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Mi_chief_fan
02-06-2009, 09:43 AM
"Excited, he's (Haley) got some good qualities for a coach."

"Watched the Cardinals alot, impressed, looking forward to him bringing his scheme to KC."

"It's a fun offense: you can run the spread,I-formation, play action and go deep."

THinks KC's receivers will thrive with Haley, likes the talent at WR.

"It's great to have an offensive minded coach like Brad CHildress in MN."

Would like to see Gailey stay

"THey might clash in some ways, but i'd like to see him run the offense this year."

"I feel like right now i'm the QB for the CHiefs until i'm told otherwise."

"I'd hate to see TG go, having him here wil help us win."

"I'll try to caontact Tony after the Pro-Bowl. In this system, the TE will get the ball."

On LJ:
"As a player you always want to be happy, obviously he doesn't want to be here, that's his perogative. I would hope none of the teammates would hold a grudge for what he said if he does come back. He's really good when he wants to be."

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-06-2009, 09:47 AM
Arizona did run alot of plays out of the gun, so I don't know why people would think that Thigpen couldn't play in that offense. That said I am not on his bandwagon for starting next year as I'd like Sanchez, but I'm sure Thigpen can work on improving from under center in the offseason and can at least be a quality backup.

seaofred
02-06-2009, 09:50 AM
Sounds like Thigpen thinks LJ is a prick.

smittysbar
02-06-2009, 09:50 AM
he said LJ is a good player when he wants to be, pretty unstoppable, when he brings that to the table.

BigChiefFan
02-06-2009, 09:56 AM
Thiggy, you'll get a shot at being the starter, but thinking you are annointed the starter by default is absurd. EARN IT.

Planetman
02-06-2009, 09:57 AM
Sounds like everyone thinks LJ is a prick.
Fixed your post.

seaofred
02-06-2009, 09:59 AM
Fixed your post.


Sorry, my bad.

KC-TBB
02-06-2009, 10:04 AM
:clap:R WE EXCITED?
I think I am...I have to see how he 'motivates'...was he a great offensive coordinator or did he just have great talent to work with?

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:06 AM
Thigpen acting like he is in Pioli and Haley's plans is funny.

Frazod
02-06-2009, 10:07 AM
I really wish one of the players would just come out and say "Larry's a prick, we all hate him, I hope he ends up in Saskatchewan."

StcChief
02-06-2009, 10:08 AM
Thiggy will have competition no doubt. LJ wants out, hope we can get something for him.

StcChief
02-06-2009, 10:09 AM
I really wish one of the players would just come out and say "Larry's a prick, we all hate him, I hope he ends up in Saskatchewan."If the players Union didn't exist it might happen.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:09 AM
Thigpen acting like he is in Pioli and Haley's plans is funny.

Not quite as funny as you thinking you know more about the situation.

Marco Polo
02-06-2009, 10:09 AM
"It's great to have an offensive minded coach like Brad CHildress in MN."


I know several Vikings fans and they all hate Childress. They think his offense is much too vanilla, kind of like what we had as an offense before they opened it up.

Chiefs Pantalones
02-06-2009, 10:09 AM
Just go away, Thigpen and Gailey. Please. Just go away.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:12 AM
Just go away, Thigpen and Gailey. Please. Just go away.
Thigpen has done nothing to deserve this imo

Rooster
02-06-2009, 10:13 AM
"It's a fun offense: you can run the spread, I-formation, play action and go deep.".[/B]"

LOL. Well Thiggy can do one of those things.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:15 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:15 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.
truth

BigChiefFan
02-06-2009, 10:15 AM
:clap:R WE EXCITED?
I think I am...I have to see how he 'motivates'...was he a great offensive coordinator or did he just have great talent to work with?

He's coached for the Jets, Bears, Pats, Cowboys and Cardinals, just to name some off the top of my head.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 10:16 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

and to think these same people say a rookie qb should have time to develop, yet thigpen is done after one yearROFL

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:17 AM
and to think these same people say a rookie qb should have time to develop, yet thigpen is done after one yearROFL

I know, not even a year.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:19 AM
and to think these same people say a rookie qb should have time to develop, yet thigpen is done after one yearROFL

Uh ... he can't drop back, Mr. JASONSAUTO. That's kinda serious, don't you think?

FAX

Brock
02-06-2009, 10:19 AM
I like Thigpen, and I think he'll make a great backup for this team.

Chiefs Pantalones
02-06-2009, 10:20 AM
Thigpen's QB rating by quarter...

1st- 100
2nd- 80
3rd- 60
4th- 50

He's not a starting QB, he didn't improve as the game went on. No thanks. The pistol was a cute experiment though.

Buzz
02-06-2009, 10:21 AM
Thigpen has done nothing to deserve this imo


I agree... the offense was scoring enough points it was the defense that let us down.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:22 AM
Uh ... he can't drop back, Mr. JASONSAUTO. That's kinda serious, don't you think?

FAX

If he finds a way to get the ball to our good players and move the chains I don't give a shit if he lines up behind the WR.

He makes things happen...sometimes out of nothing. The whole time he has done it with a suspect running game.

And what makes everyone so sure he has hit his ceiling. The guy hasn't gone through a training camp as a player that isn't an afterthought. An off season of training and work with the coaches focusing on him and his offense working with him is a big deal.

Why can't he get better?

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:23 AM
Thigpen's QB rating by quarter...

1st- 100
2nd- 80
3rd- 60
4th- 50

He's not a starting QB, he didn't improve as the game went on. No thanks. The pistol was a cute experiment though.

Why could Croyle get time to improve but Thigpen can't?

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:24 AM
Uh ... he can't drop back, Mr. JASONSAUTO. That's kinda serious, don't you think?

FAX
link?


he played under center in 2008 some

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:25 AM
Haley wants an accurate QB similar to Warner to run his offense, he doesn't want a piece of shit QB with a mediocre completion % whose overall performance gets worse by the quarter.

MVChiefFan
02-06-2009, 10:27 AM
Thigpen's QB rating by quarter...

1st- 100
2nd- 80
3rd- 60
4th- 50

He's not a starting QB, he didn't improve as the game went on. No thanks. The pistol was a cute experiment though.

It sounds like to me he IS a starting QB...just not a finishing one.

Rooster
02-06-2009, 10:27 AM
Why could Croyle get time to improve but Thigpen can't?

Because Croyle was a draft pick and Thiggy was some other teams scraps.

I'm not saying I agree with it but that's what it boils down to in the NFL.

doomy3
02-06-2009, 10:27 AM
What would you people like him to say?

"I concede that I am probably going to be a lifetime backup, so I will just lay down and let someone else be the starter."

I like the fact that he wants to be the starter and that he is showing some confidence that he can do it.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:27 AM
If he finds a way to get the ball to our good players and move the chains I don't give a shit if he lines up behind the WR.

He makes things happen...sometimes out of nothing. The whole time he has done it with a suspect running game.

And what makes everyone so sure he has hit his ceiling. The guy hasn't gone through a training camp has a player that isn't an afterthought. An off season of training and work with the coaches focusing on him and his offense working with him is a big deal.

Why can't he get better?

I'm sure he can, Mr. |Zach|. Certainly. I have nothing against the guy from that perspective. In fact, I'm impressed by what he was able to do under the circumstances last year. He's the gutsiest skeleton banger I know.

Nonetheless, he needs a ton of work on some basic quarterbacking fundamentals. Based on where he's starting from, don't you think that the developmental time might be best used working with someone who is at least comfortable in a pro offense? That's where I'm coming from.

FAX

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:27 AM
If he finds a way to get the ball to our good players and move the chains I don't give a shit if he lines up behind the WR.

He makes things happen...sometimes out of nothing. The whole time he has done it with a suspect running game.

And what makes everyone so sure he has hit his ceiling. The guy hasn't gone through a training camp has a player that isn't an afterthought. An off season of training and work with the coaches focusing on him and his offense working with him is a big deal.

Why can't he get better?

It is amazing that the garbage heap of the fanbase still clings to the idea that Thigpen can be an NFL-caliber QB.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:28 AM
Haley wants an accurate QB similar to Warner to run his offense, he doesn't want a piece of shit QB with a mediocre completion % whose overall performance gets by the quarter.
i don't know which is more sad

you responding to yourself because nobody wants to talk to you or you judging a young QB by his first year getting any real playing time in the NFL.


The Chiefs REALLY shouldn't draft a QB with people like you around.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:28 AM
Because Croyle was a draft pick and Thigpen was some other teams scraps.

I'm not saying I agree with it but that's what it boils down to in the NFL.

It sounds more so like that what it boils down to with message board experts not the NFL. Kurt Warner almost won his second Superbowl last week.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:29 AM
It is amazing that the garbage heap of the fanbase still clings to the idea that Thigpen can be an NFL-caliber QB.

I think it is amazing someone that has done literally nothing but bitch about this team calls other people the garbage heap of the fanbase.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:29 AM
link?


he played under center in 2008 some

Okay. I overstated that a little. But, I was carried away.

The point is that Gailey had to come up with a completely different offense in order to get something out of Thiggy. I think we can all agree that the guy wasn't comfortable in a pro offense.

FAX

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:29 AM
i don't know which is more sad

you responding to yourself because nobody wants to talk to you or you judging a young QB by his first year getting any real playing time in the NFL.


The Chiefs REALLY shouldn't draft a QB with people like you around.

Exhibit A of the garbage heap of the Chiefs fanbase. Elements such as yourself are satisifed with Thigpen/Croyle/Blundin caliber QBs.

doomy3
02-06-2009, 10:30 AM
It sounds more so like that what it boils down to with message board experts not the NFL. Kurt Warner almost won his second Superbowl last week.

But the reason he didn't is because he was playing against a QB who was drafted in the first round!

[/All the Gurus on here]

Rooster
02-06-2009, 10:30 AM
It sounds more so like that what it boils down to with message board experts not the NFL. Kurt Warner almost won his second Superbowl last week.

Warner has A LOT more going for him than Thiggy.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:30 AM
Warner has A LOT more going for him than Thigpen.

This can't be. He wasn't a high round draft pick. /message board experts

Rooster
02-06-2009, 10:30 AM
But the reason he didn't is because he was playing against a QB who was drafted in the first round!

[/All the Gurus on here]


ROFLROFL

doomy3
02-06-2009, 10:31 AM
Exhibit A of the garbage heap of the Chiefs fanbase. Elements such as yourself are satisifed with Thigpen/Croyle/Blundin caliber QBs.

You are such a fucking bitch.

alpha_omega
02-06-2009, 10:31 AM
Thigpen, you'll get a shot at being the starter,... EARN IT.

Just my opinion, but i would guess that Thigpen has to know this.
Surely he knows he is not going to be handed anything.

But, maybe not.

DaKCMan AP
02-06-2009, 10:31 AM
If he finds a way to get the ball to our good players and move the chains I don't give a shit if he lines up behind the WR.

He makes things happen...sometimes out of nothing. The whole time he has done it with a suspect running game.

And what makes everyone so sure he has hit his ceiling. The guy hasn't gone through a training camp as a player that isn't an afterthought. An off season of training and work with the coaches focusing on him and his offense working with him is a big deal.

Why can't he get better?

I don't think anyone is advocating his immediate release. However, do you really want to put all of your eggs into the Tyler Thigpen basket?

Brock
02-06-2009, 10:31 AM
I'm pretty sure they'll be looking to upgrade the QB position, no matter what we think of Thigpen.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:32 AM
Why could Croyle get time to improve but Thigpen can't?

*cough*

Thigpen hasn't even gone through a single season.

Red Brooklyn
02-06-2009, 10:32 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

:clap:

Hip, hip!

doomy3
02-06-2009, 10:33 AM
I'm pretty sure they'll be looking to upgrade the QB position, no matter what we think of Thigpen.

I definitely hope we do. But to knock anything Thigpen has said in any of his interviews this offseason is absurd. He SHOULD be treating this offseason as if he is the starting QB.

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 10:33 AM
Thiggy, you'll get a shot at being the starter, but thinking you are annointed the starter by default is absurd. EARN IT.

He earned it last season

Brock
02-06-2009, 10:34 AM
He earned it last season

He earned a place on the team, not a starting job.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:34 AM
I don't think anyone is advocating his immediate release. However, do you really want to put all of your eggs into the Tyler Thigpen basket?

If another QB comes in and plays better than him then fine...I want the Chiefs to be better. But dismissing what Thigpen has done on the field sounds ridiculous.

The guy made chicken salad from chicken shit.

Every other QB gets time to develop and gets a mile long list of excuses from the fanbase for playing poorly but the guy who goes out and actually moves the chains and score points can't improve at all and should be thrown aside.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:34 AM
Look. Thiggy might win the position or he might not. At least we might have a head coach and a GM and an OC who can properly evaluate our quarterback situation. At this point, we don't even know what kind of offensive scheme we'll be running.

Nevertheless, if they call Thiggy's number, I'll be behind him 100%. We'll see.

FAX

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:35 AM
I don't think anyone is advocating his immediate release. ?
really?

Haley wants an accurate QB similar to Warner .... he doesn't want a piece of shit QB(thigpen) Just go away, Thigpen and Gailey. Please. Just go away.

Red Brooklyn
02-06-2009, 10:35 AM
I'm pretty sure they'll be looking to upgrade the QB position, no matter what we think of Thigpen.

Sure. I hope so. I always want us to be looking at getting better. But I don't get the total bashing of Thigpen. He's done good things. He deserves his shot to compete for the job. Not saying he's the end all be all, but I like what he showed us last season.

Brock
02-06-2009, 10:35 AM
Jesus, this is like Croyle part 2.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:36 AM
If another QB comes in and plays better than him then fine...I want the Chiefs to be better. But dismissing what Thigpen has done on the field sounds ridiculous.

The guy made chicken salad from chicken shit.

Every other QB gets time to develop and gets a mile long list of excuses from the fanbase for playing poorly but the guy who goes out and actually moves the chains and score points can't improve at all and should be thrown aside.

There's much truthiness in this dad gummed post.

FAX

bishop_74
02-06-2009, 10:36 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

Undeniable. This is fact. He has room to improve, but I think has potential. How much I don't know. This argument that he can't play under center is silly too. He was getting his azz kicked last year running for his life. THAT is why we switched to the pistol offense. It was the best way to give him some room and time to throw the ball. I suspect with better line play he can run the offense from any formation.

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:36 AM
I think it is amazing someone that has done literally nothing but bitch about this team calls other people the garbage heap of the fanbase.

Wrong, I complained about Herm destroying the franchise which he did. Now that he is gone I'm very happy with direction the Chiefs are heading in, especially with an offensive-minded coach in Todd Haley.

My only complaint is why the garbage element of the fanbase, such as yourself want to cling to the pipedream that Herm's pet projects such as Thigpen can magically become NFL-caliber players.

The fact Thigpen got worse by quarter, as teams adjusted to him should be an indicator to even someone as dense as you that with a season worth of film on Thigpen, opposing teams will have no problem exposing Thigpen to be an NFL Europe caliber QB next season.

Tyler Thigpen is next season's Derek Anderson.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:37 AM
Jesus, this is like Croyle part 2.

Except the player we are talking about has done something.

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 10:37 AM
Bring back Al Saunders.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:37 AM
**** potential....this guy has ACTUALLY DONE IT and is still young and can improve. He started 1\2 a season. While some here were stroking it to mock drafts Thigpen was making an offense that was horrible get in the endzone without the luxury of a good running game.

talastan
02-06-2009, 10:38 AM
Thigpen has earned the right to compete. Whether he gets the starting nod or not is up to the staff. ANYONE who says he hasn't earned the right to compete is completely shortsighted. If we draft a QB and the rook does a better job than Thiggy fine. Put the best guy on the field. If Thiggy did start instead of a drafted QB than I know the "draft gurus" on here would immediately throw the new staff under the bus. The point is keep an open mind and trust the new staff that they'll make the right decision for who to start. This isn't the CeePee era anymore. We haven't been given any reason to not trust the new staff yet.

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:38 AM
He earned it last season

Based on what? Based on the fact he led the Chiefs to ONE win as a starter? Based on the fact he completely melted down on that final drive against the Dolphins with the opportunity to tie the game? Based on the fact that Thigpen, along with the rest of Herm's team decided not to show up for the final game at Cincy?

Thig Lyfe
02-06-2009, 10:39 AM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

Yup.

I don't know of Thiggy is the QBOTF, but he sure as hell deserves a chance at it.

phillip
02-06-2009, 10:40 AM
Haley wants an accurate QB similar to Warner to run his offense, he doesn't want a piece of shit QB with a mediocre completion % whose overall performance gets worse by the quarter.

Yes, because Warner was considered an accurate QB at Thigpen's age and experience level, douchebag.

According to your logic, Thigpen should not be written off until he's at least 37, right?

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:40 AM
Wrong, I complained about Herm destroying the franchise which he did. Now that he is gone I'm very happy with direction the Chiefs are heading in, especially with an offensive-minded coach in Todd Haley.

My only complaint is why the garbage element of the fanbase, such as yourself want to cling to the pipedream that Herm's pet projects such as Thigpen can magically become NFL-caliber players.

The fact Thigpen got worse by quarter, as teams adjusted to him should be an indicator to even someone as dense as you that with a season worth of film on Thigpen, opposing teams will have no problem exposing Thigpen to be an NFL Europe caliber QB next season.

Tyler Thigpen is next season's Derek Anderson.

Again, why can't Thigpen improve.

Shouldn't the king of self loathing message board experts have a good answer for this. Isn't there some kind of universal rule about backing the hurricanes and calling other people trash? Seems odd.

chiefzilla1501
02-06-2009, 10:41 AM
Uh ... he can't drop back, Mr. JASONSAUTO. That's kinda serious, don't you think?

FAX

How do you know that he can't? Given that the previous two QBs who ran under center were destroyed within the first 5 games because the offensive line protection was so bad, why do people think Thigpen or ANY QB (even a QB as tough to bring down as Big Ben) would have any fighting chance taking snaps under center? The reason he couldn't run plays under center is that the pass protection was so bad that as soon as the ball was snapped, there were two defenders already in his face.

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 10:41 AM
**** potential....this guy has ACTUALLY DONE IT


What has Thigpen done? Win one game as a starter? Melt down in the final drive against the Dolphins? Not show up against Cincy? Complete barely 55% of his passes?

Your standard for determining that Thigpen is a good QB apparently is comparing him to the likes of Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard. Even a blowhard such as yourself would look like a halfway decent QB compared to those two pieces of garbage.

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 10:45 AM
He earned a place on the team, not a starting job.

He earned it.........played better than Eli Manning did a year ago. Don't understand the kinda expectations some people have on this board. I really dont.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 10:45 AM
Thigpen is a less accurate jake plummer

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 10:46 AM
Based on what? Based on the fact he led the Chiefs to ONE win as a starter? Based on the fact he completely melted down on that final drive against the Dolphins with the opportunity to tie the game? Based on the fact that Thigpen, along with the rest of Herm's team decided not to show up for the final game at Cincy?

Football is a team game. the defense clearly lost many games for us last season, not having anything to do with thigpen.

We of all fans should know this when DV and AS ran the show.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:46 AM
What has Thigpen done? Win one game as a starter? Melt down in the final drive against the Dolphins? Not show up against Cincy? Complete barely 55% of his passes?

Your standard for determining that Thigpen is a good QB apparently is comparing him to the likes of Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard. Even a blowhard such as yourself would look like a halfway decent QB compared to those two pieces of garbage.

Put points on the board. Do you want Thigpen to play defense as well?

By my quick count 20+ points 7 out of the 12 games he played in.

3 of them 30+ points.

That is putting your team in a position to win games.

chiefzilla1501
02-06-2009, 10:47 AM
Based on what? Based on the fact he led the Chiefs to ONE win as a starter? Based on the fact he completely melted down on that final drive against the Dolphins with the opportunity to tie the game? Based on the fact that Thigpen, along with the rest of Herm's team decided not to show up for the final game at Cincy?

So the Giants should have given up on Eli Manning when the Giants only one 1 out of his first 7 games? It's not about Thigpen being good or bad. It's not about resting your future on him--the Chiefs need to bring in another QB regardless of what we think of Thigpen. It's about people like you that are convinced that a QB only deserves a half season to improve.

|Zach|
02-06-2009, 10:48 AM
It's about people like you that are convinced that a QB only deserves a half season to improve.

No it is people like him that use this team and this place as a vehicle to listen to themselves bitch. It is easy to be a hindsight is 20\20 internet message board sports fan. Ask DeBerg.

smittysbar
02-06-2009, 10:48 AM
I know several Vikings fans and they all hate Childress. They think his offense is much too vanilla, kind of like what we had as an offense before they opened it up.

I agree. R2P2

Brock
02-06-2009, 10:49 AM
Yup.

I don't know of Thigpen is the QBOTF, but he sure as hell deserves a chance at it.

He deserves a chance at it, with some serious competition brought in.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 10:51 AM
He deserves a chance at it, with some serious competition brought in.
every player on the team should have serious competition for a starting spot.

PastorMikH
02-06-2009, 10:52 AM
Thigpen has earned the right to compete. Whether he gets the starting nod or not is up to the staff. ANYONE who says he hasn't earned the right to compete is completely shortsighted.





Agreed.

Thigpen came from a Div 2 college - where he was the college's first QB EVER. He led that team to something like 30-8 record. Coming to the Chiefs he stepped in, within a few games was already catching on and putting us into positions to actually compete (had his HC not blown some calls from the sideline IMO, we would have won several more games). He did all of this with, IMO, had one of the worst QB coaches in the NFL. Some help with his footwork from a decent QB coach and I think he could be the QB everyone is hoping we'll draft with our 3rd pick.

I DO NOT have a problem with him having to compete with legit competition for his position during the off season. I do think if we spend the 3rd pick on a QB, invest the $ we'll have to pay a QB pick that high, even if Thigpen is clearly better, the other guy will have the edge for starting.

Saccopoo
02-06-2009, 10:54 AM
If another QB comes in and plays better than him then fine...I want the Chiefs to be better. But dismissing what Thigpen has done on the field sounds ridiculous.

The guy made chicken salad from chicken shit.



Sir, I know Casey Printers. And Tyler Thigpen is no Casey Printers.

Seriously though, Thigpen makes bad reads, is constantly over or under throwing his receivers (and I'm talking about the last couple of games last season, where this situation was downright embarrassing), leads his primary receiver way too much, doesn't have a good touch on his passes and is quite inaccurate on the deep passes (the two that he threw). I'd like to have a guy like Thigpen as the thrid QB - maybe. Use him as a fourth wideout, the snap holder on field goals, extra points, etc., but he has not shown the capability of being a starting QB in the NFL.

He got cut by Minnesota for Christs sake! Minnesota! And the Chiefs start him! And (some of) the fans truly want him back as our QB! Don't you tell me that we don't need a goddamn quarterback with our first pick! Other than Detroit, there isn't a team in the NFL that doesn't need a quarterback more than the Chiefs. On every conceivable level we need a quarterback.

FAX
02-06-2009, 10:58 AM
So ... do I have this right?

We're going to draft Sanchez ostensibly anointing him as our QBOTF ... but since El Armo is a rookie, we play Thiggy and develop him further instead of giving valuable PT to our future quarterback? Is that the plan here?

Or, are we talking about pinning our hopes on Thiggy as our QBOTF and passing on a quarterback in the draft altogether?

FAX

FAX
02-06-2009, 11:01 AM
... He got cut by Minnesota for Christs sake! Minnesota! And the Chiefs start him! ...

I thought MN was trying to sneak him onto their practice squad and we picked him up. That's not exactly "cutting" the guy.

FAX

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 11:04 AM
Put points on the board. Do you want Thigpen to play defense as well?

By my quick count 20+ points 7 out of the 12 games he played in.

3 of them 30+ points.

That is putting your team in a position to win games.

What about that final drive against the Dolphins... in probably the most defining moment of the season for Thigpen. The defense forced the Dolphins to turn the ball over and Thigpen had the opportunity to drive the offense down the field to tie the game with a touchdown.

How did Thigpen respond under the only major pressure situation he was faced with all season, the only real situation he was in to lead the Chiefs to tie and send a game into OT? He melted down... completely choked. First down- incomplete pass (not even close to the WR), Second down- another wild incompletion, Third down- Sacked (held on to the ball too long looking for Tony Gonzalez), Fourth down- INT.

J Diddy
02-06-2009, 11:05 AM
I thought MN was trying to sneak him onto their practice squad and we picked him up. That's not exactly "cutting" the guy.

FAX

That is exactly what happened. That is also what most teams try to do with 7th round draft picks/developmental players.

KCChiefsFan88
02-06-2009, 11:07 AM
Or, are we talking about pinning our hopes on Thigpen as our QBOTF and passing on a quarterback in the draft altogether?

FAX

That is what the Thigpen-homers want to happen, but Pioli and Haley are too smart to do that.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 11:09 AM
So ... do I have this right?

We're going to draft Sanchez ostensibly anointing him as our QBOTF ... but since El Armo is a rookie, we play Thiggy and develop him further instead of giving valuable PT to our future quarterback? Is that the plan here?

Or, are we talking about pinning our hopes on Thiggy as our QBOTF and passing on a quarterback in the draft altogether?

FAX
we have no idea what they are going to do


i assume we will have at least 1 new quarterback on the roster next year ..... probably 2.

i assume Croyle is gone cuz he just can't stay healthy. Even the smallest hit leads to a big injury.

Huard's attitude last year sucked but maybe with the new coaches he gets another year. :shrug:

BigChiefFan
02-06-2009, 11:11 AM
we have no idea what they are going to do


i assume we will have at least 1 new quarterback on the roster next year ..... probably 2.

i assume Croyle is gone cuz he just can't stay healthy. Even the smallest hit leads to a big injury.

Huard's attitude last year sucked but maybe with the new coaches he gets another year. :shrug:No Huard is done in KC. He carries one of the bigger contracts and his production certainly doesn't justify his contract.

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 11:14 AM
Sir, I know Casey Printers. And Tyler Thigpen is no Casey Printers.

Seriously though, Thigpen makes bad reads, is constantly over or under throwing his receivers (and I'm talking about the last couple of games last season, where this situation was downright embarrassing), leads his primary receiver way too much, doesn't have a good touch on his passes and is quite inaccurate on the deep passes (the two that he threw). I'd like to have a guy like Thigpen as the thrid QB - maybe. Use him as a fourth wideout, the snap holder on field goals, extra points, etc., but he has not shown the capability of being a starting QB in the NFL.

He got cut by Minnesota for Christs sake! Minnesota! And the Chiefs start him! And (some of) the fans truly want him back as our QB! Don't you tell me that we don't need a goddamn quarterback with our first pick! Other than Detroit, there isn't a team in the NFL that doesn't need a quarterback more than the Chiefs. On every conceivable level we need a quarterback.

Trent Green was cut, so was Warner, Brunell, Hasslebeck, and the list goes on.

Just because one person doesn't work out one place doesn't mean he can't succeed at another.

smittysbar
02-06-2009, 11:15 AM
Thig has been on this team for two years now, has been inaccurate from the start, and has not shown that it is getting any better. Yes I think he deserves and will get a shot to compete for the job, but will almost guarantee that he will lose.

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 11:16 AM
What about that final drive against the Dolphins... in probably the most defining moment of the season for Thigpen. The defense forced the Dolphins to turn the ball over and Thigpen had the opportunity to drive the offense down the field to tie the game with a touchdown.

How did Thigpen respond under the only major pressure situation he was faced with all season, the only real situation he was in to lead the Chiefs to tie and send a game into OT? He melted down... completely choked. First down- incomplete pass (not even close to the WR), Second down- another wild incompletion, Third down- Sacked (held on to the ball too long looking for Tony Gonzalez), Fourth down- INT.

And you think Sanchez or Stafford could do better simply because theyre projected to go first rd?

Does anyone here remember Peyton Manning's first season? Jeebus people

CoMoChief
02-06-2009, 11:21 AM
Thig has been on this team for two years now, has been inaccurate from the start, and has not shown that it is getting any better. Yes I think he deserves and will get a shot to compete for the job, but will almost guarantee that he will lose.

The only time we've been remotely competitive is when he's behind center.

Brock
02-06-2009, 11:30 AM
The only time we've been remotely competitive is when he's behind center.

So he's the best QB on a garbage team.

Mr. Laz
02-06-2009, 11:36 AM
So he's the best QB on a garbage team.
yes, but we have to start somewhere


by all means, bring in competition at EVERY position but you shouldn't shit on a guy that actually helped you improve for once.

HemiEd
02-06-2009, 11:44 AM
That is exactly what happened. That is also what most teams try to do with 7th round draft picks/developmental players.

There is an OG playing for the Colts, that the Chiefs tried to this with. I think it was my first meltdown experience on the Planet.

Brock
02-06-2009, 11:53 AM
yes, but we have to start somewhere


by all means, bring in competition at EVERY position but you shouldn't shit on a guy that actually helped you improve for once.

I want him on the team, I'm just not going to stop arguing to upgrade the position because of him.

dj56dt58
02-06-2009, 12:36 PM
Okay. I overstated that a little. But, I was carried away.

The point is that Gailey had to come up with a completely different offense in order to give Thigpen enough time to throw the ball with the shit that is the right side of our offensive line

FAX

fyp

Crush
02-06-2009, 01:00 PM
Thigpen better learn how to play under center to give this argument any legitimacy.

The problem is that I don't believe he will be effective as a traditional QB.

RINGLEADER
02-06-2009, 02:55 PM
Thigpen, you'll get a shot at being the starter, but thinking you are annointed the starter by default is absurd. EARN IT.

And you have to start winning in spite of a crappy defense. Or this place will go all China Syndrome on Haley/Pioli/Hunt...

-King-
02-06-2009, 02:58 PM
Okay. I overstated that a little. But, I was carried away.

The point is that Gailey had to come up with a completely different offense in order to get something out of Thigpen. I think we can all agree that the guy wasn't comfortable in a pro offense.

FAX


Or is it because Thigpen didn't really play in training camp so they had to make him comfortable in any way possible? The guy barely got any snaps at all, its hard to think he'd come out in an offense he isn't used to and sling the damn ball all around. Especially with Penis Curl as the QB coach. It's like if Bowe missed training camp during a time when we are using FAST blazing WRs. When he comes back, we would have to switch up a bit to make him more comfortable. Does that means he sucks? No it just means he isnt acclimated to the play style. That's the point of training camp. To get people to know the team style. You cant come in half way during the season and expect to play how every other qb plays. You have to change the playbook to your liking. Maybe next training camp you can work on the things you missed.

And maybe, because the TWO qbs before him had been injured in that style, we stopped running it. McIntosh was letting every D-End get through the line. So dropping back wasn't really an option.

But who knows, we now have a coach who knows offense, and we have a new qb coach. You guys bashed Penis Curl last year, yet you expect Thigpen to be great under him. You cant have a good student if you have a horrible teacher.

chiefscafan
02-06-2009, 03:04 PM
Ok this is what I've been thinking why not bring in a vet to mentor him such as a kurt warner type. Give thigpen some coaching and watchout. I still saw him make some throws I haven't seen in years. I'm not giving up on him just yet I just think he needs sometime. He actually is pioli's type of Qb.

chiefzilla1501
02-06-2009, 03:05 PM
So ... do I have this right?

We're going to draft Sanchez ostensibly anointing him as our QBOTF ... but since El Armo is a rookie, we play Thigpen and develop him further instead of giving valuable PT to our future quarterback? Is that the plan here?

Or, are we talking about pinning our hopes on Thigpen as our QBOTF and passing on a quarterback in the draft altogether?

FAX

I think chances are good we draft a QB, but the worst thing you can do is to annoint sanchez as QBOTF if you draft him. You start the offseason off with Thigpen as the starting QB. And then you force Thigpen to fight to keep his starting position. And then by midseason, you evaluate whether Thigpen is a guy who can lead you into the future, or if you need to look in another direction. If the answer is anything but a resounding "yes", then you can him.

We have 5-6 years to learn if Sanchez is the answer. We have a little less than a half season more to learn if Thigpen is. Before we give up on Thigpen entirely as a starting QB, I want to know for absolute certain that he isn't the answer.

I know a lot of people want to start a guy like Sanchez right away. But most teams don't immediately throw a young QB into the fire like Baltimore and Atlanta did. Most teams wait a half-season to start their rookie QB anyway. ESPECIALLY when you're talking about a guy like Sanchez, who might take a little longer to develop because of his inexperience.

PastorMikH
02-06-2009, 03:08 PM
What about that final drive against the Dolphins... in probably the most defining moment of the season for Thigpen. The defense forced the Dolphins to turn the ball over and Thigpen had the opportunity to drive the offense down the field to tie the game with a touchdown.

How did Thigpen respond under the only major pressure situation he was faced with all season, the only real situation he was in to lead the Chiefs to tie and send a game into OT? He melted down... completely choked. First down- incomplete pass (not even close to the WR), Second down- another wild incompletion, Third down- Sacked (held on to the ball too long looking for Tony Gonzalez), Fourth down- INT.



Seriously?

The second start of the guy's career and you're ready to throw the towel in on him because he couldn't "handle the preassure"? How many of the great QBs stuggled in their first couple of starts? In just looking at the QBs in the pro-bowl THIS year -

Peyton started all 16 games with a 3-13 record, threw 28 interceptions, his QB rating was 71

Bret Favre still throws interceptions all over the field, his first year, he threw the ball 4 times and had 2 ints. Managed 13 ints with 13 starts his second year in the nfl

Cutler managed to win 2 of his 5 starts his first season with a QB rat of 88 - probably the best first season of the AFC probowl qbs.

Kerry Collins completed less than half of his passes his first season, threw more INTs than TDs, and had a rating of 61.9.

On the NFC side, you've got...

Warner - No question about his performance once he got a chance to start. But he bounced around until he was 27 before he even got signed by his first NFL team. After 3 solid years in StL, he became a backup and was viewed by many as nothing more until he stepped up this year. His first season of true starting he neted 109 QB rating.

Brees - Threw one more TD than INT, had a QB rating of 76.9. Last pick of the 2nd round - I was frustrated because the 1st and 2nd round picks we gave for Green and DV could have been used to get him, thought he would have made a decent QB for us. But all the experts say he wouldn't have been any good in the NFL because he's only 6- too short.

Last but not least, we have Eli Manning who Giants fans wanted to send packing after 4 years.




Look back and you'll see most of the great QBs weren't stellar in their first seasons. Not every QB is going to be like Brady or Warner, ALMOST ALL of them are going to struggle for their first couple of years. Some that fair better have the luxury of playing for better teams - Cassel for example (in the list above, I'd include Favre, Cuttler and Warner in the group benifiting from a team around them their first season, as well as Tom Brady).


Last year Thigpen accounted for 1 less TD (22) than the entire Chiefs team in 2007 (23). in the games following the Bye week, his qb ratings were not too far off from some of the better QBs in the NFL. Also keep in mind, you really can't put every loss on Thigpen. We lost a lot of games, not because of Thigpen, but dropped passes, poor running, poor D, missed FGs, poor coaching and so on.


Ever since I became a Chiefs fan, one observation I've made is I don't think the Chiefs fan base as a whole could survive drafting and developing a QB. They would boo him at games, complain about his performances, and ask (beg) that coaches and management do something different.

Say we draft Stafford or Sanchez, how long does anyone think the fanbase would put up with bad numbers before they are filled with grumbling and complaining, reffering to the QB as "Another First Round Bust."

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-06-2009, 03:08 PM
I want him on the team, I'm just not going to stop arguing to upgrade the position because of him.

That is fine, but the people who want him gone completely sound pretty dumb. Depth is extremely important in this league and you just don't go and cut 1st year starting QB's with an 18-11 TD to INT rate.

chiefscafan
02-06-2009, 03:10 PM
Actually you want to get technical he had similar numbers to matt Ryan

ChiefsCountry
02-06-2009, 03:17 PM
Thigpen stats were very similar to Steve Peuller of the Cowboys in 1988.

-King-
02-06-2009, 03:18 PM
Lol, I wouldn't put him anywhere near Matt Ryan. But if he could do that with Herm and Penis Curl as his coaches, theres no reason he cant get to Matt Ryans level with real NFL coaching. Hell, he can be our own Steve Young. Great qb who can run.

Saccopoo
02-06-2009, 03:24 PM
Ok this is what I've been thinking why not bring in a vet to mentor him such as a kurt warner type. Give thigpen some coaching and watchout. I still saw him make some throws I haven't seen in years. I'm not giving up on him just yet I just think he needs sometime. He actually is pioli's type of Qb.

Me too. I haven't seen a quarterback miss wide open receivers like Thigpen did on occasions too numerous to count since junior high school. Or maybe NAIA football, but I digress. The guy throws beachballs. Or giant wiffleballs. Or oblong marshmallows. Something of that nature.

Sure he deserves a chance. That's why Herm thought he should be on the roster...wait. Scratch that. No chance for him. But seriously, he is going to get the chance. It would be stupid not to give him the chance. However, the only reason he was on the field last season is because the offensive line got Brodie killed and Huard maimed. He was the only option the Chiefs had, and the first three games with Thigpen out there might have been the worst I have ever seen from a quarterback on the NFL level outside of Rex Grossman, and maybe not even him. Then things started shaping up a bit, but not much. And all the credit needs to go to Gailey for that. At least he was able to make the switch in the offense that allowed Thigpen to actually start putting up some numbers. However, his qb'ing was still painful as hell to watch. At least by anyone not named Tony Gonzalez. Then he began to regress again in the final weeks of the season, overthrowing receivers by huge margins, making bad reads, etc. Meltdown.

Yeah, he gets a shot. But they better bring in about five other dudes, including Sanchez/Stafford from the draft to compete. Personally, I felt that it was the Thigpen experiment that truly doomed Carl and Herm. They made no move to get anyone of note to come in and fill the void left by the bloodied, mangled bodies of Croyle and Huard. No one. They thought it best just to let the poor bastard Thigpen die on a vine out there on the field. Many were the comments that the Chiefs were doing so in order to intentionally tank the season for the draft pick. Regardless, it was painful to watch. Very painful.

The_Doctor10
02-06-2009, 04:12 PM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

Word.

Fruit Ninja
02-06-2009, 04:15 PM
Thigpen, you'll get a shot at being the starter, but thinking you are annointed the starter by default is absurd. EARN IT.

Little late on this, but as a QB for the Chiefs or any team, that is the way he should be thinking. Even if he's a 3rd stringer act like you want to be the guy. Dont act like you wanna hold the clipboard and make some money.


I like his attitude. I dont know if he's going to be the QB for the 09 season, but whoever it is, i want them to have the same kind of attitude.

Fruit Ninja
02-06-2009, 04:17 PM
Thigpen better learn how to play under center to give this argument any legitimacy.

The problem is that I don't believe he will be effective as a traditional QB.

I think he can play under center, but or Oline was so horrible that no QB could have played under center. WE lost 2 QB's becuase our Oline cant block worth a fuck. This all happened in 6 games. If we would have stayed in a I formation we would have went through about 2-4 more quarterbacks.


Like i said in my previous post. I dont care who they draft. Draft who they think is best for this team right now. If its a QB, then so be it, If its another position then thats fine as well.

bishop_74
02-06-2009, 04:18 PM
Chiefs + Thigpen > (Broncos + Chargers) - Raiders

DaneMcCloud
02-06-2009, 05:32 PM
Trent Green was cut, so was Warner, Brunell, Hasslebeck, and the list goes on.

Just because one person doesn't work out one place doesn't mean he can't succeed at another.

Brunnel and Hasselbeck were late round picks by the Green Bay Packers that were traded, not cut, for valuable draft picks.

DaneMcCloud
02-06-2009, 05:39 PM
All Thigpen has done is improve and make plays...the guy had none of the luxuries Croyle has. He moves around and makes plays happen, distributes the ball. Doing all of this with an offense that completely changed and no pre season to prepare.

Sometimes fans on here choose strange players to shit on. I hope he keeps getting better and gets a chance to good things for this team.

The problem is Zach that he can't play under center. Do you remember the Raider game? The Atlanta game?

They put him in the spread so that he could better read the defenses. He did a pretty good job of reading the defense in the first half of most of his starts but after halftime, the defenses adjusted and shut him down. The Chiefs lost like 6 or 7 games when they were leading at halftime because of this.

They also had trouble scoring in goal line situations (again, with Thigpen behind center). Part of this was because the right side of the offensive line (the power side) was complete and utter trash but the other part of the equation is that the defenses knew what was coming because Thigpen couldn't read them well enough to throw the ball on the goal line (nor does he possess the accuracy).

I don't think the Chiefs should dump him but it's going to take him years of practice to learn how to read and react under center and quite frankly, it may never happen.

That's not a guy I want starting for my football team.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 05:42 PM
All Thigpen supporters need to go back to watching Hoosiers, Rudy, and Rocky to satisfy their dream of a no talent underachiever making it to the top. It won't happen with Thigpen. I will place a sig bet with anyone out there that Thigpen will not be a starting QB going into the season under Haley and Pioli.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 06:10 PM
Ah the Thigpen lovers are back in full force...I knew it was coming sooner or later.

If you think your franchise QB should be a short guy from a tiny school from a spread offense that can't play from under center more power to you, as a strategy it's a loser but hey.

There are guys drafted in the top 10, guys with a million times Thigpens talent that couldn't learn to do what people act like he can learn to do like it's a piece of cake. When you've been doing something for 6+ years it's hard to change it's like trying to change a guys throwing motion.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 06:13 PM
Ah the Thigpen lovers are back in full force...I knew it was coming sooner or later.

If you think your franchise QB should be a short guy from a tiny school from a spread offense that can't play from under center more power to you, as a strategy it's a loser but hey.

There are guys drafted in the top 10, guys with a million times Thigpens talent that couldn't learn to do what people act like he can learn to do like it's a piece of cake. When you've been doing something for 6+ years it's hard to change it's like trying to change a guys throwing motion.

I agree with you more often than not. We bagged Plummer like crazy around here, but Thigpen and Plummer have similar talents only Thigpen is NOT AS GOOD!!!

Mecca
02-06-2009, 06:16 PM
I agree with you more often than not. We bagged Plummer like crazy around here, but Thigpen and Plummer have similar talents only Thigpen is NOT AS GOOD!!!

Yea Thigpen isn't even Plummer, people get so enamored with running QB's, also people got so caught up in thinking Croyle was it that as soon as Thigpen did anything they were ready to just hand that to him just like they were with Croyle.

These things need to be logically looked at, not just oh shit he's on the Chiefs and he played some he's the future!

KC kid
02-06-2009, 06:17 PM
I shudder to think if the Chiefs kept herm and drafted Pat White. People would be so excited!!!

chiefzilla1501
02-06-2009, 06:35 PM
The problem is Zach that he can't play under center. Do you remember the Raider game? The Atlanta game?

They put him in the spread so that he could better read the defenses. He did a pretty good job of reading the defense in the first half of most of his starts but after halftime, the defenses adjusted and shut him down. The Chiefs lost like 6 or 7 games when they were leading at halftime because of this.

They also had trouble scoring in goal line situations (again, with Thigpen behind center). Part of this was because the right side of the offensive line (the power side) was complete and utter trash but the other part of the equation is that the defenses knew what was coming because Thigpen couldn't read them well enough to throw the ball on the goal line (nor does he possess the accuracy).

I don't think the Chiefs should dump him but it's going to take him years of practice to learn how to read and react under center and quite frankly, it may never happen.

That's not a guy I want starting for my football team.

Yeah, but in his defense, how many QBs could play under center behind that offensive line? The offensive line got the two previous QBs killed. The spread offense was the only offensive set where any QB had any kind of a fighting chance.

Again, I don't know that he's the answer and you have to bring in a QB to compete. But I think he deserves at least a full offseason before we can start talking about his ceiling. If by the end of the offseason, he's still having problems under center and he's still having accuracy issues, than you quickly cut the cord on the experiment.

PastorMikH
02-06-2009, 06:56 PM
The problem is Zach that he can't play under center. Do you remember the Raider game? The Atlanta game?

They put him in the spread so that he could better read the defenses. He did a pretty good job of reading the defense in the first half of most of his starts but after halftime, the defenses adjusted and shut him down. The Chiefs lost like 6 or 7 games when they were leading at halftime because of this.

They also had trouble scoring in goal line situations (again, with Thigpen behind center). Part of this was because the right side of the offensive line (the power side) was complete and utter trash but the other part of the equation is that the defenses knew what was coming because Thigpen couldn't read them well enough to throw the ball on the goal line (nor does he possess the accuracy).

I don't think the Chiefs should dump him but it's going to take him years of practice to learn how to read and react under center and quite frankly, it may never happen.

That's not a guy I want starting for my football team.



1) No QB has been able to play under center with success and without injury since Roaf quit - Thigpen has done the best of all - including Green.

2) Yes, Thigpen could be part of the problem with D's adjusting after halftime. Shouldn't the coaches make adjustments to compensate though? Also, Herm's "Let's run the clock" mentality coming out in the second half sure didn't help the second half.

3) Goal line, this whole team, not just Thigpen has struggled in goal line AND short yardage situations for the last 3 years. Our OL, RB, QB, yound and inexperienced recievers, as well as play-calling all have some impact on that. Truth be known, the Chiefs haven't been good at goal line and short yardage since DV/Saunders/Pre-neck-injury Priest left.


Thigpen is just one of a bunch of players I am wondering how they will perform with a new coaching staff.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 07:04 PM
If you guys really think the reason they were doing spread shit was the line and not the QB, I'm going to question if you're thinking properly.

keg in kc
02-06-2009, 07:07 PM
If you guys really think the reason they were doing spread shit was the line and not the QB, I'm going to question if you're thinking properly.What, you mean going with multiple wide-outs instead of keeping extra blockers in doesn't help the offensive line?

(although in fairness, I'd say it was a combination of QB and o-line - rare instance in the last decade where we actually saw a chiefs coordinator trying to exploit strengths and mitigate weaknesses. but chicken shit never turns into chicken soup, no matter how much you stir, and limited QB + limited o-line = limited offense)

Reerun_KC
02-06-2009, 07:10 PM
There isnt a QB on this roster than has earned or deserves to be on this team at the start of next season...

All of the trash needs taking out...

I would maybe keep Thigpen IF he could complete the most basic out pattern on a consistant basis, but the guy in row 5 has had enough of him knocking over his beer...

chiefzilla1501
02-06-2009, 07:11 PM
If you guys really think the reason they were doing spread shit was the line and not the QB, I'm going to question if you're thinking properly.

The reason they ran the spread offense was because they saw that Thigpen was doing some good things in 2-minute offense drills in practice. So they incorporated it in. Would you deny that the pass protection was 100 times better than it was when any QB was lined up under center? When Thigpen lined up under center, he was running for his life on almost every single play. So regardless of the circumstances leading to it happening, it would be hard for anyone to argue taht any QB would have had much chance playing behind the kind of offensive line that we had. Given that we lost two QBs and were giving up the most sacks in the league before we implemented the spread, there's nothing unusual about this claim.

You know what offense the Steelers ran? It was largely a spread offense too, and for much of the same reasons. Big Ben was getting clobbered, so Arians implemented a lot more spread looks so that Ben wasn't getting killed the minute the ball was snapped.

PastorMikH
02-06-2009, 07:11 PM
If you guys really think the reason they were doing spread was the line and not the QB, I'm going to question if you're thinking properly.



The other QBs on the team did fine behind this OL with the old offense didn't they.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 07:13 PM
The other QBs on the team did fine behind this OL with the old offense didn't they.

They won just as many games as Tyler Thigpen did.

doomy3
02-06-2009, 07:13 PM
There isnt a QB on this roster than has earned or deserves to be on this team at the start of next season...

All of the trash needs taking out...

I would maybe keep Thigpen IF he could complete the most basic out pattern on a consistant basis, but the guy in row 5 has had enough of him knocking over his beer...

so your opinion is that we should just cut Thigpen outright, huh? He wouldn't be on the market for more than 30 seconds if we did that.

Reerun_KC
02-06-2009, 07:15 PM
so your opinion is that we should just cut Thigpen outright, huh? He wouldn't be on the market for more than 30 seconds if we did that.

I dont give a crap what we do with him, aslong as he isnt under center when the season starts... Wait.... He cant play from under center.. Crap, that just screws up my rebuttle....


Nevermind, I need to work on a better rebuttle, brb, going to have to spread this out, cant work from behind keyboard that well...

Mecca
02-06-2009, 07:17 PM
Look Thigpen from under center against the Raiders and Falcons was one of the biggest abominations ever witnessed, he was horrendous he would hit defenders with more balls than the receivers, lets not act like this is all about the line and has nothing to do with him.

I'm tired of this underdog fixation.

stevieray
02-06-2009, 07:17 PM
how many yards and catches between Bowe and Tony?

DaneMcCloud
02-06-2009, 07:29 PM
Look Thigpen from under center against the Raiders and Falcons was one of the biggest abominations ever witnessed, he was horrendous he would hit defenders with more balls than the receivers, lets not act like this is all about the line and has nothing to do with him.

I'm tired of this underdog fixation.

Why don't these Thigpen lovers SEE THIS???

JFC on a crotch-rocket.

Deberg_1990
02-06-2009, 07:43 PM
Here is what i like about Thigpen:

1. Hes got decent legs and mobility. He knows how to escape.
2. Hes a decent passer in the spread on routes within the 5-10 yard range.

Thats about it. I dont see much to build on. He cant play under center. The only thing hes proven is that he can be an ok backup.

I dont see the improvement that some guys are talking about?? He was horrible in that Cinci game.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 07:49 PM
Why don't these Thigpen lovers SEE THIS???

JFC on a crotch-rocket.

Because logic shits on the underdog fantasy, we're talking about a fanbase that wanted Marc Boerigter to be a superstar and that want turned him into something he wasn't.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 07:50 PM
Because logic shits on the underdog fantasy, we're talking about a fanbase that wanted Marc Boerigter to be a superstar and that want turned him into something he wasn't.

boerigter got HURT.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 07:51 PM
boerigter got HURT.

It doesn't change that people acted like he was awesome, it was laughable.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 07:54 PM
It doesn't change that people acted like he was awesome, it was laughable.

he had a good rookie season and then he got HURT, no one knows how good or bad he would have been

chiefs1111
02-06-2009, 08:01 PM
I wouldn't mind Thigpen as the backup..

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:03 PM
I wouldn't mind Thigpen as the backup..

I hope we get some real talent so I don't have to read posts about how shitty guys are our future and people love them anymore.

I'm just tired of this fanbases fixation with the underdog no talent players.

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 08:04 PM
Here is what i like about Thigpen:

1. Hes got decent legs and mobility. He knows how to escape.
2. Hes a decent passer in the spread on routes within the 5-10 yard range.

Thats about it. I dont see much to build on. He cant play under center. The only thing hes proven is that he can be an ok backup.

I dont see the improvement that some guys are talking about?? He was horrible in that Cinci game.

I keep going back to one thing:

What does Thigpen do well?

What does he do well?

All franchise quarterbacks have at least one area they excel REMARKABLY WELL in.

Thigpen is a great scrambler.

All that and a bag of chips will get you 1 win.

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 08:09 PM
Jesus, this is like Croyle part 2.

Yeah, I tell ya' Brock; I made it to your post and decided I'd seen enough of the TF Assclown Brigade washing Thigpens balls.

Five more pages of that shit? No thanks. Let's just cut to the heart of the matter:

You all heard the comments from Scott and Clark regarding Gailey "making the best of a bad QB situation", yes?

This is Pioli's baby now. He's picked his coach and we're off and running. From here on out, Clark goes in to hands-off mode, more or less.

That established, Clark has consistently expressed, from the time of his father's passing, his desire for one thing and one thing only in terms of the roster:

A Franchise Quarterback.

Make no mistake; Clark's "request" WILL be met. And it won't be met with Tyler Thigpen.

Bank It!

Deberg_1990
02-06-2009, 08:09 PM
Threads like this are pointless.

Pioli isnt dumb enough to stake his entire future and reputation on Tyler Thigpen.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:11 PM
Threads like this are pointless.

Pioli isnt dumb enough to stake his entire future and reputation on Tyler Thigpen.

My favorite is to hear Tyler Thigpen get upset Herm was fired and now act like Haley will run the offense for him...

Tyler was right to cry about Herm his firing likely ended him as a starter.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:13 PM
1) No QB has been able to play under center with success and without injury since Roaf quit - Thigpen has done the best of all - including Green.

2) Yes, Thigpen could be part of the problem with D's adjusting after halftime. Shouldn't the coaches make adjustments to compensate though? Also, Herm's "Let's run the clock" mentality coming out in the second half sure didn't help the second half.

3) Goal line, this whole team, not just Thigpen has struggled in goal line AND short yardage situations for the last 3 years. Our OL, RB, QB, yound and inexperienced recievers, as well as play-calling all have some impact on that. Truth be known, the Chiefs haven't been good at goal line and short yardage since DV/Saunders/Pre-neck-injury Priest left.


Thigpen is just one of a bunch of players I am wondering how they will perform with a new coaching staff.


You will never get to see how Thigpen does. Competent coaches will never allow it

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 08:14 PM
My favorite is to hear Tyler Thigpen get upset Herm was fired and now act like Haley will run the offense for him...

Tyler was right to cry about Herm his firing likely ended him as a starter.

His arrogance really turns me off.

I can't stand him. He acts like he's some kind of quarterback of the future and has pull in the locker room.

Herm ate his brain.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:16 PM
His arrogance really turns me off.

I can't stand him. He acts like he's some kind of quarterback of the future and has pull in the locker room.

Herm ate his brain.

Herm made all these players on this 2-14 team think they are great players that accomplished something.

Tyler Thigpen talks like the Chiefs were inches from the Super Bowl.

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 08:18 PM
Herm made all these players on this 2-14 team think they are great players that accomplished something.

Tyler Thigpen talks like the Chiefs were inches from the Super Bowl.

I can't wait to see Pioli and Haley start cutting deadweight.

I want some new busts in here, pronto!

Deberg_1990
02-06-2009, 08:18 PM
Herm made all these players on this 2-14 team think they are great players that accomplished something.



Actually, alot of that is Carl too.

Remember the arrogance of the DV era Chiefs who accomplished exactly nothing, but strutted around like they had multiple ships.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:20 PM
I can't wait to see Pioli and Haley start cutting deadweight.

I want some new busts in here, pronto!

Something that is disconcerting to me is how everyone says Brian Waters is a team leader and he acts like anything good this team does is because of Herm like his comment after Herm was fired

"Where this team goes in the future is due to Herm he built this" or something like that.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:23 PM
I want Tyler to stick around. . . as the third string qb which is all he is

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:23 PM
and herm made these guys think they were something they were not. Fact is, this is a bad team that has to find some talent

unothadeal
02-06-2009, 08:26 PM
I want some new busts in here, pronto!

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l87/kdog414141/Picture5.jpg

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 08:27 PM
You know, all this time I thought that was Chocolate Head Jared.

chiefs1111
02-06-2009, 08:27 PM
and herm made these guys think they were something they were not. Fact is, this is a bad team that has to find some talent

Actually we need to find a lot of talent,not just some

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:35 PM
Will future qbs be able to get 18 TDs in 11 starts? He's young and he's had one season under his belt and yet people are already throwing him under the bus. Ok lets see, with this O line, we have gotten 3 qbs in the injury reserve including the one who damn near ended up being a vegetable. Yet you want us to keep running plays from under center.

He didnt have training camp so we had to make him comfortable. From what I see, he did pretty well. Two people with 1000+ yards and yet he's a bad qb.

How do we know he cant play under center? It's not like he had even an average qb coach to help him. He was thrust into the starting position so what choice did he have? Hmmm, 2 players had just been killed with the o-line, we were one of the worst offenses in the league yet this player came in and made us good and yet he's the worst qb you guys have ever seen.

Have you thought that under good coaching he'd atleast be decent? Or are you saying that Herm really did make bad players look good?

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 08:36 PM
You know, all this time I thought that was Chocolate Head Jared.

I thought it was Tony Danza.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:39 PM
Will future qbs be able to get 18 TDs in 11 starts? He's young and he's had one season under his belt and yet people are already throwing him under the bus. Ok lets see, with this O line, we have gotten 3 qbs in the injury reserve including the one who damn near ended up being a vegetable. Yet you want us to keep running plays from under center.

He didnt have training camp so we had to make him comfortable. From what I see, he did pretty well. Two people with 1000+ yards and yet he's a bad qb.

How do we know he cant play under center? It's not like he had even an average qb coach to help him. He was thrust into the starting position so what choice did he have? Hmmm, 2 players had just been killed with the o-line, we were one of the worst offenses in the league yet this player came in and made us good and yet he's the worst qb you guys have ever seen.

Have you thought that under good coaching he'd atleast be decent? Or are you saying that Herm really did make bad players look good?

Do you trust Scot Pioli? Will you shut up when he brings in Thigpens replacement?

unothadeal
02-06-2009, 08:39 PM
You know, all this time I thought that was Chocolate Head Jared.

Well now you know.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:40 PM
Will future qbs be able to get 18 TDs in 11 starts? He's young and he's had one season under his belt and yet people are already throwing him under the bus. Ok lets see, with this O line, we have gotten 3 qbs in the injury reserve including the one who damn near ended up being a vegetable. Yet you want us to keep running plays from under center.

He didnt have training camp so we had to make him comfortable. From what I see, he did pretty well. Two people with 1000+ yards and yet he's a bad qb.

How do we know he cant play under center? It's not like he had even an average qb coach to help him. He was thrust into the starting position so what choice did he have? Hmmm, 2 players had just been killed with the o-line, we were one of the worst offenses in the league yet this player came in and made us good and yet he's the worst qb you guys have ever seen.

Have you thought that under good coaching he'd atleast be decent? Or are you saying that Herm really did make bad players look good?

The Raider and Falcons games say hello about him playing under center..

You are putting all your argument into stats when if you'd actually judge him on his games you'd get a different view. 18-11 the guy could have literally had 10-15 more balls picked what if he was 18-21? Thigpen had a magical stroke of luck where defenders kept dropping INT's that won't continue ask Damon Huard...

54% completion rate in an offense that is predicated on the QB making easy throws speaks volumes to how inaccurate he is.

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:44 PM
Do you trust Scot Pioli? Will you shut up when he brings in Thigpens replacement?

Yes. I'm pretty sure he knows more about this than anyone here. If he drafts a qb with the 3rd pick, I'll be fine and happy with it. For me, it's either Thigpen, Stafford, or Cassell. We can rule out Cassell. Im not fascinated with Sanchez as much because I dont really know if he's consistent. He played in an USC offense that is great year in and year out no matter who is at qb. I wouldnt put all my eggs on the Dirty Sanchez basket. Thigpen atleast needs a legit shot to be the starter. Stafford is a good qb who played in the best conference in all of college football(Sanchez played in a very average conference). But whatever happens happens. Im not going to bitch either way unlike you guys who will start PMSing if we dont draft Sanchez at 3(Im pretty sure Lions will take Stafford).

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:46 PM
Tell me who the best NFL prospects on the USC offense are...he wasn't playing with Dwayne Jarrett or Mike Williams..

People say this shit without even realizing what was going on at SC or who's on the team.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 08:47 PM
Tell me who the best NFL prospects on the USC offense are...he wasn't playing with Dwayne Jarrett or Mike Williams..

People say this shit without even realizing what was going on at SC or who's on the team.

mike williams???

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:48 PM
The Raider and Falcons games say hello about him playing under center..

You are putting all your argument into stats when if you'd actually judge him on his games you'd get a different view. 18-11 the guy could have literally had 10-15 more balls picked what if he was 18-21? Thigpen had a magical stroke of luck where defenders kept dropping INT's that won't continue ask Damon Huard...

54% completion rate in an offense that is predicated on the QB making easy throws speaks volumes to how inaccurate he is.

The Patriots game says hello about Kurt Warner being near a football.


Your 2nd paragraph is based on a "what if" What's the point of it?

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:48 PM
Yes. I'm pretty sure he knows more about this than anyone here. If he drafts a qb with the 3rd pick, I'll be fine and happy with it. For me, it's either Thigpen, Stafford, or Cassell. We can rule out Cassell. Im not fascinated with Sanchez as much because I dont really know if he's consistent. He played in an USC offense that is great year in and year out no matter who is at qb. I wouldnt put all my eggs on the Dirty Sanchez basket. Thigpen atleast needs a legit shot to be the starter. Stafford is a good qb who played in the best conference in all of college football(Sanchez played in a very average conference). But whatever happens happens. Im not going to bitch either way unlike you guys who will start PMSing if we dont draft Sanchez at 3(Im pretty sure Lions will take Stafford).


I would not be shocked to see Pioli take a later round or lesser name FA Qb and start him ahead of "thiggy"

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:49 PM
mike williams???

Mike Williams was a GREAT college player that's the point I made there, he didn't have a player of that caliber with him when he was playing QB.

I literally wanna hear who this great USC offensive talent this past year was, people just think of Bush and Jarrett or Williams and assume it's always like that.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:50 PM
Mike Williams was a GREAT college player that's the point I made there, he didn't have a player of that caliber with him when he was playing QB.

I literally wanna hear who this great USC offensive talent this past year was, people just think of Bush and Jarrett or Williams and assume it's always like that.

USC does not have the top tier offensive talent they had in the past. I like Gable, but he is no Reggie Bush or Moreno

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:53 PM
USC does not have the top tier offensive talent they had in the past. I like Gable, but he is no Reggie Bush or Moreno

I think Stafon Johnson will be a starter in the NFL as a RB but he is not a super duper back.

And then who do you got after that? Damian Williams he's a nice player but he's not a star, the USC skill positions were down this year there was nothing resembling a Williams, Jarrett or Bush out there.

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:54 PM
Tell me who the best NFL prospects on the USC offense are...he wasn't playing with Dwayne Jarrett or Mike Williams..

People say this shit without even realizing what was going on at SC or who's on the team.

Yeah Dwayne Jarrett has really blown up. Just look at what he's become.

USC players have done terrible once they come into the league lately. The best ones were backups at USC(White/Cassel).

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 08:54 PM
Mike Williams was a GREAT college player that's the point I made there, he didn't have a player of that caliber with him when he was playing QB.

I literally wanna hear who this great USC offensive talent this past year was, people just think of Bush and Jarrett or Williams and assume it's always like that.

but as a prospect???

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:54 PM
Yeah Dwayne Jarrett has really blown up. Just look at what he's become.

USC players have done terrible once they come into the league lately. The best ones were backups at USC(White/Cassel).

I'm talking about what they were in college, jesus are you dumb?

The point was about who he's playing with at SC so it's what they are as college players, for the love of christ man.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:55 PM
USC had an NFL defense and a low end division one offense. Sanchez really could use more experience though before locking him in the top 3 picks. I am stil a Stafford guy

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:57 PM
Mike Williams was a GREAT college player that's the point I made there, he didn't have a player of that caliber with him when he was playing QB.

I literally wanna hear who this great USC offensive talent this past year was, people just think of Bush and Jarrett or Williams and assume it's always like that.

No you dont get it. I'm saying that Sanchez has the talent to play. But he needs more experience. ONE year is not enough. He had 2 years to start after his red shirt year, and he's just now starting. Why? How come he couldn't beat out Booty for the job even after Booty had surgery? How do we know he didn't have a fluke year. After all, Booty didnt have Jarrett/Mike Williams/Reggie Bush talent either, and they posted almost the same numbers.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 08:58 PM
can we all agree that leinart was a product of the talent around him and Sanchez does not have the same level of talent?

-King-
02-06-2009, 08:58 PM
USC had an NFL defense and a low end division one offense. Sanchez really could use more experience though before locking him in the top 3 picks. I am stil a Stafford guy

Finally! This is what I'm saying. Sanchez obviously has talent, but he's as inexperienced as can be aside from being a rarity like Matt Cassell. Stafford is ready for the NFL. He is years ahead of Sanchez.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 08:59 PM
Booty played with Jarrett there pal...

And for the record last year all the offensive coaches told Carroll they felt Sanchez should start over Booty and Carroll overruled them...

I think I know a bit more about SC than 99% of people that post here.

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:01 PM
can we all agree that leinart was a product of the talent around him and Sanchez does not have the same level of talent?

Or is Leinart the one who made the people around him look like they had talent? Dwayne Jarrett is on the practice squad now and Steve Smith is a 4th string WR. Who knows?

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:02 PM
Booty played with Jarrett there pal...

And for the record last year all the offensive coaches told Carroll they felt Sanchez should start over Booty and Carroll overruled them...

I think I know a bit more about SC than 99% of people that post here.

True. But dont you think that he's inexperienced? I mean, one year is no reason to make you a #3 pick.

Mecca
02-06-2009, 09:02 PM
LOL Jarrett is on the damn Panthers roster, I like how anyone who doesn't start is on the practice squad.

Jesus why must we get such dumbass posters?

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 09:03 PM
Steve Smith caught 57 balls last year.

He's a damn good player.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 09:04 PM
williams is the only one who ended up just absolutely sucking, and leinart was a product of the talent around him IMO, Sanchez is a much better player and prospect IMO.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 09:05 PM
Steve Smith caught 57 balls last year.

He's a damn good player.

and reggie bush and white? and sam baker

Mecca
02-06-2009, 09:06 PM
Bush is a good player too, anyone who thinks he's a total bust is stupid they just expected way to much of him.

KC kid
02-06-2009, 09:06 PM
I HATED Leinart coming out of college. I think Sanchez is ok and most years would be a mid teen pick. I think Stafford is a physical specimen above and beyong sanchez but that does not make him a better player

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 09:06 PM
can we all agree that leinart was a product of the talent around him and Sanchez does not have the same level of talent?

No. No we can not. I would normally insult you at this point. I am going to refrain, because the very question you pose says more about your dumbassery than I EVER could.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 09:07 PM
No. No we can not. I would normally insult you at this point. I am going to refrain, because the very question you pose says more about your dumbassery than I EVER could.

calm down, i think he meant that sanchez didnt have the talent around him leinart had

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:07 PM
LOL Jarrett is on the damn Panthers roster, I like how anyone who doesn't start is on the practice squad.

Jesus why must we get such dumbass posters?

He was on the practice squad for the whole 2007 season. Last season he was inactive most games.

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:09 PM
Bush is a good player too, anyone who thinks he's a total bust is stupid they just expected way to much of him.

He's ok, but for a #2 pick eh...

Mecca
02-06-2009, 09:09 PM
He was on the practice squad for the whole 2007 season. Last season he was inactive most games.

He was on their roster...if any team put a 2nd round pick on their PS he'd get claimed in a matter of minutes.

Please don't argue something that isn't true he's been on their roster his entire career.

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 09:09 PM
calm down, i think he meant that sanchez didnt have the talent around him leinart had

You are correct; my apologies to KC Kid.

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 09:09 PM
Apologies to KC Kid.

JASONSAUTO
02-06-2009, 09:10 PM
You are correct; my apologies to KC Kid.

:D

Mecca
02-06-2009, 09:10 PM
He's ok, but for a #2 pick eh...

Blame the Saints for that...even SC didn't use Bush as a workhorse back and that was in college.

Bush is a playmaker and extremely versatile but you aren't gonna pound him up the middle of your line 20 times that isn't his game.

Hell dude catches 100 passes.

Count Alex's Losses
02-06-2009, 09:10 PM
Apologies to KC Kid.

Aw, you're so sweet!

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:11 PM
He was on their roster...if any team put a 2nd round pick on their PS he'd get claimed in a matter of minutes.

Please don't argue something that isn't true he's been on their roster his entire career.

Sorry, My bad, you're right. But still, he has been inactive most of his career

Darth CarlSatan
02-06-2009, 09:12 PM
Aw, you're so sweet!

:doh!:Oi!

-King-
02-06-2009, 09:13 PM
Blame the Saints for that...even SC didn't use Bush as a workhorse back and that was in college.

Bush is a playmaker and extremely versatile but you aren't gonna pound him up the middle of your line 20 times that isn't his game.

Hell dude catches 100 passes.

He isnt a work horse back, and the Saints didnt use him like one. They used McAllister for that.