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View Full Version : Football Dan Snyder: Suing former Redskins Season Ticket Holders Who Have Lost Their Jobs


Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 01:29 PM
Article is over a month and a half old, this is probably a repost but if so, I never saw it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/02/AR2009090203887.html

This is a huge article, so I'm going to put in the next post.

EDIT: The article is just way too big. Feel free to click the link.

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 01:31 PM
It was so big, I couldn't even put it in 1 post due to board constrictions. There are all 23,872 characters of it.

Coach
10-28-2009, 01:34 PM
*snoring*

milkman
10-28-2009, 01:37 PM
Shit like this will eventually eat away at the popularity of the NFL.

Buck
10-28-2009, 01:37 PM
tl;dr

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 01:38 PM
Long story short, people signed up for 8-10 year season ticket packages and then lost their jobs, or all their money in the stock market and had to cancel. Now their tickets have been sold, but Dan is going after them anyways.

BCD
10-28-2009, 01:41 PM
Well, thats a nice way to garner future season ticket holders...

blaise
10-28-2009, 01:44 PM
This is why when you hear owners or GMs try and sell you some BS like, "We know the team's down but we need you more than ever to support the team", or when people complain about booing, or calling people fair weather fans, it's total bullcrap. The team just wants you money, and they don't care about you personally at all.
That being said, who the hell signs a 10 year contract for season tickets? 10 years? Is that how people do that normally? It seems so long.

jAZ
10-28-2009, 01:46 PM
But I'm told...

Clark (Hunt) should fire himself.

...

I think he's the worst owner in the NFL, bar none.

CoMoChief
10-28-2009, 01:48 PM
I remember hearing about this.

Thats why I buy single game tickets.......that's just me.

Stinger
10-28-2009, 01:54 PM
That being said, who the hell signs a 10 year contract for season tickets? 10 years? Is that how people do that normally? It seems so long.

That is one reason why people hate PSL's.

Also if the Chiefs ever go to the PSL I am out of there.

blaise
10-28-2009, 01:56 PM
Deadspin had some funny stuff about Snyder and the Skins

http://deadspin.com/5391095/danny-snyder-doesnt-like-you-telling-him-how-much-he-blows?skyline=true&s=x

Norman Einstein
10-28-2009, 01:57 PM
Shit like this will eventually eat away at the popularity of the NFL.

Like it hasn't already? What do you think the impact of the new Club Level prices will be in 2011? (Unless the new GM has changed the proposed pricing structure)

alpha_omega
10-28-2009, 02:01 PM
Long story short, people signed up for 8-10 year season ticket packages and then lost their jobs, or all their money in the stock market and had to cancel. Now their tickets have been sold, but Dan is going after them anyways.

Thanks for the synopsis.

Inspector
10-28-2009, 02:09 PM
The other day I saw Dan Snyder stealing candy from orphan children.

Hell, the fucker didn't leave any for me to get. Dammit!

Saulbadguy
10-28-2009, 02:19 PM
Long story short, people signed up for 8-10 year season ticket packages and then lost their jobs, or all their money in the stock market and had to cancel. Now their tickets have been sold, but Dan is going after them anyways.

Gots to get paid.

Jerm
10-28-2009, 02:27 PM
Dan Snyder is the biggest POS douche in the NFL.
Posted via Mobile Device

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 04:09 PM
Dan Snyder is the biggest POS douche in the NFL.
Posted via Mobile Device

Then so is Robert Kraft:

The New England Patriots have sued multiyear premium ticket holders. A Chicago Bears spokesman said, "In rare instances, we have sued."

Officials with the Arizona Cardinals, Denver Broncos, Minnesota Vikings, Dallas Cowboys, Miami Dolphins, San Francisco 49ers and Indianapolis Colts declined to comment on the query. Other teams did not respond.

Nice of you guys to actually READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE.

In the Redskins case, there are 20,000 PREMIUM SEAT CONTRACTS. If people sign a guaranteed contract, they must pay. Afterall, it IS a contract.

Furthermore, the Redskins have said that they have settled with nearly everyone who backed out of their contract.

----------------------------------------------------------

When Companies Default

<!-- BREAK -->
About a dozen companies bailed out on their luxury skybox leases in the past year, and the cases stand out from the premium ticket holder lawsuits in both size and nature.


The companies include a lobbying firm that went out of business, a telecommunications firm and a Shenandoah coffee roaster owned by a man indicted on charges that he ran a multimillion-dollar Ponzi scheme. The Redskins have won $8 million in judgments in eight cases.


Only one defendant is mounting a significant defense: Atlantic Transportation Equipment Ltd., a Maryland bus-maintenance company that rented a 30-seat skybox suite for $149,000 annually to entertain clients and employees. The six-year contract was due to expire next year, and the Redskins sued for the final two seasons, or $269,000 after deducting the deposit.

So, is anyone going to tell me that if a corporation signs a contract, they should be allowed to default at anytime?

JFC.

READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE BEFORE COMMENTING.

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 04:11 PM
But I'm told...

You, it's easy to see why you're so commonly tea-bagged in the DC.

You're fucking idiot who fails to read what they copy and paste.

While you're reading the article, kindly stick your clenched fist up your stupid ass repeatedly.

Jerm
10-28-2009, 04:12 PM
Then so is Robert Kraft:

The New England Patriots have sued multiyear premium ticket holders. A Chicago Bears spokesman said, "In rare instances, we have sued."

Officials with the Arizona Cardinals, Denver Broncos, Minnesota Vikings, Dallas Cowboys, Miami Dolphins, San Francisco 49ers and Indianapolis Colts declined to comment on the query. Other teams did not respond.

Nice of you guys to actually READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE.

In the Redskins case, there are 20,000 PREMIUM SEAT CONTRACTS. If people sign a guaranteed contract, they must pay. Afterall, it IS a contract.

Furthermore, the Redskins have said that they have settled with nearly everyone who backed out of their contract.

----------------------------------------------------------

When Companies Default

<!-- BREAK -->
About a dozen companies bailed out on their luxury skybox leases in the past year, and the cases stand out from the premium ticket holder lawsuits in both size and nature.


The companies include a lobbying firm that went out of business, a telecommunications firm and a Shenandoah coffee roaster owned by a man indicted on charges that he ran a multimillion-dollar Ponzi scheme. The Redskins have won $8 million in judgments in eight cases.


Only one defendant is mounting a significant defense: Atlantic Transportation Equipment Ltd., a Maryland bus-maintenance company that rented a 30-seat skybox suite for $149,000 annually to entertain clients and employees. The six-year contract was due to expire next year, and the Redskins sued for the final two seasons, or $269,000 after deducting the deposit.

So, is anyone going to tell me that if a corporation signs a contract, they should be allowed to default at anytime?

JFC.

READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE BEFORE COMMENTING.

Yeah Kraft is too...anyone who does this is.

So it was a contract, whatever. These rich fucks don't need the money and if people lose their jobs, I would think they'd understand.
Posted via Mobile Device

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 04:13 PM
Long story short, people signed up for 8-10 year season ticket packages and then lost their jobs, or all their money in the stock market and had to cancel. Now their tickets have been sold, but Dan is going after them anyways.

Sorry to correct you but it's not "long story short".

There are corporate entities involved along with an actual contract. Most of the people settled although many had a judgment against them because they failed to appear in court.

And once again, this is common practice across the NFL.

Do you think that for one second Clark Hunt will just waive off contracts on suites and Premium seats to the wealthy and corporations? Jerry Jones? Ha!

OnTheWarpath58
10-28-2009, 04:14 PM
Yeah Kraft is too...anyone who does this is.

So it was a contract, whatever. These rich fucks don't need the money and if people lose their jobs, I would think they'd understand.
Posted via Mobile Device

Just like the bank that services your mortgage?

I mean, they're rich. I'm sure they'll understand if you lose your job and quit honoring the contract.

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 04:15 PM
Yeah Kraft is too...anyone who does this is.

So it was a contract, whatever. These rich fucks don't need the money and if people lose their jobs, I would think they'd understand.
Posted via Mobile Device

Dude, when corporations fail to honor their contracts, there are consequences.

If you're going to commit to a 10-year Premium Seat, then you'd better have the money for it.

Do you understand the economics in D.C.? That stadium has been sold out FOREVER. Those seats are at a premium. Why do you think they created a 10 year contract to begin with?

I swear to fucking God, half the people that post on Chiefsplanet must have absolutely NO understanding of finance and economics at they relate to sport franchises.

Jerm
10-28-2009, 04:16 PM
Just like the bank that services your mortgage?

I mean, they're rich. I'm sure they'll understand if you lose your job and quit honoring the contract.

LOL a little bit different don't you think?

I see your point but if you expect me to feel sorry for those cocksuckers, not gonna happen.

Dan Snyder can drop dead anytime.
Posted via Mobile Device

Jerm
10-28-2009, 04:18 PM
Dude, when corporations fail to honor their contracts, there are consequences.

If you're going to commit to a 10-year Premium Seat, then you'd better have the money for it.

Do you understand the economics in D.C.? That stadium has been sold out FOREVER. Those seats are at a premium. Why do you think they created a 10 year contract to begin with?

I swear to fucking God, half the people that post on Chiefsplanet must have absolutely NO understanding of finance and economics at they relate to sport franchises.

I was understanding it was individuals, not corporations...was too lazy to read the article lol.

Still find it hard to care about Snyder even if he is getting bent over.
Posted via Mobile Device

OnTheWarpath58
10-28-2009, 04:19 PM
LOL a little bit different don't you think?

I see your point but if you expect me to feel sorry for those cocksuckers, not gonna happen.

Dan Snyder can drop dead anytime.
Posted via Mobile Device

"Your Honor, Dan Snyder is a douchebag, therefore I no longer feel it's necessary to honor the 10 year contract I signed with him."

Jerm
10-28-2009, 04:20 PM
"Your Honor, Dan Snyder is a douchebag, therefore I no longer feel it's necessary to honor the 10 year contract I signed with him."

Sounds like a good defense to me and seeing as how fucked are justice system is, it might work. :D

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 04:20 PM
I was understanding it was individuals, not corporations...was too lazy to read the article lol.

Still find it hard to care about Snyder even if he is getting bent over.
Posted via Mobile Device

There are individuals involved but in most cases, people just didn't feel like paying anymore and cited "the economy".

You know what's really fucking stupid? These people could put those tickets on eBay or Stubhub and make a profit.

Instead, the overwhelming majority of them didn't even show up in court to fight.

That's fucking stupid.

Jerm
10-28-2009, 04:21 PM
There are individuals involved but in most cases, people just didn't feel like paying anymore and cited "the economy".

You know what's really ****ing stupid? These people could put those tickets on eBay or Stubhub and make a profit.

Instead, the overwhelming majority of them didn't even show up in court to fight.

That's ****ing stupid.

Ah well that changes things...yeah sound like morons to me.

milkman
10-28-2009, 05:05 PM
Dude, when corporations fail to honor their contracts, there are consequences.

If you're going to commit to a 10-year Premium Seat, then you'd better have the money for it.

Do you understand the economics in D.C.? That stadium has been sold out FOREVER. Those seats are at a premium. Why do you think they created a 10 year contract to begin with?

I swear to ****ing God, half the people that post on Chiefsplanet must have absolutely NO understanding of finance and economics at they relate to sport franchises.

I get it.

I just think it's ridiculous for teams to offer individuals PSLs and contracts over extended peiods of time.

One or two year contracts with the option to renew should be the max.

These PSLs and long term contracts are eventually going to lead to fewer hardcore fans.

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 05:10 PM
I get it.

I just think it's ridiculous for teams to offer individuals PSLs and contracts over extended peiods of time.

One or two year contracts with the option to renew should be the max.

These PSLs and long term contracts are eventually going to lead to fewer hardcore fans.

In hot markets like D.C. and NYC, they can and will have contracts of this length because it's necessary for them to budget. THIS is the dirty little secret that most fans don't know about that's happening in the larger markets and in Dallas. Jerry Jones and owners like the Kraft Family and Snyder want to and need to keep this revenue stream so they can "buy" all the best players. It's going to be extremely contentious when negotiations open for the next CBA and it's not just between players and management. It'll be owners versus owners. These guys are sick of sharing their revenues with teams like the Chiefs and Jerry Jones has specifically mentioned them.

It's no secret that the worst teams record-wise in the NFL are also among the lowest revenue generating teams and the wealthier owners are tired of sharing their revenues to "float" these teams.

On another note, the PSL's at the new Giants & Jets stadium are out of this world.

I have a friend who's family has had eight Jet tickets since they were the Titans and eight Giants tickets going back to the 30's. Because of the PSL's, they're only getting two seats for each.

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 05:17 PM
Let's not make it out like this is all a bunch of big companies that are just bailing on their obligation. The story opens with a lady who owned a real estate company. Okay. They have a contract. Legal. But it's not ethical or moral to resell the product and then turn around and sue the first person who couldn't pay for it in the first place.


It would be hard to find a more loyal fan of the Washington Redskins than real estate agent Pat Hill. She's had season tickets since the early 1960s, when her daughter danced in the halftime shows at the old D.C. Stadium, before it was renamed in memory of Robert F. Kennedy.

In the hallway of her modest home south of Alexandria, the 72-year-old grandmother points out the burgundy-and-gold Redskins hook rug she made. In her bedroom, she shows off the pennants from two Redskins Super Bowl games she attended, and she opens a music box on her dresser that plays "Hail to the Redskins."

Now, Hill says, her beloved Redskins are forcing her into bankruptcy.

Last year, Hill's real estate sales were hit hard by the housing market crash, and she told the team that she could no longer afford her $5,300-a-year contract for two loge seats behind the end zone. Hill said she asked the Redskins to waive her contract for a year or two.

The sales office declined.

On Oct. 8, the Redskins sued Hill in Prince George's County Circuit Court for backing out of a 10-year ticket-renewal agreement after the first year. The team sought payment for every season through 2017, plus interest, attorneys' fees and court costs.

Hill couldn't afford a lawyer. She did not fight the lawsuit or even respond to it because, she said, she believes that the Bible says that it is morally wrong not to pay your debts. The team won a default judgment of $66,364.
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"It really breaks my heart," Hill said, her voice cracking as the tears well and spill. "I don't even believe in bankruptcy.

"We are supposed to pay our bills. I ain't trying to get out of anything."

Hill is one of 125 season ticket holders who asked to be released from multiyear contracts and were sued by the Redskins in the past five years. The Washington Post interviewed about two dozen of them. Most said that they were victims of the economic downturn, having lost a job or experiencing some other financial hardship.

Redskins General Counsel David Donovan said the lawsuits are a last resort that involve a small percentage of the team's 20,000 annual premium seat contracts. He added that the team has accommodated people in hard-luck circumstances hundreds of times. He said he was unaware of Pat Hill's case."

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 05:22 PM
There are individuals involved but in most cases, people just didn't feel like paying anymore and cited "the economy".

You know what's really fucking stupid? These people could put those tickets on eBay or Stubhub and make a profit.

Instead, the overwhelming majority of them didn't even show up in court to fight.

That's fucking stupid.

I can't even remotely argue with that. But to me, Dan Snyder is an asshole for going after some 73 year old lady who has faithfully purchased his product for almost 50 years. That woman has probably never heard of stubhub.

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 05:27 PM
I can't even remotely argue with that. But to me, Dan Snyder is an asshole for going after some 73 year old lady who has faithfully purchased his product for almost 50 years. That woman has probably never heard of stubhub.

That's fine. One lady. But if you read the other stories, they're no where near the same. It's people that renegged on a contract. One guy was so fucking dumb he put the $15,000.00 balance he was due on a credit card AFTER the judgment was made against him! He didn't show up in court, lost the tickets and STILL had to pay.

I have a hard time feeling sorry for stupid people.

It's a character flaw.

Ari Chi3fs
10-28-2009, 05:38 PM
I don't think DaneMcCloud would last very long on very many other forums... heh. He'd get banned for all of the personal assaults and name calling. lmao

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 05:40 PM
I don't think DaneMcCloud would last very long on very many other forums... heh. He'd get banned for all of the personal assaults and name calling. lmao

You're right. Most other boards have easily wounded vaginas. At least in my limited experience.....coughORANGEMANE.......cough.......

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 05:44 PM
Let's not make it out like this is all a bunch of big companies that are just bailing on their obligation. The story opens with a lady who owned a real estate company. Okay. They have a contract. Legal. But it's not ethical or moral to resell the product and then turn around and sue the first person who couldn't pay for it in the first place.

Well, it is a product. Did you expect them to not re-sell the seat? Leave it empty because someone re-negged? I know that in your line of business, you understand that it's not possible or feasible.

And let's keep in mind, these ticket holders had contracts for 20,000 Premium Seats.

The Redskins aren't going after people in the bleachers or just any old joe. Premium Seats that come along with a contract.

It sucks for that old lady but if it's me signing a 6 or 10 year contract at a cost of $15-20k per season (or whatever), I've got that money set aside for payment.

Otherwise, I'm not signing that contract.

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 05:49 PM
Well, it is a product. Did you expect them to not re-sell the seat? Leave it empty because someone re-negged? I know that in your line of business, you understand that it's not possible or feasible.

And let's keep in mind, these ticket holders had contracts for 20,000 Premium Seats.

The Redskins aren't going after people in the bleachers or just any old joe. Premium Seats that come along with a contract.

It sucks for that old lady but if it's me signing a 6 or 10 year contract at a cost of $15-20k per season (or whatever), I've got that money set aside for payment.

Otherwise, I'm not signing that contract.

Well, you're absolutely speaking in a language that I understand and comply with every day in my real life. But Dane, I hate it. I'm not self loathing over it. It's a job that has to be done and I'm very good at it. It's certainly not how I would do things in business, which is why I can never be super rich. It sucks, but I've come to grips with it.

Mr. Flopnuts
10-28-2009, 05:51 PM
Well, you're absolutely speaking in a language that I understand and comply with every day in my real life. But Dane, I hate it. I'm not self loathing over it. It's a job that has to be done and I'm very good at it. It's certainly not how I would do things in business, which is why I can never be super rich. It sucks, but I've come to grips with it.

Don't get me wrong, someone renegs on a bill and doesn't have an incredibly hard luck story, I'm going to get paid. And I'm not going to think twice about it. But I won't deny that I am SOFT for people who have shitty, shitty, luck. Even when it's self created. To me it's more than a character flaw, it's a mental lapse of some kind. No one wants to be a loser.

DaneMcCloud
10-28-2009, 06:13 PM
Well, you're absolutely speaking in a language that I understand and comply with every day in my real life. But Dane, I hate it. I'm not self loathing over it. It's a job that has to be done and I'm very good at it. It's certainly not how I would do things in business, which is why I can never be super rich. It sucks, but I've come to grips with it.

You're a good dude. I think everyone knows that and those who don't should.

That's the most important part.

Dead&Buried
10-28-2009, 09:17 PM
It was so big, I couldn't even put it in 1 post due to board constrictions. There are all 23,872 characters of it.

The Washington Post is the best newspaper in the United States. IMO