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Guru
05-01-2009, 02:43 PM
What are the best reasonbly priced carpet cleaners out there? I need something to pull up the water in the basement and figure it might as well be good at cleaning carpets too. I'll probably be buying tonight so any quick help would be appreciated.

Fish
05-01-2009, 02:49 PM
This isn't a lesbian thread?

Guru
05-01-2009, 02:53 PM
This isn't a lesbian thread?I don't need the humor today. I don't want to waste my money on the wrong machine.

Otter
05-01-2009, 02:54 PM
I don't need the humor today. I don't want to waste my money on the wrong machine.

You're just begging for punishment.

rockymtnchief
05-01-2009, 02:57 PM
Carpet cleaning machines probably won't pick up as much water as you're hoping in the basement. They have small reservoirs and tanks. A shop-vac or rent a pump for the basement.

I have a Bissell steam cleaner that seems to do pretty good at cleaning. I'm at work so I can't tell you which model I have.

Dicky McElephant
05-01-2009, 02:58 PM
Little Green Machine

Guru
05-01-2009, 02:59 PM
Carpet cleaning machines probably won't pick up as much water as you're hoping in the basement. They have small reservoirs and tanks. A shop-vac or rent a pump for the basement.

I have a Bissell steam cleaner that seems to do pretty good at cleaning. I'm at work so I can't tell you which model I have.I understand that, really I do. but shop vacs don't work worth a crap on carpet though. I need something that will suck it all out of the actual carpet. History has shown me that carpet cleaners do that better.

Guru
05-01-2009, 03:00 PM
You're just begging for punishment.Well, punish me later. Not right now.;)

Donger
05-01-2009, 03:00 PM
Just get the low-end Hoover.

alpha_omega
05-01-2009, 03:00 PM
If sucking up water is your primary purpose, i would also suggest that a shop-vac is going to be your best bet.

CrazyHorse
05-01-2009, 03:34 PM
I have owned and run my own carpet cleaning business for over 15 years. The shop vac with a carpet attachment works best because it has the most water lift. You cant do it with a wide blade vacuum head. There is probably a "lowest spot" somewhere on your floor. Go to it and put the hose end flat in the low spot and let the water run to you. It will be moving slow, but is the best way to extract. Otherwise you're pushing the water around, or it runs righ back to the spot you just extracted.

No carpet cleaning maching that you buy cleans carpet. They all force the dirt into the pad where it cant be retrieved. Dont but a machine for that.

Even a professional grade extractor cant extract enough water in a flood situation. The padding holds enough water to midew.

A pro would 1st get as much water as possible out with extraction. Whether that be a shop vac, carpet machine, or even towels. Once you have extracted as much as you can you have to put a dehumidifier in the room to pull the rest of the water out of the carpet. If you dont, you will have either a severe mildew problem, or a big brown water stain, or both.

The key to getting a saturated carpet dry before mildew, is with a dehumidifier. No extractor on the planet will do the job right. Or buy itself.

So if your gonna go drop a a few bucks to fix the problem your money needs to be spent on the only thing that can reach into the pad and pull the water out. A dehumidifier.

Have I mentioned you might need a dehumidifier?

Good luck.

They say you have no more than 72 hours (depending on your conditions, maybe shorter) before mildew starts. Your carpet needs to be dry by then.

Dicky McElephant
05-01-2009, 03:37 PM
I have owned and run my own carpet cleaning business for over 15 years. The shop vac with a carpet attachment works best because it has the most water lift. You cant do it with a wide blade vacuum head. There is probably a "lowest spot" somewhere on your floor. Go to it and put the hose end flat in the low spot and let the water run to you. It will be moving slow, but is the best way to extract. Otherwise you're pushing the water around, or it runs righ back to the spot you just extracted.

No carpet cleaning maching that you buy cleans carpet. They all force the dirt into the pad where it cant be retrieved. Dont but a machine for that.

Even a professional grade extractot can not extract enough water in a flood situation. The padding holds enough water to midew.

A pro would 1st get as much water as possible out with extraction. Whether that be a shop vac, carpet machine, or even towels. Once you have extracted as much as you can you have to put a dehumidifier in the room to pull the rest of the water out of the carpet. If you dont, you will have either a severe mildew problem, or a big brown water stain, or both.

The key to getting a saturated carpet dry before mildew, is with a dehumidifier. No extractor on the planet will do the job right.

So if your gonna go drop a a few bucks to fix the problem your money needs to be spent on the only thing that can reach into the pad and pull the water out. A dehumidifier.

Have I mentioned you might need a dehumidifier?

But how does he fix his problem?

CrazyHorse
05-01-2009, 03:42 PM
But how does he fix his problem?


Whats the problem? I must have missed it.

BTW, if you have concrete floors with no carpet in the basement, forget everything I just said. That advice was for "carpet only" floors. I was assuming you had carpet in the basement.

RJ
05-01-2009, 03:50 PM
Guru, what exactly is the situation you're dealing with right now? Is the flooded basement carpeted or uncarpeted? How much water are you looking at?

MoreLemonPledge
05-01-2009, 03:53 PM
If sucking up water is your primary purpose, i would also suggest that a shop-vac is going to be your best bet.

This.

Guru
05-01-2009, 04:34 PM
Guru, what exactly is the situation you're dealing with right now? Is the flooded basement carpeted or uncarpeted? How much water are you looking at?It is an unpadded carpet in a completely finished basement. It has been wet since Monday. We have always been able to dry thing by using fans in the past but this is the worst we have ever had it. I guess, according to your time table, we are already screwed on mildew.

yes, we have an old dehumidifier that has been running non stop all week.

I HATE THIS HOUSE

gblowfish
05-01-2009, 04:59 PM
I have a Bissell Carpet cleaner that does an OK job on just basic cleaning, but it's not designed to pull flood water out of a carpet. The advice from the carpet guy looks like your best bet.

Stewie
05-01-2009, 05:05 PM
It is an unpadded carpet in a completely finished basement. It has been wet since Monday. We have always been able to dry thing by using fans in the past but this is the worst we have ever had it. I guess, according to your time table, we are already screwed on mildew.

yes, we have an old dehumidifier that has been running non stop all week.

I HATE THIS HOUSE

I had a sump pump fail last year and had about 1" of water on my carpet. I had a water abatement company come out and they said I could do it myself. I have a Hoover SteamVac that I bought at Walmart and it removed the water amazingly well. I used fans and two dehumidifiers to dry it out.

I had two things going for me according to the guys who came out:

1) My basement carpet is indoor/outdoor. What they told me was it's the backing on carpet that can cause mildew/mold problems.
2) No drywall. My walls are old oak barn wood.

It took about a week to completely dry. I then used the carpet cleaner to really clean the carpet. One week later (with dehumidifiers still running) you never would have known everything had been soaked. It was ALOT of work.

unothadeal
05-01-2009, 05:06 PM
My mouth.

Guru
05-01-2009, 05:08 PM
I had a sump pump fail last year and had about 1" of water on my carpet. I had a water abatement company come out and they said I could do it myself. I have a Hoover SteamVac that I bought at Walmart and it removed the water amazingly well. I used fans and two dehumidifiers to dry it out.

I had two things going for me according to the guys who came out:

1) My basement carpet is indoor/outdoor. What they told me was it's the backing on carpet that can cause mildew/mold problems.
2) No drywall. My walls are old oak barn wood.

It took about a week to completely dry. I then used the carpet cleaner to really clean the carpet. One week later (with dehumidifiers still running) you never would have known everything had been soaked. It was ALOT of work.What kind of fans. all I can find is the damn box fans that are friggin worthless.

PastorMikH
05-01-2009, 05:13 PM
I use a shop vac to get standing water up, then a dehumidifier to dry things out.

As for cleaning carpet, I've seen the job I can do when trying to do a really good job with a carpet cleaner and I've seen the job the profesionals do. I'll opt for the pros.

Stewie
05-01-2009, 05:15 PM
What kind of fans. all I can find is the damn box fans that are friggin worthless.

My friend had two industrial fans. I didn't take a close look but its shape made me think is was like a furnace blower with the exhaust blowing right across the floor. The exhaust was probably 2" tall and 18" wide. Did a great job but I'm sure they're expensive.

Stewie
05-01-2009, 05:17 PM
It looked like this:

http://www.cleanfreak.com/cardry1.htm

Skip Towne
05-01-2009, 05:28 PM
Have fun.

stlchiefs
05-01-2009, 05:30 PM
It looked like this:

http://www.cleanfreak.com/cardry1.htm

Check with Home Depot or Lowes, you may be able to rent one from there.

Pioli Zombie
05-01-2009, 05:40 PM
I wood put my money on either Courtney Love or Ellen Degeneres
Posted via Mobile Device

RJ
05-01-2009, 05:53 PM
Check with Home Depot or Lowes, you may be able to rent one from there.


That's probably a good idea. For about $20 you can take care of your immediate problem and worry about a cleaner later. Those cleaning machines at the local grocery work real well for water extraction, IIRC.

Incidentally, that was Crazyhorse that mentioned the mildew problem and I thought his post carried some good advice. If/when you buy a carpet cleaner it should be used for occasional cleaning of traffic lanes. I doubt that any of them are a substitute for professional cleaning.

Pioli Zombie
05-01-2009, 05:57 PM
Rachel Maddow
Posted via Mobile Device

Guru
05-01-2009, 06:01 PM
Check with Home Depot or Lowes, you may be able to rent one from there.Lowes doesn't even rent them.:spock:

Home depot has two left at $104 per week each. Guess I have no choice. Doesn't solve any problems though.

stlchiefs
05-01-2009, 06:07 PM
Lowes doesn't even rent them.:spock:

Home depot has two left at $104 per week each. Guess I have no choice. Doesn't solve any problems though.

That's what the pros will use if you hire them out so they're worth it. Rather than just shoot air all over they direct it along the surface, which is what you need. You should try to get some dehumidifiers in there as well if you can.

RJ
05-01-2009, 06:08 PM
Wouldn't one of those Rug Doctor machines they rent at the grocery work?

They're hot water extraction and you want to extract from a damp carpet, correct?

Or do you have standing water?

Guru
05-01-2009, 06:22 PM
That's what the pros will use if you hire them out so they're worth it. Rather than just shoot air all over they direct it along the surface, which is what you need. You should try to get some dehumidifiers in there as well if you can.guess I should just buy one for 199

Hog Farmer
05-01-2009, 07:16 PM
I bought one of these a couple of years ago to clean my rental houses with. They work good . And they are usually available for rent in some stores. They really suck ! And I mean in a good way.


http://www.rugdoctor.com/

googlegoogle
05-01-2009, 08:35 PM
rug doctor :hmmm:

Guru
05-01-2009, 08:59 PM
I bought one of these a couple of years ago to clean my rental houses with. They work good . And they are usually available for rent in some stores. They really suck ! And I mean in a good way.


http://www.rugdoctor.com/I've got two 5 gallon shop vacs going right now. already dumped one of them twice. Keep finding more places that the water has gotten to. It stinks down there. That combined with the swine flu really stinks.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 08:03 AM
What kind of fans. all I can find is the damn box fans that are friggin worthless.

Understand that when using a fan, it will move water. But unless you have something to pull the water out of the air once moving, the room will still dry slowly. If you have had a dehumidifier running for that long, then you still need to extract some water.

But yeah a box fan is light for the job it sounds like.

You might be able to find an air mover at your local equipment rental place.

They look something like this:



You might also be able to find an extractor there as well as the dehimidifier if you think the one you have wont work well enough.

EyePod
05-02-2009, 08:07 AM
A vacuum.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 08:13 AM
Here's the good news.

Water inside your home is like cancer. If you have any wicking on the dry wall where you are showing a water line, then you likely have water in that wall. That would be an indicator that mold will likely grow in your walls. Which untreated can be every dangerous to your health and anyone else living in the home.

What it means to your structure. If the plate on the stud wall gets wet and starts to mold, it will aslo start to rot. Sometimes it can take several years to rot. But when it does, if it is a load bearing wall, the weight will crush the plate and your wall will sink. It can cause cracking in the drywall, roof leaks and several other problem. Flooding is no joke inside a home.

It might benefit you to call your insurabce company. You might have a major issue down the road if you dont.

This is the best advice to give at this point.

Yes, it is important to get the water out. But dont let the cancer grow. It will kill your house just like it can kill a person. Cancer of the home is caused....by water.

stlchiefs
05-02-2009, 09:49 AM
Here's the good news.

Water inside your home is like cancer. If you have any wicking on the dry wall where you are showing a water line, then you likely have water in that wall. That would be an indicator that mold will likely grow in your walls. Which untreated can be every dangerous to your health and anyone else living in the home.

What it means to your structure. If the plate on the stud wall gets wet and starts to mold, it will aslo start to rot. Sometimes it can take several years to rot. But when it does, if it is a load bearing wall, the weight will crush the plate and your wall will sink. It can cause cracking in the drywall, roof leaks and several other problem. Flooding is no joke inside a home.

It might benefit you to call your insurabce company. You might have a major issue down the road if you dont.

This is the best advice to give at this point.

Yes, it is important to get the water out. But dont let the cancer grow. It will kill your house just like it can kill a person. Cancer of the home is caused....by water.

One comment, do NOT call your insurance company unless you are absolutely positive that you plan on filing a claim on this. By simply contacting your insurance co. they will open a file on the incident and it will be on your record and show on your CLUE report. Even if they don't pay out on it it will still show as a claim with no payout which in the end will effect your rates.

So, definitely get the damage looked at by a professional, but no need to alarm the insurance co. unless you plan to use them.

bevischief
05-02-2009, 09:55 AM
Shop Vac, dehumidifier, steam cleaner and all types of fans.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 10:21 AM
What it means to your structure. If the plate on the stud wall gets wet and starts to mold, it will aslo start to rot. Sometimes it can take several years to rot. But when it does, if it is a load bearing wall, the weight will crush the plate and your wall will sink. It can cause cracking in the drywall, roof leaks and several other problem.
While that is all true, no modern home that is built properly has any wood-framed load bearing walls in the basement. The upper levels are supported by the concrete block (or poured concrete) walls and steelwork.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 11:27 AM
While that is all true, no modern home that is built properly has any wood-framed load bearing walls in the basement. The upper levels are supported by the concrete block (or poured concrete) walls and steelwork.

The interior of the basement in new modern homes are made of wood. They do not poor concrete interior walls in homes.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 11:40 AM
The interior of the basement in new modern homes are made of wood. They do not poor concrete interior walls in homes.
Those aren't load bearing walls then.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 11:46 AM
It is an unpadded carpet in a completely finished basement. It has been wet since Monday. We have always been able to dry thing by using fans in the past but this is the worst we have ever had it. I guess, according to your time table, we are already screwed on mildew.

yes, we have an old dehumidifier that has been running non stop all week.

I HATE THIS HOUSE

Man you have a huge problem. I did water and fire restoration for almost 10 years. Since it has been on going for this long you are going to have severe problems with mold and mildew!
You really need to call a pro. The best would be a truck mount carpet machine because it has a lot of water lift. They will probably also have a weighted roller to help squeeze as much water out of the carpet as possible. Once they remove as much water as they can get out they will probably use Turbo fans to get the air moving. They will also have you turn on your a/c because it will help get the humidity (water in the air) out of your house. They would also put a large whole house dehumidifier in the basement with a hose that should go outside so that it will drain without shutting off or worrying about trying to keep dumping the resevoir. They should also want to apply antimicrobial to help assist in killing the mold and mildew. Since this has been going on for almost a week now you probably have wicking on the sheetrock as well as any of the 2x interior walls. So the sheetrock could need to be removed up to a seam. If you don't do these things the house will start to smell really bad and the mold and mildew will continue to spread even after the water has been removed. If this is not treated correctly you and your family WILL start having health issues because of this.
Water damage is some of the worst damage you can have. It is worse than a fire, because when the fire is out the damage is done. With water it will continue to do damage long after the water is removed.
And then once this is done you have to repair where ever or whatever is putting water in your basement.

Good Luck
You are going to need it.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 11:51 AM
Those aren't load bearing walls then.

Uh yes they are. Interior walls keep the middle of the house from sagging and pulling the exterior walls in.

I do Heat and Air now, for about 4 years and I seen new construction houses constantly. I have never seen an interior wall in a basement be anything but wood. I am not talking about some cheap homes either. I just finished a 15 mil. dollar home on the White River. The interior load bearing walls were all 2x6walls some were back to back 2x6 walls. That is arkansas state code and arkansas has stricter codes than missouri.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 12:09 PM
Uh yes they are. Interior walls keep the middle of the house from sagging and pulling the exterior walls in.

I do Heat and Air now, for about 4 years and I seen new construction houses constantly. I have never seen an interior wall in a basement be anything but wood. I am not talking about some cheap homes either. I just finished a 15 mil. dollar home on the White River. The interior load bearing walls were all 2x6walls some were back to back 2x6 walls. That is arkansas state code and arkansas has stricter codes than missouri.
Well all I can say is they build them a hell of a lot different down there then, up here the upper level(s) is/are entirely supported by the foundation and steel beams and posts. There are NEVER any load bearing wood framed walls in the basement, probably for the very reasons Crazyhorse outlined.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 12:22 PM
One comment, do NOT call your insurance company unless you are absolutely positive that you plan on filing a claim on this. By simply contacting your insurance co. they will open a file on the incident and it will be on your record and show on your CLUE report. Even if they don't pay out on it it will still show as a claim with no payout which in the end will effect your rates.

So, definitely get the damage looked at by a professional, but no need to alarm the insurance co. unless you plan to use them.

Probably some sound advice. I reccomend you call a carpet cleaning company. They usually act as a general contaractor in flood cases. In fact, most fire and water restoration companies are carpet cleaning companies. They will be able to look at what you got and tell you what you need to do. But to be honest, if it's been wet a week, you have a 99% chance of having a big problem on your hands.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 12:32 PM
Uh yes they are. Interior walls keep the middle of the house from sagging and pulling the exterior walls in.

I do Heat and Air now, for about 4 years and I seen new construction houses constantly. I have never seen an interior wall in a basement be anything but wood. I am not talking about some cheap homes either. I just finished a 15 mil. dollar home on the White River. The interior load bearing walls were all 2x6walls some were back to back 2x6 walls. That is arkansas state code and arkansas has stricter codes than missouri.

In the case of a home that was build without a finished basement, they will have support poles and usually a steel beam that will run the length of the house. Often times a basement will just be open. these basements are sometimes "finished" after the home is built. In that case there would be no load bearing wall.

In the home you were refering to, it's one where the builder is basically building a 2 story with one underground. No basement, or maybe a half basement. In this case thet can get away with wood on the framed side. But on the large open side they would have to use steel to support the weight.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 12:38 PM
Well all I can say is they build them a hell of a lot different down there then, up here the upper level(s) is/are entirely supported by the foundation and steel beams and posts. There are NEVER any load bearing wood framed walls in the basement, probably for the very reasons Crazyhorse outlined.

Well then that is not a finished basement and steel is very ugly in a home.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 12:49 PM
In the case of a home that was build without a finished basement, they will have support poles and usually a steel beam that will run the length of the house. Often times a basement will just be open. these basements are sometimes "finished" after the home is built. In that case there would be no load bearing wall.

In the home you were refering to, it's one where the builder is basically building a 2 story with one underground. No basement, or maybe a half basement. In this case thet can get away with wood on the framed side. But on the large open side they would have to use steel to support the weight.

Yes but we are talking about a finished basement. Although I have never seen a finished basement house will steel poles in it I guess that doesn't mean you can't do it, but if you finish a basement that steel will be removed and replaced with wood walls or at least rapped in wood so that you can finish it.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 12:53 PM
Yes but we are talking about a finished basement. Although I have never seen a finished basement house will steel poles in it I guess that doesn't mean you can't do it, but if you finish a basement that steel will be removed and replaced with wood walls or at least rapped in wood so that you can finish it.

There you go.

From what I understand the basement os a finished basement.

Back in the day, when I was building homes, many of our basements would have the steel. Then we would build the wood walls right under the steel beam. Then we would just run our drywall right up to the floor joist. You'd never know there was any steel.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 12:55 PM
Well then that is not a finished basement and steel is very ugly in a home.
Well so are concrete walls and floors, but all that gets covered up if the basement gets finished. The vast majority of new homes here are built without finished basements, and even if they are finished when the house is built they still build them the same way with no load bearing walls in the basement.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 12:59 PM
There you go.

From what I understand the basement os a finished basement.

Back in the day, when I was building homes, many of our basements would have the steel. Then we would build the wood walls right under the steel beam. Then we would just run our drywall right up to the floor joist. You'd never know there was any steel.
Bingo, that steelwork is always there, you just can't see it.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 01:27 PM
There you go.

From what I understand the basement os a finished basement.

Back in the day, when I was building homes, many of our basements would have the steel. Then we would build the wood walls right under the steel beam. Then we would just run our drywall right up to the floor joist. You'd never know there was any steel.

Yeah steel beams would not be seen because they are from one side of the foundation to the other side. Just like anything else there will only be so far you can span that beam or the beam would have to be so big that it becomes restrictive. So then you have to support it from below and that is the steel posts that would have to either be removed and replaced with a wall or at least wrapped and covered with wood to be finished.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 01:34 PM
Well so are concrete walls and floors, but all that gets covered up if the basement gets finished. The vast majority of new homes here are built without finished basements, and even if they are finished when the house is built they still build them the same way with no load bearing walls in the basement.

Yeah concrete walls are ugly that is why they generally put 2x on those walls and then rock over that so that it is not seen. Just the same if they leave the posts. They still have to put something around those posts. A person could use the metal c-type aluminum studs and then put rock on it but either way through any of this the bottum line is that if you finish a basement you are still going to have materials that can and will set up mold and mildew.

And if a person wants to go all the way. If you leave moisture in the air the floor joist will get mold and mildew growing on them just from it being in the air.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 01:38 PM
Yeah steel beams would not be seen because they are from one side of the foundation to the other side. Just like anything else there will only be so far you can span that beam or the beam would have to be so big that it becomes restrictive. So then you have to support it from below and that is the steel posts that would have to either be removed and replaced with a wall or at least wrapped and covered with wood to be finished.

IIRC the poles were called pole jacks. they could be adjusted for height. If you put them on 8' centers you could use poles that were 3.5 inches. So they could be hiden inside the wall as easily as a 2X4.

If you needed a wider opening in your wall than 8' then you had to use biger poles, or have a wrapped pole somewhere in the middle of your opening. Keep in mind, it's been over 20 years since I did any building. So my memory + buiding code changes could have changed since then.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 01:43 PM
Why have a "basement" if you are not going to finish it?

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 01:43 PM
IIRC the poles were called pole jacks. they could be adjusted for height. If you put them on 8' centers you could use poles that were 3.5 inches. So they could be hiden inside the wall as easily as a 2X4.

If you needed a wider opening in your wall than 8' then you had to use biger poles, or have a wrapped pole somewhere in the middle of your opening. Keep in mind, it's been over 20 years since I did any building. So my memory + buiding code changes could have changed since then.

Yeah Pole Jacks are what I always hear them called.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 01:45 PM
Yeah concrete walls are ugly that is why they generally put 2x on those walls and then rock over that so that it is not seen. Just the same if they leave the posts. They still have to put something around those posts. A person could use the metal c-type aluminum studs and then put rock on it but either way through any of this the bottum line is that if you finish a basement you are still going to have materials that can and will set up mold and mildew.

And if a person wants to go all the way. If you leave moisture in the air the floor joist will get mold and mildew growing on them just from it being in the air.
All true, my original point was just that the water shouldn't be able to compromise the structural integrity of the house.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 01:47 PM
Why have a "basement" if you are not going to finish it?

The storage would be cool.

Plus, it makes for a nice storm shelter.

But if I had my way, it would be 50/50

I've seen a lot of cool game rooms and gyms in a basement where you have the room to do it.

Oh yeah....great place for a pool table.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 01:49 PM
Why have a "basement" if you are not going to finish it?
There's lots of reasons to have one, storage, furnace and water heater and other utilities, a place where kids can roughhouse and not **** anything up, hobbies, workshop etc etc.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 01:55 PM
All true, my original point was just that the water shouldn't be able to compromise the structural integrity of the house.

You should understand though, intil a person gets this problem under control, that mold is airborn. Just like CRU said, it can not only get on the floor joist (if exposed) but can get in your air duct, or travel upstairs to the top floor. If it stinks up there, then the mildew is there.

Call a fire and water resto guy have him come out, give an estimate and decide whether to do it yourself, or turn it into the insurance company. It's very important. This is probaly not the time to "fly by the seat of your pants", and hand it over to someone that knows where to look for problem issues.

Guru
05-02-2009, 01:55 PM
Jesus Christ thanks for the great thoughts crazy horse. No good news from you at all. It is so doom and gloom I don't know how much of it to even listen to.

First, I don't have sheetrock. It was all done in paneling. UGLY as hell.

Second, It has one load bearing wall right through the center. I have no idea if it is made of wood or has a steel beam because I cannot see it.

Third, I have contacted emergency restoration companies and none of them want to mess with it because more rain is on the way. They don't seem as concerned about this as you seem to be.

Fourth, I have contacted foundation companies and nobody can come out until Late May to early June. So I guess I am just fucked according to your scenario.

RJ
05-02-2009, 01:57 PM
I miss basements. Very few homes in New Mexico have them. I'm told that digging them here is cost prohibitive.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 02:01 PM
You should understand though, intil a person gets this problem under control, that mold is airborn. Just like CRU said, it can not only get on the floor joist (if exposed) but can get in your air duct, or travel upstairs to the top floor. If it stinks up there, then the mildew is there.
Oh, I understand that. I've done plenty of restoration work over the years, once you let mold get a foothold in your house it will never completely go away. The cancer analogy was very fitting.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 02:05 PM
Jesus Christ thanks for the great thoughts crazy horse. No good news from you at all. It is so doom and gloom I don't know how much of it to even listen to.

First, I don't have sheetrock. It was all done in paneling. UGLY as hell.

Second, It has one load bearing wall right through the center. I have no idea if it is made of wood or has a steel beam because I cannot see it.

Third, I have contacted emergency restoration companies and none of them want to mess with it because more rain is on the way. They don't seem as concerned about this as you seem to be.

Fourth, I have contacted foundation companies and nobody can come out until Late May to early June. So I guess I am just ****ed according to your scenario.

Until you have the water problem fixed, there is no need to do any restoration. As long as you have a water leak, you will be running in sand trying to fight mildew.

the paneling is actually a good thing. It allows you to strip it off and look behind the wall. Even treat it if needed. Then (if you were careful) rehang your paneling.

Once you get the place dried out, rent an big air purifier. That will kill the mold and mildew. But if you have an existing leak, you will be right back in the same boat next time it rains. So you better get good at drying that place out in 2 days or less.

The advice I was giving you was dependent on fixing the problem. Getting it behind you. Of course the #1 task to any water resto......get the water stopped for good.

Sorry for the bad news. Not trying to scare you. But simply giving you an education that most dont have until the house is screwed up to the point of major construction.

Sound like your just gonna be bailing and drying till May/June . Just dont throw your hands up and give up. Because this is something that can get away from ya. For now, get it dry and get it purified.

Guru
05-02-2009, 02:11 PM
Until you have the water problem fixed, there is no need to do any restoration. As long as you have a water leak, you will be running in sand trying to fight mildew.

the paneling is actually a good thing. It allows you to strip it off and look behind the wall. Even treat it if needed. Then (if you were careful) rehang your paneling.

Once you get the place dried out, rent an big air purifier. That will kill the mold and mildew. But if you have an existing leak, you will be right back in the same boat next time it rains. So you better get good at drting that place out in 2 days or less.

The advice I was giving you was dependent on fixing the problem. Getting it behind you. Of course the #1 task to any water resto......get the water stopped for good.

Sorry for the bad news. Not trying to scare you. But simply giving you an education that most dont have until the house is screwed up to the point of major construction.Well, congratulations. You have done nothing BUT scare the shit out of me and I am getting no options by my local businesses. I CAN'T dry it out in 2 days. Shit, in my last house when a pipe burst, a professional needed nearly 5 days to dry it out. I don't know where you are getting this 2 day business though.

Personally, you are not helping my situation at all with all the doom and gloom you are just getting me all worked up and nervous as hell and seem to enjoy it. I have told you the exact situation and who has been contacted. It isn't like I am not trying to do what I can to resolve things. I am not just sitting on my ass doing nothing.

Comanche
05-02-2009, 02:19 PM
Until you have the water problem fixed, there is no need to do any restoration. As long as you have a water leak, you will be running in sand trying to fight mildew.

the paneling is actually a good thing. It allows you to strip it off and look behind the wall. Even treat it if needed. Then (if you were careful) rehang your paneling.

Once you get the place dried out, rent an big air purifier. That will kill the mold and mildew. But if you have an existing leak, you will be right back in the same boat next time it rains. So you better get good at drting that place out in 2 days or less.

The advice I was giving you was dependent on fixing the problem. Getting it behind you. Of course the #1 task to any water resto......get the water stopped for good.

Sorry for the bad news. Not trying to scare you. But simply giving you an education that most dont have until the house is screwed up to the point of major construction.

What a lot of crap advise you have been given! I have a Hoover Steamvac and it WILL pull water AND dirt out of the carpet. I used it in a commercial building that was flooded by a stream that overflowed its banks. The Steamvac did a great job, pulling water out of the carpet pad AND the carpet. Open a window if you have one in your basement. If you don't have a window, use fans after the Steamvac. The Hoover Steamvac works with many other carpet cleaning situations as well. These guys will have you rebuilding your house before its all said and done. If you just want to spend TONS of money on your house then follow the other advise you have been given. Otherwise, a Hoover Steamvac is the ticket.

It sounds to me that you may have a drainage problem OUTSIDE your house that is pushing water toward your foundation. You may want to check your outside drainage as well. Make sure the fill slopes away from the foundation. If it doesn't, you may want to build it up some.

Guru
05-02-2009, 02:25 PM
What a lot of crap advise you have been given! I have a Hoover Steamvac and it WILL pull water AND dirt out of the carpet. I used it in a commercial building that was flooded by a stream that overflowed its banks. The Steamvac did a great job, pulling water out of the carpet pad AND the carpet. Open a window if you have one in your basement. If you don't have a window, use fans after the Steamvac. The Hoover Steamvac works with many other carpet cleaning situations as well. These guys will have you rebuilding your house before its all said and done. If you just want to spend TONS of money on your house then follow the other advise you have been given. Otherwise, a Hoover Steamvac is the ticket.

It sounds to me that you may have a drainage problem OUTSIDE your house that is pushing water toward your foundation. You may want to check your outside drainage as well. Make sure the fill slopes away from the foundation. If it doesn't, you may want to build it up some.Yeah, that is what we are starting with. Monday a landscaper is coming out. Hopefully they will be able to start quickly. As far as the basement goes, we are getting to the point that we may have to give up and just pull the carpet. That option stinks though. Literally. This isn't the kind of emergency that our emergency fund was set up for.

Doesn't help that we have a ton of stuff in our basement so getting the carpet out will be a ton of work with no help.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 02:30 PM
What a lot of crap advise you have been given! I have a Hoover Steamvac and it WILL pull water AND dirt out of the carpet. I used it in a commercial building that was flooded by a stream that overflowed its banks. The Steamvac did a great job, pulling water out of the carpet pad AND the carpet. Open a window if you have one in your basement. If you don't have a window, use fans after the Steamvac. The Hoover Steamvac works with many other carpet cleaning situations as well. These guys will have you rebuilding your house before its all said and done. If you just want to spend TONS of money on your house then follow the other advise you have been given. Otherwise, a Hoover Steamvac is the ticket.

It sounds to me that you may have a drainage problem OUTSIDE your house that is pushing water toward your foundation. You may want to check your outside drainage as well. Make sure the fill slopes away from the foundation. If it doesn't, you may want to build it up some.

Yeah, maybe I should get me one of them $100 hoovers. Spending all this money and time on education as well as real world experience has been a waste of time.

Never said the hoover steam vac didn't suck water. But it is a weak piece of crap that might suck a couple gallons of water out of a carpet. It also doesn't have the same water lift as a wet dry vac. Which I reccommended earlier.

Folks like you are the ones that give thier great advice from thier one experience and tell others how it's done in every sitiuation. If you really want to help, take a few seconds....admit to yourself that you dont know shit....then try not to but into a situation where your advice might cost someone something.

Your advice on this issue is not complete enough to risk ****ing up someone elses stuff.

I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm simply sharing my 15 years experience in the field for free. The advice is his for the taking. But please dont say that I have some motive to cost him a bunch of money.

I'm trying to show the guy how not to let it turn into a bigger problem than he has.

One thing I know for sure, anyone coming in here pumping up a Hoover, should stay out of the water damage business.

FTR, Consumer reports did a study on your steam vac. Says it removes less than 15% of the soil, the rest is forced into the pad where it cuts on the backing causing wear to increase 100%. So in essence your carpet will wear out in half the time. My process removes 92% and none goes past the backing. My resoil time is also as much as 10 times longer than yours as well.

Thats not what a professional calls, "get's dirt out".

There is more to cleaning carpet than a bucket of dirty water. that dont mean it's clean just because there is some in the bucket.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 02:35 PM
The storage would be cool.

Plus, it makes for a nice storm shelter.

But if I had my way, it would be 50/50

I've seen a lot of cool game rooms and gyms in a basement where you have the room to do it.

Oh yeah....great place for a pool table.
Other than the storm shelter and storage idea I would want mine finished although it wouldn't be necessary. Seems like a lot of money for storage, storm shelter, mechanical room.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 02:46 PM
What a lot of crap advise you have been given!


Most of the "expensive stuff" has been advice on mold restoration. Nothing a Hoover can do here. As for the water, I reccommended a wet dry vac, renting an air mover and dehumidifier to get it dry quickly, and renting an air purifier to help kill existing mold until he can get his problem fixed. The house has been wet for sevaral days. His water issue is turning into more than just opening a window. I dont know how it could be much cheaper than that advice as far as getting house dry, and getting the smell out.

Chief Roundup
05-02-2009, 02:49 PM
Well, congratulations. You have done nothing BUT scare the shit out of me and I am getting no options by my local businesses. I CAN'T dry it out in 2 days. Shit, in my last house when a pipe burst, a professional needed nearly 5 days to dry it out. I don't know where you are getting this 2 day business though.

Personally, you are not helping my situation at all with all the doom and gloom you are just getting me all worked up and nervous as hell and seem to enjoy it. I have told you the exact situation and who has been contacted. It isn't like I am not trying to do what I can to resolve things. I am not just sitting on my ass doing nothing.

Easy Guru if you are doing all you can do then you are on top of it and it will all be OK. But this is information that you need to know.
Crazy is giving you good advice. The 2 day thing is that the average gestation period for the bacteria to start turning into mildew is 48 hours.

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 02:57 PM
Well, congratulations. You have done nothing BUT scare the shit out of me and I am getting no options by my local businesses. I CAN'T dry it out in 2 days. Shit, in my last house when a pipe burst, a professional needed nearly 5 days to dry it out. I don't know where you are getting this 2 day business though.

Personally, you are not helping my situation at all with all the doom and gloom you are just getting me all worked up and nervous as hell and seem to enjoy it. I have told you the exact situation and who has been contacted. It isn't like I am not trying to do what I can to resolve things. I am not just sitting on my ass doing nothing.

Sorry man. I'll just shut up.

Like I said, in short.

Get an air mover, dehumidifier after you extract it. Then rent an air purifier.

Maybe get yourself a hoover, that'll surely get it dry in 2 days.

Just saying that 2 days is ideal becasue you can beat the mold issues. If you cant, then you cant. But mold is a big deal. So if you can keep it from starting, all the better. Good luck with it.

Sorry for the anxiety.

But rest assured, I'm not having fun trying to scare you. Just trying to help.

Guru
05-02-2009, 07:46 PM
Well, yanked all the carpet out today and down to just cement. found the three primary areas the water is coming. Now I have to determine whether or not this is somehow sump failure on the underground tracks or if it is just bad landscaping. If it is sump failure, at least I can look into insurance coverage. if it is bad landscaping I'll have to flip the entire bill myself. At least landscaping is cheaper.

As far as mold, I have to wait until later this week to have somebody that knows about that crap to determine how bad it potentially is.

Long ass day.

Oh, and to add to the IDIOTS that used to own this house dumbassery, they had the paneling going all the way to the floor. DUMBASSES

Guru
05-02-2009, 07:56 PM
Sorry man. I'll just shut up.

Like I said, in short.

Get an air mover, dehumidifier after you extract it. Then rent an air purifier.

Maybe get yourself a hoover, that'll surely get it dry in 2 days.

Just saying that 2 days is ideal becasue you can beat the mold issues. If you cant, then you cant. But mold is a big deal. So if you can keep it from starting, all the better. Good luck with it.

Sorry for the anxiety.

But rest assured, I'm not having fun trying to scare you. Just trying to help.I apologize for jumping on you like I did. I'm just extremely ticked off that I couldn't get the local pros to do jack for me. Hearing a worst case scenario just didn't help me much. At least now I can keep the two shop vacs on the areas that are still leaking. I hate knowing that my basement is rendered useless for up to two months now though.

Baconeater
05-02-2009, 09:05 PM
So can I start cracking jokes about space heaters and curtains now?

CrazyHorse
05-02-2009, 10:30 PM
I apologize for jumping on you like I did. I'm just extremely ticked off that I couldn't get the local pros to do jack for me. Hearing a worst case scenario just didn't help me much. At least now I can keep the two shop vacs on the areas that are still leaking. I hate knowing that my basement is rendered useless for up to two months now though.

Pulling the carpet was probably a good idea. It was very likey toast anyway. Like you said, now you can see what you've got.

Plus you can keep it dry enough to stay ahead of the mildew issues. You may have to run your dehumidifier to keep the air dryer while you have water in the basement. That just depends on how much it rains over the next few days.

But it sounds like you're on top of it. Your local guys there kinda have thier hands tied. Until you have your leak fixed there's not much they can do. They can come in and suck the water out, but if you still have water coming in, then all they're doing is taking your money.

You have to get the water stopped before they can do much. even if that just means waiting until the rain stops long enough to get it dried up. They really cant help you right now and had they came out and told you they could help you, they would have been stealing your money.

Guru
05-02-2009, 10:59 PM
Pulling the carpet was probably a good idea. It was very likey toast anyway. Like you said, now you can see what you've got.

Plus you can keep it dry enough to stay ahead of the mildew issues. You may have to run your dehumidifier to keep the air dryer while you have water in the basement. That just depends on how much it rains over the next few days.

But it sounds like you're on top of it. Your local guys there kinda have thier hands tied. Until you have your leak fixed there's not much they can do. They can come in and suck the water out, but if you still have water coming in, then all they're doing is taking your money.

You have to get the water stopped before they can do much. even if that just means waiting until the rain stops long enough to get it dried up. They really cant help you right now and had they came out and told you they could help you, they would have been stealing your money.It wouldn't be so bad if the foundation pros didn't require me to wait a month just for them to come and look at the damn thing. Thats not to do the work but just to look at it. thats nuts.