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View Full Version : Chiefs Playing for a draft pick


luv
11-17-2008, 09:12 AM
Yes or no? Feel free to give reasoning below.

Poll to follow.

ElGringo
11-17-2008, 09:17 AM
I vote no because I never believe my favorite team should play to lose a game. On the other hand, the way Herm is running things, if you believe he can even carry a coaches jock strap, you have to believe that is what he is doing. Nothing but bonehead decisions in the past 2 weeks, seems like he is trying to find ways to lose games.

Dave Lane
11-17-2008, 09:22 AM
If we get to week 15 maybe. Herm pretty much does that anyway :)

the Talking Can
11-17-2008, 09:31 AM
i don't why we lose, just that we do...so far, so good

Dr. Facebook Fever
11-17-2008, 09:34 AM
I've actually wondered lately if Herm is trying to lose for draft picks now. I have a hard time believing an NFL coach would do that.... but I just have to wonder given his erratic descision making... and I think that just the fact that I... and I'm sure others are giving the idea some actual though... is really, really sad.

I wonder if Herm and Carl have an agreement between them that if the game is close and since we aren't going anywhere this season... if he actually tries to tank. I don't know. I hope it's not the case. I think that would be tragic for the players. But if it's not the case then Herm is truly a worthless pos as a coach.

Come to think of it.... if it is the case Herm is truly a worthless pos as a coach.

Guru
11-17-2008, 09:37 AM
I want to win every week. I just don't mind the losses this year. So, no, you don't lose just to lose.

TommyHawk69
11-17-2008, 09:39 AM
I don't think we are, but I could not help but get excited when the lions were leading on sunday. It would be our only chance at Stafford.

StcChief
11-17-2008, 09:45 AM
we will get one more W. some way some how and miss out on a QBOF, that's what a :loser: does. Ask Fatlock

luv
11-17-2008, 09:51 AM
At some point, progress constitutes wins. It has to. I was under the impression that a lot of people on here would be pissed off if that happened.

BigRedChief
11-17-2008, 09:52 AM
You play to win the game.

NFL coach from you tube

King_Chief_Fan
11-17-2008, 10:00 AM
I've actually wondered lately if Herm is trying to lose for draft picks now. I have a hard time believing an NFL coach would do that.... but I just have to wonder given his erratic descision making... and I think that just the fact that I... and I'm sure others are giving the idea some actual though... is really, really sad.

I wonder if Herm and Carl have an agreement between them that if the game is close and since we aren't going anywhere this season... if he actually tries to tank. I don't know. I hope it's not the case. I think that would be tragic for the players. But if it's not the case then Herm is truly a worthless pos as a coach.

Come to think of it.... if it is the case Herm is truly a worthless pos as a coach.

you will never get me to believe that he didn't tank last year's Jets game on purpose.

Jilly
11-17-2008, 10:10 AM
hey how'd the watch party go? Any drunken pictures?

Bearcat
11-17-2008, 10:16 AM
At some point, progress constitutes wins. It has to. I was under the impression that a lot of people on here would be pissed off if that happened.

If Herm kept his job only because he won the last few games, and everyone at Arrowhead spun it like it's huge momentum for next year, etc; I'd be a little upset. The Clown needs to go.

As far as draft position, I think we should play to win. It takes away from the integrity of the game knowing a team might have a two game advantage for the last playoff spot because they're in the same division as a team that's tanking games. They already get to play us twice, we shouldn't just hand them the games.

Plus, like others have said, we don't need to tank games intentionally... Herm can be relied on to find new and exciting ways to lose each week. You can't fix stupid.

luv
11-17-2008, 10:16 AM
hey how'd the watch party go? Any drunken pictures?

It was fun. Met CrazyCoffey, his girlfriend, Dunit35, and a couple of his friends. We went to Ernie Biggs afterwards. No pictures, but we had a great time. Cool people.

Reerun_KC
11-17-2008, 10:18 AM
Herm isnt smart enough to do that....

Where are all the Herm supporters at today?

Sure-Oz
11-17-2008, 10:24 AM
I want them to keep losing, but i want them to keep trying to win, either way herm should fuck it up

luv
11-17-2008, 10:25 AM
If Herm kept his job only because he won the last few games, and everyone at Arrowhead spun it like it's huge momentum for next year, etc; I'd be a little upset. The Clown needs to go.

As far as draft position, I think we should play to win. It takes away from the integrity of the game knowing a team might have a two game advantage for the last playoff spot because they're in the same division as a team that's tanking games. They already get to play us twice, we shouldn't just hand them the games.

Plus, like others have said, we don't need to tank games intentionally... Herm can be relied on to find new and exciting ways to lose each week. You can't fix stupid.

Yes. I understand all that. I don't want to know if people think that's what Herm is doing. I want to know whether we feel we should. As I said, I think there are people on here who rejoice when we lose. Besides, if Herm is the clown we think he is, what's to say he won't completely screw up on the draft pick? Besides, nothing will be with Herm until something is done with Carl, and I don't think that will be this year.

luv
11-17-2008, 10:27 AM
I want them to keep losing, but i want them to keep trying to win, either way herm should **** it up

What is the point in improving if you don't win? Try to win, but not win?

Extra Point
11-17-2008, 10:54 AM
We're playing for the draft, regardless.

Mr. Laz
11-17-2008, 10:57 AM
2 completely different things here


1. players playing for a draft pick - absolutely not

2. fans hoping for the a draft pick - sure, why not

OnTheWarpath58
11-17-2008, 11:02 AM
Put me firmly in the camp of "where they pick is where they pick."

If they win a few games and pick 6-10, so be it.

If they lose out and pick 2, so be it.

Regardless, this team is going to have the opportunity to pick an impact player at a position of need, so it's all good to me.

rambleonthruthefog
11-17-2008, 11:30 AM
if you said yes, you are and probably will always be a b*tch.

suds79
11-17-2008, 11:43 AM
Playing for a draft pick is more than just the pick.

If the Chiefs win, it only reassures Clark that Herm deserves another year.

If we go 1-15, I can't see how anybody could possibly bring Herm back and I think he'd be gone.

I'm already assuming that Carl is gone.

Do I get up and actively root against the Chiefs? No. But am I heartbroken when they lose? No. I want Herm gone so this team can get back to winning sooner rather than later. It's looking at the big picture thing for me.

End the end, it doesn't matter what we want to happen on Sundays. Pulling for them or not, it won't change the outcome so it really doesn't matter.

chiefsngop
11-17-2008, 12:19 PM
I could never ever cheer against the Chiefs or be happy when the lose, especially at beloved Arrowhead. Can I be happy when Detroit wins ? Sure.

And we're so bad this year anyway, that I really don't feel there's much risk of us winning enough games to take us out of high draft pick contention regardless.

I worry about the mental impact of losing all these games on our young guys as it is, we're running the risk of them developing a "losing mentality". I definetly don't want to instill a "lose on purpose" mentality on these youngsters.

It's also important to remember, that if these players weren't the type of people that push themselves towards success through struggles, pain, and adversity they would never have made it to the NFL level.

Some of you can hope they lose, but don't be surprised if these kids who have worked their asses off their whole life to make it to this league, don't agree with you.

Saulbadguy
11-17-2008, 12:33 PM
2 completely different things here


1. players playing for a draft pick - absolutely not

2. fans hoping for the a draft pick - sure, why not

Agreed. It would be sickening to think that the coaches, and players would play for a draft pick.

Not so much for the fans to hope for it, though.

luv
11-17-2008, 12:52 PM
Playing for a draft pick is more than just the pick.

If the Chiefs win, it only reassures Clark that Herm deserves another year.

If we go 1-15, I can't see how anybody could possibly bring Herm back and I think he'd be gone.

I'm already assuming that Carl is gone.

Do I get up and actively root against the Chiefs? No. But am I heartbroken when they lose? No. I want Herm gone so this team can get back to winning sooner rather than later. It's looking at the big picture thing for me.

End the end, it doesn't matter what we want to happen on Sundays. Pulling for them or not, it won't change the outcome so it really doesn't matter.

You really think Carl is gone after this year whenever his contract is up after next year?

I just can't see having these guys improve without winning. I agree with OTWP. GO CHIEFS!

Mecca
11-17-2008, 12:53 PM
I'd rather have the higher pick than win some meaningless games....and the impact player at 11 is not remotely the same as the one at 3.

luv
11-17-2008, 12:54 PM
I'd rather have the higher pick than win some meaningless games....and the impact player at 11 is not remotely the same as the one at 3.

I'm sure winning is so meaningless to the guys on the team.

Mecca
11-17-2008, 12:55 PM
I'm sure winning is so meaningless to the guys on the team.

How many guys on this team are even important to the future of the team? 15 at most?

And players never want high draft picks because those guys may come to take their job.

Saulbadguy
11-17-2008, 12:56 PM
I'd rather have the higher pick than win some meaningless games....and the impact player at 11 is not remotely the same as the one at 3.

What many of us, as fans, don't understand is the culture of losing.

Mecca
11-17-2008, 01:00 PM
What many of us, as fans, don't understand is the culture of losing.

That just comes up with Herm, they'll have to get a whole new front office and staff to change that, which the Chiefs don't really seem to care about.

luv
11-17-2008, 01:00 PM
How many guys on this team are even important to the future of the team? 15 at most?

And players never want high draft picks because those guys may come to take their job.

None, if they don't win.

Mecca
11-17-2008, 01:02 PM
None, if they don't win.

They aren't getting rid of the entire team even if they go 1-15 followed with 0-16.

You know it's possible for some guys to be fine players and still lose.

But yes most of the team needs to be replaced anyway.

DaneMcCloud
11-17-2008, 01:06 PM
How many guys on this team are even important to the future of the team? 15 at most?

I'll take a stab at this:

Albert
Waters
Niswanger
Charles
Bowe
Bradley
Franklin
Thigpen
Taylor
McBride
Hali
Tyler
DJ
Flowers
Morgan
Page
Pollard

I've got 17. And out of those 17 guys, I'd bet most of them just want to compete in each and every game. A win would be nice but if they really want to improve, they all should know that the highest draft pick possible will help them in the future.

This season's lost as far as W's & L'S.

Mecca
11-17-2008, 01:08 PM
If some of those guys are on the team in the future that is expected to be good it better be as backups because they'll never be good with some of those guys starting.

luv
11-17-2008, 01:12 PM
I realize rebuilding comes with losing games. I just think that it's pointless to expect to see improvement without winning, especially against other bad teams. I see no point in playing for a draft pick. I'd rather not see all of our rookies think that improving means nothing. If Herm is back next year, are we still supposed to want them to lose?

Mecca
11-17-2008, 01:14 PM
We'll never win shit with Herm anyway so that's a bit of a difficult question to ask.

This team needs a big house cleaning, really they need a new front office and a new staff full of people that have never been here before.

DaneMcCloud
11-17-2008, 01:17 PM
If some of those guys are on the team in the future that is expected to be good it better be as backups because they'll never be good with some of those guys starting.

Out of those 17 I listed, I assume you're referring to Niswanger, Page, Pollard and Hali.

That still leaves 13 starters (well, 12 if you subtract Waters, who probably won't be around for too long).

Which is exactly why the Chiefs are losing games. They only have 14 guys (including Gonzalez) out of 22 that have any business starting on an NFL team.

1-15.

DaneMcCloud
11-17-2008, 01:18 PM
We'll never win shit with Herm anyway so that's a bit of a difficult question to ask.

This team needs a big house cleaning, really they need a new front office and a new staff full of people that have never been here before.

I think that would require an owner that actually gave a shit.

POND_OF_RED
11-17-2008, 01:20 PM
The draft pick is all we have left to play for. If we lose that than we're just losers all around.

Mecca
11-17-2008, 01:20 PM
I think that would require an owner that actually gave a shit.

Why inspires the question why do we give a shit?

Otis99
11-17-2008, 02:05 PM
It's week 12. Why throw the rest of the season away now, just to get a top draft pick? Who would want to play for a team that intentionally lost its last SIX games? As a player on the roster right now, today - how are you supposed to grow and develop when the coaching staff has basically asked you to intentionally lose?

If it were week 17, and we were playing Detroit, and both them and us were interested in the same prospect at the top of the draft, and it was tied late in the 4th quarter, and they had the ball, then maybe I could see letting someone miss a tackle or two.

But damn, not with over 1/4 of a season left!

This entire discussion is predicated on the belief (that some people have) that a single top prospect in the draft is the one player that will turn this franchise around.

If we wind up, due to our own ineptitude, of finishing the season 1-15, I severely doubt we are going to turn things around that quickly. If anything, I would be depressed that our rebuilding season did not bear any fruit.

Sure-Oz
11-17-2008, 02:06 PM
What is the point in improving if you don't win? Try to win, but not win?

You improve your play, adn barely lose, ill take that....these wins are meaningless

KCChiefsMan
11-17-2008, 02:23 PM
damned if we do, damned if we don't

Chief Faithful
11-17-2008, 02:29 PM
The team is not good enough right now to worry about it. Play for the win.

BryanBusby
11-17-2008, 02:39 PM
I don't think the Chiefs are playing for draft positioning as the number 1 overall pick has a lot of risk built in with the contract the pick will receive. The young Chiefs team would benefit more from being able to experience a win.

Sure-Oz
11-17-2008, 02:42 PM
I don't think the Chiefs are playing for draft positioning as the number 1 overall pick has a lot of risk built in with the contract the pick will receive. The young Chiefs team would benefit more from being able to experience a win.

What's your first snow prediction for KC this year?

the Talking Can
11-17-2008, 02:49 PM
I'd rather have the higher pick than win some meaningless games....and the impact player at 11 is not remotely the same as the one at 3.

I'm sure the spurs regret tanking the season to get Duncan...or Houston tanking for Olajuwon...

luv
11-17-2008, 02:53 PM
I don't think the Chiefs are playing for draft positioning as the number 1 overall pick has a lot of risk built in with the contract the pick will receive. The young Chiefs team would benefit more from being able to experience a win.

And Carl would not be willing to pay a #1 the amount that the player's agent feels he deserves, thus he would sit out until they could come to an agreement.

BryanBusby
11-17-2008, 03:09 PM
What's your first snow prediction for KC this year?
Early December, which is when (insert your favorite TV show here) will be interrupted for wall to wall coverage of the epic inch the metro will receive!

And Carl would not be willing to pay a #1 the amount that the player's agent feels he deserves, thus he would sit out until they could come to an agreement.
Which gives the Chiefs more reason to win. The higher the pick, the more likely Carl will **** it up.

Mr. Laz
11-17-2008, 03:26 PM
I'll take a stab at this:

Albert
Waters
Niswanger
Charles
Bowe
Bradley
Franklin
Thigpen
Taylor
McBride
Hali
Tyler
DJ
Flowers
Morgan
Page
Pollard

I've got 17. And out of those 17 guys, I'd bet most of them just want to compete in each and every game. A win would be nice but if they really want to improve, they all should know that the highest draft pick possible will help them in the future.

This season's lost as far as W's & L'S.
meh .... niswanger and hali are a weakness a completely crappy team. how important can they be?

Franklin can't even crack the starting lineUp on a crappy team?

Herb taylor maybe ..... bUt the right side of oUr offensive line sUcks and Herm still isn't in there.

can this be the coaching ... sUre bUt still.


sorry for the keyboard of doom for the letter U :shake:

King_Chief_Fan
11-17-2008, 03:45 PM
I know of a coach that claims

"you play to win the game.....Hello?...I don't care if you don't have any wins, you play to win the game."

Dr. Facebook Fever
11-17-2008, 03:50 PM
I know of a coach that claims

"you play to win the game.....Hello?...I don't care if you don't have any wins, you play to win the game."


So either...

A. Herm should get into politics with that kind of lying
or
B. Herm doesn't know how to win the game