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The Poz
04-12-2009, 10:29 AM
Sorry if re-post, didn't see it anywhere.
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=1331

The Falcons are reportedly interested in trading for Chiefs TE Tony Gonzalez.
The National Football Post's Michael Lombardi says the Falcons are "seriously considering" the option, with their second-round pick as bait. Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt is attached to his franchise icon, but he might be convinced to part ways as the team rebuilds.

Atlanta has the 55th pick in the second. Maybe Jarron Gilbert or Paul Kruger although I'd rather see Tony stick it out here.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:30 AM
http://www.theboxset.com/images/reviewcaptures/612capture_tombstone03.jpg

StcChief
04-12-2009, 10:32 AM
Good God Just say no... Clark have some integrity here. Gonzo needs to go out as Chief.

philfree
04-12-2009, 10:32 AM
Sorry if re-post, didn't see it anywhere.
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=1331

The Falcons are reportedly interested in trading for Chiefs TE Tony Gonzalez.
The National Football Post's Michael Lombardi says the Falcons are "seriously considering" the option, with their second-round pick as bait. Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt is attached to his franchise icon, but he might be convinced to part ways as the team rebuilds.

Atlanta has the 55th pick in the second. Maybe Jarron Gilbert or Paul Kruger although I'd rather see Tony stick it out here.

If we trade Tony is that hint that we might be seriously considering Crabtree? Without Gonzo we're lacking weapons.


PhilFree:arrow:

Basileus777
04-12-2009, 10:33 AM
For a second round pick I would do it, but nothing less than that.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 10:34 AM
2nd-round pick?

Done.

milkman
04-12-2009, 10:35 AM
2nd-round pick?

Done.

And done.

Mile High Mania
04-12-2009, 10:36 AM
Trading Gonzo would be well received within the AFCW.

beavis
04-12-2009, 10:36 AM
Good God Just say no... Clark have some integrity here. Gonzo needs to go out as Chief.

I think the days of this mentality are over.

Thank God.

ForeverChiefs58
04-12-2009, 10:39 AM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.

milkman
04-12-2009, 10:39 AM
I don't know why people seem to think that Clark Hunt is going to interfere with football operations.

You have to know that part of the deal in getting Pioli to sign on had to be full control over those football operations.

milkman
04-12-2009, 10:40 AM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.

How many of those 2nd round picks were Pioli's?

CanadianChief
04-12-2009, 10:41 AM
I thought Gonzo wanted a ring? He ain't gonna get it going to Atl so he might as well stay put.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 10:42 AM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.

tonyetony
04-12-2009, 10:42 AM
I think the days of this mentality are over.

Thank God.

I agree and Tony G has been trying and crying for a trade, we might as well get something for him.

StcChief
04-12-2009, 10:44 AM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.this. A 2nd round pick #55 in ATL. I wouldn't be surprised if Gonzo says no thanks I quit

Rain Man
04-12-2009, 10:46 AM
How many of those 2nd round picks were Pioli's?


He drafted Blackledge. Admittedly, he was smarter than Peterson since he only used a second-rounder, but still....

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:48 AM
I thought Gonzo wanted a ring? He ain't gonna get it going to Atl so he might as well stay put.

http://i41.tinypic.com/2gwgp4j.jpg

TG would have an overwhelmingly better chance at winning a SB in ATL in the next 2 years over staying in KC.

To argue otherwise is flat-out ridiculous.

Tuckdaddy
04-12-2009, 10:48 AM
I would do it for their second only if Tony wants it this way. Out of the division and conference as well. Nothing less than a second.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:49 AM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.

A contender?

Are you kidding?

Do you actually think that guys like Vrabel, Thomas and yes, Gonzalez are going to be around when this team is truly competitive?

Vrabel and Thomas might have this year left, and Gonzo has said he might play this year and next.

CanadianChief
04-12-2009, 10:50 AM
http://i41.tinypic.com/2gwgp4j.jpg

TG would have an overwhelmingly better chance at winning a SB in ATL in the next 2 years over staying in KC.

To argue otherwise is flat-out ridiculous.

I agree that his chances are better in Atlanta but I still don't see them coming anywhere close to winning a Superbowl in the next two years.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 10:52 AM
this. A 2nd round pick #55 in ATL. I wouldn't be surprised if Gonzo says no thanks I quit

He wouldn't want to play for ATL, but he would want to play for KC? What?

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:53 AM
I agree that his chances are better in Atlanta but I still don't see them coming anywhere close to winning a Superbowl in the next two years.

No one can guarantee him a SB ring.

But to say that ATL won't come close is once again foolish, considering they were closer LAST year than 20 other teams.

You have to MAKE the playoffs to win the SB, last I checked.

keg in kc
04-12-2009, 10:54 AM
For a second rounder? Get it done yesterday.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:55 AM
He wouldn't want to play for ATL, but he would want to play for KC? What?

No shit.

Franchise QB getting me the ball.

2 damn good WR's to keep me from being doubled.

A solid OL that gives the QB time.

A great running game to open up the pass.

An offensive coordinator that doesn't shit the bed in goal-to-go situations.

Yeah, it makes all the sense in the world to pass on ATL and stay in KC.

Bwana
04-12-2009, 10:55 AM
A 2nd? If that's the case, see ya Tony.

SNR
04-12-2009, 10:57 AM
Yeah, go to the Falcons, Tony. THAT'LL win you a Super Bowl :shake:

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 10:57 AM
Yeah, go to the Falcons, Tony. THAT'LL win you a Super Bowl :shake:

And staying in KC will get him what?

About 10 more wins over the next 2 years?

Atlanta at least gives him an opportunity, surrounded by a phenomenal cast.

SNR
04-12-2009, 11:00 AM
And staying in KC will get him what?

About 10 more wins over the next 2 years?

Atlanta at least gives him an opportunity, surrounded by a phenomenal cast.I didn't say he had an opportunity in KC. I'm just saying the opportunity isn't there in Atlanta. That team is still 2 or 3 years away.

wazu
04-12-2009, 11:00 AM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.

The Chiefs second-rounders are irrelevant. Let's look at how the Pats have done recently:

2000 - RB - J.R. Redmond - Off team
2001 - OT - Matt Light - Pro-Bowler
2002 - WR - Deion Branch - Traded for first round pick in 2006
2003a - DB - Eugene Wilson - Off team
2003b - WR - Bethel Johnson - Off team
2004 - DE - Marquise Hill - Off team
2005 - (no pick)
2006 - WR - Chad Jackson - Off team
2007 - (no pick)
2008 - CB - Terrence Wheatley - Started 6 of 8 games before injury

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:04 AM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.

You mean a veteran presence like Donnie Edwards?

tonyetony
04-12-2009, 11:07 AM
The Chiefs second-rounders are irrelevant. Let's look at how the Pats have done recently:

2000 - RB - J.R. Redmond - Off team
2001 - OT - Matt Light - Pro-Bowler
2002 - WR - Deion Branch - Traded for first round pick in 2006
2003a - DB - Eugene Wilson - Off team
2003b - WR - Bethel Johnson - Off team
2004 - DE - Marquise Hill - Off team
2005 - (no pick)
2006 - WR - Chad Jackson - Off team
2007 - (no pick)
2008 - CB - Terrence Wheatley - Started 6 of 8 games before injury


I noticed the only O-lineman they selected in the second is a pro bowler. You have to think if we trade back into the second that's going to be the pick since o-line is the strength of this draft.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:07 AM
I didn't say he had an opportunity in KC. I'm just saying the opportunity isn't there in Atlanta. That team is still 2 or 3 years away.

That team is loaded with young talent, as well as a nice mix of verteran leaders.

Thay've had years to build that team, and getting Matt Ryan last year to replace vick just gets them closer.

That team is far closer than you imagine.

I think they could legitimately contend this year.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:11 AM
A contender?

Are you kidding?

Do you actually think that guys like Vrabel, Thomas and yes, Gonzalez are going to be around when this team is truly competitive?

Vrabel and Thomas might have this year left, and Gonzo has said he might play this year and next.

Sorry drafturbator...not happening unless we get a 2nd AND something. Going to have to be a WOW offer...

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:12 AM
That team is loaded with young talent, as well as a nice mix of verteran leaders.

Thay've had years to build that team, and getting Matt Ryan last year to replace vick just gets them closer.

That team is far closer than you imagine.

I think they could legitimately contend this year.

what makes you think we can't win 10 games next year? All we need is a pass rush...the offense will be there.

kstater
04-12-2009, 11:13 AM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.

Chance that TG is playing when this team makes a run at SB=0
Chance that 2nd rd pic is playing when this team is ready=more than TG.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:14 AM
Sorry drafturbator...not happening unless we get a 2nd AND something. Going to have to be a WOW offer...

Quite frankly, Tony Gonzales is a whiney ass bitch who doesn't fit the Patriot mold, so if that offer is on the table, I have no doubt that Pioli will jump on it.

Crush
04-12-2009, 11:14 AM
If that is the case, pack his bags and get him the fuck out of town.

I could give two shits about him retiring as a Chief, as long as the team wins a Super Bowl sometime this century. A potential 2nd rounder will contribute more toward that goal than an aging tight end, who only has 1-2 years left, that bitches every other day about being traded.

The era of player loyalty is over. The insignia on the helmet should come before the player, if you want to win a Super Bowl.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:15 AM
Sorry drafturbator...not happening unless we get a 2nd AND something. Going to have to be a WOW offer...

Dear God.

No one is going to give up more than that for a 33 year old who plays a periphery position and has stated on numerous occasions that he's only going to play another 1-2 years.

The fact that someone is willing to part with a 2nd is shocking in itself.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:17 AM
what makes you think we can't win 10 games next year? All we need is a pass rush...the offense will be there.

Even with the signing and acquisition of solid vet players like Vrabel, Engram and Thomas, and Cassel, there's still a lot of holes on this team.

Is it possible that the Chiefs could win 10 games?
Sure, though I think 6 wins is more like it.

Are they going to legitimately contend for a SB?

Hell no.

Skip Towne
04-12-2009, 11:18 AM
If that is the case, pack his bags and get him the fuck out of town.

I could give two shits about him retiring as a Chief, as long as the team wins a Super Bowl sometime this century. A potential 2nd rounder will contribute more toward that goal than an aging tight end, who only has 1-2 years left, that bitches every other day about being traded.

The era of player loyalty is over. The insignia on the helmet should come before the player, if you want to win a Super Bowl.

Agreed. In basketball terms " The name on the front of the jersey > the name on the back"

orange
04-12-2009, 11:18 AM
I noticed the only O-lineman they selected in the second is a pro bowler. You have to think if we trade back into the second that's going to be the pick since o-line is the strength of this draft.

According to Mike Lombardi - the source of the ATL/Gonzalez rumor - the Chiefs won't have to go trade into the second to go OL:

If one of the two offensive tackles (Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe) slips to Seattle at No. 4, the Seahawks would make the move and select either one, as Walter Jones is not a sure thing to be healthy at the start of the season. Seattle values character and will remove many players from its board for that reason. Smith and Monroe meet their character qualifications. But I doubt either player makes it to Seattle at four.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/2009/04/notes-from-lombardi-sunday-edition/

kstater
04-12-2009, 11:18 AM
Dear God.

No one is going to give up more than that for a 33 year old[ who plays a periphery position and has stated on numerous occasions that he's only going to play another 1-2 years.

The fact that someone is willing to part with a 2nd is shocking in itself.

FYP

chiefs1111
04-12-2009, 11:18 AM
As much as I like Tony if the Falcons offer up their 2nd rounder,you have to take that offer.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:19 AM
Dear God.

No one is going to give up more than that for a 33 year old who plays a periphery position and has stated on numerous occasions that he's only going to play another 1-2 years.

The fact that someone is willing to part with a 2nd is shocking in itself.

This is why a wannabe like you isn't a GM.

Pioli has NO reason to trade Gonzalez. Matt Cassel is his price acquisition...Tony Gonzalez has shown he's a GREAT option for a QB...he has only gotten better with age. Scott Pioli has shown he wants veterans on the team...Tony Gonzalez is probably the best player on our roster...Tony Gonzalez makes his QB better...we need Matt Cassel to be a franchise QB.

Like I said...the only way Pioli trades TG is for a WOW offer...fortunately, the Chiefs have all of the leverage against the Falcons. If they want Gonzalez, they can give us a 2nd and 5th.

If not, I'm sure Pioli will be ok with a guy who plays the way Tony does on Sunday's...

melbar
04-12-2009, 11:20 AM
I think the days of this mentality are over.

Thank God.

Still extremely productive. If there was a serious decline in ability thats one thing. Why "thank God" for disloyalty to a productive hard working part of the organization.:shake:

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:21 AM
This is why a wannabe like you isn't a GM.

Pioli has NO reason to trade Gonzalez. Matt Cassel is his price acquisition...Tony Gonzalez has shown he's a GREAT option for a QB...he has only gotten better with age. Scott Pioli has shown he wants veterans on the team...Tony Gonzalez is probably the best player on our roster...Tony Gonzalez makes his QB better...we need Matt Cassel to be a franchise QB.

Like I said...the only way Pioli trades TG is for a WOW offer...fortunately, the Chiefs have all of the leverage against the Falcons. If they want Gonzalez, they can give us a 2nd and 5th.

If not, I'm sure Pioli will be ok with a guy who plays the way Tony does on Sunday's...


Holy Jesus.

You wonder why people think you're a retard.

Going to have to be a WOW offer...

So now a 2nd and a 5th is that WOW offer?

A SECOND AND A FIFTH.

Yeah, I'm really wowed by the addition of that 5th round pick.

Crush
04-12-2009, 11:22 AM
Also, winning 10 games should not be the goal of this team. The goal of this team is to win a Super Bowl. Anything else and you are a loser. Only one team comes out as a winner for the year. I want the Chiefs to be that winner. I'm tired of the Chiefs being grouped together with the 31 other losers.

If Atlanta is willing to give up their 2nd round pick, then so be it. See you later, California pretty boy, you never liked KC to begin with. GTFO

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 11:23 AM
what makes you think we can't win 10 games next year? All we need is a pass rush...the offense will be there.

This has to be a bullshit post to try to stir the pot.

I'm not biting.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:23 AM
This has to be a bullshit post to try to stir the pot.

I'm not biting.

No, he does this every year.

IIRC, either last year or the year before, he thought we'd win 11.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 11:25 AM
Still extremely productive. If there was a serious decline in ability thats one thing. Why "thank God" for disloyalty to a productive hard working part of the organization.:shake:

Disloyalty?

I hate the mindset that we "owe" players like Gonzo anything. He's been well paid by the organization and cheered by the fans. That's enough.

No one owes him shit, yet when he opens his pie hole, people start fumbling all over themselves to praise and comfort him.

As I've said numerous times, I don't give a **** about any single player on this team. It's about the organization as a whole for me.

Crush
04-12-2009, 11:26 AM
Why "thank God" for disloyalty to a productive hard working part of the organization.:shake:


This is a business. The Chiefs want to win a Super Bowl. We want them to win a Super Bowl. However, the NFL does not give out trophies or rings for being sentimental.

chiefs1111
04-12-2009, 11:26 AM
Im sorry but with our schedule there is now way we win 10 games this year. Maybe we could go 7-9 this season,and thats a BIG maybe... more likely 5-11

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:26 AM
Holy Jesus.

You wonder why people think you're a retard.



So now a 2nd and a 5th is that WOW offer?

A SECOND AND A FIFTH.

Yeah, I'm really wowed by the addition of that 5th round pick.

Relax guy.

I'm only saying I don't think Pioli pulls the trigger for just a 2nd round pick.

Maybe a 2nd and a player...I don't know. I don't see why Pioli NEEDS to make a deal...giving the Chiefs all of the leverage.

What's the worst thing that can happen? We have to suffer another two years of 100 receptions and 1,000+ receiving yards? Oh no!

"BUT HE WON'T BE ON THE TEAM WHEN WE'RE COMPETING FOR A SUPER BOWL!!!!"

Boo-fucking-hoo for him! He'll be an integral part in the development of our QB...and I'm ok with that. I know that it doesn't give you something to jerk off to during the draft...but chances are we'd land a decent starter at best in the 2nd round...so who gives a shit?

What's the success rate of a player making a pro bowl at the bottom of the 2nd round? 10%?

I'll take one, two or three years of high quality play from a great receiving tight end who will help our QB succeed over a late 2nd round pick that probably won't be anything better than Kawika Mitchell.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 11:27 AM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.This.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 11:27 AM
No, he does this every year.

IIRC, either last year or the year before, he thought we'd win 11.

http://www.germes-online.com/direct/dbimage/50310541/Hip_Flask.jpg

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:27 AM
Disloyalty?

I hate the mindset that we "owe" players like Gonzo anything. He's been well paid by the organization and cheered by the fans. That's enough.

No one owes him shit, yet when he opens his pie hole, people start fumbling all over themselves to praise and comfort him.

As I've said numerous times, I don't give a **** about any single player on this team. It's about the organization as a whole for me.

This is a business. The Chiefs want to win a Super Bowl. We want them to win a Super Bowl. However, the NFL does not give out trophies or rings for being sentimental.

THESE.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:28 AM
http://www.germes-online.com/direct/dbimage/50310541/Hip_Flask.jpg

Yeah, and he runs around here proud of it.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 11:29 AM
He drafted Blackledge. Admittedly, he was smarter than Peterson since he only used a second-rounder, but still....

:LOL:
Mr. Rain Man is a Football Encyclopedia.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:29 AM
No, he does this every year.

IIRC, either last year or the year before, he thought we'd win 11.

Oh well FUCK me.

God forbid I have high hopes for a team I cheer for! Damn me straight to hell!

Don't mind me, drafturbating know-it-alls, I don't want to get in the middle of your 'my god this team is full of holes' circle jerk...by all means, keep going with your awesome theories on how to trade all of our great players for draft picks every year...maybe we can trade Cassel for a 2011 1st round pick...and then Bowe!

Yeah! Lets just fucking trade everything valuable on our roster every year so we can have as many draft picks as possible! WINNING THE DRAFT > WINNING FOOTBALL GAMES!

bdeg
04-12-2009, 11:30 AM
The Chiefs second-rounders are irrelevant. Let's look at how the Pats have done recently:

2000 - RB - J.R. Redmond - Off team
2001 - OT - Matt Light - Pro-Bowler
2002 - WR - Deion Branch - Traded for first round pick in 2006
2003a - DB - Eugene Wilson - Off team
2003b - WR - Bethel Johnson - Off team
2004 - DE - Marquise Hill - Off team
2005 - (no pick)
2006 - WR - Chad Jackson - Off team
2007 - (no pick)
2008 - CB - Terrence Wheatley - Started 6 of 8 games before injury

I was thinking about this and that other thread claiming the Pats had the worst drafting record, and there are two factors not adequately taken into account:

It's a team loaded with talent. Many more difficult decisions than the Chiefs have been faced with. Also, they're typically picking at the end of every round. Over the long run, they would need to have ridiculously superior drafting to meet the average first rounder/any rounder(but especially the first).

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:31 AM
Yeah, and he runs around here proud of it.
At least I don't run around here like a know-it-all GM...

Are you typing with one hand and jerking Mecca off with the other?

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:32 AM
Relax guy.

I'm only saying I don't think Pioli pulls the trigger for just a 2nd round pick.

So which is it?

Nothing less than a WOW offer, or a 2nd and a 5th?

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:32 AM
If they are offering a second rounder I would take that deal instantly.

Just Passin' By
04-12-2009, 11:33 AM
The Chiefs second-rounders are irrelevant. Let's look at how the Pats have done recently:

2000 - RB - J.R. Redmond - Off team
2001 - OT - Matt Light - Pro-Bowler
2002 - WR - Deion Branch - Traded for first round pick in 2006
2003a - DB - Eugene Wilson - Off team
2003b - WR - Bethel Johnson - Off team
2004 - DE - Marquise Hill - Off team
2005 - (no pick)
2006 - WR - Chad Jackson - Off team
2007 - (no pick)
2008 - CB - Terrence Wheatley - Started 6 of 8 games before injury

Branch - Super Bowl MVP
Light - 2 time Pro Bowler, 1 time All Pro
Wilson - excellent safety until injuries caught up with him. Now with Texans
Hill - Not on team BECAUSE HE DIED
Jackson - Major disappointment in NE, but still in league
Johnson - Good at returns. Too stubborn to adapt to NFL. Legit bust
Wheatley - Had taken over starter's job before getting hurt
Redmond - Drafted in the 3rd round, not 2nd

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:34 AM
So which is it?

Nothing less than a WOW offer, or a 2nd and a 5th?

Well fortunately Pioli has all of the leverage, so we'll see...

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:34 AM
At least I don't run around here like a know-it-all GM...

Are you typing with one hand and jerking Mecca off with the other?

Nope.

If you stayed sober long enough to read, you'd know that there are few people that have head-butted with Mecca more than me on this forum.

I'm shocked you're posting this early, I figured you'd be busy kicking the girl you date-raped last night out of your place.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:34 AM
So which is it?

Nothing less than a WOW offer, or a 2nd and a 5th?

I think he mean't a second, a fifth, and a ShamWow.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:35 AM
I think he mean't a second, a fifth, and a ShamWow.

Knowing Hootie it was a 2nd, and a fifth of whiskey.

Frazod
04-12-2009, 11:36 AM
I'd hate to see him go, but I'm sick of his whining. I'm fine with it either way.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 11:38 AM
How about Gonzo and LJ for their 1st instead? Turner will need a breather once in a while. Tell you what, I'd throw in our second 7th rounder just good measure.

bdeg
04-12-2009, 11:38 AM
According to Mike Lombardi - the source of the ATL/Gonzalez rumor - the Chiefs won't have to go trade into the second to go OL:

If one of the two offensive tackles (Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe) slips to Seattle at No. 4, the Seahawks would make the move and select either one, as Walter Jones is not a sure thing to be healthy at the start of the season. Seattle values character and will remove many players from its board for that reason. Smith and Monroe meet their character qualifications. But I doubt either player makes it to Seattle at four.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/2009/04/notes-from-lombardi-sunday-edition/
Maybe he thinks someone will trade up for him, needing the last top OT and expecting Seattle to take him.

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:39 AM
How about Gonzo and LJ for their 1st instead? Turner will need a breather once in a while. Tell you what, I'd throw in our second 7th rounder just good measure.

I don't know why anyone would want Johnson, presumably if they trade for him then they get his contract, and thus his (way too high) salary will be guaranteed.

soundmind
04-12-2009, 11:39 AM
What TEs are left on the market for us to acquire when Tony gets shipped though? I know some people think the TE is about two spots higher on the roster than the punter - but they're important. Having TGon means you have an extension of the OL and a legitimate receiving THREAT....88 has shown zero signs of slowing down. He may only play a couple years, but I do not see his production slipping.

Not to mention, if it's your intention to give Cassel some weapons, why trade the best TE to ever play the game???

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:40 AM
How about Gonzo and LJ for their 1st instead? Turner will need a breather once in a while. Tell you what, I'd throw in our second 7th rounder just good measure.

Falcons don't have any need for LJ.

Turner and Norwood are an outstanding 1-2 punch.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:41 AM
a 2nd and Jerious Norwood will do the trick.

Frazod
04-12-2009, 11:42 AM
Isn't Coffman projected as a 2nd round pick?

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:42 AM
and the only way you trade Gonzalez is if you think Cottam has a shot to be an outstanding TE if given playing time.

I think Cottam can be pretty damn good if he is able to stay healthy (big question mark).

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:42 AM
a 2nd and Jerious Norwood will do the trick.

LMAO

chiefs1111
04-12-2009, 11:42 AM
a 2nd and Jerious Norwood will do the trick.

I really don't think they would give up Norwood

Just Passin' By
04-12-2009, 11:42 AM
What TEs are left on the market for us to acquire when Tony gets shipped though? I know some people think the TE is about two spots higher on the roster than the punter - but they're important. Having TGon means you have an extension of the OL and a legitimate receiving THREAT....88 has shown zero signs of slowing down. He may only play a couple years, but I do not see his production slipping.

Not to mention, if it's your intention to give Cassel some weapons, why trade the best TE to ever play the game???

Kellen Winslow is a Chief?

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 11:45 AM
I think Cottam can be pretty damn good if he is able to stay healthy (big question mark).

This.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:46 AM
LMAO
Well I'm glad you're having a good time.

What pick at #55 is going to make the Chiefs better than having Tony Gonzalez? is going to make Matt Cassel better?

The drafturbators are quick to give away all-pro caliber players if it means a more thrilling draft weekend.

I, however, would like to see our QB given the luxury of such an outstanding player to help him develop into the pro bowl caliber QB Chiefs fans and GM Scott Pioli envision.

I know Cassel succeeding would be terrible for all of the drafturbating Sanchez fans...

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:46 AM
Isn't Coffman projected as a 2nd round pick?

There you go. I'd make that trade.

nychief
04-12-2009, 11:47 AM
I don't see Clark letting this happen. The price is right, but that being said - he is our only reliable pass catcher... I mean if we could get a Coffman or somebody - but then what is the up side? Salary?

ChiefsCountry
04-12-2009, 11:47 AM
Could send them Dorsey and TG for their first that would be the only way we could get a first out of them.
Posted via Mobile Device

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:47 AM
Isn't Coffman projected as a 2nd round pick?

If we trade Gonzalez for ONLY #55 and use that pick on Coffman I am going to hate this world.

DaWolf
04-12-2009, 11:48 AM
I wouldn't make that deal. What kind of a message does it send? On one hand we're signing guys that make it look like we want the veteran presences around to lead the way by example and start turning this into a culture of winning now. So trading away Gonzo for a draft pick would be counterproductive to that, and it is highly doubtful that any second round pick would have the same type of impact that Gonzo would have on the offense as a perrenial pro bowler. The only way to make the trade is if you are 100% that the guy is over the hill.

bdeg
04-12-2009, 11:48 AM
Well I'm glad you're having a good time.

What pick at #55 is going to make the Chiefs better than having Tony Gonzalez? is going to make Matt Cassel better?

The drafturbators are quick to give away all-pro caliber players if it means a more thrilling draft weekend.

I, however, would like to see our QB given the luxury of such an outstanding player to help him develop into the pro bowl caliber QB Chiefs fans and GM Scott Pioli envision.

I know Cassel succeeding would be terrible for all of the drafturbating Sanchez fans...

Dude, it's not all about next year. Sure, part of it is, but really it's about long term value. You're trading for a good chance at getting a player who will be able to help to franchise for the next 10 years, not two.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:48 AM
There you go. I'd make that trade.

you'd trade Gonzalez for Coffman (when we already have Cottam)?

No fucking way that happens.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:49 AM
I wouldn't make that deal. What kind of a message does it send? On one hand we're signing guys that make it look like we want the veteran presences around to lead the way by example and start turning this into a culture of winning now. So trading away Gonzo for a draft pick would be counterproductive to that, and it is highly doubtful that any second round pick would have the same type of impact that Gonzo would have on the offense as a perrenial pro bowler. The only way to make the trade is if you are 100% that the guy is over the hill.

Here's a qquestion.

When were Mike Vrabel and Zach Thomas ever whiney ass bitches?

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:50 AM
I, however, would like to see our QB given the luxury of such an outstanding player to help him develop into the pro bowl caliber QB Chiefs fans and GM Scott Pioli envision.

I know Cassel succeeding would be terrible for all of the drafturbating Sanchez fans...

I dunno, maybe Pioli is thinking about the future of the franchise rather than its fortunes for this season?

Thank God the front office now knows they don't have to act like next year and beyond doesn't exist.

StcChief
04-12-2009, 11:50 AM
Well I'm glad you're having a good time.

What pick at #55 is going to make the Chiefs better than having Tony Gonzalez? is going to make Matt Cassel better?

The drafturbators are quick to give away all-pro caliber players if it means a more thrilling draft weekend.

I, however, would like to see our QB given the luxury of such an outstanding player to help him develop into the pro bowl caliber QB Chiefs fans and GM Scott Pioli envision.

I know Cassel succeeding would be terrible for all of the drafturbating Sanchez fans...exactly. Give Cassel a go to guy as the WRs get use to him.

Now if Cottom starts look good and stays healthy end of 2009 we could see a future TE playing at high level.
I still want Gonzo going out as a Chief. Traditional story.

Frazod
04-12-2009, 11:51 AM
If we trade Gonzalez for ONLY #55 and use that pick on Coffman I am going to hate this world.

Why? Coffman's fantastic.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:52 AM
Dude, it's not all about next year. Sure, part of it is, but really it's about long term value. You're trading for a good chance at getting a player who will be able to help to franchise for the next 10 years, not two.
so having Tony Gonzalez for a year, two (or maybe three) won't help Matt Cassel develop? That's not a long term goal?

And what are the odds a guy at #55 is a pro bowl caliber player? What are the odds he serves the Chiefs for 10 years?

10% and 1%?

Trust me, I'm thinking long term. If having two years of Tony Gonzalez helps Matt Cassel become a pro bowl caliber QB, I think those two years of service are invaluable to the franchise and much more productive than the slim chance the guy at #55 is anything more than a cheap, semi-productive starter who is valuable because his cap number is low.

Let's be honest...building through the draft is necessary because you can pay the guys drafted after the 1st round peanuts and half of the time they are as good, if not better, than the established starter who costs millions that has plenty of wear and tear on his legs.

75% of the guys drafted in the 2nd round end up on another team for their 2nd contract (I have no idea if this is true but I bet it's close to being right).

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:52 AM
you'd trade Gonzalez for Coffman (when we already have Cottam)?

No ****ing way that happens.

I think you'd have to catch at least 10 passes in a season before I would consider you the heir apparent to the tight end position.

keg in kc
04-12-2009, 11:52 AM
Well I'm glad you're having a good time.

What pick at #55 is going to make the Chiefs better than having Tony Gonzalez? That's not the question. The question is whether having 1-2 years of Tony Gonzalez is worth more than the entire Chiefs career of whoever they pick at #55.

milkman
04-12-2009, 11:52 AM
Well I'm glad you're having a good time.

What pick at #55 is going to make the Chiefs better than having Tony Gonzalez? is going to make Matt Cassel better?

The drafturbators are quick to give away all-pro caliber players if it means a more thrilling draft weekend.

I, however, would like to see our QB given the luxury of such an outstanding player to help him develop into the pro bowl caliber QB Chiefs fans and GM Scott Pioli envision.

I know Cassel succeeding would be terrible for all of the drafturbating Sanchez fans...

Guys like Jamon Meredith, Paul Kruger, Eric Wood, Jarron Gilbert could all conceivably be there and could be a big part of raising this team to contender status in the next couple of years.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:54 AM
Why? Coffman's fantastic.
and Tony Gonzalez is an all-pro...and we drafted a TE with a 1st day pick last year...

If we're trading an all-pro TE...we better have confidence in Cottam to be the starter (pick up a cheap #2 blocking TE via free agency/late in the draft/rookie free agent) and we better fill a different need with #55...

If we swap Gonzalez for Coffman it will be an epic fail on Pioli's part.

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:55 AM
That's not the question. The question is whether having 1-2 years of Tony Gonzalez is worth more than the entire Chiefs career of whoever they pick at #55.

don't talk to true fans,homers, whatever about any season after this year. on February 28, 2010, Matt Cassel and the rest of the chiefs will melt like ice cream in the sun. there is no next year. we should not be trading away players. in fact we should be trading all our picks Dan Snyder style to load up for our 2009 super bowl run.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 11:56 AM
I think you'd have to catch at least 10 passes in a season before I would consider you the heir apparent to the tight end position.

Why would he catch more than 10 passes when we have Tony Gonzalez? Cottam was drafted to be the future after Gonzalez...

I don't think teams win Super Bowl's by drafting 1st day tight ends every year.

If we trade Gonzalez fine...but if we take a TE with the pick we acquired trading him shoot me in the fucking face.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 11:56 AM
A major reason why the Chiefs have been so bad is their repeated misses on guys in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

You have to get impact players in these rounds, and Carl's ineptness has definitely skewed the perception of some of the overall importance of these draft positions.

dj56dt58
04-12-2009, 11:56 AM
A contender?

Are you kidding?

Do you actually think that guys like Vrabel, Thomas and yes, Gonzalez are going to be around when this team is truly competitive?

Vrabel and Thomas might have this year left, and Gonzo has said he might play this year and next.

which makes us competitive the next couple years..no?

After that our younger guys have developed and we sign guys/draft guys to take their places. Just like the Pats

wild1
04-12-2009, 11:58 AM
Why would he catch more than 10 passes when we have Tony Gonzalez? Cottam was drafted to be the future after Gonzalez...

I don't think teams win Super Bowl's by drafting 1st day tight ends every year.

If we trade Gonzalez fine...but if we take a TE with the pick we acquired trading him shoot me in the ****ing face.

1. The old, retard regime drafted him.

2. It was only a third round pick.

3. It's a sunk cost. It doesn't matter when or where he was picked. Either he's the future or he's not.

4. I'm sure you could find plenty of takers for the shooting in the ****ing face

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 12:00 PM
The drafturbators rather see us win 1 game than 10 games...they think the playoffs are pointless without a Super Bowl win...

I don't see why.

Young team...a playoff berth would be awesome. A win would be FANTASTIC. Nothing wrong with winning 10 games this year and continuing to build behind a 26 year old QB and a defense with tons of young talent.

chiefzilla1501
04-12-2009, 12:01 PM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.

Because Thomas and Vrabel and Goff play positions where we need stopgap talent. Love Tony Gonzalez. And I know he's an impact tight end. But a team can function with average talent at the position. Signing those guys doesn't mean the team wants to win now. What it's saying is that this team has a million different needs so we're going to fill a few positions with 1-2 year fixes to give us a few less immediate needs to look for.

I would prefer not to trade Gonzalez. But at the same time, I don't know that he fits into the team's long-term plans.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 12:02 PM
1. The old, retard regime drafted him.

2. It was only a third round pick.

3. It's a sunk cost. It doesn't matter when or where he was picked. Either he's the future or he's not.

4. I'm sure you could find plenty of takers for the shooting in the ****ing face

The old, retard regime, ACCORDING TO EVERYONE, had a hell of a draft last year. How could anyone write off Cottam yet?

bdeg
04-12-2009, 12:03 PM
so having Tony Gonzalez for a year, two (or maybe three) won't help Matt Cassel develop? That's not a long term goal?

And what are the odds a guy at #55 is a pro bowl caliber player? What are the odds he serves the Chiefs for 10 years?

10% and 1%?

Trust me, I'm thinking long term. If having two years of Tony Gonzalez helps Matt Cassel become a pro bowl caliber QB, I think those two years of service are invaluable to the franchise and much more productive than the slim chance the guy at #55 is anything more than a cheap, semi-productive starter who is valuable because his cap number is low.

Let's be honest...building through the draft is necessary because you can pay the guys drafted after the 1st round peanuts and half of the time they are as good, if not better, than the established starter who costs millions that has plenty of wear and tear on his legs.

75% of the guys drafted in the 2nd round end up on another team for their 2nd contract (I have no idea if this is true but I bet it's close to being right).

Which would be better for the long-term of Matt Cassel, TG or a brand new second round RT

I also think your perceptions have been skewed by CP, I think we can expect better drafting.

And the guys that aren't resigned are usually the ones who suck.

chiefzilla1501
04-12-2009, 12:04 PM
so having Tony Gonzalez for a year, two (or maybe three) won't help Matt Cassel develop? That's not a long term goal?

And what are the odds a guy at #55 is a pro bowl caliber player? What are the odds he serves the Chiefs for 10 years?

10% and 1%?

Trust me, I'm thinking long term. If having two years of Tony Gonzalez helps Matt Cassel become a pro bowl caliber QB, I think those two years of service are invaluable to the franchise and much more productive than the slim chance the guy at #55 is anything more than a cheap, semi-productive starter who is valuable because his cap number is low.

Let's be honest...building through the draft is necessary because you can pay the guys drafted after the 1st round peanuts and half of the time they are as good, if not better, than the established starter who costs millions that has plenty of wear and tear on his legs.

75% of the guys drafted in the 2nd round end up on another team for their 2nd contract (I have no idea if this is true but I bet it's close to being right).

That's not true.

If you're looking for LBs, Guards, Centers, or RBs, #55 is a sweet spot for those positions. You can get some really good players at that level if you're willing to look. And those are all positions where the Chiefs could use some help.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 12:04 PM
Last post in this thread because I truly don't care anymore...

If we trade Gonzalez, fine. I know we'll get a good deal because it really doesn't make any sense for us to trade a guy like TG when we are adding veteran talent and trying to win games starting NOW.

If we trade him and draft a TE with the pick we acquired for him (when we already have a young guy with loads of raw talent), we're fucking stupid. I have faith that won't happen, though.

and if anyone thinks we can't compete in the West next year, I disagree with you. I'm entitled to that opinion, so fuck off =)

bdeg
04-12-2009, 12:05 PM
The old, retard regime, ACCORDING TO EVERYONE, had a hell of a draft last year. How could anyone write off Cottam yet?
True, very good draft. One in twenty is not a good record, though.

milkman
04-12-2009, 12:05 PM
The drafturbators rather see us win 1 game than 10 games...they think the playoffs are pointless without a Super Bowl win....

No.
We think just getting to the playoffs with no real hope of ever gitting to the SB, Martyocre style, is pointless.

I have no problem with getting to the playoffs as long as we are building to a SB.

the Talking Can
04-12-2009, 12:07 PM
should a rebuilding team take a 2nd round pick for a 33 yr old TE who has given us all his best years?

uh....yeah


if you really care about Tony, let him go...

"take...these broken wings...and learn to fly again, learn to live so freeeeeee....." [/karaoke]

wild1
04-12-2009, 12:08 PM
The old, retard regime, ACCORDING TO EVERYONE, had a hell of a draft last year. How could anyone write off Cottam yet?

What does where he was drafted, or in what year he was drafted, entitle Cottam to? Either he's good enough or he isn't.

They have a year's worth of film on him. Maybe they don't like him. Or maybe they would like to have two good tight ends. Or maybe they will simply take the best value they see for each pick.

RustShack
04-12-2009, 12:09 PM
I would hate to see Tony go... but I think WR's are a hell of a lot more important in Haley's offense than TE's... plus we have Cottam now... bottom line I'd still rather keep Gonzo.

the Talking Can
04-12-2009, 12:11 PM
what makes you think we can't win 10 games next year?


ROFL

other than common sense, nothing i guess....

the Talking Can
04-12-2009, 12:15 PM
we would have essentially traded a 33yr old TE for a 26yr old starting QB


that is fucking brilliant...and proof the franchise now understands how you build a team....

seriously, awesome

T-post Tom
04-12-2009, 12:16 PM
Good God Just say no... Clark have some integrity here. Gonzo needs to go out as Chief.


Rep. :clap:

Sure-Oz
04-12-2009, 12:40 PM
2nd rounder you better take it

Count Zarth
04-12-2009, 12:49 PM
Here's the nice thing about Pioli.

He doesn't give a fuck about Gonzalez.

Peterson cared way too much about him, and even though there was a deal on the table with the Falcons LAST SEASON, it didn't get done. Because Carl allowed Gonzalez to turn it down. This was confirmed by Jay Glazer.

But if Pioli wants Gonzalez shipped out, adios. I doubt he would consider his feelings.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 12:52 PM
This was confirmed by Jay Glazer.

I'm not buying it until I hear it from Athan.

TRR
04-12-2009, 12:56 PM
I feel like draft picks are so overrated these days. In the last 5 NFL drafts not counting last seasons, we only have a couple players left on the roster....and most are not even in the league.

Anything less than a first for Gonzalez, and I keep him on the Chiefs.
Posted via Mobile Device

Micjones
04-12-2009, 01:03 PM
Even a low-round #2 is a hell of an offer for Gonzalez.
Forces you to immediately find another reliable pass-catcher though.
Might not be the worst thing. We do have Engram. He won't be as productive as Gonzalez, but he's got really reliable hands and with a legitimate #2 I think we'd be okay.

I really wanna see Gonzalez retire as a Chief, but as a pure football move this would definitely get me to thinking.

We'd get that #2 back and still have an outside shot at trading down.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 01:10 PM
Here's the nice thing about Pioli.

He doesn't give a **** about Gonzalez.

Peterson cared way too much about him, and even though there was a deal on the table with the Falcons LAST SEASON, it didn't get done. Because Carl allowed Gonzalez to turn it down. This was confirmed by Jay Glazer.

But if Pioli wants Gonzalez shipped out, adios. I doubt he would consider his feelings.

One more thing for Tony to talk to Oprah about.

LaChapelle
04-12-2009, 01:12 PM
They just picked up Thomas and could be trading Tony G? The unpredictablity of this new regime is thrilling and scary at the same time. SCHWING

kysirsoze
04-12-2009, 01:12 PM
I'l be fine either way. I see the obvious value of picking up a 2nd. I also love watching Tony play and think he's got some good years left. Not gonna get worked up about this one.

JuicesFlowing
04-12-2009, 01:16 PM
I could care less how old Tony G is, he's still at the top of his game. Keep him.

KChiefs1
04-12-2009, 01:16 PM
Coffman is going to be a stud TE in the NFL.

Direckshun
04-12-2009, 01:28 PM
I side with milkman, OTW, and others who say a 2nd round pick is more than fair. Do the deal, and do it now.

With that in mind...

You've got to give Carl Peterson credit for not trading Gonzo away last year for a 3rd. :D

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 01:28 PM
#55 ain't gonna' get it; NEXT!

Direckshun
04-12-2009, 01:40 PM
#55 ain't gonna' get it; NEXT!

I'm sorry, but yes it will.

TE is already a de-valued position. There is no TE in the league that is worth a 1st rounder.

For a 33-year-old, it makes sense that a 2nd rounder is the best possible compensation we can get for a player that won't be here when we're good.

KcKing
04-12-2009, 01:42 PM
Guess I should sell my Tony G. Chiefs Memorabilia soon before it devalues like my Signed LJ jersey and my Okoye 8X10...

LaChapelle
04-12-2009, 01:46 PM
KWII and Tony G in the same division(for 2s) would make the NFC South interesting.

Direckshun
04-12-2009, 01:49 PM
I will say this.

If the Chiefs tarde Tony G, they have to burn at least one major pick, and maybe as much as two picks total, on WR and/or TE in this draft.

We cannot leave Cassel with one weapon.

LaChapelle
04-12-2009, 01:49 PM
KWII and Tony G in the same division(for 2s) would make the NFC South interesting.

SHIT! and Shockey

Baby Lee
04-12-2009, 01:58 PM
http://i41.tinypic.com/2gwgp4j.jpg

TG would have an overwhelmingly better chance at winning a SB in ATL in the next 2 years over staying in KC.

To argue otherwise is flat-out ridiculous.

Yeah, and I stand a better chance of breaking the sound barrier in a Mustang than I do in a Civic.

NCarlsCorner2
04-12-2009, 02:04 PM
If Pioli is signing guys like Zach Thomas and trading for guys like Mike Vrabel, what makes you think he's interested in trading Tony Gonzalez?

It's going to have to be a WOW offer for them to trade Tony Gonzalez...

#55 overall isn't a WOW offer. Sorry drafturbators, it's clear Pioli is trying to build a contender with veteran presence...the Herm Edwards 25 and under only approach isn't the Pioli way. Gonzalez has a reasonable contract and is showing no signs of slowing down...he's not going to be traded IMO.

Gonzalez for DE Jamaal Anderson 6'6" 282lbs.

Halfcan
04-12-2009, 02:10 PM
Good God Just say no... Clark have some integrity here. Gonzo needs to go out as Chief.

;) Exactly!!

Mecca
04-12-2009, 02:15 PM
I'd probably do that deal, you move his contract, you can get by with an ok TE, not to mention we have a coach and a GM from teams that never really used the TE as a top option as a receiver.

There's going to be some very good players on the board in this years 2nd round.

Of course I already see the over attachment to Gonzalez in the thread, you know inspite of his constant whining.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 02:18 PM
I'd probably do that deal, you move his contract, you can get by with an ok TE, not to mention we have a coach and a GM from teams that never really used the TE as a top option as a receiver.

There's going to be some very good players on the board in this years 2nd round.

Of course I already see the over attachment to Gonzalez in the thread, you know inspite of his constant whining.

But...but who will Pickpen throw to???

You're right though; under Haley and sooner rather than later, the TE position will be less about receiving, IF we choose to go on his past offenses as an example.

Chiefs Pantalones
04-12-2009, 02:29 PM
I don't want to see him go...ugh

Mecca
04-12-2009, 03:04 PM
Personally I think people in this market get attached to players like Gonzalez because we haven't won anything so it's all that's left.

Rain Man
04-12-2009, 03:07 PM
I'm sorry, but yes it will.

TE is already a de-valued position. There is no TE in the league that is worth a 1st rounder.



There have been 13 tight ends drafted in the first round since 2000. Seems to me that half the league thinks a tight end is worth a first-round pick.

Granted, in Tony's case age is a factor, but then again if he plays four more years and makes 350 catches, that's worth a lot.

journeyscarab
04-12-2009, 03:15 PM
i say give Gonzo to them for their 1st and 4th

Mecca
04-12-2009, 03:16 PM
NO ONE is giving up a 1st round pick for a player that's 33 years old.

milkman
04-12-2009, 03:19 PM
i say give Gonzo to them for their 1st and 4th

:bong:

Rain Man
04-12-2009, 03:20 PM
NO ONE is giving up a 1st round pick for a player that's 33 years old.

Yeah, I'd agree with that, other than maybe a really good QB on a team that's a QB short of a strong run.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 03:21 PM
Jason Taylor went for a 2nd and he does something that is much more valuable than Gonzalez a team offering you a 2nd for Gonzalez is actually really high.

BigMeatballDave
04-12-2009, 03:22 PM
A 1st for TG is a pipe dream. If they could get a 2nd for him, they should be all over it.

htismaqe
04-12-2009, 03:23 PM
There have been 13 tight ends drafted in the first round since 2000. Seems to me that half the league thinks a tight end is worth a first-round pick.

Granted, in Tony's case age is a factor, but then again if he plays four more years and makes 350 catches, that's worth a lot.

How much of that was BECAUSE of Tony Gonzales, though? I think the position as a whole holds alot less value, we've just been spoiled because we've been watching the greatest ever.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 03:26 PM
I'm of the belief you draft TE's in the mid rounds unless you are picking at the very end of the 1st and there's an athletic freak there.

I might consider using a low 1st on Jared Cook this year if I was a GM.

BigMeatballDave
04-12-2009, 03:26 PM
we've been watching the greatest ever.Shhh, don't let milkman catch you typing that...:)

Dayze
04-12-2009, 03:32 PM
http://www.theboxset.com/images/reviewcaptures/612capture_tombstone03.jpg

I love that pic of Powers Booth lol. Everytime a player makes a demand, or 'else' etc, this pic always comes to mind.

Later TG. You've been awesome, but it's time for the fans to want a SB, not nice guys; specifially a 'nice guy' who's the best player on the team at the TE spot.

I hope he moves on and gets a ring; could care less if he 'stays' a chief. he'll enter the hall as a Chief and my great memories will be of his as a Chief.

Rain Man
04-12-2009, 03:41 PM
How much of that was BECAUSE of Tony Gonzales, though? I think the position as a whole holds alot less value, we've just been spoiled because we've been watching the greatest ever.

Let's check out the pattern.

2000s - 13 TEs in first round, 13 in second round (9 years, generally 32 picks per year)
1990s - 9 in first round, 17 in second round (10 years, generally 30 picks per year)
1980s - 5 in first round, 12 in second round (10 years, roughly 29 picks per year)
1970s - 16 in first round, 16 in second round (10 years, roughly 27 picks per year)

One might ponder that, once upon a time, tight ends were valuable in an era where defenses could knock receivers off their routes. When the new rules changes came about in 1979 to limit contact with receivers, it killed the tight end as a first-round position through the 80s.

So why have tight ends been making a resurgence since the low tide of the 80s? If anything, the rules changes have continued to make them less valuable, as defenders aren't allowed to touch quick little receivers.

One theory might be the growth of west coast offenses and short, high-percentage passing games. A tight end might be a sure-handed guy who can thrive in the land of linebackers. Another might be the rise of zone blitzes and more sophisticated pass rushes, where a good tight end who can block and catch has become more valuable.

And of course in the past ten years, we've had the rise of the freaks like Tony G., who are basically a receiver inflated up to 250 pounds.

Interesting pattern, but I think it's undeniable that the rules changes of 1979 killed the position for a while.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 03:55 PM
Even a low-round #2 is a hell of an offer for Gonzalez.
We'd get that #2 back and still have an outside shot at trading down.

No we won't. Our #2 was at the 34th position. The one we will be getting is at 55. Quite a bit of distance there.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 03:56 PM
SHIT! and Shockey

Shockey is overrated.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 03:58 PM
i say give Gonzo to them for their 1st and 4thFar-fetched, but bold.

:clap:

Frankie
04-12-2009, 03:59 PM
:bong:

That's kinda what I meant.

Frankie
04-12-2009, 04:01 PM
A 1st for TG is a pipe dream. If they could get a 2nd for him, they should be all over it.

A high 2nd. Not 55.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 04:03 PM
A high 2nd. Not 55.

Yep; up the ante bitches!

DaneMcCloud
04-12-2009, 04:07 PM
what makes you think we can't win 10 games next year? All we need is a pass rush...the offense will be there.

ROFL

That's almost as funny as you and your friends peeing on each other.

The Chiefs will be LUCKY to win 4 games.

4.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 04:07 PM
ROFL

That's almost as funny as you and your friends peeing on each other.

The Chiefs will be LUCKY to win 4 games.

4.

Someone forgot to show him the schedule.

Fritz88
04-12-2009, 04:09 PM
2ed round pick..

no problem

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 04:11 PM
Someone forgot to show him the schedule.

You can say that every year about everyone's schedule.

I bet people were licking their lips last year to play the Dolphins, Falcons, Cardinals, Ravens, etc...

If Dane thinks we're only going to win 4 games this year he's crazy.

DaneMcCloud
04-12-2009, 04:12 PM
The drafturbators rather see us win 1 game than 10 games...they think the playoffs are pointless without a Super Bowl win...

I don't see why.

Young team...a playoff berth would be awesome. A win would be FANTASTIC. Nothing wrong with winning 10 games this year and continuing to build behind a 26 year old QB and a defense with tons of young talent.

You really are a fucking moron.

The Chiefs NEED a right tackle, center, right guard and right tackle. They NEED a speed WR, depth at running. They NEED a passing rushing DE or OLB, and defensive line help. They NEED depth at nearly every position.

Until these positions are adequately addressed, the Chiefs aren't winning jackshit.

Whether you like it or not.

DaneMcCloud
04-12-2009, 04:13 PM
You can say that every year about everyone's schedule.

I bet people were licking their lips last year to play the Dolphins, Falcons, Cardinals, Ravens, etc...

If Dane thinks we're only going to win 4 games this year he's crazy.

What do you wanna bet, Hootie?

Put your ass on the line.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 04:14 PM
Um who are they gonna beat?

Even if you're nice and say they go 3-3 in the division outside of the division they have the NFC East which is brutal and the AFC north so there's maybe 2 there ok 5.

DaWolf
04-12-2009, 04:15 PM
Here's a qquestion.

When were Mike Vrabel and Zach Thomas ever whiney ass bitches?

Well, it has been argued that Vrabel was traded out of NE because he ripped Robert Kraft on some revenue issues. But I agree with you, if Gonzo is going to constantly while about it, get something for him. But I think he's a guy who if he's not traded, will shut his mouth during the season and work hard to help the team succeed. If I am Pioli, I either trade him now, or tell him that he's not going to be traded and that he should keep his mouth shut...

JASONSAUTO
04-12-2009, 04:15 PM
:DYou really are a fucking moron.

The Chiefs NEED a right tackle, center, right guard and right tackle. They NEED a speed WR, depth at running. They NEED a passing rushing DE or OLB, and defensive line help. They NEED depth at nearly every position.

Until these positions are adequately addressed, the Chiefs aren't winning jackshit.

Whether you like it or not.

so you have us needing 8 guys, goff was signed so 7 guys, we have 76 picks trade down and we've got em.. every player drafted willl start and super bowl here we come:D

Mecca
04-12-2009, 04:16 PM
They'll probably look better on the field but the schedule is much harder so there may not be any great improvement in wins.

JASONSAUTO
04-12-2009, 04:18 PM
They'll probably look better on the field but the schedule is much harder so there may not be any great improvement in wins.

it's true that you never know how the games will play out, i'll reserve judgement until after the draft

DaneMcCloud
04-12-2009, 04:30 PM
Where's Hootie?

Funny how guys like him disappear after a wager has been offered.

Pioli Zombie
04-12-2009, 04:39 PM
Tony G = HOF
History of 2nd rd Chiefs picks = can create a new town called Bustville.

Pioli wasn't picking them.

Do the deal
Posted via Mobile Device

LaChapelle
04-12-2009, 04:44 PM
Shockey is overrated.

A cherry picking asswhipe move. You're better than that, I hope.
A division with Tony G, KWII and Shockey would be interesting.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 05:02 PM
ROFL

That's almost as funny as you and your friends peeing on each other.




ROFL

Contrarian
04-12-2009, 05:04 PM
N

PastorMikH
04-12-2009, 05:10 PM
I'd be all for sending Tony to them, I'm tired of his whining. The only real issue I have is if we are working on a new system with a inexperienced QB and surrounding cast, Tony's ability to catch the ball could be important.

Johnny Vegas
04-12-2009, 05:10 PM
for a 2nd rounder!?!?! do it. I'd trade LJ for that at this time. Yeah you read that right.

philfree
04-12-2009, 05:12 PM
I'd be all for sending Tony to them, I'm tired of his whining. The only real issue I have is if we are working on a new system with a inexperienced QB and surrounding cast, Tony's ability to catch the ball could be important.

They can cover Tony but they can't keep him from catching the ball. I bet Cassel would be in favor of keeping Tony.

PhilFree:arrow:

Tuckdaddy
04-12-2009, 05:16 PM
Disloyalty?

I hate the mindset that we "owe" players like Gonzo anything. He's been well paid by the organization and cheered by the fans. That's enough.

No one owes him shit, yet when he opens his pie hole, people start fumbling all over themselves to praise and comfort him.

As I've said numerous times, I don't give a **** about any single player on this team. It's about the organization as a whole for me.

You SUCK! Don't care about Gonzo? How can anyone in KC not have respect for him. I wouldn't just give him away but if he wanted to go to Atl, then I'd take a second rdr and let him go. He could have left a long time ago and didn't.

Rain Man
04-12-2009, 05:26 PM
for a 2nd rounder!?!?! do it. I'd trade LJ for that at this time. Yeah you read that right.


I read that as, "You would trade for O.J. in a second."

EyePod
04-12-2009, 05:29 PM
I don't know why people seem to think that Clark Hunt is going to interfere with football operations.

You have to know that part of the deal in getting Pioli to sign on had to be full control over those football operations.

Clark could have told Pioli OK as long as TG is off limits.

EyePod
04-12-2009, 05:30 PM
I'd be all for sending Tony to them, I'm tired of his whining. The only real issue I have is if we are working on a new system with a inexperienced QB and surrounding cast, Tony's ability to catch the ball could be important.

As we saw last year. He is more important to our offense than even Mecca knows.

Micjones
04-12-2009, 05:31 PM
No we won't. Our #2 was at the 34th position. The one we will be getting is at 55. Quite a bit of distance there.

What I meant was we'd have a pick in the Second Round.
#55 isn't exactly anything to sneeze at.

This team isn't above taking a player even at the bottom of that round.

Fruit Ninja
04-12-2009, 05:40 PM
I am fine with whatever they do. Even if i dont like a particular trade i am fine with it. i wasnt thrilled with the Allen trade last year, but i have no control over what happens. So whatever happens happens. Players come and go.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 05:46 PM
What do you wanna bet, Hootie?

Put your ass on the line.

I'll wait until after the draft and after all of the signings are in before I make any wagers/predictions about next year.

I think so far Pioli has addressed several needs (Cassel, Vrabel, Thomas, Engram, Goff, Beisel) and I don't think he's done yet.

Come find me after the draft/rest of the signings are in and I'll give you my prediction...and if it's so 'out there' we can make some kind of a wager.

DaneMcCloud
04-12-2009, 05:49 PM
I'll wait until after the draft and after all of the signings are in before I make any wagers/predictions about next year.

I think so far Pioli has addressed several needs (Cassel, Vrabel, Thomas, Engram, Goff, Beisel) and I don't think he's done yet.

Come find me after the draft/rest of the signings are in and I'll give you my prediction...and if it's so 'out there' we can make some kind of a wager.

Sounds good.

Regardless of what they do this offseason, I'm sticking to no more than 4 wins.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 05:53 PM
Sounds good.

Regardless of what they do this offseason, I'm sticking to no more than 4 wins.

Why you'd tempt Aaron Curry like this, I have no clue.

bdeg
04-12-2009, 06:00 PM
Sounds good.

Regardless of what they do this offseason, I'm sticking to no more than 4 wins.

I'd put money on them getting 5. $20 sound good?

Mecca
04-12-2009, 06:18 PM
You SUCK! Don't care about Gonzo? How can anyone in KC not have respect for him. I wouldn't just give him away but if he wanted to go to Atl, then I'd take a second rdr and let him go. He could have left a long time ago and didn't.

We should all be emotionally married to a player that's never even been part of a playoff win.

Joe Montana won 4 Superbowls and got traded.

Crush
04-12-2009, 06:24 PM
They can cover Tony but they can't keep him from catching the ball. I bet Cassel would be in favor of keeping Tony.

PhilFree:arrow:


I am pretty sure Pioli cares more about the color of my poop than what Cassel thinks.

Crush
04-12-2009, 06:27 PM
Clark could have told Pioli OK as long as TG is off limits.


If that was the case, I am pretty sure Pioli would have told Clark to go fuck himself and then finish his career in New England.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 06:27 PM
Also why do people think Gonzalez is a team leader? I've never seen that I've seen a guy who's been great at his position and cares about his personal stats but not team leader.

booger
04-12-2009, 06:28 PM
Gonzalez for DE Jamaal Anderson 6'6" 282lbs.

maybe.


He's been a bust, 0 sacks in 07, 2 last year. Mike Smith may try him more at DT hoping to get something out of him.

He might be a good fit for a 5tech in the 34. We could probably have a shot at Jarron Gilbert at #55 and try to develop him instead. I'd trade Tamba for him straight up though.

Crush
04-12-2009, 06:30 PM
As we saw last year. He is more important to our offense than even Mecca knows.

We were 2-14 last year and looked god awful on both sides of the ball. Last year did not establish any precedence about the future of this football team.

Crush
04-12-2009, 06:36 PM
You SUCK! Don't care about Gonzo? How can anyone in KC not have respect for him. I wouldn't just give him away but if he wanted to go to Atl, then I'd take a second rdr and let him go. He could have left a long time ago and didn't.


First of all, Tony could care less about KC so fuck him. Even if really did love KC, then... well bye. My loyalty lies to the team and the insignia that represents it, not to any particular player.

Secondly, it does not matter if he wants to go to Atlanta or not. Pioli will ship Tony's ass off to Atlanta, whether Tony likes it or not.

Finally, I have no sympathy for millionaires.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 06:42 PM
You SUCK! Don't care about Gonzo? How can anyone in KC not have respect for him. I wouldn't just give him away but if he wanted to go to Atl, then I'd take a second rdr and let him go. He could have left a long time ago and didn't.

I respect him as a player, but my emotional attachment to him is as strong as his emotional attachment to me.

As I said, I'm a fan of the franchise and the city more generally.

Furthermore, I don't give a fuck what he wants to do. We should be making moves that benefit the long-term viability of the franchise, as it relates to Gonzo and everyone else.

I'm sure the $$$ had nothing to do with why he didn't leave earlier in his career. Gonzo isn't an idiot; he's had both eyes open every time he's re-signed with this team, so I have no sympathy for his "plight."

wild1
04-12-2009, 06:44 PM
Sounds good.

Regardless of what they do this offseason, I'm sticking to no more than 4 wins.

I think that if you subtract Herm and Carl and plug in a decent QB, they could have won 4 games last year.

I'm guessing they win 6 or 7 in 2009, with the improvements, the new coaching, hopefully removing distractions, and playing in a weak division.

Obviously making the playoffs is a pipe dream, but they could improve 4 or 5 games. That's the team's ceiling in Pioli: Year 1, but they could do it.

tk13
04-12-2009, 06:53 PM
This makes me nervous not for sentimental reasons but because we'd be taking away Cassel's best weapon. But of course a lot of people want Cassel to fail... but as much as people tout this guy and that guy as the next great TE over and over... Gates is really been the only one to come close. Gonzalez would be very difficult to replace.

dirk digler
04-12-2009, 06:57 PM
This makes me nervous not for sentimental reasons but because we'd be taking away Cassel's best weapon. But of course a lot of people want Cassel to fail... but as much as people tout this guy and that guy as the next great TE over and over... Gates is really been the only one to come close. Gonzalez would be very difficult to replace.

Yep. I don't like the idea of trading Tony G right now. We don't have enough weapons for Cassel if he is gone.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 06:58 PM
This makes me nervous not for sentimental reasons but because we'd be taking away Cassel's best weapon. But of course a lot of people want Cassel to fail... but as much as people tout this guy and that guy as the next great TE over and over... Gates is really been the only one to come close. Gonzalez would be very difficult to replace.

I don't think anyone wants Cassel to fail. I've stated that it's not the move I wanted, and I don't think it will ultimately prove successful, but I hope to be wrong. I think the perceived "Cassel opponents" largely fall into this category.

And I agree that you're almost certainly not going to replace Gonzo, now or in the foreseeable future. But a competent TE and a stronger group of WR's would work, too.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:01 PM
Yep. I don't like the idea of trading Tony G right now. We don't have enough weapons for Cassel if he is gone.

Other than we have a coach and GM who come from teams that stress the WRs as weapons and the TE's as blockers...

It's a deep WR draft on top of that. This is probably dirty to Chiefs fans but you're better off with your weapons being outside and your TE just being a complimentary piece.

Crush
04-12-2009, 07:02 PM
I don't want Cassel to fail. However, if the Falcons are willing to give up a 2nd Round pick for an aging TE, who has stated that he would only play for 1-2 more years, then you make that trade.

wild1
04-12-2009, 07:02 PM
Yep. I don't like the idea of trading Tony G right now. We don't have enough weapons for Cassel if he is gone.

I don't get this... Cassel probably has more than one year left in the tank.

No other team in the league has a Tony Gonzalez. They all groom young QBs anyway. We've got Bowe, we brought in Engram, we spent a first day pick on a (supposed)pass-catching tight end last year. And there are plenty of WRs and TEs in the draft.

Is that the best skill position lineup in the league? No. But you know what, Cassel is a veteran player now. He can deal with it. This isn't tecmo bowl where you only have one year. What, are we going to cost ourselves a playoff appearance...?

What is the risk? What is the worst case scenario? The offense sucks again?

If you have a chance to trade a player who only has one or two seasons left for a second round pick, do it.

tk13
04-12-2009, 07:06 PM
No other team in the league has a Tony Gonzalez.

You just answered your own question.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 07:08 PM
I don't think anyone wants Cassel to fail. I've stated that it's not the move I wanted, and I don't think it will ultimately prove successful, but I hope to be wrong. I think the perceived "Cassel opponents" largely fall into this category.

And I agree that you're almost certainly not going to replace Gonzo, now or in the foreseeable future. But a competent TE and a stronger group of WR's would work, too.

That's the thing, you really don't NEED to replace him, as Haley doesn't utilize the TE as a weapon in his offense.

Most teams don't - people here just think that the offense should run through the TE, because it has for the last 10 years.

wild1
04-12-2009, 07:08 PM
You just answered your own question.

What are we risking by trading him though?

wild1
04-12-2009, 07:08 PM
That's the thing, you really don't NEED to replace him, as Haley doesn't utilize the TE as a weapon in his offense.

Most teams don't - people here just think that the offense should run through the TE, because it has for the last 10 years.

Good point.

googlegoogle
04-12-2009, 07:09 PM
Don't handcuff Pioli. Let him run it.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 07:09 PM
Yep. I don't like the idea of trading Tony G right now. We don't have enough weapons for Cassel if he is gone.

BLASPHEMY!

The Messiah requires no crutches.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:09 PM
We're talking about a coach and GM that are from teams that don't use the TE as a receiver at all...Ben Watson is talented but he doesn't catch alot of passes by any means.

Hell Cassel just spent a season rarely even looking at a TE.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:10 PM
That's the thing, you really don't NEED to replace him, as Haley doesn't utilize the TE as a weapon in his offense.

Most teams don't - people here just think that the offense should run through the TE, because it has for the last 10 years.

Absolutely. Agree completely.

tk13
04-12-2009, 07:10 PM
That's the thing, you really don't NEED to replace him, as Haley doesn't utilize the TE as a weapon in his offense.

Most teams don't - people here just think that the offense should run through the TE, because it has for the last 10 years.
I don't buy that either. People said the exact same thing when Al Saunders stepped in here. If the Patriots or Cardinals had a weapon like Tony Gonzalez, they absolutely would've used him. Just like the Cowboys use Witten as a main offensive weapon.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:12 PM
Well the Chiefs with Saunders basically never got remotely talented WR's, that's their fault. They ran the passing game through Gonzalez without much of a choice..

And the Cowboys passing game running through Witten was a bit dumb when you realize what else is on that team.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:12 PM
I don't buy that either. People said the exact same thing when Al Saunders stepped in here. If the Patriots or Cardinals had a weapon like Tony Gonzalez, they absolutely would've used him. Just like the Cowboys use Witten as a main offensive weapon.

Well who wouldn't if you had someone that talented on your roster? But it's definitely not a necessity.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:13 PM
Well who wouldn't if you had someone that talented on your roster? But it's definitely not a necessity.

You'll never be able to win without a top TE, FB and guard man.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 07:13 PM
Well who wouldn't if you had someone that talented on your roster? But it's definitely not a necessity.

Neither is having Adrian Peterson...but it sure as hell helps.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:13 PM
You'll never be able to win without a top TE, FB and guard man.

There are no amount of Pro-Bowls a QB could make to equal the value of a Tony G.

pr_capone
04-12-2009, 07:13 PM
I don't get this... Cassel probably has more than one year left in the tank.

No other team in the league has a Tony Gonzalez. They all groom young QBs anyway. We've got Bowe, we brought in Engram, we spent a first day pick on a (supposed)pass-catching tight end last year. And there are plenty of WRs and TEs in the draft.

If we can get a 2nd for Tony... bye bye. A 2nd rd pick for a guy who is going to play another year or two TOPS... for me its a no brainer.

I have a hard on for Cottam and think we has the tools to be the kind of player that can change a game like Tony did for us.

6'8 271... AND can catch AND a 4.6 40?!?!?! Yeesh. He learns how to use that big body to block as well and we are set for the next decade.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:14 PM
Neither is having Adrian Peterson...but it sure as hell helps.

Fuck yes. Great players are always nice to have.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 07:14 PM
You'll never be able to win without a top TE, FB and guard man.

You'll never be able to win without Mark Sanchez man.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:14 PM
When a guy is 34 years old if you get offered a 2 you should probably move him...the only way you shouldn't is if you are at that exact moment a superbowl team and he is a key player.

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:14 PM
You'll never be able to win without Mark Sanchez man.

Atleast he plays a core position.

Cormac
04-12-2009, 07:15 PM
I can't believe all this "Tony is a whiny ass bitch" stuff.

Who cares if he demands excellence?!?! If that makes him a whiny ass bitch, then we're all whiny ass bitches on this board. Do you people long for the "we're OK with losing" attitudes of Eric Hicks???

The difference between TG and most other players is that he has earned the right to complain, and even to ask for a trade if he sees fit. The important thing is that when he doesn't get traded, what does he do? He laces up the next week and PLAYS HIS ASS OFF every play. That's the kind of guy I want on my team. A 2nd round pick might be good value to the drafturbators, but I'd rather keep him.

What will a 2nd round pick do? We have a new QB and a new scheme coming in. TG could be invaluable in getting this thing up and running the right way. We have a lot of picks, and we have lots of youth already. Herm's biggest mistake (after choosing football coach as a career) was to jettison virtually all vets and leave the team rudderless. Pioli seems to be addressing that.

Short Leash Hootie
04-12-2009, 07:15 PM
I have a hard on for Cottam and think we has the tools to be the kind of player that can change a game like Tony did for us.

6'8 271... AND can catch AND a 4.6 40?!?!?! Yeesh. He learns how to use that big body to block as well and we are set for the next decade.

Agreed BUT he's made of glass.

a 2nd and a player (of some value) and fine...but like I said, while a 2nd is a strong offer...it doesn't exactly blow me away...and Tony Gonzalez has value in the fact that we're trying to develop a young QB...whether it be Cassel, Thigpen or even Sanchez...

Mecca
04-12-2009, 07:16 PM
Constantly saying things like "I want to be traded" "if they don't do this and this I don't want to play here" is whiny ass bitch stuff.

Crush
04-12-2009, 07:19 PM
We are not competing this upcoming year. We are trying to build a championship football team. A whiny and bitchy Tony Gonzalez is a luxury that we can no longer afford.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 07:21 PM
Constantly saying things like "I want to be traded" "if they don't do this and this I don't want to play here" is whiny ass bitch stuff.

This. I've defended the living FUCK out of that guy, but his latest "Wanna' Trade Shuffle" puts the lid on THAT.

You'll never be able to win without Mark Sanchez man.

I'd trade Tony for Mark in a New York Fucking Minute.

I'd trade you for a crate of bananas and some Hustler 'sticky pages'.:)

Chiefshrink
04-12-2009, 07:22 PM
We'll get our 2nd pick back regardless if we trade Tony IMO on draft day. We will probably trade down and get that 2nd back and then see if we can get more from the Falcons like an extra pick or two. If I'm Pioli I wait til draft day and up the urgency. It is the Falcons who approached us and we do not have any urgent need to move him like the Falcons think we do.

pr_capone
04-12-2009, 07:22 PM
Agreed BUT he's made of glass.

a 2nd and a player (of some value) and fine...but like I said, while a 2nd is a strong offer...it doesn't exactly blow me away...and Tony Gonzalez has value in the fact that we're trying to develop a young QB...whether it be Cassel, Thigpen or even Sanchez...

It could be the fact that I have tried to erase last season from my mind but I don't recall him being injured while wearing a Chiefs Uni. Did he miss any games for us?

I do know he had a nasty wrist break in college but one injury does not a career define. :dunno:

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Chiefnj2
04-12-2009, 07:23 PM
I can't believe all this "Tony is a whiny ass bitch" stuff.

Who cares if he demands excellence?!?! If that makes him a whiny ass bitch, then we're all whiny ass bitches on this board. Do you people long for the "we're OK with losing" attitudes of Eric Hicks???

The difference between TG and most other players is that he has earned the right to complain, and even to ask for a trade if he sees fit. The important thing is that when he doesn't get traded, what does he do? He laces up the next week and PLAYS HIS ASS OFF every play. That's the kind of guy I want on my team. A 2nd round pick might be good value to the drafturbators, but I'd rather keep him.

What will a 2nd round pick do? We have a new QB and a new scheme coming in. TG could be invaluable in getting this thing up and running the right way. We have a lot of picks, and we have lots of youth already. Herm's biggest mistake (after choosing football coach as a career) was to jettison virtually all vets and leave the team rudderless. Pioli seems to be addressing that.

+1

tk13
04-12-2009, 07:23 PM
Well who wouldn't if you had someone that talented on your roster? But it's definitely not a necessity.
Well no it's not a "necessity", but it sure doesn't hurt to have the greatest TE of all time out there drawing triple teams in the red zone. And I'm all for flipping old guys for draft picks, but this is a more careful situation because this is a HOF caliber player that is playing at a high level and draws about as much defense respect as any pass catcher in the league.

I think we can win without him. But I'd definitely try to hold out for a 2nd and a 5th or something. I'd rather get multiple picks out of it.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 07:24 PM
Well who wouldn't if you had someone that talented on your roster? But it's definitely not a necessity.

As the TE stats for the last 10 SB winners show.

An average of 38 catches, 423 yards and 4 TD's over the course of the season.

Crush
04-12-2009, 07:25 PM
I can't believe all this "Tony is a whiny ass bitch" stuff.

Who cares if he demands excellence?!?! If that makes him a whiny ass bitch, then we're all whiny ass bitches on this board. Do you people long for the "we're OK with losing" attitudes of Eric Hicks???

The difference between TG and most other players is that he has earned the right to complain, and even to ask for a trade if he sees fit. The important thing is that when he doesn't get traded, what does he do? He laces up the next week and PLAYS HIS ASS OFF every play. That's the kind of guy I want on my team. A 2nd round pick might be good value to the drafturbators, but I'd rather keep him.

What will a 2nd round pick do? We have a new QB and a new scheme coming in. TG could be invaluable in getting this thing up and running the right way. We have a lot of picks, and we have lots of youth already. Herm's biggest mistake (after choosing football coach as a career) was to jettison virtually all vets and leave the team rudderless. Pioli seems to be addressing that.


Yes and, as a fan, I have a right to call him on his whining and bitching. You know what else? Pioli has the right to ship his whiny-ass bitch out of town for a 2nd round pick.

Also, Tony is only going to be with us for one to two more years. A 2nd Round pick has better potential than an aging TE.

Furthermore, we are not competing next year, so losing Tony would not really matter at this point.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:27 PM
Well no it's not a "necessity", but it sure doesn't hurt to have the greatest TE of all time out there drawing triple teams in the red zone. And I'm all for flipping old guys for draft picks, but this is a more careful situation because this is a HOF caliber player that is playing at a high level and draws about as much defense respect as any pass catcher in the league.

I think we can win without him. But I'd definitely try to hold out for a 2nd and a 5th or something. I'd rather get multiple picks out of it.

I don't disagree with any of this, but I'm actually shocked someone would give a 2nd at this point because of Gonzo's penchant for reminding everyone that he's about to retire in a year or two.

Granted, there's no reason to think he won't still play at a high level, but a second rounder for a one or two-year player seems a steep price.

If it were my team, it would definitely have to be a situation of Gonzo being the final piece for this to make any sense whatsoever.

Cormac
04-12-2009, 07:27 PM
Constantly saying things like "I want to be traded" "if they don't do this and this I don't want to play here" is whiny ass bitch stuff.

exaggerate much?

tk13
04-12-2009, 07:27 PM
I'd agree he's probably complained too much... but that said, this team has sucked, and his whining has not affected his on-field play one bit. It's not like a TO situation. There are few people in the game of football that you'd rather have out there in the red zone than TG.

And that said, I think he's got 2 more years in him easy, and I think it's obvious by this point that we're trying to be a contender within 2 years. That's how the NFL works nowadays anyway, Pioli's two main buddies, Parcells and Dimitroff turned Miami and Atlanta from total garbage to playoff teams in one year. We aren't going to a Super Bowl but it's very clear this front office isn't gonna be happy with a comfortable 2 win rebuilding season.

Cormac
04-12-2009, 07:28 PM
+1

Cheers

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 07:28 PM
exaggerate much?

What is there to exaggerate?

He's said he wants to be traded countless times over the past 2 years.

Grant him his wish, already.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 07:30 PM
What is there to exaggerate?

He's said he wants to be traded countless times over the past 2 years.

Grant him his wish, already.

QFT.

wild1
04-12-2009, 07:31 PM
The difference between TG and most other players is that he has earned the right to complain

BS... when he cashes his paycheck, his end of the deal is that he is supposed to be totally committed to the Kansas City Chiefs winning the super bowl. No part of that includes crying to the media about wanting to be traded.

If he wants to be traded, walk into Pioli's office and ask for it. It's team business. Deal with it in-house instead of in the media.

philfree
04-12-2009, 07:31 PM
Gonzo could really help Cassel as his go to guy. The proper use of a 2nd round pick could help too but Pioli, Haley and Co. gonna want to win every game they can. That being the case I can see keeping Gonzo.


PhilFree:arrow:

Cormac
04-12-2009, 07:32 PM
Yes and, as a fan, I have a right to call him on his whining and bitching. You know what else? Pioli has the right to ship his whiny-ass bitch out of town for a 2nd round pick.

Also, Tony is only going to be with us for one to two more years. A 2nd Round pick has better potential than an aging TE.

Furthermore, we are not competing next year, so losing Tony would not really matter at this point.

So you think he should be satisfied with the way the team around him has performed over his career? Just sit quietly and pretend 0 playoff wins is befitting of his ambition and talent?

BTW, I realise well that Pioli "has the right". And that a 2nd round pick could be a much more valuable asset than an aging TE (but the odds are very debatable). But Tony is not the problem with the Chiefs.

OnTheWarpath58
04-12-2009, 07:33 PM
BS... when he cashes his paycheck, his end of the deal is that he is supposed to be totally committed to the Kansas City Chiefs winning the super bowl. No part of that includes crying to the media about wanting to be traded.

If he wants to be traded, walk into Pioli's office and ask for it. It's team business. Deal with it in-house instead of in the media.

This.

If he wanted to play for a contender, he shouldn't have signed the contract.

Except he realized there was no way he was going to get that kind of money on the open market.

Even with that said, if you're that fucking unhappy here, be a man and take it up with the boss directly, instead of having the media fight your battles for you.

pr_capone
04-12-2009, 07:34 PM
exaggerate much?

He has been in the media saying this at least separate 3 times now IIRC.

Raised On Riots
04-12-2009, 07:34 PM
BS... when he cashes his paycheck, his end of the deal is that he is supposed to be totally committed to the Kansas City Chiefs winning the super bowl. No part of that includes crying to the media about wanting to be traded.

If he wants to be traded, walk into Pioli's office and ask for it. It's team business. Deal with it in-house instead of in the media.

Yep. You can't cry wolf to the fans forever and expect it to hold up. As I said, I have defended and defended and defended this guy; no more.

Stay or go, but wherever you go, shut the fuck up and do your job.

DeezNutz
04-12-2009, 07:34 PM
Gonzo has earned the right to be paid like the greatest TE of all time, to be respected by teammates and opponents, and to give a speech in front of his own bust in a few years.

Aside from this, which is unbelievably huge, he hasn't earned shit. Bitching to the media isn't part of the deal.

J Diddy
04-12-2009, 07:35 PM
So you think he should be satisfied with the way the team around him has performed over his career? Just sit quietly and pretend 0 playoff wins is befitting of his ambition and talent?

BTW, I realise well that Pioli "has the right". And that a 2nd round pick could be a much more valuable asset than an aging TE (but the odds are very debatable). But Tony is not the problem with the Chiefs.


Perhaps not and perhaps yes. If he's constantly bitching in public there is no telling how he acts behind closed doors.

Cormac
04-12-2009, 07:36 PM
BS... when he cashes his paycheck, his end of the deal is that he is supposed to be totally committed to the Kansas City Chiefs winning the super bowl. No part of that includes crying to the media about wanting to be traded.

If he wants to be traded, walk into Pioli's office and ask for it. It's team business. Deal with it in-house instead of in the media.

I don't really give a toss how he deals with trade requests or the media. He has probably had 50,000 interviews over the years and he has said very very few things that can be held against him. He is totally committed to the Chiefs when the ball is in the air and that is what matters.

SBK
04-12-2009, 07:42 PM
A 2nd for pretty much any player that's 34 is a good move. For a TE it's a great move.

If we were going to be starting a rookie QB this year I might consider keeping him, keyword might.