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View Full Version : General Politics Obama has some explaning to do , Tax break my butt.....


ROYC75
09-26-2008, 08:47 AM
http://www.electiontaxes.com/ (This is the calculator .)

Link http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080926/ap_on_el_pr/election_tax_burden;_ylt=AicR4BNXW6x_Hu__WPSodhLCw5R4http://www.electiontaxes.com/

(95 % my Ass ...... I told you clowns Obama's plan was false )

To me, he doesn't give me a tax break, but rather an increase. Factor in the cost of living due to small business taxes increasing and capital gains taxes and corporation taxes that will be passed on to the consumer..... I'm screwed, I'm middle class . It's not a large increase, but it will cost more thru all the social programs, cost of living, etc than the original taxes itself.



My chart will appear in the next post .

HonestChieffan
09-26-2008, 08:50 AM
Obama does not explain. He is Obama. Never question Obama.

Oh if you need him, you can call him.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 08:55 AM
Damn, hang on, something didn't download right .

Sorry for the delay, I just got busy, had to make some money to pay for his tax plan :D

Here it is, again .....

Mecca
09-26-2008, 08:56 AM
Roy is struggling with his PC to prove his point...apparently even his computer is voting for Obama.

tiptap
09-26-2008, 09:03 AM
Yeah mine went up just like Clinton. Having to pay for Republican debt. Did you include the national debt in your take?

Mecca
09-26-2008, 09:04 AM
Why is it that fiscal conservatives spend more than the so called free willing democrats....yet people continue to buy into the shit that Republicans spend less..right.

KILLER_CLOWN
09-26-2008, 09:13 AM
Why is it that fiscal conservatives spend more than the so called free willing democrats....yet people continue to buy into the shit that Republicans spend less..right.

These aren't your grandpas republicans, the party was compromised long ago. The average party propper hasn't figured that out yet. Vote Obama for average joe welfare, Vote Mccain for corporate welfare. If you really have conservative values your just S.O.L. and really do not have a voice.

patteeu
09-26-2008, 09:19 AM
Why is it that fiscal conservatives spend more than the so called free willing democrats....yet people continue to buy into the shit that Republicans spend less..right.

They don't. Even though Republicans have been horrible on the spending side of the federal budget, democrats sought even greater spending at almost every point along the path. It's a myth that Republicans are bigger spenders than dems.

Mecca
09-26-2008, 09:21 AM
Oh really?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh168/marrslw/fiscalconservative.jpg

bkkcoh
09-26-2008, 09:24 AM
They don't. Even though Republicans have been horrible on the spending side of the federal budget, democrats sought even greater spending at almost every point along the path. It's a myth that Republicans are bigger spenders than dems.

Not in the recent past, the 2 parties just want to spend the money on different items. Republicans want to spend the moeny on defense and such under the guise of making us safer, democrats want to spend it on social programs.

There can be huge debates as to what is the best way to spend the money, but if the country isn't relatively safe on our own ground, it wouldn't make any difference how much was spent on social programs.

patteeu
09-26-2008, 09:26 AM
Oh really?

Yeah, really.

[Sorry, I don't have an irrelevant cartoon to post]

Mecca
09-26-2008, 09:27 AM
Yeah, really.

[Sorry, I don't have a cartoon to post]

My post>your post.

Brock
09-26-2008, 09:28 AM
Yeah, really.

[Sorry, I don't have a cartoon to post]

You're just out of touch with the younger generation. You need to get some puppets or something.

Mecca
09-26-2008, 09:29 AM
You're just out of touch with the younger generation. You need to get some puppets or something.

You guys must have a really hard time with UP's posts.

Brock
09-26-2008, 09:29 AM
You guys must have a really hard time with UP's posts.

Not really. UP is usually funny and on point.

patteeu
09-26-2008, 09:31 AM
My post>your post.

Except that it's wrong and your pretty picture doesn't speak to the issue.

Cosmos
09-26-2008, 09:31 AM
Yeah, really.

[Sorry, I don't have an irrelevant cartoon to post]

Many of your posts qualify as such.

Garcia Bronco
09-26-2008, 09:33 AM
It's obvious from the get go that Obama, while lowering income tax, will raise the cost of living by increased business taxes.

patteeu
09-26-2008, 09:37 AM
Many of your posts qualify as such.

What do you mean? Can you give me an example?

jAZ
09-26-2008, 09:41 AM
Ummm... I don't see anything to base a judgement up.

The link is broken.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 01:11 PM
Damn, hang on, something didn't download right .

Sorry for the delay, I just got busy, had to make some money to pay for his tax plan :D

Here it is, again .....

Again, sorry, I got hammered again when I tried to correct it....


Discuss .........

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:24 PM
Come on Obots, defend this 95 %of American tax break across the board , we are talking middle class here.

irishjayhawk
09-26-2008, 02:27 PM
Roy, weren't you the one suggesting earlier that the only way to dig ourselves out of the mess we're in is to tax?

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:36 PM
Roy, weren't you the one suggesting earlier that the only way to dig ourselves out of the mess we're in is to tax?

I mentioned it, then I forgot to add in the inflation part, so that would be a bad thing to do, tax the people while in a recession, esp. not knowing how long of one now with this buyout.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:37 PM
So, can you rebuttal this 95 % tax break to Americans ? I qualify as middle class here.......

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:41 PM
Come on Obots, you are letting me down, are you not programmed in this field, did the master leave this part out ?

McCain will cost me 864.00 , only in the 4th year of his term.

Obot will cost me $ 3256.00 ,886.00,502.00,502.00, and 1366.00 in his 4 years. God forbid it goes to 8 years ......

Somebody explain this to me, how can this be.

penguinz
09-26-2008, 02:45 PM
Roy75, what makes you think this calculator is in anyway accurate?

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:49 PM
Roy75, what makes you think this calculator is in anyway accurate?


I've yet to see any other ones, got some, let's punch the #'s in and see.

So far, Obama has lied, just as I suspected him to do . His raising taxes on small business, capital gains and corporation taxes will kill the economy worst that what it is now. We all know what kind of crisis we are faced with .

J Diddy
09-26-2008, 02:51 PM
Roy75, what makes you think this calculator is in anyway accurate?


it's not

J Diddy
09-26-2008, 02:54 PM
I've yet to see any other ones, got some, let's punch the #'s in and see.

So far, Obama has lied, just as I suspected him to do . His raising taxes on small business, capital gains and corporation taxes will kill the economy worst that what it is now. We all know what kind of crisis we are faced with .


It leaves out quite a few things virtually every credit including eic.

It is the first one I've seen that supports McCain's tax plan so I see why you posted it.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 02:55 PM
it's not

Is there an official one ? IIRC, this one came from the University of Maine.

J Diddy
09-26-2008, 02:58 PM
Is there an official one ? IIRC, this one came from the University of Maine.

I don't believe there is an official one. Just seems that the numbers skew to the side of the particular website posting it.

JMO.

|Zach|
09-26-2008, 03:00 PM
It is the first one I've seen that supports McCain's tax plan so I see why you posted it.

LMAO

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 03:12 PM
It leaves out quite a few things virtually every credit including eic.

It is the first one I've seen that supports McCain's tax plan so I see why you posted it.


It's the only one I have seen, FTR. I stumbled on this one off yahhhoooooo....

J Diddy
09-26-2008, 03:13 PM
It's the only one I have seen, FTR. I stumbled on this one off yahhhoooooo....


There's one posted on here a few weeks back. Entirely different scenario.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 03:13 PM
Come on Obots, this is an issue that Obot is running his mouth about ..... where is the calculators to rebuttal this with .

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 03:14 PM
There's one posted on here a few weeks back. Entirely different scenario.

Can you find it ? I would like to see it .

jidar
09-26-2008, 04:35 PM
Can you find it ? I would like to see it .

first link on google for "Obama Tax Calculator"

http://alchemytoday.com/obamataxcut/

jidar
09-26-2008, 04:36 PM
An article about the Tax calculator I just linked:

http://www.walletpop.com/blog/2008/09/11/tax-calculator-for-how-your-taxes-would-change-under-obama-or-mc/

Using numbers from the non-partisan Tax Policy Center, the website AlchemyToday came up with a calculator to see how much Barack Obama would raise your taxes. It's a nifty device that should help clarify for people the big differences in economic policy in this election.

Are you making less than $603,000? If so, Obama isn't going to raise your taxes, the data show.

According to a Gallup Poll, 53% of Americans think Obama is going to raise their taxes, compared with just 34% who suspect the same of McCain. That means that at least 48% of Americans don't really understand what Obama is going to do and one-third don't understand what McCain is proposing. Where would so many people get the crazy idea that Obama's secret plan is to raise taxes? Well, it could be because John McCain tells them that every chance he gets.
The Washington Post put together a nifty graphic using the same data. CNNMoney also did a smart analysis of the whole thing. The gist of it is, according to CNNMoney:

McCain: The average taxpayer in every income group would see a lower tax bill, but high-income taxpayers would benefit more than everyone else.

Obama: High-income taxpayers would pay more in taxes, while everyone else's tax bill would be reduced. Those who benefit the most -- in terms of reducing their taxes as a percentage of after-tax income - are in the lowest income groups.

In the simplest terms, McCain is going to cut everybody's taxes, but cut the very richest people's taxes most. Obama is going to cut everybody's taxes except the really rich. As the Tax Policy Center points out, both plans are lousy for the federal debt: Obama's would raise the debt by $2.9 trillion, McCain's by $4.2 trillion.

I wish someone would come up with a better calculator than the alchemy one, one that would let people compare their situation under Obama and McCain. First off, people would see that for the vast majority of Americans -- those making $112,000 and under -- Obama cuts their taxes more than McCain.

Second, a better calculator would account for more than just income. A realistic calculator would ask you where you get your income. Is it from work? Or is it from the stock market? (Which Obama says he wants to raise.) Or is it from an inheritance of more than $3.5 million? And then there's McCain's proposal to tax employer healthcare, but give a tax credit to offset it.

Fiscal policy is really complicated. We could desperately need use a tool to bring it home to people where their own financial interest lies.

jidar
09-26-2008, 04:40 PM
Actually both the one I linked and the one you linked show I pay less taxes under Obama. What the hell did you do to make yours show otherwise?

jidar
09-26-2008, 04:45 PM
Again, sorry, I got hammered again when I tried to correct it....


Discuss .........

Uhm.. you're reading the graph wrong. It shows you pay lower taxes under Obama.

Chiefs_Mike_Topeka
09-26-2008, 04:48 PM
Doing my situation on the calculator provided Obama's plan will save my family over $500 a year.

Jenson71
09-26-2008, 04:56 PM
Again, sorry, I got hammered again when I tried to correct it....


Discuss .........

Your graph showed that the "refundable credits" make it so you're actually losing less overall.

What are refundable credits?

Garcia Bronco
09-26-2008, 04:57 PM
I will not get a tax break under Obama's plan and I make between 75 and 100k.

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 05:48 PM
Uhm.. you're reading the graph wrong. It shows you pay lower taxes under Obama.

Holy Cow :eek: I did, I read it as taxing more on the bottom line.

OK, I get the dunce award on this one..... Enjoy it .:grr:

Now, can we believe his plan ? Guess we just might get to see ...... STFU

ROYC75
09-26-2008, 05:50 PM
I will not get a tax break under Obama's plan and I make between 75 and 100k.


I do anywhere form 65 - 85 K per year, If his plan is real, Like I just found out, I could get a little bit more back. Time will tell .......

jidar
09-26-2008, 06:19 PM
Holy Cow :eek: I did, I read it as taxing more on the bottom line.

OK, I get the dunce award on this one..... Enjoy it .:grr:

Now, can we believe his plan ? Guess we just might get to see ...... STFU

rep for takin yer lumps.

gotta respect that.

Taco John
09-26-2008, 06:25 PM
I will not get a tax break under Obama's plan and I make between 75 and 100k.



That can't be right. Between my wife and I, we make more than that and I figured to get back between $800 and $1200.

Calcountry
09-26-2008, 06:44 PM
Obama does not explain. He is Obama. Never question Obama.

Oh if you need him, you can call him.If you question him like Curic did Palin, you would be called a racist.

Calcountry
09-26-2008, 06:48 PM
I will not get a tax break under Obama's plan and I make between 75 and 100k.
You rich bastard, I hope he makes you pay reparations.

Logical
09-26-2008, 06:48 PM
Damn, hang on, something didn't download right .

Sorry for the delay, I just got busy, had to make some money to pay for his tax plan :D

Here it is, again .....
What the hell are you talking about Roy, you are paying less in every single year shown under Obama's plan. Are you suffering from dyslexia?

Logical
09-26-2008, 06:49 PM
Holy Cow :eek: I did, I read it as taxing more on the bottom line.

OK, I get the dunce award on this one..... Enjoy it .:grr:

Now, can we believe his plan ? Guess we just might get to see ...... STFU
Sorry, I see you realized your error. Enjoy your tax cut.:D

jidar
09-26-2008, 07:01 PM
If you question him like Curic did Palin, you would be called a racist.

haha. there is no WAY you've seen that interview.

MahiMike
09-26-2008, 07:10 PM
Tax Break??!!!! Tax Break??!!!

Playoffs???!!!! Playoffs???

WilliamTheIrish
09-26-2008, 07:28 PM
This is one for the ages...


Come on Obots, defend this 95 %of American tax break across the board , we are talking middle class here.

So, can you rebuttal this 95 % tax break to Americans ? I qualify as middle class here.......

Come on Obots, you are letting me down, are you not programmed in this field, did the master leave this part out ?

McCain will cost me 864.00 , only in the 4th year of his term.

Obot will cost me $ 3256.00 ,886.00,502.00,502.00, and 1366.00 in his 4 years. God forbid it goes to 8 years ......

Somebody explain this to me, how can this be.

So far, Obama has lied, just as I suspected him to do . His raising taxes on small business, capital gains and corporation taxes will kill the economy worst that what it is now. We all know what kind of crisis we are faced with .

Come on Obots, this is an issue that Obot is running his mouth about ..... where is the calculators to rebuttal this with .

Uhm.. you're reading the graph wrong. It shows you pay lower taxes under Obama

Holy Cow I did, I read it as taxing more on the bottom line.

OK, I get the dunce award on this one..... Enjoy it .

Now, can we believe his plan ? Guess we just might get to see ......


ROY you seserve a standing ovation for the greatest self-owning thread in ..... ever.

irishjayhawk
09-26-2008, 07:30 PM
ROFL

Mecca
09-26-2008, 07:32 PM
I was looking at that graph before reading this thread wondering where he saw the increase....then I saw what he posted...that's some self ownage.

Chiefs_Mike_Topeka
09-26-2008, 07:54 PM
Holy Cow :eek: I did, I read it as taxing more on the bottom line.

OK, I get the dunce award on this one..... Enjoy it .:grr:

Now, can we believe his plan ? Guess we just might get to see ...... STFU

Well in your "defense" I am sure you went into this article already "knowing" what you were going to see based on all the spin from Repubs about how Obama is going to raise "your" taxes. When in reality all of Obama's plans call for a tax increase for only the top 2% wealthy Americans. But politics are the great generalization arena. If one part of a candidate's plan mention an increase in taxes, even if it doesn't affect 98% of the public, the opposing side is going to automatically label said candidate as an evil tax monster who wants to take more of your money.

WilliamTheIrish
09-26-2008, 10:11 PM
So ROI, can you rebuttal yourself?

|Zach|
09-27-2008, 01:57 AM
http://marketingthechurch.terapad.com/resources/6249/assets/images/good_job_blue_ribbon.png

Nightfyre
09-27-2008, 02:22 AM
At least he caught it. I was going to say something :p

whoman69
09-27-2008, 11:16 AM
Yeah, really.

[Sorry, I don't have an irrelevant cartoon to post]

The fact that the last three Republican presidents doubled the debt is irrelevent? I guess we just have to believe they were really fiscal conservatives at heart.

patteeu
09-27-2008, 01:41 PM
The fact that the last three Republican presidents doubled the debt is irrelevent? I guess we just have to believe they were really fiscal conservatives at heart.

Pretty much.

I think it would be unfair to believe anything else about Ronald Reagan, but not even I would call the other two men fiscal conservatives. As prone to spending as GWBush and his Republican Congress were, the democrats sought to top it at almost every turn. Put democrats in the place of Republicans over the past 8 years and the government would be much bigger than it is today.

DaneMcCloud
09-27-2008, 01:55 PM
Pretty much.

I think it would be unfair to believe anything else about Ronald Reagan, but not even I would call the other two men fiscal conservatives. As prone to spending as GWBush and his Republican Congress were, the democrats sought to top it at almost every turn. Put democrats in the place of Republicans over the past 8 years and the government would be much bigger than it is today.

That might be the case.

But I hardly doubt if that were the case, we'd be dumping $10 BILLION dollars a month into a worthless war, the stock market would be taking a tremendous dump and loan institutions would need a gigantic financial bailout.

Hey look, I was a Reagan fan once as well. But the history has proven that de-regulation and "trickle-down" economics does not work. In nearly thirty years since Reaganomics was instituted, the rich have become more wealthy and poor and middle class have become poorer. The divide between the rich and the poor in this country has never been greater.

It's time to end this failed economic policy.

patteeu
09-27-2008, 08:11 PM
That might be the case.

But I hardly doubt if that were the case, we'd be dumping $10 BILLION dollars a month into a worthless war, the stock market would be taking a tremendous dump and loan institutions would need a gigantic financial bailout.

The democrats have had many opportunities to reduce or block funding for the war but they haven't done it. In fact, in some cases they've played to type by proposing even more spending than the administration (see the recent veterans benefits bill for an example). But I agree with you that democrats probably would have ended the military component of the GWoT a long time ago so that would have saved them quite a bit of money. With Obama's promised new spending (approaching $1 trillion over 4 years) and all the examples of democrats wanting to spend more than Republicans over the past several years (NCLB, prescription drugs, DoHS, etc), I'm convinced that democrats would have spent more than enough to make up for Bush's military spending anyway.

And I don't agree with you at all when you try to pin the stock market and the financial crisis on the Republicans. Those aren't Republican problems. The dems have been riding shotgun and spelling the driver for the whole trip on those two deals.

Hey look, I was a Reagan fan once as well. But the history has proven that de-regulation and "trickle-down" economics does not work. In nearly thirty years since Reaganomics was instituted, the rich have become more wealthy and poor and middle class have become poorer. The divide between the rich and the poor in this country has never been greater.

It's time to end this failed economic policy.

What I see over the past 30 years is nearly uninterrupted prosperity for the entire country. Huge improvements in standard of living. The poor of today are much better off than the poor of 1978. Even with wages relatively flat, what you could buy with your wages kept getting better. That prosperity is Ronald Reagan's legacy (with help from his successors of course). De-regulation and "trickle-down" economics have been a huge success afaic. I don't know how you can come to the opposite conclusion, much less believe that history has proven the point. The disasters waiting to happen (like Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Social Security, Medicare etc.) all predate Reagan and have nothing to do with Reagan's economics.