Why Barack Obama represents American Catholics better than the pope does.

[petegz28]

http://www.newsweek.com/id/205961

Tomorrow Pope Benedict XVI and President Barack Obama meet for the first time, an affair much anticipated and in some circles frowned upon by American Catholics in the wake of Obama's controversial Notre Dame commencement speech in May. Conservatives in the church denounced Obama's appearance as a nod by the premier Catholic university to a conciliatory politics that heralds the start of a slippery moral slope.

In truth, though, Obama's pragmatic approach to divisive policy (his notion that we should acknowledge the good faith underlying opposing viewpoints) and his social-justice agenda reflect the views of American Catholic laity much more closely than those vocal bishops and pro-life activists. When Obama meets the pope tomorrow, they'll politely disagree about reproductive freedoms and homosexuality, but Catholics back home won't care, because they know Obama's on their side. In fact, Obama's agenda is closer to their views than even the pope's.

It's fitting that Obama's visit comes just days after the publication of "Charity in Truth," a Vatican encyclical that declares unions, regulation of capitalism's excesses, and environmentalism to be ethical imperatives. The document gives moral credence to Obama's message and to progressive politics writ large.

Even more intriguing is the pope's support for political activism, which he refers to in the encyclical as "the institutional path … of charity, no less excellent and effective than the kind of charity which encounters the neighbor directly." As a member of a family that preached that politics is an honorable profession, I see that he is opening the church to roles that for too long have been neglected. Here Obama (the community organizer from Chicago) could teach the pope a lot about politics—and what a Catholic approach to politics could entail. They agree, too, on poverty and Middle East peace. So far so good on papal-presidential concordance.

But there they part ways. Politics requires the ability to listen to different points of view, to step into others' shoes. Obama might call it empathy. While the pope preaches love, listening to the other has been a particular stumbling block for the Catholic hierarchy (as it is for many in power). The hierarchy ignores women's equality and gays' cry for justice because to heed them would require that it admit error and acknowledge that the self-satisfied edifice constructed around sex and gender has been grievously wrong. Before he became John Paul II, Karol Wojtyla had a telling all-or-nothing formulation: "If it should be decided that contraception is not an evil in itself then we should have to concede frankly that the Holy Spirit is on the side of the Protestant Churches."

That attitude has resulted in some heinous decisions. Most famously, in the lead up to the encyclical "Humanae Vitae" in 1968, an advisory body of theologians and laity empaneled by the pope advised that the church should reverse its position on birth control and concede that the issue should be a question for morality and for science. But authority—not truth, not love—prevailed: Pope Paul VI, listening to the advice of Wojtyla, disagreed with the majority of these advisers, who had voted 69 to 10 for change, fretting that to change this position would weaken his authority.

In the same vein, American bishops in the 1970s struggled to produce a paper that would address the concerns of women. After nine years of effort, they gave up. Why? According to Bishop P. Francis Murphy, bishops see themselves as "teachers, not learners: truth can not emerge through consultation." Pope Benedict, having lived in the safety and security of the Vatican for much of his professional life, is part of this culture that silences dissent. (His last job was as the enforcer of doctrine.)

In 1979, Sister Theresa Kane, the head of the Sisters of Mercy and the president of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious, greeted Pope John Paul II on his first visit to the United States by proposing that the Church provide "for the possibility of women as persons being included in all ministries of our Church," including the priesthood. This was greeted with revulsion at the Vatican, which insists that the only people who can represent God in the priestly role are those with male sex organs.

Yet polls bear out that American Catholics do not want to be told by the Vatican how to think. Despite the rhetoric of love and truth, the Vatican shows disdain (if not disgust) toward gays. But 54 percent of American Catholics find gay relationships to be morally acceptable, according to a 2009 Gallup poll. Meanwhile, against all scientific evidence and protestations from clergy on the ground, the pope claims that condoms aggravate the spread of AIDS. Seventy-nine percent of American Catholics disagree, according to a 2007 poll by Catholics for Choice.

When Sen. John Kerry, a pro-choice Catholic, ran for president in 2004, several bishops decided to deny him communion. A poll done at the time by Time magazine showed that 73 percent of American Catholics disagreed with that decision, and 83 percent said the bishops' move wouldn't change their vote. In fact, more than two thirds said the church shouldn't try to influence the way Catholics vote at all or tell candidates—even Catholic ones—what stance to take.

For Obama, respectful disagreement and a willingness to recognize differences was the animating spirit of the presidential campaign, and it was central to his Notre Dame speech. That is the kind of politics many Catholics practice. They're tired of watching the church grasp frantically for control at the expense of truth and love. In America last November, it showed: 54 percent of Catholics voted for Obama.

Notre Dame awarded the president an honorary degree because it saw the need to highlight the best of Catholic teaching as applied to politics: the ability to open the eyes of those who would prefer to keep them closed, and to open the hearts of those who would prefer not to know the pain that their actions cause. The pope has a lot to learn about Catholic politics in America. Barack Obama can teach him.

Kathleen Kennedy Townsend, the former lieutenant governor of Maryland, is author of Failing America's Faithful: How Today's Churches Are Mixing God With Politics and Losing Their Way.

© 2009


This is a joke, right?

[petegz28]

Of course, then again, as I have said several times....several catholics want to be catholic, but not really.

[orange]

If you liked that one, you'll love this one:


All Good Things
Even at the Vatican, they love Obama.

By Michael Sean Winters | Newsweek Web Exclusive
Jul 9, 2009 | Updated: 2:42 p.m. ET Jul 9, 2009

In the weeks leading up to President Obama's May appearance at the University of Notre Dame, almost 80 AmericanCatholic bishops, in response to his pro-choice stance on abortion, voiced their disapproval of the honorary degree being bestowed upon him. If the bishops of Obama's own electorate were that harsh, you'd expect the Curia at the Vatican, the church bedrock where the president will meet Pope Benedict XVI tomorrow, to distance themselves from him furiously.

That expectation would be wrong. President Obama is much more popular at the Vatican than he is with the most vocal American bishops. American monsignori in Vatican City "are all Fox News, Bush-loving Republicans," a Vatican reporter told me on the condition that I not use his name and harm his access. "The Italians, however, are another story. They love Obama." Indeed, most Vatican officials are just as excited to meet the new president as their secular counterparts have been elsewhere in Europe.

One reason church officials swoon for the president like their counterparts across European capitals is that the Monsignori often come from the same families as those who work in high civil-government offices. They consult the same magazines and newspapers. They attend the same boarding schools and universities. They even vacation at the same resorts. The view from Rome and the view from Brussels are similar on most issues of international importance.

These familial and intellectual connections are usually opaque to outsiders, but now and then an event highlights the bonds. The 2005 funeral of an Italian intelligence officer killed in Iraq was presided over by a high-ranking and long-serving Vatican official, Msgr. Maurizio Calipari. The spy was named Nicola Calipari, and the monsignor was his brother. Nicola was mistakenly shot by an American, which simultaneously amplified the hostility Europeans felt toward the American invasion and confirmed for the Curia their suspicion of force—a sentiment dating back as far as the fifth-century writings of St. Augustine, whose just-war theory bars aggression and "preventive" war. Benedict is a longtime and serious scholar of Augustine's writings.

Obama's cosmopolitanism is a source of derision on Fox News, but Europeans, whose nationalisms caused a century of upheaval, have gone so far as to exchange their state currencies for the euro. For the Catholic Church, which is older than the nations and has a longstanding commitment to transnational organizations (reaffirmed this week in Benedict's encyclical Caritas in Veritate), Obama's rejection of unilateralism is a source of optimism.

The Vatican is also relieved by Obama's pragmatic stance toward Latin America—even where lefty pols, such as those in Venezuela and Cuba, scorn America. The Vatican's secretary of state, Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, is a Salesian, an order of priests deeply involved in the continent. Bertone oversees the Vatican daily newspaper L'Osservatore Romano, whose favorable coverage of Obama some American Catholics have criticized. The newspaper even applauded his speech at Notre Dame. The Vatican has a broader vision and a wider set of concerns than, say, the Archbishop of Denver.

What about abortion? Of course, the pope and curial officials oppose abortion as much as the American bishops. But in Europe, where the culture is far more secular, there is simply no hope for overturning liberal abortion laws, and the clergy have reconciled themselves to that fact.

Obama and Benedict have wildly different intellectual backgrounds, and although both are "world leaders," the nature of their jobs could scarcely be more different. Obama is smart about things that do not concern the pontiff, and Benedict is wise about things unfamiliar to a liberal Protestant like the president. They will find points of policy agreement in terms of searching for peace in the Mideast, increasing aid to the Third World, and promoting environmentalism. But while it's true they'll never agree about reproductive freedom, the pope will greet Obama warmly and smile at his children. Behind him, bishops and cardinals will be jockeying for a chance to shake the president's hand. And back home in America, those conservative Catholics who have been spewing vitriol at Obama will really be gnashing their teeth.

© 2009

http://www.newsweek.com/id/205921?tid=relatedcl

[irishjayhawk]

I can't believe countries actually have an ambassador to the Vatican. What a waste.

[Saul Good]

Better than the Pope? Try better than Jesus. Obama can walk on water. Jesus hasn't been able to do that ever since he got those holes through his feet.

[WilliamTheIrish]

This is a joke, right?

Good article Pete. And a very nice follow up discussion.

[WilliamTheIrish]

I found that article to be spot on. The CC is just a money machine in my opinion. They used to just want your soul and have families that had a bunch of kids so they could have their souls.
Then they discovered they could exchange souls for a bigger piece of the tithe pie. They weren't as concerned about souls after that.

[Jenson71]

A lot of the article is well-known and obvious. I think the conclusion is correct for the most part. Unfortunately. Our country's party system is much more prominent than a foreign-speaking, foreign-living organization head. We are bombarded with Democrats and Republicans when we watch the news, read the papers and magazines, listen to talk radio. More people, including Catholics, vote in the election than go to church regularly I'm sure, and more people would glance over headlines on the internet than actually sit down and read a Papal Encyclical.

[blaise]

I found that article to be spot on. The CC is just a money machine in my opinion. They used to just want your soul and have families that had a bunch of kids so they could have their souls.
Then they discovered they could exchange souls for a bigger piece of the tithe pie. They weren't as concerned about souls after that.

Yeah, it's too bad they don't spend any of that money on charitable work. They just buy stained glass windows while other groups feed the homeless and stuff.

[BucEyedPea]

Did the Pope talk about partial birth abortion with Obama too?
Or just how to steal other people's money—but do it legally of course— as part of it's social doctrine.
And they must have really had a grand ole time whooping it up about World Govt.

[blaise]

I can't believe countries actually have an ambassador to the Vatican. What a waste.

I agree. There's only like 400 Catholics in the whole world, so why bother? With the money they spend on this Obama could have another date night.

[Jenson71]

Partial birth? I don't know. The Pope asked Obama to promise he would work to lower abortions and he also gave Obama a copy of Dignitas personae.

Of course, the Pope noted that the government should not impede on the freedom of choice in deciding what to do with your body, especially when there is a free market solution that can help. These are the mere cute suggestions of an old, out of touch priest for people to smile at and dismiss.

[HonestChieffan]

I can't believe countries actually have an ambassador to the Vatican. What a waste.

why?

[HonestChieffan]

Of course, the Pope noted that the government should not impede on the freedom of choice in deciding what to do with your body,

I bet that was never said

[Jenson71]

I bet that was never said

You would be right. BucEyedPea is doing a nice ethics check on the Pope.

[Jenson71]

I can't believe countries actually have an ambassador to the Vatican. What a waste.

It is common for countries to have formal diplomatic relations with other countries.

[HonestChieffan]

You would be right. BucEyedPea is doing a nice ethics check on the Pope.

Like the Pope needs an ethics check.

[Elwaysux]

The main stream media loves to report how 54% of Catholics voted for Obama. The problem with the Catholic church is that they are not vocal enough about voting in alignment with your faith. The primary guiding evil to vote against is anyone harming the innocent so any Catholic voting for a pro abortion candidate needs to reevaluate calling themselves Catholic. You cannot be pro abortion and Catholic.

[Jenson71]

The main stream media loves to report how 54% of Catholics voted for Obama. The problem with the Catholic church is that they are not vocal enough about voting in alignment with your faith. The primary guiding evil to vote against is anyone harming the innocent so any Catholic voting for a pro abortion candidate needs to reevaluate calling themselves Catholic. You cannot be pro abortion and Catholic.

I think there are vocal Bishops and priests that speak out, though in American Catholic tradition, never in favor of somene specifically in an election.

The problem for these Bishops and priests are that Bishops and priests are no longer as respected as they were in an earlier age, as recent as the 1950s. Use ten homilies on the evils of abortion or some aspect of social justice. It might change the minds of a few at most.

[orange]

The main stream media loves to report how 54% of Catholics voted for Obama. The problem with the Catholic church is that they are not vocal enough about voting in alignment with your faith. The primary guiding evil to vote against is anyone harming the innocent so any Catholic voting for a pro abortion candidate needs to reevaluate calling themselves Catholic. You cannot be pro abortion and Catholic.

Someone who flaunts profanity and hatred derision as his personal trademark pronouncing on other people's moral fitness - priceless! LMAO

[HonestChieffan]

Based on what I hear from my Catholic friends you will see a more active anti Obama move and more activity in the congressional races as well. Some Catholics got fooled the first time but dont look for it to happen again.

[Brock]

Someone who flaunts profanity and hatred as his personal trademark pronouncing on other people's moral fitness - priceless! LMAO

Profanity and hatred?

[orange]

Profanity and hatred?

Sux and **** aren't profanity?

"Hatred" is too strong, I'm still fishing for the right word.

Derision. How's that?

[WilliamTheIrish]

Yeah, it's too bad they don't spend any of that money on charitable work. They just buy stained glass windows while other groups feed the homeless and stuff.

Never said the church doesn't do charitable work. But, like the Arabs do the Palestinians, it pays to keep a great deal of folks in poverty in order for the money to keep flowing.

And when you press that guilt, which the church has done wonderfully for about billion years, it keeps the coffers from getting too low.

[Jenson71]

Based on what I hear from my Catholic friends you will see a more active anti Obama move and more activity in the congressional races as well. Some Catholics got fooled the first time but dont look for it to happen again.

I think as a whole it would just ebb and flow with the rest of the population, and end up being just as evenly divided as it usually is.

[HonestChieffan]

Never ends how non Catholics can serve judgement on the Church. Same for non Methodists who are critical or non whatever who freely offer up thier version of how they see others and what others should believe or do.

[orange]

Never ends how non Catholics can serve judgement on the Church. Same for non Methodists who are critical or non whatever who freely offer up thier version of how they see others and what others should believe or do.

Did the Catholic Church renounce proseletyzing? I.e. "offering up thier version of how they see others and what others should believe or do."

[HonestChieffan]

Do you object to anyone with faith expressing their faith to others?

[Jenson71]

Never ends how non Catholics can serve judgement on the Church. Same for non Methodists who are critical or non whatever who freely offer up thier version of how they see others and what others should believe or do.

As a Catholic, I don't mind it, as long as it is based on reason, of course. A lot of the more common criticism towards the Church is unreasonable and sometimes not even based on reality.

[blaise]

Never said the church doesn't do charitable work. But, like the Arabs do the Palestinians, it pays to keep a great deal of folks in poverty in order for the money to keep flowing.

And when you press that guilt, which the church has done wonderfully for about billion years, it keeps the coffers from getting too low.

Yes, the Catholic church is keeping people impoverished. When non-religious groups give charity it's much better. People become millionaires.

[HonestChieffan]

As a Catholic, I don't mind it, as long as it is based on reason, of course. A lot of the more common criticism towards the Church is unreasonable and sometimes not even based on reality.

Those are the ones that get old after a while. A trip to Vatican City and some travel in and around Italy is eyeopening and worth the trip costs just to develop a better respect and understanding of the Catholic Church. Even for an ex-Episcopalian Methodist.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Never ends how non Catholics can serve judgement on the Church. Same for non Methodists who are critical or non whatever who freely offer up thier version of how they see others and what others should believe or do.

Who are you speaking of?

[WilliamTheIrish]

Yes, the Catholic church is keeping people impoverished. When non-religious groups give charity it's much better. People become millionaires.

Run with that.

[HonestChieffan]

Who are you speaking of?

People in general who are outspoken and critical with no basis for what they say

[WilliamTheIrish]

People in general who are outspoken and critical with no basis for what they say

Anybody specifically?

[HonestChieffan]

no, in general there are all manner of people who are critical of churches they have never been in. Its not rare.

[WilliamTheIrish]

I agree. And there are defenders of same that have never or acknowleged the damage they do.

However, I guess I'm unique in that I was raised in the CC, but fortunately was able to launch the shackles.

[BigChiefFan]

The Pope wears alot of bling.:D

[GoChiefs]

Because most American Catholics are a bunch of frauds? Hear hear.

[SHTSPRAYER]

Pravdaweek is a moonbat periodical, but go ahead and run with it, Pete.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Pravdaweek is a moonbat periodical, but go ahead and run with it, Pete.

Pravdaweek? LMAO

[BucEyedPea]

Never said the church doesn't do charitable work. But, like the Arabs do the Palestinians, it pays to keep a great deal of folks in poverty in order for the money to keep flowing.

And when you press that guilt, which the church has done wonderfully for about billion years, it keeps the coffers from getting too low.

Hmmm, I dunno. I think one reason why this Pope has latched onto the One World Govt idea under the UN Charter is because Catholism is growing and that growth is in poor countries. So the whole one world, 3rd way- socialism under the UN Charter ( just check it's Human Rights list) would lift it's own congregation up. Of course the ends doesn't justify the means ( stealing from others) so he would not really be advocating true Catholicism. So there's no need for any guilt. The thing is it would just ruin their big donors and they might find themselves unable to afford the Vatican at some point without them.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Hmmm, I dunno. I think one reason why this Pope has latched onto the One World Govt idea under the UN Charter is because Catholism is growing and that growth is in poor countries. So the whole one world, 3rd way- socialism under the UN Charter ( just check it's Human Rights list) would lift it's own congregation up. Of course the ends doesn't justify the means ( stealing from others) so he would not really be advocating true Catholicism. So there's no need for any guilt. The thing is it would just ruin their big donors and they might find themselves unable to afford the Vatican at some point without them.

To me the entire concept of the church is based on guilt. From Original Sin (because we all know, infants are inherently evil) to the Last Rites (begging to have guilt of deeds while alive expunged before being thrust in the ground.

In between, you give $ and hope that this mystical God dude doesn't thrust you to the depths of hell with the likes of Hitler.

No thanks.

[SHTSPRAYER]

I agree. And there are defenders of same that have never or acknowleged the damage they do.

However, I guess I'm unique in that I was raised in the CC, but fortunately was able to launch the shackles.

Oh brother.

:rolleyes:

What a drama queen.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Oh brother.

:rolleyes:

What a drama queen.

This post was like Booey throwing out the first pitch. Limp, and wiiiiide right.

[SHTSPRAYER]

This post was like Booey throwing out the first pitch. Limp, and wiiiiide right.

Tell me more about the "shackles", freedom fighter.

ROFL

[BucEyedPea]

To me the entire concept of the church is based on guilt. From Original Sin (because we all know, infants are inherently evil) to the Last Rites (begging to have guilt of deeds while alive expunged before being thrust in the ground.

In between, you give $ and hope that this mystical God dude doesn't thrust you to the depths of hell with the likes of Hitler.

No thanks.
I don't know who taught you your catechism but infants are not considered inherently evil. All Original Sin means is that each of us has the capacity to do wrong. That doesn't mean we do it or all the time or to great harm. What's that saying: " A church is a hospital for sinners, not a hotel for saints." It's a given that mankind falls. That means we make ethical and moral mistakes and have vices. It doesn't mean we are all evil.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Tell me more about the "shackles", freedom fighter.

ROFL

Keep tossing, Booey!

[SHTSPRAYER]

Keep tossing, Booey!

http://www.zefrank.com/theshow/gallery/d/8604-1/tiananmen-square-tanks.jpg

[WilliamTheIrish]

I don't know who taught you your catechism but infants are not considered inherently evil. All Original Sin means is that each of us has the capacity to do wrong. That doesn't mean we do it or all the time or to great harm. What's that saying: " A church is a hospital for sinners, not a hotel for saints." It's a given that mankind falls. That means we make ethical and moral mistakes and have vices. It doesn't mean we are all evil.

12 years of Catholic School education with The Sisters Of Charity Of Leavenworth.

And (to me) the entire concept of Original Sin is so ridiculous it's nothing but the beginning of the heaping of guilt upon the masses. No infant enters the world stained by any sin of mankind.

[WilliamTheIrish]

http://www.zefrank.com/theshow/gallery/d/8604-1/tiananmen-square-tanks.jpg


Shout it Booey!

[SHTSPRAYER]

However, I guess I'm unique in that I was raised in the CC, but fortunately was able to launch the shackles.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/hDURv8fj9dk&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hDURv8fj9dk&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[WilliamTheIrish]

You'll have to describe that ShTSP. Can't access the Tube from work.

[SHTSPRAYER]

You'll have to describe that ShTSP. Can't access the Tube from work.

Too bad. Everybody else will have a laugh at your expense.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Too bad. Everybody else will have a laugh at your expense.

I know you're pretty limited in intelligence. That usually happens to the chronically unemployed. Maybe you can try. Real hard. To describe the piece.

I don't have a lot time. After all. I'm employed.

[BucEyedPea]

12 years of Catholic School education with The Sisters Of Charity Of Leavenworth.

And (to me) the entire concept of Original Sin is so ridiculous it's nothing but the beginning of the heaping of guilt upon the masses. No infant enters the world stained by any sin of mankind.

8 years for me with some lay teachers and 2 years college....just a few nuns.
If you have some guilt over doing some wrong things then it means you're social. If you have none....well....hmmmm...never mind.