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Tribal Warfare
07-15-2009, 12:27 AM
Cassel has Moss to thank for his good fortune (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/chiefs/story/1325446.html)
JASON WHITLOCK COMMENTARY

Matt Cassel’s new contract makes me appreciate Randy Moss, arguably the greatest football player of our lifetime.

Check that. Moss might be the most influential football player of any lifetime. You could argue he’s better than Jim Brown, John Elway, Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice and Joe Montana.

I know. No one likes Randy Moss. He’s aloof and lazy. He plays with a swagger that comes off as disrespect. He’s never won a Super Bowl.

None of that justifies overlooking or minimizing his impact.

Matt Cassel, a backup at Southern California for five years, a backup in the NFL for four years, just cashed in for $60 million thanks to Randy Moss. Cassel joins a crew of well-known quarterbacks who have had their profiles (and sometimes bank accounts) elevated thanks to the most talented wide receiver to ever play the game.

After just one season of playing alongside Moss in New England, Cassel went from unheralded scrub to a man with a six-year contract worth $60 million-plus, which includes $28 million in guaranteed cash and $40 million over the first three years.

Randall Cunningham, Jeff George, Daunte Culpepper, Kerry Collins, Tom Brady and Chad Pennington are chuckling. They’ve all ridden the Randy Moss gravy train.

In 1998, Moss’ rookie year, Cunningham and the Vikings used Moss to win 15 of 16 regular-season games and set a plethora of NFL offensive records.

In 1999, George resurrected his career, replacing Cunningham midway through the season and throwing for nearly 3,000 yards and 23 TDs in 10 starts.

In 2000, Culpepper established himself as a superstar, tossing 33 TD passes and for more than 3,700 yards in just his second NFL season.

In 2005, Collins hopped on the Randy Moss bandwagon in Oakland, picking up 3,700 passing yards and 20 TDs in a misguided Raiders offense.

And as you know, Tom Brady took control of the Moss circus two years ago in New England and eclipsed damn near every passing and scoring record imaginable. The Patriots rocked through the regular season undefeated and were considered the greatest NFL team of all-time until the Giants ambushed New England in the Super Bowl.

Oh, I almost forgot the spectacular 1997 college season Pennington put together at Marshall winging the ball to Randy Moss. The Thundering Herd jumped to Division I that season and clowned every school in the Mid-American Conference because of the impossible-to-slow Pennington-to-Moss connection.

So Matt Cassel is in excellent company when it comes to maximizing his time with Randy Moss. A season ago, Cassel wiped off eight years of rust and managed to lob just enough rainbows to Moss and Wes Welker to convince a few general managers that a USC backup was good enough to be an NFL franchise quarterback.

I’m not going to bag on Cassel. I honestly don’t have a clue whether he’s worth the money. I do know he was the one quarterback in this whole group who regularly struggled locating Moss with the long ball.

But, again, this column isn’t really about Cassel and whether he’s the right long-term move for the Chiefs. We’ll find that out over the next couple of years.

This column is about Randy Moss. He deserves to be regarded as one of the 15 or 20 best players of all-time. It’s ridiculous that he’s never won the league’s MVP award. He should’ve won the award in 1998 outright and should’ve shared the award with Tom Brady in 2007.

Moss reminds me of Shaquille O’Neal. Shaq has one MVP award and four NBA titles. Steve Nash has two MVP awards and no NBA Finals appearances.

In his prime, we took O’Neal for granted because he was so much bigger and more dominant than his competitors. We didn’t think it was fair.

We’ve made the same mistake with Randy Moss. Not since Jim Brown has a single offensive player had the kind of impact Moss has on the game.

Is he lazy? Does he take plays off? Yes and yes.

You still have to account for Moss on every single snap. He dictates and limits what a defense can do. And he’s made a bunch of quarterbacks rich and famous.

I hope Cassel sends Randy a thank-you note when he takes his $28 million to the bank.

Rausch
07-15-2009, 12:30 AM
Duh...

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 12:36 AM
Whitlock is talking out his ass. I wonder how many Patriots games he even WATCHED.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 12:39 AM
A season ago, Cassel wiped off eight years of rust and managed to lob just enough rainbows to Moss and Wes Welker

This is completely ignorant sportswriting.

Cassel and Moss didn't even hook up deep all that much. In fact, if Moss hadn't DROPPED SO MANY PASSES, Cassel would have looked even better.

And Welker's role did not involve catching rainbows.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 12:42 AM
In 2005, Collins hopped on the Randy Moss bandwagon in Oakland, picking up 3,700 passing yards and 20 TDs in a misguided Raiders offense.

This right here is pretty bad, too. Collins had better seasons WITHOUT Randy Moss.

Mecca
07-15-2009, 01:00 AM
I’m not going to bag on Cassel. I honestly don’t have a clue whether he’s worth the money. I do know he was the one quarterback in this whole group who regularly struggled locating Moss with the long ball.

Yet that part is accurate. He's right though Moss is a once in a generation type of WR. He is the most naturally gifted player to ever play that position. But for some reason people don't like him and he's not appreciated.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 01:06 AM
Yet that part is accurate. He's right though Moss is a once in a generation type of WR. He is the most naturally gifted player to ever play that position. But for some reason people don't like him and he's not appreciated.

The accuracy of that part should be a POSITIVE. The fact that Cassel didn't have perfect chemistry with Moss is bad, but the fact that New England's offense FLOURISHED despite that tells you how good Cassel was. He produced big plays throwing to other receivers.

In fact, I'd say he relied on Welker MORE than Moss.

I'm not going to deny the fact that Moss has a profound effect on what sort of coverage a defensive coordinator calls, but when a receiver is open and he has time, Cassel can flat out put the ball in a breadbox, regardless of who he's throwing to.

Mecca
07-15-2009, 02:18 AM
To this point Randy Moss has taken Welker who is a solid player and made him a star, it's really easy to get open underneath when your slot is under Moss.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 02:20 AM
To this point Randy Moss has taken Welker who is a solid player and made him a star, it's really easy to get open underneath when your slot is under Moss.

Welker's talent was evident in Miami.

KCChiefsMan
07-15-2009, 02:27 AM
who didn't see this article coming?

Direckshun
07-15-2009, 03:11 AM
Considering it's Whitlock, let's just praise the fact the article isn't "Cassell has his race to thank for his good fortune."

Short Leash Hootie
07-15-2009, 03:14 AM
Welker's talent was evident in Miami.

as evidenced by the fact the Pats gave up a 2nd and 7th for Welker...and only a 4th for Moss.

Rausch
07-15-2009, 04:24 AM
This is completely ignorant sportswriting.

What's ignorant is to point out that the game's best deep threat was a target you struggled to hit, and yet, he's the reason you had success.

I agree that he owes a lot to Moss. He does.

You can name a b/u managing a SB team with the starter out and his career beyond that team is pretty much a wash. I agree with the basic Whit idea...

BossChief
07-15-2009, 04:58 AM
Yet that part is accurate. He's right though Moss is a once in a generation type of WR. He is the most naturally gifted player to ever play that position. But for some reason people don't like him and he's not appreciated.

I bet he lost a few fans when they saw him live and saw how many plays he just went through the motions instead of selling it.

Be likely lost a few more when he walked off the field in the last game of the year back when he was in Minny only to realize later they made the playoffs.

He lost a few more when he went to Oakland...need I say more?

I bet he lost a few more when he gave -0- effort the next year in Oakland dropping his value to a fohrth rounder in NFL circles.

I think he has shown to be a HOFer and one of the times most talented players at any position, but maybe his attitude takes away from that.

I feared his signing with Oakland when we had Bartee and Warfield, but he never beat us.

Ill never forget Dwayne Washington OWNING him!

Cassel only completing 2 passes all year over 30 yards out of like 25 wbile having Moss as the main deep threat is surely freightening.

Anyone else get the feeling Whitlock is tiptoeing around Cassel a little because he doesnt want to be put out again as it seems he was after the whole Brian Waters fiasco? I do.

big nasty kcnut
07-15-2009, 05:33 AM
What the heck fatlock. You have to mention jeff george name again. He suck i hope he run into a aids tree while drinking antifreeze then die in fire.
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JD10367
07-15-2009, 06:13 AM
Considering it's Whitlock, let's just praise the fact the article isn't "Cassell has his race to thank for his good fortune."

Yeah, but it DID say, "The average white quarterback has to thank the speedy black man for making him rich."

2008 Welker = 111 receptions, 1165 yards
2008 Moss = 69 receptions, 1008 yards
Whitlock = racist douchebag hack

the Talking Can
07-15-2009, 06:51 AM
typically obtuse article....

it would make sense if the GM who traded for him hadn't drafted him, watched him work, watched him off the field, watched him in the locker room, watched him in the weight room, watched him take over a team, watched how he handled that pressure, watched how his teammates responded to him, watched how he grew into the role and prepared as a starter, watched how he handled the pressure of his father dying and still laid it all out on the field......

but to Whitlock, and a lot of dumb fans, the move is only about stats racked up while playing with Moss...in fact, I bet that is the last thing Pioli cared about....the literal last thing....

this wasn't Carl trading for Grbac folks, which was simply an idiot GM seeing something shiny in the distance and wanting it....Pioli has "lived" with Cassel...doesn't mean Cassel will pan out, but it does mean that Pioli is making an informed decision....you have to admit that much..

wild1
07-15-2009, 07:01 AM
The fact that Pioli knows more about Matt Cassel than anyone, including the fact that he played with Randy Moss, means this isn't some GM trying to manage a team by looking at the stat sheet. It's a terribly weak argument. Couple it with his "USC backup turned NFL starter" and he just sounds like he's whining for the sake of whining.

All there is here is "we'll see if he can do it without randy moss". Well, no kidding, we're going to see that over the next 3-4-5-6 years whether anyone likes it or not. But why do you need to write a whole column about that? A drifter in an alley knows that much.

Hog Farmer
07-15-2009, 07:02 AM
The only person Cassel needs to thank is Bernard Pollard.

JASONSAUTO
07-15-2009, 07:04 AM
maybe if moss had ran the routes at full speed all year he would have caught more passes, 75% of the time cassel overthrew him. moss was dogging it

Chiefnj2
07-15-2009, 07:09 AM
But for some reason people don't like him and he's not appreciated.

Because at times he's lazy, takes plays off, and is known for quitting and pouting when things don't go his way.

BigRedChief
07-15-2009, 07:14 AM
Moss may have been one of the top 10-15 most talented players of all time but because of his taking plays off and a sometimes really poor attitude, no way he is top 10-15 player of all time.

JD10367
07-15-2009, 07:15 AM
maybe if moss had ran the routes at full speed all year he would have caught more passes, 75% of the time cassel overthrew him. moss was dogging it

Ayup. Moss dropped quite a few balls last season. So, if anything, if Moss had played up to potential the Pats might've made the playoffs, Cassel's numbers would've been even better, and maybe his contract would've been much bigger or the Broncos would've offered much more and much sooner, etc.,.

Moss is a great wideout. He's also lazy sometimes and gives up on routes. And, last time I checked, he hasn't won a Super Bowl in three cities now. One man doesn't make a team (as Cassel showed last season by admirably filling in for Tom Brady).

Now, as to the larger question, "Did Cassel look better because of the talent around him?" Sure. What player doesn't? But it's reciprocal. A good QB makes average players look better (see "Brady, Tom, 2001-2005", when he made some very average targets look like All-World receivers). Just because you have a Randy Moss running a pattern, doesn't mean it's a gimme: you still need to read the defense quickly, make your sight adjustments while backpedaling and avoiding the rush, and actually make the damn throw. Which Cassel did, quite often. So f**k off, Whitlock.

Sure-Oz
07-15-2009, 07:27 AM
We all know jwhit is hoping the chiefs trade for tardvaris jackson

Mile High Mania
07-15-2009, 07:29 AM
Moss is a great receiver, one of the best... however, think of how much better his stats and possibly trophy shelf would look like if he had the never quit mentality of a Rice, Harrison or Carter.

Anyway, putting Moss on the stage with guys like Elway, Montana, Rice, Jim Brown... please, let's just not go there.

Might as well say TO belongs on that same stage - he's a few years older than Moss, outranks him on the all-time leader boards for rec/yards/TD... Moss will catch and surpass him, but there's not much difference in TO and Moss.

One is more of a loudmouth than the other... Moss isn't as much of a headcase, but they both have incredibly wild talent, yet their teams have never won titles.

CoMoChief
07-15-2009, 07:40 AM
This is typical Whitlock. Cassell has yet to throw a single ball in regulation play for the Chiefs, Whitlock has to bash the Chiefs.

If Cassell plays well, look for Whitlock to write something like "Cassell can lead Chiefs to Superbowl" or "Pioli made right decision with Cassell".

stevieray
07-15-2009, 08:14 AM
By his logic, if Moss dropped every pass from Cassel that hit him in the hands, Casell would suck.

no wonder he takes plays off, he must get tired throwing it to himself.

veist
07-15-2009, 08:34 AM
And if Randy Moss had half as much determination as he has talent he'd already own all the WR records. Guy is crazy talented but his effort is entirely dependent on how well his team is doing. Team is losing and he hasn't been getting "his" good luck getting him to sell a crossing route.

Spicy McHaggis
07-15-2009, 09:16 AM
In fact, I'd say he relied on Welker MORE than Moss.

After reading Whitlock's article, this was my first thought. While Moss caught more TDs, as he always will, Welker made himself a great target underneath for Cassel all season long to the tune of snagging probably 40 more catches than Moss.

ChiefGator
07-15-2009, 09:48 AM
Matt Cassel, a backup at Southern California for five years, a backup in the NFL for four years, just cashed in for $60 million thanks to Randy Moss.

...

I do know [Cassel] was the one quarterback in this whole group who regularly struggled locating Moss with the long ball.


So... then how did Moss "make" Cassel again? Maybe it was that other receiver... you know.. the white guy who caught 111 footballs last year, as opposed to Moss's 69?

ChiefGator
07-15-2009, 09:49 AM
Okay... so I guess we all noticed the same thing... maybe I should have read the other responses before writing. :: chuckle ::

ChiefButthurt
07-15-2009, 09:52 AM
The greatest player to play the game??? WTF? He lost my interest after the first sentence. He's not even the greatest wide receiver to play the game.

Day One of sportswriter training

Teacher - Class....always write something stupid to start your day.

Whitlock - **Raises his hand** Can I write more than one stupid thing a day?

Mr. Krab
07-15-2009, 10:07 AM
Ignore Bellichek who seems to have the golden touch
Ignore Welker who did more for the offense than Moss imo
Pick out the Black receiver who was a glorified decoy most of the time.



Didn't Whitlock just write an article about Blacks who disguise their racism?

wild1
07-15-2009, 10:10 AM
So... then how did Moss "make" Cassel again? Maybe it was that other receiver... you know.. the white guy who caught 111 footballs last year, as opposed to Moss's 69?

whoops... I guess the author didn't notice that guy.

BarrySPAMAID
07-15-2009, 10:17 AM
This is completely ignorant sportswriting.

Cassel and Moss didn't even hook up deep all that much. In fact, if Moss hadn't DROPPED SO MANY PASSES, Cassel would have looked even better.

And Welker's role did not involve catching rainbows.

Troof. Plus Matt Cassel still had to stand in the pocket, and make the throws that he made. I am so tired of everyone attributing Cassel's success to 2 wide receivers. He still made the throws. He still leads by example. He still works hard, and Scott Pioli believes in him. I'm good with that.


typically obtuse article....

it would make sense if the GM who traded for him hadn't drafted him, watched him work, watched him off the field, watched him in the locker room, watched him in the weight room, watched him take over a team, watched how he handled that pressure, watched how his teammates responded to him, watched how he grew into the role and prepared as a starter, watched how he handled the pressure of his father dying and still laid it all out on the field......

but to Whitlock, and a lot of dumb fans, the move is only about stats racked up while playing with Moss...in fact, I bet that is the last thing Pioli cared about....the literal last thing....

this wasn't Carl trading for Grbac folks, which was simply an idiot GM seeing something shiny in the distance and wanting it....Pioli has "lived" with Cassel...doesn't mean Cassel will pan out, but it does mean that Pioli is making an informed decision....you have to admit that much..
This is the best post I have seen out of you in a while. Very good stuff.


The only person Cassel needs to thank is Bernard Pollard.

I dont care who you are, that's funny stuff right there.



This is typical Whitlock. Cassell has yet to throw a single ball in regulation play for the Chiefs, Whitlock has to bash the Chiefs.

If Cassell plays well, look for Whitlock to write something like "Cassell can lead Chiefs to Superbowl" or "Pioli made right decision with Cassell".

BAAAAHHHHH Sheep, BAHHHHHH. Whitlock is reaching for stuff, and to think he gets paid for this???

The greatest player to play the game??? WTF? He lost my interest after the first sentence. He's not even the greatest wide receiver to play the game.

Day One of sportswriter training

Teacher - Class....always write something stupid to start your day.

Whitlock - **Raises his hand** Can I write more than one stupid thing a day?
ROFLROFLROFLROFL

Mr. Wizard
07-15-2009, 10:17 AM
How can one find stats on how many passes he threw to moss versus the other players? I would think it would have been mentioned in his article, but no.

HemiEd
07-15-2009, 10:19 AM
What the heck fatlock. You have to mention jeff george name again. He suck i hope he run into a aids tree while drinking antifreeze then die in fire.
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Made my day. ROFL

HemiEd
07-15-2009, 10:20 AM
The only person Cassel needs to thank is Bernard Pollard.

This took way too long, post 19!

Mr. Arrowhead
07-15-2009, 10:20 AM
Pioli must of forget whitlock shipment of Donuts for this week.

Que Card QB
07-15-2009, 10:25 AM
Moss had a fork stuck in his ass before Brady and Cassel were his QBs.

beach tribe
07-15-2009, 10:27 AM
I've always thought that Moss is the most dangerous player ever to play football. He simply cannot be covered by ANYONE. He demands double coverage on every play, and I would tell my QB to throw it to Moss in single coverage no matter what the CB was doing

Just Passin' By
07-15-2009, 10:31 AM
Moss is a hell of a player, but it didn't matter in Oakland. Despite the fellatio Whitlock's providing the man here, the reality is that Moss is just a wide receiver who's never won a Super Bowl. Those quarterbacks Whitlock mentioned? Brady has 3 rings, Kerry Collins was the starting QB of one of the elite teams in the league last season despite being in his late 30's, Chad Pennington is incredibly accurate with, or without, Randy Moss lining up with him, and Randall Cunningham got teams to the playoffs without Moss.

If people are going to make Cassel shower people with "thank you" cards, let's talk about the people that really deserve them the most:

Pioli
Belichick
McDaniels
Tom Brady
Matt Light
Logan Mankins
Dan Koppen
Stephen Neal
Nick Kaczur
Kevin Faulk

and then start tossing in the Welkers, Mosses and Watsons of the world, but never forget that the guy had an opportunity and ran with it.

Reaper16
07-15-2009, 10:32 AM
Damn. Whitlock spends a good part of the last couple of years writing or talking about race relations, playing to the JoCo crowd by taking a "black culture is bad for black people" stance and people still see him as prejudiced against whites.

Reaper16
07-15-2009, 10:33 AM
Moss is a hell of a player, but it didn't matter in Oakland. Despite the fellatio Whitlock's providing the man here, the reality is that Moss is just a wide receiver who's never won a Super Bowl. Those quarterbacks Whitlock mentioned? Brady has 3 rings, Kerry Collins was the starting QB of one of the elite teams in the league last season despite being in his late 30's, Chad Pennington is incredibly accurate with, or without, Randy Moss lining up with him, and Randall Cunningham got teams to the playoffs without Moss.

If people are going to make Cassel shower people with "thank you" cards, let's talk about the people that really deserve them the most:

Pioli
Belichick
McDaniels
Tom Brady
Matt Light
Logan Mankins
Dan Koppen
Stephen Neal
Nick Kaczur
Kevin Faulk

and then start tossing in the Welkers, Mosses and Watsons of the world, but never forget that the guy had an opportunity and ran with it.
Really? He should thank the line that gave up like a gazillion sacks last year?

LaChapelle
07-15-2009, 10:34 AM
Whitlock has phots of Carl's cock in Gretz's mouth for his good fortune.

DeezNutz
07-15-2009, 10:34 AM
Damn. Whitlock spends a good part of the last couple of years writing or talking about race relations, playing to the JoCo crowd by taking a "black culture is bad for black people" stance and people still see him as prejudiced against whites.

JoCo crowd? Why this stereotype?

It's no more or less accurate than any other.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 10:35 AM
Whitlock has phots of Carl's cock in Gretz's mouth for his good fortune.

n00b post of the year

Just Passin' By
07-15-2009, 10:50 AM
Really? He should thank the line that gave up like a gazillion sacks last year?

As essentially a first year QB learning on the go, he was only sacked one time more than Roethlisberger, and the learning curve and superior meshing with the O-line was clearly on display over time. Here's a breakdown:

2
4
4
5
4


Now, that's the sack numbers through the first 6 weeks of the season. Cassel was trying to get used to playing football in the NFL and Stephen Neal was on the PUP list.

Neal came off the list and worked himself into the lineup over the next two weeks before regaining his starting position. Sack numbers in the two transitional games:

6
3

Neal then became the starter for the rest of the season. The sack numbers:

0
1
3
2
5 (Pittsburgh)
3
3
1
1

It was pretty clearly a tale of two seasons when it came to sacks. The team surrendered 28 sacks in the 7 games that Neal was not the starter, and 19 sacks in the 9 games he started. When the starting O-line was in place and Cassel had gotten his feet wet, sacks were far less of a problem.

Reaper16
07-15-2009, 11:23 AM
JoCo crowd? Why this stereotype?

It's no more or less accurate than any other.
Because affluent whites are the only demographic that reads the Star anymore, and that demographic is largely concentrated in Johnson County.

Mr. Krab
07-15-2009, 11:40 AM
Because affluent whites are the only demographic that reads the Star anymore,
Link?

Halfcan
07-15-2009, 11:56 AM
Moss is a great football player-but will always be a thug off the field.

Reaper16
07-15-2009, 11:59 AM
Link?
I don't have one. I'm assuming based on what I read in the pages of that paper each day.

DeezNutz
07-15-2009, 12:07 PM
I don't have one. I'm assuming based on what I read in the pages of that paper each day.

There aren't a lot of liberals in JoCo.

Pioli Zombie
07-15-2009, 12:12 PM
Brady sucks. Its all because of Moss.
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Reaper16
07-15-2009, 12:19 PM
There aren't a lot of liberals in JoCo.
I'm talking about the metro section, not the op-ed page. NO coverage of inner-city crime. Happy, optimistic articles about KCMSD superintendent John Convington's quest to fix the schools despite instituting more of the same old, same old so far. This week, several articles taking the KCPD to task for all manner of bullshit; some of it deserved, but all of it written from an antagonistic perspective. Columns defending The Funk + Gloria Squitiro. The Star is all about window-dressing these days. I'm guessing that the few people that actually read their product don't want to read about how much of a Hellhole much of this city is.

Pioli Zombie
07-15-2009, 12:23 PM
I can't believe the MILFs here at Einstein bagels. OMG.

Ok, sorry....
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DeezNutz
07-15-2009, 12:26 PM
I'm talking about the metro section, not the op-ed page. NO coverage of inner-city crime. Happy, optimistic articles about KCMSD superintendent John Convington's quest to fix the schools despite instituting more of the same old, same old so far. This week, several articles taking the KCPD to task for all manner of bullshit; some of it deserved, but all of it written from an antagonistic perspective. Columns defending The Funk + Gloria Squitiro. The Star is all about window-dressing these days. I'm guessing that the few people that actually read their product don't want to read about how much of a Hellhole much of this city is.

I was bullshitting, of course.

Interesting points.

I'm hungry for a bagel and a caramel macchiato...

Chocolate Hog
07-15-2009, 01:10 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0IXUrvST_k&feature=related

Cassel is just a good QB, Whitlock.

Mr. Krab
07-15-2009, 01:23 PM
I don't have one. I'm assuming based on what I read in the pages of that paper each day.
So the stories read "white"?

Reaper16
07-15-2009, 01:52 PM
So the stories read "white"?
They read glossy and suburban.

L.A. Chieffan
07-15-2009, 01:58 PM
i dont know why but it is starting to piss me off when people refer to cassel as matty ice

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 02:00 PM
Matt Cassel’s new contract makes me appreciate Randy Moss, arguably the greatest football player of our lifetime.

Check that. Moss might be the most influential football player of any lifetime. You could argue he’s better than Jim Brown, John Elway, Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice and Joe Montana.

Annnnnnnnnnnnnd, article over.

FAILOCK.:shake:

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 02:12 PM
i dont know why but it is starting to piss me off when people refer to cassel as matty ice

"Sporty Spice"? :D

http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv252/raisedonriots/melc10a.png

Chocolate Hog
07-15-2009, 02:15 PM
Raised on Riots come to the Red Zone chat. There all talking about how good Thigpen is

TRR
07-15-2009, 04:50 PM
Cassel has Cassel to thank for his good fortune. Cassel stayed in shape and game ready waiting for his # to be called. He made plays to get Moss and Welker the ball and stayed calm and cool in an adverse time.
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KCBOSS1
07-15-2009, 05:14 PM
Wow, that's crazy pretty high praise. Think about how good Moss could have been if he didn't take 50% of the plays off.

wild1
07-15-2009, 06:02 PM
i dont know why but it is starting to piss me off when people refer to cassel as matty ice

that's because on a scale of 1 to 10 the retardedness of that nickname is 18.

Norman Einstein
07-15-2009, 06:18 PM
Yet that part is accurate. He's right though Moss is a once in a generation type of WR. He is the most naturally gifted player to ever play that position. But for some reason people don't like him and he's not appreciated.

Moss isn't appreciated because he is lazy, gets his feelings hurt easily, and quits when things aren't going his way. He is a complete waste of talent.

JASONSAUTO
07-15-2009, 06:21 PM
Moss isn't appreciated because he is lazy, gets his feelings hurt easily, and quits when things aren't going his way. He is a complete waste of talent.

mecca would rather have a super talented, i mean the most talent and potential EVER, player who is also lazy and plays half hearted most of the time than a player who has less talent and plays his ass off every play. PRINT THAT.

Mecca
07-15-2009, 07:52 PM
mecca would rather have a super talented, i mean the most talent and potential EVER, player who is also lazy and plays half hearted most of the time than a player who has less talent and plays his ass off every play. PRINT THAT.

If he changes the game the way Moss does, absolutely. Even if Moss isn't doing anything every defense is afraid of him, the way he's defended opens the field for everyone else.

Randy Moss makes Welkers under routes bigger plays.

ChiefGator
07-15-2009, 08:00 PM
It was pretty clearly a tale of two seasons when it came to sacks. The team surrendered 28 sacks in the 7 games that Neal was not the starter, and 19 sacks in the 9 games he started. When the starting O-line was in place and Cassel had gotten his feet wet, sacks were far less of a problem.

Rep for this. Nice work.. have not seen that breakdown anywhere before.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 08:01 PM
If he changes the game the way Moss does, absolutely. Even if Moss isn't doing anything every defense is afraid of him, the way he's defended opens the field for everyone else.

Randy Moss makes Welkers under routes bigger plays.

Explains why Welker averaged the same number of yards per catch in Miami...

Mecca
07-15-2009, 08:08 PM
Explains why Welker averaged the same number of yards per catch in Miami...

The fact that there are actually posts in this thread that imply that Wes Welker changes the game or is better than Randy Moss is fucked up.

I know people don't like Moss but that is ridiculous.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 08:12 PM
The fact that there are actually posts in this thread that imply that Wes Welker changes the game or is better than Randy Moss is fucked up.

I know people don't like Moss but that is ridiculous.

That's retarded. But Welker is talented in his own right. And it's not like he'd be double covered in the slot every time if Moss wasn't there. He'd still see plenty of single coverage, and he'd beat it.

Of course Whitlock would have you believe he was catching "rainbows" down the field all year long. Dumb. Ignorant. Lazy.

Mecca
07-15-2009, 08:14 PM
Welkers a good player and he beats single coverage, he's a perfect slot WR and having Moss there with him makes his job easier.

Bugeater
07-15-2009, 08:19 PM
The whole point he is trying to make is bullshit anyway, those Viking teams were loaded, just about any QB would've done well on them even without Moss. IIRC Culpepper had his best year statistically after he left.

And how many SBs has Brady won without him? And how many has he won with him?

As far as Collins, he wasn't exactly a slouch before he came to Oakland, he took one team to an NFC title game and another to a SB.

And lastly, Pennington. Yay, he tore it up with Moss in the friggin' MAC. :rolleyes:

sedated
07-15-2009, 08:20 PM
The whole point he is trying to make is bullshit anyway, those Viking teams were loaded, just about any QB would've done well on them even without Moss. IIRC Culpepper had his best year statistically after he left.

And how many SBs has Brady won without him? And how many has he won with him?

As far as Collins, he wasn't exactly a slouch before he came to Oakland, he took one team to an NFC title game and another to a SB.

And lastly, Pennington. Yay, he tore it up with Moss in the friggin' MAC. :rolleyes:

you always have a way of making me all warm inside...

Mecca
07-15-2009, 08:22 PM
Culpepper's best year came the year Moss missed some games but he was on their team.

The first year without Moss was the year he threw all the picks and then blew out his knee.

Just Passin' By
07-15-2009, 08:31 PM
The fact that there are actually posts in this thread that imply that Wes Welker changes the game or is better than Randy Moss is ****ed up.

I know people don't like Moss but that is ridiculous.

Moss is a great receiver. He's probably the most talented receiver to ever play the game, and he's up at the very top of the all time wideouts.

That being said, claiming that Cassel has Moss to thank as if Moss was the only straw stirring the drink is just idiotic of Witlock, and including Brady with those other quarterbacks was about as moronic as a writer can get, given Brady's having 3 rings without Moss and none with him.

Bugeater
07-15-2009, 08:32 PM
Culpepper's best year came the year Moss missed some games but he was on their team.

The first year without Moss was the year he threw all the picks and then blew out his knee.
Yep, I looked it up and I stand corrected. That was by far the worst year with the Vikings for Moss, his numbers are about half of what they normally were, it's kinda funny that it was Culpepper's best.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 10:39 PM
Yep, I looked it up and I stand corrected. That was by far the worst year with the Vikings for Moss, his numbers are about half of what they normally were, it's kinda funny that it was Culpepper's best.

On first glance he did have his best season with Moss in out of the lineup. However me watching everygame that season i know better.

Culpepper threw for 19 TD's in his first 5 games of that season. Moss got partially tore his hamstring in the 2nd quarter of game 5 in New Orleans.

Moss had 8 TD's in 4 games & 1 & half quarters. He was on his way to breaking the Rice record that year i'm convinced.

He played in I believe 2 snaps in the next game against Tennesee & then completely shut it down the next 3 games.

He threw for 3 TD's in 3 games without Moss. The Vikings went from averaging 31 points a game to 20 points in that span.

Moss was in & out of that lineup that rest of the year.

So Culpepper goes from 19 TD's in 5 games with Moss to 20 TD's in 11 games with him missing 4 games completely plus in & out of the lineup for the remaining 7 games.

Whitlock strikes again.

Bugeater
07-15-2009, 10:48 PM
On first glance he did have his best season with Moss in out of the lineup. However me watching everygame that season i know better.

Culpepper threw for 19 TD's in his first 5 games of that season. Moss got partially tore his hamstring in the 2nd quarter of game 5 in New Orleans.

Moss had 8 TD's in 4 games & 1 & half quarters. He was on his way to breaking the Rice record that year i'm convinced.

He played in I believe 2 snaps in the next game against Tennesee & then completely shut it down the next 3 games.

He threw for 3 TD's in 3 games without Moss. The Vikings went from averaging 31 points a game to 20 points in that span.

Moss was in & out of that lineup that rest of the year.

So Culpepper goes from 19 TD's in 5 games with Moss to 20 TD's in 11 games with him missing 4 games completely plus in & out of the lineup for the remaining 7 games.

Whitlock strikes again.
LOL, I love how you conveniently overlooked everything else I said in post #76. The entire premise of this article is crap.

Whitlock strikes out.

Chocolate Hog
07-15-2009, 10:50 PM
LOL, I love how you conveniently overlooked everything else I said in post #76. The entire premise of this article is crap.

Whitlock strikes out.

Shhh thats Jason Whitlock. We need famous people to post on Chiefsplanet.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 10:53 PM
So... then how did Moss "make" Cassel again? Maybe it was that other receiver... you know.. the white guy who caught 111 footballs last year, as opposed to Moss's 69?

No Disrespect because I think Welker is a hell of player but I don't think one team came in against the Pats & said "We have to stop the Welker & single up that Moss guy."

Teams & will continue to say we are not going to give up the big play to that Moss guy & let them have that dink & dunk stuff.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 11:03 PM
LOL, I love how you conveniently overlooked everything else I said in post #76. The entire premise of this article is crap.

Whitlock strikes out.

I didn't leave out anything. I pulled the wool off that 2004 season by Culpepper. He went into the toilet the very next without Moss way before the knee injury.

Whitlock over did it with the article no doubt about that. However Moss being one of the top 10 most influential players in the history of football is without question.

I think Cassel was mediocre to above average last year. I cant get an exact read yet on what type of player he truly can be.

However i'm leaning towards fraud but the 2nd Miami Dolphin game he was terrific. The Dolphins did exactly what every other team refused to do with the Pats. They blitzed 58% of that game by far the most of any team last year according the Boston Globe.

Yeremiah Bell of the Dolphins said the Patriots with Cassel want you to fear Moss & play Cover 2. He said the really want nice safe throws to Welker because Cassel has struggled with the deep ball.

The Dolphins blitzed & Cassel burned them every which way. I counted 3 double corner blitzes. Cassel didn't make a bad read or the entire day.

He was fantastic & this was the game where I said it might be something there with this guy.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 11:06 PM
The Dolphins blitzed & Cassel burned them every which way. I counted 3 double corner blitzes. Cassel didn't make a bad read or the entire day.

He was fantastic & this was the game where I said it might be something there with this guy.

The guy spreads the ball around and finds the open man better than almost any first-year starter I have seen in a long time. The Seahawks game really impressed me too...Seattle blitzed the hell out of him and he took it all and kept firing.

Chocolate Hog
07-15-2009, 11:09 PM
The guy spreads the ball around and finds the open man better than almost any first-year starter I have seen in a long time. The Seahawks game really impressed me too...Seattle blitzed the hell out of him and he took it all and kept firing.

It's much easier for people to believe whatever a sports columnist tells them instead of actually watching the games.

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 11:12 PM
The guy spreads the ball around and finds the open man better than almost any first-year starter I have seen in a long time. The Seahawks game really impressed me too...Seattle blitzed the hell out of him and he took it all and kept firing.

You just like a guy who can "take it all", don't you?:p

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 11:14 PM
You just like a guy who can "take it all", don't you?:p

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/customavatars/avatar3815_190.gif

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 11:16 PM
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/customavatars/avatar3815_190.gif

She looks like she wants to bite your dick off.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 11:26 PM
The whole point he is trying to make is bullshit anyway, those Viking teams were loaded, just about any QB would've done well on them even without Moss. IIRC Culpepper had his best year statistically after he left.

And how many SBs has Brady won without him? And how many has he won with him?

As far as Collins, he wasn't exactly a slouch before he came to Oakland, he took one team to an NFC title game and another to a SB.

And lastly, Pennington. Yay, he tore it up with Moss in the friggin' MAC. :rolleyes:

The Viking team that was completely loaded? You mean the team that went 9-7 the year scored 354 points & had the 21 ranked defense.

The same Viking team the won ONE playoff game the entire decade prior to 1998.

The same Viking team that changed 2 starters in 1998 from 1997. Jimmy Hitchcock & Randy Moss.

They then proceed to go 15-1 & break the NFL scoring record with that rookie who shall remain nameless leading the team with 1327 yards & 17TD's.

Maybe you think Hitchcock was the differencemaker.


Brady was the best before Moss arrived. However he doesn't sniff 50 TD's or an NFL Scoring record or undefeated season if 81 isn't on the roster. His previous career high was 28 TD's.

However your correct it is about the Super Bowl ring. Go ask Brady if he'd rather have Deion Branch or Randy Moss.


Can't argue about Collins though. However in 05 he had his best season beside that Super Bowl year.

22TD's & 13INT's & 3610 yards in 2000. 21TD's & 12INT's for 3759 yards in 2005 his only season with Moss.

Do i really have to talk about Chad & the Mac!:doh!:

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 11:33 PM
Jeff George fucking sucked; I just want this stated for the record right now.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 11:33 PM
The guy spreads the ball around and finds the open man better than almost any first-year starter I have seen in a long time. The Seahawks game really impressed me too...Seattle blitzed the hell out of him and he took it all and kept firing.

You beat me to it. The Seattle game was the 2nd most he was blitzed last year. Wasn't quite as sharp this game though. He missed some throws. Now he was under pressure but he was against the Dolphins but made the play.

He missed a WIDE OPEN Moss that would have been a 40 to 50 yard TD in the 2nd quarter if I believe.

However i'll cut him some slack because I think after that particular play Moss became a little frustrated with Matt & jogged some patterns thru this game.

rashid242
07-15-2009, 11:36 PM
Jeff George ****ing sucked; I just want this stated for the record right now.

I generally agree with you. However maybe you didn't know but Jeff George had his only winning season with Vikings & Moss. He went 9-3 including regular season & playoffs. That's only winning season for his career.

Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 11:36 PM
You beat me to it. The Seattle game was the 2nd most he was blitzed last year. Wasn't quite as sharp this game though. He missed some throws. Now he was under pressure but he was against the Dolphins but made the play.

He missed a WIDE OPEN Moss that would have been a 40 to 50 yard TD in the 2nd quarter if I believe.

However i'll cut him some slack because I think after that particular play Moss became a little frustrated with Matt & jogged some patterns thru this game.

Yes he had Moss WIDE OPEN deep off play action...he just missed it.

The throw you might remember from this game that really awed me was the one he made to Gaffney over the middle at the end of the third quarter. Cassel had bodies all around him in the pocket and put it on the money between three defenders.

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Count Zarth
07-15-2009, 11:38 PM
Whitlock has been anti-Cassel for awhile.

5. It's funny that Bill Belichick's finest coaching performance didn't even put the three-time Super Bowl winner in the playoffs.

Getting the Patriots to 11-5 without Tom Brady should get Belichick some serious consideration for coach of the year.

Yes, Belichick has every reason to believe in his system. He can afford to stay the course and not panic. But sticking with Matt Cassel — a nonstarter throughout his collegiate and pro career — is one of the gutsy coaching moves of the season. Halfway through the season, Cassel had thrown seven TDs and eight interceptions. Most other organizations would've made a foolish deal for a veteran QB.

Belichick is likely to get a big laugh this offseason when some team overpays for Cassel during the free-agent season. Cassel is all smoke and mirrors. The Patriots won their last four games, beating Seattle, Oakland, Arizona and Buffalo.

Cassel isn't very good.

Bugeater
07-15-2009, 11:47 PM
The Viking team that was completely loaded? You mean the team that went 9-7 the year scored 354 points & had the 21 ranked defense.

The same Viking team the won ONE playoff game the entire decade prior to 1998.

The same Viking team that changed 2 starters in 1998 from 1997. Jimmy Hitchcock & Randy Moss.

They then proceed to go 15-1 & break the NFL scoring record with that rookie who shall remain nameless leading the team with 1327 yards & 17TD's.

Maybe you think Hitchcock was the differencemaker.


Brady was the best before Moss arrived. However he doesn't sniff 50 TD's or an NFL Scoring record or undefeated season if 81 isn't on the roster. His previous career high was 28 TD's.

However your correct it is about the Super Bowl ring. Go ask Brady if he'd rather have Deion Branch or Randy Moss.


Can't argue about Collins though. However in 05 he had his best season beside that Super Bowl year.

22TD's & 13INT's & 3610 yards in 2000. 21TD's & 12INT's for 3759 yards in 2005 his only season with Moss.

Do i really have to talk about Chad & the Mac!:doh!:

Yes, they were loaded offensively. As a matter of fact, didn't Brad Johnson start that 1998 season? Why isn't he on Whitlock's list? Oh, I know, because the Vikes were stupid and let him go and kept Cunningham instead. I guess if you want to give Moss credit for that I won't argue with you. That makes Whitlock right on 2 out of the 6 QBs he listed, yay him.

Raised On Riots
07-15-2009, 11:50 PM
Whitlock has been anti-Cassel for awhile.

Well, Cassel is certainly better than anything that utter shithole Ball State ever churned out.

Did I mention Nate Davis is a poor man's Josh Freeman?

Quite so.

rashid242
07-16-2009, 04:45 AM
Yes, they were loaded offensively. As a matter of fact, didn't Brad Johnson start that 1998 season? Why isn't he on Whitlock's list? Oh, I know, because the Vikes were stupid and let him go and kept Cunningham instead. I guess if you want to give Moss credit for that I won't argue with you. That makes Whitlock right on 2 out of the 6 QBs he listed, yay him.

Johnson broke his ankle in Game 2 against the Rams. Every QB Whitlock named had their best or 2nd best statistical season with Randy Moss as a teammate.

Brady didn't need Moss but he clearly made him better & vice versa.

Even if they didn't win a Super Bowl.

JD10367
07-16-2009, 07:13 AM
whoops... I guess the author didn't notice that guy.

Well, in his defense, Welker is short. And you know all white guys look alike. :shrug:

JD10367
07-16-2009, 07:21 AM
I've always thought that Moss is the most dangerous player ever to play football. He simply cannot be covered by ANYONE. He demands double coverage on every play, and I would tell my QB to throw it to Moss in single coverage no matter what the CB was doing

And yet Moss hasn't won a Super Bowl, and little white Wes Welker had way more catches than him. Thus, we'll have to assume that Moss dogs it an awful lot. Or he's not as great as everyone thinks. Or maybe both, because--drum roll--not dogging it is part of what would make a player great. Wes Welker is the Tom Brady of quarterbacks. If Randy Moss's career had ended with Oakland, he would've been the Jeff George of wide receivers. Simply having the physical tools doesn't automatically make you the greatest, otherwise we never would have seen the Joe Montanas and Raymond Berrys of the NFL.

Count Zarth
07-16-2009, 01:26 PM
Whitlock getting boxed about the ears...

http://blog.mlive.com/highlightreel/2009/07/jason_whitlock_randy_moss_migh.html



I know this is supposed to be a blog about the Detroit Lions, but you'll have to indulge me today.

The column I just read has me ashamed of myself.

For the past decade or so, I've watched Randy Moss thinking he was an outstanding talent, a sometimes malcontent, but certainly one of the better players in the NFL.

I stand corrected.

Moss is one of the greatest players ever to strap on a helmet, nay, the greatest athlete ever to participate in a sporting event of any nature.

OK, so I might be going a little overboard, but if you read the latest column from the Kansas City Star's Jason Whitlock, you just might believe Moss is to sports what Michael Jackson was to music.

Kansas City Star, July 15: Matt Cassel's new contract makes me appreciate Randy Moss, arguably the greatest football player of our lifetime.

Check that. Moss might be the most influential football player of any lifetime. You could argue he's better than Jim Brown, John Elway, Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice and Joe Montana.

I know. No one likes Randy Moss. He's aloof and lazy. He plays with a swagger that comes off as disrespect. He's never won a Super Bowl.

None of that justifies overlooking or minimizing his impact.

Let's get a few things straight:

1) I don't know Jason Whitlock, but I like his columns. Might not always agree with him – as I most assuredly do NOT here – but I like that he's outspoken, original and questions the status quo without being bombastic.

2) I like Randy Moss. While he's annoyed me at times, he's never struck me as someone I couldn't stand. Sure, he's certainly no saint – in fact, he's NEVER played for New Orleans (BOO-yah!) – but I appreciate his talent and enjoy watching him play. Especially when he's motivated.

Whitlock raises the argument in response to the Chiefs giving new quarterback Matt Cassel a jaw-dropping six-year, $63 million contract.

As the fill-in for an injured Tom Brady last season, Cassel guided the Patriots to 11 wins, at times racking up explosive Bradyesque-like stats.

Whitlock's point is that Cassel owes his enormous payday to Moss ... as do Brady, who had a whole season with Moss; Randall Cunningham, who threw to Moss in Minnesota; Jeff George, who took over for Cunningham; Daunte Culpepper, who George begat; and Kerry Collins, who teamed with Moss in Oakland.

Lest we forget Moss went to Marshall, Whitlock makes sure we don't forget how Chad Pennington made a name for himself thanks to Moss while they were both part of the Thundering Herd.

If I'm not mistaken, when God rested on the seventh day, Moss was there to clean up some minor details, too.

C'mon, J-Whit ... do you really think it's arguable that Moss is "better than Jim Brown, John Elway, Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice and Joe Montana"?!

Is it his career statline (170 games, 843 receptions, 13,201 yards and 135 TDs)? It can't be the statline because Jerry Rice's (303 games, 1,549 receptions, 22,895 yards and 197 TDs) absolutely dwarfs Moss'.

Oh, it's the way he's padded the stats of every quarterback he's played with.

I won't argue that Moss has certainly helped in that aspect. And some quarterbacks – like Pennington and Culpepper – he's helped tremendously.

Other QBs probably weren't as influenced as Whitlock would have us believe.

Cunningham, though he threw his career-high 34 TDs while paired with Moss, had a pretty respectable career behind him by the time he met Moss in Minny.

George was the same talented, but overconfident quarterback he was before and after Moss.

Collins didn't exactly light the world on fire in Oakland: he threw eight of 20 TD passes to Moss. Hardly historical.

And Brady ... well, let's just say Brady cemented his status in the NFL well before Randy got on the glory wagon. (That said, the Pats were certainly one of the most exciting offenses EVER after Moss signed with New England.)

Which brings us back to Cassel.

Yeah, I have major questions as to whether he'll pan out for the Chiefs. Regardless, I'd agree that he should probably send one of those big paychecks to Moss.

None of that changes the fact that Moss, despite being one of the most talented players ever at his position, is a wide receiver. Which, as we all know in Detroit, is NOT one of the most influential positions on the field.

So while I would definitely agree with Whitlock that Moss is one of the best wide receivers during his time in the league, he doesn't register as one of the best players of all time.

Chocolate Hog
07-16-2009, 02:06 PM
What does Whitlock know about football? He's probably bashing Cassel cuz he wanted the Chiefs to sign a black QB.

Raised On Riots
07-16-2009, 02:20 PM
What does Whitlock know about football? He's probably bashing Cassel cuz he wanted the Chiefs to sign a black QB.

:doh!:Good lord, Billay.

Chocolate Hog
07-16-2009, 02:22 PM
:doh!:Good lord, Billay.

What? He played at a shitty college and writes articles all the time about race. If Matt Cassel plays a bad game he'll write about how we should have drafted Nate Davis. The guy is a race hustler.

Raised On Riots
07-16-2009, 02:27 PM
What? He played at a shitty college and writes articles all the time about race. If Matt Cassel plays a bad game he'll write about how we should have drafted Nate Davis. The guy is a race hustler.

He's going to write that regardless. I'm just saying, here we have a beautiful article throwing some smack on Fatty, and the first response I see is you validating his bullshit belief system.

Chocolate Hog
07-16-2009, 02:34 PM
He's going to write that regardless. I'm just saying, here we have a beautiful article throwing some smack on Fatty, and the first response I see is you validating his bullshit belief system.

Howd I validate his belief system?

Raised On Riots
07-16-2009, 02:55 PM
Howd I validate his belief system?

By making it about black and white.

Chocolate Hog
07-16-2009, 03:05 PM
By making it about black and white.

It's not about Black & White to anyone besides Whitlock. I'm sure Chiefs fans don't care either as long as whoever the QB is completes more then 54% of the throws.

KC Tattoo
07-16-2009, 03:09 PM
most successful teams have a stud WR that's part of the game. Most SB winning QBs have had a go to guy that's nothing new to football. Cassel wont miss Moss because he has D Bowe to throw too.

Raised On Riots
07-16-2009, 03:32 PM
It's not about Black & White to anyone besides Whitlock. I'm sure Chiefs fans don't care either as long as whoever the QB is completes more then 54% of the throws.

That's the point. We don't and shouldn't care. But Fatty want's us to, he believes he's right, and he wants us to feed his inner Fatty Demon so that he can continue to regurgitate his foolishness.

We must starve his Fatty Demon and not feed it.

chiefzilla1501
07-16-2009, 03:46 PM
most successful teams have a stud WR that's part of the game. Most SB winning QBs have had a go to guy that's nothing new to football. Cassel wont miss Moss because he has D Bowe to throw too.

Well, let's not exaggerate. Cassel will miss Moss and D Bowe isn't nearly as good. But I agree with you that Cassel is singled out for some really weird reason. I don't remember people railing against Big Ben because he got to throw to Plaxico/Ward or Carson Palmer for throwing to Chad Johnson/Housh. Arguably, both of those WR combos are pretty comparable to Holt/Bruce.

Shit, you hear more criticism of Matt Cassel than you do of Joe Flacco, even though Flacco had what I thought was an extremely overrated season.

Count Zarth
07-16-2009, 05:57 PM
Flacco had six games where he completed 52 percent or less of his passes. If Cassel had turned in that many stinkers people would be laughing at us.

Halfcan
07-16-2009, 06:45 PM
I thank Go Chiefs for Whitlocks good fortune-without GC-Whit is just another fat dude with Gates sauce on his face.