Obama and Chavez

[Hog Farmer]

I'm so glad they're turning out to be good friends. This is truly a great time in our lives that we can now be friends with Chavez,Castro and Armadenijad. Now if he will just reach out to the Somali pirate leadership the circle will be complete.

[patteeu]

What was his opening line? "It's a real chore to get that Sulpher smell out of the oval office, hahaha!"

[RedNeckRaider]

Great leadership! and the whole sucking up to Mexico, you know got to keep the future voters rolling in! This is the greatest country in the world, lets all join him and help him change that!

[HolmeZz]

I think if there's anything we learned from 9/11, it's that there's no greater way to ensure American security than having as many people out there that hate us as possible.

[SBK]

I think if there's anything we learned from 9/11, it's that there's no greater way to ensure American security than having as many people out there that hate us as possible.

Naw, we learned that you should fear your patriots (soldiers), fear your citizens (if they're conservative), and cozy up to the people that want you destroyed.

If you can't do that quickly enough a world tour apologizing for your success may help. If all else fails you should just bow down and worship a foreign king.

[whatsmynameagain]

I think if there's anything we learned from 9/11, it's that there's no greater way to ensure American security than having as many people out there that hate us as possible.

THIS!

[|Zach|]

Naw, we learned that you should fear your patriots (soldiers), fear your citizens (if they're conservative), and cozy up to the people that want you destroyed.

If you can't do that quickly enough a world tour apologizing for your success may help. If all else fails you should just bow down and worship a foreign king.

You are all about creating an imaginative alternate universe. They are not real but they are fun so I guess everything has a purpose.

[BCD]

Keep your friends, and your Enemies CLOSER...

[blaise]

I don't care. It's business. As long as what he does ends up working for the best interest of the U.S. I'm ok with it.

[BucEyedPea]

I don't care. It's business. As long as what he does ends up working for the best interest of the U.S. I'm ok with it.

That's the question. I say it doesn't.

[blaise]

That's the question. I say it doesn't.

I don't know if we can know yet. I'm skeptical about it, but I'll reserve judgement. Maybe he has a plan. Maybe he feels that by showing the Venezualan people that the U.S. isn't so bad he'll erode some of Chavez's power.

[BucEyedPea]

I don't know if we can know yet. I'm skeptical about it, but I'll reserve judgement. Maybe he has a plan. Maybe he feels that by showing the Venezualan people that the U.S. isn't so bad he'll erode some of Chavez's power.

Huh? I was referring to torture....but not now I see I posted that post in the wrong thread. Sorry. :shake:

[Frankie]

I think if there's anything we learned from 9/11, it's that there's no greater way to ensure American security than having as many people out there that hate us as possible.

One punch K.O. :clap:

Thread closed.

[vailpass]

One punch K.O. :clap:

Thread closed.

Better call home (do they have working phone lines in that shit hole you are from?) and say hi to everyone while you can.With that nut-job running your country it won't be long before a full-out bombing campaign puts that desert latrine into permanent radio silence. Hopefully it will be the Israelis that carry out the job, they do it right.

[Reaper16]

Better call home (do they have working phone lines in that shit hole you are from?) and say hi to everyone while you can.With that nut-job running your country it won't be long before a full-out bombing campaign puts that desert latrine into permanent radio silence. Hopefully it will be the Israelis that carry out the job, they do it right.
Mother of Fucking Christ.

[Brock]

How did he pass up the chance to shank that guy in the neck?

[vailpass]

Mother of Fucking Christ.

Tell me there Reaper old boy whose words/actions inspire more outrage in you: mine or Iran's leader?



Iran's leader sparks walkout, shouts of 'shame'
Western diplomats leave U.N. race meeting, protesters throw objects
The Associated Press
updated 8:01 a.m. MT, Mon., April 20, 2009
GENEVA - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad accused Israel of being the "most cruel and racist regime," sparking a walkout Monday by angry Western diplomats at a U.N. racism conference.

The hard-line leader's appearance overshadowed the substance of the weeklong United Nations attempt to stamp out intolerance worldwide. The United States and eight other Western countries, expressing concerns about its fairness, were already boycotting the event.

Protesters dressed with clown wigs and holding placards repeatedly interrupted Ahmadinejad's speech with shouts of "Shame! shame!" and "Racist! racist!" throwing soft red objects on the podium.

Later, about 100 members of mainly pro-Israel and Jewish groups blocked Ahmadinejad's entrance to a scheduled news conference.

Ahmadinejad, in a rambling speech, accused Israel of being the "most cruel and racist regime" and pointed the finger at the United States and Europe for helping to establish the country after World War II "under the pretext of Jewish suffering."

That prompted a walkout by some 40 diplomats from European countries such as Britain and France, which had threatened to leave the conference if it descended into anti-Semitic or other rhetoric harshly critical of Israel, which marred the U.N.'s last racism gathering.

The boycotting countries expressed concern that Muslim countries would drown out many issues with calls for a denunciation of Israel and a global ban on criticizing aspects of the Islamic faith.

"As soon as he started to address the question of the Jewish people and Israel, we had no reason to stay in the room," said French Ambassador Jean-Baptiste Mattei.

Speaking directly after Ahmadinejad, Norway's foreign minister said the Iranian leader's comments "run counter to the very spirit of dignity of the conference."

Ahmadinejad "has made Iran the odd man out," Jonas Gahr Store said.

Even before his speech, Ahmadinejad polarized the meeting, which is intended to examine all forms of intolerance around the world.

Israel recalls ambassador
Israel recalled its ambassador to Switzerland earlier Monday to protest Swiss President Hans-Rudolf Merz's meeting with Ahmadinejad late Sunday during which Merz pressed the case of a jailed American journalist in Tehran.

"The meeting between the president of a democratic country with an infamous Holocaust-denier such as the president of Iran, who calls for Israel's destruction, does not mesh with the values that Switzerland represents and that are supposed to be represented at the U.N. conference on racism," the Israeli Foreign Ministry said in a statement.


President Barack Obama said Sunday that the United States would communicate with Iran about journalist Roxana Saberi through its Swiss intermediaries, which have officially represented U.S. interests in Iran since the American hostage crisis that began in 1979. The Swiss government said it also took up other "unresolved cases" of U.S.-Iranian relations.

Ahmadinejad's attendance has provoked outrage from Jewish groups and Israel, as he has in the past questioned the Holocaust and called for Israel's destruction.

[Iowanian]

It would have been funny if a reporter would have drilled Abberjabberdingdong with some smelly flip flops.

[HolmeZz]

Everyone knows Ahmadinejad never spoke like that when George Bush was President!

[Garcia Bronco]

Chavez is an evil dictator. His country is in absolute poverty. All brought about by his leadership. He's seized businesses and tried to make his rule permanent. He's a socialist dictator in the mold of Adolf Hitler. He has provoked war on his neighbors and blames ever ill on the United States and Europe.

[Frankie]

Better call home (do they have working phone lines in that shit hole you are from?) and say hi to everyone while you can.With that nut-job running your country it won't be long before a full-out bombing campaign puts that desert latrine into permanent radio silence. Hopefully it will be the Israelis that carry out the job, they do it right.

Calm down a bit. Your racism is showing. And your board-proven stupidity can't even cover it.

[Frankie]

Everyone knows Ahmadinejad never spoke like that when George Bush was President!

This would have been the KO punch if your earlier post hadn't done the job. :thumb:

[Ultra Peanut]

feels good man

[vailpass]

Calm down a bit. Your racism is showing. And your board-proven stupidity can't even cover it.

Interesting that you would use the term racism.

What are your thoughts regarding the iranian president's words and actions towards Israel as quoted in the article I posted here?

[Iowanian]

Everyone knows Ahmadinejad never spoke like that when George Bush was President!


Obviously, treating him like a contributing member of the world has softened his stance and thawed the ice so he'll act more civilized.....

oh.

[vailpass]

Interesting that you would use the term racism.

What are your thoughts regarding the iranian president's words and actions towards Israel as quoted in the article I posted here?

In case you missed it Frankie I'm reposting my question here for you. Where do you stand on the issue of the iranian president's views towards Israel and the Jewish people?

[alanm]

Mother of ****ing Christ.Israel will do whatever they feel they have to do. The US be damned.

[Chief Henry]

In case you missed it Frankie I'm reposting my question here for you. Where do you stand on the issue of the iranian president's views towards Israel and the Jewish people?





Hey Frankie, can you answer the question listed above ?

[Frankie]

In case you missed it Frankie I'm reposting my question here for you. Where do you stand on the issue of the iranian president's views towards Israel and the Jewish people?

Has been answered in the "who'da thunk it?' thread you have already tried to corrupt that one anyway. Go look there.

[Reaper16]

Tell me there Reaper old boy whose words/actions inspire more outrage in you: mine or Iran's leader?

I don't think that Ahmadinejad being a crazy asshole makes an entire place, with a long history of valuable culture and thought, a "shithole."

[SHTSPRAYER]

Last week Mexican President Calderon blamed America for the drug war. The primary cause, he said, was having "the world's biggest consumer' of illegal drugs" as his neighbor.

Obama's response:

"At a time when the Mexican government has so courageously taken on the drug cartels that have plagued both sides of the borders. It is absolutely critical that the United States joins as a full partner in dealing with this issue."

Fair enough.

But then more recently, Obama is shaking hands and yucking it up with Venezualan dictator Hugo Chavez, who has openly supported the Columbian drug trafficking gang FARC, who are the largest importer of illegal narcotics into the USA.

Yet he was quoted as saying "I fail to see how open relations with Venezuala can hurt the United States".

Is Obama just plain stupid? Too lazy to do some research?

[Donger]

I think if there's anything we learned from 9/11, it's that there's no greater way to ensure American security than having as many people out there that hate us as possible.

Actually, what we learned from 9/11 is that there are really f*cking crazy people out there and they want to kill us (and you) for no reason beyond hatred. And you know what? There always will be, regardless of what we do.

[Frankie]

Actually, what we learned from 9/11 is that there are really f*cking crazy people out there and they want to kill us (and you) for no reason beyond hatred. And you know what? There always will be, regardless of what we do.

What I have bolded is as irresponsible as their methods for and solutions to their actual reasons to hate.

[Donger]

What I have bolded is as irresponsible as their methods for and solutions to their actual reasons to hate.

Don't think you'll get a pass, Frankie. You're an American, too.

[patteeu]

Last week Mexican President Calderon blamed America for the drug war. The primary cause, he said, was having "the world's biggest consumer' of illegal drugs" as his neighbor.

Obama's response:

"At a time when the Mexican government has so courageously taken on the drug cartels that have plagued both sides of the borders. It is absolutely critical that the United States joins as a full partner in dealing with this issue."

Fair enough.

But then more recently, Obama is shaking hands and yucking it up with Venezualan dictator Hugo Chavez, who has openly supported the Columbian drug trafficking gang FARC, who are the largest importer of illegal narcotics into the USA.

Yet he was quoted as saying "I fail to see how open relations with Venezuala can hurt the United States".

Is Obama just plain stupid? Too lazy to do some research?

Which Obama are you referring to?

[KC native]

Last week Mexican President Calderon blamed America for the drug war. The primary cause, he said, was having "the world's biggest consumer' of illegal drugs" as his neighbor.

Obama's response:

"At a time when the Mexican government has so courageously taken on the drug cartels that have plagued both sides of the borders. It is absolutely critical that the United States joins as a full partner in dealing with this issue."

Fair enough.

But then more recently, Obama is shaking hands and yucking it up with Venezualan dictator Hugo Chavez, who has openly supported the Columbian drug trafficking gang FARC, who are the largest importer of illegal narcotics into the USA.

Yet he was quoted as saying "I fail to see how open relations with Venezuala can hurt the United States".

Is Obama just plain stupid? Too lazy to do some research?

The right wing paramilitaries in Colombia are just as involved in the cocaine trade as FARC. Neither of which are the largest importers of drugs. They sell most of their wares to the Mexican Cartels because they can't traffic it efficiently over the Gulf of Mexico. Next time do some research before you spout off..

[Duck Dog]

I don't think that Ahmadinejad being a crazy asshole makes an entire place, with a long history of valuable culture and thought, a "shithole."

You're right, Iran has a long history of being a shithole.

[Reaper16]

You're right, Iran has a long history of being a shithole.
Persian culture is one of the most significant in the history of the human race.

[Donger]

Persian culture is one of the most significant in the history of the human race.

Yes, but what have they done for the world in, say, the last 500 years?

[FishingRod]

I do not see having communication with North Korea, Iran , Venezuela or any other Government as a bad thing. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Diplomats have always been at least part time spies and backdoor channels that can be invaluable sources of information. On the other hand Obama has been running around bending over backwards and forwards to make nice with everyone and in many cases coming across as not only extending an olive branch but in some cases appears to be asking for forgiveness from the world. That is a bit much for me but when his efforts are responded to in uncivil and undiplomatic fashion such has been done in Nicaragua, Iran and Venezuela it makes him look week to ignore it or to make no comment. After listing to almost an hour of Crap from Ortega his response of what he thought of it was "It was 50 minutes long. That's what I thought." Ok maybe just a little funny but not exactly "I knew John Kennedy, John Kennedy was a friend of mine you are no John Kennedy."
Likewise Secretary of State Hillary Clinton ignored the question and said "I thought the cultural performance was fascinating," Clinton said. Asked again about the Ortega speech, Clinton said: "To have those first class Caribbean entertainers on all on one stage and to see how much was done in such a small amount of space, I was overwhelmed."

I guess it is national pot day maybe she was just all stoned and distracted by the shiny dancers. I have never claimed to be a fan of Clinton or Obama but they do represent our country and would like to see the appearance of a little more spine and intelligence.

[BucEyedPea]

I'm so glad they're turning out to be good friends. This is truly a great time in our lives that we can now be friends with Chavez,Castro and Armadenijad. Now if he will just reach out to the Somali pirate leadership the circle will be complete.

Is it like the Rumsfeld handshake with Saddam Hussein?


http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/handshake.jpg

[KC Dan]

Is it like the Rumsfeld handshake with Saddam Hussein?


http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/handshake.jpg
Exactly! And, hopefully they will end up the in the same condition later...

[wild1]

You have to wonder how long it will be before the media and liberals start making a concerted effort to rehab Hugo Chavez' image. Probably won't be too long.

We'll see stories about how - oh! in person, he's actually very charming. What a beautiful wife and family he has. Oh, he's done so much for the poor and blah blah blah. He likes some kind of silly pop music and is a big Yankees fan! Oh, look at him, he's like a nice old grandfather! (the way they were talking about Castro not long ago)

This guy is a marxist military thug who got hundreds of people killed the first time he tried to violently overthrow the government there, and since he got into power and consolidated the power of the government within himself almost totally, who knows how many more were locked up or killed. How many times do you see some throwaway news report about Chavez threatening to wreck the world's energy economy or that he's had his thugs shut down a media outlet there? The last election was rigged to keep him in power. The only difference between him and Saddam Hussein is that he's not as good at what he does.

Venezuela has become one of those Marxist countries where state run media pumps out propaganda constantly, dissidents disappear, and the barrios just get bigger.

This is not a respectable man to be pal around with. If anyone in this country knew the half of him they wouldn't even shake his hand, much less buddy up with him, or sit there meekly with him at dinner while he and his buddies trash them all night.

People like Chavez and Ahmandinajad are going to run rings around him, if he isn't willingly compliant to their aims. Especially Ahmandinajad. These people don't respect him. They'll powder his bottom all he wants because they know he won't be any issue for them no matter what they do.

They don't respect him. They see weakness. And they are right.

[SHTSPRAYER]

The right wing paramilitaries in Colombia are just as involved in the cocaine trade as FARC. Neither of which are the largest importers of drugs. They sell most of their wares to the Mexican Cartels because they can't traffic it efficiently over the Gulf of Mexico. Next time do some research before you spout off..

DO SOME RESEARCH NA! LOL

[D2112]

Don't think you'll get a pass, Frankie. You're an American, too.

He's also a douchebag. lets not forget about that either.

[Frankie]

Hey "Righties,".... why don't you just pick-n-choose what is good leadership and what is bad:

http://pro.corbis.com/images/BE073949.jpg?size=67&uid={1C1C6586-E05E-43F2-AC98-E75F55667062} http://jericdietrich.com/nixonchina/contimg/nixon_mao_handshake2.jpg

http://pro.corbis.com/images/TL006070.jpg?size=67&uid={245F79C5-40F9-4580-B30E-7B2017254A18} http://www.israelnationalnews.com/static/blogs/20081112015630.jpg

http://www.notinkansas.us/Images/rumsfeld-hussein.jpg http://www.sundaytimes.lk/090419/images/obama-chavez.jpg

[Hog Farmer]

And Chavez hands him a book about how America exploited his country. LOOK AT THE FACES OF CHAVEZ AND OBAMA ! Our president is being ridiculed.

[SHTSPRAYER]

And Chavez hands him a book about how America exploited his country. LOOK AT THE FACES OF CHAVEZ AND OBAMA ! Our president is being ridiculed.


Let's not gloss over Chavez' history and the love affair the left/democrats have had with him; this little gem is from 2003:


http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/346jorji.asp

[Hog Farmer]

Let's not gloss over Chavez' history and the love affair the left/democrats have had with him; this little gem is from 2003:


http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/346jorji.asp

Yep ! It's too bad Obama wasn't clever enough to take out Chavez using a suicide belt!

[SHTSPRAYER]

BOGOTA, Colombia — Files in a laptop computer seized from the wreckage of a Colombian rebel camp in Ecuador offer new insights into Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez's desire to undermine Colombia's U.S.-allied government.

If authentic, the computer files suggest Chavez has been in league with the rebels for more than a decade.

While Chavez is not one of the correspondents, his sentiments are conveyed in numerous messages exchanged by the rebels.

Venezuela contends the texts are lies and fabrications.

If so, they are expertly done.

Not only do they offer an unprecedented glimpse into the rebels' mind-set, they also reflect deepening rebel contacts with European governments and even representatives of the United States, who have tried to negotiate the release of dozens of hostages.

They are signed electronically by the most powerful men in the leftist Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia, or FARC, the hemisphere's oldest and most potent rebel movement.

Those signing the documents include Raul Reyes, the FARC's foreign minister and public face, who was killed when Colombian commandos raided his jungle hideout in Ecuador on Saturday. His killing, along with 23 of his comrades, struck a chilling blow to the group.

Others who signed messages include Manuel Marulanda, the rebels' 77-year-old supreme leader; Jorge Briceno, their much-feared field marshal, and Ivan Marquez, the insurgents' apparent go-between with Chavez. Marquez is believed to live in Venezuela.

Copies of 13 documents were sent to reporters Tuesday by Colombia's national police chief, Gen. Oscar Naranjo. He revealed their existence Sunday as his government came under a withering diplomatic attack for violating Ecuador's territory with the raid.

They indicate that Chavez, seeking to raise the FARC's stature and relieve it of its international pariah status, shares their goal of isolating and discrediting Colombia's president, Alvaro Uribe.

But do they prove that Venezuela was actually financing the FARC's bid to overthrow a democratically elected government? That's not clear.

Naranjo alleges that the number "300," also called the "dossier" in a Dec. 23 message signed by Marquez, refers to a $300 million gift from Chavez to the rebels.

In a Jan. 14 missive, Briceno discusses what to do with the "dossier."
"Who, where, when and how will we receive the dollars and store them?" he asks fellow members of the FARC's seven-man ruling secretariat.

Uribe has worked as no other Colombian president to defeat the FARC. So it's no surprise that in the Jan. 14 message, Briceno discusses a desire to undermine Uribe by making him cede a safe haven to the rebels for talks on a prisoner swap.

"Uribe will become more isolated, together with his boss from the North," the text says — a clear reference to President Bush, whose government provides Colombia with some $600 million a year in military aid.

In a document dated Feb. 9, Marquez passes along Chavez's thanks for a $150,000 gift when he was imprisoned from 1992-94 for leading a failed coup — and indicates Chavez's desire to smear Uribe.

In it, Marquez says Venezuela wants documentation of damage by Colombia's military to "the civilian population, also images of bombardments in the jungle and its devastation — to use as a denunciation before the world."
In a Feb. 8 letter, Marquez discusses Chavez's plan to try to persuade leading Latin American nations to help get the FARC removed from lists of international terror groups.

And at least three of the documents express Chavez's deep desire to meet with Marulanda, hopefully on Venezuelan soil. Marulanda has reportedly never left Colombia.

Marquez also says Chavez is prepared to offer Venezuelan territory for the FARC's desired prisoner swap, which would be a huge embarrassment for Uribe. The FARC has proposed exchanging some 40 hostages, including three U.S. military contractors, for hundreds of rebels currently in Colombia's jails. The FARC captured the three when their surveillance plane crashed in February 2003.

In the Feb. 9 letter, Marquez also relays Chavez's concern about the 60-year U.S. prison sentence given to FARC commander Ricardo Palmera for conspiring to hold the three Americans hostage. He writes that Chavez "was disposed to hire paid lawyers," presumably for Palmera.

The messages indicate Chavez believes his rebel sympathies may have hurt him politically. One communication said Chavez told a rebel contact that this public support may have contributed to his loss of a Dec. 2 referendum that would have consolidated his power.

Chavez's ally, Ecuadorean President Rafael Correa, was similarly engaged with the rebels, the documents indicate.


Before Saturday's raid, Correa's official position was that he wouldn't take sides. But in a Jan. 18 message, Reyes says he received Ecuadorean Internal Security Minister Gustavo Larrea and another envoy who expressed Correa's interest "in making official relations with the FARC's leadership."

Correa's government was willing "to change officers in the security forces who have been hostile to communities and civilians" in the border area where the FARC has camps, Reyes said. Ecuador even offered to "give documentation and protection to one of ours," he wrote.

Larrea has acknowledged the meeting but said it was only to press for the hostages' release.

The rebels have released six hostages — all Colombian politicians — since Uribe tried to end Chavez's mediation role with the FARC in November, accusing the Venezuelan president of overstepping his mandate. The most recent to be freed said last week that hostage Ingrid Betancourt, a former presidential candidate who also holds French citizenship, is extremely ill.
Betancourt has become a cause celebre in France. French contacts with Reyes are mentioned in several documents, including a request that the French envoy, identified only as "Noe," be granted a meeting with Marulanda.
References to U.S. diplomatic overtures are scintillating, if vague.

In a Dec. 11 message to the secretariat, Marquez writes: "If you are in agreement, I can receive Jim and Tucker to hear the proposal of the gringos."
Writing two days before his death, Reyes tells his comrades that "the gringos," working through Ecuador's government, are interested "in talking to us on various issues."

"They say the new president of their country will be (Barack) Obama," he writes, saying Obama rejects both the Bush administration's free trade agreement with Colombia and the current military aid program.

Reyes writes that his response to the Americans was that the United States would have to publicly express these positions.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,335128,00.html

[KCCHIEFS27]

Personally, I look at this in another way. Bush displayed puerileness by not talking to Chavez and quite frankly, was probably intimidated by the man. The book Obama received from Chavez was written in 1970(before I stated it was about the Bush administration, which makes this even more of an irrelevant jab) and Obama shaking his hand only affirmed the fact that he was willing to sit down face to face, without fear, to talk with this man. NO SITUATION IS RESOLVED BY IGNORING IT. I haven't agreed with everything Obama has done so far and I didn't argue against everything Bush did. Nobody has ever been perfect in office, but for those called traitors and unpatriotic when they spoke out about Bush, have a damn good reason to sit back and laugh at those of you dissenting against Obama thus far.

[J Diddy]

I don't understand the big deal. I mean half the problems we are in as diplomatically is because we try to enforce our will on everyone. How many would come to a negotiation table knowing that before you would even talk you first had to declare everything you thought to be right was in fact wrong.

[patteeu]

And Chavez hands him a book about how America exploited his country. LOOK AT THE FACES OF CHAVEZ AND OBAMA ! Our president is being ridiculed.

Obama sat through a 50 minute tongue lashing from Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega denouncing the US for terrorist aggression toward Central America. Our President meekly took notes. Diplomatic prowess!

[patteeu]

Personally, I look at this in another way. Bush displayed puerileness by not talking to Chavez and quite frankly, was probably intimidated by the man. The book Obama received from Chavez was written in 1970(before I stated it was about the Bush administration, which makes this even more of an irrelevant jab) and Obama shaking his hand only affirmed the fact that he was willing to sit down face to face, without fear, to talk with this man. NO SITUATION IS RESOLVED BY IGNORING IT. I haven't agreed with everything Obama has done so far and I didn't argue against everything Bush did. Nobody has ever been perfect in office, but for those called traitors and unpatriotic when they spoke out about Bush, have a damn good reason to sit back and laugh at those of you dissenting against Obama thus far.

Really? What reason is that?

[Duck Dog]

Q. Does everyone shake the hand and smile real big to the fella that just a few weeks earlier called you a "poor ignorant man?"

A. Only if your yellow bellied and spineless.

[SHTSPRAYER]

BAM'S LATIN LOVERS

At a Caribbean resort, Obama grinned through a semi-erotic encounter with Venezuelan dictator Hugo Chavez, then failed to answer a "strategic rape" charge lodged against America by ex-Sandinista Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua (who knows plenty about rape).

Ignoring America's allies in favor of photo ops with anti-American leftists, such as Ecuador's Rafael Correa and Chavez, Obama blamed the United States for Latin America's problems.

Whoa! Plenty of US policies toward Latin America have been misguided and myopic. But the primary causes of political, economic and social failure from the Rio Grande to Tierra del Fuego have been homemade.

Until Latin American states accept responsibility for what generations of corrupt, oppressive leaders did to their own countries, they won't progress beyond their self-destructive cultures of blame.

It's easy to chant, "Yanquis, go home!" Well, the Yankees went home. And only such countries as Chile, Colombia and, increasingly, Brazil, which have taken responsibility for their own futures, are making progress.

Obama was exactly right on one point: Our relations with Latin America must be a partnership in which all are treated as equals, based upon mutual respect.

But how do the lurid, screwball attacks on us by the likes of Chavez, Ortega or Bolivia's Evo Morales -- a racist demagogue -- count as examples of mutual respect? Doesn't our country deserve some slight defense from our president?

Obama needs to get up off his knees. Foreign leaders have already pegged him as the wimpiest metrosexual this side of the men's grooming-products counter at Barney's.

As for our southern neighbors, blaming the gringos is easy. And it's satisfying. And suicidal. Take just two tragic examples of today's self-destructive "populism" in South America.

Argentina, a land of enormous potential, just never gets its act together. Democracy never quite works. Instead, the old culture of deadly caudillos, of strongman rule -- dating back to Rosas in the 19th century -- morphed into one of strongmen-through-elections.

Over the last two decades, this lovely, tragic country suffered from the fake-free-market looting of former President Carlos Menem, followed by the left-wing looting of the Kirchner Mob today. America did nothing to harm Argentina. But guess who the current regime blames as it robs its own people?

If anything, the long history of Venezuela is even more tragic. South America's fight for freedom first gained its footing in Caracas, when Simon Bolivar stepped up to lead the struggle.

A heroic, dauntless genius, Bolivar ultimately freed not only Venezuela, Colombia and Ecuador from the arthritic rule of Spain but, with the help of other heroes (such as Jose San Martin), completed the liberation of Peru and Bolivia.

Bolivar's thanks? He died miserably on his way into exile, driven out by special interests and usurping thugs. South America did produce Washingtons and Lincolns. But when times got tough it defaulted to juntas and dictators.

The egomaniacal Hugo Chavez drones on for hours about his "Bolivarian Revolution." But Bolivar, brave and peerless, stood for the rule of law above all else. A healthy constitution was his first prescription for freedom. Chavez sees the law as an obstacle to be smashed.

Grinning from ear to ear, our president embraced a man who persecutes, jails and, yes, terrorizes Venezuela's last democratically elected officials as he runs a once-vibrant economy into the ground. (Will we soon send aid to Caracas to compensate for the drop in the price of oil?)

Obama should be supporting those who respect the rule of law and the outcome of contested elections, the leaders of such diverse political systems as those of Brazil, Chile, Mexico and Colombia. Instead, he lent his prestige to our declared enemies -- thugs who are doing great harm to their own people.

What we saw on display wasn't just the horrifying naivete the Obama administration shows throughout its foreign policy, but something even more worrisome: our president's greatest weakness.

He needs adulation. He's hooked on it. The crowds and clapping and cameras are O's cocaine (these days).

But to what end? Is it worth humiliating our country for a pat on the back and a fist bump from Hugo Chavez? When the ovations end, as they ultimately will, what will be left for the country our self-adoring president was elected to lead?

Whose president is he?

Ralph Peters is Fox News' strategic analyst and the author of "Looking for Trouble."

http://www.nypost.com/seven/04212009/postopinion/opedcolumnists/bams_latin_lovers_165369.htm?page=2

[KC native]

BOGOTA, Colombia — Files in a laptop computer seized from the wreckage of a Colombian rebel camp in Ecuador offer new insights into Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez's desire to undermine Colombia's U.S.-allied government.

Remember there is always two sides to a story

http://www.pacificfreepress.com/news/1/2648-the-farc-ep-files-venezuela-and-interpol.html
Fri 23 May 2008

The FARC-EP Files, Venezuela and Interpol Print
Written by Stephen Lendman
Friday, 23 May 2008 17:28


Spinning the News - The FARC-EP Files, Venezuela and Interpol
by Stephen Lendman


First some background. On March 1, the Colombian military (with US Special Forces help) illegally attacked a FARC-EP rebel camp inside Ecuador.

US satellite telephone tracking located the site. Washington signed off on the mission. Over 20 people were killed, including 16 or more FARC-EP members while they slept.

Key among them was Paul Reyes, the FARC-EP's second-in-command, key peace negotiator and public voice, and lead figure in the Chavez-led hostage negotiations with Colombia.

The action was a clear act of aggression and premeditated murder. It's not how the dominant media played it. Hostile verbal exchanges took place between Hugo Chavez and Ecuador's Raphael Correa on the one hand and Colombia's Alvaro Uribe and George Bush on the other. US presidential candidates, as expected, supported the White House and Bogota.

Tensions heightened further when Colombia's vice-president, Francisco Santos Calderon, revealed his nation's army recovered three laptops and other material at the FARC-EP camp with provocative evidence on their hard drives. He claimed it showed Chavez and Correa have links to the FARC-EP, and Venezuela provided weapons, munitions, and $300 million or so to the rebel group. In addition, the FARC-EP was accused of acquiring 50 kilograms (110 pounds) of uranium, that it wishes to sell it for a radioactive dirty bomb, it also sold 700 kilograms of cocaine for about $1.5 million, and more.

The story is preposterous, but the media grabbed hold of it. No evidence exists, so they invent it. In March, Colombian authorities asked Interpol to examine the computer files for authenticity. The organization released its report on May 15. On its web site, it states that Secretary General Ronald Noble "advised senior Colombian law enforcement officials that INTERPOL's team of forensic experts discovered 'no evidence of modification, alteration, addition or deletion' in the user files of any of the three laptop computers, three USB thumb drives and two external hard disks seized during a Colombian anti-narcotics and anti-terrorist operation on a FARC camp on 1 March 2008."

But Interpol admitted that lacking evidence doesn't prove "there was no tampering." In fact, some files had future date stamps and other indications of data alteration. It questions their authenticity, and Interpol (deep in its report) acknowledged that Columbia likely manipulated the contents - with an explanation needing close reading to understand. It delegitimizes Colombian claims and would get an international court to dismiss them out of hand. Reporters doing their job should as well. Data accuracy can't be verified or worse - they may be entirely fraudulent, and made-in-Washington mischief may be behind it.

Interpol's report continued saying;

* "between 1 and 3 March, direct access to the seized computer exhibits....did not follow internationally recognized principles in the handling of electronic evidence under ordinary circumstance." Its experts "verified that this....had no effect" on file contents, but other report evidence contradicts that statement.


Interpol, in fact, stated that;

* "Direct access may complicate validating this evidence for purposes of its introduction in a judicial proceeding because law enforcement is then required to demonstrate or prove that the direct access did not have a material impact on the purpose for which the evidence is intended."


In short, hard drive data prove nothing and may, in fact, be fake. With US involvement clear, it wouldn't be the first time, and Washington is rich in talent to do it.


Independent computer experts are also troubled. They believe that failure to follow standard evidence handling procedures seriously jeopardizes its reliability. With care, forensic specialists or computer professionals can add, delete or alter hard drive material without leaving a footprint.

Dominant media reports ignored this and more. They passed over or played down key findings, including Interpol's statement: that its experts didn't "evaluate the accuracy or the source of the exhibits' content."

How could they?

The volume was enormous amounting to the equivalent of "39.5 million pages in Microsoft Word...." At the rate of 100 pages a day, "it would take more than 1000 years to read" it.

That alone begs the question. In a few days or even weeks, how were Colombian authorities able to analyze the data to discover provocative information therein. That notion also got no attention in the dominant media. Neither did most other parts of the truth.

Spinning the News - How Big Media Does It

Here's how Murdoch's Wall Street Journal's played it on May 16. Its editorial page said Interpol's May 15 report "won't make Venezuelan strongman Hugo Chavez's day." It reported Interpol's claim about no evidence of file tampering, but ignored the issues of authenticity, accuracy, manipulation, or impossible "speed-reading" skills of Colombian verifiers. It concluded that "Interpol's certification proves that Mr. Chavez is trying to destabilize a US ally (and that he's a) proven supporter of terrorism in our own hemisphere."

The New York Times' Simon Romero was little better. His May 16 article was headlined: "Files Tying Venezuela to Rebels Not Altered, Report Says." He called Interpol's report "a setback for Venezuela, which had claimed that the computer files....were fabrications...." It "may advance efforts under way in the Congress to add Venezuela to the United States' list of state sponsors of terrorism...."

Well down in his report, Romero admitted that "Interpol could not vouch for the accuracy of the files" and that "a Colombian antiterrorism unit (seized them improperly and) in violation of internationally recognized rules on handling electronic evidence...." No further comment was added.


In contrast, Romero played up State Department spokesman, Sean McCormack, saying these "are serious allegations about Venezuela supplying arms and support to a terrorist organization.... that has deep implications for the people of the region." He had to acknowledge, however, what credible experts agree on. Given the importance of US and Venezuelan relations, chances of declaring the country a state sponsor of terrorism is highly remote - "particularly without more evidence (read any evidence) of the country's support of the FARC..."

Latin American history professor Greg Grandin goes further. He believes "Almost all of Latin America and most of the world would take Venezuela's side in this dispute. Any move (against the Chavez government) would further isolate the United States in a region where it has been hemorrhaging influence."

That doesn't phase Romero. Piling on is his specialty. Truth isn't. He returned on May 18 with a provocative feature story headlined: "Chavez Seizes Greater Economic Power." Some key points in it are:

* "Chavez is intensifying state control of the Venezuelan economy through a wave of takeovers of private companies and creation of government-controlled ventures with allies like Cuba and Iran; fears are intensifying (over) more nationalizations;

* "it's happening "just months after voters rejected a referendum to give the president sweeping constitutional power (leading critics to accuse him of being) more interested in consolidating power than in fixing Venezuela's problems;

* "while he has argued that (he aims) to correct social injustices and fight soaring inflation, his critics say his moves are instead compounding these troubles;" no supporter voices in sight;

* "to avoid "outright confiscation (he's) offering 'some' compensation;" unmentioned is it's fair market value and nothing was, is or will be "confiscated;

* "Romero stresses Venezuela's ties to Iran and China with joint ventures and infrastructure projects; also that Chavez will "export more oil to China in exchange for more Chinese investment in Venezuela;" implied, of course, are his relations with US rivals, and, in the case of Iran, a country George Bush calls "the world's leading state sponsor of terrorism;

* "he ignores Venezuela's successes; along with Argentina, it's the fastest growing regional economy and one of the fastest in the world at a time of economic weakness; its impressive employment growth with most of it coming in the private sector; that Chavez is friendly to business and boosts the private economy; the country's huge social gains; and Chavez's immense popularity and growing world stature; instead he lists problems - high inflation, less foreign investment, food shortages, capital flight, and more that are only mitigated by "high oil prices;

* "near the article's end, he's forced to admit what economist Mark Weisbrot explains - that Chavez "is so far mainly just reversing some of the privatizations that took place in the 1990s;

* "Romero reverts to form with some provocative ending quotes about Chavez "stimulating a pre-insurrectional climate;" that his nationalizations aim "to annihilate the productive apparatus so that we depend more on petroleum, which is to depend more on the state, or in other words, to depend more on Chavez."



For the dominant US media, Chavez-bashing is full-time. Washington Post writers excel at it on any pretext, and Juan Forero's May 16 Interpol report article was typical. It's headlined: "FARC Computer Files Are Authentic, Interpol Probe Finds." He echoed the Wall Street Journal and New York Times and said files seized;

* "contain e-mails (Interpol never mentioned any) and other documents that show how Venezuela's populist leader had formed such a tight bond with guerrilla commanders that his key lieutenants had offered help in obtaining sophisticated weaponry such as surface-to-air missiles while delivering light arms. The files also document links between FARC and Ecuador's president, Raphael Correa, a close ally of Chavez."


Similar reports appeared throughout the US and western media. They never miss a chance to play down facts and attack populist leaders. In response, Hugo Chavez dismissed the allegations as "ridiculous." He urged Colombia's president to have "a moment of reflection (and added) The government of Columbia is capable of provoking a war....to justify a US intervention in Venezuela." He also called Colombia's assertion "a new act of aggression." It means relations with his neighbor will come "under deep review," and Reuters reported May 15 that "Venezuela is deeply revising diplomatic, economic and political relations with Colombia" following Interpol's report and the Uribe government's allegations.

Ecuador's Correa was abroad in France, but took time to say the computer file documents "prove absolutely nothing. We have information that the Colombian government had the computers for some time and prepared all this." Quite possibly because the entire story is unraveling. But don't expect Big Media to report it.


Revving Up Gunboat Diplomacy

While it continues, the Pentagon announced in April that it's resurrecting its Fourth Fleet in Latin America and the Caribbean after a 60 year hiatus. It was created during WW II and disbanded in 1950. Reasons given were vaguely stated - to "conduct varying missions including a range of contingency operations, counter narco-terrorism, and theater security cooperation activities."

US Naval Forces Southern Command chief Admiral James Stevenson said the move would send a message to the entire region, not just Venezuela. Commandant of the National War College, General Robert Steel added that:

* "The United States' obsession with Venezuela, Cuba and other things indicates they are going to use more military force, going to use that instrument more often." Bolivian President Evo Morales called the move "Fourth Fleet....intervention."


The Fleet begins operating in July and will be headquartered out of Florida's Mayport Naval Station. It'll be part of the Pentagon's Southern Command, extending from the Caribbean to the continent's southern tip. Its strength will be formidable - aircraft carriers, submarines, various attack ships, and several nuclear-armed ones.

With no Latin American threat, why then this move, and why now with an administration nearing its end and bogged down in two unwinnable wars? Like the Middle East and Central Asia, the region's importance is crucial. Venezuela alone is why. Its proved oil reserves were just raised to 130 billion barrels, but include what's uncounted and they're far higher.

On its web site, the US Department of Energy (DOE) estimates the country's extra-heavy oil at 1.36 trillion barrels, or 90% of the world's total. That's more than all "proved" world reserves combined and in addition to Venezuela's "proved" light sweet resources of around 80 billion barrels that alone ranks it seventh in the world behind the five largest Middle East producers and Canada.

With stakes that high, it's significant that Admiral Joseph Kernan will become Fleet commander when it's activated. He currently heads the Naval Special Warfare Command that includes Navy Seals and other counterinsurgency units. His choice is troublesome, and regional leaders are mindful. Hugo Chavez especially. It may be why he's buying nine Russian submarines, but against America it hardly registers. In total, Venezuela spends $1 - 2 billion on its military annually or less than half of 1% of the Pentagon's budget. Nonetheless, it's another reason Washington targets him with a hawkish commander now charged to do it.

Rumor also is that the Pentagon plans building a Colombian military base near Venezuela's border. Washington's Colombian ambassador, William Brownfield, said it's possible if its Manta, Ecuador one is closed. Its lease expires in 2009, and Raphael Correa said renewal depends on the US granting Ecuador equivalent basing rights in South Florida - his way of confirming renewal won't happen.

Chavez is justifiably alarmed at the prospect of US troops on his border. He warned Colombia not to do it and said this action will force Venezuela to revive a decades-old territorial conflict over its possible La Guajira location. He further added: "We will not allow the Colombian government to give La Guajira to the empire." Stationing US troops there will be "a threat of war at us." So far, neither Washington or Colombia confirm what's planned. But Colombia's defense minister, Juan Manuel Santos, denies the base rumor, at least in La Guajira. In a May 14 televised address, Chavez called it "good news." Nonetheless, the situation bears watching.

Chavez is justifiably wary. As long as he's president, he'll be vilified and targeted. Latin America is vital to Washington. Venezuela is a key part of it. But America's dominance is weakening, neoliberal pillage caused it, the Bush administration accelerated it, Bolivarianism challenges it, so muscular militarism may replace diplomacy to restore it.

Colombia's belligerency, the FARC-EP files, Fourth Fleet reactivation, continued funding of Venezuela's opposition, CIA's covert mischief, disruptive street violence, and other planned schemes are troublesome. They're to reassert regional control and rid Washington of its leading hemispheric antagonist. No guessing who, and no telling when the next attempt will come or in what form. Everything tried so far failed. Even worse, it's been counterproductive. Chavez has enormous stature and immense popular support.

That makes him an even greater threat and hints at something bigger coming. So far, it's just speculation, however, with the administration's tenure winding down. But it may or may not deter those running it who are always wrong, never in doubt, and apparently willing to risk making a bad situation worse. Stay tuned, expect surprises, and be assured the months ahead won't be boring.


Stephen Lendman lives in Chicago and can be reached at lendmanstephen@sbcglobal.net.

[KC native]

And SHTSprayer, don't let recent events get in your way either

http://www.reuters.com/article/homepageCrisis/idUSN14462756._CH_.2400

Print | Close this window
Venezuela Chavez calls for Colombia FARC ceasefire
Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:40pm EDT
By Frank Jack Daniel

CARACAS, April 14 (Reuters) - Venezuela's President Hugo Chavez said Colombia's FARC rebels should lay down weapons for four months to help start peace talks, toughening his stance toward the Marxist group Washington says his government backs.

Chavez made his comments a few days before the Summit of the Americas, a meeting of regional leaders in which Chavez and U.S. President Barack Obama will both participate.

Chavez was speaking in support of a proposal by Colombian President Alvaro Uribe, who last week called on the rebels to cease hostilities as a sign they are interested in talks.

"The president said if there is a peace proposal the government is ready, that they should stop their activities for four months," Chavez said during a press conference with Uribe in Caracas.

"I think that's fair, the FARC should take note of this."

With the help of billions of dollars in U.S. aid, the Colombian army has largely driven the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia from cities into remote mountain and jungle camps, rescuing their most famous hostage, politician Ingrid Betancourt, and killing top leaders.

At the summit in Trinidad this week, Chavez will forcefully propose the United States drops its trade embargo against his close ally Cuba, but has also said he is open to talks with Obama.

The United States last year accused Venezuela's top two intelligence chiefs and a recently retired interior minister of helping the rebels smuggle cocaine.

In an interview soon after taking office, Obama said Chavez exported terrorist activities and supported the FARC, which is widely hated in Colombia for attacking civilian targets and using bombs in urban areas.

The Colombian army has also used unethical tactics including killing peasants and disguising them as rebels to improve their body count.

Laptops found by Colombia in a rebel camp last year were seized on by Washington as evidence of cooperation between Venezuelan officials and Colombian rebels.

Chavez has in the past called on the FARC to be recognized as a legitimate army and not considered terrorists.

But he has gradually stepped up pressure on the rebels who have fought the Colombian government for decades, telling them to hand over without preconditions dozens of hostages held in jungle camps.

On Wednesday he said he was neither a friend or an enemy of the rebels. "Venezuela and our government do not support armed or violent movements in Colombia or in any part of the world," Chavez said.

"I am not an ally of the FARC, I am not a friend of the FARC -- but you know that I am not their enemy." (Editing by Todd Eastham)

[InChiefsHell]

And this from Bill O'Reilly...possibly showing that Obama gave Chavez the business for embarrassing him...if it's true (and we don't know because we don't have audio) I have to give Barack props on this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfOhZT1aL9U

[patteeu]

And this from Bill O'Reilly...possibly showing that Obama gave Chavez the business for embarrassing him...if it's true (and we don't know because we don't have audio) I have to give Barack props on this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfOhZT1aL9U

I don't know what Obama was saying during that conversation. I hope that it's true that he was laying down the law, but it's hard to say.

One thing I know for sure though is that I'm not a fan of O'Reilly's body language and voice interpretation expert segments. Some insights might be available from these people, but for the most part he might as well have a fortune teller on to preview the next day's news as far as I'm concerned.