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View Full Version : Movies and TV Who knew?!... Major Charles Emmerson Winchester is gay.


Frankie
05-06-2009, 12:05 PM
M*A*S*H Star Ogden Stiers Comes Out

6 May 2009 5:15 AM, PDT

http://content8.flixster.com/question/57/04/81/5704814_std.jpg

M*A*S*H star David Ogden Stiers has come out as gay - after years of fearing he would be denied roles because of his sexuality.

The actor first tasted fame as Major Charles Winchester on the hit TV comedy before finding steady work as a voice actor in several Disney projects, including Beauty And The Beast and Pocahontas.

But throughout his career, he was warned he risked losing work if he came out as a gay man.

He tells the Gossip Boy blog, "From the late 1980s until about seven or eight years ago, you would find certain individuals coming up to you, me, and advocating the position that since we were doing family fare that it would be best were the actors to maintain a certain palatability to parents.

"These parties likely had heard rumors or harbored suspicions about me and wanted to make sure no embarrassing incidents were forthcoming."

But he insists his reasons for coming out now, at the age of 66, have nothing to do with his profession - he wants to find a life partner.

Stiers adds: "I could claim noble reasons as coming out in order to move gay rights forward, but I must admit it is for far more selfish reasons. Now is the time I wish to find someone and I do not desire to force any potential partner to live a life of extreme discretion for me."

http://www.imdb.com/news/ns0000002/#ni0773478

Boon
05-06-2009, 12:07 PM
This is shocking news.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 12:10 PM
This is shocking news.

Why shocking. Who knew Perry Mason/Ironside was gay?

gblowfish
05-06-2009, 12:10 PM
So, I guess he wants to find another BJ?

Iowanian
05-06-2009, 12:11 PM
I knew it when he folded his hankies and danced alone while he listened to classical music while Hawkeye was making rice whiskey.

Otter
05-06-2009, 12:12 PM
My gaydar is weak, I seen him as an elitist but gay? Nope, didn't see that one coming. Who was the guy with the big nose that dressed in woman's clothing? Maybe he was the stealth to Charles Winchesters gayday signature.

T-post Tom
05-06-2009, 12:14 PM
If all those years of working with Jamie Farr in drag doesn't scare you straight, then nothing will. ;)

T-post Tom
05-06-2009, 12:15 PM
Why shocking. Who new Perry Mason/Ironside was gay?

The guy sucking his wanker.

gblowfish
05-06-2009, 12:18 PM
Charles Emerson Winchester:
The Republican Barney Frank!

Rain Man
05-06-2009, 12:19 PM
If he had revealed it, Colonel Potter would have sent him home per Army policy. This is a major plot flaw.

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:23 PM
I've never seen MASH, but didn't he play John Cusack's father in Better Off Dead?

T-post Tom
05-06-2009, 12:26 PM
If he had revealed it, Colonel Potter would have sent him home per Army policy. This is a major plot flaw.

Klinger wasn't the best tactician. :D

vailpass
05-06-2009, 12:27 PM
So, I guess he wants to find another BJ?

:D Well played.

Redrum_69
05-06-2009, 12:28 PM
Did this guy ever get baptized?

Boon
05-06-2009, 12:28 PM
I've never seen MASH,.............

Are you serious?

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:28 PM
Are you serious?

Yes.

Boon
05-06-2009, 12:29 PM
Yes.

Wow.

Katipan
05-06-2009, 12:31 PM
Wow.

No kidding.

I have never ever ever ever ever had a boyfriend, lover, husband that would watch M*A*S*H with me. I've seen every episode too many times to count.

Boon
05-06-2009, 12:33 PM
No kidding.

I have never ever ever ever ever had a boyfriend, lover, husband that would watch M*A*S*H with me. I've seen every episode too many times to count.

It's on just about every channel.
Has been for twenty years.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 12:33 PM
I've never seen MASH,...

I would not admit to that publicly.
;)

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:34 PM
It's on just about every channel.
Has been for twenty years.

I'm not saying that I haven't had the opportunity to watch it. I've just never wanted to.

buddha
05-06-2009, 12:35 PM
It's not surprising in the least to me. Can you picture Stiers with a woman on his arm? I can't.

As for somebody who has never seen MASH before... you must have gotten a helluva deal on that cave you're living in.

Katipan
05-06-2009, 12:36 PM
I'm not saying that I haven't had the opportunity to watch it. I've just never wanted to.

The movie is better.

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:40 PM
The movie is better.

I'll take your word for it.

Katipan
05-06-2009, 12:45 PM
I'll take your word for it.

It has a football game in it!

Really, is it that the concept repulses you or is it that you are indifferent?

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:46 PM
It has a football game in it!

Really, is it that the concept repulses you or is it that you are indifferent?

Indifferent.

Katipan
05-06-2009, 12:47 PM
Indifferent.

What if I tell you there's a suicide?

C'mon. Football and suicide. Such is the life of a Chiefs fan.

Donger
05-06-2009, 12:49 PM
What if I tell you there's a suicide?

C'mon. Football and suicide. Such is the life of a Chiefs fan.

It would make no difference.

Dave Lane
05-06-2009, 01:04 PM
No kidding.

I have never ever ever ever ever had a boyfriend, lover, husband that would watch M*A*S*H with me. I've seen every episode too many times to count.

Haven't seen that many times of each but I've seen plenty. I'm in on a Mash watch night. Not quite as good as a Youtube date night. I give good youtube, or so I've been told...

Katipan
05-06-2009, 01:05 PM
Haven't seen that many times of each but I've seen plenty. I'm in on a Mash watch night. Not quite as good as a Youtube date night. I give good youtube, or so I've been told...

Wanna wife swap?

patteeu
05-06-2009, 01:20 PM
I've never seen MASH, but didn't he play John Cusack's father in Better Off Dead?

Yes, he did.

Amnorix
05-06-2009, 01:23 PM
I admit my gaydar missed on him. :shrug:

Frosty
05-06-2009, 01:49 PM
It has a football game in it!




And nudity! (though rather brief)

Rain Man
05-06-2009, 01:50 PM
He played a gay man on an episode of Frasier. I thought he was acting, but now I'm not so sure.

Frazod
05-06-2009, 02:20 PM
I'm not saying that I haven't had the opportunity to watch it. I've just never wanted to.

The first three seasons, with the original cast, are some of the best comedy ever on TV. It goes steadily downhill from there. By the time Winchester arrived it had definitely jumped the shark, yet limped on for several more painful years.

Pablo
05-06-2009, 02:23 PM
I'm not saying that I haven't had the opportunity to watch it. I've just never wanted to.I've seen plenty of MASH episodes when I was little just because my Grandpa watched them.

I can understand your indifference. I've never watched Star Wars and have absolutely no desire to do so.

patteeu
05-06-2009, 02:27 PM
I've seen plenty of MASH episodes when I was little just because my Grandpa watched them.

I can understand your indifference. I've never watched Star Wars and have absolutely no desire to do so.

David Ogden Stiers isn't the only guy copping to being gay today. :p

Boon
05-06-2009, 02:38 PM
The first three seasons, with the original cast, are some of the best comedy ever on TV. It goes steadily downhill from there. By the time Winchester arrived it had definitely jumped the shark, yet limped on for several more painful years.

Yeah. After Col. Blake and Trapper left, it went from M*A*S*H to M*U*S*H.

Frazod
05-06-2009, 02:44 PM
Yeah. After Col. Blake and Trapper left, it went from M*A*S*H to M*U*S*H.

Season 4 was okay. But after they broke up Frank and Margaret in Season 5, and every episode was pick-on-Frank-while-he's-sad-and-lonely, it started to suck. Winchester added to the suckage. And after Radar left the suckage was complete.

Boon
05-06-2009, 02:45 PM
Season 4 was okay. But after they broke up Frank and Margaret in Season 5, and every episode was pick-on-Frank-while-he's-sad-and-lonely, it started to suck. Winchester added to the suckage. And after Radar left the suckage was complete.

It lost it's burst.
Seems to be a prevalent theme.

RippedmyFlesh
05-06-2009, 02:46 PM
It would make no difference.
There are hot nurses :p

blaise
05-06-2009, 02:46 PM
Not a big Alan Alda fan. The show's ok, but I wouldn't go out of my way to watch it. In fact, I doubt Ill ever watch an episode again.

You had to know something was up with Winchester though. After Burns left, Winchester stepped in but he never made a play for Hot Lips.

Katipan
05-06-2009, 02:49 PM
... Winchester stepped in but he never made a play for Hot Lips.

They had some very sweet moments.

Frazod
05-06-2009, 02:53 PM
Not a big Alan Alda fan. The show's ok, but I wouldn't go out of my way to watch it. In fact, I doubt Ill ever watch an episode again.

You had to know something was up with Winchester though. After Burns left, Winchester stepped in but he never made a play for Hot Lips.

Alan Alda is one of main reasons I'm so obnoxious. Often when I watch old MASH episodes I'll hear Hawkeye say things that have become so engrained into my personality I don't even think about where I first heard them.

So blame him. :D

Pioli Zombie
05-06-2009, 03:17 PM
Yeah. A real shockah. Almost as much a shock as finding about Liberace and the guy from Wham. Next thing you'll know the guys from Fraser will shock us.
Posted via Mobile Device

Chief Henry
05-06-2009, 03:24 PM
Mash was must see TV with me. I loved it.

Stewie
05-06-2009, 04:38 PM
The TV show was good in the beginning but then Alan Alda slowly gained more and more control. This caused him to start menstruating and the show became unwatchable.

So, Charles is gay? His role on the show was more painful an annoying than any of his personal problems could ever be. Life-partner? Get a dog.

DeepPurple
05-06-2009, 04:39 PM
I saw Mash the movie in 1970 when it was released while I was in the Army stationed in Korea. I also use to play the theme "Suicide is Painless" in the jukebox all the time at the NCO club. However, I never saw an episode of the TV series Mash.

I attempted to watch Mash a couple of times but couldn't take Alan Alda as Hawkeye Pierce. Donald Sutherland owns that character in my mind, and I could never take more than a minute when Alda was on the screen. I wish I could of gotten into the show, I enjoyed the movie a lot, I even bought the VHS back in the 80's.

listopencil
05-06-2009, 06:41 PM
Any of you read the books? Good stuff.

listopencil
05-06-2009, 06:42 PM
Oh, and yes. I watched the show and enjoyed the first few seasons but grew to dislike it as Alan Alda drove it into the ground.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 06:48 PM
I'm not saying that I haven't had the opportunity to watch it. I've just never wanted to.

Goes against your conservative nature, heh Donger?

Frankie
05-06-2009, 06:49 PM
The movie is better.

Not IMO.

KCTitus
05-06-2009, 06:50 PM
Oh, and yes. I watched the show and enjoyed the first few seasons but grew to dislike it as Alan Alda drove it into the ground.

Alda wasnt the only one to ruin that show...by the 1980's, Linda Bloodworth Thomason was one of the producers and Mike Farrell also had something to do with the direction of the show.

There was nothing funny about the last 3 seasons. It became political grandstanding.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 06:52 PM
The first three seasons, with the original cast, are some of the best comedy ever on TV. THE best.

By the time Winchester arrived it had definitely jumped the shark, yet limped on for several more painful years.

By MASH's standards. But it was still a good show.

Mr. Kotter
05-06-2009, 06:57 PM
Duh. LMAO

His pussy-footing "gentleman's" behavior with Hotlips was a dead fugging give-away. Most of us have known he's been gay as a three-dollar bill for decades.

Uh...NTTAWWT, of course.

Rain Man
05-06-2009, 07:01 PM
Any of you read the books? Good stuff.

There are M*A*S*H books? What is their chronology relative to the movie and the TV show?


I grew up with the TV show, so the movie seemed very odd to me with different actors playing the main characters. M*A*S*H was a show I could never quite place in my hierarchy of shows. I watched it a lot and like it, but got annoyed at Alan Alda's preaching sometimes. At that age, I pretty much only wanted the comedy elements and had to tolerate the politics.

I never saw the appeal of Hot Lips, either. Maybe it was just that they were in a war zone or something.

My favorite character was probably Colonel Blake. He was delightfully goofy.

On character switchouts, I would say that...

Potter < Blake
Winchester = Burns
Honeycutt < McIntyre
(Expanded) Klinger < O'Reilly


Overall, then, I guess I'd say that the show got weaker as time went on since I generally liked the new characters less, but I didn't mind the new characters, so I still enjoyed the show.

cdcox
05-06-2009, 07:01 PM
Duh. LMAO

His pussy-footing "gentleman's" behavior with Hotlips was a dead fugging give-away. Most of us have known he's been gay as a three-dollar bill for decades.

Uh...NTTAWWT, of course.

Since he kept it a secret for so long, I guess you're slipping. ;)

Frazod
05-06-2009, 07:01 PM
THE best.

No. I would give that nob to WKRP.

By MASH's standards. But it was still a good show.

No, towards the end it sucked ass. Tired old gray-haired hippies in the 9th-10th-11th season of a show about a three year war, in a mobile hospital that never moved, making political statements people no longer cared about.

:ZZZ:

Mr. Kotter
05-06-2009, 07:05 PM
Since he kept it a secret for so long, I guess you're slipping. ;)


It wasn't a secret. He just kept it in the closet. As it should be, IMHO. :)

LaChapelle
05-06-2009, 07:40 PM
What actor isn't gay? They've had to learn to act for survival since they looked forward to taking showers after PE.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 09:33 PM
David Ogden Stiers isn't the only guy copping to being gay today. :p

:LOL: Very good.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 09:43 PM
There are M*A*S*H books? What is their chronology relative to the movie and the TV show?

The movie was based on a book. The show was loosely based on the movie. I read the book years ago and really enjoyed it. IMO it was way better than the movie. If I remember right the character Hawkeye was based on the author's experience in Korea.


Potter < Blake
Winchester < Burns
Honeycutt < McIntyre
(Expanded) Klinger < O'Reilly

FYP

Frankie
05-06-2009, 09:45 PM
I admit my gaydar missed on him. :shrug:

You have a gaydar? Don't you have to be gay to have one? :shrug:

Frazod
05-06-2009, 09:47 PM
The movie was based on a book. The show was loosely based on the movie. I read the book years ago and really enjoyed it. IMO it was way better than the movie. If I remember right the character Hawkeye was based on the author's experience in Korea.

The author of the book hated the movie - the book was just a humorous recounting of his war time experiences - Altman turned that into an anti-Vietnam message film.

Frankie
05-06-2009, 09:53 PM
MASH was a progressive tv-tabu-killing show. I wonder if the producers had even suspected DOS was in the closet. Think about all the possibilities they missed out on if they had persuaded him to play Charles as a closeted gay man too.

whoman69
05-06-2009, 10:19 PM
No wonder Reverend Gene Purdy from the Dead Zone was such a conflicted, tortured character.

Rain Man
05-06-2009, 10:39 PM
MASH was a progressive tv-tabu-killing show. I wonder if the producers had even suspected DOS was in the closet. Think about all the possibilities they missed out on if they had persuaded him to play Charles as a closeted gay man too.


Maybe they did and we just didn't pick up on it. Does anyone ever remember an episode where he was girl-chasing? Most of the time he was keeping his part of the tent tidy and listening to classical music and using words like 'droll'.

Frosty
05-07-2009, 07:48 AM
Does anyone ever remember an episode where he was girl-chasing?

Didn't he fall for one of the "working girls" in Rosie's Bar in one episode?

Katipan
05-07-2009, 07:59 AM
Maybe they did and we just didn't pick up on it. Does anyone ever remember an episode where he was girl-chasing? Most of the time he was keeping his part of the tent tidy and listening to classical music and using words like 'droll'.

Yes, actually. The man got "married" one night in Tokyo. And he and Nurse Kelly were always going to "events" together.

BigOlChiefsfan
05-07-2009, 08:50 AM
Another victim of the Radar Reacharound

blaise
05-07-2009, 08:52 AM
Radar was a real asshole, I thought. That was one of the only times I liked Alda, was when he told Radar that he was a little baby bitch.

blaise
05-07-2009, 08:53 AM
And I hated that psychiatrist, Sydney or whatever his name was.

Bwana
05-07-2009, 08:55 AM
No way! Next you'll be telling us Richard Simmons is gay.

Donger
05-07-2009, 09:18 AM
Goes against your conservative nature, heh Donger?

Judging from some of the descriptions, it doesn't sound like I missed much. But, no, since I had no idea that this show was hippy-ish, my conservative nature was not the reason I never watched it.

ping2000
05-07-2009, 09:25 AM
Alan Alda is one of main reasons I'm so obnoxious. Often when I watch old MASH episodes I'll hear Hawkeye say things that have become so engrained into my personality I don't even think about where I first heard them.

So blame him. :D

"I think it's fair to warn you my falcon will be here in five seconds." - Hawkeye to Frank Burns (Most awesome line ever)

Frankie
05-07-2009, 09:47 AM
And I hated that psychiatrist, Sydney or whatever his name was.

Are you kidding? I loved EVERY episode he was in.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 09:48 AM
Are you kidding? I loved EVERY episode he was in.

Meeeeee too. Especially the bon fire episode.

Rain Man
05-07-2009, 09:57 AM
Didn't he fall for one of the "working girls" in Rosie's Bar in one episode?

Yes, actually. The man got "married" one night in Tokyo. And he and Nurse Kelly were always going to "events" together.


Perhaps those were just clever writing ruses to show that he was attempting to pass as hetero. So the show portrayed him as a gay man who was trying to hide his sexuality.

It's a whole subplot that I never picked up on. Amazing.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 10:06 AM
And I hated that psychiatrist, Sydney or whatever his name was.

My favorite character was Col. Flagg, the intelligence officer.

http://www.nationmaster.com/wikimir/images/upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/62/Edward-winter-as-colonel-flagg-MASH.jpg

Katipan
05-07-2009, 10:08 AM
Perhaps those were just clever writing ruses to show that he was attempting to pass as hetero. So the show portrayed him as a gay man who was trying to hide his sexuality.

It's a whole subplot that I never picked up on. Amazing.

I think you just hope all rich people that listen to classical music are gay.

Why Rain Man? Do you like classical music?

Rain Man
05-07-2009, 10:09 AM
My favorite character was Col. Flagg, the intelligence officer.

http://www.nationmaster.com/wikimir/images/upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/62/Edward-winter-as-colonel-flagg-MASH.jpg


I forgot about him. Far and away the best character on the whole series.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 10:09 AM
My favorite character was Col. Flagg, the intelligence officer.

http://www.nationmaster.com/wikimir/images/upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/62/Edward-winter-as-colonel-flagg-MASH.jpg

That's awesome. We are entirely opposite people.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 10:12 AM
That's awesome. We are entirely opposite people.

You didn't find Flagg funny?

Katipan
05-07-2009, 10:48 AM
You didn't find Flagg funny?

Maybe the first time but he's like the Jackass movies or Pauly Shore.

Can only take so much.

Boon
05-07-2009, 11:03 AM
I liked Col Flagg.
The CIA guy.
Dude is a hoot

Otter
05-07-2009, 11:09 AM
I had my first crush come from the MASH Series:

It was 1984, I was 9 or 10 years old at the time. A cock eyed optimist just beginning to take notice of the differences between men and women and the strange allure they held on me.

Bell bottoms were on their way out and popped collars and poofy hair were, much like myself, on their way in. Van Halen's "Jump" Video blared on a single analog speaker contained in a 17 inch color television in the TV room.

Kevin Bacon danced his way into our hearts as a big city boy showing the reserved residents of small town anywhere that dance was something to be embraced and not feared on the big screen in his first staring role in the movie "Footloose".

It was around 4:30pm and I was waiting for father to arrive home from work while Mom finished up dinner. I was surfing channels 2 and 13 when the theme to MASH played and I first laid eyes on this brown eyed beauty. I would never look at women the same again.

Oh yes, after that life changing moment I spent many hours trying to convince my family that I was in my bedroom with the door closed practicing clapping for a special class at school.

This was a more innocent time, a time before one could photoshop her face to a well known porn star and create an animated gif or, if feeling motivated a flash movie of her spanking you or where she is at your knees while your dressed up as Al Pacino on the cover of "Scarface".

Yes folks, this young lady was the first to break otter's heart and she'll always hold a special place for me.

http://www.marcia-strassman.com/ms-mash6.jpg
(http://www.marcia-strassman.com/ms-mash6.jpg)

vailpass
05-07-2009, 11:25 AM
Maybe the first time but he's like the Jackass movies or Pauly Shore.

Can only take so much.

I can't help but love a man who thinks like this........


“You took a yellow Red before a White American, and that's pretty pinko!”

“Watched a hundred hours of The Three Stooges. Every time I felt like smiling, I jabbed myself in the stomach with a cattle prod.”

“I could kill you with one finger.”

“My father touched me that way once. To this day he still has to wear orthopedic shirts.”

“I have no home. I'm the wind.”

“We've got files on people who haven't even been born.”

“The CIA can supersede anyone's orders.”

“You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.”

“Nobody can get the truth out of me because even I don't know what it is. I keep myself in a constant state of utter confusion.”

“One guy decides he's not gonna fight anymore, it catches on, and pretty soon you know what we've got?” (BJ answers)Peace?
If it wasn’t for war, you wouldn’t know what peace was!

ping2000
05-07-2009, 11:34 AM
I had my first crush come from the MASH Series:

It was 1984, I was 9 or 10 years old at the time. A cock eyed optimist just beginning to take notice of the differences between men and women and the strange allure they held on me.

Bell bottoms were on their way out and popped collars and poofy hair were, much like myself, on their way in. Van Halen's "Jump" Video blared on a single analog speaker contained in a 17 inch color television in the TV room.

Kevin Bacon danced his way into our hearts as a big city boy showing the reserved residents of small town anywhere that dance was something to be embraced and not feared on the big screen in his first staring role in the movie "Footloose".

It was around 4:30pm and I was waiting for father to arrive home from work while Mom finished up dinner. I was surfing channels 2 and 13 when the theme to MASH played and I first laid eyes on this brown eyed beauty. I would never look at women the same again.

Oh yes, after that life changing moment I spent many hours trying to convince my family that I was in my bedroom with the door closed practicing clapping for a special class at school.

This was a more innocent time, a time before one could photoshop her face to a well known porn star and create an animated gif or, if feeling motivated a flash movie of her spanking you or where she is at your knees while your dressed up as Al Pacino on the cover of "Scarface".

Yes folks, this young lady was the first to break otter's heart and she'll always hold a special place for me.

http://www.marcia-strassman.com/ms-mash6.jpg
(http://www.marcia-strassman.com/ms-mash6.jpg)

Hey, that's "Welcome Back Kotter's" wife!

Otter
05-07-2009, 11:38 AM
Hey, that's "Welcome Back Kotter's" wife!

Indeed, but much hotter at the time for some reason. I think it's the hair and she didn't wear glasses on MASH.

Frazod
05-07-2009, 11:45 AM
Indeed, but much hotter at the time for some reason. I think it's the hair and she didn't wear glasses on MASH.

Exactly. She was hot as hell (great eyes).

Of course, she pales by comparison to the movie Lt. Dish (Jo Ann Pflug).

Thig Lyfe
05-07-2009, 11:53 AM
Stuff like this is just another reason homosexuality is not and never has been a choice. Why would you willingly choose to be something that you feel the need to cover up for decade after decade? Wouldn't it be easier to just not choose that lifestyle?

It's amazing to me that there are still people who believe homosexuality is anything but a biological phenomenon with an extreme and unwarranted social stigma.

Donger
05-07-2009, 11:57 AM
Priscilla Barnes.... Yummy.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 12:12 PM
Priscilla Barnes.... Yummy.

Maybe so, but Nurse Cutler was played by Marcia Strassman.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 12:14 PM
Stuff like this is just another reason homosexuality is not and never has been a choice. Why would you willingly choose to be something that you feel the need to cover up for decade after decade? Wouldn't it be easier to just not choose that lifestyle?

It's amazing to me that there are still people who believe homosexuality is anything but a biological phenomenon with an extreme and unwarranted social stigma.

People in Hollywood cover up the fact that they are politically conservative for the same reasons, but that doesn't mean that conservatism is biological.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 12:38 PM
We certainly wouldn't have a thread about "OMG CHARLES IS A CONSERVATIVE"

Baby Lee
05-07-2009, 12:42 PM
Stuff like this is just another reason homosexuality is not and never has been a choice. Why would you willingly choose to be something that you feel the need to cover up for decade after decade? Wouldn't it be easier to just not choose that lifestyle?

It's amazing to me that there are still people who believe homosexuality is anything but a biological phenomenon with an extreme and unwarranted social stigma.

Eliot Spitzer and John Edwards are loving you right about now. ;)

FTR, I'm not saying that homosexuality, or adultery or occasioning hookers or substance abuse or any of the other myriad acts that can deliver both pleasure and pain, are or are not choices, just that the evidence of pain occasioned is not proof of the absence of choice.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 12:52 PM
We certainly wouldn't have a thread about "OMG CHARLES IS A CONSERVATIVE"

Probably not, but you might hear something like that at a Hollywood cocktail party, which is more relevant to my point.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 12:53 PM
FTR, I'm not saying that homosexuality, or adultery or occasioning hookers or substance abuse or any of the other myriad acts that can deliver both pleasure and pain, are or are not choices, just that the evidence of pain occasioned is not proof of the absence of choice.

Same.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 12:54 PM
Probably not, but you might hear something like that at a Hollywood cocktail party, which is more relevant to my point.

I think it's far easier to be a conservative than a homosexual.

Baby Lee
05-07-2009, 12:58 PM
I think it's far easier to be a conservative than a homosexual.

In Alabama or Hollywood? Or both?

Katipan
05-07-2009, 01:02 PM
In Alabama or Hollywood? Or both?

Everywhere.

I know that when I see someone I'm attracted to there is a visceral reaction. I do not control it. I don't look for it. I don't actively want it. It just is.

Being a financial conservative and a social liberal took years of brainwashing and choice.

Baby Lee
05-07-2009, 01:07 PM
I know that when I see someone I'm attracted to there is a visceral reaction. I do not control it. I don't look for it. I don't actively want it. It just is.
Sorry about that in advance. ;)

Being a financial conservative and a social liberal took years of brainwashing and choice.

Not sure I follow, if one thing just happens and the other takes brainwashing and volition, why is the latter easier?

patteeu
05-07-2009, 01:09 PM
Everywhere.

I know that when I see someone I'm attracted to there is a visceral reaction. I do not control it. I don't look for it. I don't actively want it. It just is.

Being a financial conservative and a social liberal took years of brainwashing and choice.

You seem to have decided what you want the answer to be and feel the need to defend a bad argument (SportsRacer's) that leads to that answer.

Besides, you can't be a financial conservative and a social liberal if we are entirely opposite people.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 01:09 PM
Sorry about that in advance. ;)

Thank God girls can hide it easier than boys. Snail trails are easily wiped away if you drag your ass off the chair as you're standing up.

Frankie
05-07-2009, 01:13 PM
Being a financial conservative and a social liberal took years of brainwashing and choice.

Actually I recall reading a study that suggested that people are born liberal or Conservative. They are just wired differently.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 01:17 PM
You seem to have decided what you want the answer to be and feel the need to defend a bad argument (SportsRacer's) that leads to that answer.

poop. SportsRacer can defend his own ass.

I did make the concious choice to believe that homos have it worse than conservos. Without the hatred the right feels for the left or the utter disrespect the left feels for the right, the moderates would win and they're too wishy washy for me.

I guess it amounts to having to work way harder to hide being homosexual than to hide being conservative. I don't think I believe people would go through such lengths if they didn't have to.

Besides, you can't be a financial conservative and a social liberal if we are entirely opposite people.

I'm scared.

Katipan
05-07-2009, 01:23 PM
Actually I recall reading a study that suggested that people are born liberal or Conservative. They are just wired differently.

Is that the homo gene mutated?

Katipan
05-07-2009, 01:24 PM
Sorry about that in advance. ;)



Not sure I follow, if one thing just happens and the other takes brainwashing and volition, why is the latter easier?

Because I get to choose it.

patteeu
05-07-2009, 01:39 PM
poop. SportsRacer can defend his own ass.

I did make the concious choice to believe that homos have it worse than conservos. Without the hatred the right feels for the left or the utter disrespect the left feels for the right, the moderates would win and they're too wishy washy for me.

I guess it amounts to having to work way harder to hide being homosexual than to hide being conservative. I don't think I believe people would go through such lengths if they didn't have to.

A lot of "homos" don't bother hiding it and do just fine. Especially in Hollywood. I'd agree that it's generally easier to be an open "conservo" in most places though.

I'm scared.

I don't know why that would be.

Donger
05-07-2009, 01:52 PM
I had no idea Priscilla Barne's had posed nude, let alone with such stunning frequency. God Bless The Internet.

Otter
05-07-2009, 02:10 PM
Not sure I follow, if one thing just happens and the other takes brainwashing and volition, why is the latter easier?

Anyone else have to look the meaning of that word up?

Donger
05-07-2009, 02:10 PM
Anyone else have to look the meaning of that word up?

No.

Otter
05-07-2009, 02:21 PM
No.

How can you be sure? There's 244 people viewing the forum.

Donger
05-07-2009, 02:22 PM
How can you be sure? There's 244 people viewing the forum.

I wasn't answering for anyone else.

Frankie
05-07-2009, 02:36 PM
I had no idea Priscilla Barne's had posed nude, let alone with such stunning frequency. God Bless The Internet.

And Photoshop.

listopencil
05-07-2009, 06:19 PM
By the way- these are the books I was talking about. There are a lot of them.

http://www.mash4077.co.uk/novels.html