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Jilly
03-24-2009, 09:58 AM
Our church has a strong relationship with our neighborhood watch group. They meet at our church, we have opened the doors for them, provided coffee, cookies, etc etc. We are happy to have them. Recently, our church has taken on the task of nesting a new church start for a hispanic congregation. They meet Tues evening and Sat. evening. After a Sat evening worship, one of the block captains from the neighborhood watch group contacted our person in charge of relating to them complaining of people being in the church parking lot and if they should be there. (We are talking over 30 cars in the lot). Then, on the following Tues, the same person contacted our person to complain of someone, although no specifics were named, throwing trash in the street. The neighborhood block captain lives in tremendous fear and calls the police if even an odd car drives through the neighborhood....esp if said car is driven by someone not of her ethnicity.
After my congregation member who was contacted came to me with this information, she told me she didn't want to be called with such nonsense. So I sent an email to the this block captain and asked that she voice non emergency concerns during office hours of the church on Monday through Thursday. I explained to her why the extra traffic in the church parking lot and how as a church we work on an attitude of grace and acceptance, knowing that mistakes will always be made and that any one of us could have thrown trash out the window of our car. (let me know if you want me to paste that email into this, but for now I'm leaving it out). I received an email back, basically a passive aggressive email about how I shouldn't judge her, and how she just wanted to make sure the church was safe and the neighborhood was safe, etc. etc and she told me that I accused her of being racist.
I don't want to cause a riff in the neighborhood, but, at the same time, I'm called to do ministry and have a hard time keeping my mouth shut when it comes to racial equality, acceptance, etc. and am wondering if I need to address this any further or should just leave it alone?

I need level headed thinking right now, instead of my initial passionate response which would be to call her out. Thanks everyone.

Jill

Radar Chief
03-24-2009, 10:01 AM
I need level headed thinking right now, instead of my initial passionate response which would be to call her out. Thanks everyone.

Jill

Wow did you ever come to the wrong place.

Jilly
03-24-2009, 10:04 AM
Wow did you ever come to the wrong place.

I so wonder about myself sometimes, especially in moments of desperation.

Der Flöprer
03-24-2009, 10:08 AM
Without seeing the email it's hard to say whether she has any merit in her claims that you're judging her, calling her racist, etc. If you're confident you didn't do those things, I would ask her how she interpreted that. She's trying to take control of the situation by putting you on the defensive. I wouldn't allow it.

Dave Lane
03-24-2009, 10:10 AM
Check my Matthew's Zombies thread they might be able to help :)

Brock
03-24-2009, 10:11 AM
"block captain" ROFL:rolleyes:

KC native
03-24-2009, 10:11 AM
I wouldn't call her out on it yet. Let her build up a few more examples like this and then you won't have to worry about making a case to her because her actions will speak for themselves. It's always easier to let people like this discredit themselves rather than trying to change their minds about their views of race.

Kudos for being willing to call her out though. Many people who aren't racist allow racists to spew their hate and not say anything which gives the racist the implicit reinforcement that their views are acceptable.

nstygma
03-24-2009, 10:12 AM
you have to diffuse the situation and apologize, take the blame etc. then go to her house after a few days with her favorite pie... she will be open, then you can make her a deal she can't refuse.

Jilly
03-24-2009, 10:14 AM
This is the email I initially sent:

Our congregation thanks you for all your hard work to keep the community together and informed. You have done a wonderful job and we really appreciate it. It's nice to know that there are people who truly care.
As I know you've noticed, our congregation is nesting a new church start and we are so excited about it. There is a growing number of Spanish speaking people in our community, and this is obviously an area that " Christian Church, as a community, can't possibly reach out to. So we are so excited that this new church start is able to do something that we cannot do. We realize that as we live in community together that there will be some snags in the relationship and some things we need to iron out, but, as a church, we are doing everything we can to be hospitable and welcoming to the folks of this new church - Iglesia Cristiana " ". Although we know that the entire neighborhood does not always share our vision of loving people with Christ, promoting a peaceful and welcoming community, we truly hope we can all live together and accept what is happening around us and within us with joy and hope. As these new faces join our community, we ask for your understanding and joy that we can live into diversity and be grateful for the ministry they are called to do as you are grateful and understanding of the ministry that " is called to do.
As various things are noticed, I would ask that you please wait and call the church office on Monday morning and talk to our secretary, Nancy or myself to discuss these things. Our lay people in the congregation (like Peggy), have quite a lot of responsibilities as it is, and need breaks and space especially on the weekend, etc. While they care a lot about what is happening, there are some things that are non emergencies that may need to be taken care of and generally most of these concerns filter through me anyway. We are open to discussing things with the new church about our great relationship with our community and how we all need to mindful of it, but as with any human beings, some things just happen and I would like to ask for your understanding in that. As a church, our hope is always to accept and approach people with a nonjudgmental grace.

Thanks for your understanding and again, please communicate with me if you have concerns.

In Christ's Peace,

Rev. Jill

Dave Lane
03-24-2009, 10:14 AM
you have to diffuse the situation and apologize, take the blame etc. then go to her house after a few days with her favorite pie... she will be open, then you can make her a deal she can't refuse.

Does she even have a horse?

Radar Chief
03-24-2009, 10:15 AM
Personally, I wouldn’t bother responding any further. From what you’re saying, and I have no reason to doubt your word, it sounds to me like she’s looking for an excuse to be a busy body and will continue being one no matter what you say or do.
Best to just keep the local police informed of what your doing and you may even pass out some cards with your name and a number you can be reached to your Hispanic congregation should any issues with the police arise from their presence in your neighborhood.
Look, the police probably already know who crazy yappie dogs lady is and know to blow off the majority of what she’s complaining about. That’s actually a problem for the neighborhood watch group but I don’t know the influence you have with them.

HonestChieffan
03-24-2009, 10:15 AM
Let it lie, take time to think it through and dont pick at the scab.

Brock
03-24-2009, 10:18 AM
.http://www.amsterdamboatclub.com/images/gladys_kravitz.jpg

nstygma
03-24-2009, 10:18 AM
Does she even have a horse?probably a yappie dog

Jilly
03-24-2009, 10:20 AM
probably a yappie dog

2 of them...oh and she leaves her Christmas lights on the house...oh and their yard is the most cluttered of all of them.

nstygma
03-24-2009, 10:22 AM
2 of them...oh and she leaves her Christmas lights on the house...oh and their yard is the most cluttered of all of them.yep, thats the type. you can't confront them directly about anything. you have to use things such as bundt cakes and snicker doodles

DaKCMan AP
03-24-2009, 10:23 AM
Send her a bottle of white zin..

oldandslow
03-24-2009, 10:31 AM
Let it go...

Nothing you are going to do is going to make the woman become something she does not choose to be.

One of the harder things to do as a parent, teacher, leader, CEO, and I imagine, minister is to realize that not all battles can be won. Some are not even worth fighting.

BTW - what you are doing with the hispanic community is GREAT.

Dave Lane
03-24-2009, 10:49 AM
Be a shame to leave a yappy dogs head in her bed but oh well...

trndobrd
03-24-2009, 01:12 PM
Invite her to come to one of the Saturday evening services as your guest.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:15 PM
Without seeing the email it's hard to say whether she has any merit in her claims that you're judging her, calling her racist, etc. If you're confident you didn't do those things, I would ask her how she interpreted that. She's trying to take control of the situation by putting you on the defensive. I wouldn't allow it.

Based on this part of the OP...

The neighborhood block captain lives in tremendous fear and calls the police if even an odd car drives through the neighborhood....esp if said car is driven by someone not of her ethnicity.

... it looks like Jilly essentially believes that this block captain *is* a racist to one degree or another. Given that, along with the block captain's reaction, I'm betting that Jilly effectively judged the lady and/or called her a racist whether she intended to do so or not.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:17 PM
I wouldn't call her out on it yet. Let her build up a few more examples like this and then you won't have to worry about making a case to her because her actions will speak for themselves. It's always easier to let people like this discredit themselves rather than trying to change their minds about their views of race.

Kudos for being willing to call her out though. Many people who aren't racist allow racists to spew their hate and not say anything which gives the racist the implicit reinforcement that their views are acceptable.

Is it racist to complain about someone throwing litter out of their window if their ethnicity is different than your own?

trndobrd
03-24-2009, 01:19 PM
Disregard the previous post. Take the cannoli.

KC native
03-24-2009, 01:19 PM
Is it racist to complain about someone throwing litter out of their window if their ethnicity is different than your own?

So, you completely ignore the rest of what they lady complained about? For someone that likes to whine about Darth Cheney being quoted out of context you sure like to leave context out when it's convenient to you.

tooge
03-24-2009, 01:24 PM
I would tell the "block leader", "block nazi", or whatever they are, that you will even donate a vehicle for them to use in watching the bloxk. Here is a nice one.

Jilly
03-24-2009, 01:24 PM
Based on this part of the OP...



... it looks like Jilly essentially believes that this block captain *is* a racist to one degree or another. Given that, along with the block captain's reaction, I'm betting that Jilly effectively judged the lady and/or called her a racist whether she intended to do so or not.

Except that in a neighborhood watch meeting I heard her say things like, "These people" and "those blacks that live" and "they're Muslims and I don't know what they're doing, he doesn't work during the day, but he often leaves his house with a suitcase like he's taking a trip and I bet he's probably a terrorist"

Garcia Bronco
03-24-2009, 01:27 PM
I wouldn't call her out on it yet. Let her build up a few more examples like this and then you won't have to worry about making a case to her because her actions will speak for themselves. It's always easier to let people like this discredit themselves rather than trying to change their minds about their views of race.


This is sound advice. Of course she's yet to really demostrate she's racist based on the OP, but if she truly is it will become apparent over time. If she is racist and it's unjust then God will have say, and we don't need to worry about it.

The word race is so loosely defined that it's hard to find anyone that isn't in some way racist.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:35 PM
This is the email I initially sent:

Our congregation thanks you for all your hard work to keep the community together and informed. You have done a wonderful job and we really appreciate it. It's nice to know that there are people who truly care.
As I know you've noticed, our congregation is nesting a new church start and we are so excited about it. There is a growing number of Spanish speaking people in our community, and this is obviously an area that " Christian Church, as a community, can't possibly reach out to. So we are so excited that this new church start is able to do something that we cannot do. We realize that as we live in community together that there will be some snags in the relationship and some things we need to iron out, but, as a church, we are doing everything we can to be hospitable and welcoming to the folks of this new church - Iglesia Cristiana " ". Although we know that the entire neighborhood does not always share our vision of loving people with Christ, promoting a peaceful and welcoming community, we truly hope we can all live together and accept what is happening around us and within us with joy and hope. As these new faces join our community, we ask for your understanding and joy that we can live into diversity and be grateful for the ministry they are called to do as you are grateful and understanding of the ministry that " is called to do.
As various things are noticed, I would ask that you please wait and call the church office on Monday morning and talk to our secretary, Nancy or myself to discuss these things. Our lay people in the congregation (like Peggy), have quite a lot of responsibilities as it is, and need breaks and space especially on the weekend, etc. While they care a lot about what is happening, there are some things that are non emergencies that may need to be taken care of and generally most of these concerns filter through me anyway. We are open to discussing things with the new church about our great relationship with our community and how we all need to mindful of it, but as with any human beings, some things just happen and I would like to ask for your understanding in that. As a church, our hope is always to accept and approach people with a nonjudgmental grace.

Thanks for your understanding and again, please communicate with me if you have concerns.

In Christ's Peace,

Rev. Jill

I think your email is polite and hits on all the important points, but I don't see why you felt the need to include the blue or red parts. In particular, the red part sets up a tone that suggests that the letter has to do with race relations rather than litter and loitering reports. Those parts should have been left out. The fact that you expressed an opinion that this lady is fearful and more prone to take offense when an ethnicity other than her own is involved indicate to me that you had the thought in your mind that you were dealing with a race relations issue even though you tried not to come right out and say it.

Even though you didn't really do anything terribly wrong, I think you should send another note to the lady apologizing for "anything you might have done to give her the impression" that you were accusing her of being racist. Asking her to forgive you would be a nice touch, even if you don't really feel like you were wrong.

I hope this helps.

Jilly
03-24-2009, 01:44 PM
I think your email is polite and hits on all the important points, but I don't see why you felt the need to include the blue or red parts. In particular, the red part sets up a tone that suggests that the letter has to do with race relations rather than litter and loitering reports. Those parts should have been left out. The fact that you expressed an opinion that this lady is fearful and more prone to take offense when an ethnicity other than her own is involved indicate to me that you had the thought in your mind that you were dealing with a race relations issue even though you tried not to come right out and say it.

Even though you didn't really do anything terribly wrong, I think you should send another note to the lady apologizing for "anything you might have done to give her the impression" that you were accusing her of being racist. Asking her to forgive you would be a nice touch, even if you don't really feel like you were wrong.

I hope this helps.

It does help and I really appreciate your input. I'm not sure I should apologize for this though. It could be my pride, but part of it is that I do feel some sense of call in letting them know that our vision as a church is to be a peaceful community which means that we do not welcome some of the tones of their meetings, etc. But at the same time, that's the price we pay for inviting them in. It's a weird limbo to live in....but you're probably right, I probably did send her a message that I was judging her. My problem is that I don't want a nosy, prejudice neighbor like her, hindering and/or hurting the good people of this new church.

KC native
03-24-2009, 01:46 PM
It does help and I really appreciate your input. I'm not sure I should apologize for this though. It could be my pride, but part of it is that I do feel some sense of call in letting them know that our vision as a church is to be a peaceful community which means that we do not welcome some of the tones of their meetings, etc. But at the same time, that's the price we pay for inviting them in. It's a weird limbo to live in....but you're probably right, I probably did send her a message that I was judging her. My problem is that I don't want a nosy, prejudice neighbor like her, hindering and/or hurting the good people of this new church.

You have nothing to apologize for.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:47 PM
Except that in a neighborhood watch meeting I heard her say things like, "These people" and "those blacks that live" and "they're Muslims and I don't know what they're doing, he doesn't work during the day, but he often leaves his house with a suitcase like he's taking a trip and I bet he's probably a terrorist"

What you're saying here is not that you didn't judge her, but instead that you had more reasons than previously mentioned to do so. Given that you did judge her, you had 3 choices when you wrote the email:

1. Come out and say it
2. Hint at it but don't come out and say it directly
3. Leave it out

You chose option 2. She picked up on it. Now you're talking about how her response was passive aggressive without recognizing that yours was too.

I think the better option would have been to leave it out and address the time and place for making non-emergency reports of the type being discussed, given that those types of reports aren't inherently related to the race relations issue (even if in her case they may be). That would have resolved the immediate problem (of stopping the after hours calls) and it would have allowed you to collect more information on which to base a future judgment about whether or not there was a real race relations problem.

stevieray
03-24-2009, 01:52 PM
My problem is that I don't want a nosy, prejudice neighbor like her, hindering and/or hurting the good people of this new church.


I bet that is tough.


Jesus didn't hang out with the righteous, he hung out with those who needed him most...use this adversity as an opportunity to reach out to her without conditions..kindness can move a mountain. ..

Jilly
03-24-2009, 01:52 PM
What you're saying here is not that you didn't judge her, but instead that you had more reasons than previously mentioned to do so. Given that you did judge her, you had 3 choices when you wrote the email:

1. Come out and say it
2. Hint at it but don't come out and say it directly
3. Leave it out

You chose option 2. She picked up on it. Now you're talking about how her response was passive aggressive without recognizing that yours was too.

I think the better option would have been to leave it out and address the time and place for making non-emergency reports of the type being discussed, given that those types of reports aren't inherently related to the race relations issue (even if in her case they may be). That would have resolved the immediate problem (of stopping the after hours calls) and it would have allowed you to collect more information on which to base a future judgment about whether or not there was a real race relations problem.

Except that I feel it part of my calling as a Christian minister to say something when I see an injustice. This is my problem, I think. I cannot preach a message of love, acceptance, and speaking out against injustice to my congregation and then not do it myself?
And to be fair, I'm not complaining about her passive aggressive response, I'm wondering how I need to respond to it.

Garcia Bronco
03-24-2009, 01:52 PM
It does help and I really appreciate your input. I'm not sure I should apologize for this though. It could be my pride, but part of it is that I do feel some sense of call in letting them know that our vision as a church is to be a peaceful community which means that we do not welcome some of the tones of their meetings, etc. But at the same time, that's the price we pay for inviting them in. It's a weird limbo to live in....but you're probably right, I probably did send her a message that I was judging her. My problem is that I don't want a nosy, prejudice neighbor like her, hindering and/or hurting the good people of this new church.

It's not that you mean the apology, it's about winning an emotional debate. While you may think it a pride thing, if you apologize then her grudge disappears. Whether racist or not, you want to be in a position to control future situations.

BucEyedPea
03-24-2009, 01:53 PM
What you're saying here is not that you didn't judge her, but instead that you had more reasons than previously mentioned to do so. Given that you did judge her, you had 3 choices when you wrote the email:

1. Come out and say it
2. Hint at it but don't come out and say it directly
3. Leave it out

You chose option 2. She picked up on it. Now you're talking about how her response was passive aggressive without recognizing that yours was too.

I think the better option would have been to leave it out and address the time and place for making non-emergency reports of the type being discussed, given that those types of reports aren't inherently related to the race relations issue (even if in her case they may be). That would have resolved the immediate problem (of stopping the after hours calls) and it would have allowed you to collect more information on which to base a future judgment about whether or not there was a real race relations problem.

Agree. The racism was implied. There's all kinds in a congregation, so I'd have left that out. Acceptance means acceptance of each with all their warts.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:53 PM
It does help and I really appreciate your input. I'm not sure I should apologize for this though. It could be my pride, but part of it is that I do feel some sense of call in letting them know that our vision as a church is to be a peaceful community which means that we do not welcome some of the tones of their meetings, etc. But at the same time, that's the price we pay for inviting them in. It's a weird limbo to live in....but you're probably right, I probably did send her a message that I was judging her. My problem is that I don't want a nosy, prejudice neighbor like her, hindering and/or hurting the good people of this new church.

I know I wouldn't want to apologize either, especially if I believed that she was acting on racist motivations. The question is whether you want to smooth over the relationship between your church and the community watch organization (in which case an apology, even if you don't *feel* it, would be useful) or whether you are fine with leaving the impression that you judged her in place (in which case a more direct airing might have been more appropriate). I suppose you could take a third approach and tell her something like "You're right, I did judge you and it's possible that I misjudged you. If I did, I'm sorry. I'm just trying to do what I can to make sure that our new nested congregation receives the best welcome our community can possible give them, blah blah blah." :shrug:

BucEyedPea
03-24-2009, 01:54 PM
I suppose you could take a third approach and tell her something like "You're right, I did judge you and it's possible that I misjudged you. If I did, I'm sorry. I'm just trying to do what I can to make sure that our new nested congregation receives the best welcome our community can possible give them, blah blah blah." :shrug:
Great solution!

Garcia Bronco
03-24-2009, 01:55 PM
I know I wouldn't want to apologize either, especially if I believed that she was acting on racist motivations. The question is whether you want to smooth over the relationship between your church and the community watch organization (in which case an apology, even if you don't *feel* it, would be useful) or whether you are fine with leaving the impression that you judged her in place (in which case a more direct airing might have been more appropriate). I suppose you could take a third approach and tell her something like "You're right, I did judge you and it's possible that I misjudged you. If I did, I'm sorry. I'm just trying to do what I can to make sure that our new nested congregation receives the best welcome our community can possible give them, blah blah blah." :shrug:

Perfection.

InChiefsHell
03-24-2009, 01:56 PM
I think your email is polite and hits on all the important points, but I don't see why you felt the need to include the blue or red parts. In particular, the red part sets up a tone that suggests that the letter has to do with race relations rather than litter and loitering reports. Those parts should have been left out. The fact that you expressed an opinion that this lady is fearful and more prone to take offense when an ethnicity other than her own is involved indicate to me that you had the thought in your mind that you were dealing with a race relations issue even though you tried not to come right out and say it.

Even though you didn't really do anything terribly wrong, I think you should send another note to the lady apologizing for "anything you might have done to give her the impression" that you were accusing her of being racist. Asking her to forgive you would be a nice touch, even if you don't really feel like you were wrong.

I hope this helps.

This, exactly.

I'd say Jilly didn't mean to explicitly call this person a racist, but since she does believe that this person is a racist it's hard to write a note like that without coming across as being accusatory.

I'd guess the recipient didn't like being called out for something that deep in her heart she knows is true.

Jilly
03-24-2009, 01:57 PM
Agree. The racism was implied. There's all kinds in a congregation, so I'd have left that out. Acceptance means acceptance of each with all their warts.

It does, except, like I said in a previous post, I'm stuck because I preach some strong messages that we should not keep silent when injustice occurs and as a leader, a responsible and authentic leader, that's what I felt needed to happen here, but at the same time, I value community and the peace of this community and preach that message as well? So, I'm seeing all your points, just not sure what's best, most appropriate, most valuable....etc etc.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 01:57 PM
So, you completely ignore the rest of what they lady complained about? For someone that likes to whine about Darth Cheney being quoted out of context you sure like to leave context out when it's convenient to you.

Maybe you can explain to me which parts of her complaints were racist then (based on posts 1-24).

BucEyedPea
03-24-2009, 01:58 PM
It does, except, like I said in a previous post, I'm stuck because I preach some strong messages that we should not keep silent when injustice occurs and as a leader, a responsible and authentic leader, that's what I felt needed to happen here, but at the same time, I value community and the peace of this community and preach that message as well? So, I'm seeing all your points, just not sure what's best, most appropriate, most valuable....etc etc.

I think pats solution is perfect for that too.
But I also think your two goals can conflict with one another at times.

Garcia Bronco
03-24-2009, 02:01 PM
I'm stuck because I preach some strong messages that we should not keep silent when injustice occurs and as a leader,

It's not what you say in this world. It's how you say it.

Jenson71
03-24-2009, 03:37 PM
Kill everybody in a right-wing anti-government militia takeover. Declare the block the new Heavenly Kingdom. Keep the block captain alive for strategic advice. Use her family as hostages.

aturnis
03-24-2009, 03:44 PM
burn it down.

KC native
03-24-2009, 03:46 PM
Maybe you can explain to me which parts of her complaints were racist then (based on posts 1-24).

Context whore comes back for more. So you pick out the trash comment but leave out the other events? Why?


After a Sat evening worship, one of the block captains from the neighborhood watch group contacted our person in charge of relating to them complaining of people being in the church parking lot and if they should be there. (We are talking over 30 cars in the lot). Then, on the following Tues, the same person contacted our person to complain of someone, although no specifics were named, throwing trash in the street. The neighborhood block captain lives in tremendous fear and calls the police if even an odd car drives through the neighborhood....esp if said car is driven by someone not of her ethnicity.
Jill

patteeu
03-24-2009, 06:37 PM
Context whore comes back for more. So you pick out the trash comment but leave out the other events? Why?

Because I didn't think I needed to repeat the entire OP. What's racist about throwing trash out in the street or loitering in a church parking lot? Seriously.

Feel free to admit that you're FOS.

Saul Good
03-24-2009, 07:15 PM
Except that I feel it part of my calling as a Christian minister to say something when I see an injustice.

You didn't say anything about the injustice. You simply implied that the complaints were racially motivated. If you're going to play the card, play the card. Otherwise, you create a scenario in which any time someone complains about the actions of a minority, they run the risk of being labeled a racist.

jidar
03-24-2009, 08:28 PM
O

I need level headed thinking right now, instead of my initial passionate response which would be to call her out. Thanks everyone.

Jill


Sounds like the boat has sailed on that one there Jill

patteeu
03-24-2009, 08:35 PM
Sounds like the boat has sailed on that one there Jill

Maybe so, but I don't think the situation is anywhere near the point where it can't be smoothed over with a little sweet talk in which the watch captain is afforded the benefit of the doubt.

Sully
03-24-2009, 08:40 PM
She should just buy the watch captain an armband that says "WC" on it so the lady can wear it as she sits on her porch or walks the streets and feel more important.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 09:02 PM
She should just buy the watch captain an armband that says "WC" on it so the lady can wear it as she sits on her porch or walks the streets and feel more important.

A badge would probably go a long way. You've seen the magic that bolded usernames work around here when it comes to stroking some folks' egos. :)

NewChief
03-24-2009, 09:07 PM
A badge would probably go a long way. You've seen the magic that bolded usernames work around here when it comes to stroking some folks' egos. :)

I've noticed you've been awful fuggin uppity lately.

patteeu
03-24-2009, 09:13 PM
I've noticed you've been awful fuggin uppity lately.

I've got a newfound swagger!

Jilly
05-04-2009, 02:17 PM
SO, I decided to do nothing regarding this issue and just left it as it was. I got an email from this lady this morning about NOISE coming from the church on Saturday night. It started at 7pm and was still going at 7:55pm. It was drums. The church sharing our building has a full band for their worship.... so yes, there is noise. There has been noise. Now there's apparently part of the neighborhood complaining....

is this something I need to address, or just let it roll off my back? Or can our church really get a citation for noise?

wild1
05-04-2009, 02:21 PM
Reading the opening post, I can't tell what the question is.

wutamess
05-04-2009, 02:27 PM
"block captain" ROFL:rolleyes:

ROFL

wutamess
05-04-2009, 02:30 PM
Practice! We talkin bout pract... er Church!

Jilly
05-04-2009, 02:38 PM
Reading the opening post, I can't tell what the question is.

you prob need to read the whole thread with the follow ups and everything....I can't tell you at this point.

Basically she thinks I called her a racist. And got pissy with me.

wild1
05-04-2009, 02:43 PM
you prob need to read the whole thread with the follow ups and everything....I can't tell you at this point.

Basically she thinks I called her a racist. And got pissy with me.

So ignore her.

nstygma
05-04-2009, 03:17 PM
you can make as much noise as you want until 10pm

patteeu
05-05-2009, 07:14 AM
SO, I decided to do nothing regarding this issue and just left it as it was. I got an email from this lady this morning about NOISE coming from the church on Saturday night. It started at 7pm and was still going at 7:55pm. It was drums. The church sharing our building has a full band for their worship.... so yes, there is noise. There has been noise. Now there's apparently part of the neighborhood complaining....

is this something I need to address, or just let it roll off my back? Or can our church really get a citation for noise?

It's possible to get a citation for noise, but it's hard for me to believe that a church band (playing inside, I presume) would be generating enough noise to draw one. Maybe I'm naive about how loud this church band can get.

Maybe you could check with local law enforcement authorities to see what the rules are in your neighborhood and possibly have them send an officer out to see if the noise level is a problem. In the (unlikely IMO) event that it's too loud, let the church know that their band is a little too loud and that the city has told you that the noise level needs to be reduced and in the (more likely IMO) event that they say it's fine, respond to the complaining lady telling her that you checked it out and find that it falls within acceptable levels for that time of day or just ignore the complaint. :shrug:

InChiefsHell
05-05-2009, 07:31 AM
pat is so practical. That's exactly what I was going to suggest. Beat her to the punch, call the cops yourself and get it cleared.

Earthling
05-05-2009, 10:01 AM
you can make as much noise as you want until 10pm

Not in Colorado. We played a wedding gig, outdoors, in Georgetown CO. and the local police were there in about 10 min. He informed us that Georgetown had a city "noise" ordinance that nothing could be louder than 50db. I asked him where his decibel meter was and what it registered us at. He replied.."You don't expect us to carry them things around with us do ya?" I replied "Well...yes" Long story short he shut us down and we had to move it all inside at a very subdued volumn.

Earthling
05-05-2009, 10:07 AM
Jilly...One possibility of dealing with this lady is to have her participate in a disscussion on 'How best to welcome our new members'. She can voice her dissent on matters at that time, if she chooses, and also she might feel like an active participant in the course settled upon, which might render her more open to everything.