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Frankie
11-02-2008, 05:58 PM
Seriously rethinking my vote on Tuesday. I have a hard time believing most of the Republicans charges against Obama. But him being elite and out of touch with the common man keeps gnawing at me.

Frankie
11-02-2008, 05:59 PM
Here's the proof:

Taco John
11-02-2008, 06:07 PM
That's a long way to go about letting us know that you like that picture.

Frankie
11-02-2008, 06:14 PM
That's a long way to go about letting us know that you like that picture.

Well I kinda feel goofy 2nite.

kstater
11-02-2008, 06:18 PM
Ok, I chuckled.

BigRedChief
11-02-2008, 06:24 PM
Seriously rethinking my vote on Tuesday. I have a hard time believing most of the Republicans charges against Obama. But him being elite and out of touch with the common man keeps gnawing at me.
My 16 year old son gets it. His work.
http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii161/ummkno/obamajpg.gif

whatsmynameagain
11-02-2008, 06:37 PM
Momma always said you can tell a lot about someone by their shoes......

jjjayb
11-02-2008, 07:46 PM
Momma always said you can tell a lot about someone by their shoes......

1.3 million dollar house and he can't afford to fix his shoes?

Chiefshrink
11-02-2008, 08:42 PM
Photo op picture. This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos. I guarantee you he does not wear holes in his soles. Totally setup. This guy will be slicker than Slick Willy himself.

Thig Lyfe
11-02-2008, 08:44 PM
This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos.

:spock:

The retarded insinuation that Barack Obama has never worked hard aside, isn't that basically the case with most presidential candidates? The campaign trail, especially nowadays, is a long and stressful grind.

KCJohnny
11-02-2008, 08:54 PM
Joe Biden doesn't think he's ready.

Mr. Flopnuts
11-02-2008, 08:55 PM
Photo op picture. This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos.

Harvard Law Degrees, and becoming the first black male to ever lead the Review is a stroll in the park for guys like you. You should really run in 12.

KCJohnny
11-02-2008, 09:04 PM
Harvard Law Degrees, and becoming the first black male to ever lead the Review is a stroll in the park for guys like you. You should really run in 12.

Don't leave out chairing the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (http://globallabor.blogspot.com/2008/09/highlights-of-obamaayers-chicago.html).

splatbass
11-02-2008, 09:12 PM
Don't leave out chairing the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (http://globallabor.blogspot.com/2008/09/highlights-of-obamaayers-chicago.html).

You mean the charity started by Walter Annenberg, the Republican friend of Nixon and Reagan? ROFL

BigRedChief
11-02-2008, 09:14 PM
You mean the charity started by Walter Annenberg, the Republican friend of Nixon and Reagan? ROFL
Friggin commies are everywhere.

WilliamTheIrish
11-02-2008, 09:16 PM
Don't leave out chairing the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (http://globallabor.blogspot.com/2008/09/highlights-of-obamaayers-chicago.html).

Get ready to salute him, soldier.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 05:15 AM
My 16 year old son gets it. His work.

Did ACORN get his voter registration turned in?

HonestChieffan
11-03-2008, 05:19 AM
Hard work stapleing flyers to light poles in the hood.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 05:25 AM
Joe Jamail, the high powered lawyer who won a historic judgment (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B0DE2D61E3CF930A25751C0A961948260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all) in the lawsuit between Penzoil and Texaco back in the 80's, tells an interesting story about some of the things he would do to win the sympathy of the juries that heard his cases. One of the things he did was to wear shoes like those in Frankie's picture. At some point during the trial, he'd make it a point to put his feet up and show the jury the holes in his soles just like Obama's. Don't fall for the theatrics, Frankie.

KCJohnny
11-03-2008, 05:34 AM
Hard work stapleing flyers to light poles in the hood.

ROFL

Alphaman
11-03-2008, 05:50 AM
Seriously rethinking my vote on Tuesday. I have a hard time believing most of the Republicans charges against Obama. But him being elite and out of touch with the common man keeps gnawing at me.

Exactly what is it about him that makes you think he is elite and out of touch with the common man? Just because his opponent likes to call him that doesn't make it true.

Until a few years ago when his books sold like crazy, Obama, financially, was the common man, trying to provide for his family and their future while paying off college loans. Elitists don't forgo high paying jobs to work as a community organizer.

Is he intelligent? Yes, more so than most. However, in this election Obama has made his entire campaign about fighting for the common man, i.e. the middle class. HIs proposed tax cuts are all about helping the middle class, the common man. So is his health care plan. His response to the bail out was to lay out 4 principles that were focused helping the economy and the homeowner instead of the mortgage companies and their CEOs and executives.

tiptap
11-03-2008, 05:55 AM
Did ACORN get his voter registration turned in?
Chisun Lee is a reporter for ProPublica, America's largest independent, nonprofit newsroom that produces investigative journalism in the public interest.

For weeks, Republican leaders have warned that widely reported problems with fake voter registrations could result in a flood of phony votes in pivotal states.

But Ronald Michaelson, a veteran election administrator and member of the McCain-Palin Honest and Open Election Committee, said in an interview that he could not name a single instance in which this had occurred.

“Do we have a documented instance of voting fraud that resulted from a phony registration form? No, I can’t cite one, chapter and verse,” he said.

The claims and counterclaims about fraudulent voting have emerged as a prominent issue in the 2008 campaign. Sen. John McCain declared in the final presidential debate that ACORN — the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, the low-income advocacy group whose temporary staffers submitted thousands of faked applications — “is now on the verge of maybe perpetrating one of the greatest frauds in voter history in this country, maybe destroying the fabric of democracy.”

Republican elected officials and lawyers for state Republican parties have made similar claims in court and in statements to the press. So far, however, they have failed to provide significant supporting evidence.

A review of prosecutors’ statements and documents filed by Republicans in the most serious new cases alleging voter fraud shows that none offer an example in which a fraudulently registered person managed to cast a valid vote. While several cases argue that such frauds are possible, none sketched a scenario for how massive numbers of people could fake registrations and then vote.

Asked for specifics about the dangers of fake registration, Ben Porritt, a spokesman for the McCain campaign, provided links to 13 news clips and a 2003 Missouri state auditor’s report. Eleven of the cases did not involve registration fraud. Two recounted how felons appeared to have cast illegal votes under their own names. The lone example of a forged registration leading to an illegitimate vote comes from The Wall Street Journal’s John Fund, who in April 2006 wrote that a community organizer had improperly registered a noncitizen, and “someone eventually voted in [the noncitizen’s] name.”

Michaelson, who served for 27 years as executive director of the Illinois Board of Elections, said the sharp exchanges over registration fraud have undermined voters’ confidence in the electoral system.

“The fact that so many of these illegal registrations are being made public raises a perception in the minds of people,’’ he said. “That’s more of a general concern. You don’t want to perpetuate the idea that our election process is lacking integrity.”

Asked whether his own party was responsible for fostering that perception, Michaelson said, “Well, it doesn’t help. It has captured the attention of a lot of people.” Why do it, then? “Maybe it’s because there’s nothing else to talk about,” he said.

Michaelson could not cite a single real example of how registration fraud has led to voting fraud. He said that an election-rigging scheme starting with phony application forms would not make much sense. Michaelson joined the McCain team when asked by its general counsel, Trevor Potter, whom he knew from their days working together at the Federal Election Commission.

Michaelson explained why the mere perception of widespread fraud can do public harm: “When reports are circulating in the media that this one group has turned in 5,000 applications and 2,000 of them are invalid, for the minimally informed voter, they say, ‘Oh my gosh, what’s happening to our process? Our process is lacking integrity.’ It just plants seeds of doubt in the minds of people who don’t understand the process very well.

“That’s just not a very healthy atmosphere,” he said.

This week, the Ohio GOP launched an ad claiming “hundreds of thousands of new voter registrations are questionable” and asking, “Could Ohio’s election be stolen?”

The implied link between registration and voting fraud has ranged beyond sound bites. It has driven Republicans’ invocation of legal power to scrutinize voters, demands for U.S. Justice Department intervention and court orders, and criminal investigations.

Fake registrations an unlikely vehicle for fraud

Numerous election experts, including Barnard College political scientist Lorraine Minnite and Justice Department veteran Gerald Hebert of the Campaign Legal Center, told ProPublica that fake registrations were an unlikely and unwieldy means of stealing an election.

Such a scheme would have to involve a substantial crew of fraudsters—tens of thousands of people—willing to risk the hefty prison sentences and fines if caught.

Michaelson agreed that the scenario is implausible. “We have to distinguish between voter registration fraud and voter election fraud,” he said. He said that officials “inundated at the last minute” with piles of applications can let phony registrants “slip through the cracks” and get on the voter rolls. But he could not name a type of voting fraud that would begin with the filing of false registrations.

The McCain campaign has asserted that phony registrations could facilitate fraud on absentee ballots. “Voter registration fraud can quickly turn into vote fraud — especially in the case of absentee balloting and in states that do not require photo identification to vote,” the campaign wrote in a letter to U.S. Attorney General Michael Mukasey calling for a federal investigation. (The Associated Press, quoting two “senior law enforcement officials,” recently reported that an inquiry is under way. Justice Department spokesperson Laura Sweeney told ProPublica she couldn’t “confirm or deny” an investigation.)

Michaelson said absentee ballot scams have typically involved political operatives telling legitimately enrolled people whom to vote for.

Another member of McCain’s Honest and Open Election Committee, Harvard law professor and former U.S. solicitor general Charles Fried, stepped down last week after voting absentee for Obama-Biden. He said by e-mail that the campaign’s positions on voter fraud had not figured in his decision. “It was all about Sarah Palin who is spectacularly unqualified,” Fried wrote. “My decision had nothing at all to do with the justified outrage against the shenanigans of ACORN and the like.”

GOP bid for voter lists could spawn eligibility challenges

Republicans have gone to court in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Ohio to obtain the names of new registrants. Their target often has been lists of names flagged when states compared their voter rolls to other data bases, such as motor vehicle registrations and Social Security. Those checks, required under a new federal law, have already been shown to be notoriously error-prone. Critics have said that disclosing the lists to a political party would enable mass eligibility challenges that could cause confusion at crowded polling sites.

The GOP sought a list of more than 20,000 new registrants in Wisconsin. Among those tagged as suspect were four of the six retired judges who make up the state’s bipartisan election board. The Wisconsin Republican Party’s brief warned that, if the presidential election is very close, “the deciding votes may well be cast by ineligible voters registered illegally.” It alluded to “criminal behavior” involving registrations, citing factual support consisting of three news accounts: one about a woman charged with submitting phony forms, one saying registration workers were being investigated for possible fraud, and one quoting a Republican spokesperson saying the hiring of former felons to collect voter applications — even if not illegal — “doesn’t smell right.”

The Wisconsin trial judge rejected the lawsuit on technical grounds, but noted that she was unpersuaded by the GOP’s mentions of “criminal activity.”

Wisconsin Attorney General J. B. Van Hollen, a Republican official who initiated the failed suit, announced Tuesday that he would deploy more than 50 state law enforcement agents and collaborate with local prosecutors to guard against fraud on Election Day. It was unclear what the agents might do, and Van Hollen’s office did not return a call from ProPublica.

Prosecutors are probing possible voter fraud in Ohio after a judge rebuffed a GOP attempt to obtain lists of names of registrants who had been flagged by database checks.

A Republican filing in that court case cited as its sole evidence a New York Post article reporting that one man – after being told by election officials to stop “repeat registering” – had “breezed into Ohio election offices” and had “reregistered with a fake address and cast a paper ballot.” The GOP filing said “these bogus registrations can lead, and in fact have led, to fraudulent absentee voting.”

Hamilton County prosecutor Joseph Deters, the southwest Ohio regional chair of the McCain campaign, launched a grand-jury investigation involving several hundred new voters identified in the database checks. He told The Associated Press that he’d received “widespread complaints of fraud,” but declined to discuss details. Local election officials said they hadn’t heard any such complaints. Deters could not be reached for comment.

House Minority Leader John A. Boehner (R-Ohio) last week persuaded President Bush to ask the Justice Department to revive the Ohio legal challenge for greater scrutiny of new registrants. Otherwise, he warned, “thousands, if not tens or hundreds of thousands, of names whose information has not been verified ... will remain on voter rolls. ... And there is a significant risk — if not a certainty, that unlawful votes will be cast and counted.” The New York Times reported that informed sources say Justice will not take up the cause.

Todd Rokita, the Republican secretary of state in Indiana, recently sent federal and state prosecutors a letter demanding a criminal investigation into voter registrations involving ACORN. Rokita wrote, “This is not simply registration fraud. This is voter fraud. ... Fraudulent registrations are the first step in ... rendering an inaccurate tally on Election Day.” In his letter — portions of which were redacted — he cited a 2003 local election marred by absentee ballot fraud. His office did not respond to a phone message and detailed email asking about the link between phony registration applications and phony ballots.

Scholars who have authored books documenting election fraud — political scientists R. Michael Alvarez of the California Institute of Technology, Thad Hall of the University of Utah and University of Kentucky historian Tracy Campbell — told ProPublica they could not think of an example of registration-driven voter fraud.

Voting rights advocates in recent years have worked to debunk assumptions that elections get stolen because individuals fake their eligibility. They have said that election fraud most commonly involves party operatives bribing legitimate voters or partisan poll workers manipulating ballots.

The modern antifraud movement, calling for scrutiny at the individual voter level, was spearheaded by Republicans after the hairline-close 2000 presidential election, as journalist Jeffrey Toobin has described at length. A five-year, nationwide voter-fraud investigation by the Bush Justice Department yielded 86 convictions as of 2006 — some for multiple voting or vote buying, and many of people who claimed not to have realized that their citizenship or criminal record mattered.

McCain adviser Michaelson believes that the real way to prevent stolen outcomes — or the perception of them — is to abolish the partisan oversight systems that prevail in most states. Officials, he said, “are the final barriers to election fraud. But we have districts where it’s really hard to find a legitimate Republican or a legitimate Democrat. Even if on paper you have [bipartisan] checks and balances, you really don’t.”

“The problem is when you have a razor-thin margin of victory like in Florida 2000,” Michaelson said, “then these individual instances of fraud that otherwise would be accepted as part of the imperfect election process — elections are messy — just become very, very important.”

“Frankly,” Michaelson said, “all election administrators hope for landslides in their jurisdictions.”

Kristin Jones of ProPublica contributed to this story.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/15155.html

patteeu
11-03-2008, 07:13 AM
tip tap,

Apparently I'm a better investigative journalist than your outfit that no one has ever heard of:

Review indicates 278 felons cast ballots illegally in state (http://www2.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=314489)

KCJohnny
11-03-2008, 07:17 AM
tip tap,

Apparently I'm a better investigative journalist than your outfit that no one has ever heard of:

Review indicates 278 felons cast ballots illegally in state (http://www2.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=314489)

Cha ching!

penchief
11-03-2008, 07:18 AM
Photo op picture. This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos. I guarantee you he does not wear holes in his soles. Totally setup. This guy will be slicker than Slick Willy himself.

blah blah blah. More unsubstantiated fear and smear being projected by sore losers in denial about how out of touch their political party has become.

Dick Bull
11-03-2008, 07:20 AM
tip tap,

Apparently I'm a better investigative journalist than your outfit that no one has ever heard of:

Review indicates 278 felons cast ballots illegally in state (http://www2.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=314489)


so what exactly is the process to determine if someone is eligible to vote after they've had a felony?

penchief
11-03-2008, 07:23 AM
tip tap,

Apparently I'm a better investigative journalist than your outfit that no one has ever heard of:

Review indicates 278 felons cast ballots illegally in state (http://www2.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=314489)

So, do you think these 278 votes was a conspiracy by democrats to influence the outcome of the election or just a 278 vote glich void of partisanship?

Also, how do you feel about the systematic efforts of the Bush Administraton and the republican party to use the Justice Department and state party officials to purge eligible voters from the voting rolls en masse in democratic strongholds?

patteeu
11-03-2008, 07:24 AM
so what exactly is the process to determine if someone is eligible to vote after they've had a felony?

I couldn't tell you. Fortunately, I've never been convicted. I've wondered that myself though.

morphius
11-03-2008, 07:26 AM
Probably couldn't afford new shoes after giving that breathtaking 5.7% of his salary in charity to help out all those needy folks he keeps talking about. Of course we shouldn't talk about the 1% he gave for who knows how long before getting elected...

Just had to toss that in there, lol.

Dick Bull
11-03-2008, 07:27 AM
I couldn't tell you. Fortunately, I've never been convicted. I've wondered that myself though.


Seems to me they would have to have a national registry to compare it to. Background checks would cost too much time and money. It'd have to be national because state wide wouldn't work.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 07:27 AM
So, do you think these 278 votes was a conspiracy by democrats to influence the outcome of the election or just a 278 vote glich void of partisanship?

Also, how do you feel about the systematic efforts of the Bush Administraton and the republican party to use the Justice Department and state party officials to purge eligible voters from the voting rolls en masse in democratic strongholds?

When democrats know that the vast majority of felons and illegal immigrants will vote for their party instead of the Republicans, they don't really need a conspiracy to make a difference. They just need to get out the vote among those groups. ACORN and same day registration are just two of the tools they use toward that end.

Dick Bull
11-03-2008, 07:27 AM
Probably couldn't afford new shoes after giving that breathtaking 5.7% of his salary in charity to help out all those needy folks he keeps talking about. Of course we shouldn't talk about the 1% he gave for who knows how long before getting elected...

Just had to toss that in there, lol.

Nah, he probably just gave a homeless man his good shoes.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 07:30 AM
Seems to me they would have to have a national registry to compare it to. Background checks would cost too much time and money. It'd have to be national because state wide wouldn't work.

It may be that the rules vary from state to state. I agree that any verification process would probably have to involve a registry/database somewhere but I'm not confident any verification actually takes place. They may rely on challenges from the two parties to keep everything on the up and up. :shrug:

Radar Chief
11-03-2008, 07:31 AM
Also, how do you feel about the systematic efforts of the Bush Administraton and the republican party to use the Justice Department and state party officials to purge eligible voters from the voting rolls en masse in democratic strongholds?

blah blah blah. More unsubstantiated fear and smear being projected by sore losers in denial about how out of touch their political party has become.

:LOL:

patteeu
11-03-2008, 07:50 AM
Also, how do you feel about the systematic efforts of the Bush Administraton and the republican party to use the Justice Department and state party officials to purge eligible voters from the voting rolls en masse in democratic strongholds?

The more extensive the voter registration fraud operation of the democrats become, the more important it is for Republicans to make challenges and for government officials to clean up the voter rolls. The occasional eligible voter gets caught up in this because there simply isn't enough time to do a background check on every individual registrant. As democrats push toward same day registration and earlier voting, the job of policing fraudulent voter registrations becomes ever more challenging.

Many of the purges you have in mind come as a result of new election laws passed in the wake of the issues that came to light in the 2000 election. Can you show me an example of a purge that took place in contravention of election law?

morphius
11-03-2008, 08:04 AM
Nah, he probably just gave a homeless man his good shoes.
More than likely it was when he was walking across the burning ground to sign his deal with the devil, lol.

penchief
11-03-2008, 08:17 AM
When democrats know that the vast majority of felons and illegal immigrants will vote for their party instead of the Republicans, they don't really need a conspiracy to make a difference. They just need to get out the vote among those groups. ACORN and same day registration are just two of the tools they use toward that end.

You appear to be making a lot of unsubstantiated generalizations in order to arrive at your conclusions.

I don't know how you figure that most felons are going to vote democratic. That seems like a bias on your part. Most of the hardened criminials I've observed fit the intolerant, aggressive, overreactive profile that characterizes right wing partisans.

Also, your generalization that poor people are more likely to be democrats is not necessarily true, either. I think it depends on whether one is a rural poor or an urban poor, a poor white or a poor minority. As I pointed out in another thread, I am very familiar with two of the biggest welfare counties in PA and NY. And both of those counties will be voting overwhemingly for McCain just as they always vote overwhelmingly republican. And per capita, they probably have just as many or more felons than any other county in their respective states.

penchief
11-03-2008, 08:20 AM
:LOL:

Well, let's ignore the fact that voter rolls have been purged and tons of eligible voters have been disenfranchised. And let's also ignore the fact that their is an ongoing investigation over the politicization of the Justice Department specifically related to the effort to prosecute trumped up voter fraud cases.

penchief
11-03-2008, 08:22 AM
The more extensive the voter registration fraud operation of the democrats become, the more important it is for Republicans to make challenges and for government officials to clean up the voter rolls. The occasional eligible voter gets caught up in this because there simply isn't enough time to do a background check on every individual registrant. As democrats push toward same day registration and earlier voting, the job of policing fraudulent voter registrations becomes ever more challenging.

Many of the purges you have in mind come as a result of new election laws passed in the wake of the issues that came to light in the 2000 election. Can you show me an example of a purge that took place in contravention of election law?

Again, exactly how many cases have been prosecuted resulting from the Bush Administraton's politicization of the Justice Department for that reason?

It has become ever more apparent that the voter fraud hype is designed to justify the voter suppression tactics of the republican party.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:35 AM
1.3 million dollar house and he can't afford to fix his shoes?

1.3 million dollar houses are not that rare anymore. In our city there are a few doctors who have them. Having 7 or 8 of those houses is what really separates you from Joe Sixpack and Joe the plumber.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:36 AM
Photo op picture. This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos. I guarantee you he does not wear holes in his soles. Totally setup. This guy will be slicker than Slick Willy himself.And since you know him personally,.....

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:38 AM
You mean the charity started by Walter Annenberg, the Republican friend of Nixon and Reagan? ROFL

Damn you beat me to this. I wish KCJ would actually read some of the stuff he qhotes.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:41 AM
Get ready to salute him, soldier.

KCJ is thinking it over. He may quit the military not to serve a CIC who's a commie. I know he is thinking cause he hasn't yet answered my question about this.

BigCatDaddy
11-03-2008, 08:41 AM
1.3 million dollar houses are not that rare anymore.

LOL!

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:44 AM
Joe Jamail, the high powered lawyer who won a historic judgment (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B0DE2D61E3CF930A25751C0A961948260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all) in the lawsuit between Penzoil and Texaco back in the 80's, tells an interesting story about some of the things he would do to win the sympathy of the juries that heard his cases. One of the things he did was to wear shoes like those in Frankie's picture. At some point during the trial, he'd make it a point to put his feet up and show the jury the holes in his soles just like Obama's. Don't fall for the theatrics, Frankie.

Yeah I'm sure he took a grinder to his Gucci shoes just for this pic.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 08:48 AM
So, do you think these 278 votes was a conspiracy by democrats to influence the outcome of the election or just a 278 vote glich void of partisanship?

Also, how do you feel about the systematic efforts of the Bush Administraton and the republican party to use the Justice Department and state party officials to purge eligible voters from the voting rolls en masse in democratic strongholds?

Hell, Republican operatives throw away twice that many early Dem ballots a day in Florida.

Fat Elvis
11-03-2008, 08:58 AM
The more extensive the voter registration fraud operation of the democrats become, the more important it is for Republicans to make challenges and for government officials to clean up the voter rolls. The occasional eligible voter gets caught up in this because there simply isn't enough time to do a background check on every individual registrant. As democrats push toward same day registration and earlier voting, the job of policing fraudulent voter registrations becomes ever more challenging.

Many of the purges you have in mind come as a result of new election laws passed in the wake of the issues that came to light in the 2000 election. Can you show me an example of a purge that took place in contravention of election law?


You're worried about registration fraud; how about stopping voter suppression--which is predominantly perpetrated by the pubs?

patteeu
11-03-2008, 09:02 AM
You appear to be making a lot of unsubstantiated generalizations in order to arrive at your conclusions.

I don't know how you figure that most felons are going to vote democratic. That seems like a bias on your part. Most of the hardened criminials I've observed fit the intolerant, aggressive, overreactive profile that characterizes right wing partisans.

Also, your generalization that poor people are more likely to be democrats is not necessarily true, either. I think it depends on whether one is a rural poor or an urban poor, a poor white or a poor minority. As I pointed out in another thread, I am very familiar with two of the biggest welfare counties in PA and NY. And both of those counties will be voting overwhemingly for McCain just as they always vote overwhelmingly republican. And per capita, they probably have just as many or more felons than any other county in their respective states.

I didn't say anything about poor people or welfare so I'm not sure if you even understood my post.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 09:05 AM
Again, exactly how many cases have been prosecuted resulting from the Bush Administraton's politicization of the Justice Department for that reason?

It has become ever more apparent that the voter fraud hype is designed to justify the voter suppression tactics of the republican party.

I asked you first. I've already posted evidence of illegal voter fraud today. Have you backed up your insinuation that there have been illegal voter purges with anything yet?

patteeu
11-03-2008, 09:06 AM
Yeah I'm sure he took a grinder to his Gucci shoes just for this pic.

What do you think the purpose of the picture was? The focus is on the shoes, not the candidate. You're being played.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 09:09 AM
You're worried about registration fraud; how about stopping voter suppression--which is predominantly perpetrated by the pubs?

I've already pointed out that it becomes more important to suppress fraudulent voters as the democrats continue to increase their efforts to make fraud easier. If our registration laws were adequate to prevent fraud there would be no need for cleaning up the voter rolls.

BucEyedPea
11-03-2008, 09:10 AM
You're worried about registration fraud; how about stopping voter suppression--which is predominantly perpetrated by the pubs?

Proof?

penchief
11-03-2008, 10:05 AM
I asked you first. I've already posted evidence of illegal voter fraud today. Have you backed up your insinuation that there have been illegal voter purges with anything yet?

What makes you believe that more felons are going to vote democratic?

We've already seen it done in Ohio and Florida in 04 and 00. We have seen it in Colorado and Georgia this year while the courts are getting involved in Ohio.

triple
11-03-2008, 10:09 AM
hey frankie:

http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/27/that-is-what-change-means-for-barack-the-redistributor-it-means-taking-your-money-and-giving-it-to-someone-else/#comment-13554

patteeu
11-03-2008, 10:25 AM
What makes you believe that more felons are going to vote democratic?

Because they tend to be shiftless, low-character victimizers who don't have any qualms about satisfying their own desires even if it means taking from those that have what they want.

And because of the implication inherent in the democrat's efforts to make it easier for them to vote.

Oh, and because studies of the subject (http://dwb.thenewstribune.com/news/local/story/4850294p-4452879c.html) indicate that it's true.

We've already seen it done in Ohio and Florida in 04 and 00. We have seen it in Colorado and Georgia this year while the courts are getting involved in Ohio.

Illegal suppression? What are you talking about?

Dick Bull
11-03-2008, 10:29 AM
Because they tend to be shiftless, low-character victimizers who don't have any qualms about satisfying their own desires even if it means taking from those that have what they want.

And because of the implication inherent in the democrat's efforts to make it easier for them to vote.

Oh, and because studies of the subject (http://dwb.thenewstribune.com/news/local/story/4850294p-4452879c.html) indicate that it's true.



Illegal suppression? What are you talking about?


Wow. Me thinks you think that way that it would support the claim that they somehow stole this election. Newsflash, it ain't even gonna be that close.

Fat Elvis
11-03-2008, 10:45 AM
Proof?

Try this:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27508967?GT1=43001

And don't be an idiot and try to insinuate that these examples were perpetrated by people who are sympathetic to the Democratic Party.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 10:57 AM
Wow. Me thinks you think that way that it would support the claim that they somehow stole this election. Newsflash, it ain't even gonna be that close.

I think you're trying too hard.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 10:59 AM
Try this:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27508967?GT1=43001

And don't be an idiot and try to insinuate that these examples were perpetrated by people who are sympathetic to the Democratic Party.

Who did these things and were any laws broken? Your article leaves a lot of questions unanswered. No wonder you read what you wanted to read into it.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 11:02 AM
What do you think the purpose of the picture was? The focus is on the shoes, not the candidate. You're being played.If I had camera in that room, I would definitely take a picture focusing on the shoes. Subjects like this, no photographer misses out on.

Frankie
11-03-2008, 11:04 AM
hey frankie:

http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/27/that-is-what-change-means-for-barack-the-redistributor-it-means-taking-your-money-and-giving-it-to-someone-else/#comment-13554

Either give me a cliff note or point me to what I'm supposed to look at. It's an awful long reading.

penchief
11-03-2008, 11:04 AM
I asked you first. I've already posted evidence of illegal voter fraud today. Have you backed up your insinuation that there have been illegal voter purges with anything yet?

But you didn't post any evidence that it benefits democrats or was part of a democratic conspiracy.

I didn't say they were illegal purges. Any purge that disenfranchizes legitimate voters is unjust and undemocratic. Just because legal maneuvering on behalf of political partisans may render those purges within a new boundary doesn't mean they are legitimate, warranted, or morally right.

triple
11-03-2008, 11:09 AM
Either give me a cliff note or point me to what I'm supposed to look at. It's an awful long reading.

just a post from a campaign worker about what's going on :shrug:

penchief
11-03-2008, 11:11 AM
Because they tend to be shiftless, low-character victimizers who don't have any qualms about satisfying their own desires even if it means taking from those that have what they want.

And because of the implication inherent in the democrat's efforts to make it easier for them to vote.

Oh, and because studies of the subject (http://dwb.thenewstribune.com/news/local/story/4850294p-4452879c.html) indicate that it's true.



Illegal suppression? What are you talking about?

Voting roll purges. There is no question because it has been documented that legitimate voters have been purged from the rolls illegitimately. And those purges have taken place in heavily democratic areas and perpetrated by republican operatives.

Also, voter suppression comes in the way of misinformation and intimidation. See the flier that was sent out in Virginia on official Commonwealth letterhead. Who do you suppose put that flier out? Republican operatives or democratic operatives? Why does it always seem that republicans are conniving to suppress the vote? Seems like a reasonable person could assume that such a pattern of behavior would indicate a concerted effort to on the part of the republican party to suppress the vote. That is very undemocratic behavior. Very unAmerican behavior, IMO.

HemiEd
11-03-2008, 11:11 AM
Photo op picture. This is the hardest he has every worked in his life these past 10 mos. I guarantee you he does not wear holes in his soles. Totally setup. This guy will be slicker than Slick Willy himself.

http://i35.tinypic.com/2ug1h5c.jpg

patteeu
11-03-2008, 11:14 AM
But you didn't post any evidence that it benefits democrats or was part of a democratic conspiracy.

Actually, I did. See post 55 for additional information on this score.


I didn't say they were illegal purges. Any purge that disenfranchizes legitimate voters is unjust and undemocratic. Just because legal maneuvering on behalf of political partisans may render those purges within a new boundary doesn't mean they are legitimate, warranted, or morally right.

If they weren't illegal then don't bother me with your whining. I've already pointed out the very real reason why these purges are essential (i.e. to protect the integrity of our vote against voting fraud). In the wisdom of our elected officials, these laws, while at times imperfect, are the best compromises we've been able to develop in order to provide these safeguards. Your warped sense of what constitutes "unjust" and "undemocratic" are irrelevant as far as I'm concerned.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 11:17 AM
Voting roll purges. There is no question because it has been documented that legitimate voters have been purged from the rolls illegitimately. And those purges have taken place in heavily democratic areas and perpetrated by republican operatives.

Also, voter suppression comes in the way of misinformation and intimidation. See the flier that was sent out in Virginia on official Commonwealth letterhead. Who do you suppose put that flier out? Republican operatives or democratic operatives? Why does it always seem that republicans are conniving to suppress the vote? Seems like a reasonable person could assume that such a pattern of behavior would indicate a concerted effort to on the part of the republican party to suppress the vote. That is very undemocratic behavior. Very unAmerican behavior, IMO.

BTW, I forgot to mention in my last post that you don't seem to understand the meaning of the word "legitimate" (likewise for "illegitimately" in this post). Again, have any of these alleged purges been illegal? A simple yes (with support) or no will do.

penchief
11-03-2008, 11:39 AM
BTW, I forgot to mention in my last post that you don't seem to understand the meaning of the word "legitimate" (likewise for "illegitimately" in this post). Again, have any of these alleged purges been illegal? A simple yes (with support) or no will do.

Just because legal maneuvering may legitimatize purging legitimate voters from the rolls doesn't make it okay. You seem to be arguing that it does.

It especially doesn't make it okay when it is being done for politically partisan reasons. You seem to think that is also okay.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 11:51 AM
Just because legal maneuvering may legitimatize purging legitimate voters from the rolls doesn't make it okay. You seem to be arguing that it does.

It especially doesn't make it okay when it is being done for politically partisan reasons. You seem to think that is also okay.

It's not only OK, it's essential to preserve the integrity of our electoral system.

Dick Bull
11-03-2008, 11:52 AM
I think you're trying too hard.

nah, haven't even broke a sweat

penchief
11-03-2008, 12:00 PM
It's not only OK, it's essential to preserve the integrity of our electoral system.

So disenfranchizing 1000 legitimate voters motivated by partisanship is justified in the name of preventing one illegal vote that cannot be proven is partisan? There are laws to prevent illegal voting. It is a federal offense. It is a felony. And most people aren't going to do that. Would you?

This has got to be one of the biggest strawmen ever concocted. Again, why hasn't there been any prosecutions under the Bush Administration's directive?

Trust me, the story is voter suppression and disenfranchisemant, not voter registration fraud. The republican party is trying to justify mass voter suppression and disenfranchisement as a tactic.

patteeu
11-03-2008, 12:18 PM
So disenfranchizing 1000 legitimate voters motivated by partisanship is justified in the name of preventing one illegal vote that cannot be proven is partisan? There are laws to prevent illegal voting. It is a federal offense. It is a felony. And most people aren't going to do that. Would you?

This has got to be one of the biggest strawmen ever concocted. Again, why hasn't there been any prosecutions under the Bush Administration's directive?

Trust me, the story is voter suppression and disenfranchisemant, not voter registration fraud. The republican party is trying to justify mass voter suppression and disenfranchisement as a tactic.

Speaking of strawmen, where do you get your numbers?