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luv
11-15-2008, 12:25 AM
http://kan.scout.com/2/811935.html

Saints Will Test Thigpen, Edwards

By C.E. Wendler

Everyone is excited about Chiefs quarterback Tyler Thigpen, and that’s great. In a 1-8 season, it’s tough not to get excited about a young player who puts together three efficient, nearly flawless games in a row. So go ahead, Chiefs fans, enjoy the moment.

But how long will the moment last? While I will apologize to Thigpen for characterizing him as a "practice squad" quarterback a few weeks ago, I’m not completely sold that he’s the right quarterback for the Chiefs’ future, especially if Herm Edwards is around. Here’s why:

1. The Chiefs’ new offense feels like a fluke.

2. Even if it’s not, is Edwards truly on board with it?

Yes, Thigpen’s quarterback rating looks great, ESPN.com is writing about him, analysts like Ron Jaworski are praising him, and he’s the next cover boy for Warpaint Illustrated The Magazine. But all of this is due to the Chiefs’ "innovative" pass-happy attack. While the new spread offense is fun to watch and has made the Chiefs competitive, it doesn’t feel like a long-term solution, but rather a gimmick.

In three games, it’s been outstanding for one half, only to fall almost completely flat in the second half. Thigpen, too, turns into a pumpkin when the first-half clock strikes zero.

In the second half against the Jets, Bucs and Chargers, the Chiefs averaged only 112 net offensive yards, and scored only 12 total points. After halftime, "The Gailey Gimmick" produces 3.9 yards per play (far below the Chiefs’ 28th-ranked 4.7 yards per play overall this season) and has a third-down conversion rate of 25 percent. Thigpen, meanwhile, has attempted 50 passes for an underwhelming 230 yards, with just one touchdown pass.

Sad but true – in a way, the Chiefs’ new offense is worse than the old one. All the opposition has to do is wait until after halftime for the three-and-outs to start. And because Kansas City has no interest in shortening the contest with their running game, there are plenty of chances to exploit the Chiefs' woeful defense.

Here’s the other thing I don’t like – the Chiefs still don’t throw the football down the field enough. Sure, Thigpen hit a bomb to Bradley, and threw a nice pass down the seam to Gonzalez in San Diego. But there are way too many short throws in this offense. It’s still far too easy for defenses to play most of their defenders within 15 yards of the line of scrimmage, and stop the Chiefs like it was nothing.

I don’t see Thigpen making the NFL throws pro scouts drool over at the combine – the deep out, the post, the 20-yard dig, the ball zipped down the sideline into the closing hole between the corner and safety in the Cover Two. Far too often, I see him hitting receivers short who run for big yards after the catch. No matter how much you might want to believe it, Chan Gailey is not Bill Walsh and Thigpen is not Joe Montana (this is also the year 2008, not 1981).

If Thigpen and the spread are for real, we’ll find out Sunday against the Saints. While New Orleans has the league’s top-ranked offense, their defense is almost as bad as Kansas City’s. This game should be a track meet, and the Chiefs should bring in Dick Vermeil as a one-game offensive consultant.

The Chiefs won’t put any pressure on Drew Brees (who has only been sacked eight times this year, anyway), and though Kansas City has stopped the run lately, the Saints barely even bother to run the ball in most games. If Brees has less than 150 yards passing by halftime, consider Gunther Cunningham a genius.

While the Saints are torching the Chiefs’ young and injury-addled defense, I expect Thigpen and company to do the same to New Orleans. Here’s the problem – what happens after halftime?

If Kansas City’s new offense is legit, they should have no problems making any halftime adjustments against one of the league’s most pathetic defenses, and continuing their first-half assault. That goes double this week, because the Chiefs will be at home, and NFC teams traditionally don’t play well at Arrowhead.

If Thigpen and company falter again, there’s a problem. He might not be the quarterback of the future everyone wants him to be.

But this is also where Herm Edwards enters the equation. With the return of Larry Johnson this week, how will the Chiefs fit him into the offense? Johnson’s pass blocking is too poor for him to be a consistent part of the spread offense. Kansas City’s run blocking is also poor – there’s no way Johnson should receive more than 14 or 15 carries.

Even if the Chiefs get a lead? Yes. If Thigpen passes Kansas City to a 14-point advantage at halftime, keep throwing. The Saints are good enough on offense (and the Chiefs are bad enough on defense) that no lead should feel safe tomorrow. The Chiefs should approach the game as if they’re playing 1999 Rams.

If Edwards chooses to sit on a lead and try to run clock, there’s a problem. He might not be the head coach of the future everyone wants him to be (Clark Hunt being "everyone").

So can Herm avoid the temptation of feeding Johnson the ball with a lead? And can Thigpen do anything before the Chiefs are trailing in the second half? That’s what’s on my mind as the Saints come marching into Kansas City.

Reerun_KC
11-15-2008, 12:37 AM
Not a bad article...

Made some good points...

Mr. Flopnuts
11-15-2008, 12:43 AM
That's actually one of the best articles I've ever read from him. And I already think he's a decent writer.

luv
11-15-2008, 12:45 AM
Even if he does try to hand the ball off to LJ more in the second half, we'll still have three-and-outs.

greg63
11-15-2008, 12:45 AM
Something tells me that I'm glad NOT to have read it.

Tribal Warfare
11-15-2008, 12:47 AM
Nice one, Clayton :clap:

Tuckdaddy
11-15-2008, 12:50 AM
I'm not ready to call Thiggy our man for 09 yet either but he's been very good for a guy from damn near off the street.

WTF is wrong with a healthy short passing attack? He's shown he can thrown the ball down the field. But our O-line can hold for so long. Why is that not in the article?

Jaws says he looks good, this guys opinion takes a back seat in my book.

luv
11-15-2008, 12:51 AM
Two words come to mind after reading this article.


Cautiously optimistic.

smittysbar
11-15-2008, 12:53 AM
Very good points, IMO he is doing a HELL of a job now that he is telling it as he sees it.

smittysbar
11-15-2008, 12:57 AM
I'm not ready to call Thiggy our man for 09 yet either but he's been very good for a guy from damn near off the street.

WTF is wrong with a healthy short passing attack? He's shown he can thrown the ball down the field. But our O-line can hold for so long. Why is that not in the article?

Jaws says he looks good, this guys opinion takes a back seat in my book.

Because we go away from what is working in the first half. You can throw stats out that say we are passing in the second half but it's little dinks and donks, which is about the same as running.

You say whats wrong with that, I say BECAUSE IT AIN'T ****ING WORKING!

DaneMcCloud
11-15-2008, 01:00 AM
Yeah, let's not blame the law firm of SackIntosh and Jones for halftime adjustments.

JFC.

And furthermore, the Chiefs were on the road in the Meadowlands, faced a great defense in Tampa Bay, then would have won the game in San Diego if it weren't for the long snapper.

This team has had some bad luck this year and NONE of that is related to Thigpen.

Sorry, Clay. This article plays to all of the negative Nellies out there.

I call bullshit.

chiefs1111
11-15-2008, 01:08 AM
I do agree with him on one point,id like to see some more shots taken down the field.

luv
11-15-2008, 01:16 AM
Yeah, let's not blame the law firm of SackIntosh and Jones for halftime adjustments.

JFC.

And furthermore, the Chiefs were on the road in the Meadowlands, faced a great defense in Tampa Bay, then would have won the game in San Diego if it weren't for the long snapper.

This team has had some bad luck this year and NONE of that is related to Thigpen.

Sorry, Clay. This article plays to all of the negative Nellies out there.

I call bullshit.

You have a good point, as well. I'm just not ready to declare him as a saviour after three games.

smittysbar
11-15-2008, 01:20 AM
Yeah, let's not blame the law firm of SackIntosh and Jones for halftime adjustments.

JFC.

And furthermore, the Chiefs were on the road in the Meadowlands, faced a great defense in Tampa Bay, then would have won the game in San Diego if it weren't for the long snapper.

This team has had some bad luck this year and NONE of that is related to Thigpen.

Sorry, Clay. This article plays to all of the negative Nellies out there.

I call bullshit.

I would have to agree to most of this.








HOLY SHIT.........I know Dane, don't get used to it.

I don't think it is as much him as it is the more conservative approach that the team takes.

I think it was Bowe that dropped a couple passes also that would have netted the 1st down.

Ebolapox
11-15-2008, 01:21 AM
Yeah, let's not blame the law firm of SackIntosh and Jones for halftime adjustments.

JFC.

And furthermore, the Chiefs were on the road in the Meadowlands, faced a great defense in Tampa Bay, then would have won the game in San Diego if it weren't for the long snapper.

This team has had some bad luck this year and NONE of that is related to Thigpen.

Sorry, Clay. This article plays to all of the negative Nellies out there.

I call bullshit.

perhaps we should change goatboy's name to buzz killington

http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/commenter/330000/334066_300.jpg

L.A. Chieffan
11-15-2008, 01:29 AM
Typical Goat. Fall madly deeply in love with Huard when nobody wanted anything to do with him and then rip Thigpen to shreds when it seems there might actually be a QB fans can start getting excited about. Huard wouldn't be able to handle this offense in his wettest dreams.

KCJohnny
11-15-2008, 01:41 AM
If the analysis-by-halves is original to Wendler (which I doubt) then he has done some noteworthy research.

However the last time I checked, QBs don't make halftime adjustments, Coaches/coordinators do. Wendler's numbers for Thigpen in the 2nd half are also skewed by his early season bail outs of Croyle and Huard. In the last 4 games, Thigpen has thrown for 6 TDs, scored 2 more on runs/receptions, has not thrown an INT (!) and accrued a sparkling 101.1 passer rating. In nearly all those contests he had the Chiefs driving down to the opponents goalline in the final minutes.

The spread type formations favor a twitchy back like Faulk or Addai, which in KC would be Savage. That said, LJ could do some damage in the YAC on short receptions. The only rule of the spread is to get the ball into the hands of your playmakers.

The Chiefs should approach the game as if they’re playing 1999 Rams.


BTW Claython, when you were in the 5th grade or so, this very scenario happened against the reigning SB champion StL Rams, and the Chiefs stomped on them 54-34 (2000). The Chiefs were running an offense that favored utilization of the Zebra formation (2 WRs, 2 TEs, 1 RB) which spread one of the TEs out like a WR.

Ebolapox
11-15-2008, 01:43 AM
...when you were in the 5th grade or so...

JFC you're condescending. do you ever tire of being an overbearing asshole?

L.A. Chieffan
11-15-2008, 01:47 AM
JFC you're condescending. do you ever tire of being an overbearing asshole?

Dont use the Lords name in vain, blasphemy.

Ebolapox
11-15-2008, 01:49 AM
Dont use the Lords name in vain, blasphemy.

a good impression. I give you an A- and tell you to kindly get me a piece of pie whilst I suck the beach boys' collective dicks, strum my guitar poorly (like a hippy frat boy wearing abercrombie and fitch and flip flops), and berate those who don't agree with me and claim they're just following the PPL

beach tribe
11-15-2008, 01:53 AM
This is a well written article that is obviously clouded by personal opinion, and not guided by professional objectivity. The scheme is mostly to blame for the second half fall offs.
Claytons dislike for Thigpen leaves him blind to the actual culprits of the pluses, and minuses of the Thigpen project. You consistently choose the wrong horse to ride Clayton. It's way too early to tell whether Thigpen is the guy or not, but he's the only positive surprise the Chiefs have up to this point( save Bradley ) He's a zero risk, High reward feel good story. You should use that to your journalistic advantage, but you would rather him fail, than have to admit, that you MIGHT be wrong about him.

IMO we draft the franchise guy no matter what Thigpen does, assuming that guy is there, so his success will only be a positive. Thigpen should, in no way, alter our draft plans as far as the QB position is concerned.

Deberg_1990
11-15-2008, 02:23 AM
I think Claythan always intentionally takes the opposite approach of popular opinion.

That way he can gloat over a "see, i told ya so. All you fools were wrong" every 1 out of a 1000 times.

Its all caculated.

T-post Tom
11-15-2008, 02:57 AM
"and he’s the next cover boy for Warpaint Illustrated The Magazine."


Forget the "Madden Curse" & the "Sports Illustrated Curse." Thiggy just got the "Egads-the-frogs-of-Egypt-are-upon-us-Warpaint Curse." Expect disaster in 3.2.1...

the Talking Can
11-15-2008, 05:23 AM
Typical Goat. Fall madly deeply in love with Huard when nobody wanted anything to do with him and then rip Thigpen to shreds when it seems there might actually be a QB fans can start getting excited about. Huard wouldn't be able to handle this offense in his wettest dreams.

claythan thinks that Darling is a good player but Thigpen isn't....



and people pay to read it.....ROFL


what a stupid fat virgin

the Talking Can
11-15-2008, 05:25 AM
"No matter how much you might want to believe it, Chan Gailey is not Bill Walsh and Thigpen is not Joe Montana (this is also the year 2008, not 1981)."


and wtf is this stupidity?

MIAdragon
11-15-2008, 05:25 AM
Yeah, let's not blame the law firm of SackIntosh and Jones for halftime adjustments.

JFC.

And furthermore, the Chiefs were on the road in the Meadowlands, faced a great defense in Tampa Bay, then would have won the game in San Diego if it weren't for the long snapper.

This team has had some bad luck this year and NONE of that is related to Thigpen.

Sorry, Clay. This article plays to all of the negative Nellies out there.

I call bullshit.


Add in SEVERAL key dropped passes and I agree 100%

Hog Rider
11-15-2008, 05:34 AM
Whoever thought, that this year, we'd be talking about having a two touchdown lead at halftime,?, against anybody??
:hmmm:

rad
11-15-2008, 08:07 AM
What a horrible, horrible read. I usually like his stuff, too.

Sad but true – in a way, the Chiefs’ new offense is worse than the old one.

LMAO

the Talking Can
11-15-2008, 08:19 AM
What a horrible, horrible read. I usually like his stuff, too.



LMAO

breathtakingly stupid, isn't it?


he values the R2PP...

KC Tattoo
11-15-2008, 08:31 AM
KEEP DOUBTING Thigpen:cuss:





Hey somebody is bound to say it...

JuicesFlowing
11-15-2008, 08:44 AM
Claythan should date Eileen Weir.

Coach
11-15-2008, 08:51 AM
Claythan should date Eileen Weir.

Nah, he needs to start with this one....

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=111777031

Brock
11-15-2008, 09:37 AM
Like we didn't already know he was biased against Thigpen.

KChiefs1
11-15-2008, 10:56 AM
Claythan can write?

Next thing you'll be telling me is that he can read....

Skip Towne
11-15-2008, 11:23 AM
I aways have to check to see if Claythan or Luv wrote these articles.

jidar
11-15-2008, 11:36 AM
This is a well written article that is obviously clouded by personal opinion, and not guided by professional objectivity. The scheme is mostly to blame for the second half fall offs.
Claytons dislike for Thigpen leaves him blind to the actual culprits of the pluses, and minuses of the Thigpen project. You consistently choose the wrong horse to ride Clayton. It's way too early to tell whether Thigpen is the guy or not, but he's the only positive surprise the Chiefs have up to this point( save Bradley ) He's a zero risk, High reward feel good story. You should use that to your journalistic advantage, but you would rather him fail, than have to admit, that you MIGHT be wrong about him.

IMO we draft the franchise guy no matter what Thigpen does, assuming that guy is there, so his success will only be a positive. Thigpen should, in no way, alter our draft plans as far as the QB position is concerned.

Excellent take.

I agree wholeheartedly and thankfully you put it so well I don't have to figure out how to make the post myself.

StcChief
11-15-2008, 11:37 AM
If the analysis-by-halves is original to Wendler (which I doubt) then he has done some noteworthy research.

However the last time I checked, QBs don't make halftime adjustments, Coaches/coordinators do. Wendler's numbers for Thigpen in the 2nd half are also skewed by his early season bail outs of Croyle and Huard. In the last 4 games, Thigpen has thrown for 6 TDs, scored 2 more on runs/receptions, has not thrown an INT (!) and accrued a sparkling 101.1 passer rating. In nearly all those contests he had the Chiefs driving down to the opponents goalline in the final minutes.

The spread type formations favor a twitchy back like Faulk or Addai, which in KC would be Savage. That said, LJ could do some damage in the YAC on short receptions. The only rule of the spread is to get the ball into the hands of your playmakers.



BTW Claython, when you were in the 5th grade or so, this very scenario happened against the reigning SB champion StL Rams, and the Chiefs stomped on them 54-34 (2000). The Chiefs were running an offense that favored utilization of the Zebra formation (2 WRs, 2 TEs, 1 RB) which spread one of the TEs out like a WR.exactly. I was there. when Chiefs were "all over them". Very exacting game.
Kimble Andres run amock....

milkman
11-15-2008, 12:03 PM
Excellent take.

I agree wholeheartedly and thankfully you put it so well I don't have to figure out how to make the post myself.

Would it have been so difficult to make the same post.

I'll put his thoughts in one short sentence.

"Claythan, you're a dumbass."

See, that was easy, wasn't it?

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 07:29 PM
Do you love jesus?

No, jackass, but I've been waiting almost 48 hours to reply to this post, so I'm going to open up on you with both god-killing barrels.

If the analysis-by-halves is original to Wendler (which I doubt) then he has done some noteworthy research.

I do all of my own research. No one has EVER done any research for me. The fact that you doubt it just speaks to your stupid fucking bias. Go fuck yourself you dirtbag "christian."

However the last time I checked, QBs don't make halftime adjustments, Coaches/coordinators do. Then blame your gay lover, Herm.

Wendler's numbers for Thigpen in the 2nd half are also skewed by his early season bail outs of Croyle and Huard.Wrong, jackass. I didn't factor any of Thigpen's numbers from any other games other than his three-game stretch. Grown a brain you fucking jesusite.


BTW Claython, when you were in the 5th grade or so, this very scenario happened against the reigning SB champion StL Rams, and the Chiefs stomped on them 54-34 (2000). No shit, you motherfucking hypocrite. I wrote about that god damn game two weeks ago. By the way, I was in the 11th grade when that fucking game was televised. And I hated jesus.

kstater
11-16-2008, 07:32 PM
LMAO
Welcome back GoChiefs

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 07:41 PM
By the way, props for Thigpen for making a few plays in the second half today.

However, his accuracy is still a major, major weakness. He had Bradley for a touchdown today and made the guy make an insane diving catch instead. He's not good enough. Fire Carl, fire Herm, bring in a new coach and let him pick his quarterback. Thigpen is a fine backup. And he can play in our gimmick spread package as a wrinkle from time to time.

Brock
11-16-2008, 07:45 PM
Basically an Eileen Weir type of article. Poor, shallow analysis.

BigMeatballDave
11-16-2008, 07:51 PM
By the way, props for Thigpen for making a few plays in the second half today.

However, his accuracy is still a major, major weakness. He had Bradley for a touchdown today and made the guy make an insane diving catch instead. He's not good enough. Fire Carl, fire Herm, bring in a new coach and let him pick his quarterback. Thigpen is a fine backup. And he can play in our gimmick spread package as a wrinkle from time to time.You are truely a moron. I suppose you think BC could be doing better than Thig is doing now.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 07:54 PM
You are truely a moron. I suppose you think BC could be doing better than Thig is doing now.

I have no doubt Croyle is more accurate than Thigpen. It's not even close.

But I really don't want to talk about either of them. One can't stay healthy, the other one has a scattershot arm. It's time to move on.

FringeNC
11-16-2008, 07:56 PM
I have no doubt Croyle is more accurate than Thigpen. It's not even close.

But I really don't want to talk about either of them. One can't stay healthy, the other one has a scattershot arm. It's time to move on.

Thigpen is accurate when he has time. His mobility and quick decision making and decent accuracy is how this offense has gone from epic bad to at least average. This offensive turnaround is all Gailey and Thigpen.

milkman
11-16-2008, 07:59 PM
By the way, props for Thigpen for making a few plays in the second half today.

However, his accuracy is still a major, major weakness. He had Bradley for a touchdown today and made the guy make an insane diving catch instead. He's not good enough. Fire Carl, fire Herm, bring in a new coach and let him pick his quarterback. Thigpen is a fine backup. And he can play in our gimmick spread package as a wrinkle from time to time.

When Thigpen sets his feet and follows through he is pretty damn accurate.

However, like most QBs, when making deep throws while on the move, his accuracy takes a hit.

BigMeatballDave
11-16-2008, 07:59 PM
I have no doubt Croyle is more accurate than Thigpen. It's not even close.

But I really don't want to talk about either of them. One can't stay healthy, the other one has a scattershot arm. It's time to move on.Some of his passes aren't perfect, to be sure. Atleast his vagina isn't made of glass. I'll take Thig over an Armor-plated BC.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:00 PM
Thigpen is accurate when he has time.

At times. Other times, not so much. He terribly missed Bradley on a quick out on a third down we badly needed late in the game.

And some of those fade passes were disgusting.

milkman
11-16-2008, 08:01 PM
At times. Other times, not so much. He terribly missed Bradley on a quick out on a third down we badly needed late in the game.

And some of those fade passes were disgusting.

Bradley dropped a crucial third down pass that hit him right in the chest.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:02 PM
Bradley dropped a crucial third down pass that hit him right in the chest.

Bradley could drop more passes with a more accurate QB.

MIAdragon
11-16-2008, 08:03 PM
By the way, props for Thigpen for making a few plays in the second half today.

However, his accuracy is still a major, major weakness. He had Bradley for a touchdown today and made the guy make an insane diving catch instead. He's not good enough. Fire Carl, fire Herm, bring in a new coach and let him pick his quarterback. Thigpen is a fine backup. And he can play in our gimmick spread package as a wrinkle from time to time.

the throw he had to make on the run after being flushed from the pocket? Yea he sucks.

milkman
11-16-2008, 08:04 PM
Bradley could drop more passes with a more accurate QB.

You are really a disingenuous little basement dwelling Oediple pissant, aren't you?

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:06 PM
the throw he had to make on the run after being flushed from the pocket? Yea he sucks.

Well, it wasn't like he was throwing off his back foot. I've seen plenty of quarterbacks throw a decent ball when they're running forward with momentum like that. Bradley saved his ass. And I lost count of the number of times he made Tony go low for a ball.

FringeNC
11-16-2008, 08:06 PM
Chiefs WRs were getting not getting open (according to Len on the radio feed), and the pass protection sucked, yet we still moved the ball. Again, I congratulate Gailey and Thigpen for a respectable offensive showing. Any area of this team that displays competence is rather obvious.

BigMeatballDave
11-16-2008, 08:10 PM
Well, it wasn't like he was throwing off his back foot. I've seen plenty of quarterbacks throw a decent ball when they're running forward with momentum like that. Bradley saved his ass. And I lost count of the number of times he made Tony go low for a ball.You're an assbag. I don't know if Thig is the future here, but his play the last 4 games is as good as we have seen out of a Chiefs QB since Green in '05. Your sexual prowess has far surpassed your football knowledge.

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:14 PM
Oh now you want to talk about Thigpen's accuracy issue? Jesus monkey fucking a football almighty Christ.

Before people starts railing on Thigpen's 50% completion percentage, let me remind ya'll that I believe there was at least 4 passes that were dropped. So let's assume those four passes were caught, which would bring his numbers from

19/38

to

23/38

That's a 10% difference from a 50% to 60%

I also see major improvements on his overall game, and his biggest problem was that his passes tend to sail over the receivers head by 8 ft in the air. Remember the Atlanta and Oakland game where he overthrew his receivers by 8 feet? Even a simple quick out pass to the receiver, the receiver would have no chance to catch it as it would have been sailing up to the upper deck.

That is no longer the issue.

And as it has been mentioned on here, the receivers were not getting any seperation from the secondary, and as usual, the pass-protection was shitty, as usual.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:15 PM
You're an assbag. I don't know if Thig is the future here, but his play the last 4 games is as good as we have seen out of a Chiefs QB since Green in '05.

I won't deny that he's improved. He's played fairly well. But it's obvious he's not the answer.

milkman
11-16-2008, 08:17 PM
You're an assbag. I don't know if Thig is the future here, but his play the last 4 games is as good as we have seen out of a Chiefs QB since Green in '05. Your sexual prowess has far surpassed your football knowledge.

This would be funny, if it wasn't true.


Wait.....It's still funny.

LMAO

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:17 PM
I won't deny that he's improved. He's played fairly well. But it's obvious he's not the answer.

In 4 games, you won't know the answer. To fairly judge a QB's future, one must go through a season and half. A season is acceptable, but most perfer a season and half, IMHO.

But he is what Brokie Croyle should have been doing in the first place, that is to show some improvement in some areas. He has shown us alot of improvements in his game, and let keep reminding us that he's only 24, and was only a 7th round pick, out of a small college nobody even heard of.

He still has tremendous potentional, IMHO.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:19 PM
In 4 games, you won't know the answer. To fairly judge a QB's future, one must go through a season and half. A season is acceptable, but most perfer a season and half, IMHO.

Well, I don't see him magically becoming a consistently accurate passer. Maybe you do. I hope he does. I also hope we have another option at quarterback next year.

The Bad Guy
11-16-2008, 08:21 PM
I won't deny that he's improved. He's played fairly well. But it's obvious he's not the answer.

Obvious to who?

The person who proclaimed Devard Darling would be good? Damon Huard?

I'd rather rely on my grandmother's blind dog for talent evaluations than you.

kstater
11-16-2008, 08:22 PM
Another thing to look at with Thigpen is the time spent with the recievers. At most, he's spent 6 weeks with these guys. He was the 3rd stringer throwing to guys off the street in preseason, while most other QB's have had a lot more time to work on the timing and nuances of each reciever.

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:29 PM
Well, I don't see him magically becoming a consistently accurate passer. Maybe you do. I hope he does. I also hope we have another option at quarterback next year.

Well, let's remind ourselves how bad he was during the Oakland and Atlanta games. He hardly even cracked the 50% barrier during those games. Also his footwork was just awful, as every time he threw the ball, the ball would have sailed over 8 feet over the receivers head.

The last 4 games, he has been at 50% or better. It's improvement. His decision making has improved. There's always still areas that he gotta get better, but remember, he's just 24 years old. And this is his 6th NFL game. He has lead the Chiefs several chances to win the last 4 games, and if the Chiefs had any kind of a defense, like Pittsburgh or Tennessee, they could be 2-2 or 3-1 in the last 4 games.

Remember, Rome wasn't built overnight.

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:31 PM
Another thing to look at with Thigpen is the time spent with the recievers. At most, he's spent 6 weeks with these guys. He was the 3rd stringer throwing to guys off the street in preseason, while most other QB's have had a lot more time to work on the timing and nuances of each reciever.

Excellent point. Remember how bad his timing was with the receivers during the Oakland and Atlanta games? Other than his inaccuracy during those games, his timing with the receivers was not up to date during those games.

When he threw that perfect slant pass to Bowe in the middle during the Jets game, I knew he got the timing down now, because Bowe didn't break stride on that throw. And so far, he has gotten the timing down with the receivers thus far.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 08:33 PM
Well, let's remind ourselves how bad he was during the Oakland and Atlanta games. He hardly even cracked the 50% barrier during those games. Also his footwork was just awful, as every time he threw the ball, the ball would have sailed over 8 feet over the receivers head.

The last 4 games, he has been at 50% or better. It's improvement. His decision making has improved. There's always still areas that he gotta get better, but remember, he's just 24 years old. And this is his 6th NFL game. He has lead the Chiefs several chances to win the last 4 games, and if the Chiefs had any kind of a defense, like Pittsburgh or Tennessee, they could be 2-2 or 3-1 in the last 4 games.

Remember, Rome wasn't built overnight.

He's good enough to win games during the regular season, I agree. But I want a quarterback who's good enough to go toe-to-toe with Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs. I don't see him as that guy.

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:34 PM
He's good enough to win games during the regular season, I agree. But I want a quarterback who's good enough to go toe-to-toe with Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs. I don't see him as that guy.

Personally, I don't care much for him to be going toe-to-toe with Peyton Manning and Tom Brady, because he doesn't play defense.

You want someone to go toe-to-toe with those two guys? Then get a middle linebacker and/or a DE, then we'll talk.

The Bad Guy
11-16-2008, 08:52 PM
He's good enough to win games during the regular season, I agree. But I want a quarterback who's good enough to go toe-to-toe with Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs. I don't see him as that guy.

It's nice that your criteria is going toe-for-toe with 2 of the best QBs of all-time.

But judging this guy using said criteria is probably the dumbest fucking thing next to Zouk, Chiefzilla and any other Herm supporter.

He could be a really good QB who wins in the playoffs. The only way to find that out is time.

Coach
11-16-2008, 08:59 PM
It's nice that your criteria is going toe-for-toe with 2 of the best QBs of all-time.

But judging this guy using said criteria is probably the dumbest fucking thing next to Zouk, Chiefzilla and any other Herm supporter.

He could be a really good QB who wins in the playoffs. The only way to find that out is time.

And the way he has been playing, I don't have any problem giving him time. He just need some improvement on the right side of the O-line and a running game.

Tribal Warfare
11-16-2008, 09:30 PM
At times. Other times, not so much. He terribly missed Bradley on a quick out on a third down we badly needed late in the game.

And some of those fade passes were disgusting.

I said this before 1st half he plays good/great, but in the 2nd half he plays very average due to him tightening up.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 09:32 PM
I said this before 1st half he plays good/great, but in the 2nd half he plays very average due to him tightening up.

He was terrible in the 2nd half. 9 for 22. Just terrible.

greg63
11-16-2008, 10:49 PM
By the way, props for Thigpen for making a few plays in the second half today.

However, his accuracy is still a major, major weakness. He had Bradley for a touchdown today and made the guy make an insane diving catch instead. He's not good enough. Fire Carl, fire Herm, bring in a new coach and let him pick his quarterback. Thigpen is a fine backup. And he can play in our gimmick spread package as a wrinkle from time to time.

I actually agree with you on something.


...I feel so dirty.

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 10:54 PM
I have no doubt Croyle is more accurate than Thigpen. It's not even close.

But I really don't want to talk about either of them. One can't stay healthy, the other one has a scattershot arm. It's time to move on.

Thigpen missed two or three throws today...the Bradley one was a tough throw on the run...not many QB's would even have the ability to be in the position to make that throw...the throw he made to Franklin on the run where he totally improvised everything was one of the best throws I've ever seen from a Chiefs QB, period.

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 10:55 PM
At times. Other times, not so much. He terribly missed Bradley on a quick out on a third down we badly needed late in the game.

And some of those fade passes were disgusting.

????

He barely missed Bradley...it wasn't a terrible pass.

And he threw a PERFECT pass to Bowe that landed a yard in front of him perfectly placed on the sideline today...and he gave Bowe several opportunities to make big plays for him...Bowe is good, a legit #1 WR IMO...but Randy Moss = a 4 TD game with the throws Thiggy was making.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 10:57 PM
Thigpen missed two or three throws today...the Bradley one was a tough throw on the run...not many QB's would even have the ability to be in the position to make that throw...the throw he made to Franklin on the run where he totally improvised everything was one of the best throws I've ever seen from a Chiefs QB, period.

That was a terrible throw, too.

Your vantage point at the stadium must have been shit.

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 10:57 PM
He was terrible in the 2nd half. 9 for 22. Just terrible.

Nah. He wasn't terrible...I was at the game. His numbers are far worse than he actually played...4 or 5 dropped balls...3 balls Bowe COULD have caught if he was the superstar I think he'll turn out to be...plus a lot of the playcalling was sketchy today...especially goal to go.

Thigpen was good today. Another solid performance...he's easily our MVP thus far.

Silock
11-16-2008, 10:57 PM
He's good enough to win games during the regular season, I agree. But I want a quarterback who's good enough to go toe-to-toe with Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in the playoffs. I don't see him as that guy.

Yeah, because Manning looked so great in his first season starting, too.

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 10:58 PM
That was a terrible throw, too.

Your vantage point at the stadium must have been shit.

that throw landed right in front of me...it wasn't a bad throw...D Bowe can't get any separation...he isn't a deep threat. That ball was perfectly placed...D Bowe was a step slow.

Bowe is a great possession receiver...thank god we have Bradley to spread the field.

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 10:58 PM
Nah. He wasn't terrible...I was at the game. His numbers are far worse than he actually played...4 or 5 dropped balls...3 balls Bowe COULD have caught if he was the superstar I think he'll turn out to be...plus a lot of the playcalling was sketchy today...especially goal to go.

Thigpen was good today. Another solid performance...he's easily our MVP thus far.

You jump in the sack with just about anyone who throws a touchdown pass, don't you?

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 11:00 PM
that throw landed right in front of me...it wasn't a bad throw...D Bowe can't get any separation...he isn't a deep threat. That ball was perfectly placed...D Bowe was a step slow.

Bowe is a great possession receiver...thank god we have Bradley to spread the field.

The throws to Bradley and Franklin were shit. He was bailed out.

The throw to Bowe was overthrown. But blame Bowe for being slow. Don't blame the quarterback for overthrowing him. Makes sense.

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 11:01 PM
You jump in the sack with just about anyone who throws a touchdown pass, don't you?

Thigpen is the best QB we've had since Vermeil's last year...hands down.

He can run, he can throw, and he's a gamer.

He has top 10 natural ability...he's a 2nd year guy and a 1st time starter and he is playing as good as any QB in the NFL right now...he can run, he can make any throw...and he made plays from behind center today as well...

This guy has a TON of potential...every week we expand our offense for him, as well...

This guy gives me a reason to watch on Sunday's...

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 11:02 PM
The throws to Bradley and Franklin were shit. He was bailed out.

The throw to Bowe was overthrown. But blame Bowe for being slow. Don't blame the quarterback for overthrowing him. Makes sense.

The throw to Franklin was shit? Are you kidding me?

Count Alex's Losses
11-16-2008, 11:03 PM
The throw to Franklin was shit? Are you kidding me?

Franklin had to go down for the ball.

Much like you are going down on Thigpen.

boogblaster
11-16-2008, 11:07 PM
Thiggy had a good day not great ... Some were under-thrown some were to high .. But considering where he came from and the task he's been handed, he's done pretty well ...

Short Leash Hootie
11-16-2008, 11:17 PM
Franklin had to go down for the ball.

Much like you are going down on Thigpen.

You're ridiculous. He was on the run with defenders in his face...and he improvised the throw...it was a great play by both Tyler and Will.

Fruit Ninja
11-16-2008, 11:29 PM
Thigpen is doing fine. They finally let him go deep today on more then 1 or 2 occasions. I like that. He still getting a feel for the game. He's not making stupid mistakes. He's actually playing like a veteran back there. As time goes by, he's going to be making 15-20 yard passes. With how bad the right side of our Oline is, its just not possible to do it constantly. Suckintosh is so bad and the coaches know it. This is The ONLY way the Chiefs can move the ball right now.

I am getting Thigpen an A for effort and about a B for execution right now. He is the ONLY reason why we are even moving the ball.

Fruit Ninja
11-16-2008, 11:31 PM
The throw to Franklin was shit? Are you kidding me?

He has always had an agenda against Franklin. That throw he made was a big time throw. Was it low? sure, but you know what, it was in a spot where only he can catch it. I am fine with that. As long as its not misthrown so bad that he throws an interception. Its ok. A fine example of a horrible throw into coverage was the Brees' interception. That was a bad pass and abad read.

Thigpen is no Brady or Peyton, but he's learning and getting better and more confident at the weeks go by. Thats is honestly all we can ask for.