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View Full Version : Chiefs The hypocritical analysis of Todd Haley


petegz28
09-20-2009, 10:42 PM
Week 1:

Chiefs D gives up 500 yards of O, the team committs 2 penalties, no turnovers and keeps the game close scoring 24 points by a special teams play and defensive play while only putting up 160ish yards of offense.

Pundit Analysis:

Haley has the team going in the right direction, they were disciplined and aggressive.


Week 2:

Chiefs put up 400 yards of offense, the defense only allows 160ish yards of O, the team gets 9 penalites, a rusty QB throws 2 picks and makes a terrible decision to end the 1st half and only scoring 10 points in the game. Haley takes responisibilty for things that clearly were not his fault. Something a Chiefs head coach has not done in 3 years.

Pundit Analysis:

Haley sucks, he is an embarrasment, this team lacks discipline, they are the worst in the NFL.



My analysis:

Our team looked damn good today and we kicked the crap out of a team we should have. We just had a couple things go wrong at the worst possible times. This will happen with a new team, new coach and rusty QB. All in all, if we played the same game again we route the other team. My only criticism of Haley in the Raiders game was the prevent defense at the end of the game. Other than that, we man-handled a team that man-handled the alleged Super Bowl favorite SD Chargers a week ago.


All in all, this team is heading in the right direction and today sucked. But I still saw promise in our team. A promise we haven't seen in the last 3 years.

Marty Mac Ver 2.0
09-20-2009, 10:44 PM
If this was Facebook, I'd hit the "like" button.

DeezNutz
09-20-2009, 10:46 PM
Looked damn good today?

Like what happened in week 1, apparently my television malfunctioned for a large portion of the afternoon.

When this team actually does play a complete, solid game of football, it will be the slowest day in the history of CP because countless monitors across the country will be so thickly covered in ejaculate that it will take the Geek Squad weeks to respond.

LaChapelle
09-20-2009, 10:48 PM
The Raiders didn't mount a scoring drive until after the Chiefs could. It's amazing how many times this kind of thing happens in every NFL game. The ifs ands or buts arguments are a waste of time.

Mecca
09-20-2009, 10:49 PM
Damn good is a really bad line, damn good is how the Giants looked.

petegz28
09-20-2009, 10:51 PM
Damn good is a really bad line, damn good is how the Giants looked.

I should say, damn good between the 20's. Or damn good except the score.

You don't put up 400 yards of offense and hold a team under 200 yards of offense by looking like shit. We just couldn't finish off our drives.

OnTheWarpath58
09-20-2009, 10:51 PM
A team that:

-Loses the turnover battle (-2)

-Racks up 400+ yards of offense, but only 10 points

-Committed NINE penalties for 70 yards

-Loses to a team that only manages 166 yards of offense, with a QB that was completing passes at a 30% clip

LOOKED DAMN GOOD TODAY?

Mecca
09-20-2009, 10:51 PM
You should put they played a solid game but decided they didn't want to win.

petegz28
09-20-2009, 10:52 PM
A team that:

-Loses the turnover battle (-2)

-Racks up 400+ yards of offense, but only 10 points

-Committed NINE penalties for 70 yards

-Loses to a team that only manages 166 yards of offense, with a QB that was completing passes at a 30% clip

LOOKED DAMN GOOD TODAY?


Slow down and read the OP again....

Count Zarth
09-20-2009, 10:52 PM
We have been in a position to win two weeks in a row. If you don't think that has anything to do with good coaching you are a complete and utter fucking moron, especially considering the OBVIOUS lack of talent.

Maybe if Tamba Hali or Mike Vrabel could get off a friggin' block on the pass rush in the fourth quarter we wouldn't be winless.

Maybe if Ndookwe could contain Greg fuckin' Ellis we march down the field for a field goal and tie it up.

Jesus Christ. Blame Haley? The only coach who could win consistently with this pack of talent is Albus Dumbledore.

doomy3
09-20-2009, 10:52 PM
Damn good is a really bad line, damn good is how the Giants looked.

I definitely wouldn't say the Chiefs looked damn good.

I also wouldn't say the Giants looked damn good.

Their offense did, but their vaunted DLine was absolutely gashed by Barber and Felix Jones all night. They were abused, and if Romo would have had a halfway decent game, the Cowboys would have won that game.

OnTheWarpath58
09-20-2009, 10:53 PM
Slow down and read the OP again....

I did.

It's full of bullshit excuses.

Mecca
09-20-2009, 10:54 PM
They looked good at times and looked extremely sloppy at others. The game was a mixed bag they never had any complete drives.

This is what I think when I think about it, last week with a backup QB on the road with the Ravens they were conservative trying to stay in it, the Ravens were aggressive and had some fuckups so while dominating the Chiefs stayed close.

Today against a team they felt they were better than with Cassel back they were more aggressive resulting in more penalties and turnovers giving the game to the Raiders.

Mecca
09-20-2009, 10:55 PM
We have been in a position to win two weeks in a row. If you don't think that has anything to do with good coaching you are a complete and utter fucking moron, especially considering the OBVIOUS lack of talent.

Maybe if Tamba Hali or Mike Vrabel could get off a friggin' block on the pass rush in the fourth quarter we wouldn't be winless.

Maybe if Ndookwe could contain Greg fuckin' Ellis we march down the field for a field goal and tie it up.

Jesus Christ. Blame Haley? The only coach who could win consistently with this pack of talent is Albus Dumbledore.

In position to win is the same shit that happened all of last year, I remember numerous people saying we'd win alot of those games now cause Haley is a better coach than Herm.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2009, 10:55 PM
A team that:

-Loses the turnover battle (-2)

-Racks up 400+ yards of offense, but only 10 points

-Committed NINE penalties for 70 yards

-Loses to a team that only manages 166 yards of offense, with a QB that was completing passes at a 30% clip

LOOKED DAMN GOOD TODAY?

You missed the part where he said if we didn't go into a Prevent Defense, we would have won.

I'm sure that clears that up.

:rolleyes:

DBOSHO
09-20-2009, 11:00 PM
i think its easy to put the blame on the hc

the truth is, that its cassels and pendergasts fault.

cassels throw at the end of the half is unexcusable. if he throws it away, he gets at least 1 more try at the endzone. also, the 2nd pick wasnt too great. engram was a little open and cassel just overthrew him. another missed attempt at some points. i will cut him some slack though. it was his 1st game in a month.

clancy once again fucks up out of a win. the blitz was working all game, so why he chose not to blitz an error prone qb on 3rd and fucking 15 puzzles me. he called a pretty good game up until the final drive.

i guess i can throw flowers in as well. that pick 6 has to be caught

after ive had some time to think about it, overall, im very proud of the way the team played today. lets face it, we beat the piss out of the raiders, but a few breaks, mental errors, and some terrible TERRIBLE calls by the refs cost us the game.

chiefs victories-0
chiefs moral victories-2

aturnis
09-20-2009, 11:02 PM
My only criticism of Haley in the Raiders game was the prevent defense at the end of the game.

Blame Pendergast. He's calling the defense and went conservative this week. He all out blitzed last week and that's what lost the game. He was just too scared to make that same mistake.

I say, you can still blitz and not send 9 of you 11 players. I can't remember exactly how many he sent on that play last week, but I'm pretty sure that both safeties evacuated the deep middle of the field. Leaving the corners one on one with their men. Carr got beat and that was it. Thing about that play was, even if car gets beat, the chances of Flacco completing the pass were 50/50.

petegz28
09-20-2009, 11:03 PM
The bottom line is, there is no call for the 180 on Haley that some people are having.

OnTheWarpath58
09-20-2009, 11:09 PM
The bottom line is, there is no call for the 180 on Haley that some people are having.

Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.


Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

SNR
09-21-2009, 12:18 AM
A team that:

-Loses the turnover battle (-2)

-Racks up 400+ yards of offense, but only 10 points

-Committed NINE penalties for 70 yards

-Loses to a team that only manages 166 yards of offense, with a QB that was completing passes at a 30% clip

LOOKED DAMN GOOD TODAY?The Steelers' offense oftentimes racks up yards and yards of offense with a point total less than two TD's worth to show for it.

Just saying....

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2009, 12:23 AM
The Steelers' offense oftentimes racks up yards and yards of offense with a point total less than two TD's worth to show for it.

Just saying....


The Steelers have game-changers all over their roster.

That's the difference.

Count Zarth
09-21-2009, 12:33 AM
In position to win is the same shit that happened all of last year, I remember numerous people saying we'd win alot of those games now cause Haley is a better coach than Herm.

In this case I think it's true.

I guess you can fault Haley for rushing four guys, but then again last week he rushed eight and got beat all the same.

The talent level on the team sucks. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

mikey23545
09-21-2009, 05:26 AM
Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.


Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

Finally - a truthspeaker.

It's going to be hard for a lot of posters on this BB to understand another reason Haley is going to catch a lot of shit, and deserves it...A majority of posters in this thread who are sticking up for Haley are immature, arrogant, condescending pricks just like him...And they can never understand that when you constantly treat people like absolute shit, and act like you are doing them a favor just to acknowledge their existence, you better be ready for some payback if your mouth writes a check your coaching ass can't cash....Don't think anyone is going to cut you any slack after you've done the "Genius Strut" all over their face...

Marcellus
09-21-2009, 06:32 AM
In position to win is the same shit that happened all of last year, I remember numerous people saying we'd win alot of those games now cause Haley is a better coach than Herm.

We got blown out by the same Raider team at home last year and could not stop the run.

I would say there was marked improvement.

Marcellus
09-21-2009, 06:34 AM
Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.


Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

Herm was an idiot and a ton of the complaints were about the busts that he drafted.

the Talking Can
09-21-2009, 06:36 AM
so haley's second game makes him the same as Herm coaching in his 7th season?



anyone see the disconnect here?

Saulbadguy
09-21-2009, 06:39 AM
No pressure on the QB.
Below average game by our QB.
Below average running game.

Blah - looked like more of the same.

BigRedChief
09-21-2009, 06:40 AM
so haley's second game makes him the same as Herm coaching in his 7th season?



anyone see the disconnect here?
THIS!

I'm not defending the guy or think he's just wonderful but, he might be HermII and he might turn out to be a good NFL coach. After two games I think its a little early to determine. For all of our sakes we had better hope its the latter.

Saulbadguy
09-21-2009, 06:42 AM
THIS!

I'm not defending the guy or think he's just wonderful but, he might be HermII and he might turn out to be a good NFL coach. After two games I think its a little early to determine. For all of our sakes we had better hope its the latter.

For the record, I don't mind Haley.

We just have glaring personnel issues at nearly every position.

BigRedChief
09-21-2009, 07:03 AM
For the record, I don't mind Haley.

We just have glaring personnel issues at nearly every position.
I agree and if Cassel and Jackson are busts then he's the blame for those choices but the rest of the players wern't on his watch. It's obvious to me that King Carl has left the cover bare and its going to take a while to replinsh the talent.

rad
09-21-2009, 07:05 AM
Finally - a truthspeaker.

It's going to be hard for a lot of posters on this BB to understand another reason Haley is going to catch a lot of shit, and deserves it...A majority of posters in this thread who are sticking up for Haley are immature, arrogant, condescending pricks just like him...And they can never understand that when you constantly treat people like absolute shit, and act like you are doing them a favor just to acknowledge their existence, you better be ready for some payback if your mouth writes a check your coaching ass can't cash....Don't think anyone is going to cut you any slack after you've done the "Genius Strut" all over their face...

Yeah. Let's get a guy like Crying Dick in here. This team needs sensitivity and compassion.

Saulbadguy
09-21-2009, 07:07 AM
I agree and if Cassel and Jackson are busts then he's the blame for those choices but the rest of the players wern't on his watch. It's obvious to me that King Carl has left the cover bare and its going to take a while to replinsh the talent.

The players weren't on his watch but the positions are for sure on his watch. If he does nothing to improve the position then we are back to square 1.

Fish
09-21-2009, 07:37 AM
Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.


Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

Exactly. If Herm would have coached yesterday's game, he would be getting brutally crucified for the loss. There would be thread after thread about what a damn fool Herm was.. Instead we have people on their knees thanking Haley for a moral victory over the Raiders. I don't get it at all.....

LaChapelle
09-21-2009, 07:52 AM
Patience for a new crew from top to bottom does not equal cawk sucking.

Mr. Arrowhead
09-21-2009, 07:54 AM
Exactly. If Herm would have coached yesterday's game, he would be getting brutally crucified for the loss. There would be thread after thread about what a damn fool Herm was.. Instead we have people on their knees thanking Haley for a moral victory over the Raiders. I don't get it at all.....

new coach, new gm, new QB, and hell a new renovated stadium. Herm was suppose to be a experience HC, but he still didnt know better, at least we know Haley has room to improve, and people will be more patient with a new regime

LaChapelle
09-21-2009, 07:57 AM
Clark's reign hasn't been but a couple years as well.

Fish
09-21-2009, 08:05 AM
new coach, new gm, new QB, and hell a new renovated stadium. Herm was suppose to be a experience HC, but he still didnt know better, at least we know Haley has room to improve, and people will be more patient with a new regime

Herm defenders had excuses for the losses as well. That doesn't change the fact that we're 0-2 just like we were last year.

MahiMike
09-21-2009, 08:50 AM
I totally agree. 400 yds of offense with a whole bunch of new players. Excellent play calling. Just enough bad plays/penalties/bad luck thrown in to lose. We're heading the right direction. Like I said before the 1st game, we'll be clicking after the bye at get 5 wins to end the season.

HemiEd
09-21-2009, 09:02 AM
You missed the part where he said if we didn't go into a Prevent Defense, we would have won.

I'm sure that clears that up.

:rolleyes:The 3rd and 18 (IIRC) conversion was a killer, a direct result of playing soft with no pressure.

MadMax
09-21-2009, 09:02 AM
Looked damn good today?

Like what happened in week 1, apparently my television malfunctioned for a large portion of the afternoon.

When this team actually does play a complete, solid game of football, it will be the slowest day in the history of CP because countless monitors across the country will be so thickly covered in ejaculate that it will take the Geek Squad weeks to respond.



ROFLROFL be lots of :holdman: goin on.

MadMax
09-21-2009, 09:05 AM
We have been in a position to win two weeks in a row. If you don't think that has anything to do with good coaching you are a complete and utter ****ing moron, especially considering the OBVIOUS lack of talent.

Maybe if Tamba Hali or Mike Vrabel could get off a friggin' block on the pass rush in the fourth quarter we wouldn't be winless.

Maybe if Ndookwe could contain Greg ****in' Ellis we march down the field for a field goal and tie it up.

Jesus Christ. Blame Haley? The only coach who could win consistently with this pack of talent is Albus Dumbledore.



Why is everyone who doesn't agree with your opinion morons??? Just seems to be a theme for you lately.:shrug:

Baby Lee
09-21-2009, 09:06 AM
Hie thee to a dictionary. How is this hypocritical?

So I guess if I like Dustin Hoffman, but hated Ishtar, that'd be hypocritical too? ;)

HemiEd
09-21-2009, 09:08 AM
so haley's second game makes him the same as Herm coaching in his 7th season?



anyone see the disconnect here?

yeah, and to not notice the marked improvement, in how this team is performing, is a serious oversight.

I am very encouraged.

They will learn from these mistakes hopefully.

Fish
09-21-2009, 09:15 AM
yeah, and to not notice the marked improvement, in how this team is performing, is a serious oversight.

I am very encouraged.

They will learn from these mistakes hopefully.

Moral improvement is one thing. But improving the W column is still the only thing that matters. And so far there hasn't been any of that. Haley is 0-6 already as a head coach. And the team is still making some terrible mistakes. I like some of what I see as well, but until we learn how to win, encouragement isn't worth much.

Here's to hoping they learn from these mistakes as well!

HemiEd
09-21-2009, 09:22 AM
Moral improvement is one thing. But improving the W column is still the only thing that matters. And so far there hasn't been any of that. Haley is 0-6 already as a head coach. And the team is still making some terrible mistakes. I like some of what I see as well, but until we learn how to win, encouragement isn't worth much.

Here's to hoping they learn from these mistakes as well!

Yeah, I hate a loss just as much as the next guy, especially to the Raiders. However, I didn't expect the Chiefs to win this game, just due to the line superiority of the Raiders on both sides of the ball.


But I must say, this team is starting to get to be fun to watch again.

It won't happen over night, but it is going to happen, they will be a good team IMO.

Haley is catching a bunch of shit already, but he and his approach, are so refreshing after the Herm debacle, that I am not giving him any.

ferrarispider95
09-21-2009, 10:38 AM
Here is the difference I see between Haley and Herm...

Haley will make changes. Herm was way too soft, no one was worrying about losing their job, herm was their buddy.

A young team and new coach is going to make mistakes. I don't think you can criticize Haley until you see him make the same mistakes over and over. Herm would, it was the same story every week.

I see more of a team out there with Cassel behind center, than I ever did with Herm and Gunther's BS.

BigChiefFan
09-21-2009, 10:46 AM
I agree with the thread starter. Haley has the team going in the right direction, IMO. Give him some talent and we start winning some of these close games. I expect, the team will play better in the future.

FringeNC
09-21-2009, 11:04 AM
The Chiefs outgained the opposition by over 200 yards, something Herm Edwards accomplished one time during his 49 games here. ONCE.

The idea that yardage differentials have no bearing on the future is ridiculous. It is a variable that Vegas uses in line determination -- for good reason -- it has predictive power. I just don't get why some refuse to acknowledge that luck plays a major role in the outcome of NFL games, but tends to average out for a team over the course of the season.

JFC, the Raiders RAN for over 300 yards on us last year, and we dominated the LOS under a new coach and some are having a meltdown and calling the coach incompetent? WTF?

jidar
09-21-2009, 11:19 AM
We DOMINATED by the box score.

I don't know why so many people want to ignore that.

If we were Raiders fans right now this board would be full of threads about how much we sucked but got lucky. I'm sure it would be the same people too and all of them quoting our box scores.

Chiefs -vs- Raiders
Time of possession: 38mins vs 22mins
Rushing Yards: 173 vs 67
Passing Yards: 236 vs 99
Total Yards: 409 vs 166
Avg gain per play ran: 5.2yds vs 3.3yds
First Downs: 25 vs 11
3rd Down Efficiency: 33% vs 22%
Completions: 24/39 vs 7/24

We just got hurt by:
Penalties: 9 - 70 vs 4 - 45
Turnovers: 2 vs 0
And of course the dumb pass at the end of the 2nd.

These are solvable things. We can play better and have a lot of things to fix, but we're not as bad as people are posting on here.

KCtotheSB
09-21-2009, 11:33 AM
I'll admit, I was pissed yesterday after the game ended. Losing 25 out of the last 27 has sort of "numbed" me from the losing, but yesterday's stung because we had the win right there and it was closer than ever. That sting from losing is a good thing, I think. Normally, I'd acknowledge we'd get our ass kicked with Herm at the headset and there'd be shit we could do about it with Carl in office.

However, with the new administration and seeing every step I've seen them take since their inception, I'm liking what I'm seeing. I'm seeing accountability, a new infusion of toughness and the idea that "losing" isn't acceptable. I can completely understand why people are taking whiffle ball bats to Haley. However, I'm still giving him a pass. Minus some very ill-timed throws by Cassel and absolutely shitty defensive playcalling in the final 2 minutes, we're halfway to our 2008 record right now. Perhaps it's because I'm a "glass is half full" kind of guy, but I'm just as excited about next week's game vs Philly as I was this past week. Until Haley and Cassel exhibit trends and repetitive fuckups that cost us games like past tenures, I'm going to continue being excited and hopeful with this new regime.

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2009, 11:36 AM
We DOMINATED by the box score.

I don't know why so many people want to ignore that.



Because it's absolutely meaningless when you lose the game.

The Chiefs under Vermeil "dominated" the box score.

They got exactly ZERO playoff wins, one playoff appearances and four losing seasons (I'm sorry but 8-8 is a loss).

Fish
09-21-2009, 11:39 AM
Hooray! We're the box score champions!!

Still not a single win, and just as many mistakes as last year, but hey.. stats are great....

Baby Lee
09-21-2009, 11:42 AM
We DOMINATED by the box score.
I'll give them credit for blowing up a decent running attack, but we dominated the rest because JaMarcus was ABYSMAL, in the parlance of Denny Green with JR 'they were who we thought Terri Schiavo was' and we let 'em off the hook.

That said, I WILL stand by my long held stance that 'crappy but improving teams will look a million different types of crappy . . . until they don't any more.'

Remember, it's like tuning an automobile, until every setting is dialed in, it's a powerless rough running machine.

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 11:47 AM
They looked good at times and looked extremely sloppy at others. The game was a mixed bag they never had any complete drives.
This is what I think when I think about it, last week with a backup QB on the road with the Ravens they were conservative trying to stay in it, the Ravens were aggressive and had some fuckups so while dominating the Chiefs stayed close.

Today against a team they felt they were better than with Cassel back they were more aggressive resulting in more penalties and turnovers giving the game to the Raiders.

yeah going down the field and scoring a td with 2something left isnt a complete drive:rolleyes:

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 11:49 AM
Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.


Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

guess what: it doesnt matter what you think or what you have read all fucking summer. it's not your choice whether haley deserves the credit i'm or others are giving him

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 11:51 AM
Finally - a truthspeaker.

It's going to be hard for a lot of posters on this BB to understand another reason Haley is going to catch a lot of shit, and deserves it...A majority of posters in this thread who are sticking up for Haley are immature, arrogant, condescending pricks just like him...And they can never understand that when you constantly treat people like absolute shit, and act like you are doing them a favor just to acknowledge their existence, you better be ready for some payback if your mouth writes a check your coaching ass can't cash....Don't think anyone is going to cut you any slack after you've done the "Genius Strut" all over their face...

the EXACT same could be said about the idiots bashing haley. hell THEY are the ones who said the raiders would run all over us. THEY are the ones who said that the TE would GASH us. neither happened.

Lex Luthor
09-21-2009, 11:55 AM
Moral improvement is one thing. But improving the W column is still the only thing that matters. And so far there hasn't been any of that. Haley is 0-6 already as a head coach. And the team is still making some terrible mistakes. I like some of what I see as well, but until we learn how to win, encouragement isn't worth much.

Here's to hoping they learn from these mistakes as well!
I hate to interrupt your rant, but Haley isn't 0-6. He's 0-2. Preseason games are meaningless.

The Chiefs will probably start this season 0-7. But that will still be WAY too early to draw a meaningful conclusion about either Scott Pioli or Todd Haley. They inherited a team that was 2-23 in the last 25 games of the Carl/Herm era. It's unreasonable to think they can turn it around overnight. The win-lost record for this entire season is irrelevant. The time to judge them will be at the end of next season.

Fish
09-21-2009, 11:56 AM
the EXACT same could be said about the idiots bashing haley. hell THEY are the ones who said the raiders would run all over us. THEY are the ones who said that the TE would GASH us. neither happened.

Well hooray!! Neither happened! Another moral victory we didn't think of....

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2009, 11:56 AM
guess what: it doesnt matter what you think or what you have read all fucking summer. it's not your choice whether haley deserves the credit i'm or others are giving him

Of course it doesn't, and I never claimed it does.

I'm just pointing out where the true hypocrisy lies - with the people who absolutely blasted Herm Edwards for the same bullshit we saw yesterday - bad clock management, use of time-outs, undisciplined football and a litany of mistakes.

So if you want to be one of the hypocrites, that's your choice. Just don't complain if you get called out for it.

Pasta Giant Meatball
09-21-2009, 12:25 PM
The team was competitive the last half of last year as well. They STILL just can't get over the hump and get the W. It was very frustrating that the Fade couldn't do ANYTHING the entire day until thier final drive. Close losses are common in the NFL, but when you don't have a pass rush you are going to lose alot of games like this.

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2009, 12:29 PM
The team was competitive the last half of last year as well. They STILL just can't get over the hump and get the W. It was very frustrating that the Fade couldn't do ANYTHING the entire day until thier final drive. Close losses are common in the NFL, but when you don't have a pass rush you are going to lose alot of games like this.

Last half?

Dude, as soon as Chan Gailey implemented the Spread Offense for Tyler Thigpen, the Chiefs were "competitive". The Chiefs lost eight games by 7 points or less.

The problem is that it was an illusion and masked what was otherwise, a very bad football team.

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 12:39 PM
Of course it doesn't, and I never claimed it does.

I'm just pointing out where the true hypocrisy lies - with the people who absolutely blasted Herm Edwards for the same bullshit we saw yesterday - bad clock management, use of time-outs, undisciplined football and a litany of mistakes.

So if you want to be one of the hypocrites, that's your choice. Just don't complain if you get called out for it.

i cant see how you can HONESTLY sit here and act as though those were herm type games you watched the last two weeks

HemiEd
09-21-2009, 12:41 PM
Of course it doesn't, and I never claimed it does.

I'm just pointing out where the true hypocrisy lies - with the people who absolutely blasted Herm Edwards for the same bullshit we saw yesterday - bad clock management, use of time-outs, undisciplined football and a litany of mistakes.

So if you want to be one of the hypocrites, that's your choice. Just don't complain if you get called out for it.

There has to be a timeline. This guy is trying to put something together out of the ashes Herm fucking Edwards left behind.

I didn't bash Herm, until he proved to me that he was a liar, worthless piece of shit, and a total waste of cells.

It didn't take him long, but it was longer than two games. IIRC it was half a season, before I flipped on him. His total lack preperation for the playoff game finished the deal.

Haley is a leader, and accepted responsiblity. Herm took credit for all that was good, and the failures were do to others.

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2009, 12:43 PM
i cant see how you can HONESTLY sit here and act as though those were herm type games you watched the last two weeks

I guess you need to read this as well. Feel free to pass it on to the next person that is missing the entire point of this discussion.



Comparing Herm and Haley is a complete joke in itself.

Herm was a coach for 3 seasons before coming here. He made the same mistakes over and over and over again. His clock management never improved. His half time adjustments were some of the worst in NFL history.

Haley is in his 2nd game running the show, as well as calling plays. Comparing him to Herm is a laughable joke. Haley can be compared to Herm in a year if he's still making the same BS mistakes. Not now.

Herman Edwards and Carl Peterson ruined this franchise. It's going to take Pioli and Haley a hell of a long time to fix the mistakes that have been made over an entire decade.

I think you're missing it, Frank.

I don't think people are using the Haley/Herm "comparisons" to say that Haley is a shitty coach.

Personally, the guy has grown on me, he wasn't my first, second or third choice. I'm not saying he is a shitty HC, or will be one in the future.

People are merely pointing out the hypocrisy of the fanbase.

Last year, EVERYTHING was Herm Edwards fault.

Mis-use of time outs? Herm's fault.

Shitty clock management? Herm's fault.

Bad situational play calling? Herm's fault.

Leaving points on the board? Herm's fault.

Constant mental mistakes? Herm's fault.


All those things happened yesterday, but for some reason, they are everyone BUT Todd Haley's fault.

You can't have it both ways.

I agree with that.

I did miss the point.

It was a very sloppy game. I'll give it a pass one or two times, but this team can not win when they beat themselves. This is the least talented Chiefs team I can ever remember and that's saying something.

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 12:44 PM
There has to be a timeline. This guy is trying to put something together out of the ashes Herm fucking Edwards left behind.

I didn't bash Herm, until he proved to me that he was a liar, worthless piece of shit, and a total waste of cells.

It didn't take him long, but it was longer than two games. IIRC it was half a season, before I flipped on him. His total lack preperation for the playoff game finished the deal.

Haley is a leader, and accepted responsiblity. Herm took credit for all that was good, and the failures were do to others.

THIS!!!!! and haley most likely took credit for things he didnt deserve. THATS what he as a coach IS SUPPOSED TO DO. and like hemi said here it's THE SECOND FUCKING GAME. and cassel's first. give it some fucking time at LEAST a couple of weeks god damn

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 12:47 PM
I guess you need to read this as well. Feel free to pass it on to the next person that is missing the entire point of this discussion.

see OTWP the FACT you are missing is that herm had PROVEN time and time again that his teams CONTINUALLY would do that same shit. first in NY then here. si that PUTS it on herm. in 7 years he had that same shit happen over and over. come back and play when haley shows that he's of the same mold

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2009, 12:50 PM
see OTWP the FACT you are missing is that herm had PROVEN time and time again that his teams CONTINUALLY would do that same shit. first in NY then here. si that PUTS it on herm. in 7 years he had that same shit happen over and over. come back and play when haley shows that he's of the same mold

Wow.

I couldn't have made it any clearer, and you still missed it.

Why am I not surprised.

Can we get an English-to-Retard translator in here, and they can read my post to Sauto?

HemiEd
09-21-2009, 12:50 PM
OTW, I now get your point.

That is the privelage of being a fan, especially on a BB.

Towards the end, I was blaming Herm for bad weather on weekends, and a pimple on my ass.

His dis-interest in Chiefs tradition, pretty much made me hate him.

JASONSAUTO
09-21-2009, 01:02 PM
Wow.

I couldn't have made it any clearer, and you still missed it.

Why am I not surprised.

Can we get an English-to-Retard translator in here, and they can read my post to Sauto?

i didnt miss it. i got it. the REASON that everything was herms fault, as far as im concerned, is because it CONTINUALLY happened. when it happens time and time again then yeah i will agree that it's haley's fault. two different situations and no hypocrisy here. see haley hasnt had time to change the CULTURE of the organization, even our best and most talented players have been told for too fucking long that "it's okkkkkkkaaaayyyy" and it's not fucking ok and IMO from everything thats happened so far it's NOT OK in haley's eyes either.

Contrarian
09-21-2009, 03:34 PM
As much crap that Cassel is getting I still think that he played well in the pocket that was given and when it collapsed he avoided more than one sack and many times made play. I thought he showed much more poise than Croyle. Night and day. So he screwed up a few times his FIRST game as a Chief. I'll give him that. He didn't have a huge passing game but for Matt to put it in there for Bowe to catch that ball and pull ahead, Awesome!!!!! And the show of team comradary afterwards was more awesome!!!
I like my Chiefs. I like Todd Haley. I like our receivers. I enjoyed watching Wade. I enjoyed watching our attitude. I like what they are becoming with two games into the season. Two frickin games people don't make a season. We will win and continue to get better both as a coaching unit and in player personnel. Shoulda, coulda, woulda, if, but, f*ck that.
We lost, it was everbody's fault but I still liked watching it. For the first time in a long time.