PDA

View Full Version : Chiefs What makes me feel good about the Cassel trade...


SNR
02-28-2009, 05:30 PM
This trade is proof that we're trying to actually build a SYSTEM.

You hear constantly about teams that have system players. Players that have success for teams, but won't do well outside because they're "system" players. The Herm years had no system, we were trying to acquire as much talent as we could through the draft (fair strategy) and had no way of coaching them into a team cohesion.

I'd like to remind people that for years, Tom Brady was one of those "system" players. He was a system QB. Flat out. Remember for years that people didn't think Tom Brady was even a top 3 QB in the NFL due to young player mistakes that he made? The 2001 year of the Super Bowl was full of bad, stupid mistakes by Brady. The next year wasn't any better. It wasn't until the 2003 season that the Patriots REALLY started to win lots of games, and Brady finally asserted himself as the real leader of the Patriots. The result? The Patriots won two more Super Bowls and had a 16-0 season.

Remember what Pioli said. It's not necessarily about the best players, but the players that fit the system and are all on the same page.

That's what Cassel will give us. People are quick to point out his flaws. That's because he went through the first year of learning how to play in the NFL. He's not going to look like the best QB even in the AFCW. But he fits this new good ol' boy system that we have installed.

So no, he doesn't have the talent or upside of Stafford or Sanchez. I'm pretty sure that Pioli and Haley BOTH know this. That was never the direction they were going.

BradyFTW!
02-28-2009, 05:36 PM
Brady never made a lot of dumb mistakes- that's exactly why he kept the starting job when Bledsoe was healthy. He didn't win many games back then, either. The Patriots' philosophy, though, is that you need to build a good defense, not turn the ball over, create some turnovers on D, and win the field position battle,

Personally, I think the whole "system player" thing is overdone, and don't get why it's used to degrade guys. Tom Brady, Mike Vrabel, Troy Brown, Rodney Harrison, and Ty Law were all system players, in that they knew their role, played it to perfection, and maximized their abilities. Why is that a bad thing? Someone else can take a team of workout warriors, I'll take a team of "system" players, and we'll see whose team wins.

Thig Lyfe
02-28-2009, 05:38 PM
Brady never made a lot of dumb mistakes- that's exactly why he kept the starting job when Bledsoe was healthy. He didn't win many games back then, either. The Patriots' philosophy, though, is that you need to build a good defense, not turn the ball over, create some turnovers on D, and win the field position battle,

Personally, I think the whole "system player" thing is overdone, and don't get why it's used to degrade guys. Tom Brady, Mike Vrabel, Troy Brown, Rodney Harrison, and Ty Law were all system players, in that they knew their role, played it to perfection, and maximized their abilities. Why is that a bad thing? Someone else can take a team of workout warriors, I'll take a team of "system" players, and we'll see whose team wins.

I don't think you're very good at reading.

DaFace
02-28-2009, 05:39 PM
For me, it's just the fact that the NFL is looking at it and saying, "Man, the Chiefs got one hell of a deal there." I always felt like we got the short end of the stick with Carl. I hope this will be the first of many deals that we get the better half.

doomy3
02-28-2009, 05:42 PM
I don't think you're very good at reading.

Seems to me he replied to a sentence that was written exactly like that in the OP.

CaliforniaChief
02-28-2009, 05:43 PM
I think it's a phenomenal deal. I was lukewarm to the idea believing we'd have to surrender multiple draft picks to get him...but to get a guy who has demonstrated his ability on an NFL field at a playoff-caliber level AND a leader/mentor who is still a good football player like Vrabel, all for a second-round pick...yeah that works for me.

But it's impossible to evaluate one trade apart from the whole season. Once we head to camp we can really evaluate the complete picture...this is just a big piece of it.

Thig Lyfe
02-28-2009, 05:44 PM
Seems to me he replied to a sentence that was written exactly like that in the OP.

Wha?

Mr. Krab
02-28-2009, 05:46 PM
1. we didn't get shafted on the trade price. carl peterson almost always got killed.

2. Even if the players don't turn out to be great, at least they make sense for what we are trying to do.

2a Vrabel is an experienced guy on a defense full of young guys who can help coach them up for a new defense.

2b Cassel is a young but relatively experienced Quarterback who will still carry some respect with key players like Tony and Waters.

most make sense and don't leave you saying "WTF" like most of our moves normally did under the previous administration.

BradyFTW!
02-28-2009, 05:46 PM
Seems to me he replied to a sentence that was written exactly like that in the OP.

Yup, I pretty much agreed with the general sentiment, but disagreed with two ideas.

1: Brady made a bunch of stupid mistakes in 2001-2002 (he didn't)
2: The Patriots didn't win a lot of games until 2003 (how can you win a SB without winning a lot of games?)

The rest was just agreeing with the OP's point and tying it back, a bit, to Pioli's past experience.

Thig Lyfe
02-28-2009, 05:48 PM
Yup, I pretty much agreed with the general sentiment, but disagreed with two ideas.

1: Brady made a bunch of stupid mistakes in 2001-2002 (he didn't)
2: The Patriots didn't win a lot of games until 2003 (how can you win a SB without winning a lot of games?)

I thought you were somehow implying that SNR thought system players were a bad thing. My bad.

doomy3
02-28-2009, 05:50 PM
Remember for years that people didn't think Tom Brady was even a top 3 QB in the NFL due to young player mistakes that he made? The 2001 year of the Super Bowl was full of bad, stupid mistakes by Brady. The next year wasn't any better.


Brady never made a lot of dumb mistakes- that's exactly why he kept the starting job when Bledsoe was healthy. He didn't win many games back then, either. The Patriots' philosophy, though, is that you need to build a good defense, not turn the ball over, create some turnovers on D, and win the field position battle,

I don't think you're very good at reading.

Wha?

:spock:

Thig Lyfe
02-28-2009, 05:56 PM
:spock:

I was referring to the "system player" stuff, not the stuff about Tom Brady's mistakes. I thought he was arguing with SNR that system players are good when SNR was already saying that.

And I already said my bad.

doomy3
02-28-2009, 05:57 PM
I was referring to the "system player" stuff, not the stuff about Tom Brady's mistakes. I thought he was arguing with SNR that system players are good when SNR was already saying that.

And I already said my bad.

Gotcha. I was messing with the quotes when you sent your last reply. It's cool

BradyFTW!
02-28-2009, 06:02 PM
I was referring to the "system player" stuff, not the stuff about Tom Brady's mistakes. I thought he was arguing with SNR that system players are good when SNR was already saying that.

And I already said my bad.

Yeah, that was my bad, probably. Should have clarified where the disagreement ended and the agreement began.

'Hamas' Jenkins
02-28-2009, 06:05 PM
What the fuck is a Cover 2 if not a system?

MichaelH
02-28-2009, 06:10 PM
I've been tickled since Carl left and then Hermie got fired. Anything the new regime puts into place will be strides above anything Carl could ever dream about. The Cassel trade only confirms my feelings.

speak24
02-28-2009, 07:21 PM
:Scanlon::Scanlon::shake::shake:

Can't be worse than the last several years...

FAX
02-28-2009, 07:23 PM
What the **** is a Cover 2 if not a system?

It is a "cystem".

A lot of people get that one confused.

FAX

speak24
02-28-2009, 07:27 PM
pull my finger...

unlurking
02-28-2009, 07:29 PM
What the fuck is a Cover 2 if not a system?
shytstem