PDA

View Full Version : Other Sports Fantasy Baseball Draft Strategies


soundmind
03-08-2009, 01:31 PM
I have played Fantasy Football since 1997, and feel like I have a pretty good grip on it. Having played the actual sport for over a decade, and having an unhealthy interest in the sport my whole life, I've never really worried about the draft, waivers, trades....it all makes sense to me.

However, in an attempt to fall back in love with baseball, I agreed to join a fantasy baseball league, and I'm just curious what some strategies are for the draft?

I realize like any sport, there's positional value, but having basically stopped watching since the strike, I'm fearful I'm going to end up picking 3+ players based solely on name recognition (which isn't good, cause they're probably old!)....

Any help and/or wisdom is welcomed and appreciated.

Old Dog
03-08-2009, 01:33 PM
5x5 roto, head to head, or what's the scoring system?

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-08-2009, 01:34 PM
Don't draft a pitcher in the first 5-6 rounds.

Tend towards players who have good home parks to play in if it's a tossup (Coors, Arlington, that shitbox in Philly).

Beware of Matt Holliday.

soundmind
03-08-2009, 01:35 PM
5x5 roto, head to head, or what's the scoring system?

It's a 12-team head to head league, with a standard scoring system - though my friend has told me he gives just a little more love to Relief Pitching than most leagues, "but nothing crazy".

Obviously the scoring system is paramount in my research.

Old Dog
03-08-2009, 01:37 PM
Closers (IMO) are more important in a head to head league. Still don't want one in about the top 5 rounds, but a GOOD one can win saves for you and do a lot of good in WHIP and ERA in a given week.
In a roto, they're not as important toward WHIP and ERA

58-4ever
03-08-2009, 01:37 PM
Get at least one closer that can get you points for ERA, saves, WHIP, etc...

I've had K-Rod the last few years, and he's been a gem.

soundmind
03-08-2009, 01:39 PM
Don't draft a pitcher in the first 5-6 rounds.

Tend towards players who have good home parks to play in if it's a tossup (Coors, Arlington, that shitbox in Philly).

Beware of Matt Holliday.

Thus far, your ballpark comment has definitely been echoed by some others, and sounds right on.

Are there any "bad" ballparks to call home vs. the "good" ones? I would assume a "bad" park is one that's HUGE.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-08-2009, 01:40 PM
Thus far, your ballpark comment has definitely been echoed by some others, and sounds right on.

Are there any "bad" ballparks to call home vs. the "good" ones?

Petco is the worst, by far.
Safeco is pretty bad.
Dodger Stadium isn't great
Metrodome
PNC
McAfee (A's ballpark)

Short Leash Hootie
03-08-2009, 01:41 PM
It's a 12-team head to head league.

ok, here you go...

Stay away from drafting starting pitching...if you want to be good, you stream...plain and simple...streaming means you keep 2 or 3 open spots on your pitching rotation and every day you stream starting pitchers...you want to play match-ups as much as you can...side with home pitchers against bad offenses, etc...but you want to start 2 or 3 pitchers a day.

Then you draft 4 or 5 closers...2 great closers, 2 good ones, and maybe take a waiver at a few late closers for shitty teams...

That way...every week you'll most likely win 3 of the 5 pitching categories...wins/K's/saves...

On to offense...

I tend to sacrifice one category and draft others...I usually don't go for SB's...so I draft power guys...I'd focus my entire first 5 rounds on guys that hit a lot of homeruns and drive in a lot of runs...

I also take flyers on guys who are usually good but have down years the year before...

I haven't prepared for my fantasy drafts yet...but use ESPN's live draft lobby to practice a few...and this list is probably the best tool you can use to know when a player should be taken...

http://games.espn.go.com/flb/livedraftresults

I'm not a big fan of H2H because of the streaming factor...but if you want to win you have to do it.

I usually play roto leagues...it's much more about skill than activity...which is why a lot of people sour on FBA and FLB...and love FFL.

Short Leash Hootie
03-08-2009, 01:43 PM
It's imperative you draft at least 3 closers...I'd go with 4 or 5.

If you only draft 1 or 2, you might as well just draft 0.

soundmind
03-08-2009, 03:46 PM
ok, here you go...

Stay away from drafting starting pitching...if you want to be good, you stream...plain and simple...streaming means you keep 2 or 3 open spots on your pitching rotation and every day you stream starting pitchers...you want to play match-ups as much as you can...side with home pitchers against bad offenses, etc...but you want to start 2 or 3 pitchers a day.


Oh craptastic, so playing a H2H league means I've started my Fantasy Baseball journey on the highly involved side....damnit.

Thanks for all the help guys, this is all being committed to my draft day notes!

soundmind
03-08-2009, 03:50 PM
On to offense...

I tend to sacrifice one category and draft others...I usually don't go for SB's...so I draft power guys...I'd focus my entire first 5 rounds on guys that hit a lot of homeruns and drive in a lot of runs...

I also take flyers on guys who are usually good but have down years the year before...



Is there a reason you steer away from the speed guys? One of my mock drafts, I got complimented at the end for snagging speed - granted they were all late picks....Logic is trying to tell me that the guys who carry the biggest sticks are potentially contributing in more categories....?

Short Leash Hootie
03-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Oh craptastic, so playing a H2H league means I've started my Fantasy Baseball journey on the highly involved side....damnit.

Thanks for all the help guys, this is all being committed to my draft day notes!

Depends on what kind of league it is...if it's casual, streaming probably won't happen...if it is competitive, people will be staying up until midnight every night snagging the best SP on the waiver wire...

I tend to go with HR hitters because they are generally 4 tool players while guys like Tavaras in Colorado really only steals bases...and he steals an OF power spot on your roster...

I usually just forfeit SB's when I draft H2H...and ERA/WHIP...

Power guys and closers...I'd spend my first 6 picks or so on offense and then turn to closers for the next 4 rounds (unless you find a great value somewhere) and then take guys like Rich Harden later on (good SP that will fall) or starters that switched from the AL to the NL...

If you're in a casual league and you stream 10 SP games a week...you will pretty much be guaranteed the playoffs.

Denver Dave
03-08-2009, 04:22 PM
It's imperative you draft at least 3 closers...I'd go with 4 or 5.

If you only draft 1 or 2, you might as well just draft 0.


Not true. With 1 or 2 safe closers, you are fine. 10-12 closer jobs in baseball will not have the same guys who start the season in those roles. There's also established closers who will go on the DL and have temp replacements for 15-20 days.

If a manager stays on of top it by following box scores, it's easy to pick up relievers who will find their way into closer roles.

When it comes to winning in fantasy baseball, having 4-5 closers is important, but a manager doesn't have to invest a lot of resources in them to get there.

soundmind
03-08-2009, 06:19 PM
Not true. With 1 or 2 safe closers, you are fine. 10-12 closer jobs in baseball will not have the same guys who start the season in those roles. There's also established closers who will go on the DL and have temp replacements for 15-20 days.

If a manager stays on of top it by following box scores, it's easy to pick up relievers who will find their way into closer roles.

When it comes to winning in fantasy baseball, having 4-5 closers is important, but a manager doesn't have to invest a lot of resources in them to get there.

So in my last draft, which may have been the best yet (position 10/12), I ended up with Lidge and Soria before taking a SP. I reached some on both I guess, but you'd just about have to dominate with that right??? Seems like you're much better off to draft at the bottom in baseball....:hmmm:

My "aces" ended up being Liriano and Dempster....again, not knowing a ton that felt WEAK - however I felt pretty bada$$ with Howard/Utley as my 1st and 2nd...

Is it wise to spread your guys out on different teams, or does that matter a lot less in fantasy baseball? Just noticed that I keep drafting a lot of Phillies.

duncan_idaho
03-08-2009, 06:54 PM
As a new fantasy baseball player, I'd advise you NOT to be a streamer. It's a b.s. tactic, and most of the leagues I play in now take measures to prevent teams from doing it.

If you do plan to stream, however, check to make sure your league doesn't have a limit of the maximum number of moves you can make. There was a guy new to our league last year who burned through 30 of his 75 moves in the first month before he realized there was a limit... it was quite hilarious.

Anyway, I think it's a dubious tactic, at best. And you can counteract it by loading up on RPs. If you have enough saves coming in to dominate that category and do a nice job of adding stud setup men (Scott Linebrink in the past is a good example) who generally have low ERAs and WHIPS, you can dominate Saves, ERA and WHIP just as much as a streamer will dominate Ws and Ks.

The nice thing is that good setup men are almost always available following the draft, and they pop up during the season, too.

In H2H, i usually go heavy on hitters early and make sure I come out of the draft with at least 4 closers (and maybe a guy or two who could take over as a closer). For starting pitchers, if SP isn't a required position, I will completely ignore them. It basically means you sacrifice Ks and Ws every week, but if you do a good job with your relief corps, you are going to win pitching 3-2 most weeks, and you should have a strong lineup because you're drafting hitters throughout the early rounds (when other teams are starting to add top-notch starters).

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-08-2009, 07:02 PM
That's why I like the league I play in.

H2H

The mass stats for pitching are Ws, Ls, Saves
Other pitching stats are K/9, Whip, and ERA

So if you stream, you're most likely going to get your shit pushed in in K/9 and losses, and because you are using lower quality pitchers, one or two bad starts will cause a spike in WHIP and/or ERA.

Plus, there is a 25 IP minimum.

Streaming is the fantasy equivalent of cheezing in Madden.

Denver Dave
03-08-2009, 08:29 PM
So in my last draft, which may have been the best yet (position 10/12), I ended up with Lidge and Soria before taking a SP. I reached some on both I guess, but you'd just about have to dominate with that right??? Seems like you're much better off to draft at the bottom in baseball....:hmmm:

I don't think there's anything wrong with drafting a closer that's likely to keep the job for the entire season.

Some managers like to draft an abundance of bottom barrell closers in the teens. It's a great strategy, but the downside to that is you could use a pick on a guy in round 20 who keeps the closer job for two weeks (Mark Lowe-SEA), while your competition plucks Tommy Hanson who goes on to win the NL ROY.

My point in my original post was you don't have to get 4-5 closers in your initial draft. As the season progresses, it's easy to accumulate closers if you stay on top of baseball news.

It's good to get as many closers as you can, but having the best position players and starting pitchers wins championships. Don't let good starting pitchers/position players drop just to pick up a closer.

My "aces" ended up being Liriano and Dempster....again, not knowing a ton that felt WEAK - however I felt pretty bada$$ with Howard/Utley as my 1st and 2nd...

Is it wise to spread your guys out on different teams, or does that matter a lot less in fantasy baseball? Just noticed that I keep drafting a lot of Phillies.

Howard and Utley are safe picks. Put them on as many teams as you can. I think it's good to have a diverse portfolio, but mainly on guys that are riskier (i.e. A.J. Burnett, Rich Harden). Try to limit how many teams you rely on them.

Short Leash Hootie
03-08-2009, 09:42 PM
That's why I like the league I play in.

H2H

The mass stats for pitching are Ws, Ls, Saves
Other pitching stats are K/9, Whip, and ERA

So if you stream, you're most likely going to get your shit pushed in in K/9 and losses, and because you are using lower quality pitchers, one or two bad starts will cause a spike in WHIP and/or ERA.

Plus, there is a 25 IP minimum.

Streaming is the fantasy equivalent of cheezing in Madden.
Meh.

I've played Fantasy Baseball for over a decade...I prefer Roto but streaming isn't cheezing, it's strategy.

I've been in west coast leagues where I couldn't stay up until 2 or 3 AM every morning so I'd stream two days in advance...

I only play in leagues that are competitive...so yeah, maybe it's cheezing in a public yahoo league...but a pay league...if you sign up for H2H and there is no limit for transactions, you're throwing your money away if you don't stream.

As for the guy earlier who said something about dominating ERA/WHIP/Saves...the point of streaming is to load up on enough closers to ensure that you'll win the Saves category 90% of the time...

Anyways...I'd strongly suggest any casual or first time player to play in Roto leagues...H2H is a lot of work...

|Zach|
03-08-2009, 10:13 PM
people will be staying up until midnight every night snagging the best SP on the waiver wire...


That sounds like a terrible existence.

The Bad Guy
03-08-2009, 10:25 PM
Any retard can pick up guys every day based on matchups. That's not strategy, that's the epitome of being a fucking cheeseball.

That's why you join a league with move limits.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-08-2009, 10:28 PM
Meh.

I've played Fantasy Baseball for over a decade...I prefer Roto but streaming isn't cheezing, it's strategy.

I've been in west coast leagues where I couldn't stay up until 2 or 3 AM every morning so I'd stream two days in advance...

I only play in leagues that are competitive...so yeah, maybe it's cheezing in a public yahoo league...but a pay league...if you sign up for H2H and there is no limit for transactions, you're throwing your money away if you don't stream.

As for the guy earlier who said something about dominating ERA/WHIP/Saves...the point of streaming is to load up on enough closers to ensure that you'll win the Saves category 90% of the time...

Anyways...I'd strongly suggest any casual or first time player to play in Roto leagues...H2H is a lot of work...

The point of setting up leagues against streaming and setting max transactions is so that people with no lives and an inability to find pitching talent don't have an advantage from Zerging the waiver wire.

soundmind
03-08-2009, 11:26 PM
The point of setting up leagues against streaming and setting max transactions is so that people with no lives and an inability to find pitching talent don't have an advantage from Zerging the waiver wire.

What's a reasonable limit for transactions to limit streaming? Either weekly or season, or both....?

Sanka
03-09-2009, 02:18 AM
I had my first draft tonight, this is a 10 man league

C: Ryan Doumit
1B: Carlos Pena. Garrett Atkins, Prince Fielder, Hank Blalock
2B: Ian Kinsler, Howie Kendrick
3B: Garrett Atkins, Hank Blalock, Adrian Beltre
SS: Ryan Theriot
OF: Alfonso Soriano, Nick Markakis, Torii Hunter, Jayson Werth, Coco Crisp
SP: Jake Peavy, Scott Kazmir, Derek Lowe, Gavin Floyd, Chris Volstad
Closers: Carlos Marmol, Kerry Wood, Bobby Jenks, Mike Gonzalez

ChiefsCountry
03-09-2009, 02:58 AM
I play the pitching route, I sort of scheme but I then again I don't. I dont sit there and stalk pitchers on the wavier wire but I load up on pitching. Its amazing the retards that you can steal a home run hitter in a trade for starting pitching from and you can replace that with wavier wire/rookie/hot hand guys. I normally keep to the miniuim on batters, for the most part I look for guys who are durable and play every day. Fantasy baseball is a lot of fun but it takes a ton of work. Good luck its a great way to stay involved with the game, you will be watching SportsCenter and Baseball Tonight alot more closely.

chiefzilla1501
03-09-2009, 03:38 AM
Is there a reason you steer away from the speed guys? One of my mock drafts, I got complimented at the end for snagging speed - granted they were all late picks....Logic is trying to tell me that the guys who carry the biggest sticks are potentially contributing in more categories....?

Hmm... I disagree with Hootie. SBs can be a huge game-winner because I think too many fantasy players are obsessed with HRs and RBIs or obsessed with players who bring a lot of speed but are crappy everywhere else. My advice would be to steer clear from guys like Taveras--you do NOT want to sacrifice HRs, RBIs, and OPS just to move up one or two spots in the SBs category. My approach has always been to overrank players who are productive in HRs and SBs. I prefer guys who can hit 30 HRs and 30 SBs over guys who can hit 45 HRs with 0 SBs. I would have players like Ramirez and Reyes especially, and then someone like Sizemore on the top of your list. I would also consider reaching for guys like Rollins or Carl Crawford, two guys who will light up your SB categories and while they will not dazzle in any other category, they won't kill you either. The key is not to avoid the SB category altogether, it's to avoid guys like Taveras and to avoid loading your roster with too many guys like Rollins or Crawford--you only need one or two of the Rollins/Crawford mold. In later rounds, if you think two players are fairly equal, always let SBs be a tie-breaker--you'll be surprised at how building a roster full of 15 SB guys can really make you dangerous. I would also really overrate a guy like Bobby Abreu. Here's why I don't like sacrificing one category--every league will have one lucky son of a bitch who will end up with a 10-HR guy who for some reason is hitting 40 HRs for you that season. You don't want to put all your eggs into the HR or RBI basket because even if you stack your team with thoroughbreds, you might still get beat by someone who got lucky.

The key to winning fantasy baseball from an offensive standpoint is not to win any category. It's to be good enough that you're 7 out of 10 on almost every dimension and that no dimension makes you fall less than 5. Too many people are focuses on being 10 of 10 on only a few key categories and that's the wrong approach.

My second word of advice? Never give up. Never. I promise you that about half or your league will stop paying attention by midseason--almost every year I place in the top 3 because I am a vulture in midseason when there are a ton more quality players on the waiver wire because nobody else paid any attention.

Pay close attention to saves. And don't be afraid to reach. This is a category that is extremely difficult to upgrade after the draft, so make absolutely sure that you have 2 stud closers on your roster. If you don't have 2 studs, you need to carry 3 good ones on your roster. Again, no reason to sacrifice one category. And in almost every draft I've been in, there's a huge run on closers in one of the rounds. Don't miss out on the wave, or else you'll be picking from the scrap pile.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 05:42 AM
The point of setting up leagues against streaming and setting max transactions is so that people with no lives and an inability to find pitching talent don't have an advantage from Zerging the waiver wire.

Well either way, drafting starting pitching is completely overrated.

Every year 5-15 guys no one have ever heard of end up having the best seasons...I.E. Edinson Volquez.

If I'm drafting H2H, I'm spending my first 5-7 picks on offense, my next 3-5 on closers are guys who have fallen too far, and then I cherry pick the end of the draft for guys like Rich Harden who could be the #1 pitcher in the game but everyone stays away from because of injury history...or established guys that had a rough prior season...or guys that make the switch from the AL to NL...

I'd make some suggestions but I haven't prepared for my drafts yet...

Either way, you'll never see Grady Sizemore on my team...I think he has bust written all over him this year.

and Albert Pujols should be the #1 pick, not Hanley Ramirez.

That dude can say whatever he wants about SB's in H2H, it's definitely the one offensive category worth sacrificing.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 08:16 AM
What's a reasonable limit for transactions to limit streaming? Either weekly or season, or both....?

50-60 per season.

The best thing is just to have an active commish who will lock douchebags who pull off that horseshit strategy.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 08:17 AM
I had my first draft tonight, this is a 10 man league

C: Ryan Doumit
1B: Carlos Pena. Garrett Atkins, Prince Fielder, Hank Blalock
2B: Ian Kinsler, Howie Kendrick
3B: Garrett Atkins, Hank Blalock, Adrian Beltre
SS: Ryan Theriot
OF: Alfonso Soriano, Nick Markakis, Torii Hunter, Jayson Werth, Coco Crisp
SP: Jake Peavy, Scott Kazmir, Derek Lowe, Gavin Floyd, Chris Volstad
Closers: Carlos Marmol, Kerry Wood, Bobby Jenks, Mike Gonzalez

Your team is awful.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 08:24 AM
Your team is awful.

It's like he didn't get a pick until the 3rd round...and then only got a pick every other round after that.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 08:28 AM
50-60 per season.

The best thing is just to have an active commish who will lock douchebags who pull off that horseshit strategy.

Back in the day, ESPN.com was where the most competitive fantasy sports were played...everything was pay to play and there were thousands of players who took that shit balls to the wall serious.

I was one of them.

Seems like the only people who call it horseshit strategy are the ones who can't pull it off...

Streaming is part of H2H...H2H with capped transactions is Roto, plain and simple.

Roto is geared towards a great, balanced draft with educated waiver wire moves...capping H2H is rotoissifying H2H...so my advice to you is...stop bitching about streaming in H2H and start playing Roto...

Or get into a league that doesn't allow ANY waiver wire moves...those are fun leagues.

I would LOVE to play in a fantasy baseball league, ANY scoring system, against you so I could whip the living shit out of you...fantasy baseball is the one fantasy sport that is geared more towards skill and knowledge rather than luck (FFL).

duncan_idaho
03-09-2009, 10:54 AM
Back in the day, ESPN.com was where the most competitive fantasy sports were played...everything was pay to play and there were thousands of players who took that shit balls to the wall serious.

I was one of them.

Seems like the only people who call it horseshit strategy are the ones who can't pull it off...

Streaming is part of H2H...H2H with capped transactions is Roto, plain and simple.

Roto is geared towards a great, balanced draft with educated waiver wire moves...capping H2H is rotoissifying H2H...so my advice to you is...stop bitching about streaming in H2H and start playing Roto...

Or get into a league that doesn't allow ANY waiver wire moves...those are fun leagues.

I would LOVE to play in a fantasy baseball league, ANY scoring system, against you so I could whip the living shit out of you...fantasy baseball is the one fantasy sport that is geared more towards skill and knowledge rather than luck (FFL).

"Pulling off" streaming is not difficult. Anybody with the time to do it and a rudimentary knowledge of baseball can "pull off" streaming. Only cost is staying up late so you can "push the button" before the other guys.

I have consistently crushed a few guys in a H2H league (with no move limits) that I play in by loading up on relievers myself. The streamers tend to go with more "value" closers than true studs like Nathan, I guess since they figure they're punting ERA and WHIP anyway, so I am still able to dominate them in saves (having 2-3 setup guys on your roster usually nets you a vulture save or two a week, too)

I've won the pitching categories 3-2 in the playoffs against oweners who stream each of the past two seasons (and won those categories at an 80 percent clip during the season). The strategy is an effective counter in invididual matchups and over the course of the season.

And I don't think imparting roster limits is "rotofying" H2H. It is increasing the difficulty of the league and the importance of making good moves each time.

soundmind
03-09-2009, 11:26 AM
Back in the day, ESPN.com was where the most competitive fantasy sports were played...everything was pay to play and there were thousands of players who took that shit balls to the wall serious.

I was one of them.

Seems like the only people who call it horseshit strategy are the ones who can't pull it off...

Streaming is part of H2H...H2H with capped transactions is Roto, plain and simple.

Roto is geared towards a great, balanced draft with educated waiver wire moves...capping H2H is rotoissifying H2H...so my advice to you is...stop bitching about streaming in H2H and start playing Roto...

Or get into a league that doesn't allow ANY waiver wire moves...those are fun leagues.

I would LOVE to play in a fantasy baseball league, ANY scoring system, against you so I could whip the living shit out of you...fantasy baseball is the one fantasy sport that is geared more towards skill and knowledge rather than luck (FFL).

Football isn't luck. I've taken 4 in a row in my keeper league, and I'm certainly NOT a lucky guy - just draft better than everyone in the league. There's a strategy to it all, that being that if you're gonna spend that pick on Brady, you get his backup.

It sounds like "streaming" is basically the same as jockeying your D/ST on a weekly basis, based on matchups - which I have no problem with.

But I think baseball is different, it's a 162-game every single f*ck*ing day environment.....streaming in that arena, to me, is just a ridiculous amount of work...some of us need something outside fantasy sports in our lives....and it makes a good portion of the draft completely worthless. I'm inexperienced, but I'd certainly vote against it.

eazyb81
03-09-2009, 11:51 AM
50-60 per season.

The best thing is just to have an active commish who will lock douchebags who pull off that horseshit strategy.

You can't lock them for doing something that's not technically illegal.

If you want to end streaming, then have a max amount of transactions per week. Until then though, no one really has room to bitch.

Also, it's not like streaming is some huge advantage. I tried to stream last year in my championship and still lost.

It's not arbitrage; it's a strategy, plain and simple.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 02:25 PM
You can't lock them for doing something that's not technically illegal.

If you want to end streaming, then have a max amount of transactions per week. Until then though, no one really has room to bitch.

Also, it's not like streaming is some huge advantage. I tried to stream last year in my championship and still lost.

It's not arbitrage; it's a strategy, plain and simple.

It's douchebaggery for people attempting to glitch the system. It's Madden cheezing in a different milieu.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 02:26 PM
I would LOVE to play in a fantasy baseball league, ANY scoring system, against you so I could whip the living shit out of you...fantasy baseball is the one fantasy sport that is geared more towards skill and knowledge rather than luck (FFL).

Would you then post a chat transcript to prove how <del>dominant</del> much of a douchebag you are?

Sure-Oz
03-09-2009, 02:39 PM
Speaking of fantasy baseball is naptown starting another chiefsplanet league this year with Yahoo?

Sure-Oz
03-09-2009, 02:41 PM
Also, who are the sleepers/rookies this year we should look out for? Any links to that type of info?

chiefzilla1501
03-09-2009, 02:45 PM
Well either way, drafting starting pitching is completely overrated.

Every year 5-15 guys no one have ever heard of end up having the best seasons...I.E. Edinson Volquez.

If I'm drafting H2H, I'm spending my first 5-7 picks on offense, my next 3-5 on closers are guys who have fallen too far, and then I cherry pick the end of the draft for guys like Rich Harden who could be the #1 pitcher in the game but everyone stays away from because of injury history...or established guys that had a rough prior season...or guys that make the switch from the AL to NL...

I'd make some suggestions but I haven't prepared for my drafts yet...

Either way, you'll never see Grady Sizemore on my team...I think he has bust written all over him this year.

and Albert Pujols should be the #1 pick, not Hanley Ramirez.

That dude can say whatever he wants about SB's in H2H, it's definitely the one offensive category worth sacrificing.

Well of course a guy like Pujols is a no-brainer. But that's talking about a .340+, 40+ HR guy. That's a no-brainer. But Ramirez will be neck and neck with guys like David Wright and Ryan Braun and Texeira, and I say go with Ramirez. Sizemore will line up against guys like Ryan Howard or Carlos Lee, and you gotta go with Sizemore.

Unless there is an enormous difference, I try to steer clear of 0 steal guys as much as possible. I think the easiest way to compete in SBs is to load up on 15 SB guys like Braun or Wright or Berkman. I don't agree with sacrificing a category. SBs is the easiest way to steal a category without even trying. Even if you don't have a Pierre or Tavarez (and you should NEVER go with guys like this), you can still end up ranked in the top 3 or 4 in SBs if almost every guy on your roster is capable of about 15 steals. And that's not hard to do at all and it would not come at a sacrifice to HRs, RBIs, or AVG.

The Bad Guy
03-09-2009, 03:24 PM
Back in the day, ESPN.com was where the most competitive fantasy sports were played...everything was pay to play and there were thousands of players who took that shit balls to the wall serious.

I was one of them.

Seems like the only people who call it horseshit strategy are the ones who can't pull it off...

Streaming is part of H2H...H2H with capped transactions is Roto, plain and simple.

Roto is geared towards a great, balanced draft with educated waiver wire moves...capping H2H is rotoissifying H2H...so my advice to you is...stop bitching about streaming in H2H and start playing Roto...

Or get into a league that doesn't allow ANY waiver wire moves...those are fun leagues.

I would LOVE to play in a fantasy baseball league, ANY scoring system, against you so I could whip the living shit out of you...fantasy baseball is the one fantasy sport that is geared more towards skill and knowledge rather than luck (FFL).

So you're telling me it takes a massive amount of skill to stream guys? So going in and seeing someone is playing the Royals on a Saturday, or the Giants on a Sunday is a rocket science?

Fucking please.

It takes far more skill to draft a team than it does to sit there like a fucking loser every night grabbing the weekend starters.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 03:35 PM
So you're telling me it takes a massive amount of skill to stream guys? So going in and seeing someone is playing the Royals on a Saturday, or the Giants on a Sunday is a rocket science?

Fucking please.

It takes far more skill to draft a team than it does to sit there like a fucking loser every night grabbing the weekend starters.

Read this thread:

http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=4299292&highlight=stuart#post4299292

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 03:39 PM
So you're telling me it takes a massive amount of skill to stream guys? So going in and seeing someone is playing the Royals on a Saturday, or the Giants on a Sunday is a rocket science?

****ing please.

It takes far more skill to draft a team than it does to sit there like a ****ing loser every night grabbing the weekend starters.

When you play in an H2H league where 8 of the 10 owners are looking to stream...then yes, it takes a SHIT ton of strategy and research.

I'm not talking about streaming in a yahoo public league when you're the only guy who knows what the fuck you're doing.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 03:42 PM
When you play in an H2H league where 8 of the 10 owners are looking to stream...then yes, it takes a SHIT ton of strategy and research.

I'm not talking about streaming in a yahoo public league when you're the only guy who knows what the fuck you're doing.

I love that you assume that because no one is in your league that no one is in a money league.

Fuck, I played in a 14 team H2H $ league the last two years that was 7x7, and you don't see me bashing other guy's leagues because of it.

What a pathetic douchebag you are.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 03:44 PM
Read this thread:

http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=4299292&highlight=stuart#post4299292

That is an awesome fucking thread.

My offer still stands...I'm even better on the PC now that I can use my XBOX 360 controller...

No one beats this guy on Madden for the XBOX ORIGINAL...it's impossible.

Back when Madden actually had GOOD gameplay...it's a shame the only video game I play now is Halo 3...and yes, I'll sell you a 50, I have 6 ;)

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 03:44 PM
I love that you assume that because no one is in your league that no one is in a money league.

****, I played in a 14 team H2H $ league the last two years that was 7x7, and you don't see me bashing other guy's leagues because of it.

What a pathetic douchebag you are.

Come on then, big guy...

Invite me to a league, any type of scoring, and we'll see who comes out on top.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 03:51 PM
and besides, I'll always cling to my #2 Tiger Woods 2005 ranking in the nation as one of my most prized accomplishments! I had 20+ more hole in 1's than anyone else on Live.

My EA sporting abilities are outstanding.

The Bad Guy
03-09-2009, 04:01 PM
When you play in an H2H league where 8 of the 10 owners are looking to stream...then yes, it takes a SHIT ton of strategy and research.

I'm not talking about streaming in a yahoo public league when you're the only guy who knows what the **** you're doing.

I don't play in a yahoo public league.

You also don't have to "stream" to win.

If you draft a balanced team, streaming is unnecessary unless you are just trying to scrounge a few categories on Sunday.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 04:06 PM
I don't play in a yahoo public league.

You also don't have to "stream" to win.

If you draft a balanced team, streaming is unnecessary unless you are just trying to scrounge a few categories on Sunday.

Streaming allows you to basically concentrate on offense only...that's the point of it...you don't have to worry about pitching because you win 3/5 categories every week...

In a standard 5X5 H2H league...I generally draft offense for the first 6-8 rounds...then focus on closers or VALUE picks the next 3-4 rounds after that...and then back to offense for the rest of the draft until a few late round relievers (that could be the 2009 version of Soria last year) and established pitchers that had a rocky 2008 that may rebound in 2009...and then I focus on grabbing the one or two Edinson Volquez's that emerge as great starters no one had ever heard of.

That's why it's strategy.

Streaming in H2H allows you to ignore pitching on draft day and still win the pitching categories every week.

If you don't stream in H2H, you have to draft pitchers high, and then you can't focus on offense...so it means ONE mistake could be the end of your season.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 04:10 PM
People were drafting Jake Peavy like 8th overall last year. He had a great year. But instead of drafting Jake Peavy, you could watch a few games in April and notice some of the studs like Volquez and get Peavy value from a starter that isn't even drafted.

And that's why streaming is so important.

You can stack your offense and still dominate pitching every week...and if you're in a league where no one else is streaming, a lot of the times you can pick great matchups and win ERA/WHIP, too...especially since a lot of reliever heavy teams can have horrible weeks in both categories if one of their closers implodes a few times...since they won't have a lot of innings to offset a 1 IP 6 ER type of inning.

duncan_idaho
03-09-2009, 04:10 PM
:duncan_idaho runs from thread in sheer terror of internet tough guy Hootie. He's the best at fantasy sports! He's the best at Madden! He was No. 2 in the world at Tiger Woods golf like five years ago!:

Seriously, man. If 8 of 10 guys in a league are streaming, what's the point? That really is a matter of "who can push the button the fastest."

Streaming is b.s. any way you cut it because it severely diminishes the importance of the draft.

A fantasy league in which an owner has to draft well, make smart waiver and FA adds, and pull off some trades to win it is something most people would call a "fun" league. A fantasy league where an owner has to beat someone to the button by 30 seconds every other day so he can two starts out of Mike Pelfrey this week is something most people would call stupid.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 04:49 PM
:duncan_idaho runs from thread in sheer terror of internet tough guy Hootie. He's the best at fantasy sports! He's the best at Madden! He was No. 2 in the world at Tiger Woods golf like five years ago!:

Seriously, man. If 8 of 10 guys in a league are streaming, what's the point? That really is a matter of "who can push the button the fastest."

Streaming is b.s. any way you cut it because it severely diminishes the importance of the draft.

A fantasy league in which an owner has to draft well, make smart waiver and FA adds, and pull off some trades to win it is something most people would call a "fun" league. A fantasy league where an owner has to beat someone to the button by 30 seconds every other day so he can two starts out of Mike Pelfrey this week is something most people would call stupid.

You're describing a roto league...which is fine. I love roto. It makes the draft SUPER important. H2H allows you to mess up a little on draft day...

Streaming is a big part of H2H...sorry if you guys can't acknowledge that.

duncan_idaho
03-09-2009, 05:12 PM
You're describing a roto league...which is fine. I love roto. It makes the draft SUPER important. H2H allows you to mess up a little on draft day...

Streaming is a big part of H2H...sorry if you guys can't acknowledge that.

It doesn't HAVE to be. And is becoming less of one.

Just because someone likes a weekly scoring format, to make things a little more interesting than a year-long race, doesn't mean that person only wants to play roto.

There's a difference between "messing up on draft day" and covering it with a few shrewd pickups or a good trade and what you've been portraying. The streaming strategy you've described is not "messing up on draft day." It is a purposeful strategy.

I would be interested to see what a 10-team draft with 8 teams that were going to stream would look. Doesn't that kind of blow the whole "draft nothing but offense early" strategy? Since other guys are still grabbing hitters when normally they'd be looking at starting pitchers?

I used to work at a mag that produced heavy fantasy content, and the entire fantasy staff (like 8-10 people) HATED streaming. In the leagues they ran (and thoser are pretty intense, don't you think?), nobody streamed players. The lone exception? That freaking tool Matthew Berry.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 05:55 PM
Yeah Berry is an ESPN guy and in ESPN pay leagues, you stream.

I'm sure Matthew Berry probably won that league, or at least made the playoffs, too.

If he was the only one streaming, that means he was winning more than he lost.

Short Leash Hootie
03-09-2009, 05:55 PM
Yeah Berry is an ESPN guy and in ESPN pay leagues, you stream.

I'm sure Matthew Berry probably won that league, or at least made the playoffs, too.

If he was the only one streaming, that means he was winning more than he lost.

DrRyan
03-09-2009, 06:25 PM
I am sure Berry won those leagues if he is abiding by his infinite wisdom like he spouts in the football season. I watched him on Sunday countdown on multiple occasions break the news that Peyton Manning and Reggie Wayne were "good starts" this week. F***ing great insight from that clown. Next thing you know he will be telling me I should target Pujols, Hanley, D. Wright and Santana.:clap:

DrRyan
03-09-2009, 06:28 PM
Things that everyone(Hootie) who is touting about streaming players seems to be forgetting is the likelihood of negative points for bad outings and losses. We have a guy in one of my leagues that had over 300 transactions last year. Chasing the two start pitchers every week. It is a double edged sword, they sure can help you, but the opposite is also true. I personally prefer H2H point leagues over the roto format. Just me though.

If you don't get penalized for bad starts by SP, then I guess there is minimal downside to chasing the two starters.

duncan_idaho
03-09-2009, 06:34 PM
Yeah Berry is an ESPN guy and in ESPN pay leagues, you stream.

I'm sure Matthew Berry probably won that league, or at least made the playoffs, too.

If he was the only one streaming, that means he was winning more than he lost.

Actually, it was before Berry was hired at ESPN, when he was still running the TMR site and was writing a weekly column for Sporting News (that's the fantasy staff he was competing against in the league I was talking about).

He failed to place in the money in any of the three years I was working there/around the fantasy guys. Best finish was sixth, as I recall (and this was a no-moves-limit league). It was quite the running joke that Berry couldn't win cash even when he was cheating.

Him getting hired at ESPN was funny; he was by far the least talented fantasy writer, and his performance against the other SN experts was lackluster at best no matter the sport. Shows that a good nickname is more important than substance sometimes, I guess.

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 06:38 PM
Actually, it was before Berry was hired at ESPN, when he was still running the TMR site and was writing a weekly column for Sporting News (that's the fantasy staff he was competing against in the league I was talking about).

He failed to place in the money in any of the three years I was working there/around the fantasy guys. Best finish was sixth, as I recall (and this was a no-moves-limit league). It was quite the running joke that Berry couldn't win cash even when he was cheating.

Him getting hired at ESPN was funny; he was by far the least talented fantasy writer, and his performance against the other SN experts was lackluster at best no matter the sport. Shows that a good nickname is more important than substance sometimes, I guess.

He generally gives awful, awful advice.

I tried listening to one of that asshat's podcasts. I made it to about 3 minutes, then he started talking about his inability to pick up chicks and I was fucking done.

duncan_idaho
03-09-2009, 07:00 PM
hamas, Berry was by far the biggest dumbass at SN, and it really wasn't close. Wish I could have posted some of his unedited work on here. Horrible. Absolutely horrible.

I still don't understand how that guy gets hired at ESPN with so many better options out there...

'Hamas' Jenkins
03-09-2009, 07:09 PM
hamas, Berry was by far the biggest dumbass at SN, and it really wasn't close. Wish I could have posted some of his unedited work on here. Horrible. Absolutely horrible.

I still don't understand how that guy gets hired at ESPN with so many better options out there...

It probably had far more to do with who he knew than what he knew. It's not like ESPN is full of brilliant sports minds. It's generally a cesspool for the LCD.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 02:29 AM
lol.

Whatever guys...I could have seen from a mile away the pile on Berry after he was brought up...if you work for ESPN you are incompetent according to this site...

I guarantee you that...if Berry was in an H2H league and he was the only one streaming and there were no game limits...he finished higher than 6th...

duncan_idaho
03-10-2009, 08:36 AM
lol.

Whatever guys...I could have seen from a mile away the pile on Berry after he was brought up...if you work for ESPN you are incompetent according to this site...

I guarantee you that...if Berry was in an H2H league and he was the only one streaming and there were no game limits...he finished higher than 6th...

Well, as someone who worked with Berry and edited his work (more frequently than I would have liked), I think I can speak on how shitty he was as a writer/fantasy sports editor/advisor.

And I don't care what you think. He didn't finish higher than sixth. He made the playoffs one of three years and lost in the first round. That is a fact. Part of that probably had something to do with the other owners in a 14-team league all devoting almost all of their bench spots to reserve SPs (another strategy for dealing with streamers)

I have seen guys lose with streaming more often than not. Of all the leagues I've played in, I've seen one guy win with it twice (in a league where no one paid attention).

It's not the magic bullet you're making it out to be.

The Bad Guy
03-10-2009, 09:10 AM
Keep being a fanboy, Hootie.

We should get a Chiefsplanet league with me, Hootie, Hamas, Duncan and anyone else from this thread.

Put your money where your mouth is Hootie.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 09:29 AM
http://games.espn.go.com/flb/leagueoffice?leagueId=131593

Send me your email and I'll send invites. It's standard 5X5 H2H with a 50 transaction cap so people won't bitch.

We can either start a thread and have the draft offline and I'll enter everything manually or try to find a time where everyone would be available for a live draft. I hate doing live drafts with half of the owners on auto-pilot, though. An active draft is part of the fun.

Sure-Oz
03-10-2009, 09:41 AM
I am in for another yahoo league or whatever, i know the past 3 years or so ive been in a chiefsplanet league with badguy, tk, naptown and whoever else

The Bad Guy
03-10-2009, 10:04 AM
I want to have a live draft, and a money pot.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 10:30 AM
I want to have a live draft, and a money pot.

I'm ok with that, do you have PayPal? No one trusts me so I won't be handling the money, but I'll gladly let you or anyone else hold the winnings in a paypal account or something like that.

and I'm pretty open, but in order to have a live draft I'd really prefer if at least 8 members would be able to make it...

Right now I'd really only be willing to dish out $25 or so...money is a little tight for me.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 10:32 AM
I am in for another yahoo league or whatever, i know the past 3 years or so ive been in a chiefsplanet league with badguy, tk, naptown and whoever else

I'll send invites to those guys...ESPN Free is better than Yahoo Free IMHO...I really despise Yahoo and their jacked up rankings...at least if someone misses a draft in ESPN the rankings are set so they can at least get a decent draft out of it.

L.A. Chieffan
03-10-2009, 10:33 AM
always draft as many catchers, royals, and colorado pitchers as early as you can

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 10:34 AM
I have to have email addresses to send invites...so anyone who wants in needs to PM me their email address.

RJ
03-10-2009, 10:47 AM
I am in for another yahoo league or whatever, i know the past 3 years or so ive been in a chiefsplanet league with badguy, tk, naptown and whoever else


I sent Naptown a PM the other day about that league but haven't heard back from him. Is someone else setting it up? Have you heard anything?

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 10:59 AM
I sent an invite to RJ.

Waiting for email addresses from The Bad Guy, Hamas, Duncan, Sure Oz, Tk13, and anyone else looking for a competitive league.

We can hammer out all of the details once the league is filled.

The Bad Guy
03-10-2009, 11:32 AM
We could make it a 30 dollar league, winner take all.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 11:55 AM
We could make it a 30 dollar league, winner take all.

I don't mind that idea if everyone is on board.

RJ
03-10-2009, 12:08 PM
Anywhere from zero to fifty would be acceptable to me.

The Yahoo league Oz mentioned had no money involved but it always stayed active, even the bottom dwellers stuck around. Maybe a Planet Pride thing.

Are there any fees owed to ESPN?

duncan_idaho
03-10-2009, 02:13 PM
I despite ESPN. Would much rather play a Yahoo league, but if the consensus is ESPN, that's fine.

Not sure about putting money in it, either. I hate PayPal passionately, and it probably isn't safe to send the case to one guy.

But whatever.

smreid@gmail.com

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 02:16 PM
There are no fees with ESPN anymore...

I don't understand why you despise ESPN more than Yahoo? I think Yahoo is about the worst fantasy provider out there...I suppose that's just my opinion, though.

Have you tried ESPN since it went free?

It least with ESPN if someone has to miss the draft and doesn't set their list, they won't give them shitty players...ESPN has some good pre-set rankings...unlike Yahoo who has the worst rankings I've ever seen. If you miss a Yahoo draft, you're fucked.

Short Leash Hootie
03-10-2009, 02:17 PM
I sent you an invite...Duncan.

The Bad Guy addressed some idea changes for the league...when it is full we'll all figure out the exact settings then.

duncan_idaho
03-10-2009, 04:19 PM
I sent you an invite...Duncan.

The Bad Guy addressed some idea changes for the league...when it is full we'll all figure out the exact settings then.

Hootie -

I have had nightmarish experiences with ESPN, starting with the fantasy keeper league I started in 2006. we played the league without a comissioner in its third and final year because ESPN couldn't figure out how to fix it after converting it to their new system.

I just prefer Yahoo!s system - especially for adds and drops. And Yahoo!s writers are a lot better than ESPN's crew (though I think Karabell is solid).

I'll probably join it sometime tomorrow. About to check out of the office and busy for the night...

The Bad Guy
03-10-2009, 04:42 PM
Duncan,

You can trust me with the cash and to payout winners. I've been on this board 8 years and am not going anywhere.

That's why you keep the pot at 30 dollars. If you don't, by July, people aren't going to give a shit about it if it's free.

RJ
03-11-2009, 01:45 PM
I posted a message on the league board with some names of other Planeteers who I remember playing in the Yahoo league we had for so many years, assuming we may still have spots to fill.

doomy3
03-11-2009, 01:49 PM
I'd be interested in playing depending on when the draft is, etc...