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Von Dumbass
04-09-2009, 11:38 AM
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2009/04/forbes_pats_one.html
There are different ways to gauge how successful teams are in the NFL Draft, and Forbes has come up with its own fomula rating the league's 32 teams over the last three years.

Based on that formula, which heavily weighs how many draft picks remain on a team's roster, the Patriots rank as the NFL's worst drafting team.

"The bottom five will surprise fans most. The worst drafting team in the past three years, holding on to only a little more than half of its drafted players: the New England Patriots. With three Super Bowl wins since 2001, the Patriots are the team of the decade so far. They boast a 39-9 record in the past three years. How have they maintained that excellence? Though saddled with low draft picks, the Patriots have been the masters of picking up useful veteran free agents--players whose contracts have expired, making them eligible to sign with any team--to fill holes in their lineup (see: receivers Randy Moss and Wes Welker)."

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2009/04/forbes_pats_one.html

This article, which was passed along by a reader (thanks Ken), sheds a different light on the strong reputation that the Patriots have regarding personnel acumen.

Certainly, other factors must be considered, such as: 1) Because the Patriots have had a stocked roster there have been fewer opportunities for rookies; 2) Rookie free agents like Pierre Woods and Gary Guyton aren't accounted for; 3) Technically, Wes Welker was the team's second-round draft choice in 2007, and Randy Moss was the team's fourth-round draft choice in 2007 (those players were acquired with those picks).

But even with those points in mind, the article by Forbes makes one pause and consider if the team has missed some opportunities -- particularly in 2006 and 2007.

It would be hard to argue that those drafts were the team's best work.

Here is the Forbes link. http://www.forbes.com/2009/04/08/nfl-draft-teams-lifestyle-sports-nfl-draft_slide_8.html?thisSpeed=30000

Brock
04-09-2009, 11:40 AM
Wes Welker wasn't a free agent. Forgive me if I'm skeptical. EDIT- Neither was Randy Moss, this guy's a dumbass.

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 11:41 AM
Too bad Moss and Welker weren't free agents...they used draft picks to acquire them.

Epic fail by Forbes.

dirk digler
04-09-2009, 11:42 AM
LMAO

The Donkey's were rated the 3rd best but still suck. The Steelers were rated the 3rd worst LMAO

Dartgod
04-09-2009, 11:45 AM
DAMMIT, SCOTT!! :cuss:

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 11:47 AM
Hey Cutler (cool name), are you a Bears fan?

Mr. Flopnuts
04-09-2009, 11:47 AM
Shouldn't it be orton7624 now?

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 11:48 AM
LMAO

You suck, Donkey fan!

beach tribe
04-09-2009, 11:55 AM
No NO Cutler sucks now, just ask him.

LaChapelle
04-09-2009, 11:56 AM
Let me see if I have this right.

1) Patriot's drafts suck so Pioli sucks

2) Even though the Patriots drafts are the worst. McDaniels can take a 7th rounder from that dung heap and make him a winner. McDaniels is genius.

So to some up, Broncos rule, Chiefs suck.

veist
04-09-2009, 12:00 PM
Wow, what a joke. Their formula is "who has the most of their drafted players, that makes them the best at drafting". So many things wrong with that it makes me want to punch someone.

T-post Tom
04-09-2009, 12:01 PM
Well judging by the Patriot fans' comments on the link, Forbes really screwed the pooch when they paid that writer.

nychief
04-09-2009, 12:06 PM
well, it stands to reason that fewer draft picks will make the final 53 on a very good team.

blaise
04-09-2009, 12:10 PM
I think Forbes was the magazine that said Kevin McHale was the top General Manager in sports a couple of years ago.

http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/02/sports-greatest-gms-biz-cz_jg_0302gms_2.html

Amnorix
04-09-2009, 12:10 PM
Well judging by the Patriot fans' comments on the link, Forbes really screwed the pooch when they paid that writer.

Well, the formula's got a million problems.

Here's why the Patriots were dead last (a few of the reasons, anyway):

1. start date. They looked at the last 3 years only. If they went back just one more year -- to four years ago -- then you pick up Pro Bowler Logan Mankins, and three starters -- CB Hobbs, ROT Kaczur and S Sanders. You also get some dooooofus named Matt Cassel, but of course, that wouldn't matter because....

2. the ONLY criteria for whether it's a good draft is (a) you drafted the guy, and (b) he's still with your team. Using that formula, the Patriots get ZERO credit for a guy like Cassell (who didn't count nayway because he only goes back three years). For that matter, the Giants and Bolts would get zip for Manning/Rivers because they didn't KEEP the guy they drafted. To Forbes' mind, the difference between drafting Philip Rivers (and trading him for Eli Manning) and drafting Ryan Leaf -- none.

3. Patriots get ZERO credit for using draft picks to acquire established players. We traded picks to get these two flunkies named Moss and Welker. According to Forbes, it counts as much as drafting Joe da Suck and Wally Washout. No credit for that, none.

4. As a result -- in 2007 we had ONE pick in the first three rounds. Big surprise that alot of those 4-7th rounders didn't stick with a team that had an undefeated regular season and was iwthin a minute or so of winning the Super Bowl. :rolleyes:

Seriously -- they almost had to specifically design a formula to hose the Pats to come up with this...

All that said, nobody is going to argue that 2006/07 were the Patriots' best drafting years. They obviously weren't. But how the hell many guys (other than Hamas) would argue that a 2nd and 7th for Welker and a 4th for MOss were a bad idea?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 12:14 PM
Seriously -- they almost had to specifically design a formula to hose the Pats to come up with this...

Yep...but there are a lot of Cutler's out there to spread this dumbassery around as Gospel.

So the Pats are the worst (dynasty), and the Steelers are the third worst (Super Bowl champs)...Hmm...since the draft is so unimportant apparently, it sure makes Denver look ever dumber for trading Cutler away for all of those useless draft picks.

Dumbass.

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 12:15 PM
(other than Hamas)

Reptastic. Great post.

Hamas would trade his first born child for a conditional 4th round pick.

King_Chief_Fan
04-09-2009, 12:29 PM
Yep...but there are a lot of Cutler's out there to spread this dumbassery around as Gospel.

So the Pats are the worst (dynasty), and the Steelers are the third worst (Super Bowl champs)...Hmm...since the draft is so unimportant apparently, it sure makes Denver look ever dumber for trading Cutler away for all of those useless draft picks.

Dumbass.:doh!::clap:

Tuckdaddy
04-09-2009, 12:31 PM
Who gives a shit what Forbes thinks?

Count Alex's Wins
04-09-2009, 12:33 PM
Who gives a shit what Forbes thinks?

WPI > Forbes?

blaise
04-09-2009, 12:35 PM
WPI > Forbes?


In terms of subscription price?

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 12:37 PM
WPI > Forbes?

I don't know how WPI has subscribers, especially in this economy.

It's a garbage site (scout.com sucks overall), and it charges $110 for nothing. Are you kidding me?

If I had to choose between a $10 gift certificate to Wendy's or a five year WPI subscription, no joke, I'm taking Wendy's and never looking back (and I don't even like Wendy's all that much)...

dirk digler
04-09-2009, 12:39 PM
In terms of subscription price?

LMAO

Count Alex's Wins
04-09-2009, 12:40 PM
I don't know how WPI has subscribers, especially in this economy.

It's a garbage site (scout.com sucks overall), and it charges $110 for nothing. Are you kidding me?

If I had to choose between a $10 gift certificate to Wendy's or a five year WPI subscription, no joke, I'm taking Wendy's and never looking back (and I don't even like Wendy's all that much)...

WPI > Hootie's brain?

Amnorix
04-09-2009, 12:47 PM
Reptastic. Great post.

Hamas would trade his first born child for a conditional 4th round pick.

I had a long-running war with him over the Welker pick.

Short Leash Hootie
04-09-2009, 12:47 PM
WPI > Hootie's brain?

I don't blame you for getting a paycheck...props...

JASONSAUTO
04-09-2009, 12:48 PM
I don't know how WPI has subscribers, especially in this economy.

It's a garbage site (scout.com sucks overall), and it charges $110 for nothing. Are you kidding me?

If I had to choose between a $10 gift certificate to Wendy's or a five year WPI subscription, no joke, I'm taking Wendy's and never looking back (and I don't even like Wendy's all that much)...

ROFL

Mecca
04-09-2009, 12:59 PM
Well in fairness the Patriots draft history since 2006 is pretty blah.

CoMoChief
04-09-2009, 01:07 PM
I guess Forbes forgets that the Pats draft nearly at the bottom of the draft every season.

Mile High Mania
04-09-2009, 01:07 PM
I didn't even read it... I mean, the Broncos' drafts sucked until the year they got Cutler, Marshall, etc... the last few years, they've had good drafts. However, the team has sucked b/c their paying the sins for past draft/FA failures and multiple DC replacements.

Anyway, the rationale for the list is just worthless.

EyePod
04-09-2009, 02:50 PM
I would argue that NE is better than the rest of the NFL, because they draft players low, and then trade them high. What was Cassel drafted at? What did they get for him? What about Branch? Same thing. This list could be added to also.

-King-
04-09-2009, 02:50 PM
Well, the formula's got a million problems.

Here's why the Patriots were dead last (a few of the reasons, anyway):

1. start date. They looked at the last 3 years only. If they went back just one more year -- to four years ago -- then you pick up Pro Bowler Logan Mankins, and three starters -- CB Hobbs, ROT Kaczur and S Sanders. You also get some dooooofus named Matt Cassel, but of course, that wouldn't matter because....

2. the ONLY criteria for whether it's a good draft is (a) you drafted the guy, and (b) he's still with your team. Using that formula, the Patriots get ZERO credit for a guy like Cassell (who didn't count nayway because he only goes back three years). For that matter, the Giants and Bolts would get zip for Manning/Rivers because they didn't KEEP the guy they drafted. To Forbes' mind, the difference between drafting Philip Rivers (and trading him for Eli Manning) and drafting Ryan Leaf -- none.

3. Patriots get ZERO credit for using draft picks to acquire established players. We traded picks to get these two flunkies named Moss and Welker. According to Forbes, it counts as much as drafting Joe da Suck and Wally Washout. No credit for that, none.

4. As a result -- in 2007 we had ONE pick in the first three rounds. Big surprise that alot of those 4-7th rounders didn't stick with a team that had an undefeated regular season and was iwthin a minute or so of winning the Super Bowl. :rolleyes:

Seriously -- they almost had to specifically design a formula to hose the Pats to come up with this...

All that said, nobody is going to argue that 2006/07 were the Patriots' best drafting years. They obviously weren't. But how the hell many guys (other than Hamas) would argue that a 2nd and 7th for Welker and a 4th for MOss were a bad idea?!?!?!?!?!?!?

I agree, and another point is: The Patriots are already set no matter what, they got established players, so they dont need to play rookies as much. Thats why the draft picks look so bad, because they are sitting behind a perfect team. Matt Ryan wouldnt have improved the patriots draft record, because he would have been sitting behind a hall of fame qb. You cant really have a great draft if your team is already perfect.

And even then, Jarrod Mayo >> All but 5 or 6 first rounders last year.

Amnorix
04-09-2009, 03:08 PM
I would argue that NE is better than the rest of the NFL, because they draft players low, and then trade them high. What was Cassel drafted at? What did they get for him? What about Branch? Same thing. This list could be added to also.

This is rare, actually.

We traded Cassell (a 7th round pick) and Vrabel (FA signing) for a high 2nd with KC.

We traded Branch (a 2nd round pick) to Seattle for a middling 1st round pick (#24).

We traded Tebucky Jones (a 1st or 2nd roound pick during the Grier error) to New Orleans for like a 3rd, 4th and 7th or something.

We traded Bledsoe (1st overall pick) to Buffalo for a 1st round pick.

There might be others, but not many, certainly...

KCrockaholic
04-09-2009, 04:12 PM
wow forbes sucks!

Jayhawkerman2001
04-09-2009, 04:15 PM
seeing this make me realize how ridiculous forbes is. the patriots the worst drafting team? HAH!! thats downright ridiculous. from what i remember they've been draft geniuses

LaChapelle
04-09-2009, 04:46 PM
Cutler7624 seems to be on 24 hour damage control. Nap time is calling.