberately allowing a group of its citizens to die from a terrible disease for the sake of an ill-conceived experiment? In light of this and many other shameful episodes in our history, African Americans' widespread mistrust of the government and white society in general should not be a surprise to anyone.

1. All quotations in the article are from Bad Blood: The Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment, James H. Jones, expanded edition (New York: Free Press, 1993).

http://www.infoplease.com/spot/bhmtuskegee1.html

Looks like Rev. Wright was correct.


Hmmm. Ok.

KCJohnny
09-18-2008, 07:37 AM
But who said God is a right wing reactionary and that Jesus is fascist? YOU?

And why are you so sure that God's plan is profit-driven? Does he speak directly to you, too.

By the way, are you ever going to respond to those statements by Jefferson and Franklin that refute your claims about their intentions?

I'm not going to help you hi-jack a prefectly legitimate thread about theology.
KCJ
Bachelor of Theology
Logos Christian College
1995

KCJohnny
09-18-2008, 07:44 AM
Rev. Wright also alleged that the HIV/AIDS virus was developed to spread genocide among African Americans.

This is impressive when you realize that Wright and Obama support Planned Parenthood which was founded by white racist and eugenicist Margaret Sanger to limit the births of colored people.

Today, the same Planned Parenthood that Wright/Obama support is responsible for this shocking stat: while black women make up only 6% of the country's population, they are the victims of 36% of the nation's abortions.

94% of PP's 'clinics' are located in racial minority neighborhoods. The birth rate among black couples has fallen below the replacement rate for the first time in American history.

So Wright and his disciple Barack Obama are actually supporting genocide against their own people. But don't take my word for it; listen to other African Americans tell it in their own words at blackgenocide.org (http://www.blackgenocide.org/).

Theology matters.

KILLER_CLOWN
09-18-2008, 07:47 AM
Rev. Wright also alleged that the HIV/AIDS virus was developed to spread genocide among African Americans.

This is impressive when you realize that Wright and Obama support Planned Parenthood which was founded by white racist and eugenicist Margaret Sanger to limit the births of colored people.

Today, the same Planned Parenthood that Wright/Obama support is responsible for this shocking stat: while black women make up only 6% of the country's population, they are the victims of 36% of the nation's abortions.

94% of PP's 'clinics' are located in racial minority neighborhoods. The birth rate among black couples has fallen below the replacement rate for the first time in American history.

So Wright and his disciple Barack Obama are actually supporting genocide against their own people. But don't take my word for it; listen to other African Americans tell it in their own words at blackgenocide.org (http://www.blackgenocide.org/).

Theology matters.

Bingo!

penchief
09-18-2008, 07:49 AM
I'm not going to help you hi-jack a prefectly legitimate thread about theology.
KCJ
Bachelor of Theology
Logos Christian College
1995

So who said God is a right wing reactionary and that human existence revolves around the profit motive? God? Who said God is a republican? And why do republican policies and conduct go against the grain of Jesus's teachings?

Just like your faith and your service don't make you all-knowing, your bachelor's in Theology doesn't make you correct about the issues, either.

So, are you ever going to confront those statements by Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin that refute your claim about their intentions. Or are you just going to continue spouting your prejudices as if they were indisputible knowledge?

KCJohnny
09-18-2008, 09:13 AM
So who said God is a right wing reactionary and that human existence revolves around the profit motive? God? Who said God is a republican? And why do republican policies and conduct go against the grain of Jesus's teachings?

Just like your faith and your service don't make you all-knowing, your bachelor's in Theology doesn't make you correct about the issues, either.

So, are you ever going to confront those statements by Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin that refute your claim about their intentions. Or are you just going to continue spouting your prejudices as if they were indisputible knowledge?

I replied to you here (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=191871), mr. penchief.

penchief
09-18-2008, 09:17 AM
I replied to you here (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=191871), mr. penchief.

And I responded back.

But you still didn't address the fact that you assigned motives to Jefferson and Franklin that have been refuted by their own words.

KCJohnny
09-18-2008, 09:22 PM
‘Black genocide’

Abortion: Protesters want the NAACP to speak up on the slaughter of unborn African-Americans | Alisa Harris

http://www.worldmag.com/images/content/abortion8.jpg

link (http://www.worldmag.com/articles/14218)
If someone wiped out the entire African-American population in Oakland, Atlanta, and Washington, D.C., the number still wouldn't equal the number of black babies lost to abortion in one year: 683,294. According to the Allan Guttmacher Institute, African-American women are nearly five times more likely than non-Hispanic white women to have an abortion. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, almost one in every two African-American pregnancies ends in abortion.
These are facts, say pro-life blacks, that the NAACP can't afford to ignore. On July 14, the pro-lifers—including Alveda King (niece of Martin Luther King Jr.) and Clenard Childress of Life Education and Research Network—picketed the NAACP's 99th Annual Convention to address what Childress calls "black genocide." King said of Planned Parenthood, "It has led the way in eliminating African-Americans to the point where one quarter of the black population is now missing because of abortion. Planned Parenthood is anti-life and we are here to say enough is enough!"



Jeremiah Wright is a black liberation theologian. That particular theology changes the nature and substance of Christian revelation to radically marxist view of the Christian religion. It deconstructs the sacred texts to apply derived interpretations to current issues and problems. One of the casualties of liberation theology is the Judaic-Christian dogma that God is the author of life and that life begins at conception.

This leaves Wright and his disciple Barack Obama on the wrong side of history, morailty and their own community's best interest. As the above article reveals, there is a genocidal campaign being waged against black children right here, right now.

Theology matters.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-18-2008, 09:28 PM
Bootlegged, SHTSPRAYER, KCJohnny...all we need is Marc Bulger, Chief Henry, and recxjake, and this thread will be a true dip****athon.

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 12:33 AM
Between 1882 and 1968, 3,446 Blacks were lynched in the U.S. That number is surpassed in less than 3 days by abortion.

1,452 African-American children are killed each day by the heinous act of abortion.

3 out of 5 pregnant African-American women will abort their child.

Since 1973 there has been over 13 million Black children killed and their precious mothers victimized by the U.S. abortion industry.

Is this good for America? If Obama backs Planned Parenthood and rejects the Born Alive Infant Protection Act (http://amyproctor.squarespace.com/blog/2008/8/21/jill-stanek-on-obamas-vote-against-helping-aborted-babies-bo.html), is this really good judgment? Is this the man you want leading our nation?

(Links contain graphic content)
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/782/photo17fy2.jpg
http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/6078/photo04cw4.jpg
http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/6475/photo13er0.jpg

Logical
09-19-2008, 12:36 AM
Between 1882 and 1968, 3,446 Blacks were lynched in the U.S. That number is surpassed in less than 3 days by abortion.

1,452 African-American children are killed each day by the heinous act of abortion.

3 out of 5 pregnant African-American women will abort their child.

Since 1973 there has been over 13 million Black children killed and their precious mothers victimized by the U.S. abortion industry.

Is this good for America? If Obama backs Planned Parenthood and rejects the Born Alive Infant Protection Act (http://amyproctor.squarespace.com/blog/2008/8/21/jill-stanek-on-obamas-vote-against-helping-aborted-babies-bo.html), is this really good judgment? Is this the man you want leading our nation?Yes

ROYC75
09-19-2008, 12:36 AM
Now, suddenly, the Reverend Jeremiah Wright is misunderstood. Suddenly, so-called black liberation theology is misunderstood.

ROFL Yeah, right . The chicken is clucking again .....

ROYC75
09-19-2008, 12:40 AM
Rev. Wright also alleged that the HIV/AIDS virus was developed to spread genocide among African Americans.

This is impressive when you realize that Wright and Obama support Planned Parenthood which was founded by white racist and eugenicist Margaret Sanger to limit the births of colored people.

Today, the same Planned Parenthood that Wright/Obama support is responsible for this shocking stat: while black women make up only 6% of the country's population, they are the victims of 36% of the nation's abortions.

94% of PP's 'clinics' are located in racial minority neighborhoods. The birth rate among black couples has fallen below the replacement rate for the first time in American history.

So Wright and his disciple Barack Obama are actually supporting genocide against their own people. But don't take my word for it; listen to other African Americans tell it in their own words at blackgenocide.org (http://www.blackgenocide.org/).

Theology matters.


They are highly irresponsible, but that is OK, They have BIG GOVERNMENT to help them continue to cheat and take advantage of the system, a system that each and every one of us must pay for.

Irresponsible behavior is OK ........ should be the new Obama's CHANGE slogan.

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 12:42 AM
<OBJECT height=344 width=425>

<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ypDwNpgIUQc&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></OBJECT></P>
Here is audio of Barack Obama defending his no vote against the Illinois version of The Born Alive Infants Protection Act that he voted against in April 2002, which later became a federal law in August 2002. In the audio, Obama refers to the Act, saving babies who’ve survived the abortion, as placing an additional “burden” on the mother and doctors.

After all, he wouldn't want his own daughters 'punished with a baby"...

Logical
09-19-2008, 12:46 AM
Did you actually read Cardinal Ratzinger's explanation?

Liberation theology:

1. Deconstructs the Tradition of scriptural orthodoxy.
2. Invites contemporary interpretation grounded in no historical context other than that which is relevant to a modern/local cause.
3. Baptizes marxist class struggle and posits the struggle for political and economic 'justice' as the Biblical warfare between good and evil.
4. Focuses on praxis according to Marx and not the theology of the Jesus of the historical Church.
5. Changes the meanings of such keystone concepts as the Kingdom of God into a marxist revolution whereby instruments of insurgency are seen to be the tools of the Church in bringing about this 'Kingdom of God'.

The Cardinal admits to its ability to attract and deceive those seeking concrete expressions of change in the political and economic conditions of those in the Third World and like conditions.

So if you like change, want change, change you can 'believe in', Senator Obama is your man. Don't be surprised when that change takes on more of a Venezuelan flavor than the intent of our Founding Fathers.

What is amazing is he types all this shit knowing, no one really believes him or cares.

Logical
09-19-2008, 12:52 AM
So who said God is a right wing reactionary and that human existence revolves around the profit motive? God? Who said God is a republican? And why do republican policies and conduct go against the grain of Jesus's teachings?

Just like your faith and your service don't make you all-knowing, your bachelor's in Theology doesn't make you correct about the issues, either.

So, are you ever going to confront those statements by Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin that refute your claim about their intentions. Or are you just going to continue spouting your prejudices as if they were indisputible knowledge?

Jesus was big on occupying countries, killing people randomly around the world, and collecting his ten pieces of silver...or was that Moses, who can keep those fable guys straight.

ROYC75
09-19-2008, 12:52 AM
<OBJECT height=344 width=425>

<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ypDwNpgIUQc&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></OBJECT></P>
Here is audio of Barack Obama defending his no vote against the Illinois version of The Born Alive Infants Protection Act that he voted against in April 2002, which later became a federal law in August 2002. In the audio, Obama refers to the Act, saving babies who’ve survived the abortion, as placing an additional “burden” on the mother and doctors.

After all, he wouldn't want his own daughters 'punished with a baby"...

That's sad when you look at a child and consider it a " burden ". Obama's mother was blessed with a "burden" from his father. You can argue that his mother tried and loved Barrack, but lack the funds and the ability to provide and care for baby Barrack. Just think, he could have been another statistic, of a different kind .

Again, it falls in line with being irresponsible, it's the liberal way, screw up, find anyway you can to get out of being responsible for your actions.

Mecca
09-19-2008, 12:53 AM
What is amazing is he types all this shit knowing, no one really believes him or cares.

I'm not sure what's worse this shit or his football takes.

Reaper16
09-19-2008, 12:55 AM
What is amazing is he types all this shit knowing, no one really believes him or cares.
Naw, man. You gotta' believe.

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 12:55 AM
That's sad when you look at a child and consider it a " burden ". Obama's mother was blessed with a "burden" from his father. You can argue that his mother tried and loved Barrack, but lack the funds and the ability to provide and care for baby Barrack. Just think, he could have been another statistic, of a different kind .

Again, it falls in line with being irresponsible, it's the liberal way, screw up, find anyway you can to get out of being responsible for your actions.

Yes. Very, very sad. Because the judgment of God is not sleeping. There will be consequences to the murder of 40 million innocent human beings. I tremble.

Mecca
09-19-2008, 01:00 AM
Excuse me, like I said before what if I don't believe in God?

How can I be worried about the judgment of something I don't even believe exists?

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 01:02 AM
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=535 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Margaret Sanger Would Have Loved Barack Obama

</TD></TR><TR><TD>http://www.blackgenocide.org/images/spacer.gif</TD></TR><TR><TD>By Rev. Clenard H. Childress Jr.,
March 5, 2008

Revelations of eugenic ideology and the racist practices of Planned Parenthood are unfolding more and more.
The public is just beginning to believe what people of conscience have known long ago: Planned Parenthood has diabolically perpetrated their murderous plot to surgically eliminate those they deem undesirable. In other words: kill the babies of unsuspecting minority women by aborting their children. Then, tell them this is a "good thing" for you and your people. No other ethnic group in the United States has been decimated more by abortion than the Afro-American community. The war being waged upon innocent captives in the womb is led by Planned Parenthood.

The strategy:
Convince the targeted community to accept their eugenic racist plan by selecting one from their ethnicity to promote it. One of Planned Parenthood's earliest known projects was in 1939. It was called the “Negro Project” -- a project designed to control the birth of "human weeds" which was how Margaret Sanger referred to colored people; a project designed to introduce abortion, sterilization and different forms of birth control. This is what a co-eugenic wrote to Margaret Sanger to make sure the "Negro Project" was a success:
Clarence Gamble, heir of Proctor and Gamble, wrote a memorandum in November, 1939 entitled: "Suggestions for the Negro Project." In the letter he suggested black leaders “be placed in positions where it would appear they were in charge."

This is a letter to Clarence Gamble, from Margaret Sanger, in which she wrote,
"We should hire three or four colored ministers, preferably with social-service backgrounds, and with engaging personalities. The most successful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal. We don't want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members."

For those of you that don't know, Barack Obama became a "minister" of Planned Parenthood a long time ago. He's so good at carrying out their racist, murderous, agenda against Afro-Americans and society at large, they gave him a 100% score on his voting record. Planned Parenthood is following the strategy of their racist founder, Margaret Sanger, to the letter. Planed Parenthood is saying, “We have our poster boy! Get him out in front as a lure for their women and men. Get them into our abortion clinics and dismember their children by the millions!” You say absurd? No Way! Planned Parenthood’s Valentine cards were sent out to hundreds of thousands of young people in the nation. Whose face is plainly seen waving to them with a big smile? Whose endorsement is given to this racist and calloused organization? Who is used to lure children to give credibility to its hideous plot? Barack Obama, that's who!

On July 17, 2007, Barack Obama said the following before the Planned Parenthood Action Fund:
"Thank You, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you! ($) Thanks to all of you at Planned Parenthood for all the work that you are doing for women all across the country and for families all across the country-and for men who have enough sense to realize you are helping them, all across the country. I want to thank Cecile Richards (national president of Planned Parenthood) for her extraordinary leadership. I am happy to see so many good friends here today, including Steve Trombley and Pam Sutherland from my home state of Illinois. We had a number of battles down in Springfield from many years and it's wonderful to see that they are here today"

The first friend mentioned is, Cecile Richards, who he commends for extraordinary leadership in killing babies who are disproportionately black.

The second is, Steve Trombley, who is the president of Planned Parenthood Chicago. You can imagine how many of our young women have been victimized and whose pre-born children were killed under his supervision. His third friend he mentions is, Pam Sutherland. She is the State CEO of Planned Parenthood for Illinois. America needs to know how much these folks were, and continue today, to be in the head and actions of Senator Barack Obama. How much did he compromise his own values?

I choose here to quote Dr. Martin Luther King from his last Sunday sermon before his death:
"There comes a time when one must take the position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but he must do it because conscience tells him it is right. I believe today that there is a need for all people of goodwill to come with a massive act of conscience and say in the words of the old Negro Spiritual, ‘We ain't goin' study war no more.’"
This is the challenge facing modern man.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


Full editorial here (http://www.blackgenocide.org/obama.html).

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:03 AM
What is amazing is he types all this shit knowing, no one really believes him or cares.

Nope. I believe him, and I care.

Mecca
09-19-2008, 01:04 AM
Nope. I believe him, and I care.

Do you also like pie?

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:05 AM
Do you also like pie?

....? What is that supposed to mean?

Mecca
09-19-2008, 01:06 AM
....? What is that supposed to mean?

ROFL

What do you think it means?

Logical
09-19-2008, 01:06 AM
Do you also like pie?ROFLROFL

Nothing like old cross thread humor to confuse a n00B. Well played.

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:09 AM
ROFLROFL

Nothing like old cross thread humor to confuse a n00B. Well played.

Right. I don't memorize, nor do I have the time to memorize every thread. Apparently you do. I seem to always agree with you Mecca, but for some reason, this time I don't think it's going to happen. But you got me, I guess.

Logical
09-19-2008, 01:10 AM
That's sad when you look at a child and consider it a " burden ". Obama's mother was blessed with a "burden" from his father. You can argue that his mother tried and loved Barrack, but lack the funds and the ability to provide and care for baby Barrack. Just think, he could have been another statistic, of a different kind .

Again, it falls in line with being irresponsible, it's the liberal way, screw up, find anyway you can to get out of being responsible for your actions.What is irony is that Baracks mother did not have the advantage of Roe v Wade, he was born before it was approved. It would have been a back alley abortion with a coat hanger performed most likely by an unqualified quack.

Logical
09-19-2008, 01:11 AM
Right. I don't memorize, nor do I have the time to memorize every thread. Apparently you do. I seem to always agree with you Mecca, but for some reason, this time I don't think it's going to happen. But you got me, I guess.

Now you cannot keep me and Mecca straight, hint I have 62000 posts it is easy to see, oh that and the username in the post.

Mecca
09-19-2008, 01:14 AM
What is irony is that Baracks mother did not have the advantage of Roe v Wade, he was born before it was approved. It would have been a back alley abortion with a coat hanger performed most likely by an unqualified quack.

I think some would like for it to go back to being like that, it's kind of sad frankly.

Even if you are completely personally against abortion, this is America where freedom is what it's about so even if I was personally against it I'd still be pro choice.

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:14 AM
Now you cannot keep me and Mecca straight, hint I have 62000 posts it is easy to see, oh that and the username in the post.

Oh, so you were the person who asked me if I like pie...in which I responded with "what is that supposed to mean"

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:15 AM
Now you cannot keep me and Mecca straight, hint I have 62000 posts it is easy to see, oh that and the username in the post.

And congratulations on your "62,000" posts. That means something to somebody, Im sure.

orange
09-19-2008, 01:16 AM
ROFL

What do you think it means?

Wow. You found the one Planeteer who doesn't get the "pie" reference.

Kudos.

Mecca
09-19-2008, 01:18 AM
I could just have Bert come and eat peoples babies that will lower the abortion rate.

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:18 AM
Wow. You found the one Planeteer who doesn't get the "pie" reference.

Kudos.

Keep going, bro. Only 61000ish posts away from Cronus.

Logical
09-19-2008, 01:31 AM
Oh, so you were the person who asked me if I like pie...in which I responded with "what is that supposed to mean"
No, are you under the influence and if you are can I have some.:spock:

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:36 AM
No, are you under the influence and if you are can I have some.:spock:

Totally. But can we sit around and think of cool Hellinstic Greek names for ourselves? That would be awesome.

Mizzou_8541
09-19-2008, 01:37 AM
No, are you under the influence and if you are can I have some.:spock:

My bad, I should have respected the post count....

ROYC75
09-19-2008, 01:42 AM
Night guys, gotta get to bed, got grand jury duty in the morning.......

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 02:01 AM
And congratulations on your "62,000" posts. That means something to somebody, Im sure.
ROFL

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 02:02 AM
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=535 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Margaret Sanger Would Have Loved Barack Obama

</TD></TR><TR><TD>http://www.blackgenocide.org/images/spacer.gif</TD></TR><TR><TD>By Rev. Clenard H. Childress Jr.,
March 5, 2008

Revelations of eugenic ideology and the racist practices of Planned Parenthood are unfolding more and more.
The public is just beginning to believe what people of conscience have known long ago: Planned Parenthood has diabolically perpetrated their murderous plot to surgically eliminate those they deem undesirable. In other words: kill the babies of unsuspecting minority women by aborting their children. Then, tell them this is a "good thing" for you and your people. No other ethnic group in the United States has been decimated more by abortion than the Afro-American community. The war being waged upon innocent captives in the womb is led by Planned Parenthood.

The strategy:
Convince the targeted community to accept their eugenic racist plan by selecting one from their ethnicity to promote it. One of Planned Parenthood's earliest known projects was in 1939. It was called the “Negro Project” -- a project designed to control the birth of "human weeds" which was how Margaret Sanger referred to colored people; a project designed to introduce abortion, sterilization and different forms of birth control. This is what a co-eugenic wrote to Margaret Sanger to make sure the "Negro Project" was a success:
Clarence Gamble, heir of Proctor and Gamble, wrote a memorandum in November, 1939 entitled: "Suggestions for the Negro Project." In the letter he suggested black leaders “be placed in positions where it would appear they were in charge."

This is a letter to Clarence Gamble, from Margaret Sanger, in which she wrote,
"We should hire three or four colored ministers, preferably with social-service backgrounds, and with engaging personalities. The most successful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal. We don't want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members."

For those of you that don't know, Barack Obama became a "minister" of Planned Parenthood a long time ago. He's so good at carrying out their racist, murderous, agenda against Afro-Americans and society at large, they gave him a 100% score on his voting record. Planned Parenthood is following the strategy of their racist founder, Margaret Sanger, to the letter. Planed Parenthood is saying, “We have our poster boy! Get him out in front as a lure for their women and men. Get them into our abortion clinics and dismember their children by the millions!” You say absurd? No Way! Planned Parenthood’s Valentine cards were sent out to hundreds of thousands of young people in the nation. Whose face is plainly seen waving to them with a big smile? Whose endorsement is given to this racist and calloused organization? Who is used to lure children to give credibility to its hideous plot? Barack Obama, that's who!

On July 17, 2007, Barack Obama said the following before the Planned Parenthood Action Fund:
"Thank You, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you! ($) Thanks to all of you at Planned Parenthood for all the work that you are doing for women all across the country and for families all across the country-and for men who have enough sense to realize you are helping them, all across the country. I want to thank Cecile Richards (national president of Planned Parenthood) for her extraordinary leadership. I am happy to see so many good friends here today, including Steve Trombley and Pam Sutherland from my home state of Illinois. We had a number of battles down in Springfield from many years and it's wonderful to see that they are here today"

The first friend mentioned is, Cecile Richards, who he commends for extraordinary leadership in killing babies who are disproportionately black.

The second is, Steve Trombley, who is the president of Planned Parenthood Chicago. You can imagine how many of our young women have been victimized and whose pre-born children were killed under his supervision. His third friend he mentions is, Pam Sutherland. She is the State CEO of Planned Parenthood for Illinois. America needs to know how much these folks were, and continue today, to be in the head and actions of Senator Barack Obama. How much did he compromise his own values?

I choose here to quote Dr. Martin Luther King from his last Sunday sermon before his death:
"There comes a time when one must take the position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but he must do it because conscience tells him it is right. I believe today that there is a need for all people of goodwill to come with a massive act of conscience and say in the words of the old Negro Spiritual, ‘We ain't goin' study war no more.’"
This is the challenge facing modern man.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Full editorial here (http://www.blackgenocide.org/obama.html). <!-- / message -->

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 02:03 AM
Between 1882 and 1968, 3,446 Blacks were lynched in the U.S. That number is surpassed in less than 3 days by abortion.

1,452 African-American children are killed each day by the heinous act of abortion.

3 out of 5 pregnant African-American women will abort their child.

Since 1973 there has been over 13 million Black children killed and their precious mothers victimized by the U.S. abortion industry.

Is this good for America? If Obama backs Planned Parenthood and rejects the Born Alive Infant Protection Act (http://amyproctor.squarespace.com/blog/2008/8/21/jill-stanek-on-obamas-vote-against-helping-aborted-babies-bo.html), is this really good judgment? Is this the man you want leading our nation?

(Links contain graphic content)
http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/782/photo17fy2.jpg
http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/6078/photo04cw4.jpg
http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/6475/photo13er0.jpg

patteeu
09-19-2008, 08:29 AM
I think some would like for it to go back to being like that, it's kind of sad frankly.

Even if you are completely personally against abortion, this is America where freedom is what it's about so even if I was personally against it I'd still be pro choice.

Are you pro-choice on murder and robbery too?

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 09:34 AM
Are you pro-choice on murder and robbery too?

Mecca obviously cannot tell murder when he sees it. (post #32 and #65).

penchief
09-19-2008, 09:41 AM
Mecca obviously cannot tell murder when he sees it. (post #32 and #65).

How's it feel dropping bombs on innocent women and children?

KCJohnny
09-19-2008, 09:42 AM
How's it feel dropping bombs on innocent women and children?

I wouldn't know.

How's it feel playing God?

penchief
09-19-2008, 10:08 AM
I wouldn't know.

How's it feel playing God?

I wouldn't know. That's your job. And you seem to think you're doing a pretty good job.

How is the killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent people not murder? How is the glorifying of SHOCK AND AWE not just as distasteful to you?

***SPRAYER
08-14-2009, 06:48 AM
bump

Duck Dog
08-14-2009, 09:32 AM
How's it feel dropping bombs on innocent women and children?

I know this old, but what a stupid thing to say. Under any circumstances.

penchief
08-14-2009, 09:38 AM
I know this old, but what a stupid thing to say. Under any circumstances.

Not when you're dealing with KCJohnny and his double standard when it comes to murder. It may have been blunt but it was necessary.

***SPRAYER
08-14-2009, 09:38 AM
How's it feel dropping bombs on innocent women and children?

Angry enough to join Trinity United, or Silly and Jilly's church.

:cuss:

penchief
08-14-2009, 09:41 AM
Angry enough to join Trinity United, or Silly and Jilly's church.

:cuss:

Not angry at all. Just pointing out the obvious to someone who can't see past his own prejudice.

***SPRAYER
08-14-2009, 09:43 AM
Not angry at all. Just pointing out the obvious to someone who can't see past his own prejudice.

I agree. Rev Wright is good people.

penchief
08-14-2009, 09:57 AM
I agree. Rev Wright is good people.

What's that have to do with KCJohnny passing judgment on others when he advocates for actions that are ethically and morally questionable?

vailpass
08-14-2009, 10:01 AM
How's it feel dropping bombs on innocent women and children?

ROFL Peace an love man! Don't trust anyone over 30! Make love not war!

Could you be anymore outdated and off point? How does it feel to be as butthurt as you?

penchief
08-14-2009, 10:04 AM
ROFL Peace an love man! Don't trust anyone over 30! Make love not war!

Could you be anymore outdated and off point? How does it feel to be as butthurt as you?

How's your reading comprehension? I'm not even going to ask if you care about context because I already know the answer.

I was hardly butthurt when I said that to KCJohnny. I was simply pointing out to KCJohnny that he was in no position to pass judgment on other people considering his hypocricy related to the killing of innocent people.

vailpass
08-14-2009, 10:06 AM
How's your reading comprehension? I'm not even going to ask if you care about context because I already know the answer.

And I was hardly butthurt when I said that to KCJohnny. I was pointing out to KCJohnny that was in no position to pass judgment on other people considering his hypocricy related to the killing innocent people.


But you for some reason ARE in a position to pass judgement? Buck up little soldier and face the real world.

What's that have to do with KCJohnny passing judgment on others when he advocates for actions that are ethically and morally questionable?

penchief
08-14-2009, 10:07 AM
But you for some reason ARE in a position to pass judgement? Buck up little soldier and face the real world.

How was I passing judgment when I asked him to think about that question? And what do you think ethically and morally "questionable" means. It means it is questionable. Not that a judgment has been made.

vailpass
08-14-2009, 10:09 AM
How was I passing judgment when I asked him to think about that question?

You labeled his words as "ethically and morally questionable". How much more judgemetnal could you be?
Whose ethics? Whose morals? Yours?

penchief
08-14-2009, 10:14 AM
You labeled his words as "ethically and morally questionable". How much more judgemetnal could you be?
Whose ethics? Whose morals? Yours?

Yes, finish reading my post. Questionable means questionable. Questionable does not mean that final judgment has been passed. KCJohnny doesn't question his moral authority when he passes judgment on others. I thought that he should be aware that he appeared to hold a double standard related to the killing of innocent people.

I agree that nobody should be playing the moral authority card. That was exactly my point to KCJohnny. Thank you for agreeing with me.

***SPRAYER
08-14-2009, 10:16 AM
I wish Rev Wright could have baptised my daughter. He is awesome.

vailpass
08-14-2009, 11:36 AM
Yes, finish reading my post. Questionable means questionable. Questionable does not mean that final judgment has been passed. KCJohnny doesn't question his moral authority when he passes judgment on others. I thought that he should be aware that he appeared to hold a double standard related to the killing of innocent people.

I agree that nobody should be playing the moral authority card. That was exactly my point to KCJohnny. Thank you for agreeing with me.

Were you ass-raped in the military? Just asking.

***SPRAYER
08-14-2009, 11:52 AM
Rev Wright is awesome. I can see why someone would want to go to his church for twenty years.

penchief
08-14-2009, 12:38 PM
Were you ass-raped in the military? Just asking.

Why would you ask a stupid question like that?

The Mad Crapper
07-04-2010, 09:22 AM
Don't you just love the civility from the left?

Bootlegged, SHTSPRAYER, KCJohnny...all we need is Marc Bulger, Chief Henry, and recxjake, and this thread will be a true dip****athon.

Bootlegged
09-14-2011, 02:18 PM
Why would anyone waste any time talking about this?

:bravo:

Bootlegged
09-14-2011, 02:26 PM
<iframe width="420" height="345" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/-1X5sZ6Q4Fw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

patteeu
09-14-2011, 03:16 PM
<iframe width="420" height="345" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/-1X5sZ6Q4Fw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

That guy must hate his life. Reprehensible.