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View Full Version : Chiefs Big surprise...Shefter wrong.... (again)


SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 08:16 AM
Reading the article in this morning's paper pointed out something.

"Edwards is not free to make any staff changes, and the assistants were, at least until recently, not free to look for other jobs. But the Chiefs granted Houstonís request to interview secondary coach David Gibbs."

Hmm... not free to look for other jobs. So, the whole rumor about Herm and the organization telling them to go out and find other employment is total BS.

Why am I not surprised. What a clown.

Brock
01-13-2009, 08:18 AM
when did Schefter say that?

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 08:24 AM
when did Schefter say that?

About three weeks ago. He's a tool. I have no doubt that he has 'sources'... but he tends to run with things based on one 'source' and the reality is that even insiders sometimes get the wrong impression of a situation.

If the Chiefs were set on firing Herm, then they should be letting these guys go look for jobs. Frankly, the fact that they are specifically restricting them from interviewing makes me nervous.

I really thought the Cincy game was enough to get Herm canned. Up until that point, I really thought Hunt liked him too much, and that he would be back. But, after that game... I thought we would actually get a new coach.

Now, the time table for a new GM is the Super Bowl. All of the college all star games will have occured. Many coaches will be off the market.

Hmmm. We might just have to stick with ol' Herm another year out of prudence.

If Herm is gone, I don't understand not letting the staff interview for other positions.

DaKCMan AP
01-13-2009, 08:34 AM
Now, the time table for a new GM is the Super Bowl. All of the college all star games will have occured. Many coaches will be off the market.

Hmmm. We might just have to stick with ol' Herm another year out of prudence.

I don't buy that crap. Sure, it's nice for your coach to be at the senior bowl or the east/west shrine game, etc. But the reality is that the majority of the information gathered to create a draft board is from the team's scouts/scouting service. This information has been gathered all year and over multiple years and the coaching staff doesn't realistically have the time to contribute to that.

Chiefnj2
01-13-2009, 08:39 AM
I don't buy that crap. Sure, it's nice for your coach to be at the senior bowl or the east/west shrine game, etc. But the reality is that the majority of the information gathered to create a draft board is from the team's scouts/scouting service. This information has been gathered all year and over multiple years and the coaching staff doesn't realistically have the time to contribute to that.

I don't agree with what your saying. Scouts have to know what the new coach and GM are looking for in players and what type of system they will run. The Eagles, Pats and Steelers and Colts get players that fit the mold of what the coach wants and the system they run. I think it is very important for the GM, coach and scouts to be on the same page and to watch the senior bowl practices and see which players fit their scheme, which players are picking up new coaching techniques and are coachable, etc.

MGRS13
01-13-2009, 08:43 AM
In don't know why every one is acting so surprised. Clark loves Herm. If he has to shoot down Pioli to keep Herm He's seems to be proving that he will. Once again we will end up with the bucs reject and Herm will be head coach.(You can take your sources that say Dominik is out of the running and shove them up your ass) So far every "source" in this whole thing has been wrong. Clark is screwing the pooch.

chiefforlife
01-13-2009, 08:45 AM
The organization has been less than forth coming with information. I wouldnt be surprised if Shefter was right all along. The only assistant coach anyone would want, is interviewing in Houston. Why would they allow, only their best coach to go elsewhere?

FringeNC
01-13-2009, 08:52 AM
On the other hand, we just let Gibbs interview for a job. I have a feeling that anyone who wants to get an interview will be allowed one. I think Shefter is effectivey right. These guys are still under contract, and will get paid, but the Chiefs aren't going to stand in there way of getting another job. Perhaps Gailey would be an exception.

the Talking Can
01-13-2009, 08:55 AM
In don't know why every one is acting so surprised. Clark loves Herm. If he has to shoot down Pioli to keep Herm He's seems to be proving that he will. Once again we will end up with the bucs reject and Herm will be head coach.(You can take your sources that say Dominik is out of the running and shove them up your ass) So far every "source" in this whole thing has been wrong. Clark is screwing the pooch.

you have no idea what is going on....literally....you know absolutely nothing, like the rest of us

DaKCMan AP
01-13-2009, 08:59 AM
I don't agree with what your saying. Scouts have to know what the new coach and GM are looking for in players and what type of system they will run. The Eagles, Pats and Steelers and Colts get players that fit the mold of what the coach wants and the system they run. I think it is very important for the GM, coach and scouts to be on the same page and to watch the senior bowl practices and see which players fit their scheme, which players are picking up new coaching techniques and are coachable, etc.

A scout can only evaluate players based upon a single scheme? :spock: Sure, it can help in identifying which players to get further in-depth information. However, the scouts should have information on a ton of players and if you're looking to fill a certain scheme or system suggest which player best fits that criteria.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 09:06 AM
In don't know why every one is acting so surprised. Clark loves Herm. If he has to shoot down Pioli to keep Herm He's seems to be proving that he will. Once again we will end up with the bucs reject and Herm will be head coach.(You can take your sources that say Dominik is out of the running and shove them up your ass) So far every "source" in this whole thing has been wrong. Clark is screwing the pooch.


It certainly feels that way. I said that Herm would be back before the Cincy game. But, I really felt like the Cincy game would be enough to change that.

I think Clark is looking for a GM that will retain Herm, and it is probably a hard sell.

I think the Chiefs were planning all along for CP to resign after this year. However, I think the Chiefs also planned on promoting Kuharich until this year went so poorly.

Now, I think they are looking for a fresh perspective, but also to save face a little with the fans. And, in the end, it will not suprise me to see Herm on the sidelines next year.

I have to believe that Herm will be let go.... but the longer it drags on... the more I worry.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 09:10 AM
The organization has been less than forth coming with information. I wouldnt be surprised if Shefter was right all along. The only assistant coach anyone would want, is interviewing in Houston. Why would they allow, only their best coach to go elsewhere?

BS. Chan Gailey would have a ton of interviews. Price would have some interest and even the offensive line coach could get an interview or two.

Gibbs has history with Kubiak.

There are very few coaches on the Chiefs roster that won't have a job somewhere if they choose after the Chiefs release them.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 09:12 AM
On the other hand, we just let Gibbs interview for a job. I have a feeling that anyone who wants to get an interview will be allowed one. I think Shefter is effectivey right. These guys are still under contract, and will get paid, but the Chiefs aren't going to stand in there way of getting another job. Perhaps Gailey would be an exception.

I disagree. I think the Chiefs have prevented the coaches from interviewing. Price and Gailey will be hot commodities if they hit the open market before staffs are filled out.

FringeNC
01-13-2009, 09:15 AM
I disagree. I think the Chiefs have prevented the coaches from interviewing. Price and Gailey will be hot commodities if they hit the open market before staffs are filled out.

Too bad the NFL doesn't allow compensation for coaches anymore. Just think what Gunther and Krumrie could fetch?

Zouk
01-13-2009, 09:19 AM
Why am I not surprised. What a clown.

Schefter is most definitely not a clown, and his original report was almost certainly correct. Just because a team doesn't officially let coaches interview doesn't mean that Herm hasn't told them informally that they can work up contingency plans through back channels on the hush hush. I'm convinced Herm has his own backup job lined up with the Bears, for example.

As for Gibbs, I think he's interviewing for a job with an assistant head coach label (not sure on that though). Kubiak wanted him as his defensive coordinator when he first got hired, but Gibbs wanted to be in KC to be close to his wife's family and becuase of his relationship with Gunther. But now his father works in Houston so things might have changed.

crazycoffey
01-13-2009, 09:21 AM
Big Surprise!
This thread is.
Just look at it's creator.....

raybec 4
01-13-2009, 09:25 AM
Weren't you the one arguing that Herm's staff needed to be retained because they had been chosen to caoach the Senior Bowl and could get a leg up on evaluating the talent coming out? What happened to that....or did you hear it from Adam Shefter?

MGRS13
01-13-2009, 09:45 AM
you have no idea what is going on....literally....you know absolutely nothing, like the rest of us
Well I do know that Clark wants to keep Herm, it has been reported over andd over again. Although he has said he would hire a GM who would replace him I don't think he really wants to do it. So Clark is either.......
A. cheap and doesn't want to pay Herm the remainder of his contract or
B. A complete and total idiot.
Either way he is giving me no reason to have any faith in him.

Brock
01-13-2009, 09:46 AM
He has to pay Herm either way, so I don't know what that has to do with anything.

MGRS13
01-13-2009, 10:13 AM
He has to pay Herm either way, so I don't know what that has to do with anything.
But he has to pay Herm for nothing if he fires him.

raybec 4
01-13-2009, 10:28 AM
But he has to pay Herm for nothing if he fires him.

From what we've seen the past three years, he's been paying Herm for nothing.

Brock
01-13-2009, 10:33 AM
From what we've seen the past three years, he's been paying Herm for nothing.

Yes.

Mr. Laz
01-13-2009, 10:35 AM
Big surprise ... SensibleChiefsfan, (not) so Sensible.

MGRS13
01-13-2009, 10:36 AM
From what we've seen the past three years, he's been paying Herm for nothing.
But, but, he's a REALLY nice guy. Right?

smittysbar
01-13-2009, 10:52 AM
Big surprise ... SensibleChiefsfan, (not) so Sensible.

:clap:

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 10:54 AM
Too bad the NFL doesn't allow compensation for coaches anymore. Just think what Gunther and Krumrie could fetch?

Perhaps Gunther if a team was looking for a linebacker's coach. LOL.

beach tribe
01-13-2009, 10:56 AM
IMO Pioli is Clark's man. The only issue is whether he wants to come aboard. If he does, Herm is gone. He will not choose Herm over Pioli, but will keep Herm if one of the other candidates wants to, and is not going to let him go until he knows that is the case.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 10:56 AM
Weren't you the one arguing that Herm's staff needed to be retained because they had been chosen to caoach the Senior Bowl and could get a leg up on evaluating the talent coming out? What happened to that....or did you hear it from Adam Shefter?

I came back in yesterday and posted that I was wrong on the Chiefs coaching the Senior Bowl. Unlike Shefter, I don't claim to have inside sources.

I put clearly that it was said on the redzone podcast by Soren Petro.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 10:59 AM
Well I do know that Clark wants to keep Herm, it has been reported over andd over again. Although he has said he would hire a GM who would replace him I don't think he really wants to do it. So Clark is either.......
A. cheap and doesn't want to pay Herm the remainder of his contract or
B. A complete and total idiot.
Either way he is giving me no reason to have any faith in him.

I don't think he is an idiot, but he is clearly enamored with what Herm is selling. If he keeps Herm, he will cost himself far more than his salary in season ticket sales. So, it will be based on a belief in Herm.

I believe Herm is better than most think, but not good enough.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 11:01 AM
He has to pay Herm either way, so I don't know what that has to do with anything.


The point would be that he would have to pay another coach as well. Still don't think this factors into the equation, as he will lose more in season ticket sales than the salary of Herm Edwards.

beach tribe
01-13-2009, 11:02 AM
Well I do know that Clark wants to keep Herm, it has been reported over andd over again. Although he has said he would hire a GM who would replace him I don't think he really wants to do it. So Clark is either.......
A. cheap and doesn't want to pay Herm the remainder of his contract or
B. A complete and total idiot.
Either way he is giving me no reason to have any faith in him.

He's also said that if the new GM doesn't want Herm, that it would not be a deal breaker. Clark has done everything he's said he would. How is not giving you any reason to trust him? Do you really think that Clark would choose Herman fucking Edwards over Scott Pioli? If Pioli is not hired, it's because he doesn't want to come aboard, but I guarantee it won't be because Clark says that he has to keep Herm.

MOhillbilly
01-13-2009, 11:03 AM
Well I do know that Clark wants to keep Herm, it has been reported over andd over again. Although he has said he would hire a GM who would replace him I don't think he really wants to do it. So Clark is either.......
A. cheap and doesn't want to pay Herm the remainder of his contract or
B. A complete and total idiot.
Either way he is giving me no reason to have any faith in him.

OR
C. clark is going to hire a GM and let him do his job. never the less this far into the offseason for teams not in the playoffs it bodes well for herms employment into the 09 season.

beach tribe
01-13-2009, 11:06 AM
I don't think he is an idiot, but he is clearly enamored with what Herm is selling. If he keeps Herm, he will cost himself far more than his salary in season ticket sales. So, it will be based on a belief in Herm.

I believe Herm is better than most think, but not good enough.

You really should change your name.

Reerun_KC
01-13-2009, 11:08 AM
He's also said that if the new GM doesn't want Herm, that it would not be a deal breaker. Clark has done everything he's said he would. How is not giving you any reason to trust him? Do you really think that Clark would choose Herman ****ing Edwards over Scott Pioli? If Pioli is not hired, it's because he doesn't want to come aboard, but I guarantee it won't be because Clark says that he has to keep Herm.

But if Pioli doesnt come and we hire some other GM, Herm is retained or God forbid, given a contract extension...

You can bet that the NEW GM is garbage and Clark will feel the wrath of the fanbase for along time...

Reerun_KC
01-13-2009, 11:09 AM
I believe Herm is better than most think, but not good enough.

6-26

enough said....

Brock
01-13-2009, 11:10 AM
But if Pioli doesnt come and we hire some other GM, Herm is retained or God forbid, given a contract extension...

You can bet that the NEW GM is garbage and Clark will feel the wrath of the fanbase for along time...

What if Pioli retains Herm? That might cause a few heads to explode.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 11:10 AM
Schefter is most definitely not a clown, and his original report was almost certainly correct. Just because a team doesn't officially let coaches interview doesn't mean that Herm hasn't told them informally that they can work up contingency plans through back channels on the hush hush. I'm convinced Herm has his own backup job lined up with the Bears, for example.

As for Gibbs, I think he's interviewing for a job with an assistant head coach label (not sure on that though). Kubiak wanted him as his defensive coordinator when he first got hired, but Gibbs wanted to be in KC to be close to his wife's family and becuase of his relationship with Gunther. But now his father works in Houston so things might have changed.

Herm would not tell his coaches to pursue work elsewhere if they were not going to be allowed to actually pursue the jobs.

No team is going to hold open a position based on the 'possibility' that a guy will be let go.

And, IF the coaches were calling around about jobs, then any team that talked to them intently would be guilty of tamperiing and the Chiefs would have the right to pursue compensation. At the very least, the league would be able to take away a draft pick for just talking to any coach currently under contract about a job without the Chiefs' knowlege.

At the very least, this proves that the firing of the coaching staff is not a foregone conclusion, as many have assumed for a long time.

beach tribe
01-13-2009, 11:12 AM
But if Pioli doesnt come and we hire some other GM, Herm is retained or God forbid, given a contract extension...

You can bet that the NEW GM is garbage and Clark will feel the wrath of the fanbase for along time...

With the built up anticipation, I don't think I could handle another year of Herm, or a GM that would want to keep him. The only way I can see it happening is if the new GM knows that his guy will be available in 2010, and is not available at this moment. Reguardless(sp?), I would boycot the Chiefs in 2009.

FringeNC
01-13-2009, 11:13 AM
What if Pioli retains Herm? That might cause a few heads to explode.

Yep, starting with mine.

beach tribe
01-13-2009, 11:14 AM
What if Pioli retains Herm? That might cause a few heads to explode.

I could handle it if Pioli was hired, and kept Herm, because I think it would just be for 1 yr, and that Pioli had a replacement in mind, but that man is not available at this time. Although I would not like it. If Herm gets an extension...........I just don't want to think about that.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 11:16 AM
You really should change your name.

Herm is a guy who has taken two teams to the playoffs that missed the playoffs for the two seasons preceding him.

In both instances, he has taken over teams in decline.

His teams play hard for him. Chan Gailey came here BECAUSE of Herm Edwards. Herm has a ton of respect among the coaches in the league.

I don't think he is good enough to win the Super Bowl, which is the biggest reason I am scared of him coming back for another year. It will not be surprising, especially in this division, if Herm gets the Chiefs to the playoffs next year. And, that will earn him an extension.

And, that will condemn the Chiefs to mediocrity for a long time.

I am not one to look at one year windows. For the 2009 season, bringing Herm back may be the best option. I am worried about the long term of the organization.

I would be in favor of bringing Herm back for his last year if I knew he would go no better than 6-10 and a new coach would be hired.

It would mean a year for the new GM to get comfortable with the organization and would lead to more continuity, which I believe leads to more consistent success.

SenselessChiefsFan
01-13-2009, 11:20 AM
6-26

enough said....

Hey, I am not saying he is a world beater, but he took two teams that had not been to the playoffs in the previous two seasons and got them to the playoffs. Both teams were in steep decline when he took them over.

He was in year four of the rebuild in NY when they were a field goal away from going to the AFC Championship game.

I wouldn't care about him coming back if I wasn't concerned with him making the playoffs again and getting an extension.... which I think is a distinct possibility.

FringeNC
01-13-2009, 11:21 AM
Herm has a ton of respect among the coaches in the league.

I don't buy it. Pure conjecture. I conjecture if you had NFL coaches rank order all the other NFL coaches anonymously, Herm Edwards would be no where near the top. In fact, I think he'd be near the bottom.

Mr. Laz
01-13-2009, 11:21 AM
somebody tell me .....

when "Sensible"chiefsfan was picking his name out that he wasn't thinking "all these other chiefs fans are so stupid, i'm so much smarter"

bowener
01-13-2009, 12:25 PM
What if Pioli retains Herm? That might cause a few heads to explode.

Well, last I saw, Gibbs, our DB coach may leave for Houston, so Herm apparently still has a place on this team to coach :)

MGRS13
01-13-2009, 12:55 PM
What if Pioli retains Herm? That might cause a few heads to explode.
Then we've all been sold a bill of goods because he is an idiot. Look there is no reason to keep Herm. if you do and he shows improvement i.e. 4 games 6 games or 7 wins then what we resign him? Nope either we cut ties now and be behind the eight ball by three years or we keep Herm and go 5, 6, 7 years in the hole. Not to mention Herm will not approach this years draft like we should, as a team that needs to be completly rebuilt starting with a real QBOTF. Nope Herm will approach it like we are 1 or 2 players away. This team is teetering on the edge right now and clark doesn't seem to understand that.